Dublin Murders - General Discussion

[Grammaeryn]

A STARZ series based on the novels by Tana French.  The story, consisting of eight episodes, is adapted from In the Woods and The Likeness. Starring Sarah Greene and Killian Scott.

I haven’t read the books but I’m enjoying the series! There have been enough twists to keep it interesting. Plus, the scenery is amazing. There is a certain shade of moss and grassy green that is SO IRELAND. Mrs Fitzgerald is so totally my grandmother it’s eerie. Four episodes have been broadcast. I’m interested in your theories and reactions to the WTF moments.

[Chas411]

I thought it was really good in parts but they tried to do too much in one series. I think the doppelgänger storyline could have waited until the second series. 

[meep.meep]

I've read In the Woods but not the other one.  I'm enjoying it so far.

[Grammaeryn]

I was really disappointed that Rob and Cassie hooked up. It was sleazy and soapy. What are your theories about the murders? I have a theory about a Rob/Adam. Adam didn’t survive, his doppelgänger did. Katy’s murder is stumping me. Something is hinky with Rosalind. 

[raven]

On 12/5/2019 at 9:32 PM, Grammaeryn said:

I was really disappointed that Rob and Cassie hooked up.

I didn't like that either.  I was enjoying their friendship until that happened.  I thought they both acted like jerks in this last episode.

I haven't read the books either and I understand this is a mash up of two of them.  I have to wonder why because so far I'm not engaged in the doppelganger storyline.   Also, too many of the men look similar and I'm thinking who is that? or a name is mentioned and I'm trying to remember who it is they're talking about.

Katy's sister was def acting oddly - I wondered if she was making up the whole guy with a kitten story to get attention.   Her parents are not exactly paying her any mind so it wouldn't surprise me.

I am enjoying it though.  I believe it's 8 episodes.  I have to be careful googling, don't want to be spoiled!

[Robert Lynch]

Ireland is beautiful, right?

[ghoulina]

I've read all of French's books, but it was years ago. So I'm enjoying not remembering exactly what happened. 

For instance, I know what happened with Katie (won't say), but I cannot remember what happened with Peter and Jamie in 85. 

This is, indeed, a mash-up of In the Woods and The Likeness. I'm not 100% sure, but I do not remember the stories crossing over in the books. The only thing crossed over was Cassie. I'm pretty sure she finished the Katie investigation with Rob before the thing with Lexie happened. 

So yea, I'm not really sure why they're mashing them together. I think it's going to take traction from the stories. I actually enjoyed The Likeness better, as a book. But, as for television, I'm most invested in Rob's case. 

Other than that, I'm loving everything about this. It's impossible to capture French's beautiful prose on film, but the mood and the acting - it's all very well done. 

[Starleigh]

I'm enjoying it, but will definitely say the books are far and away superior. The characters seem less likeable on the show than in the books, imo. Plus, it doesn't really do justice to Rob and Cassie's bond of friendship. 

Edited December 9, 2019 by Starleigh

[Captanne]

I have not read any Tana French and am only watching this show because it's in my genre.  I find it a bit hallucinatory for my tastes and none of the characters are really likable for me.  Also, the treatment of sex is more honest than on American television but there was one gratuitous naked female torso shot that startled me -- Rob and Cassie are engaging in a brief dialogue about the case in front of the peg board and right in the middle is a shot of the prone naked torso in the leaves.  That was a cheap shot and unworthy of this show's quality. 

Additionally, the show is way too slow.  This could be done in half the time or released all at once for binging.  Point being, for my tastes, it's not as good as some of the Scandinavian shows I've binged "for free" on Netflix and other Irish murder shows I've binged, so it's not really worth the month of Starz* membership.  In for a penny, in for a pound -- I'll finish watching it but I feel slightly ripped off.  

*Starz is like "Skinemax" for me.  Too much crappy soapy soft porn on the channel for me to ever want to get a subscription for any significant amount of time.

[MaggieG]

I read these books too, but a while ago so there are a few things I'm remembering but I've forgotten the ending so I'll be in for a surprise when we find out who did what and who killed whom.

I really enjoy the relationship between Cassie and Rob. I'm hating how Rob is acting towards her. I'm glad she asked him "are you like this with all women or just me?" I felt bad for her poor boyfriend. When she told him she used to have sex with the prison guy, his face was so sad. 

