S12.E22: Reunion Part 1

[Hangin Out]

I didn’t have the time to read the posts today, so there’s that.  I’ve been watching all the previous seasons.  I have to say that I really love Tinsley.  She’s sweet, kind, and wouldn’t hurt a fly.  I hope all good things come to her.  I’ve noticed she is a little babyish in her thinking and how she projects herself.  I don’t know if it was Dale who babied her or what.   I don’t know if Scott finds that endearing or what.  After awhile, it might get on his nerves.  She cries a lot over simple things.  Will she be able to grow up a baby by herself, or need lots of help?  We really haven’t seen her in many situations where we see what she can handle.  That falling on the floor was telling.  What grownup does that?  It might be cute now.  When she’s with Dale she’s always crying about something menial, and looks foolish.  Maybe that’s why Scott takes control of every situation.  Time will tell.  I wish them luck.

 

 

[OdinO.]

2 hours ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Great find!  So this article basically confirms what a few of us have been theorizing about Scott was/is true from Tinsley’s perspective as well.  

For her to say—publicly, no less—That Scott “is a very different person than anyone [she’s] ever dated” and “he has controlling ways about him” is saying a lot, considering that she dated Nico Fanjul, who beat the shit out of her.  

As viewers, I think we are all prone to projecting our own desires and motives onto these “ladies,” but I’ve never seen it as acutely as I’ve seen with Tinsley.  Forgive me if I get too Jungian, but I feel like there is this really strong collective viewer compulsion to cast Tinsley as the archetype of this picture perfect princess who is now living out her fairy tale, especially as juxtaposed against the wicked stepmother, Dorinda.  

Now, I have no problem with Dorinda as the wicked stepmother from hell.  This post is not about Dorinda.  I’m actually a little bored of Dorinda right now.  

But I also don’t like Tinsely at all, and, I have twisted myself up into a pretzel trying, and it just doesn’t happen for me.  I see someone who is vapid, weak, desperate, and very immature.  I have absolutely no sympathy for the argument that Dale raised her to be this way, thus that is all she knows.  Did Dale raise Tinsley in isolation, perhaps in a remote cave, or did Tinsley leave home to attend an Ivy League school nowhere near Dale?  Not to mention that Tinsley was in boarding school prior to that time, so she was not with Dale as long as most of us regular people are with our mothers.  Then add 20+ years of Tinsley’s life, at least some time of which was spent abroad, and I come to the conclusion that Tinsley can’t have it both ways—she cannot be this successful businesswoman jet-setter and someone who is under the spell of her mommy a quarter of a century after Dale was not her primary caregiver.  

My theory is that Tinsley is neither a smart, savvy businessperson, nor is she a victim of Dale (whom I find heinous by the way).  I get the impression that a lot of her opportunities were handed to her, sort of the way that opportunities were handed to Paris Hilton.  I’ve read some interviews, and Tinsely has been very calculated about becoming a New York socialite; it didn’t just happen.  She’s worked with some heavy hitters in the industry to become the person she portrays herself to be, such as quitting her job to become a “little socialite.”  And if she was going to be a socialite, I would actually respect that.  But I can’t with the crying and the poor me attitude that she has carried around since day one of being on this show.  And the vacillating, and my God, the prevarication, complete with the hand-wringing makes me really wonder about her emotional maturity.  

I’ve always said Tinsley needed assistance with her mental health and learning how to find the ability to assert herself (when she’s sober) more than she needed to be on reality TV, especially fresh off an arrest.  I’m also not fond of the way she spun her arrest aka her mugshot, as she’s so fond of calling it, into something cute and kitschy, between taglines and coasters.  I think that’s tacky, and it strikes me that she doesn’t seem to treat incarceration with the gravitas it deserves.  

I just tend to find weakness non-endearing.  Vulnerability can be extremely endearing, and I’ve always tried to find that in Tinsley, but each and every time, it comes up as weakness.  She is 45 damned years old.  Which other woman on any of the franchises has acted in this “poor me” style that Tinsley has?  I can’t really think of one.  Stephanie Holman on RH of Dallas, who is in her thirties, cries a lot and sometimes appears weak, but she has twenty times the backbone that Tinsley does.  I just don’t get why I should be rooting for someone like this.  She doesn’t read as a sympathetic character, she reads as a pathetic character to me, or a tragic character, like Blanche DuBois from A Streetcar Named Desire.  

