S06.E07: Nevermind

[CooperTV]

Quote

Clarke’s past catches up to her.

Original airdate 6/18/2019.

[marcee]

“Possession is 9/10 of the law”???? What in actual fuck? How is that an expression on another planet, hundreds (thousands?) of years in the future where they don’t have a legal system even remotely close to where that expression originated from?

”Sharing is caring”!? Who the hell is writing for Josephine? How is that an expression in fucking Sanctum?

“Zoology 101”? Because I’m sure college class naming conventions survived the apocalypse.

Everything about this episode dialogue is pissing me off.

Edited June 19, 2019 by marcee

[ketose]

Wow. Clark is alive? ALIE is responsible for saving her? That may be the least surprising reveal ever.

Edited June 19, 2019 by ketose

[Guest]

Where was the place Clrake put the lockbbox?  Is that where she killed Finn?

 I was sincerely irritated with Bellamy when Clarke gave up because he made a deal.  I'm more irritated now that he got the morse code message and they'll likely skip over that detail once Clarke gets control of her body back.

I enjoyed seeing Monty and didn't mind his speech about doing better.  I don't know what is wrong with me. That has never happened before.

So Josephine has a library full of memories where she is slitting throats and sacrificing babies and basically committing genocide and the thing she can't look at is that she was being bitchy and a teenager blamed her for his suicide.  I mean it was bad and, yeah if its the worst thing that ever happened, I get it but she is apparently a mass murderer with aspirations to be Hitler, but immortal.

I may having promised this show at some point this episode that I was out if Clarke didn't get her body back..

[Lady Calypso]

As predictable as it was that Clarke would find a way to communicate that she's alive, I still thought it was a good episode. I loved seeing the little things that have happened over the years. I loved seeing Eve Harlow come back as Maya. Maya was a character who I actually really liked, so I was glad to see her come back.

Clarke vs Josephine was actually pretty fun.

Seeing Monty again was what really made the episode for me. 

The only nitpick I have? No way Bellamy would have caught on to the Morse Code right away like that. If Josephine had been in the room for several minutes and Clarke kept doing it, then maybe. 

I liked seeing the return of ALIE and I forgot that Clarke would still have ALIE's chip in her, much like everyone else not named Raven or Abby. Kind of neat that ALIE tried to preserve the memory so Josephine wouldn't get it. I guess even ALIE realizes that Josephine is a sociopath. 

Did we REALLY need Octavia to make an appearance in Clarke's mind? 

It was nice to see the return of Jake as well. We haven't seen him since season 1. 

[roctavia]

39 minutes ago, marcee said:

“Possession is 9/10 of the law”???? What in actual fuck? How is that an expression on another planet, hundreds (thousands?) of years in the future where they don’t have a legal system even remotely close to where that expression originated from?

”Sharing is caring”!? Who the hell is writing for Josephine? How is that an expression in fucking Sanctum?

“Zoology 101”? Because I’m sure college class naming conventions survived the apocalypse.

Everything about this episode dialogue is pissing me off.

Josephine is 200 some years old, though... and was taking college classes on earth before the bombs went off and before she left for sanctum, so the phrasing makes sense to me.. Clarke might not get all of her references though...

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, roctavia said:

Josephine is 200 some years old, though... and was taking college classes on earth before the bombs went off and before she left for sanctum, so the phrasing makes sense to me.. Clarke might not get all of her references though...

I LOLd at "Possession is 9/10 of the law" because of the double meaning.

[ketose]

53 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

Where was the place Clrake put the lockbbox?  Is that where she killed Finn?

 I was sincerely irritated with Bellamy when Clarke gave up because he made a deal.  I'm more irritated now that he got the morse code message and they'll likely skip over that detail once Clarke gets control of her body back.

I enjoyed seeing Monty and didn't mind his speech about doing better.  I don't know what is wrong with me. That has never happened before.

