S08.E06: Honey, I'm Home?

[Gem 10]

46 minutes ago, Lily247 said:

That is absolutely correct, UNFORTUNATELY in todays society if a mother is not working then very often working moms will turn their nose at them. Hence why there are so many bullshit MLM businesses out there for theae SAHMs who want to try to contribute financially. I don't think it is realistic to marry a stranger and expect tthem to be your breadwinner. Situations like that usually happen after years of dating marriage financial talks babies etc. Therr are many many men nowadays who are "evolved thinkers" and will not marry a woman who is not job-oriented or making a certain income bracket. However, this is just a woman's lot nowadays. 

I think nowadays married women work not only for the money, but to get out of the house.  It’s easier to go to the office or wherever then to stay home with screaming kids and all that goes with it.  I went back when my third was old enough to get in the house with a key.  Nowadays, some share their money because it’s necessary, and some keep it for themselves.  I know women who work and their day care expense exceeds their salary, but they don’t care.  Jasmine looks like what’s hers is hers alone.  She talked money before the ink dried.  Will looked dumbfounded, and turned off.  We will see what happens with these two.  Interesting.  Oh, and one interesting thing.  I see a lot of Grandmothers in the stores taking care of their grandchildren while their daughters are working.  I’ll bet some don’t mind and some do.  I think I went off the track here with all this, lol.

[Ilovepie]

2 hours ago, Lily247 said:

That is absolutely correct, UNFORTUNATELY in todays society if a mother is not working then very often working moms will turn their nose at them. Hence why there are so many bullshit MLM businesses out there for theae SAHMs who want to try to contribute financially. I don't think it is realistic to marry a stranger and expect tthem to be your breadwinner. Situations like that usually happen after years of dating marriage financial talks babies etc. Therr are many many men nowadays who are "evolved thinkers" and will not marry a woman who is not job-oriented or making a certain income bracket. However, this is just a woman's lot nowadays. 

I had the opposite problem when I had my first child. I live in a fairly conservative community and I got a lot of side eye when I chose to go back to work when my daughter was three months. I think in this day and age either choice is acceptable but there is a lot of mud slinging back and forth between the two camps. I agree that Jasmine is nuts for expecting a man she has known for two weeks to fund her life. And this is without any kids in the picture! That brings up a question: Is there such a thing in this modern world as a “housewife”? Meaning a childless woman who just stays home and takes care of the house? 

[configdotsys]

2 hours ago, qtpye said:

I know Jas said that she wanted to split the bills  with Will paying more but I was wondering what people on the board would think of a woman or a man who frankly did not want to work but  take care of the home and take care of the kids?

I think it's about what works for both people and that there are certain things that are just not negotiable. Not wanting kids and completely different views on finances are two non-negotiable issues to me. I personally think once kids come into the picture, it is a whole different ballgame and if one person wants to and they are financially able to stay home, then great. Some people are just not cut out to stay home and want to work. That's great too. It doesn't matter in what way people set up their finances as long as both of the people are of the same mind. It's not fair to expect the other person to bend on these issues that are huge and can bring such turmoil and resentment to the marriage. 

[qtpye]

57 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

I had the opposite problem when I had my first child. I live in a fairly conservative community and I got a lot of side eye when I chose to go back to work when my daughter was three months. I think in this day and age either choice is acceptable but there is a lot of mud slinging back and forth between the two camps. I agree that Jasmine is nuts for expecting a man she has known for two weeks to fund her life. And this is without any kids in the picture! That brings up a question: Is there such a thing in this modern world as a “housewife”? Meaning a childless woman who just stays home and takes care of the house? 

I guess with women you’re damned if you do or damned if you don’t.  I think Jas wants a guy like her dad and Will is not it. It’s too bad because he does seem like a good guy overall. These two probably should go their separate ways almost as much as Luke and Kate

[Crazy Bird Lady]

5 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

That brings up a question: Is there such a thing in this modern world as a “housewife”? Meaning a childless woman who just stays home and takes care of the house? 

Yes, there is. But we're retired...  And unfortunately, the fact that the husband isn't working anymore, either, doesn't mean he automatically helps out with the housework and cooking!!  Mine washes his own clothes, will throw away his own trash (if I remind him), and maybe take his own dirty dishes to the sink... But that's about it. He'll go shopping with me, but he never goes alone... So I do consider myself a housewife!

Edited February 2, 2019 by Crazy Bird Lady

[Ilovepie]

3 hours ago, Crazy Bird Lady said:

Yes, there is. But we're retired...  And unfortunately, the fact that the husband isn't working anymore, either, doesn't mean he automatically helps out with the housework and cooking!!  Mine washes him own clothes, will throw away his own trash, if I remind him, and maybe take his dirty dishes to the sink... And that's about it. So I do consider myself a housewife!

Ha! I guess I meant more a newly married young woman (I don’t mean to insinuate that you are old!). I think your comment shows that the answer is no, this doesn’t exist in the world we now live in. If I encountered a woman in her 20’s, 30’s, or 40’s that had no children but just stayed home I would wonder why. I would probably call her unemployed before referring to her as a “housewife”.

I am lucky my husband is very self sufficient. He cleans up after himself, does the laundry and takes care of the yard and pool. Our money goes into a joint account and he pays the bills but I keep my hand in by balancing the checkbook every month. He was very helpful when our kids were little too (and still is). I consider myself lucky.

I wonder what Jasmine asked for during the interview process, because it seems that Will is not it, and vice versa. Again, I wonder if the “experts” just put them together for drama sake alone because they don’t seem to have anything in common whatsoever. I’m gonna say this one is another disastrous pairing. No way in hell these two stay married.

[Blissfool]

On 1/30/2019 at 5:08 AM, Neurochick said:

  No one would give Kate the Heather treatment because we know what Luke did, she said it on the show.  I don’t think the show ever revealed what Derek was doing.

But the show could have edited all that out if she broke her contract and balked. We would not have been made privy to the offensive comments. Luke would have been portrayed as a victim.

This was most likely the case with Heather and Derek.

 

On 1/30/2019 at 1:17 PM, dirtypop90 said:

  I'm not sure why Keith was selected.  He brings zero to the table

I think it's because they had already selected short/petite Kristine, so when Keith and his grandma said Keith's wife had to be tall....BINGO!

 

On 1/30/2019 at 1:46 PM, dirtypop90 said:

Can he?  What is Will bringing to the table?  (This is not me being snarky.  I just honestly don't see anything appealing about him and want to know why others are a fan).

He has a home, a career, likes dogs, and he's the world's best uncle.

 

On 1/30/2019 at 3:28 PM, Gem 10 said:

I think this is the first time I have seen a groom not interested in having sex on his honeymoon with his willing and ready wife.  Am I right?  Oh, excuse me .. there’s that sloth weirdo, Kate’s husband.  I forgot his name for a second.