What I also don’t love is that I think Tinsley gets a lot of sympathy for her appearance.  She looks frail, therefore she is given more deference IMO.  If Tinsley were 200 lbs and she wore coochie cutters with spiked heels and wore her hair in an Afro, I’m not sure the viewing audience would be so protective over her.  I find her looks jarring at this point.  When I looked at that picture someone posted up thread of the ring—which was beautiful—I couldn’t believe how thin her nose was.  I just didn’t want to look at her face.  This is veering heavily into Michael Jackson territory and body dysmorphic disorder.  Again, get mental health assistance.  Reality TV is not a substitute for serious therapy, despite what Andy Cohen may try to get these women to believe.  

I try not to write too much about Tinsley, because she gives the appearance of being so soft that it’s hard to pinpoint her dark, unwell underbelly, and that was why I was so, so glad she left the show.  I was so relieved I wouldn’t have to keep watching something insidious and stunted that was masquerading as sweetness and manners and light.  I was really not thrilled when I saw that she was returning for the reunion.

 In fact, when Tinsley left the show, I was more relieved in some ways than when I heard Bethenny was leaving the show.  Bethenny is like Ramona, Sonja and Lu in that she can hang.  She is utterly dreadful, but she’s a tough bitch and she didn’t get kid glove treatment.  I’m not sure anyone pitied Bethenny, at least not toward the end.  And even though Bethenny didn’t have Dale as a mother, she was supposedly “raised by wolves” with a stepfather who came on the show and admitted he dragged Bethenny’s mom across the house by the hair in front of Bethenny when she was a little girl.  But “raised by wolves” is used as a punchline, whereas “Dale” is used as this panacea to explain all of Tinsley’s pathologies.  Bethenny is only a handful of years older than Tinsley.  I don’t get the double standard.  

For the record, I think they’re both horrible, in completely different ways.  

And I know that the counterpoint is that Bethenny went out of her way to hurt people, whereas Tinsley kind of just shows up and doesn’t harm anyone.  But I just don’t respect the way Tinsley lives her life.  I don’t think she is a good example to other people, adults or children.  If I bought into Bethenny’s mentality that some women represent all women, which I don’t, I would agree that Tinsely sets women back 100 years.  I happen to think we’re all individuals, and nothing Tinsley or Bethenny or Dorinda says or does has any bearing on me as a woman.  At the same time, I just want her to go to Chicago and live her best life and be off the show.  And, for the record, as always, I hope I’m wrong and Tinsley and Scott get hitched and live happily ever after off the fat of the land.  Tinsley’s gain isn’t my loss.  

I do think Tinsley has made pretty significant strides between the time she left the show and the reunion, and I gave her credit for that upthread.  I am happy to see that.  But when I read an article like the one posted, I get a bee in my bonnet and I get extremely exasperated about Tinsley all over again and then I have to write about it.  In short, I just feel like she’s nobody’s victim, and I find it surprising that so many buy what she is selling hook, line and sinker.  But there are only two more reunion installations left, and then we can officially bid her adieu, so I’m not going to get too twisted up about it.  I just dislike her.  I hope that she learns how to be a strong person, for her own sake, and for the sake of any children she may have, but if she doesn’t, I’m sure the world will keep on turning.  

I just don’t think “helpless” is a cute look in 2020, for an adult woman or a man, and I’m glad the four year narrative of poor little rich girl is finally going bye-bye.  It’s about three and a half years overdo, but who’s counting?  

Bravo!

 

[Ginger]

On 9/10/2020 at 7:02 PM, eleanorofaquitaine said:

You know, they showed us that scene with Dorinda yelling at John in the previews last year but never what it was about. Now we know.

She's a deeply troubled human being.

Wait, don't forget, "he'll always have a seat at my table." I wish I had a dollar for every time Dorinda repeated that ridiculous phrase. I'm so glad she's gone. 

[Hangin Out]

10 hours ago, Ginger said:

Wait, don't forget, "he'll always have a seat at my table." I wish I had a dollar for every time Dorinda repeated that ridiculous phrase. I'm so glad she's gone. 

All these old fashioned sayings.  She sounds and acts like an old lady.  I’m wondering what she’s going to do next.

[Chit Chat]

On 9/16/2020 at 4:00 PM, LibertarianSlut said:

But when I read an article like the one posted, I get a bee in my bonnet and I get extremely exasperated about Tinsley all over again and then I have to write about it.

