S03.E12: Chapter Forty-Seven: Bizarrodale

[Bort]

Amidst preparations for their upcoming wedding, Sierra and Tom receive an unsettling message, which forces "The Midnight Club" to reunite. Meanwhile, Veronica and Reggie take drastic measures to clean up a mess they created. Cheryl learns some unexpected news about the college she has set her sights on. Lastly, Kevin gives Moose an ultimatum.

Airdate: Wednesday, February 6, 2019

[WhosThatGirl]

So I already know I’m going to not like this episode as it seems to focus on the characters I don’t like at all and happen to be a lot of the most irritating characters to

Me. Reggie. Kevin. Cheryl. Josie’s fine I guess. And also a big focus on the parents again because everyone wants to see more of them? Maybe they do, I personally don’t. Thank you, next.

 

Anyways... 

 

So Jughead was still the narration person instead of someone else? Interesting. Again how does he know things he isn’t around to hear?

 

Also Serria and Tom making the best decision to have a small city hall wedding. Nothing good happens at a tv wedding. And especially doubt one good thing would happen at a Riverdale wedding. So wait serria has a fling with moose’s dad too?

 

Choni scene. Okay Toni you miss the gang but maybe you shouldn’t have allowed your girlfriend to break rules and steal and maybe housed some of your fellow gang members in your mansion. I have a feeling that Toni might not be into doing the college thing. But again am I supposed to feel bad for her getting kicked out of the gang? She showed no remorse and was all about stealing for fun and then being a bitch about it all. Also selling out her friends secret. She’s a real great friend. To me Toni is just as bad as Cheryl. Maybe worse because she’s known these people for almost forever.

 

Love Hermione enlisting her daughter to get money for drug dealers. Slow clap for great parenting skills. I mean look veronica is a moron for burning the drugs because that was dumb as all hell and it really did nothing but love Hermione being all get the money. 

 

Cheryl and college.opps Penalope is ruining it for her. 

 

Hey moose and Kevin. Oh Kevin stop making someone come out of the closet. Are we supposed to think this is cute? It’s not cool for anyone to be forced out of the closet. And I’m not even big on moose.

 

Aw Josie and sweet pea. I’m not sure how I feel about another ultimatum.

 

Sierra And Tom scene. And a letter from the g and g king and the other midnight club members. Ew. So I guess this marks Sierra and Tom off the g and g king list? I suspected it may have been Sierra. Now

I’m back to thinking it’s a lodge parent.

 

Cheryl and Kevin have a conversation. Also love that Cheryl knows, probably everyone does. And thank you cheryl for speaking the truth. Also How how much is bumble paying for advertising on this show as of late?!?!? Also Cheryl don’t help Kevin push someone out of the closet. If someone did that to cheryl, imagine how many houses she would have burned down. Her announcement was super gross. And Kevin don’t act innocent about this whole thing. Kevin totally knew.

 

Hey Toni actually makes a speech and stands up to

Cheryl about what she did! But also again.. I get that the serpents are her family and all that, but really sweetie, I don’t give a damn when you treated them horribly. Because you did.

 

Josie and Archie. So Josie wasn’t dating to focus on music? And Archie offers to take her to her audition. That’s sweet.

 

Veggie scene. Eh. If I didn’t watch live, I would skip.  So Reggie’s grand scheme is to steal money from his dad? I mean his dad sucks because apparently he’s been hitting him a lot which is terrible-also way to just breeze past that information Veronica, yup. Again I feel like sort of like her relationship with Archie, this is kind of a nothing relationship. It doesn’t seem that deep, at least not on Veronica’s end. Maybe it’s deep for Reggie but Veronica doesn’t seem to care all that much about it.

 

Love the parents being like “are we supposed to leave our kids while we run around like teenagers?” Uh, you kind of already do. None of you really parent and when you do it’s not even remotely good at all. Except for Fred. I mean half your kids probably aren’t even at home anyway. 

 

Joises audition. Yeah Archie shouldn’t be allowed to watch but tv wise.

 

Veronica “Reggie were you shot?” Uh, duh Veronica. Seriously. I’m thinking Reggie likes Veronica a lot and Veronica might just like hooking up. That’s totally fine but it’ll be interesting to see people who like them a lot think they are so deep. I think it’s deep for one of the parties involved but not both.

 

So Cheryl and Toni break in for.. something?

 

So Josie didn’t get in. You know what? Slow clap Riverdale. I’m glad sometimes when characters don’t get into their dream schools. Also Archie being a nice supportive guy. Also I don’t have any issue with Josie but she isn’t alone. She has mom and she could have Kevin too. He’s about to be her brother. Shrug.

 

The money was a dye pack. I mean shrug.. that’s not.. surprising to me? I mean.. seriously you can’t just take bags worth of money without them having some sort of protection with it, even Reggie being shot is like a nothing. There’s always going to be a lot of security when it comes to money.

 

So Moose comes out of the closet. I don’t know how I feel about this. It makes me feel uncomfortable about it.

 

So Cheryl is doing her college interview to get Toni in.

 

Hey Gladys is the drug dealer? Aw. Sad. But also high five for calling out Hermione for allowing Hermione to send her daughter out to a drug dealer. I mean she’s a terrible mother too but I guess like crazy knows crazy, terrible knows terrible. And she’s taking Reggie’s car? And of course she doesn’t want Jughead to know but my guess is he will find out.

 

Aw Cheryl says sorry to Moose. And no it wasn’t right. And it wasn’t right for Kevin to force him either. Also of course they are going to the bunker and love cheryl pointing out it needs fresh sheets because everyone has hooked up there.

 

Midnight club scene. Ugh. And Hiram is out of the hospital bed with a cane. 

 

Hey Moose and Kevin getting hot and heavy. I mean whatever. I’m still really angry about how this all went down.