So Josephine has a library full of memories where she is slitting throats and sacrificing babies and basically committing genocide and the thing she can't look at is that she was being bitchy and a teenager blamed her for his suicide.  I mean it was bad and, yeah if its the worst thing that ever happened, I get it but she is apparently a mass murderer with aspirations to be Hitler, but immortal.

I may having promised this show at some point this episode that I was out if Clarke didn't get her body back..

There's the old Mel Brooks line "tragedy is when I cut my finger, comedy is when you fall into an open sewer and die." The bad things Josephine did to be immortal don't bother her. Seeing someone commit suicide for essentially nothing is something she had no control over. Josephine if nothing else is a control freak.

52 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

As predictable as it was that Clarke would find a way to communicate that she's alive, I still thought it was a good episode. I loved seeing the little things that have happened over the years. I loved seeing Eve Harlow come back as Maya. Maya was a character who I actually really liked, so I was glad to see her come back.

That really sucked when Maya got killed. She even said that they (Weathermen) were all guilty as she was dying of radiation. Clarke makes the hard choices, but that's the way it's written in the script. I'm not sure that Bellamy's decision, for example, is objectively wrong. However, whatever Clarke does will be the perfect, but difficult choice.

That choice, of course, will be to burn down Sanctum.

[thuganomics85]

As soon as I saw that this was going to be a twisty, "takes place in someone's mind" episode, I figured we'd see a few cameos from past characters.  Fun seeing Clarke's Dad, Maya (Eve Harlow is always great!), and ALIE again.  And smart to save Christopher Larkin's name till the end credits, so the Monty appearance was a good surprise.  I do wonder if Lexa was ever on the table or if Alycia Debnam Carey is just too busy now, but I did like the significance of her drawling on the wall, and how it clearly was noticed by Clarke and effected her emotionally.

The actress playing Josephine was perfectly creepy, and I it also makes Eliza Taylor's "Josephine as Clarke" scenes even better, since you can kind of see what parts Eliza takes from her performance, and uses it for her own.

I also question Bellamy figuring out the Morse Code thing that quickly, but I guess I can see why the show wanted to hurry things up on that end.

The Primes are starting to feel like the nobles from Game of Thrones, only with immortality, which is even scarier.  A Cersei Lannister that can never die!  Ahh!!!

[AudienceofOne]

Oh good, a bottle episode with Clarke being forced to face a succession of the show's most annoying characters.

The actress who plays Josephine is really bad. I found her acting nails on a chalkboard in the first episode and this was an entire episode of her monologuing. I found it painful. 

Edited June 19, 2019 by AudienceofOne

[dju]

I generally always like the use of Morse code as a plot 'tool' if you will, but the function and the effect of it here was very, very clunky, I echo the comment those have made about it being unbelievable for Bellamy to catch onto it that quickly, or at all. Surely there could be other ways to clue someone in on Clarke being alive that aren't this dependent on very unpredictable variables like someone from the group being around Josephine at the right time, someone paying enough attention, that someone also knowing morse code etc. 

And is it just me or does the continued 'I left him (and everyone else) to die in a fighting pit' thread of guilt Clarke is holding onto feel like TPTB trying to make amends against the backlash they got last season for how OOC/shitty that character decision was. It comes across as disingenuous to me considering how quickly they had Bellamy forgive her for doing that.

[AudienceofOne]

28 minutes ago, dju said:

And is it just me or does the continued 'I left him (and everyone else) to die in a fighting pit' thread of guilt Clarke is holding onto feel like TPTB trying to make amends against the backlash they got last season for how OOC/shitty that character decision was. It comes across as disingenuous to me considering how quickly they had Bellamy forgive her for doing that.

I had completely forgotten it, as I did with most of the scenes from last season where Clarke was (IMHO) wildly out of character.

I didn't mind Clarke's emotional progression in this - even if it was contingent on her believing that Josephine would ever honour any deal. Of course, once she rifled around in her memory files and realised she had evolved into a genocidal monster I guess she finally worked that out. 

As for Josephine's acting - being arch and flouncy doesn't make you a badass. It makes you a teenage girl who thinks pop stars are the same as ageless genocidal dictators. Her performance is painful to watch. 