I had to laugh at Rosalynd dressing in skimpy clothes, drinking wine trying to come on to Rob. Between his roommate and Cassie, Rob has enough on his plate women wise lol.

Carhal is a dick

[Captanne]

What has made Robbie's strange relationships with women clear is the flashback we've finally been exposed to.  He was a child and (at least) saw someone he knew raped by someone else he knew with two others complicit.  We still don't know what happened next in that scenario but that, by itself, is enough to confuse a person for their whole lives (if left un-treated) regarding intimacy with anyone ever.

I feel sorry for Robbie now -- but I was less patient with him before we saw the flashback.

*Have we got answers as to where his two chum "witnesses" have gotten to?  Do we know who they are?  (We may and I've just forgotten.  I've heard so many characters mentioned and dismissed as dead or in New Zealand or something.....I've lost track of his two chums in the woods.)

[meep.meep]

They have never been found.  It's why the girl's mother keeps telling the police to investigate Adam.

[raven]

50 minutes ago, meep.meep said:

They have never been found. 

I think @Captanne is referring to the rapist's two friends.  One of them (the one who held down Sandra's arms) is the father of Katy.  I don't know who the other one is.

That was a terrible scene but Margaret going after her daughter in the shower and yelling she didn't want her was awful too.

I have some trouble understanding how the police force works.  Cassie is a detective I guess but can abandon her usual responsibilities to go under cover because of "other balding, skinny guy?"  That scenario is confusing.

Rob has needed heavy duty therapy for a long time.  I recall one earlier ep where he said he tried hypnosis and listed some other things and nothing worked.   Time to try again!  He did act like an ass towards Cassie, who's been his friend and is keeping his job-threatening secret, but he's humanly decent - not accepting Rosalind's come on.

These people have amazingly traumatic backgrounds. 

[Captanne]

I was trying to distinguish between the two complicit accomplices who held the girl down and the two "chums" who were with Robbie as witnesses.  We know what happened to the accomplices.  I guess we don't know what happened to the two chums?

[MaggieG]

Jamie and Peter are Adam/Rob's young friends who went missing. I don't believe their bodies were ever found. Jamie's mom is the one that keeps calling saying they need to look into Adam. Young Cathal, Jonathan and Shane did the rape in the woods. We've seen adult Cathal and Jonathan and I believe adult Shane is the drug addict/homeless looking guy that's appeared a few times.

[Captanne]

Didn't some friend die in New Zealand of natural causes?  Or Robbie lied about "Adam" dying in New Zealand of natural causes or some such?  

Also the mother who keeps saying, "Find Adam" is the one whose daughter went missing -- that's Jamie's mother.  So I guess I should have put Jamie and that mother together and connected the "little girl with the makeup" they were creeping on (Makeup Girl is Jamie.)

Honestly, this show.  Please, I wish it was bingeable so I could keep these people straight and not have to pay Starz $6.99 for one month of membership.  Because I'm cancelling that shit as soon as this is over.

[ghoulina]

17 hours ago, raven said:

I have some trouble understanding how the police force works.  Cassie is a detective I guess but can abandon her usual responsibilities to go under cover because of "other balding, skinny guy?"  That scenario is confusing.

Cassie was undercover before she transferred/was promoted to murder. The bald, skinny guy is the head of the undercover unit. 

At this stage, many people seem to believe there might be a connection between Katie's murder and Lexie's, so I'm assuming they don't see it as a huge issue if Cassie looks into that case, especially given her undercover background.

2 hours ago, Captanne said:

Didn't some friend die in New Zealand of natural causes?  Or Robbie lied about "Adam" dying in New Zealand of natural causes or some such?  

That was Rob lying about what happened to "Adam". He's afraid of the other cops digging too deep and finding out who he is. This story has "Adam" dying in a car accident, though. I believe he said that the police ruled it an accident, but hinted it may have been intentional.

[whydoievencare]

I'm pretty surprised that they've combined two books for one series - I would have thought there was enough in each book to have their own.  I've read the books and really enjoyed them.  