 

The midnight club got punked.  And all the couples got interrupted. That makes me happy that it wasn’t just Bughead. Cheryl wins though “it’s my hateful mother”

 

Except for moose and Kevin. Did they not take their phones? And moose got taken away..  by people working for his dad because he was forced out of the closet? I think we’re supposed to think it’s the king but I think it’s his dad. Although where is he going to send him? The sisters doesn’t exist so they killed them selves and the farm bought the asylum so... I’m curious. 

 

Okay it is for the game. But also didn’t Kevin already start playing? He started with Josie and reggie and someone else.  But wait.. it was Moose’s dad? And another flashback episode about Mooses dad being gay and liking Kevin? And he was sent to the sisters. So the game started at the sisters. Well why wasn’t cheryl forced to play or Polly? Also.. ugh. This story is terrible. Also FP do you know who else was scared by the g and g king? Betty. Who was sent there by your hookup buddy, Alice. 

 

Yeah we are never going to find the g and g king. Because everyone is one, apparently. I mean I’m not sure if this is a terrible tactic for the show, maybe they are just throwing possible suspects at the wall to see which character as the king would stick better, unlike last season when they didn’t have a black Hood killer until the third to last episode and that went down real well but here we are. 

 

Hey Family Jones reunion! FP doesn’t seem too thrilled about that but Jughead seems super happy and it is adorable. 

 

So Sierra and Tom do a city hall type wedding. Again the best option. And no party. And Archie and Josie jam together like the old days.. of last year.  Anyway.. it’s fine. I knew this was leading to a kiss at the end. Also Sierra and Tom happy moment. And Moose is leaving. Because his dad is crazy. Bye Moose. This is sad. This whole storyline is sad and uncomfortable for various reasons I have mentioned.

 

Oh my god. Ew. Cheryl has made her and Toni a new gang. Is this supposed to be cute? It just makes me roll my eyes. Also the fact that Toni just accepts it, yeah she has super great loyalty skills.

 

So Hermione is mad that Gladys had now chosen to stay in Riverdale.

 

Also damn it show.. they’re making jellybean bad and evil? Great. Once again Jughead can’t have anything nice or good.

 

Archie and Josie kiss. Which.. yeah. 

 

So.. another break. So are they going to try to make it seem like Alice or Polly dies next episode? I doubt it. But we won’t know until the 27th.

[Demian]

The older actors on this show must be having the most fabulous time working on it -- this show is daytime soap crap combined with nighttime network budgets, and that's got to be a fun environment to play around in.

(Well, daytime soap crap and nighttime budgets combined with incredibly knowing scripts. which is kinda like catnip to me.)

Edited February 7, 2019 by Demian

[tennisgurl]

How many Gargoyle Kings are running around?! Is Party City running some kind of surplus sale? 

I am starting to suspect that there is no one Gargoyle King, and its somehow tons of different people using the name and costume for their own goals? Like a Riverdale version of the Dread Pirate Roberts?

[WhosThatGirl]

I mean I didn’t hate this episode and I’m surprised about that because I don’t like Cheryl and Toni. Still don’t. Oh yay they have a new gang. Ugh. 

10 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

How many Gargoyle Kings are running around?! Is Party City running some kind of surplus sale? 

I am starting to suspect that there is no one Gargoyle King, and its somehow tons of different people using the name and costume for their own goals? Like a Riverdale version of the Dread Pirate Roberts?

As I said I wonder if they are trying out different characters to see who will be the most good person to pin it on, but it does also seem like people are doing it for different goals.

Also.. are characters still playing the game? Kevin Josie and Reggie were playing at one point, possibly Moose was too? I know he was doing fizzle rocks at one point. The serpents were playing. Veronica and Archie were not, although Archie was/is a pawn in it, Betty isn’t and hasn’t. The kids at the sisters were playing, so were people in the farm in it too? Now they probably are as Alice sent the kids Betty saved there. It’s confusing. I mean I’m starting to think that even if characters aren’t physically playing the game, they are?

Edited February 7, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[WhosThatGirl]

7 minutes ago, Sonoma said:

Haha! Love The Princess Bride reference.

I thought it was a nice episode and break to let the other characters shine. I'm not a big fan of most of the supporting characters but I'm glad their fans got a chance to see more of them.

 

Yeah, it wasn’t as bad as I anticipated. Honestly I feel kind of bad for Moose but I didn’t enjoy the forced coming out of the closet. And Choni is still ew to me. Like it’s hard for me to sympathize with Toni when the reason she got kicked out was because she broke the rules and didn’t help out any of her fellow gang members and like I’ve been saying , her loyalty is thinly veiled, she’s already on a new gang with random girls. It’s hard to like someone like that. That’s why I have such a problem with Cheryl. And I didn’t up until two episodes ago when she was giving Jughead crap about being away to help archie( out of a murder charge, not riding around on a beach tour) and stealing and leaving calling cards about who was stealing. And not doing a damn thing to help any of the other serpents. You lose points there as a person to me. 

Edited February 7, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[methodwriter85]

47 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

How many Gargoyle Kings are running around?! Is Party City running some kind of surplus sale? 

I am starting to suspect that there is no one Gargoyle King, and its somehow tons of different people using the name and costume for their own goals? Like a Riverdale version of the Dread Pirate Roberts?

Kind of like A on Pretty Little Liars, which turned out to be like a million people.

I'm really bothered by the fact that they had a chance to do an openly bisexual storyline with Cheryl, but nope, she's a lesbian. Just like Willow on Buffy or Santanna on Glee or Jenny on the L-Word. Thanks for the bisexual erasure, Riverdale!

I did like Kevin and Moose but I'm not surprised it's over. Oh, well.

Edited February 7, 2019 by methodwriter85

[WhosThatGirl]

1 minute ago, methodwriter85 said:

Kind of like A on Pretty Little Liars, which turned out to be like a million people.

I'm really bothered by the fact that they had a chance to do an openly bisexual storyline with Cheryl, but nope, she's a lesbian. Just like Willow on Buffy or Santanna on Glee or Jenny on the L-Word. Thanks for the bisexual erasure, Riverdale!

I did like Kevin and Moose but I'm not surprised it's over. Oh, well.