[ottoDbusdriver]

Oh no, not the oblation !!!  Whatever the hell that is.  This was little more than a glorified clip show.

I thought this episode to be an incredible waste of time.  Filler for the sake of filler.

So, Josephine has not matured or grown wiser at all.  In 200+ years.  She's just become more and more psychotic.  Yeah, that's the kind of person worth preserving as a prime.

[KittenPokerCheater]

12 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Seeing Monty again was what really made the episode for me. 

Exactly.  I was so happy to see him again.

And I don’t get it either; why a guy shooting himself in front of her was her worst memory when compared to everything she did after.  Speaking of the whole after, when will we understand how after Russel killed his family/everyone, he magically brought them back to life and put a chip in them?  

Now, how they get Clarke back and get Josephine out of her (preferablly dead), is something I want to see. 

[Lady Calypso]

27 minutes ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

And I don’t get it either; why a guy shooting himself in front of her was her worst memory when compared to everything she did after.  Speaking of the whole after, when will we understand how after Russel killed his family/everyone, he magically brought them back to life and put a chip in them?  

Yeah, I thought that was dumb. No way do I believe their implication that Josephine saw someone kill themselves in front of her and because of her and that turned her into a sociopath. 

As for your second part, I believe everyone already had the chips in them and were meant to record what they saw and heard. I think they were meant just for research purposes...as in, they were only supposed to be on Sanctum for a select number of years before Elgius came back for them, but then they didn't and Russell killed them all anyway, so Gabriel found a way to alter the chips and upload their consciousness instead.

30 minutes ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

 Now, how they get Clarke back and get Josephine out of her (preferablly dead), is something I want to see. 

I mean...isn't it as simple as paralyzing Josephine and then performing surgery to take the chip out of Clarke's head? She's alive, and now everyone will know, so...isn't it a really simple solution?

[theschnauzers]

Re the Morse Code bit. Bellamy explained it in the scene where he relays the message. I don’t think it was random when Clarke sent it. She still had enough access to what her physical body was seeing and hearing to know when to try to send the message. Not any different from POWs using their eye blinks to send a message. I thought it was a well chosen device.

[ketose]

11 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Oh no, not the oblation !!!  Whatever the hell that is.  This was little more than a glorified clip show.

I thought this episode to be an incredible waste of time.  Filler for the sake of filler.

So, Josephine has not matured or grown wiser at all.  In 200+ years.  She's just become more and more psychotic.  Yeah, that's the kind of person worth preserving as a prime.

Oblation apparently means an offering, which doesn't help at all. It sounds like Josephine wants the Primes to only mate with each other so that they're more likely to end up with nightbloods. I guess to make sure that plan works, everyone who's not a nightblood has to be sacrificed which still makes no sense, since there don't seem to be a lot of Primes.

I also think this show accidentally veered into a philosophical argument. Josephine is just a memory card at this point. She died after a few weeks on the planet. Her father ended someone else's consciousness to install memories that allowed him to believe he was communicating with his daughter again. I can see why Josephine is soulless. The hard drive has no soul.

[Paloma]

31 minutes ago, ketose said:

It sounds like Josephine wants the Primes to only mate with each other so that they're more likely to end up with nightbloods. I guess to make sure that plan works, everyone who's not a nightblood has to be sacrificed which still makes no sense, since there don't seem to be a lot of Primes.

You would think as a scientist she would be concerned about genetic defects due to inbreeding (if she does want Primes to only mate with each other). 

[ketose]

51 minutes ago, Paloma said:

You would think as a scientist she would be concerned about genetic defects due to inbreeding (if she does want Primes to only mate with each other). 

Well, the bodies are totally different. The main connection is that they have nightblood so they can support a memory device.

[tennisgurl]

"We’re back bitches!"

I really liked this episode, because I love Clarke and her constant moral questioning, and how despite doing awful things, she really is trying her best to help people as much as is possible in a world that just seems to be one terrible thing after another. I mean, any one major arc on this show would scar more people for life, and Clarke and the gang have lived through about 78 of them. Except for ditching Bellamy in the fighting pits, that seemed pretty cold even more hard choices, and I think the writers have realized it and have doubling down on how ashamed Clarke feels about it. 