Jephte 

 

On 1/30/2019 at 3:45 PM, UniqueHandle said:

I don't know if any of you watch Big Brother but Luke reminds of of Paul Abrahamian from Big Brother 18 and 19. 

Ok, now *I* am repulsed and feel dead inside.

(Runs to bathroom)

[Empress1]

3 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

I think your comment shows that the answer is no, this doesn’t exist in the world we now live in. If I encountered a woman in her 20’s, 30’s, or 40’s that had no children but just stayed home I would wonder why. I would probably call her unemployed before referring to her as a “housewife”.

I think the only time that happens nowadays is if it's a very wealthy couple - a "real housewives" situation. And in that case, it's usually a staff of people doing the actual work of running the house.

I remember an episode of the MTV reality show True Life about two young married couples (all under 25). One of them was religious and it was determined that the husband would go to work and she'd stay home - but she was bored out of her mind, because it really just doesn't take that much time to run a household of two adults. They lived in a small one-bedroom so there wasn't much to clean, and two adults don't generate that much laundry. She ended up asking for permission to work part-time, which he granted (they were very old-fashioned).

I'd think the same about Jasmine and Will if Jasmine were to stay home now. Will's house and the house they're in for the show look to be less than 1500 square feet. Neither of them appears to have a job that requires long hours (I bet Stephanie works a lot). Two adults don't generate more laundry than can be done on a weekend. Keeping a >1500-square-foot house clean doesn't take that much time. Running their particular household isn't a full-time job, you know?

[Crazy Bird Lady]

5 hours ago, Empress1 said:

I think the only time that happens nowadays [where a young, childless woman is a "housewife"] is if it's a very wealthy couple - a "real housewives" situation. And in that case, it's usually a staff of people doing the actual work of running the house.

I was a young housewife with young children when we lived overseas...  but I was not permitted by local law to work  for pay. The the "diplomatic status" my husband had, made that illegal. 

Since we had a maid and a (part-time) gardener while we were there, I suppose I was a bit of like those Reality Show couples mentioned above.

But we weren't on TV. And I worked before and after our kids were born, and I worked again after we returned to our home country. 

I know that my circumstances were kind of unique, and I certainly realize how lucky we were! Having a maid (and no job) freed me to focus on doing special things for my children and family, as well as volunteering in the community where we lived. That wasn't something that had been in my life plan, but it's how things turned out --and our whole family benefited from it.

[So did our maid, by the way. She was a single mom and her we paid for her son to grow up attending a good school. When we left, her severance pay sufficed as a hefty down payment on a small house for the two of them, and paid for her son's first semester in college studying electrical engineering.]

You never know what the future holds in store for you, as a married couple. Christine should learn that... because Keith is a healer.  If Keith reaches his educational goal, he may indeed become Doctor Keith. It's possible he/they could decide to live in an underdeveloped country for a while, somewhere Keith could vaccinate lots of people and also prevent unnecessary deaths in various other ways. 

Meanwhile, 'Queen' Christine might seize the opportunity to provide desperately needed employment to someone who could help her with housework, children, etc. She would probably enjoy being in the position to do that.  

Edited February 3, 2019 by Crazy Bird Lady
Oops!

[Lily247]

10 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

Oh, and one interesting thing.  I see a lot of Grandmothers in the stores taking care of their grandchildren while their daughters are working.  I’ll bet some don’t mind and some do.  I think I went off the track here with all this, lol.

I personally think that grandmothers are typically the best childcare option for babies of working parents. Wherr I come from, therr was a very exacting culture concerning working moms and 90% of women followed this formula:

stay home with baby for about 7 or 8 months, then go back to work and grandma watches the baby until baby turns into a toddler, where they will enter daycare which is subsidized by the government and very affordable. Granted, there was no real concept of a SAHM because majority of women worked; however the choice was made easy by waiting till baby got older because of  humane maternity laws; grandparents happily played a large role in raising children, and daycare didnt charge up the a**. Here in the US, because we are not family/maternity friendly, there are a ton of women forced to give their 6 week olds to strangers in daycare settings before they even finish their post partem bleeding. Sad if you ask me. Even in nearby Canada mothers get a year of PAID leave !!

[Soup333]

2 hours ago, Crazy Bird Lady said:

I was a young housewife with young children when we lived overseas... butI was not permittedby local law to work for pay.The the "diplomatic status" my husband had, made that illegal.

Since we had a maid and a (part-time) gardener while we were there, I suppose I was a bitof like those Reality Show couples mentioned above.

But we weren't on TV. And Iworked before and after ourkids were born, and I worked again after we returned to our home country.

I know that my circumstances were kind ofunique, and I certainly realize how lucky we were! Having a maid (and no job) freed me to focus on doing special things for my children and family, as well as volunteering in the community where we lived. Thatwasn't something that had been in my life plan, but it's how thingsturned out--and our whole family benefited from it.

[So did our maid, by the way. She was a single mom and her we paidfor her son to grow up attendinga good school. When we left, her severance pay sufficed as a hefty down payment on a small house for the two of them, and paid for her son's first semester in college studying electrical engineering.]

You never know what the future holds in store for you, as a married couple. Jasmine should learn that... because Will is a healer.If Willreaches his educational goal, hemayindeed become Doctor Will. It's possible he/they coulddecideto live in an underdeveloped country for a while, somewhere Willcould vaccinate lots of people and also prevent unnecessary deaths in various other ways.

Meanwhile, Jasmine might seize the opportunitytoprovide desperately needed employment to someone who could help her with housework, children, etc.

I think you might be mixing up Will and Keith. Queen Kristine’s husband is the one in school to be a doctor/nurse/Indian chief. Will is in finance. 

[Crazy Bird Lady]

1 hour ago, Soup333 said:

I think you might be mixing up Will and Keith. Queen Kristine’s husband is the one in school to be a doctor/nurse/Indian chief. Will is in finance. 

TY, Soup.

[Gem 10]

19 hours ago, Crazy Bird Lady said:

Yes, there is. But we're retired...  And unfortunately, the fact that the husband isn't working anymore, either, doesn't mean he automatically helps out with the housework and cooking!!  Mine washes his own clothes, will throw away his own trash (if I remind him), and maybe take his own dirty dishes to the sink... But that's about it. He'll go shopping with me, but he never goes alone... So I do consider myself a housewife!

Haha, me too.  Kids are out of the house, and both of us are retired.  BORING.  I cook and clean .. he does dishes .. that’s why I can’t find anything, takes trash out, goes to the store if I don’t want to, and watches sports day in and day out.  I’ve worked with kids and without kids.  I don’t care what anyone says, retirement is boring, unless you have a yacht and lots of cash. After you help kids thru college, there’s not too much left.  So, I am a legit housewife now and it ain’t no big deal.  Oh .. and for fun, we go to the Doctor together, then probably lunch, lol.  

