S01.E05: Good for the Soul

[paulvdb]

Quote

The Boys head to the "Believe" Expo to follow a promising lead in their ongoing war against the Supes. There might -- MIGHT -- be a homicidal infant, but you'll have to see for yourself.

Premiere date: July 26, 2019

[mac123x]

This was the hardest episode to watch.  The portrayal of Christians as stereotypical gay-hating, pushy hypocrites had me rolling my eyes so hard.  The writers' obvious disdain for Christianity was transparent.

Also, Ezekiel is publicly opposed to homosexuality because he's secretly gay himself?  Fuck off with that self-hating gay bullshit.

[Miles]

The "fly" was there again. Now I'm sure it's a supe.

Intereting that in this version they are actively making new supes out of babies with compound V. In the comics the effects on compound V were transmitted genetically to the next generations... somhow. Yes, the TV version actually makes more sense and brings up interesting questions, like "why?".

Edited July 30, 2019 by Miles

[marketdoctor]

Quote

Also, Ezekiel is publicly opposed to homosexuality because he's secretly gay himself?

In real life, this happened with Roy Cohn and J. Edgar Hoover, among others.  I think they had Starlighter as a counterpoint:  someone who is trying her best, but struggles with her faith, and with temptation, but still tries really hard to do the right thing.

Quote

In the comics the effects on compound V were transmitted genetically to the next generations...

Although that sounds close to Lysenkoism, if the compound V rearranged your DNA (like radiation does), that could be passed on to future generations.

It's not a shot-for-shot adaptation, but in talking with someone who read the comics, they did a good job with the adaptation.  As someone who had not read the comics, I liked the counterplay (The Deep is very shallow; Starlighter kind of just wants to be normal, etc.)  It keeps me thinking, and has the mix of comedy and tragedy that often comes up in life.

[Racj82]

On 7/27/2019 at 10:59 PM, mac123x said:

This was the hardest episode to watch.  The portrayal of Christians as stereotypical gay-hating, pushy hypocrites had me rolling my eyes so hard.  The writers' obvious disdain for Christianity was transparent.

Also, Ezekiel is publicly opposed to homosexuality because he's secretly gay himself?  Fuck off with that self-hating gay bullshit.

All of these things exist in the real world whether you hate them or not. Or whether you think they too tropey or not.

This view on religion is no different than their take down of superheroes. Both avenues are filled with, in show, people constantly keeping secrets and using images to mask who they really are. Also turning something pure and well meaning into a business.

Edited August 1, 2019 by Racj82

[moonshine71]

1 hour ago, Racj82 said:

All of these things exist in the real world whether you hate them or not. Or whether you think they too tropey or not.

This view on religion is no different than their take down of superheroes. Both avenues are filled with, in show, people constant keeping secrets and using images to mask who they really are. Also turning something pure and well meaning into a business.

I think it's a bit naive to go into a show based on a Garth Ennis property and not expect religion to be skewered...

[Morrigan2575]

On 7/30/2019 at 8:29 PM, moonshine71 said:

I think it's a bit naive to go into a show based on a Garth Ennis property and not expect religion to be skewered...

Or Eric Kripke for that matter. LOL

I really liked this episode, I adore Starlight which is why I'm terrified she's going to go bad. I like Maeve as well she's basically what Starlight will turn into if she doesn't get out of the game. It's rather tragic in a way.

[Morrigan2575]

On 7/30/2019 at 1:11 AM, Miles said:

The "fly" was there again. Now I'm sure it's a supe.

Could that be Lamplighter? We're told her retired and he gets referenced a couple of times in the series, plus we even see his image the walls. They say he retired but, I wonder what really happened? Was he killed? Did he turn against Vaught? Is he the mystery guy on the 82nd floor?

[festivus]

I'm really liking this show, I have not read the comic so I knew nothing going in except that show would be dark. Homelander and his mommy fixation, I figured it was going to go there but still, ewww. 

I got a huge laugh out of Butcher using that baby to kill people. I'm a horrible person. It reminded me of some of the darkly funny stuff in shows like Happy or Preacher and how it would crack me up.

[Raja]

On 7/30/2019 at 5:29 PM, moonshine71 said:

I think it's a bit naive to go into a show based on a Garth Ennis property and not expect religion to be skewered...

To cross comics franchises,  "whoooo?".  It begs the question what percentage of the audience is following an artist and what percentage dropped in to see if they got something extra for their Amazon Prime fees.

[CooperTV]

At this point of my binge-watching I'm actually struggling to continue. Karl Urban is super hot, and his accent is even more so... But when the show only has exactly one genuinely good person so far, of the entire cast of psychos, sociopaths, creeps, murderers and hypocrites (not all of them the Seven!), it's hard to care about anything. I mean, I hate Hughie most of them all.

The themes and the writing are not that good (actually, this episode everything was just cliche and bad), and I want the Seven and the Boys just to kill each other, so people could live in peace without those horrible monsters.