Respectfully, I don't put that much thought into any of these ladies!  I like Tinsley because of her lighthearted nature.  She was a breath of fresh air compared to the likes of Dorinda and a drunken Sonja.   As far as all of the other chatter about her, I don't delve that deeply into what makes them tick.  My only hope is that she finds peace and contentment with Scott.  😉

[LibertarianSlut]

59 minutes ago, ChitChat said:

Respectfully, I don't put that much thought into any of these ladies!  I like Tinsley because of her lighthearted nature.  She was a breath of fresh air compared to the likes of Dorinda and a drunken Sonja.   As far as all of the other chatter about her, I don't delve that deeply into what makes them tick.  My only hope is that she finds peace and contentment with Scott.  😉

That makes sense.  I get that.  I respect that everyone watches the show for their own reasons, whether it is escapism or something else.  I never really used to be into their fashion when I was younger, as I could throw on a t-shirt, sandals and jeans and it looked good on me, and now that I’m a little older, I am so closely clocking what they are wearing, so we probably even change the reasons we watch over the course of the 12 years this show has been on, or at least I have.  

But I don’t think I could be a really avid watcher if I didn’t really get into it.  That’s just for me.  This is embarrassing, but I take these shows very seriously, even though I love to have a laugh and often do at the same time, and even though sometimes I want to be more lighthearted about the way I view.  I just can’t look at it differently, even if I try.  

I don’t find Tinsley lighthearted at all, though.  I think Luann and Ramona are lighthearted.  I think Tinsley is very immature and puts on a lighthearted face in an attempt to keep sweet and get along with people, because she is conflict averse because she never learned how to handle conflict.  And I think the weight of that face is part of the reason she drinks so much, and is often even so very dark when she drinks. 

If every time Tinsley is on my screen, I get uncomfortable, which I do, I find it a worthy exercise to do a deep dive to try to pinpoint why.  It’s sort of like self-work or at least I can chalk it up to that in order to justify how much time I spend thinking about reality TV!  It’s not jealousy that I don’t like Tinsley.  I’ve thought of that and it’s just not pinging.  Dorit—the girl from that other franchise—is younger, prettier and has the same level body as Tinsley and Dorit only bothers me as much as swatting at a fly.  

There’s something about Tinsley’s helplessness that just drives me crazy and freaks me out and I’ve probably driven all of my fellow posters crazy and freaked them out with how much I’ve written about it, especially earlier in the season, and that’s why I’m so glad she’s leaving and moving on and the audience can move on.

I guess if I were really psychoanalyzing it very honestly, I resent Tinsley, because I sort of had a Tinsley thing going on in my twenties—girl who cries, girl who drinks, girl with the cute outfits (though not as expensive), girl with issues—and at some point in my thirties I realized, especially with help from my husband, that is not a cool person to be.  That is not a good character.  That is not a good role model.  I can work hard—really hard—every day and be strong and assertive and make decisions and speak well and sound mature and not complain (as much) and show up to my own life as an active participant and I guess I wonder why I could make that leap in my thirties, but Tinsley is in her forties, with far more resources that I ever had, and she hasn’t done any of that—she is me 10 years ago—and she just keeps getting pass after pass.

 And maybe that is on me for not running my own race and looking at her, when I should really only worry about myself, but, alas, these feelings come up, and I see that other viewers voice them from time to time as well, so while it may partially be my issue, it’s also an issue that Tinsley has that other people are rejecting.   

I strongly dislike the other women too.  This has been a pretty horrendous season, but I feel like they get called out, especially Ramona, Sonja and Leah.  Luann is a sly dog that flies under the radar sometimes too, and when I see that happening, I like to call attention to Luann’s bullshit immediately.  Everyone is onto Dorinda’s machinations.  At the season four reunion of RHOC, Vicki told Gretchen that she was at the Vatican and someone came up to her and told her they hated Slade.  I feel like Dorinda—rightfully—is at that point of viewer hatred saturation that I don’t feel like I need to even voice my concern about her behavior, because everyone is doing it for me.  And by the same token, the less I feel that the truth about Tinsley is exposed, the more I want to talk about her flaws, because they’re perhaps not as obvious, but they’re still very present, so I guess I find that a more intriguing well to mine than the one about how glad I am that Dorinda is fired or how Leah is immature or Sonja is a boozy drunken liar.  When I felt no one was “onto” Sonja, way back in the day, I was on her like white rice (TM Ramona) too.  I have said upthread that I think that there will be a point in the next decade that Tinsley turns into a Sonja.  And in my typical contrarian mindset, I will have moved on by then to another bitch who I think is more interesting to criticize, hahaha. 

And, with that, I will end my therapy session.  If anyone who read this feels I owe them the same money that I pay my psychiatrist, please PM me and I’ll Venmo you the $200.  💰😉

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by LibertarianSlut
Quadruple post

[Chit Chat]

14 minutes ago, LibertarianSlut said:

This is embarrassing, but I take these shows very seriously, even though I love to have a laugh and often do at the same time, and even though sometimes I want to be more lighthearted about the way I view.  I just can’t look at it differently, even if I try.  