[Gem 10]

21 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

I had the opposite problem when I had my first child. I live in a fairly conservative community and I got a lot of side eye when I chose to go back to work when my daughter was three months. I think in this day and age either choice is acceptable but there is a lot of mud slinging back and forth between the two camps. I agree that Jasmine is nuts for expecting a man she has known for two weeks to fund her life. And this is without any kids in the picture! That brings up a question: Is there such a thing in this modern world as a “housewife”? Meaning a childless woman who just stays home and takes care of the house? 

I think a childless woman who chooses to stay home is her business.  Nowadays, I think there is a lot of pressure for a mother to work.  My oldest daughter has three kids and stays home.  She’s highly educated but feels she has to be home.  Her day is full with driving the kids here and ther to school, sports, whatever.  But, I know she feels guilty staying home and not contributing, as most of her friends work.  I think she feels less than.  Thank goodness, her husband makes good money.  My own Mother worked with three kids her whole life and was always tired and miserable, but she had no choice.  I give credit to working Motherswhen their kids are small.  It must be very hard and a lot of pressure for them.  My Mother used to tell me to stay home with the kids as men have one job, but a working Mother has two jobs.

[Ilovepie]

6 minutes ago, Gem 10 said:

I think a childless woman who chooses to stay home is her business.

It is, but she better be prepared to get judged hard by her peers. It’s why I stated I would call her “unemployed” rather than housewife because nobody does that anymore unless there are children to take care of. I think that’s why Will was so put off by Jasmine.

And @Gem 10 - I’m sorry your daughter feels guilty - she shouldn’t. Raising kids is hard. For me, harder than going to my nice office and sitting at my organized desk quietly working or talking to peers. It’s part of the reason I went back to work- I couldn’t take the isolation or chaos.

[aphroditewitch]

1 hour ago, Ilovepie said:

It is, but she better be prepared to get judged hard by her peers. It’s why I stated I would call her “unemployed” rather than housewife because nobody does that anymore unless there are children to take care of. I think that’s why Will was so put off by Jasmine.

 

Depends on who the peers are. Most childless women who stay home are part of communities where it is the norm for women to not work outside the home. Although usually women in those communities start having children early on in their marriage. If someone is infertile in those communities, they might receive pity but they are also left out because so many of the social functions for women in those types of communities involve being a mom. 

I don't recall Jasmine saying flat out that she didn't want to work before having kids. Just that she didn't want to be contributing equally to finances despite it being unclear who makes more money. Although if Will is in finance, then he probably makes more. The whole finance conversation was so clumsily done and it should have been handled better. Even for a fake conversation it was really bad. 

[Gem 10]

2 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

It is, but she better be prepared to get judged hard by her peers. It’s why I stated I would call her “unemployed” rather than housewife because nobody does that anymore unless there are children to take care of. I think that’s why Will was so put off by Jasmine.

And @Gem 10 - I’m sorry your daughter feels guilty - she shouldn’t. Raising kids is hard. For me, harder than going to my nice office and sitting at my organized desk quietly working or talking to peers. It’s part of the reason I went back to work- I couldn’t take the isolation or chaos.

I agree with you, but if a woman with children works, who does all the other stuff for the kids like after school activities, meetings in school, picking them up at the bus stop, religion, sports, etc, etc.  That’s probably where neighbors and grandparents come in I suppose.  Plus, in my day the men didn’t do much concerning the kids.  Nowadays, the men do a lot when it comes to helping out with the kids.

Edited February 3, 2019 by Gem 10

[qtpye]

21 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Ha! I guess I meant more a newly married young woman (I don’t mean to insinuate that you are old!). I think your comment shows that the answer is no, this doesn’t exist in the world we now live in. If I encountered a woman in her 20’s, 30’s, or 40’s that had no children but just stayed home I would wonder why. I would probably call her unemployed before referring to her as a “housewife”.

I am lucky my husband is very self sufficient. He cleans up after himself, does the laundry and takes care of the yard and pool. Our money goes into a joint account and he pays the bills but I keep my hand in by balancing the checkbook every month. He was very helpful when our kids were little too (and still is). I consider myself lucky.

I wonder what Jasmine asked for during the interview process, because it seems that Will is not it, and vice versa. Again, I wonder if the “experts” just put them together for drama sake alone because they don’t seem to have anything in common whatsoever. I’m gonna say this one is another disastrous pairing. No way in hell these two stay married.

 

18 hours ago, Empress1 said:

I think the only time that happens nowadays is if it's a very wealthy couple - a "real housewives" situation. And in that case, it's usually a staff of people doing the actual work of running the house.

I remember an episode of the MTV reality show True Life about two young married couples (all under 25). One of them was religious and it was determined that the husband would go to work and she'd stay home - but she was bored out of her mind, because it really just doesn't take that much time to run a household of two adults. They lived in a small one-bedroom so there wasn't much to clean, and two adults don't generate that much laundry. She ended up asking for permission to work part-time, which he granted (they were very old-fashioned).

I'd think the same about Jasmine and Will if Jasmine were to stay home now. Will's house and the house they're in for the show look to be less than 1500 square feet. Neither of them appears to have a job that requires long hours (I bet Stephanie works a lot). Two adults don't generate more laundry than can be done on a weekend. Keeping a >1500-square-foot house clean doesn't take that much time. Running their particular household isn't a full-time job, you know?

 

17 hours ago, Crazy Bird Lady said:

I was a young housewife with young children when we lived overseas...  but I was not permitted by local law to work  for pay. The the "diplomatic status" my husband had, made that illegal. 

Since we had a maid and a (part-time) gardener while we were there, I suppose I was a bit of like those Reality Show couples mentioned above.

But we weren't on TV. And I worked before and after our kids were born, and I worked again after we returned to our home country. 

I know that my circumstances were kind of unique, and I certainly realize how lucky we were! Having a maid (and no job) freed me to focus on doing special things for my children and family, as well as volunteering in the community where we lived. That wasn't something that had been in my life plan, but it's how things turned out --and our whole family benefited from it.

[So did our maid, by the way. She was a single mom and her we paid for her son to grow up attending a good school. When we left, her severance pay sufficed as a hefty down payment on a small house for the two of them, and paid for her son's first semester in college studying electrical engineering.]

You never know what the future holds in store for you, as a married couple. Christine should learn that... because Keith is a healer.  If Keith reaches his educational goal, he may indeed become Doctor Keith. It's possible he/they could decide to live in an underdeveloped country for a while, somewhere Keith could vaccinate lots of people and also prevent unnecessary deaths in various other ways. 

Meanwhile, 'Queen' Christine might seize the opportunity to provide desperately needed employment to someone who could help her with housework, children, etc. She would probably enjoy being in the position to do that.  

 

I am reminded of a situation where a woman I knew had an arranged marriage. After the kids were born she realized she was doing 80 percent of the childcare, 90 percent of the housework, as well as contributing 100 percent of her salary to household upkeep. She realized that she drank the Koolaid of her culture that women are not valuable and should do anything (which translates into everything) to keep their husband happy, even though she was raised in the United States. She put her foot down. Now, her husband still does not do shit but she puts 50 percent of her paycheck in a bank account under her own name and the rest goes to the household. Her husband is okay with this and she does not feel as frustrated in her marriage. It kind of reminded me of when women were encouraged to bring home the bacon and fry it in a pan and never let him forget he’s a man.