[luckylou]

I have enjoyed this series.  I am surprised so many seem so confused about what is going on.  I have read at least one other book by Tana French, but not these two stories. I admit to having watched several of the episodes twice, which does help clarify who is who.  Cassie/Lexie looks very much like Rob’s roommate by design, I think.  And Jamie looks somewhat like Cassie as well, again maybe by design.  

I do not think the men do look like each other. But it is confusing that the adult characters we see in flashbacks as children look so little like their younger versions.  Again, by design...but again, this adds to the confusion.  

It is hard for me to believe that ten year old ADAM/Rob who is blond and broad faced becomes adult Adam/ROB and is brown haired and narrow faced.  But of course the story requires that no one recognize Adam. Maybe it will turn out he dyes his hair or has had plastic surgery. When I attended  a high school reunion and saw people for the first time in forty years, I recognized nearly everyone without the help of name tags, except a woman who had graduated as a boy, and a couple of others I never knew well.  This in spite of graying and balding heads and more especially weight gains.

At this point, nearly at the end of the series, it appears that both main characters have serious psychological problems related to childhood traumas, neither of which received appropriate attention in childhood. So...the story is at least as much about the mental/emotional problems of Rob and Cassie as it is about who killed Katie and what happened to Peter and Jamie.  And it is clear that Ron and Cassie are much more than police partners.  So it seems to be also a romance.  

I think it will turn out that the murder of Katie occurred because of the murders of Peter and Jamie.  Judging by the lack of commentary about the series on this site, it does not appear there will be a second season. And since the only way of having a second season would have been for Rob and Cassie NOT to get together as romantic partners at the end of season one, I am curious to see how the season ends.  

[Darian]

I may be bailing. I just can't get into the doppelganger storyline. I thought French managed to sell it in the book, despite some gaping plot holes. Her writing is that strong. But I can't motivate myself to start the recording I made last night, so this might be it for me. It's a shame, too, because I like the cast and like her books, usually. 

[KBrownie]

25 minutes ago, Darian said:

I may be bailing. I just can't get into the doppelganger storyline. I thought French managed to sell it in the book, despite some gaping plot holes. Her writing is that strong. But I can't motivate myself to start the recording I made last night, so this might be it for me. It's a shame, too, because I like the cast and like her books, usually. 

I'm interested in the Lexie/Cassie angle and how Lexie became a real actual person and how Cassie created her to deal with the trauma of losing her parents.  I am NOT interested the Lexie/roommates story however.  I don't care one bit about any of the four of them.  I like the focus more on the Katy/Adam story.  Was Katy payback for Jonathan's role in whatever happened in the woods?  I mean, other than him helping to facilitate a rape.   I also wonder if the show is going to provide some real answers about what happened to Peter/Jamie/Adam and why Adam came back and not the others.  There is a lot to cover with only two episodes left.  

And it's too bad they pulled the trigger so quick on Rob/Cassie.  They really are the only ones who can begin to understand the other without judgment or fear.  Despite the very first scene of the series with Cassie telling Rob they won't see each other again, I hope they are able to work something out.

As for Katy's murderer, I totally think Rosalind might have snapped and killed her.  Katy was getting to leave their dysfunctional family and have an actual life.  Something Rosalind has been denied her whole life.  

I've enjoyed the series so far, except for the latest focus on Lexie and the four roommates.  I might have to check out the books.  I've never heard of them before now.  

Edited December 16, 2019 by KBrownie

[Starleigh]

Because they made the choice to put both stories together, it definitely has a rushed feel and some of the important points have been changed, including some of the characterization . Which is a shame imo. Tana French is far and away my favorite (contemporary) novelist. The best part of her books is the characters and slow build up of the detective duo's relationship.

The series really doesn't do justice to the books. I agree, if I hadn't read them, I'd have a hard time keeping up with the plot and characters:(

Luckylou, you have made some good insights but I don't want to spoiler anything so won't make any specific comments! 

The good news is, for anyone who wants to try her books, you really can read them in any order. They are not a series, exactly, just loosely connected. My personal favorite is Broken Harbor.