And that's okay too!!  I've found that sometimes I let my emotions get the best of me when watching these shows and then I take a step back and realize that I shouldn't let their foolishness aggravate me so much!  We all have enough crap to deal with in our lives, so I'd prefer some fairly mindless entertainment from the HWs, not the meanness and cruelty that has been on display.  

Just as Rinna ruined the BH HWs for me, Dorinda is doing the same with this franchise.  I'm hoping for a better season next time with her gone.  If it doesn't get any better, then just like with the BH's one, I'll be out.  I'm going to give the Salt Lake City one a try.  

[RedDelicious]

@LibertarianSlut you explain it so clearly. 

For me, I don’t actually like Tinsley either, and I’ve said as much, but I do feel bad for her, because I’ve had relationships like the way she describes hers with Scott in the People article and it’s a terrible, terrible place to be. I can relate to that.

She has more resources than I do though and the world by the @ss so to speak, and she’s crying regularly and melting down over such loser situations. I’m so sick of the routine. It’s exasperating. If I could finally figure it out, anyone can. 

She’s a grown woman acting like a teenager. Get it together and ditch the sickeningly sweet candy shell. 

[Hangin Out]

I’m watching Reunion #1.  By the way Andy is laughing at every little thing they all say, I think he truly loves the New York Housewives the best.  They bring it.

[Chit Chat]

36 minutes ago, RedDelicious said:

I’m so sick of the routine. It’s exasperating. If I could finally figure it out, anyone can. 

I'd quit watching a show before I let it get me that aggravated!  Such is the case with the BH's franchise.  I had enough of Rinna's crap, so I no longer watch them.  I don't miss it at all!   I'm at a point with the entire franchise that I can take it or leave it.  If they keep going in this direction of drunken women running around acting like fools, and ones who are just plain mean, then I'll be done with the whole thing.   The shows just aren't fun anymore.  YMMV.

Edited September 18, 2020 by ChitChat

[divsc]

I think a big part of Tinsley being with Scott is because she doesn't want to be single, she wants to have a husband, and she wants that last chance effort at a baby. I wrote about this once before, but being in your 40s when you always thought you would have a family of your own and it didn't happen, is a huge, life changing thing. People don't see it because there's not just one moment in time that it happened. Not having a baby means sooo much more than just not having the baby, especially when it's not by choice. It leaves you isolated, marginalized, judged, shamed, and just left out. Everyone else is a mother. Everything on tv. Every book. Everything is "family friendly." Every politician is fighting for "hard working families." The way women instantly talk about their children or make small talk by asking, "How many kids do you have?" Being in a group of women and the constant chatter of schools and sports or who's sick or birthday parties. Who is pregnant. Who just had a baby. And when you are in your 40's - it's most of your peers. The comments - about being #blessed. About not knowing what love is until you became a mother. The way mothers are given more social status or value. Or virtues like empathy are automatically assumed. "As a mother, I was horrified by..." And that's on top of the grief of not having the family (or even the partner) you always envisioned. Even though Tinsley had been drunk out of her mind, the way she was crying to her mom at the Circus about all the kids there and how, "I might never have that." 

It really is a disenfranchised grief or an ambiguous loss that is so hidden in our society. And no one talks about it, because they don't want to be pitied or shamed or blamed, or told non-helpful things like, "Well you can adopt" or "have a baby on your own." So yea, I found the turkey baster comment beyond cruel and insensitive. Mostly because that's a major pain spot for Tinsely and for anyone to go purposely and deliberately poke someone's most inner pain with a crude joke, makes them a total asshole. It's not that much different than someone making a HAHAHA joke, "Think this whatever would have cured Richard's liver? Hahahah!" Like who even does that?? It's not so much the actual comment, but being so insensitive as to make a rude remark about a painful topic or someone's grief.

And Dorinda's non-apology at the reunion was just as bad. "I thought you'd be pregnant by now." Smirk. Right. Like 40 year olds can just make babies appear on demand. IVF isn't even always successful, but no one talks about that either. Or about the mental health of someone who finds themselves involuntarily childless, whether it's by medical or social reasons, or everything in between. 

I don't particularly like Scott either or think he's all that great of a catch, but I can understand why Tinsely sooo wants it to work with this guy, if having a family was still something she wanted to pursue. None of the other women, all of them mothers, are in any position to judge her motives. It's not an easy path with a bunch of appealing options. She has to make decisions and there is a reality to it. 

I'm a big believer in looking for the good, focusing on what you have, not what you don't, but another woman making jokes or being snotty about someone not having children or ability to get pregnant, is just so disgusting to me. I think it's more about preying on someone's deepest vulnerability that is so disturbing to me, even more than the actual lame comment. 