17 hours ago, Lily247 said:

I personally think that grandmothers are typically the best childcare option for babies of working parents. Wherr I come from, therr was a very exacting culture concerning working moms and 90% of women followed this formula:

stay home with baby for about 7 or 8 months, then go back to work and grandma watches the baby until baby turns into a toddler, where they will enter daycare which is subsidized by the government and very affordable. Granted, there was no real concept of a SAHM because majority of women worked; however the choice was made easy by waiting till baby got older because of  humane maternity laws; grandparents happily played a large role in raising children, and daycare didnt charge up the a**. Here in the US, because we are not family/maternity friendly, there are a ton of women forced to give their 6 week olds to strangers in daycare settings before they even finish their post partem bleeding. Sad if you ask me. Even in nearby Canada mothers get a year of PAID leave !!

Grandparents can provide great childcare if they are into doing that. My own parents are in their sixties and are still going strong with their amazing careers. Both of them are also active members of the community and have busy social lives, which also include volunteering. They do not provide me with any childcare, even though they love their grandchildren. It’s okay since I work very hard to be able to send my children to a place that they love and learn a great deal.

Edited February 3, 2019 by qtpye

[spunky]

At first I thought Keith was just lazy, I finally understand him after this episode. As someone who was raised in the West Indies by her grandmother, I can attest that Keith is a product of the old school culture. His grandma's generation raised boys to be the king of the castle, they weren't taught to cook or clean, because that's not manly. Meanwhile the girls were raised to wait on the men hand and foot. Hell they even got a bigger plate of food and a bigger piece of meat. That being said Keith will eventually get out of it once he realizes that his wife his not his grandma.

[spunky]

On 1/30/2019 at 10:20 AM, aphroditewitch said:

I think there was probably abusive stuff from Ryan before the reunion day, it just wasn't a verbal threat captured by the sound/video team until that day. There was also Sonia and Nick. Sonia did actually leave but the show pressured her to come back and work things out. On decision day I think Sonia wanted to divorce, but was again pressured to say she wanted to stay married. I think there have been several couples where the women in particular wanted out even if there wasn't verbal abuse because the guy they had been matched with was just horrible. I think Danielle wanted to call it quits with Cody, especially after all his complaining about how they weren't having sex, but there was pressure to stay. I think Boston Jaclyn would have split with Ryan on decision day too. There was a lot of pressure on Season 2 Jaclyn as well, even when they revealed at the 6 month reunion that they had split, the experts were pressuring her to give him another chance. 

There was also Sheila and Nate. She got the "angry Black woman" edit the whole season. Meanwhile Nate was sleeping with his side chick the entire time, hence her "I'm not doing this with you" statements. 

[Ilovepie]

5 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

I agree with you, but if a woman with children works, who does all the other stuff for the kids like after school activities, meetings in school, picking them up at the bus stop, religion, sports, etc, etc.  That’s probably where neighbors and grandparents come in I suppose.  Plus, in my day the men didn’t do much concerning the kids.  Nowadays, the men do a lot when it comes to helping out with the kids.

This is veering off topic, but my husband and I do all of that jointly. We are both lucky to have jobs that allow us the flexibility to leave work in the middle of the day if needed, and we both shuttle/supervise with after school activities. Both kids were in daycare until kindergarten though, and also after school campus club once in school. There are no family for us that live locally though so we are on our own.....apologies for not sticking to the subject!

[Gem 10]

On 2/2/2019 at 1:06 PM, Ilovepie said:

I had the opposite problem when I had my first child. I live in a fairly conservative community and I got a lot of side eye when I chose to go back to work when my daughter was three months. I think in this day and age either choice is acceptable but there is a lot of mud slinging back and forth between the two camps. I agree that Jasmine is nuts for expecting a man she has known for two weeks to fund her life. And this is without any kids in the picture! That brings up a question: Is there such a thing in this modern world as a “housewife”? Meaning a childless woman who just stays home and takes care of the house? 

Yeah, I know of some women with and without kids that are housewives.  Usually, the husbands make lots of money and the ladies spend their days at the “club” lunching, playing tennis, shopping and drinking.  I’m not one of them, dammit.

[Gem 10]

50 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

This is veering off topic, but my husband and I do all of that jointly. We are both lucky to have jobs that allow us the flexibility to leave work in the middle of the day if needed, and we both shuttle/supervise with after school activities. Both kids were in daycare until kindergarten though, and also after school campus club once in school. There are no family for us that live locally though so we are on our own.....apologies for not sticking to the subject!

No apologies .. good answer.  I know what you mean.  One daughter of mine works and her husband is a fireman, so he does a lot with the kids as he’s home different hours to take care of the kids while she is in work.  Nice setup.  The men today are amazing.  They take the kids to the doctors, cook, change diapers, etc.  Not in my day.  I know we’re off track here, but all the stories are interesting, and by now, we sort of know one another, which is nice.  Helpful too, sometimes.

[Ilovepie]

2 minutes ago, Gem 10 said:

The men today are amazing.  

That’s why both my grandmothers thought Mr. Ilovepie was so amazing- it’s just a different era. 😊

[Gem 10]

On 2/2/2019 at 6:13 PM, Blissfool said:

Can he?  What is Will bringing to the table?  (This is not me being snarky.  I just honestly don't see anything appealing about him and want to know why others are a fan).

How can Will bring anything to the table?  He’s too busy pleasing Jasmine and figuring “what the heck did I get into”.  She over rides him .. I want this, don’t do that, I don’t like that. Blah, blah, blah.  I really think she doesn’t know what she wants.  Maybe she should ask her father.

[aphroditewitch]

1 hour ago, spunky said:

There was also Sheila and Nate. She got the "angry Black woman" edit the whole season. Meanwhile Nate was sleeping with his side chick the entire time, hence her "I'm not doing this with you" statements. 

I feel like the side chick got a crappy deal if she stayed with Nate following that season. Because even before he and Shelia split she revealed to the experts that he had never given her la petite mort. 

[Stinamaia]

15 minutes ago, aphroditewitch said:

I feel like the side chick got a crappy deal if she stayed with Nate following that season. Because even before he and Shelia split she revealed to the experts that he had never given her la petite mort. 

I liked Shelia, Davina, and Heather. I was completely on their sides.  The only woman I remember really disliking was that woman who treated Neil so badly on their honeymoon.  She reminds me a bit of Luke. She thought she was too good for him.  

[Gem 10]

16 minutes ago, Stinamaia said:

I liked Shelia, Davina, and Heather. I was completely on their sides.  The only woman I remember really disliking was that woman who treated Neil so badly on their honeymoon.  She reminds me a bit of Luke. She thought she was too good for him.  