Glee at least had Brittany. She got to date Santana and then when they broke up, they allowed her to have a relationship with a guy. She ended up with santana(spoiler). But this show has Toni who is the bisexual character. Granted this was the most she has said in an episode and probably never again. Even by he end of it she’s just back to being Cheryl’s girlfriend.

Also I’m not a fan of Kevin and moose. I hate ultimatums and especially one that requires a person to come out before they are ready. I feel Kevin had an inkling of what Cheryl was going to do by announcing about Moose and that isn’t okay.

[tennisgurl]

I actually liked this episode pretty well, it gave some of the side characters some time to shine, and kind of got close to making some sense. For this show, I consider that a big win! 

Poor Moose and Kevin. When Moose finally came out, and he and Kevin were being all cute and snuggly, I figured that he was doomed, but at least he survived, and could still come back. Damn it show, you finally made me like the guy, or at least pay some attention to him, and then you get rid of him! Poor Kevin. 

That was not cool at all of Cheryl to semi out Moose with her blind item, glad that Toni called her out on it. Her getting Toni the interview at the fancy college was nice though. Although, is Cheryl a lesbian, or bisexual, leaning towards girls? Were all her things with guys just for show? Or is this a Willow from Buffy thing where bisexuality just isnt a thing? And I did love Cheryl showing up with her bow and arrow to save Moose and Kevin. All the other parents are like "are you safe?!" and Penelope is like "where is your bow?!?" The little scene she had with Kevin was actually rather nice. Although, Kevin isnt the only one around here with a 50s aesthetic, Cheryl. Thats kind of the whole town. 

The older cast must be having a blast with all of this old school melodrama. And of course when they call their kids, everyone but Josie and Archie are getting it on. You horny little weirdos.

Speaking of, Josie and Archie? I was digging them as friends, but i can kind of get behind this. I like that their plot was an actually teenager plot for awhile there, and not all filled with mobsters and cults and serial killers. They both sure sound great together. 

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I actually liked this episode pretty well, it gave some of the side characters some time to shine, and kind of got close to making some sense. For this show, I consider that a big win! 

Poor Moose and Kevin. When Moose finally came out, and he and Kevin were being all cute and snuggly, I figured that he was doomed, but at least he survived, and could still come back. Damn it show, you finally made me like the guy, or at least pay some attention to him, and then you get rid of him! Poor Kevin. 

That was not cool at all of Cheryl to semi out Moose with her blind item, glad that Toni called her out on it. Her getting Toni the interview at the fancy college was nice though. Although, is Cheryl a lesbian, or bisexual, leaning towards girls? Were all her things with guys just for show? Or is this a Willow from Buffy thing where bisexuality just isnt a thing? And I did love Cheryl showing up with her bow and arrow to save Moose and Kevin. All the other parents are like "are you safe?!" and Penelope is like "where is your bow?!?" The little scene she had with Kevin was actually rather nice. Although, Kevin isnt the only one around here with a 50s aesthetic, Cheryl. Thats kind of the whole town. 

The older cast must be having a blast with all of this old school melodrama. And of course when they call their kids, everyone but Josie and Archie are getting it on. You horny little weirdos.

Speaking of, Josie and Archie? I was digging them as friends, but i can kind of get behind this. I like that their plot was an actually teenager plot for awhile there, and not all filled with mobsters and cults and serial killers. They both sure sound great together. 

Archie should always duet with people. He sounds better that way.

[Dee]

KJ & Ashleigh positively sparkle onscreen. She's the best scene partner he's ever had.

Gina Gershon is the best. There better be at least a couple of good catfights between she & Alice in the near future.

Kevin & Moose were boring. Can Kevin have one drama free relationship?

Also? Poor SweetPea deserves love.

Tom & Sierra are an E-Harmony commercial.

While I'll always be partial to McMantle, Veronica & Reggie could be fun if the show cared about actually writing for Reggie.

Cheryl, Toni & everything Choni have to go. That includes Penelope.

[ruby24]

I think Reggie's hot but he's obviously limited as an actor, and maybe that's why they haven't bothered to give him much of a character? I still think they ought to give him more of a personality than just dumb beefcake guy, especially since they're definitely going down this Veronica/Reggie route. She seems too sophisticated to take him seriously. If they want to do an Archie/Veronica/Reggie triangle at some point down the road, they'd have to give him something more for there to be any suspense about who she'd choose.

[WhosThatGirl]

13 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

I think Reggie's hot but he's obviously limited as an actor, and maybe that's why they haven't bothered to give him much of a character? I still think they ought to give him more of a personality than just dumb beefcake guy, especially since they're definitely going down this Veronica/Reggie route. She seems too sophisticated to take him seriously. If they want to do an Archie/Veronica/Reggie triangle at some point down the road, they'd have to give him something more for there to be any suspense about who she'd choose.

The problem is this episode kind of

highlighted that all Veronica seems to see him as is a beefcake, someone to pass the time with and someone who will do things for her. Which is fine but it puts Veronica in a bad light. I mean they showed Reggie caring about her well being more than Veronica did for him, as I mentioned above he said something about stealing money also to get back at his dad for hitting him throughout the years and Veronica didn’t even acknowledge that. It really doesn’t put her in a great light right now regarding the relationship. I mean I’m perfectly fine with her viewing this as a non serious thing but yeah the show has to figure out if he’s really meant to be a contender for her seriously.

Edited February 7, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[Snookums]

Heh heh heh. For an episode titled Bizarrodale, this was least chaotic one in a while, while still being fun crazy!

Nice to see Moose, Josie, and Reggie getting more to do. Josie especially killed it--when she's talking about how much she's given up to stay Mature and Focused and how it didn't matter in the end and she has no idea what to do she really sold the scene. Especially when you think about the earlier line about how she couldn't ask her mom for a ride because if she didn't get in there'd be no end to her mother's nitpicking over what they could have done differently. I appreciated the theme of the episode--that you can really try and be really good and it may not get you what you want--being taken seriously with her character. And KJ was great as a supportive friend.