[film noire]

What a great & thoughtful post, @divsc  - take care.

 

[Chit Chat]

20 hours ago, divsc said:

It's not an easy path with a bunch of appealing options. She has to make decisions and there is a reality to it. 

I enjoyed reading your post, divsc.  It's very insightful and reminds me that there is a lot more depth to most of these ladies than what we see on this show.  Dorinda is such a horrible person for the way she treated Tinsley.  She doesn't have an ounce of empathy towards anybody.  Even if she never had fertility issues or any of the other problems Tinsley's had, as a woman you'd think that she'd have some compassion for her.  

I've always liked Tinsley - quirks and all (who doesn't have a few?), but she did nothing to warrant the ugliness that Dorinda displayed, and I'm super disappointed in the other ladies for cowering to Dorinda.  I'd never let a friend be treated that way and sit idly by. 

[Raiderred]

On 9/12/2020 at 5:04 PM, Sweet-tea said:

I have a feeling she and Scott won’t make it to the wedding. He’s been so wishy washy with her. I don’t think he’s as into her as she is him,

I have felt this way since their first bowling alley date.  It just seems sooo forced for both of them.

[wallies]

@LibertarianSlut @divsc - Great comments by both! 

I posted last week that I don't think Tinsley and Scott are going to last. They've been engaged for 10 months and they don't have a wedding date yet (or at least it's not made public). If you're 45 and wanting a baby in the age of coronavirus...why not just JOP it? She's eloped before. How old do they really want to be as first-time parents? I understand women can get pregnant later than ever and men want to work on their careers...but really, 40+ year old parents of newborns isn't always something to aspire to.

Lest you think I'm being insensitive, I suffer in silence being a 40+ woman who always wanted a husband and child. It a huge personal loss, almost like a death, that goes entirely unacknowledged and unrecognized in society. I need a partner to have a baby, I cannot handle it all on my own, not at my age. So I feel for Tins, yet I'm not someone who'll desperately settle as she seems to be doing. Let's face it - if this were 10 years ago, she wouldn't care about Scott, they aren't from the same mold. He likely knows this and is using it to his advantage by controlling her to assuage his own feelings of insecurity. Unfortunately, our molds are long set in our 40s.

So c'mon Tins & Scott, prove us all wrong and just get married already! 

 

[LibertarianSlut]

40 minutes ago, wallies said:

Let's face it - if this were 10 years ago, she wouldn't care about Scott, they aren't from the same mold.

Word. Up.  The whole post—but especially this sentence—has nailed Tinsley better than any sentence alone that I have ever read.  It encompasses everything about her that bothers me.  The desperation and the inauthenticity is a toxic combination by which I cannot abide, by which I could never abide.  This is exactly what I have been circling around when I wrote on several occasions that if she wanted to be the socialite—do it girl!  Do it with aplomb.  If you want to do the wife and mom from the Midwest, do it baby (grinning Heather Thomson emoji to be placed here).  Just don’t piss on my leg and tell me it’s raining.  Don’t tell me everything is fine when everything is far from fine.  I have five senses that work just fine. I can see and hear, and what I see, hear and read about Tinsley just doesn’t add up—she is a book of contradictions—and some people can pull that off just fine, because—please forgive the expression—they own it.  When a woman in her forties had four seasons of reality TV and show us who she was and she balked, always opting for the easy, safe path and micro-deflections, I don’t buy it, I don’t like it, and I’m glad she’s off TV.  

I have to say that even though I thought this was an abysmal season, I feel like more people had their pulse on Tinsley’s bullshit than last season, and I have enjoyed that more than I have enjoyed the show.  Shout-out to @RedDelicious.  

As far as the childless thing, I do think it is a big issue that goes ignored.  I think there’s a stigma on single and childless women.  I think it’s easy for me to not have a strong reaction to the turkey baster comment, because I’m still young enough to theoretically have a kid—I’m younger than Bethenny was when she conceived Bryn—but it’s not going to happen.  My husband doesn’t want one, and I don’t want one enough to overrule him, in addition to the fact that the idea of all that physical pain scares me shitless.  There is a quote from Miranda Hobbes of Sex and The City (OMG, I wish Tinsley would have to spend time alone in a room with Miranda—she’d be scared straight) wherein Miranda and the other women go to an engagement party and after they leave, Miranda tells her friends that married people find single people weird, don’t understand them, and want to put them on a shelf somewhere.  Even watching that as a teen, I was blown away by how true this statement was.  