I liked them also.  Neil’s wife, the one with all the candles in the closet was just as bad as Molly, the blonde that treated Jon like dirt.  Blondie took him, so everything worked out.  I also liked the girl who sold vodka and married Basement Ryan.  They should have a reunion of everybody to see how they are all doing now.  That would bring in a lot of viewers.

[Lily247]

2 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

I liked them also.  Neil’s wife, the one with all the candles in the closet was just as bad as Molly, the blonde that treated Jon like dirt.  Blondie took him, so everything worked out.  I also liked the girl who sold vodka and married Basement Ryan.  They should have a reunion of everybody to see how they are all doing now.  That would bring in a lot of viewers.

Haha.... memories. If I recall correctly, at least one of those Ryans was wildly unpopular. I think it was the one who was yelling curse words at his wife ("if you cant understand me, go read a f******* book!")and lived like a flashy big shot. I highly doubt any of the unlikeables (all guys named Ryan, Samantha, Atlanta Ashley) would come back. 

Actually, I think Samantha kind of redeemed herself in the end. She was an absolute jerk for most of the experiment and then suddenly had an epiphany and some humble pie and started chasing him too late. I liked that he was given the opportunity to take his manhood back by just rejecting her. 

Edited February 4, 2019 by Lily247

[Ilovepie]

16 minutes ago, Lily247 said:

Actually, I think Samantha kind of redeemed herself in the end. She was an absolute jerk for most of the experiment and then suddenly had an epiphany and some humble pie and started chasing him too late. I liked that he was given the opportunity to take his manhood back by just rejecting her. 

I agree - she was awful but she realized it and tried to be better. One of my favorite shots in the history of this show was at the end of that season with her and Neil in the Big Spoon/Little Spoon Onesies. It also seems like they are friends now judging by social media, so I wouldn’t lump her in with the other deplorables......

[Aethera]

Folks, just a reminder that while it's totally fine to relate your real lives to the goings on in the episode, if you're ONLY talking about your lives, and not at all about the episode, that discussion belongs in Small Talk. Thanks!

 

Fixed to link to actual Small Talk, sorry!

[Yeah No]

On 2/1/2019 at 10:04 PM, Crazy Bird Lady said:

We are rather ordinary people, for the most part, who have observed AJ's nervousness and excessive sweating, his making lots of weird anxious sounds, noticed his declaration that the one thing about marriage he can count on is that he won't have to eat alone. Etc.  

Now we are seeing some aggressive verbal behavior from him --a short temper sometimes, a guy who gets 'jumpy', seems easily frustrated, and didn't want to do "homework" on his honeymoon so he snapped at that 'production' woman. 

We are the sort of people who observe, and then think about what we observe. It really doesn't take a Ph.D or any kind of 'expert' to recognize erratic behavior, or to realize that what we've observed is hurting AJ's relationship with the woman he said he's smitten with, his new "Sexy A.F. Wife".  We are qualified to compare A.J. with other people we've known that seem to have anxiety sometimes (or with people who can be especially short-tempered, or who seem to get frustrated easily). 

And we all probably feel some kind of way about it. 

I couldn't agree with you more.  If it quacks like a duck it's usually a duck, I always say.  AJ is so much like a couple of men I've known (one especially so) that it amazes me, even down to the anger management part of it too.  It usually also goes along with rigid opinions that spark arguments that can never be resolved.  Lord help Stephanie if she ever disagrees with him on anything he holds near and dear to his heart.  She will have to endure heated anger-fueled "soapbox" soliloquies where he says crazy things about his head exploding that will send her running for the hills.  There's a reason her gut instinct had her shedding tears when she saw his pissy behavior about the couples' exercise.  It was fear because she knew at that moment that there was something off and that it was likely going to be a rough ride if not an outright fail with him.  Putting myself in her shoes I probably would have felt the same way in that moment.  

I do have a graduate degree in Psychology, BTW, but I agree with you that it doesn't take one to see this stuff for what it is.

[Yeah No]

On 2/2/2019 at 1:06 PM, Ilovepie said:

I had the opposite problem when I had my first child. I live in a fairly conservative community and I got a lot of side eye when I chose to go back to work when my daughter was three months. I think in this day and age either choice is acceptable but there is a lot of mud slinging back and forth between the two camps. I agree that Jasmine is nuts for expecting a man she has known for two weeks to fund her life. And this is without any kids in the picture! That brings up a question: Is there such a thing in this modern world as a “housewife”? Meaning a childless woman who just stays home and takes care of the house? 

I got side eye 20 years ago when I was married and working without children when I lived in a town that had the highest proportion of kids to adults in my state.  I think it's sad that in a day when women supposedly have more choices there is a lot of judgment on them for choosing what is not considered the norm in their community or in the general population at the time.  Freedom of choice should mean that Jasmine is allowed to want to be a SAHM if that is what is aligned with her values.  She shouldn't feel wrong about wanting any one of the options open to her, nor be made to feel like she is wrong for it by her peers.  Neither should she be bashed if she were not to have kids to stay home and take care of a house.  That's between her and her husband.  Obviously, her husband's values about sharing finances are different than hers, and that's where the problem lies.  But to me freedom to choose means no one else should bash a couple for making their own choices just because they differ with whatever is popular at the time.

BTW, right now I am a 'childless' woman of 60 that after a long career "just" stays at home and takes care of a house, and I know that one of the things the 1960s womens' movement stood for is that what is considered housework should not be belittled by being diminished as not real work.  Saying "just" in my opinion belittles and disrespects it.  That is actually male chauvinist thinking.  Not that you in particular meant it that way, but it has been used that way a lot.  Also, at my age taking care of a house and home is a LOT of very real and valid work, primarily because I'm not as energetic as I once was, plus my husband's work does not leave him with much time to do work in the house, not that he wouldn't if he had the time.  But the way we distribute our work is up to us, and IMO it should be that way for any of the couples on this show.  Everyone's situation and values are different.

Oh, and I prefer "child free" over "childless" because of the negative connotations of the latter word.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Yeah No

[Yeah No]

To all those that believe that couples should split finances 50-50, I have a question for you.  What if Jasmine should become ill and can't work for a time and/or she decides after burning herself out that working and having kids is too much responsibility for her and as a result wants to stay home to devote all her time and energy to that?  Should she still be responsible for 50% of the finances?  For the "privilege" of staying home with kids should she have to go into debt or take money out of her personal bank account in order to pay "her share"?  Is she obligated to work outside the home for a salary to contribute her 50% even if taking care of a home and children at the same time is unfulfilling or too much for her?  Should her husband expect that of her?  

Also, just how much work is Will willing to do in the house and with kids so that Jasmine can work full time and not be overwhelmed with home and child responsibility?  The point is, we don't even know that.  He has high expectations of her financially but may not be thinking of an equal distribution of work to correspond with that expectation.  Sadly, even today's young men are still not following through on that equal distribution of labor in the home.  It's better today but it has still not come as far as it should.  And Will has not impressed me with being on board with that equal distribution.  He might be but he has not shown that to me so I'm skeptical. 