I really wished they hadn't kissed because I was so digging the idea that these two could be really good friends, have a person in their lives that's important without romantic feelings but just as special. Also, this means Archie has dated THREE of the four Pussycats (of course, Val and Melody have vanished into the ether, but still) and if I was Josie I'd be doing a head tilt at that idea. However, they did have really good chemistry and Archie's asking "can I kiss you?" shows that consent can be hella sexy.

Moving on to the Bumbling Not Bank Robbery: I wish this story had some more screen time! Because Reggie and Veronica make a great comedy duo of two people who are in too deep but can't back out now, and Ronnie's constant "plan plan plan as things get crazier" while Reggie asks if breaking kneecaps is a real thing is honestly delightful! Poor Reggie, he wants to be tough (his earnest joy in being able to "say I got shot!" while Vee gently points out the entire idea is that NOBODY KNOWS THAT THEY DID THIS was hands-down adorable) and his comment about his dad's handing out shiners like they're his allowance underlined that.

(And frankly Mr. Mantle better watch out. Because his kid is GIGANTIC and has been taught all the wrong lessons about physical violence. Someday he's going to hit back.)

Okay, somebody help me out here--is Gladys working for Hiram as his liaison in this deal? Because that means Hiram's buying the factory? That he owns? From his wife? Who doesn't seem to know that, right? And Hiram found out about this while lying in a coma? Or is Gladys double crossing Hiram and working for Edgar or whoever or for herself or what? And she found out about this sale from Toledo? CONFUSED IS WHAT I AM. And why is Gladys so happy to be back in Riverdale while recruiting her preteen daughter against her own father and brother? If there's anything Riverdale has by way of an embarrassment of riches, it is shitty, horrible parents; as much as I love Gina Gershon, this is the fifteenth cherry on this sundae.

While I'm glad Josie and Kevin are happy for their folks (and Tom and Sierra have a believable "found my old flame again" heat) I do wish they'd at least ask about their other current, living parents. Kevin's mom is in a war zone, for God's sake! I'm not suggesting they be invited to the wedding but a single line or so about the fact that these kids are about to be stepsiblings while not even bringing them up seems weird.

But never mind that, onto the Plot That Will Not Die: G&G, The Re-Uppening! 

All I can say is that finding out who the 'real' Gargoyle King is better be worth it after all these shenanigans. While my heart went out to Moose's dad, the show once again does not stick the landing by handing this huge, twisted revelation to an character we've just barely seen and can't have a real connection with. Plus, while it was established that he was exposed to this craziness by the SOQM, how on earth did he know anything about the Midnight Club and Ascension Night? He wasn't a member and it's a sure bet Hiram wasn't recruiting him for this bullshit. Blah.

Honestly, every time they cut back to this story I was "oh, right, this." But the actors were having a blast, which was fun to watch, and man oh man, I don't know who Nathalie Boltt is married to but I assume it's the costume designer. Her outfits in this were TO DIE FOR, especially that getup she had on at the initial meeting with the velvet poppies. Perfectly over the top while staying on point thematically. The cyanide antidote (loved how everybody side-eyed her at the same time until she just said "oh please" and downed hers, hee!) and asking Cheryl if she had her bow really gave her a bunch of fun notes to play.

Cheryl is Cheryl, again, and while I'm glad Toni called her out on her self-centeredness (outing anybody is wrong, but a minor teenager whose dad is CLEARLY not down with this? She could have, and nearly did, get him killed) that whole thing was so After School Special that even Madeline's flawless line reads couldn't cover the seams completely. And frankly, her ability to say what I'm thinking IRT that nasty ass bunker cot makes me forgive her for a lot.

 

Quote

I'm really bothered by the fact that they had a chance to do an openly bisexual storyline with Cheryl, but nope, she's a lesbian. Just like Willow on Buffy or Santanna on Glee or Jenny on the L-Word. Thanks for the bisexual erasure, Riverdale!

This annoys me too! One, because as you say, it makes bisexuality seem like a cowardly dodge rather than a sexual identity and two, they HAVE gay characters! Kevin is gay! Always has been! Toni says she's bi but since she's nothing but Cheryl's Girlfriend these days, it doesn't seem to really count.

[HeatLifer]

9 minutes ago, Snookums said:

I really wished they hadn't kissed because I was so digging the idea that these two could be really good friends, have a person in their lives that's important without romantic feelings but just as special. Also, this means Archie has dated THREE of the four Pussycats (of course, Val and Melody have vanished into the ether, but still) and if I was Josie I'd be doing a head tilt at that idea. However, they did have really good chemistry and Archie's asking "can I kiss you?" shows that consent can be hella sexy.

This. All of this. 

And, if anything, I wish they could have actually built Josie and Archie for real ‘cause there was hella potential there if they gave it the time. Alas, it’s not happening for a number of reasons, so I’m just enjoying it for what it is.

Also, once again, KJ can have chemistry with all humans and inanimate objects. 

[WhosThatGirl]

18 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

This. All of this. 

And, if anything, I wish they could have actually built Josie and Archie for real ‘cause there was hella potential there if they gave it the time. Alas, it’s not happening for a number of reasons, so I’m just enjoying it for what it is.

Also, once again, KJ can have chemistry with all humans and inanimate objects. 

Eh, I think he has chemistry with some but not all. Like I never see chemistry with him and Lili but maybe that’s because to me cole and Lili have it in spades and it overpowers anything KJ can have. I think sometimes he can have good chemistry with Camilla but the show ruins it sometimes. That’s just me. We all have different views. He did have quite good chemistry with Ashleigh though.

Also I really didn’t like the Choni scenes tonight. As I said many times it just highlighted that the writers don’t know how to write Toni and have never seemed to know how. Yeah she got a great moment telling cheryl off but as I said by the end of the episode it’s all back to status quo for her of being Cheryl’s girlfriend. But again have they ever written Toni well? I mean let’s be real she jumped on this show and immediately was a Bughead foil before anyone could even warm up to her and then she was mostly just around for Jughead to vent to and occasionally she got to call him out but then they threw her into the Choni relationship and she became.. a girlfriend. I don’t think she’s ever been written decently.