[Grammaeryn]

This undercover assignment Cassie is on is beyond dumb. Of course she gets found out - there is no anticipation on that front. 
Does Rob have seizures or a weird dislocated neck/shoulder problem? If the show was another genre, I would expect him to be a werewolf with that jerking around!
Sadly, this show started out so well but gets stupider and stupider. The leads have become total assholes. O’Neil and Phelan are angels IMHO. 
I do have a theory that Rosalind is really Sandra Sculley’s child. 

[Captanne]

I'm glad you brought up the seizure question -- remember that weird shower scene when he was gyrating all over the shower like he was growing a third arm?  I was busy doing something else and not paying real attention.  I had blissfully forgotten about it until this weird thing in the bathroom with the quicky.  Ugh.  So weird.

[MaggieG]

I thought it was because he fell out of bed and then landed weirdly on his neck. He was in the shower with the hot water trying to loosen up his neck muscles so he can snap his neck back into place. Not sure why that seemed to come back. He was screwing the roommate and imagining Cassie, maybe the stress of missing Cassie? I'm still enjoying this show and I do think there is potential for a second season. Depending on how this season ends, Rob and Cassie might have to leave their shit in the past and move forward and work on a new case. You can see by the flashback in this episodes and previous episodes (before they slept together), they have a great working relationship and a deep friendship.

[SuzWhat]

I decided to give up on this.   I will read this forum to find out how it ends.  I intend to read the book(s).   

[Captanne]

SuzWhat, I'm almost there with you.  Rob is too weird and Cassie is taking much too long finding out who her twin is/was.  The show is creepy and boring for me.  (I also have no idea why these four horrible young people are living in that mansion, what their relationships are with each other, and how we were suddenly told they are preventing some mysterious bypass from being put in so -- wah, my heart doesn't bleed because I don't care -- no one likes them at the pub).

For my tastes, they made a grave mistake not dropping this all at once so we could binge it.  I really don't want to pay Starz $6.99 to have it dribbled at me one hour a week.  I just don't care enough.

[izabella]

Varys!  So happy to see Conleth Hill again!  And with hair!

That's the best I can say about this series.  I started out enjoying it, then lost track of the plot, and now it's turned into a different case with a dumb plot....it's a big mess.  I'm more interested in what happened back in 1985 than with Katy, more interested in Katy than whatever is going on with those fools in that house, but it seems the show isn't planning on explaining much of anything and is highly confusing. 

I guess there are only two more episodes?  I guess I'll watch to complete the series, but it lost me when Lexie showed up, so I don't know how much I care.  It sure has turned me off any desire to read the books.

3 minutes ago, Captanne said:

(I also have no idea why these four horrible young people are living in that mansion, what their relationships are with each other, and how we were suddenly told they are preventing some mysterious bypass from being put in so -- wah, my heart doesn't bleed because I don't care -- no one likes them at the pub).

See, I'm so confused, I totally missed that they are somehow doing that.  Is that what the rock through the window was about?  Is that what Lexie was being paid for?

[Captanne]

I just went out on Ye Trusty Olde Internet and spoiled myself (because I like spoilers*) and am even more disappointed.  Glad I never read any French novels.

*I do like spoilers.  I've been reading a lot recently about Gilgamesh and an academic noted that old myths and "epics" are so infused with gods and dreams and portents that the main fun of the stories for the reader/listener was not "what happens" but "how it happens" and that the knowing of the future and having it play out as predicted was, in fact, just another way to assert order in a chaotic existence.  So, I'm not worried about liking spoilers as much as I do -- apparently they have a grand tradition.  🙂

Today, frex, we like suspense.  4000 years ago, mankind preferred to know the outcome and to watch the narrative play out according to an orderly plot.  I guess I'm just an old-fashioned girl.

[meep.meep]

1 hour ago, izabella said:

See, I'm so confused, I totally missed that they are somehow doing that.  Is that what the rock through the window was about?  Is that what Lexie was being paid for?

You didn't miss it.  Their opposition to the motorway was inserted randomly into this episode.  Never before have they mentioned the motorway in the Lexie part of the story, or that the group at the house were keeping it from going through.

In the other part of the story, Katy's father is leading the local opposition to the motorway and the archaeologists are working furiously to finish the excavation before it goes in.  I think that was made clear.

[ghoulina]

I don't think it's so much that the college kids are opposed to the motorway. Not in theory. But it seems like they'd have to give up the house and the land for it to be put in. And both of those have apparently been in Daniel's family for years. So I don't think he's too keen to let them get bulldozed.

But yes, the locals want the motorway for the work it will bring. So they're at opposition with the kids in the house. 

[raven]

3 hours ago, izabella said:

I'm more interested in what happened back in 1985 than with Katy, more interested in Katy than whatever is going on with those fools in that house,

This is how I feel.  I was bored with this last episode because I don't care about these people and Cassie was terrible at undercover, not surprised she was found out so quickly.  I like the house though.

Rob's seizure was just so out there and random.  Couldn't the woman he was having sex with tell that there was something physically wrong?  I almost laughed at that, he was so obviously in physical distress and she thought he was drunk or something. 

I am curious to see if Rob's secret comes to light, because him investigating the crime he witnessed as a child and the aftermath is just...not would should be happening.  No wonder he is losing it.   I find myself feeling badly for young Cassie and young Rob (Adam) but not so much for their adult versions.

[Quilt Fairy]

I've been very disappointed by this show.  They made a huge mistake by combining the two novels.  Cassie is the only connection between the two and they take place several months apart, not congruently.  If I had not read them, like other posters I would be confused by the Lexie story and they are giving it terribly short shrift, IMO.  The book on which that storyline is based, The Likeness, is a fantastic book, a true mystery novel full of suspense as Cassie spends many weeks living with the housemates as Lexie, not the few days implied by the TV show.  It's also one of my favorite audiobooks of all time as the narrator has the most delicious Irish accent. 

It's funny, I distinctly remember reading In The Woods many years ago when I was recovering from knee surgery,  and it was a real page-turner.  Now, however, I cannot for the life of me remember whodunit in either of the cases. 

[Captanne]

Because Robbie is a protagonist and such a weird one, at that, the only thing I really care about is what happened in the forest all those years ago and what happened to the other two children. 

Spoiler guarded because, seriously, this is a legit spoiler so don't read it if you care. 

Spoiler

According to Ye Olde Internet, we never find out.  So, fuck it.

Edited December 18, 2019 by Captanne

[RedHackle]

On ‎12‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 4:01 AM, Chas411 said:

I thought it was really good in parts but they tried to do too much in one series. I think the doppelgänger storyline could have waited until the second series. 

I 100% agree. That is an awful lot of plot for a single show, before you even get to the doppleganger twist. I was enjoying the show but felt like that was just one plot twist too many.

[luckylou]

@Starleigh

I broke down and read the two novels.  I must say, I like my idea for what might happen better than what French had happen! I do wonder if the series may change the endings.  If they do not, I think there will be many very disappointed viewers, partially because of the casting, and partially because of the constant clips of the children running through the woods and all the misdirection in both stories.

I thought "In the Woods" was a better novel, in the end, than the other.  The idea that anyone can move in and pass as a roommate without being detected is too far-fetched to accept...imagine duplicating the voice, mannerisms, likes and dislikes without having known the person...  and I did guess immediately "whodunit" long before the ending of "The Likeness."  I see others have questioned the possibility of this on this forum.

On the other hand, the whole doppelgänger portrayed in the TV series is ridiculously hard to accept without believing that Cassie/Lexie is in need of psychiatric help, and clearly Rob needs some counseling both in the novel and in this TV series.  The novel is more believable in that sense.  But the novel dragged on, at least for me, and I found myself skimming the last section, but in the novels neither Rob nor Cassie seems deranged, though Rob clearly has some issues.

Tana French writes extremely well and really draws in readers more interested in investigation and in character than in action, but I think these two early novels are not among her best.  I will probably watch the final episodes just to see how the TV show ends.  If it ends in a way true to the books, I predict terrible disappointment on the part of the viewers still remaining!

 

[Starleigh]

Yes, overall this series has been a disappointment. I liked the first episode or two but then it went downhill. Really the most disappointing thing to me is how unlikable the characters are. Just very different from the books. All except Quigley, oddly enough, he's a jerk in the books but a decent hard-working detective in the show. So weird, all around.

[NeenerNeener]

On 12/16/2019 at 10:11 PM, Starleigh said:

The good news is, for anyone who wants to try her books, you really can read them in any order. They are not a series, exactly, just loosely connected. My personal favorite is Broken Harbor.