To be totally honest, this is how I feel about my friends and cousins that have kids—I see how their kids dominate not just their lives, but their every waking moments, and I realize that our lifestyles have diverged so completely that I create a little distance.  To borrow another reference from Sex and The City, I just don’t want to talk about diaper genies.  And this is nothing against moms—I’m sincerely so happy for moms whose kids give them fulfillment—but I personally don’t want to hold someone’s kid or talk about their kid.  All this is to say that there are two sides to this issue, and I’m saying it in the hopes that it gives anyone who’s childless some comfort—there are people out there who, rightly or wrongly, may actually find you a little bit more interesting or a little bit relatable for not having them.  

Kathryn from RHBH—a one season wonder—was one of my favorite Housewives of all time and part of my affinity toward her was that she was 51 years old, kind of a badass, had a husband who was nine years younger than her, and was completely unapologetic about the fact that she and her husband chose to travel instead of having kids.  And this is not anti-kid or anti-family; I really enjoy watching some of the Housewives with really big families navigate all those kids and husbands—Jennifer from RHNJ and Larsa from RH Miami come to mind—but it’s because they enjoy it and it’s what they and their husbands wanted.  I doesn’t feel like anyone wheeled and dealed and did back room negotiations with a rubber hose to get “what they wanted” or, probably more accurately, what they were conditioned to want and never took the time to question and didn’t have the conviction to take the road less travelled.  

And, with that, I think I am done talking about Tinsley.  I’ve said everything I have to say and it feels great.  I feel like Katy Perry:  swish, swish, bish, another one in the basket.  💋

 

[divsc]

I think the freezing eggs things also adds another element to the mix. In most cases, when you start hitting your early, mid forties, the truth is, the ability to get pregnant without "help" and carry a healthy baby to term is not as easy as the media makes it seem. Yes, there are the few celeb stories (and in many cases, there really was some form of IVF they may or may not talk about. Which is fine - but it gives women false hope for the "miracle" baby.) And of course everyone has that neighbor's friend's cousin who had a baby at 54! But in general, it's risky and not always easy, and I think most women reach a point (and age) where they come to accept a genetic baby of their own is just not in the cards for them. And grieve the loss of the dream, and it may always be there, but there is some level of acceptance and move forward.

But when you freeze your eggs - you buy yourself some time. You lengthen the logistical time - but then also the emotional timetable. I think the loss becomes even more ambiguous, because the dream isn't quite yet over. You can think, "We can still do it" and that same sense or urgency isn't there. It seems like a tortured limbo status to be in.  Do you give up and move on with your life? Or do you keep the dream alive, even if everything doesn't feel right? Also, egg freezing has no guarantees of success. 

Hard to know what's going on with Tinsley and Scott and no wedding date set. Or even if she still wants kids at this point. Is he really alll on bored to have a baby immediately? Are they really doing this? I think ambivalence is also a valid reason for why maybe they haven't pursued this. And also more common than people talk about. It still doesn't take away the loss or sorrow of not becoming a mother or the kids you may have once wanted. But it's also fair to say at 40+ years old you don't want to be an older parent at this point. And you can decide that and STILL get to grieve the loss of the babies you never had.

The biggest thing is I think it's all deeply personal and not anyone else's place to make assumptions or judge. Nor does Tinsley owe anyone else explanations. (Just that she was on a reality tv show, so you know...) And hopefully she has/makes some friends in the same life stage as her, and a good therapist, because these gossipy/judgy women henpecking at her gotta go.

Edited September 20, 2020 by divsc

[TzuShih]

On 9/19/2020 at 7:42 PM, LibertarianSlut said:

Word. Up.  The whole post—but especially this sentence—has nailed Tinsley better than any sentence alone that I have ever read.  It encompasses everything about her that bothers me.  The desperation and the inauthenticity is a toxic combination by which I cannot abide, by which I could never abide.  This is exactly what I have been circling around when I wrote on several occasions that if she wanted to be the socialite—do it girl!  Do it with aplomb.  If you want to do the wife and mom from the Midwest, do it baby (grinning Heather Thomson emoji to be placed here).  Just don’t piss on my leg and tell me it’s raining.  Don’t tell me everything is fine when everything is far from fine.  I have five senses that work just fine. I can see and hear, and what I see, hear and read about Tinsley just doesn’t add up—she is a book of contradictions—and some people can pull that off just fine, because—please forgive the expression—they own it.  When a woman in her forties had four seasons of reality TV and show us who she was and she balked, always opting for the easy, safe path and micro-deflections, I don’t buy it, I don’t like it, and I’m glad she’s off TV.  

I have to say that even though I thought this was an abysmal season, I feel like more people had their pulse on Tinsley’s bullshit than last season, and I have enjoyed that more than I have enjoyed the show.  Shout-out to @RedDelicious.  