So many call backs! The "We’re back bitches" line, seeing characters of the past show up, lots of places and events being mentioned or shown, Clarke's hairstyles and outfits over the years, Lexa and how much Clarke still misses her, the pictures of tons of past characters, I really liked trying to spot everything and placing all the references. We went WAY back into the archives with references to Finn, Wells, the fact that there were actually 102 people down first, and of course, Monty! Oh God I miss Monty, it was so great to see him and his sweet smile again. 

I guess it never fully registered to me how the Primes have been around for so long they actually remember Earth, even though they always make Earth references that no one else does, so seeing young Josephine on Earth was just super trippy. I dont know if her ex killing himself in front of her is what drove her to become this, as she seemed nice enough when we saw her get killed the first time, maybe it was being killed and brought back over and over that messed her up and made her lose empathy?

The one moment I found a bit out of character was Clarke thinking that Josephine would actually honor her deal and help her people. Clarke is smarter than to trust her, even before she saw how awful she was. 

Edited June 20, 2019 by tennisgurl

[Daltrey]

I find some of the reactions and responses to this episode far more frustrating and annoying than the episode itself. I quite enjoyed it, to be honest, and found that most everything played out in a fairly logical manner.....considering it is "The 100" we're talking about.😉 It's late and I'm too tired to go into more detail, maybe tomorrow I'll share some thoughts. 

[Paloma]

11 hours ago, ketose said:

11 hours ago, Paloma said:

You would think as a scientist she would be concerned about genetic defects due to inbreeding (if she does want Primes to only mate with each other). 

Well, the bodies are totally different. The main connection is that they have nightblood so they can support a memory device.

I guess I was thinking that she wanted Primes to only mate with each other earlier in this society, before all the Primes had gone through multiple body changes. But if the only genetic material that the bodies now share is nightblood, inbreeding is not an issue (unless they use bodies from the same family or unless nightblood itself carries some genetic flaws).

[AudienceofOne]

No, inbreeding is a definite problem.

I feel like they're going for some kind of Eugenics vibe here but it all just makes no damn sense. I mean, Eugenics also makes little sense for the same reason - i.e. inbreeding - but at least they have a large enough population that they could fool themselves otherwise. This society would be desperately trying to import genetic material, not kill off babies that don't have a trait that's incredibly rare.

[ketose]

3 hours ago, AudienceofOne said:

No, inbreeding is a definite problem.

I feel like they're going for some kind of Eugenics vibe here but it all just makes no damn sense. I mean, Eugenics also makes little sense for the same reason - i.e. inbreeding - but at least they have a large enough population that they could fool themselves otherwise. This society would be desperately trying to import genetic material, not kill off babies that don't have a trait that's incredibly rare.

We're all inbred to some extent, since everyone is apparently descended from Mitochondrial Eve from 200,000 years ago. They key is to keep enough genetic diversity between any particular set of parents. That can be done by making sure they are at least 5th cousins or higher, which reduces the amount of common DNA to nearly the level of two wholly unrelated people.

[AudienceofOne]

That's like saying we're all inbred because we're all homosapiens

It's a big difference if you have a very small, contained population trying to breed in a single recessive gene that produces one individual every decade or so.

[Samwise979]

I actually find it more unrealistic that Clarke knew she could communicate through the Christmas lights than Bellamy figuring it out. But, I don't really care about how unrealistic it is, I like this show for what it is. I actually said "yes!" with a fist in the air Breakfast Club style when Bellamy was like, Clarke's alive and we're getting her back!

[Jeddah]

On 6/19/2019 at 2:01 PM, theschnauzers said:

Re the Morse Code bit. Bellamy explained it in the scene where he relays the message. I don’t think it was random when Clarke sent it. She still had enough access to what her physical body was seeing and hearing to know when to try to send the message. Not any different from POWs using their eye blinks to send a message. I thought it was a well chosen device.

Didn’t he say it was from Life on Earth class? That’s a continuity error. He wasn’t in that class because he wasn’t supposed to be going to Earth. Or did I remember that wrong? 

This episode just made me realize that Season 1 feels like a long time ago and like a completely different show.

[roctavia]

1 hour ago, Jeddah said:

Didn’t he say it was from Life on Earth class? That’s a continuity error. He wasn’t in that class because he wasn’t supposed to be going to Earth. Or did I remember that wrong? 

This episode just made me realize that Season 1 feels like a long time ago and like a completely different show.

I think they all took it with the thought that someday everyone on the Ark would be able to go back to earth.... the 100 that got sent were the under 18 that were in "ark jail" and didn't know they were going to earth until just before it happened... at least, I think...

[Jeddah]

25 minutes ago, roctavia said:

I think they all took it with the thought that someday everyone on the Ark would be able to go back to earth.... the 100 that got sent were the under 18 that were in "ark jail" and didn't know they were going to earth until just before it happened... at least, I think...

I thought the flashback when Pike was teaching Earth Skills was a class for the kids about to go, but they didn’t know why they were having the class. Bellamy was a stowaway after trying to kill Jaha so he wouldn’t have been there. I guess you’re right that they probably always had Earth skills class. That makes sense. 

[ramble]

Well this was a slog. The 100 seems determined to push me off the viewing couch. The one bright spot was seeing Monty. I found the whole thing bland. So not only are the primes carelessly murdery and dismissive of the lesser people that serve them they also sacrifice babies. In case you didn’t know they were evil. Ugh. 

[slf]

On 6/21/2019 at 11:59 AM, Jeddah said:

I thought the flashback when Pike was teaching Earth Skills was a class for the kids about to go, but they didn’t know why they were having the class. Bellamy was a stowaway after trying to kill Jaha so he wouldn’t have been there. I guess you’re right that they probably always had Earth skills class. That makes sense. 

Yeah, Pike specifically mentions Bellamy being his student in Earth Skills so it was a class everyone had to take.

[Ziggy]

On 6/21/2019 at 11:59 AM, Jeddah said:

I thought the flashback when Pike was teaching Earth Skills was a class for the kids about to go, but they didn’t know why they were having the class. Bellamy was a stowaway after trying to kill Jaha so he wouldn’t have been there. I guess you’re right that they probably always had Earth skills class. That makes sense. 

Everyone took Earth Skills on the Ark.  Pike was teaching it for a 2nd time to The 100 as a refresher course.  Actually, it was the first time for Octavia, as she didn't go to school.  Also, Clark wasn't allowed to attend the refresher course.  In fact, the person who told Pike to reteach the course specifically mentioned that Clark wouldn't be there.  Pike said, "That's ok, she paid attention the first time."

[Jeddah]

28 minutes ago, Ziggy said:

Everyone took Earth Skills on the Ark.  Pike was teaching it for a 2nd time to The 100 as a refresher course.  Actually, it was the first time for Octavia, as she didn't go to school.  Also, Clark wasn't allowed to attend the refresher course.  In fact, the person who told Pike to reteach the course specifically mentioned that Clark wouldn't be there.  Pike said, "That's ok, she paid attention the first time."

I forgot all of that. At some point I should rewatch this show because it’s just taken some non-sensical turns to get where it is now.

[Ziggy]

On 7/5/2019 at 11:44 AM, Jeddah said:

I forgot all of that. At some point I should rewatch this show because it’s just taken some non-sensical turns to get where it is now.

I can't tell you how many times I completely miss a reference to an earlier season and find someone on this board remembered.  That's one of the reasons I like coming here (even if I have nothing to say).  I always end up following the show better.

I might do a rewatch, too.  I wonder how much of it I'll remember and how much of it will make me go, "Oh, right!"

[roctavia]

Still catching up on this episode, but... didn't they make Clarke a nightblood via bone marrow transplant??? Not Becca's magic zero G serum??