Broken Harbour was the one I felt was the weakest, followed by The Trespasser.

What I did like was that every lead detective in each book was a minor character in the book before, with the exception of the first book, of course. 

Now that I've seen this I realize why the two previous attempts to bring The Likeness to film have failed. It really isn't believable.

I'm glad there's finally a forum for this show!

Edited December 22, 2019 by NeenerNeener

[Starleigh]

You definitely have to suspend your belief a bit for the plots to work. Agree with you there! But my favorite part of her books isn't the plot anyway, I love the way she depicts the detective duo's relationship. My favorite scenes are the interrogations of the suspects and how they play off each other. 

And Broken Harbor was a little heartbreaking, and I like that in a book. Not in a movie or television show though!

[MaggieG]

So I totally missed this on the previous episode, but are we supposed to think Cassie is pregnant?

[izabella]

2 hours ago, MaggieG said:

So I totally missed this on the previous episode, but are we supposed to think Cassie is pregnant?

I thought so.  The previous episode had her finding Lexie's pregnancy test, plus the extra one in the box, which she took and it seemed to show Cassie was pregnant.

So, as I understand it, the explanation for Lexie is that the guy who knew Cassie as Undercover Lexie ran into a woman on a bus who looked like her.  He asked her about being sent to rehab (Undercover Lexie's story), etc., and based on that, the lookalike took on Undercover Lexie's cover story and became Lexie.  Okaaayyy.

[luckylou]

“The Likeness” is possibly more believable in the book version because Lexie originates as a typical childhood imaginary friend, not as some bizarre duplicate personality  which leads us to think TV Cassie has multiple personality disorder.  Her acceptance into the house (in the book,) while hard to believe, serves to change the way she closes the case and her choices in life.  

And I think the novel “In The Woods” somewhat changes how Adam/Rob has been damaged by the disappearance of his friends. The memories he gains in the book from interviewing surviving parents and others brings the reader to see how Rob has been damaged by what happened and also, I think, suggests an answer to what actually happened. We see how his preoccupation with the earlier case damages the end result.

These books are as much about the detective as about the criminals.  I think that is what makes Tana French’s books so memorable.

[Quilt Fairy]

8 hours ago, luckylou said:

These books are as much about the detective as about the criminals.  I think that is what makes Tana French’s books so memorable.

Agreed.  And her detectives have messy, complicated lives. 

After the first 2 books, I really enjoyed #3, Faithful Place, which features Frank Mackie, currently seen as Cassie's handler.  But after that one, I don't think I finished a single one of the latter 3.  The were just too slow and too dark. 

[izabella]

17 hours ago, luckylou said:

And I think the novel “In The Woods” somewhat changes how Adam/Rob has been damaged by the disappearance of his friends. The memories he gains in the book from interviewing surviving parents and others brings the reader to see how Rob has been damaged by what happened and also, I think, suggests an answer to what actually happened. We see how his preoccupation with the earlier case damages the end result.

What do you think is suggested?  What I've gathered is he and his "friends" watched the teenagers rape the girl, and then ran away.  Rob/Adam tags along with the other two, the ones that disappeared, and they barely tolerate him and bully him.  Adam was found hugging a tree with some kind of marks on his back and blood in his shoes.  Does that mean the ones who disappeared hurt him and then...what?   Their bodies weren't found, so Adam couldn't have killed them....they would have been found.  Did they run away?  Forever? 

[luckylou]

1 hour ago, izabella said:

 

1 hour ago, izabella said:

What do you think is suggested?  What I've gathered is he and his "friends" watched the teenagers rape the girl, and then ran away.  Rob/Adam tags along with the other two, the ones that disappeared, and they barely tolerate him and bully him.  Adam was found hugging a tree with some kind of marks on his back and blood in his shoes.  Does that mean the ones who disappeared hurt him and then...what?   Their bodies weren't found, so Adam couldn't have killed them....they would have been found.  Did they run away?  Forever

The blood in the shoes, which in the book is established as being type A, so either Adam’s or Jamie’s...if I recall correctly...and the torn shirt are the big puzzle.  Let’s see what the final episode does about this.