As far as the childless thing, I do think it is a big issue that goes ignored.  I think there’s a stigma on single and childless women.  I think it’s easy for me to not have a strong reaction to the turkey baster comment, because I’m still young enough to theoretically have a kid—I’m younger than Bethenny was when she conceived Bryn—but it’s not going to happen.  My husband doesn’t want one, and I don’t want one enough to overrule him, in addition to the fact that the idea of all that physical pain scares me shitless.  There is a quote from Miranda Hobbes of Sex and The City (OMG, I wish Tinsley would have to spend time alone in a room with Miranda—she’d be scared straight) wherein Miranda and the other women go to an engagement party and after they leave, Miranda tells her friends that married people find single people weird, don’t understand them, and want to put them on a shelf somewhere.  Even watching that as a teen, I was blown away by how true this statement was.  

To be totally honest, this is how I feel about my friends and cousins that have kids—I see how their kids dominate not just their lives, but their every waking moments, and I realize that our lifestyles have diverged so completely that I create a little distance.  To borrow another reference from Sex and The City, I just don’t want to talk about diaper genies.  And this is nothing against moms—I’m sincerely so happy for moms whose kids give them fulfillment—but I personally don’t want to hold someone’s kid or talk about their kid.  All this is to say that there are two sides to this issue, and I’m saying it in the hopes that it gives anyone who’s childless some comfort—there are people out there who, rightly or wrongly, may actually find you a little bit more interesting or a little bit relatable for not having them.  

Kathryn from RHBH—a one season wonder—was one of my favorite Housewives of all time and part of my affinity toward her was that she was 51 years old, kind of a badass, had a husband who was nine years younger than her, and was completely unapologetic about the fact that she and her husband chose to travel instead of having kids.  And this is not anti-kid or anti-family; I really enjoy watching some of the Housewives with really big families navigate all those kids and husbands—Jennifer from RHNJ and Larsa from RH Miami come to mind—but it’s because they enjoy it and it’s what they and their husbands wanted.  I doesn’t feel like anyone wheeled and dealed and did back room negotiations with a rubber hose to get “what they wanted” or, probably more accurately, what they were conditioned to want and never took the time to question and didn’t have the conviction to take the road less travelled.  

And, with that, I think I am done talking about Tinsley.  I’ve said everything I have to say and it feels great.  I feel like Katy Perry:  swish, swish, bish, another one in the basket.  💋

 

So articulately put, LS!    In truth, you spared me the literary exhaustion of trying to explain my similar personal feelings of Tinsley's ongoing contradictions.  Forgive me RHONY's fans, if I question the true intentions of Tinsley to 'desperately want children.'  Speaking at least for myself, what we assume will 'complete us' in our 20s, can be surprisingly reassessed in our 40s.  In no way do I have ANY right to 'analyse' a woman whom I've never shared a friendship with.  But....I CAN see Tinsley living a happy, satisfied life with someone she loves and respects - with or without children.  (And I totally 'get' the gratification she derives from her genuine intentions to create a more humane world for animals in need.  Love is love!)

[Boo Boo]

On 9/17/2020 at 11:09 PM, divsc said:

I think a big part of Tinsley being with Scott is because she doesn't want to be single, she wants to have a husband, and she wants that last chance effort at a baby. I wrote about this once before, but being in your 40s when you always thought you would have a family of your own and it didn't happen, is a huge, life changing thing. People don't see it because there's not just one moment in time that it happened. Not having a baby means sooo much more than just not having the baby, especially when it's not by choice. It leaves you isolated, marginalized, judged, shamed, and just left out. Everyone else is a mother. Everything on tv. Every book. Everything is "family friendly." Every politician is fighting for "hard working families." The way women instantly talk about their children or make small talk by asking, "How many kids do you have?" Being in a group of women and the constant chatter of schools and sports or who's sick or birthday parties. Who is pregnant. Who just had a baby. And when you are in your 40's - it's most of your peers. The comments - about being #blessed. About not knowing what love is until you became a mother. The way mothers are given more social status or value. Or virtues like empathy are automatically assumed. "As a mother, I was horrified by..." And that's on top of the grief of not having the family (or even the partner) you always envisioned. Even though Tinsley had been drunk out of her mind, the way she was crying to her mom at the Circus about all the kids there and how, "I might never have that." 

It really is a disenfranchised grief or an ambiguous loss that is so hidden in our society. And no one talks about it, because they don't want to be pitied or shamed or blamed, or told non-helpful things like, "Well you can adopt" or "have a baby on your own." So yea, I found the turkey baster comment beyond cruel and insensitive. Mostly because that's a major pain spot for Tinsely and for anyone to go purposely and deliberately poke someone's most inner pain with a crude joke, makes them a total asshole. It's not that much different than someone making a HAHAHA joke, "Think this whatever would have cured Richard's liver? Hahahah!" Like who even does that?? It's not so much the actual comment, but being so insensitive as to make a rude remark about a painful topic or someone's grief.

And Dorinda's non-apology at the reunion was just as bad. "I thought you'd be pregnant by now." Smirk. Right. Like 40 year olds can just make babies appear on demand. IVF isn't even always successful, but no one talks about that either. Or about the mental health of someone who finds themselves involuntarily childless, whether it's by medical or social reasons, or everything in between. 

I don't particularly like Scott either or think he's all that great of a catch, but I can understand why Tinsely sooo wants it to work with this guy, if having a family was still something she wanted to pursue. None of the other women, all of them mothers, are in any position to judge her motives. It's not an easy path with a bunch of appealing options. She has to make decisions and there is a reality to it. 

And I'm a big believer in looking for the good, focusing on what you have, not what you don't, but another woman making jokes or being snotty about someone not having children or ability to get pregnant, is just so disgusting to me. I think it's more about preying on someone's deepest vulnerability that is so disturbing to me, even more than the actual lame comment. 

Great post!

I'm of the mindset that Tins could've had all that -- the husband, the kid.  But she didn't want to date an average guy.  She wanted someone of wealth.  She could've met a nice accountant who would've loved to settle down with the skinny blonde former "IT" girl and she could've had a family by now.   Instead, she chose to limit her dating pool and  I'm guessing men of her wealth are looking for the 30 year old.  

So for me, it's hard for me to feel too sorry for Tins.  She's wealthy but chased wealth.    The best she could do apparently is Scott.

Edited September 21, 2020 by Boo Boo

[FozzyBear]

On 9/13/2020 at 4:57 PM, bichonblitz said:

 

I am so perplexed by this friendship. IG photo's of them on some boat in CT living it up and yes, that sweet little (revolting) post from Beth. Why Bethenney, Why? I always thought Bethenney disliked Dorinda. Remember the nutcracker fiasco where Dor was so pissed at Beth because she thought Beth didn't bow down to her enough and thank her for the damn nutcracker? That went on for how many episodes? How about the time Bethenney took Dor with her to help with the hurricane relief and Dorinda ruined the business dinner with her embarrassing drunken slurring comments to Beth's partners? Then next day on the plane Beth told her flat out that she was a drunk and needed help. I'm just not getting it at all. Then a couple of days ago I listened to a Heather McDonald podcast. Lu was a guest. Lu said something that explains so much about Beth. She said Beth goes after the under dog, the one who is falling apart. She enjoys building them back up. Once they are all shiny and good as new, Beth will attack in order to bring them back down. I also think Beth is trying to get to Carole by showing what good friends she is with Dorinda, who is also friends with Carole. She wants to make Carole jealous. I guess I just answered my own question of Why, Bethenny, Why? lol.  

I think Bethanny likes being needed and taking on friends as projects. If Dorinda came to her with her “poor me. Tinsely doesn’t tell me all about her dates and my basement flooded. Plus it’s Richards half-birthday today! What am I to do?” Then that would appeal to Bethany’s need to see herself as the wise fixer giving sage advice. I like Bethanny actually, but even I will admit she likes to be the smart one in the room.

[RealHousewife]

It's kind of weird to watch this show three years later. I don't remember covid causing debates in the other cities I watched. I wish I had RHONY to entertain me when I was cooped up in the house, but better late than never. 

Dorinda almost makes the Fox Force 5 look docile. Almost. 

Tins is sweet. It's a bummer she didn't marry and have kids with Scott if that's what she wanted, but I hope she's happy and living her best life. 

[ZettaK]

On 8/26/2023 at 11:17 AM, RealHousewife said:

It's kind of weird to watch this show three years later. I don't remember covid causing debates in the other cities I watched. I wish I had RHONY to entertain me when I was cooped up in the house, but better late than never. 

Dorinda almost makes the Fox Force 5 look docile. Almost. 

Tins is sweet. It's a bummer she didn't marry and have kids with Scott if that's what she wanted, but I hope she's happy and living her best life. 

Covid caused conflict in the OC HWs (Braunwyn, Vicki, Kelly), and there was some controversy in Atlanta about Cynthia's wedding, inviting hundreds of people with no special precautions in October of 2020.

It's better that Tinsley didn't marry Scott because it was revealed he was an asshole from reports outside the show (too). He was playing with her by breaking up with her constantly.

Edited August 30, 2023 by ZettaK