When a woman stays home to take care of home and children, the husband benefits.  Her work is worth something to him because she frees him up of his share of the responsibility to those things.  So if Jasmine wants to stay home Will is getting something as a result.  This was one of the points of the 1960s womens' movement, that housework and childcare are worth something and men should have an equal responsibility to those things, and women that stay home to do those things are benefiting a man.  She's not shirking responsibility by choosing to do that, it's just a different distribution of responsibility.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Yeah No

[configdotsys]

50 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

To all those that believe that couples should split finances 50-50, I have a question for you.  What if Jasmine should become ill and can't work for a time and/or she decides after burning herself out that working and having kids is too much responsibility for her and as a result wants to stay home to devote all her time and energy to that?  Should she still be responsible for 50% of the finances?  For the "privilege" of staying home with kids should she have to go into debt or take money out of her personal bank account in order to pay "her share"?  Is she obligated to work outside the home for a salary to contribute her 50% even if taking care of a home and children at the same time is unfulfilling or too much for her?  Should her husband expect that of her?  

Also, just how much work is Will willing to do in the house and with kids so that Jasmine can work full time and not be overwhelmed with home and child responsibility?  The point is, we don't even know that.  He has high expectations of her financially but may not be thinking of an equal distribution of work to correspond with that expectation.  Sadly, even today's young men are still not following through on that equal distribution of labor in the home.  It's better today but it has still not come as far as it should.  And Will has not impressed me with being on board with that equal distribution.  He might be but he has not shown that to me so I'm skeptical. 

When a woman stays home to take care of home and children, the husband benefits.  Her work is worth something to him because she frees him up of his share of the responsibility to those things.  So if Jasmine wants to stay home Will is getting something as a result.  This was one of the points of the 1960s womens' movement, that housework and childcare are worth something and men should have an equal responsibility to those things, and women that stay home to do those things are benefiting a man.  She's not shirking responsibility by choosing to do that, it's just a different distribution of responsibility.

My comments on Jasmine and her 50/50 complaint is based on what I have seen on the show. She comes across as a selfish “happy wife, happy life,” type that expects to get her way or she’ll make Will’s life miserable. 

Throwing out situations about one getting sick or whatever are things that you could speculate about forever. What if Will gets sick and requires a very long period of rest and recuperation at home? Will Jasmine cover everything and sell her house if she has to in order to keep the family afloat while he gets better? Will she take a second job ringing up cheeseburgers or driving Uber and forego some things to take care of him like supportive wives would? I would collect cans if my spouse was ill in order to pay for everything as I'm sure the folks here would do as well. Would Jasmine do it lovingly or would she resent having to do it and let him know that constantly.

I think SAHMs work harder than anyone but that’s not Jasmine so I'm not commenting on her SAHM skills or the division of labor in the household as Will seemed fine with contributing to the household chores and stuff. My problem with Jasmine is the here and now. They have no kids, she is a working, independent woman so she’s not averse to working or she would have stayed at home and let daddy take care of her. She owns a home and has done well for herself and could combine with Will to have a nice starting nest egg but she comes across as a "What's yours is mine and what's mine is mine," type and that's fine if she finds a guy who thinks that is just swell. Presumably she went husband hunting because she wanted to build a life with someone and one of the first thing she tells him is that she expects him to bear the brunt of the finances because that's what she wants. Not what's best for us but what she wants and her answer when he protests is “happy wife, happy life.” 

[Ilovepie]

1 hour ago, Yeah No said:

BTW, right now I am a 'childless' woman of 60 that after a long career "just" stays at home and takes care of a house, and I know that one of the things the 1960s womens' movement stood for is that what is considered housework should not be belittled by being diminished as not real work.  Saying "just" in my opinion belittles and disrespects it.  That is actually male chauvinist thinking.  Not that you in particular meant it that way, but it has been used that way a lot. 

I believe I qualified my statement earlier by saying a woman in her 20’s, 30’s or 40’s. I was not meaning anyone who is retired, and I’m not really taking extenuating circumstances into account either, just non working for no reason. And quite honestly, I would have a hard time respecting (or understanding) a non working able bodied young “child free” woman, so the “just” was unconsciously intended. My original point was that other than crazy rich people you just don’t see this happening nowadays.

I have no problem with Jasmine’s (or anybody’s really) desire to be a SAHM. I do have a problem with her expecting this stranger to pay her bills practically two minutes after they met. That whole conversation was weird, and she has crazy expectations about Will. 

[Yeah No]

Talking about extenuating circumstances was my point.  Talking about a 50-50 financial split in the abstract is in my opinion never realistic given how these things usually work out in real life.  Real life is full of extenuating circumstances and qualifications.  Not working is never for "no reason" unless the person just shirks every life responsibility and doesn't take on the bulk of the household and child work.  Where women are concerned that is by far not usually the case even among upper middle class women, and I have no reason to think based on what I have seen so far that Jasmine is that much of a diva that she would just sit on her ass and paint her nails all day and expect Will to shoulder all the financial and household responsibility.  I think her skeptical attitude with Will is because she is looking for fairness, not because she wants someone to take care of her.  Looking at her work history shows me she's not that kind of person.

From what I have seen of Jasmine's work history she probably doesn't make as much as Will so a "fair" distribution of their finances would not be 50-50 anyway, unless Will were to step up and do more of the household work, such as cooking, cleaning, shopping and laundry to make up for the fact that Jasmine is contributing far more of her income to the household expenses.  If Will wants to split every hair I think he should work it out to its logical conclusion.  Usually women end up doing more of the household work regardless of how much money they contribute, even today with men just like Will.  My point is that if there is a 50-50 distribution of financial responsibility, there should be a 50-50 distribution of household work.  If there is not, then the person paying less should shoulder more of that work proportionately.  If fairness is the goal it does require taking those things into account, in my opinion.  And regardless of what a lot of men SAY, their interpretation of what shouldering half the housework is usually means less work than a woman thinks they should do.  It's just the way things are currently, and I don't expect Will, from what I have seen of him to be much different.  I also don't see what's wrong with Jasmine trying to get to the real deal with regard to where Will is coming from in that regard.  I would definitely want to know before getting any more involved with him emotionally.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Yeah No

[Stinamaia]

14 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

I liked them also.  Neil’s wife, the one with all the candles in the closet was just as bad as Molly, the blonde that treated Jon like dirt.  Blondie took him, so everything worked out.  I also liked the girl who sold vodka and married Basement Ryan.  They should have a reunion of everybody to see how they are all doing now.  That would bring in a lot of viewers.

Yes. Jacqui or something like it.  All the women that season got terrible men.  

The men this season are a bit confusing except for Luke.  He’s very clear. I like Will the best.  He is playing it close to the vest.  I think he can’t really feel safe sharing his thoughts and feelings because he can’t be sure it won’t be used against him.  

[Yeah No]

One more thing - Don't tell me that Will and Jasmine's money conversation happened before they told each other how much they make.  Being married I would think that would be an early topic of conversation.  If Jasmine's income is less than Will's his insistence of a 50-50 financial split would have justifiably provoked Jasmine's negative reaction.  In my opinion if fairness is the goal she should pay proportionately less towards household expenses unless he plans on doing proportionately more of the housework.  Fair is fair.

[Stinamaia]

I’m against the 50-50 idea, because you can’t reqlly do that without a lot of keeping lists in your head.  How do you decide that with household chores?  I think that the person who cooks doesn’t do the clean up is a nice rule of thumb, but that doesn’t always work out in terms of time.  Things rarely work out 50-50.  In a true partnership of love and respect, there will be times when one person does pretty much everything but then it balences out later. I think tit for tat can wind up hurting relationships.  Trying to work these things out when you only haven’t lived with someone but have just met them is almost impossible and makes people start imagining the worst case scenario.

3 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

One more thing - Don't tell me that Will and Jasmine's money conversation happened before they told each other how much they make.  Being married I would think that would be an early topic of conversation.  If Jasmine's income is less than Will's his insistence of a 50-50 financial split would have justifiably provoked Jasmine's negative reaction.  In my opinion if fairness is the goal she should pay proportionately less towards household expenses unless he plans on doing proportionately more of the housework.  Fair is fair.

The thing is, when the hypothetical of her earning more money was presented, Jasmine only moved to a 40-60 split with her paying less.  I had the impression that she made more than Will from the whole tenor of that conversation, but really, I know nothing.

[Empress1]

3 hours ago, Yeah No said:

To all those that believe that couples should split finances 50-50, I have a question for you.  What if Jasmine should become ill and can't work for a time and/or she decides after burning herself out that working and having kids is too much responsibility for her and as a result wants to stay home to devote all her time and energy to that?  Should she still be responsible for 50% of the finances?  For the "privilege" of staying home with kids should she have to go into debt or take money out of her personal bank account in order to pay "her share"?

Also, just how much work is Will willing to do in the house and with kids so that Jasmine can work full time and not be overwhelmed with home and child responsibility?  The point is, we don't even know that.  He has high expectations of her financially but may not be thinking of an equal distribution of work to correspond with that expectation.  Sadly, even today's young men are still not following through on that equal distribution of labor in the home.  It's better today but it has still not come as far as it should.  And Will has not impressed me with being on board with that equal distribution.  He might be but he has not shown that to me so I'm skeptical. 

When a woman stays home to take care of home and children, the husband benefits.  Her work is worth something to him because she frees him up of his share of the responsibility to those things.  So if Jasmine wants to stay home Will is getting something as a result.  This was one of the points of the 1960s womens' movement, that housework and childcare are worth something and men should have an equal responsibility to those things, and women that stay home to do those things are benefiting a man.  She's not shirking responsibility by choosing to do that, it's just a different distribution of responsibility.

No. I don't think anyone has made that suggestion. Right now they are a dual-income, no-kid couple. There's no reason for Will to shoulder the bulk of the expenses right now, which is what Jasmine is suggesting they do with the 70/30 split she wants, when Jasmine makes money too. (The only way this makes sense to me is if Will makes that much more than Jasmine, which we don't know, and that doesn't appear to have factored into Jasmine's thinking given Pastor Cal's question.) I've never heard anyone suggest that a SAHP should be going into debt to pay the household bills; the assumption is that the income-earning spouse's salary covers the household and the SAHP adds value by taking care of the home and children. That's not where Jasmine and Will are in their relationship, though. Jasmine hasn't even mentioned wanting to quit her job that I can recall.

Re: the distribution of housework, if I recall correctly, Will asked Jasmine if she thought that she should shoulder more of it if he was taking on the bulk of the financial burden. Will was saying basically what you are: if you're not contributing financially, shouldn't you contribute more to the household upkeep? I don't even think that's a controversial position.

21 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

One more thing - Don't tell me that Will and Jasmine's money conversation happened before they told each other how much they make.  Being married I would think that would be an early topic of conversation.  If Jasmine's income is less than Will's his insistence of a 50-50 financial split would have justifiably provoked Jasmine's negative reaction.  In my opinion if fairness is the goal she should pay proportionately less towards household expenses unless he plans on doing proportionately more of the housework.  Fair is fair.

It might have, though. We don't know. We did not see them have the conversation - we didn't see ANY of the couples have that conversation. AJ told us that he and Stephanie had it, but we have no idea when they did. Could have been at the reception, could have been five minutes before he said so on camera.

Quote

I believe I qualified my statement earlier by saying a woman in her 20’s, 30’s or 40’s. I was not meaning anyone who is retired

I agree - retirement doesn't belong in this conversation. It's not the same thing. (I can't wait to retire - I have like 35 years to go though! - so I'm not shitting on retirement.)

Edited February 4, 2019 by Empress1

[Gem 10]

2 hours ago, Yeah No said:

To all those that believe that couples should split finances 50-50, I have a question for you.  What if Jasmine should become ill and can't work for a time and/or she decides after burning herself out that working and having kids is too much responsibility for her and as a result wants to stay home to devote all her time and energy to that?  Should she still be responsible for 50% of the finances?  For the "privilege" of staying home with kids should she have to go into debt or take money out of her personal bank account in order to pay "her share"?  Is she obligated to work outside the home for a salary to contribute her 50% even if taking care of a home and children at the same time is unfulfilling or too much for her?  Should her husband expect that of her?  

Also, just how much work is Will willing to do in the house and with kids so that Jasmine can work full time and not be overwhelmed with home and child responsibility?  The point is, we don't even know that.  He has high expectations of her financially but may not be thinking of an equal distribution of work to correspond with that expectation.  Sadly, even today's young men are still not following through on that equal distribution of labor in the home.  It's better today but it has still not come as far as it should.  And Will has not impressed me with being on board with that equal distribution.  He might be but he has not shown that to me so I'm skeptical. 

When a woman stays home to take care of home and children, the husband benefits.  Her work is worth something to him because she frees him up of his share of the responsibility to those things.  So if Jasmine wants to stay home Will is getting something as a result.  This was one of the points of the 1960s womens' movement, that housework and childcare are worth something and men should have an equal responsibility to those things, and women that stay home to do those things are benefiting a man.  She's not shirking responsibility by choosing to do that, it's just a different distribution of responsibility.

HELL NO !  It is not a privilege to stay home and take care of kids day in and day out.  Its a big job.  Jasmine should not be expected to give one red cent.  She’s taking care of his kids.  I must live on Mars.  My husband and I pooled our money together no matter what each of us made from day one.  I didn’t work when the kids were small, then worked part time when they were bigger.  What’s his was mine and vice versa.  If he needs cash, he takes it and same with me.  All this 50, 30, 60 is foreign to me.  Maybe because they just got married and don’t know if they will stay together.  When we got inheritances, we shared equally down the middle.  We never had an argument over money and are married a very long time.  It’s just much easier to share equally.  I am old fashioned.  I know things are done differently now with women.  A few years back, it was talleyed up what a Mother was worth money wise if they had to hire someone to do everything.  I think it came to something like over $300,000 per year or something like that?  Maybe more.  I don’t remember exactly.  Guys almost fainted.   