[Quilt Fairy]

Even though I didn't remember the ending, I thought Googling it wouldn't really spoil me since once upon a time I did read In the Woods.  I will be interested to see whether Starz stays true to the book or changes things up.  

I think they really fucked up the Lexie story from The Likeness.  I appreciate that you must suspend disbelief to accept that Cassie and Lexie are really identical, and that Cassie can move into her place in the house.  That being said, the relationship between the 5 housemates is extremely important, and you only find out how as Cassie spends more and more time with them.  They identified the killer correctly, but his one statement, "You sold your share of the house"  is the key to why the murder happened, and you would never get that from how it played out in the show. 

[raven]

I really wish they had held out on the doppelganger story.  I thought the very little we got of Cassie playing mind games, after she was discovered, was interesting.  I wanted more of that.

Does the show want me to hate Rob?  Because I kind of do.  I feel terribly for Adam but Rob, not so much, even though I know he is damaged and never got the help he needed or the support he should have had from his parents.

I may check out the books since so many of you are recommending them.  I recently read all of the Ann Cleeves Shetland novels, which were good (excellent character work and settings) but very similar in the way the mysteries wrapped up.  I hope these books are different.

[Irlandesa]

On 12/17/2019 at 3:16 PM, Captanne said:

For my tastes, they made a grave mistake not dropping this all at once so we could binge it.  I really don't want to pay Starz $6.99 to have it dribbled at me one hour a week.  I just don't care enough.

If you paid for two months, it was probably worth it to Starz.  But there is a way to binge, you'd just have to wait until all of the show aired.  I watched the first two episodes and realized it was too slow for me to watch week to week so I basically waited until yesterday to catch up.  And I finished the first seven around midnight when they dropped the final episode. 

I know these were two separate books but I ended up really liking the last two episodes, one of which was primarily with the roommates.  I don't know if it's because I binged or if everything just came together but I thought they were riveting.

I don't know what to make of having a 17/18 year old be a super villain who is able to manipulate everyone and figure out things no one else had.  I also don't quite understand how Rob being Adam puts all of his cases in jeopardy.  Even this case in jeopardy.  The show didn't explain that well.  As I understand it, he had legally changed his name. 

[zoey1996]

I’ve watched only three episodes, and I’m having trouble sorting it out.  Like who is the bearded professor, the one found naked in the woods with the fire and doused with wine?  Was Rob hallucinating the wolf?

There are other things, but that’s a start. 

[KBrownie]

There were parts of this I liked, but overall I feel disappointed.

I guessed a while back that it was probably Rosalind that killed Katy because of how she'd been treated by her family, but like it has been mentioned, her being some kind of evil, mastermind I didn't really buy.  I was thinking some kind of sudden, mental break where she snaps and kills Katy because she resented that Katy was about to get to leave and get a chance at life while she was stuck.  And her whole thing with Rob and Cassie at the end?  I didn't really get where all that was coming from.  Yeah, Rob rejected her advances, but he was trying to sincerely help her I thought.

I still say too much time was spent on the Lexie plot that really didn't end up meaning all that much.  Cassie didn't really go into how Lexie really came into existence.  I would have liked to have seen more of the fallout with Jonathan Devlin's statement about the rape and what happened to poor Shane.  I wanted to see Sandra Sculley get her justice finally.  And did Margaret and Jonathan feel any regret for how they treated Rosalind? It wasn't her fault they were irresponsible and married when they didn't want to.   So much more could have been done than the pointless roommates plot.  

I knew it was coming, but I wanted more Rob and Cassie.  I hate that's that how they ended and that they teased the reconciliation between Cassie and O'Neil(?).  For anyone who has read the books, do they actually never see each other again and Cassie ends up back with the ex?  They really were the only ones who were ever going to get each other, but I understood Cassie's point about them needing to deal with what had happened to them both.  Too bad they couldn't do it together.  That opening scene with them was great.  

Overall, I loved the chem between the leads and the Irish scenery, but the story could have been better.

Also, I wanted to know what happened to Jamie and Peter damn it!  None of this "we raised a darkness" business.  

I did notice they referred to this as a "season" finale.  Are there any plans for more episodes?

Edited December 30, 2019 by KBrownie