[Happywatcher]

On 7/30/2019 at 10:37 AM, marketdoctor said:

In real life, this happened with Roy Cohn and J. Edgar Hoover, among others.  I think they had Starlighter as a counterpoint:  someone who is trying her best, but struggles with her faith, and with temptation, but still tries really hard to do the right thing.

Although that sounds close to Lysenkoism, if the compound V rearranged your DNA (like radiation does), that could be passed on to future generations.

It's not a shot-for-shot adaptation, but in talking with someone who read the comics, they did a good job with the adaptation.  As someone who had not read the comics, I liked the counterplay (The Deep is very shallow; Starlighter kind of just wants to be normal, etc.)  It keeps me thinking, and has the mix of comedy and tragedy that often comes up in life.

If V rewrote genetic code somehow it could be passed in semen, so at least it makes some sense. To save people a few clicks: Stalin didnt like Jews, and thought genetic science was too Jewish. So the Soviets invented a new science. Lysenkoism was the belief that exposing seeds to harsh conditions passed along a resistance to their offspring. It was stupid

[CooperTV]

6 minutes ago, Happywatcher said:

To save people a few clicks: Stalin didnt like Jews, and thought genetic science was too Jewish. So the Soviets invented a new science. Lysenkoism was the belief that exposing seeds to harsh conditions passed along a resistance to their offspring. It was stupid 

Not that it isn't offtopic in this thread but. That's some high kevel misinformation.

Lysenko studied selection and the methods of agriculture that were successful for thirty years straight. Vavilov (who wasn't a Jew, by the way, unlike other people who actually made the Revolution happen and created USSR) did the same (selection and other things) but he wasn't getting any immediate results with his work at the time. Which was a fact, as any important results genetic science got for agriculture were made way after WWII.

[Swartz]

Quote

All of these things exist in the real world whether you hate them or not. Or whether you think they too tropey or not.

Yeah but its always Christianity that Hollywood goes after

[Paws]

Perhaps it’s because many gay people work in Hollywood and were raised in Christian families? Just spitballing here...

I absolutely Love this show! I normally hate anything to do with superheroes but since we’re not meant to admire them it’s just fun. 

[Morrigan2575]

8 hours ago, Paws said:

Perhaps it’s because many gay people work in Hollywood and were raised in Christian families? Just spitballing here...

I absolutely Love this show! I normally hate anything to do with superheroes but since we’re not meant to admire them it’s just fun. 

Or because Christians don't really have to worry about getting shot/killed for simply practicing their religion the way Jews and Muslims do?  If I was a writer in Hollywood I would use Christians over other religions for fear of creating more hate and potentially deadly situations.  

[ketose]

On 7/30/2019 at 1:11 AM, Miles said:

The "fly" was there again. Now I'm sure it's a supe.

Intereting that in this version they are actively making new supes out of babies with compound V. In the comics the effects on compound V were transmitted genetically to the next generations... somhow. Yes, the TV version actually makes more sense and brings up interesting questions, like "why?".

In the words of Butcher, it's diabolical. If you want to hide the existence of a serum that creates supes, you distribute it all over the country so it looks like a random event, like the X-Men. You use it in the NICU because if the baby dies, it's less suspicious. Also, Vought needs more heroes all the time as they expand their customer base.

 

On 7/30/2019 at 7:13 PM, Racj82 said:

All of these things exist in the real world whether you hate them or not. Or whether you think they too tropey or not.

This view on religion is no different than their take down of superheroes. Both avenues are filled with, in show, people constantly keeping secrets and using images to mask who they really are. Also turning something pure and well meaning into a business.

Except religious people exist IRL and superheroes do not.

Edited August 26, 2020 by ketose
slight de-spoilering

[Racj82]

6 hours ago, ketose said:

In the words of Butcher, it's diabolical. If you want to hide the existence of a serum that creates supes, you distribute it all over the country so it looks like a random event, like the X-Men. You use it in the NICU because if the baby dies, it's less suspicious. Also, Vought needs more heroes all the time as they expand their customer base.

 

Except religious people exist IRL and superheroes do not.

Okay... Doesn't actually change anything that I said. This is a world where we everything is the same as ours but we have superheroes. So issues in our world are still issues in theirs.

[Frost]

Was the baby Teddy?   I was trying to see some kind of name on the crib, but I didn't spot one.  Butcher waving the baby around so his laser eyes could decapitate the other guys was so awful and awesome at the same time!  Every time the camera shows Homelander giving Teddy the stink-eye I worry he's going to actually hurt the baby.  I'm OK with black comedy but that would go too far for me.  Of course, the poor dolphin getting launched through the windshield and then splattered by the semi was too far too.  Ugh!  Not the dolphin!!!

I suppose the woman in the nail salon was involved in turning the girl over to the bad guys.  I'm glad Frenchie's faith in her was ultimately rewarded.