[Gem 10]

One more thing, haha.  Why are Will and Jasmine talking so much about money at this early point.?  They should concentrate on having sex.  Maybe they aren’t compatible in the sack, so there goes everything down the drain.  Too soon to talk money.He doesn’t look interested anyhow.  

[configdotsys]

2 hours ago, Stinamaia said:

I’m against the 50-50 idea, because you can’t reqlly do that without a lot of keeping lists in your head.  

The 50/50 that I refer to in my comments is what Will said on the show "the household bills." The monthly necessaries. Those are the split bills so no list keeping is needed because those bills are typically in the same ballpark every month. I don't think anyone is saying that it is possible to take every element of a marriage and break it into two equal parts that each person is responsible for. I didn't see Will or Jasmine say that either.

If Jasmine is so bent on being traditional and paying less either because she just feels like it or because she wants to keep house and raise kids, that is a conversation that a mature adult has with their spouse that excludes the eye rolling shock she demonstrated at his suggestion that the "household bills" be split in half. She could have explained to him that it in her mind it should be in proportion to what each of them has and makes, and that her ideal life would be to stay home and raise kids. Instead, she looked shocked at the 50/50 like he was some crazy person for even suggesting such a thing and then topped it off with the happy wife, happy life cherry on the top. I wouldn't blame anyone for being totally turned off by that.

[Neurochick]

5 hours ago, Yeah No said:

To all those that believe that couples should split finances 50-50, I have a question for you.  What if Jasmine should become ill and can't work for a time and/or she decides after burning herself out that working and having kids is too much responsibility for her and as a result wants to stay home to devote all her time and energy to that?  Should she still be responsible for 50% of the finances?  For the "privilege" of staying home with kids should she have to go into debt or take money out of her personal bank account in order to pay "her share"?  Is she obligated to work outside the home for a salary to contribute her 50% even if taking care of a home and children at the same time is unfulfilling or too much for her?  Should her husband expect that of her?  

First of all Will could become ill, or burnout just as much as Jasmine can.

My issue with Jasmine isn't that she wants to stat home.  To me Jasmine did a bait and switch.  Promote yourself as independent, then as soon as you say "I do" decide to become a housewife.  Did she say in the beginning that when she married she didn't want to work anymore?  That's what I'd like to know. 

[Stinamaia]

14 minutes ago, configdotsys said:

The 50/50 that I refer to in my comments is what Will said on the show "the household bills." The monthly necessaries. Those are the split bills so no list keeping is needed because those bills are typically in the same ballpark every month. I don't think anyone is saying that it is possible to take every element of a marriage and break it into two equal parts that each person is responsible for. I didn't see Will or Jasmine say that either.

If Jasmine is so bent on being traditional and paying less either because she just feels like it or because she wants to keep house and raise kids, that is a conversation that a mature adult has with their spouse that excludes the eye rolling shock she demonstrated at his suggestion that the "household bills" be split in half. She could have explained to him that it in her mind it should be in proportion to what each of them has and makes, and that her ideal life would be to stay home and raise kids. Instead, she looked shocked at the 50/50 like he was some crazy person for even suggesting such a thing and then topped it off with the happy wife, happy life cherry on the top. I wouldn't blame anyone for being totally turned off by that.

Believe me, I’m not on Jasmine’s side in this discussion.  There’s such a lack of clarity in their discussion I want to do a mediation to sort it out. 

For the purposes of the show, expenses definitely need to be 50-50 if they aren’t taken care of  by production.

i think you need to love and trust one another and be dedicated to your marriage to work out financial arrangements, and even then small negotiations are needed over years before things fall into place. None of that is present here.  

Ricky Bobby needs to be sent to talk to all new couples.

[Gem 10]

Hahaha, Ricky Bobby is paying 95 to her 5 now.  If she stays home with baby, he will also pay the $17,000 credit card bill.  Plus, she wanted the new more expensive house.  Is this guy for real?  He is so enamored of her I want to throw up.

[Ilovepie]

22 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

To me Jasmine did a bait and switch.  Promote yourself as independent, then as soon as you say "I do" decide to become a housewife.

I think this is the problem too, but she is confusing because she wants him to take care of her, but at the same time she is still calling herself "independent". I think Will is confused too. What if he asked for an independent woman, and now she's like "you're the provider like my dad". I think it's just too early in their relationship to figure out how any of this will work out in the long run. I think splitting bills evenly during the experiment is really the only fair thing to do since they don't even know if they will stay together after the 6 weeks is up. If they agree to stay together (and I don't think they will), that is the time to really figure out how you will divide expenses, not when you barely know the other person's last name and you're shacked up in a temporary Airbnb.

Just now, Gem 10 said:

 If she stays home with baby, he will also pay the $17,000 credit card bill.

Perhaps that CC bill was paid for by "Happily Ever After?"???

[Gem 10]

19 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

I think this is the problem too, but she is confusing because she wants him to take care of her, but at the same time she is still calling herself "independent". I think Will is confused too. What if he asked for an independent woman, and now she's like "you're the provider like my dad". I think it's just too early in their relationship to figure out how any of this will work out in the long run. I think splitting bills evenly during the experiment is really the only fair thing to do since they don't even know if they will stay together after the 6 weeks is up. If they agree to stay together (and I don't think they will), that is the time to really figure out how you will divide expenses, not when you barely know the other person's last name and you're shacked up in a temporary Airbnb.

Perhaps that CC bill was paid for by "Happily Ever After?"???

There’s a Happily Ever After?  When and where?  Is that the one PETA and the two others are on?  There’s so many, I can’t keep up between everything.

[Jack Sampson]

3 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

One more thing, haha.  Why are Will and Jasmine talking so much about money at this early point.?  They should concentrate on having sex.  Maybe they aren’t compatible in the sack, so there goes everything down the drain.  Too soon to talk money.He doesn’t look interested anyhow.  

Someone should tell her how it works - you hook him with great sex THEN have him start paying your bills.

 

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

First of all Will could become ill, or burnout just as much as Jasmine can.

My issue with Jasmine isn't that she wants to stat home.  To me Jasmine did a bait and switch.  Promote yourself as independent, then as soon as you say "I do" decide to become a housewife.  Did she say in the beginning that when she married she didn't want to work anymore?  That's what I'd like to know. 

I doubt she even wants to be a housewife.  I think she wants to be independent but have Will finance her.

 

Sonia wanted the same thing but at least she was up front about it.  She literally said, and the experts reiterated in a voice over, that she wanted a husband to finance her lifestyle.