Edited February 7, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[HeatLifer]

36 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

chemistry

Chemistry, to me, isn’t just about romantic or sexual chemistry, though, which is what I’m assuming you’re referring to. Lili and KJ do a great job portraying close friends. That’s chemistry. 

[WhosThatGirl]

Just now, HeatLifer said:

Chemistry, to me, isn’t just about romantic or sexual chemistry, though, which is what I’m assuming you’re referring to. Lili and KJ do a great job portraying close friends. That’s chemistry. 

I mean maybe. Since I haven’t seen it in a while, even that brief scene when helped him dye his hair was kind of nothing. It’s been a while since I’ve seen them really act like friends.

The thing is I also don’t really see the Veggie chemistry either and others do? Tonight highlighted that for me as well, mostly that Reggie seems kind of ready to be all in and veronica just seems like she is using him to pass the time and someone who is willing to help her and do things for her. Which is fine. You do you veronica. It also brings me back to a point that I and a lot Other posters had about veronica trying to clear archies name may not have at the end of the day been about Varchie and Veroncia and how much she loved and cared for archie(which I’m sure she did) but was more about winning against her father a lot too and proving him wrong. Like I said im sure she loved Archie and cared deeply for him but I also think a large part of her was about winning too. 

That said like someone else said if they plan on doing a Varchie/veggie triangle, I saw veronica deeply caring for Archie at a time, I haven’t seen that in her feelings for Reggie. At least not yet. I agree with someone else that Charles is kind of limited so maybe that’s the issue? I just don’t see chemistry. At least not deep feelings chemistry. 

[Snookums]

Did anyone catch all the Patricia Highsmith references? Not only Highsmith college, but the "community college theater production of The Talented Mister Ripley" and Penelope telling Cheryl "this is the price of salt." 

[bara007]

14 minutes ago, Snookums said:

Did anyone catch all the Patricia Highsmith references? Not only Highsmith college, but the "community college theater production of The Talented Mister Ripley" and Penelope telling Cheryl "this is the price of salt." 

Interesting! "The price of salt" reference is probably well placed with these two characters .... but not entirely:)

[bobbyjoe]

With Kevin and Moose tonight, the show pulled a fake-out on the “kill your gays” problem on tv where too often an LGBT character is the sacrifical lamb in the cast when the producers feel they need a “shocking” death.  Particularly when two LGBT characters get too close, tv still too often quickly offs one of them.  So for a minute there it looked like Moose was headed for Riverdale’s secondary Archie character graveyard (where folks like Miss Grundy and Dilton Doiley are buried).  This would have been particularly bad as we’ve already seen one of Kevin’s lovers get killed off this season.  Good for the show in not following through and instead turning it into a story about repressed homophobia.*

*I do agree with people above who say Kevin was being a jerk about demanding Moose come out, but that kind of insensitivity is also, unfortunately, sometimes pretty realistic behavior in somebody as young as Kevin’s supposed to be.

Edited February 9, 2019 by bobbyjoe

[Advance35]

Did Riverdale trend Worldwide last night?  It usually does.  Like them or not (I am the latter) the Bugs appear to be a necessary evil.

The secondary characters have never been of particular interest to me and that's still the case.

For my money, Veronica Lodge is the most mistreated character on the canvas.  They really never allow the character any pathos (and I think CM is as serviceable as the rest of the cast). Can we have the girl comment on her father please, his status or their status as a family after finding out what her Mother was up to?

What was pointed out upthread I kind of agree with, Veronica is selfish but we have seen her acknowledge this, when Fred was shot she said she can plan parties and spearhead an awesome shopping spree but that she doesn't know how to "be there" for other people.  God forbid the writers ever explore or address this.  This has appeared in her relationships, she'll give material things and ride her boytoys till they beg for rest and water but she wasn't taught the value of genuine emotion, which is no surprise with parents like Hiram and Hermione.

She and Reggie have potential but they need to do more with him.  Is it an acting thing?  If so, give him a little coaching, they should have one on stand by after KJ's attempt at playing drunk last week.

Reggie thinks outside the box, is morally fluid (dealing jingle jangle in S2) and is clearly very protective of Veronica.  C'mon writers, let's see some effort here.

Gladys should not underestimate Hermione Lodge who I maintain is still the most dangerous character on the canvas.  What we don't see is just as important as what we do.  She plotted to murder Hiram with FP, schemed to frame FP for the crime, while plotting to sell Hiram's drug labs to FP's ex-wife?  Around and around she coils.

I hate Archie and Josie.  It was like watching raw vegetables boil. I admit I'm bias since Archie got the sympathy edit in his break up with Veronica and I hate Josie because she is getting better writing then Veronica (likely to build her up for next year), if only Ronnie could make it off Gilligan's Island.

[WhosThatGirl]

I mean having veronica comment on her family isn’t going to happen because none of the teenagers really comment on their family and their misdeeds until they want to work it into a plot for that episode It’s dumb. At least to me.

Also its so funny to me that people on Instagram are upset Gladys turned it to be evil when I knew from the moment we met her she wasn’t going to be up to no good. I rolled my eyes and knew I wouldn’t like her, she abandoned her teenage son and left him with his father who was a drunk and running a hng(reasons why she said she left) and refused his call to live with her. Yup, she was always going to be a winner. I didn’t care what actress was going to play gladys she was always  going to suck. So her turning out to be a drug dealer.. small shrug. I mean it breaks my heart for Jughead. I’m sad they roped Jellybean into it, though. There was no need for that. Except for the inevitable Jughead breakdown. Seriously this show seems to love to torture certain characters and put them though the ringer a lot. 

[thuganomics85]

Damn, I've seen some tough parenting on TV, but Hermione being all "This is your fuck-up, Veronica, so you get to fix this or the drug dealers will deal with you!" is hardcore!  Of course, it ends up being Gladys that she was dealing with, and she is being lenient for now.  Likely because she seems to have an even bigger plot in store.

I'm under no illusions that Cheryl isn't anything but a selfish, diabolical queen 90% of the time, but even by her standards, outing Moose more or less (even though she didn't actually say his name) was pretty damn low.  I'm glad that Toni called her out on everything at least, but I do it was still going to end with Cheryl fixing everything, and everyone pretty much forgiving her.  It sucks since I think Madelaine Petsch is great (by this show's standards at least), but they've really been doing a number on her character this season.

Pretty easy paycheck for Cole Sprouse and especially Lili Reinhart, huh?

Glad neither Kevin or Moose died, but of course it had to end with them breaking up.  Kevin can't catch a break.

Archie and Josie are fun together, but I'm not sure if a romance will turn out well.  Especially since that can be said for any relationship that poor Archie has been in.

Always enjoy when the adult actors are together and watching them all have a blast dining on this campy material.

So.  Many.  GARGOYLE KINGS!!!

And to end things on a shallow note: damn, Camila Mendes was looking extra great in this one!

[Wilpen]

I'm almost glad Gladys is a dirty drug dealer. It explains how any mother could abandon her child like she did Jughead. Go away, Gladys.

I adored Jughead eating off of Betty's plate.

I didn't like the scene with Veronica straddling Reggie. I thought of the younger audience watching the episode and cringed a bit. Every other pairing had a tenderness and mutual, balanced dynamic... Bughead, Koose, Choni, and Archie/Josie. I don't know... I just cringed a bit witnessing that Veggie scene. Rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe it's more due to how it's obvious Reggie is way more into Veronica and the relationship (so far) is just not balanced. It could also be because I've never seen such stupidity... trying to rob a car dealership in broad daylight.

Why were the adults all sneaking in through the window? They had the sheriff and the mayor with them. Couldn't they have gone through the front door? lol.

Edited February 9, 2019 by Wilpen

[Lady Calypso]

Well, this episode wasn't as bad as I expected it to be. See, show? When you focus on the other main characters not named Archie, Veronica, Jughead, or Betty, it's not so bad! I'm just laughing that they relegated their other main cast members to have a prominent role in a "special episode". 

Of course, the Veronica/Reggie stuff still annoys me with how Reggie's been acting. And the Cheryl stuff was abysmal, like I thought it would be. But the Kevin/Moose stuff was decent. I don't know why they went this route, but I guess Moose is gone for now. Now Kevin has no plot again. 

Gladys is back and is shady, which makes total sense. Her and Jellybean are in on some scheme which....alrighty, then. 

The Archie/Josie stuff was actually very sweet. Archie deserves some normalcy and Josie deserves some kind of plot.  

Cheryl outing Moose is actually not surprising. It just makes me never want to like her again. Toni bitching her out was warranted. I like Toni way better than I like Cheryl, even if Toni has merely been a plot device for other characters.

[SourK]

On 2/6/2019 at 9:20 PM, tennisgurl said:

How many Gargoyle Kings are running around?! Is Party City running some kind of surplus sale?

I kind of like the idea that maybe the Sisters create a whole generation of Gargoyle Kings by being total assholes to kids they didn't like back in the 60s. Kind of like, this is their legacy of inter-generational trauma. They taught those boys to terrorize people they don't like in this really particular, messed-up way. Good job.

On 2/6/2019 at 10:45 PM, tennisgurl said:

Poor Moose and Kevin. When Moose finally came out, and he and Kevin were being all cute and snuggly, I figured that he was doomed, but at least he survived, and could still come back. Damn it show, you finally made me like the guy, or at least pay some attention to him, and then you get rid of him! Poor Kevin.

I get that it's 100% a plot reason why Moose and Kevin had to have sex in the gross bunker and also tell everyone that that was their big plan -- they needed to be somewhere the Gargoyle dicks could nab them, and somebody needed to know. But Jesus. On the one night everybody's parents are LARPing at the high school, those two decide their big romantic moment needs to be there?! Really? Ugh.

On 2/6/2019 at 11:01 PM, Dee said:

KJ & Ashleigh positively sparkle onscreen. She's the best scene partner he's ever had.

Agree. I was surprised by how much chemistry they had, and I love that shot where they're breathing really hard because they were just singing at each other, and suddenly the mood turns sexual. If they only had less dialogue they'd be a great TV couple.

On 2/7/2019 at 1:10 AM, WhosThatGirl said:

Also I really didn’t like the Choni scenes tonight. As I said many times it just highlighted that the writers don’t know how to write Toni and have never seemed to know how. Yeah she got a great moment telling cheryl off but as I said by the end of the episode it’s all back to status quo for her of being Cheryl’s girlfriend.

I didn't like the part where Cheryl essentially bought a new gang for her to make up for getting them kicked out of the old one. That's... not the point of that story. I also really dislike this pattern we're seeing where Toni only shows up in scenes with Cheryl and sometimes doesn't even get to talk while Cheryl monologues to her.

7 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Damn, I've seen some tough parenting on TV, but Hermione being all "This is your fuck-up, Veronica, so you get to fix this or the drug dealers will deal with you!" is hardcore!  Of course, it ends up being Gladys that she was dealing with, and she is being lenient for now.  Likely because she seems to have an even bigger plot in store.

Yeah. That decision tracks with what we've seen people do on Riverdale before but that would make no sense in real life. Partly because it would almost definitely end with Veronica getting hurt or killed -- which Hermione shouldn't want if she loves Veronica as much as she says she does -- and partly because Gladys would still hold Hermione responsible for the deal regardless of who she sent as a go-between. This seemed like a really weird, out of character decision that only happened so that Veronica would know Gladys was a drug dealer and have to keep it a secret.

[WhosThatGirl]

The problem with Cheryl and Toni getting a brand new gang definitely just retracts Toni’s feelings and like I said in a different post continues to make me lose sympathy for her. I mean I didn’t have very much but I sort of understood when she tried to explain to cheryl that the serpents were her family and they accept her and whatever but by episodes end when cheryl shows her a room full of randoms and says we have a new gang, she’s like okay fun! Yeah.. she definitely loses any points of any sympathy and it just proves she isn’t a good person either and has no loyalty.

It also doesn’t help that I guess Choni is just honestly going to have no real conflict or problems if this episode is any indication. I mean I know normally they are just background noise so we don’t get time to focus on them too much but this episode just made me think, they finally have a disagreement and fight but by episodes end, they’re together and better than ever. Also more than likely Cheryl will probably be footing the bill for Toni’s college and... they are probably never ever breaking up. I’m not sure if this is good or bad.  

I mean another reason I fear they won’t break up is because a lot of the Choni stans  are kind of insane and so well... there’s that. I can’t imagine how they would react if the couple broke up. They get angry when the couple has a scene where they hold hands and get mad because they don’t speak. I really think Choni is always going to be safe. Sure they might have a fight but by episodes end like a silly sitcom everything will be fine in the end. Why doesn’t anyone complain about that ship staying together and being boring? 

[Advance35]

Quote

Damn, I've seen some tough parenting on TV, but Hermione being all "This is your fuck-up, Veronica, so you get to fix this or the drug dealers will deal with you!" is hardcore!  Of course, it ends up being Gladys that she was dealing with, and she is being lenient for now.  Likely because she seems to have an even bigger plot in store.

I've always wondered if Hiram and Hermione would become sick of Veronica foiling all of their schemes.  Half the stunts they try to pull, only work out 60% because Veronica consistently tries to work against them.   I don't doubt they love Veronica, but I wonder if eventually, they might decide they love themselves more.

[angora]

Well, at least neither Moose or Kevin got killed.  I was nervous as soon as Moose said that coming out to his dad went okay and holding my breath as soon as all the parents started calling their kids.  Still, bad form for them to hook up and then immediately ship Moose off, even if I get it from a character perspective.  Cheryl was definitely wrong to meddle in the first place and "blind item" out Moose.  I have a little more sympathy for Kevin - no, he shouldn't try to force Moose out of the closet before he's ready, but Kevin also needs to take care of himself, and if it's hurting him emotionally to be sneaking around with a guy, I can understand him getting to a point where he says, "I care about you, but I can't keep doing this."

Reggie and Veronica kind of worked for me here.  Their disastrous caper was pretty fun.  I liked Veronica sitting in the getaway car in her sunglasses and headscarf, and spoiling Reggie's excitement about being able to tell people he got shot was pretty amusing.  Although, what was up with her awkward non-reaction to Reggie telling her his dad beats him?

Okay, so I have a history of not being able to tell when a show is setting up for a new couple.  Last week, when Josie helped Archie while he was spiraling, I thought, "Aw, so nice that we can see two characters of corresponding genders/orientations just being friends and supporting each other!"  Shows what I know (for the record, I thought the exact same thing about Bughead until like a second before they kissed for the first time.)  Oh, and seriously - "People Like Us" from Michael John LaChiusa's The Wild Party?  What an oddly random pull.  I do not buy for a second that either of those characters would know that song.

Poor Jughead looked so blame happy hugging his mom.  She's gonna break his heart all over again, isn't it?

[HeatLifer]

11 minutes ago, angora said:

Poor Jughead looked so blame happy hugging his mom.  She's gonna break his heart all over again, isn't it?

Oh, yeah. But I’m also imagining his ride in finding out the truth and whether he’ll even believe it at first. I feel like he’s going to want to keep his family together initially, so this will be an upsetting revelation.

[SourK]

I forgot: one thing this episode taught me is that gay guys can use Bumble. I legitimately didn't know that. And I googled to make sure it was true, and it was! I can only conclude that Bumble sponsored the show and that's why the characters finally said something true.

Also, imagine how different the A-plot would have been if these adults had trusting relationships with their kids, such that they could say, "I can't tell you why, but something dangerous might happen tonight. All of you should stick together and look out for each other." Also, maybe Hiram's security people could have watched all the kids if Veronica hadn't fired them while he was in a coma after Hermione and FP tried to kill him. So many what ifs.

[Snookums]

I found it intensely hilarious that while all the other parents were calling their "Having Better Sex Than You Ever Did" kids and going "LOCK THE DOORS! ARE YOU OKAY???" Penelope just rings up Cheryl and goes "get your bow and kill this asshole." In a bizarre and horrible way they totally get each other.

[Carrots4]

Ugh, this show. If Moose’s dad wanted to scare his son straight, what was the point of the “got you” message on the wall for the midnight club?  It was a waste of time and resources. Also a little weird that Moose used Kevin’s last name when saying goodbye. They were boyfriends, not business partners. The rest of the ridiculousness has already been pointed out, such as the Midnight Club having to sneak in through a window. At this point I’m watching just to see how it ends.

[Wilpen]

All those Gargoyle Kings running around reminds me of the endless A's on PLL, lol. 

[WhosThatGirl]

4 hours ago, Wilpen said:

All those Gargoyle Kings running around reminds me of the endless A's on PLL, lol. 

Yup and I don’t think that’s a great story. I hated it with pll. The only good thing I can take is that with Riverdale they tend to end their story arcs but seasons end and start a new one, unlike pll so we will more than likely get an actual real king maybe.

[Wilpen]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Yup and I don’t think that’s a great story. I hated it with pll. The only good thing I can take is that with Riverdale they tend to end their story arcs but seasons end and start a new one, unlike pll so we will more than likely get an actual real king maybe.

Very true. I wish PLL would have followed the book series more closely concerning the mystery. I think it was a mistake on MKs end trying to get too cute and original. MK followed the book series closely in season 1 which is why it’s arguably the best season of the series. 

Hopefully the GK reveal has a nice payoff. 

Edited February 10, 2019 by Wilpen

[WhosThatGirl]

1 minute ago, Wilpen said:

Very true. I wish PLL would have followed the book seriesmore closely regarding the mystery. I think it wasa mistake trying to get too cute and oringal. MK followed the book series closely in season 1 which is why it’s arguably the best season of the series. 

Hopefully the real GK reveal has a nice payoff. 

I never read the book series but I’ve read people that point out like you have just done that the book series of the mystery was much better and that the show started to veer off because it was a tv show and they had fan bases to attest to. 

Anyways. I was starting to enjoy the g and g king mystery but I’m enjoying it less and less when there appears to be many kings and now it’s stopped making sense again(I know, does anything on this show?) and now I’m thinking the playoff isn’t going to be good at all. I mean it probably won’t be as bad as the reveal of the black hood but I doubt it’s going to be good at all because even when we find out who the king is, it’s probably not going to mean anything. Everyone is a king at this point for various reasons. Hell, I’m not going to be surprised if all the parents have decided to be a king to get an end goal of some kind. 

The problem is we aren’t getting any answers to anything and I know it’s this show but I have a ton of questions left over and more keep popping up that will never be answered. Did everyone stop playing the actual game? Because as I’ve said there were episodes where the serpents were playing and then Josie Kevin and Reggie started playing and it was implied that many of the teens were playing(and doing fizzle rocks as well, Kevin and moose were but no one has circled back to that). So when Kevin and moose in this episode were against playing- weren’t they already? At least Kevin was. It didn’t make sense. Especially because this game seems to work like Jumnjui, even if you stop playing, you are still playing, so Kevin is always playing. Also we still have all those kids from the sisters who were still playing who are now in the farm and chances are the farm is playing now too. Again.. way too many questions. A lot will probably never be answered. 

[Al D]

On 2/10/2019 at 9:43 PM, WhosThatGirl said:

I was starting to enjoy the g and g king mystery but I’m enjoying it less and less when there appears to be many kings and now it’s stopped making sense again

I has so much hope for this story line at the beginning 😞 I thought they had it all planned out now I fear it's gonna be another black hood situation 😞

My (obviously completely wrong) 'theory' is that Edgar is the original G&G king. So we know the game originated at the sisters but it obviously made it out in to the world since 'The Midnight Club' were playing it. So I think maybe Edgar wasn't always called Edgar - and he went to Riverdale High at the same time as everyone else but was a complete outsider and was invisible to everyone around him so he hated everyone. He got to his tipping point when he found out that The MC all became friends when they were meant to hate each other and felt even more alone now that in his eyes the whole of the school's cliques were coming together minus him. So he became the original G&G king. And when he and his cult came to town, he wanted to get all the kids of the town playing the game to get revenge, but obviously Hiram/Tallboy and now Moose's dad started using it to their advantage. And no one realises he used to live in Riverdale including his daughter and he created the cult after leaving Riverdale so he had a place where he felt he belonged. *and breathe*

But it's more likely to be Phil or Sue that have lived down the road for years.

P.S. Did anyone else go on Netflix today all excited completely forgetting it's not on for a few weeks, or was that just me.

Edited February 14, 2019 by Al D
Spelling mistake.

[PeekaBoo]

I am so late on this and everything's probably been talked about already but here goes...

I liked the episode, it was nice to have the one episode where the B characters got some spotlight. I managed to fall fro Koose for a bit and it was nice that they were together and that kevin was happy for a second or two. The entire fall-out was a bit OMG (much like the whole theme of this season, ha). Seriously, I was holding my breath and fearing that either Moose or Tom were going to get killed but oof, they didn't. The fact that there's a millionth GK makes it soooo boring now... i mean, i can see this happening... NEXT WEEK -- YET ANOTHER APPEARANCE OF THE GARGOYLE KING but he's the REAL ONE! lol Eye roll...

It was a bit sad that Moose's dad was behind all of this (for this episode). Oh yeah, and did that Moose actor lose weight? he looked more boney than previously! Good for him!

The Choni thing was ok, a bit like, ok, give them a cute story this episode. Ok... It was a bit meh but i do feel for Cheryl, she really likes Toni, and is trying to do what she can (her own way) to make her gf happy.... But really, the Pretty Poisons? Is Riverdale now the centre of 20 different gangs?! Yet another eye roll...

I'm surprised no one is talking about that Veronice and REggie were actually pulling a robbery? I mean, really? 

ANd Gladys.... oh gladys.... It didn't really surprise me that she turned out to be a baddy.... Breaks my heart for Juggie and JB too, since Gladys managed to brainwash her... 

But what's her agenda? Just being a bitchy bad ass wanting to rule Riverdale and dealing drugs? Why did she have to run away in the first place? Was she really the one with the balls in the Joneses? Is FP really a softie who got corrupted by Gladys? I'm really curious... 

It's a bit sad because I do like Gina Gershon being the bitchy BAMF that she usually is and it's going to be sweet to see her fall.... 

This gets me worried for bughead as per future spoilers but we'll see...

Oh and the sexy scene there with the ships... Mmmm.... I did like bughead going at it... HA! Need more of that!

Okay, episode, 

[Bill1978]

First episode of this season that I pretty much watched all of it since Kevin, Moose and Josie were heavily featured. I found it interesting that while we got the standard heterosexual teen sex scenes, and even a decent lesbian bed scene (from memory it has been a week) I found it telling that not only did the gay sex scene go back to the good old 90s way of moving offscreen, it seems the boys consummated their relationship while fully clothed.

I know a lot of people aren't fans of Moovin, but I was. So the departure of Moose makes me even less inclined to tune in now. And I also get the impression that Josie is possibly being written out. Which would leave Kevin as my sole reason to watch, meaning I will be able to watch episodes in under 4 minutes. Thank goodness I get this via Netflix and not forced to sit through the actual show on regular TV. How did this show drift so far away from the awesomeness that was Season 1 where I was invested in every single character?

[Dee]

12 hours ago, Bill1978 said:

First episode of this season that I pretty much watched all of it since Kevin, Moose and Josie were heavily featured. I found it interesting that while we got the standard heterosexual teen sex scenes, and even a decent lesbian bed scene (from memory it has been a week) I found it telling that not only did the gay sex scene go back to the good old 90s way of moving offscreen, it seems the boys consummated their relationship while fully clothed.

At least Kevin & Moose got a love scene. Josie & Archie didn't even get that.