Homelander is the worst of the bunch, so far.  He's so cold and calculating.  Total psychopath.  He wasn't interested in even trying to save anyone once he blew out the plane's controls.

I'm confused as to whether Vought is randomly selecting babies to inject with Compound V to turn them into supes, or if they have some inkling a baby has a latent power and uses V to activate it and power it up early.  Activating a baby's superpowers does seem a dodgy proposition, babies not being known for their self control 😁

[MagnusHex]

Started watching The Boys, and as someone entrapped by a Christian mum trying to control my life, I relate to this speech so much:

I started watching this series just this week, a few days ago. It's been an entertaining series so far, but this episode means so much to me, specifically Starlight's sub-plot. It felt like my own life story, having a fanatical Christian mum trying to control how you live and breathe. It's suffocating. All her words in this speech, it's as if she's speaking my mind. God, being forced to swallow a belief that isn't yours. It's all maddening.

My dad, he passed away just last Monday. Heart attack. He was almost as domineering as mum back then, but grew indifferent towards me over the past few years. Now that he's gone though, I feel like my mum, having no one else to control anymore, would turn her attention towards me instead. So I think it's time that I take time away from her, have some space between us. We Chinese, unlike Americans, we have these values my people hold so sacred. But I grew up on American values through American TV shows and movies like The Boys. So I'm glad I got to watch this show and still feel a connection to values in these shows, values I could identify with, not those old-fashioned, stick-in-the-mud Chinese values.

I have nothing against God or Christians, and I'm sure there are some friendly Christians out there who aren't homophobes or fanatics, but man, when you have a mum like mine... it's hard. That kind of unquestioning belief in something as non-existent as God and angels. I hate having my life shackled by something like that. As the good Mercury of Queen would say, "I want to break free!"

The ending to this episode was pretty solid as well. I kinda wanted a more tragic ending, but it's cool how it ended as well. When I first stumbled onto this show, I thought it was gonna be just dark comedy, dark and cynical but still funny, not tragic, tearjerking drama like this, but this ending proved me wrong. It's pretty good so far, this series. Out of the main characters, I could identify with a number of them. Starlight aside, Hughie's ordinary man persona was pretty relatable as well, just trying to do his best in a confusing world. He'd have been a Peter Parker in the The Boys' world of Supes. Butcher could be like Logan.

Speaking of Butcher... man, Karl Urban. What a waste not to have him play Batman. Still waiting, folks. His role in Dredd was obviously the popular go-to whenever someone fan-casts him as Batman, but his role as Butcher is not a bad example either. He's obviously got what it takes to skulk around in the dark and act all menacing. He can be pretty charismatic as well in his past roles (not to mention having a charming face), so playing playboy Bruce Wayne won't be an issue either.

Homelander... what a dick. I don't think he's Brightburn-level evil, but man, he's such a jerk. lol I doubt he couldn't rescue that plane at all the previous episode. And poor Maeve has to go along with his shenanigans. I've got a feeling that all the supes here are being manipulated by Homelander. They seem to fear him and report to him, even A-Train. I think that A-Train actually cared about Popclaw. I was initially skeptical, thinking that he's just using her, but he seems to have actually loved her a lot. It's probably Homelander's orders for him to kill her. 

Wonder how that baby will turn out though. I remember reading elsewhere that he's

Spoiler

Homelander's kryptonite, and Butcher will use the baby against him.

Great show so far. Really looking forward to how it all turns out.

Edited February 21, 2021 by MagnusHex

[Ottis]

On 7/27/2019 at 10:59 PM, mac123x said:

This was the hardest episode to watch.  The portrayal of Christians as stereotypical gay-hating, pushy hypocrites had me rolling my eyes so hard.  The writers' obvious disdain for Christianity was transparent.

Also, Ezekiel is publicly opposed to homosexuality because he's secretly gay himself?  Fuck off with that self-hating gay bullshit.

I found it reasonably accurate.

[Camera One]

It's pretty easy to root for Starlight, and I'm liking the scenes with Maeve as well.  She seems more than the ice queen personae she showed towards Starlight in the first episode.

It seems like Huey is finding it easier and easier to think on his feet and lie.  By the end, I wasn't sure if he was just playing Starlight when he finally told her his girlfriend died, or if that was a genuine emotional reveal for him.  

 

[Bulldog]

Late to the party, but two quick questions:

1) Was Stillwell’s blue fingernail polish supposed to be the same as the missing bottle of polish from the salon?

2) Is it possible Homelander is Teddy’s father?

 

[Affogato]

On 8/17/2019 at 12:47 PM, Happywatcher said:

If V rewrote genetic code somehow it could be passed in semen, so at least it makes some sense. To save people a few clicks: Stalin didnt like Jews, and thought genetic science was too Jewish. So the Soviets invented a new science. Lysenkoism was the belief that exposing seeds to harsh conditions passed along a resistance to their offspring. It was stupid

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetics