The Marvel Cinematic Universe: The Avengers, etc.

[GHScorpiosRule]

He's BAAAAAAACK!!!! Vincent D'Onofrio to return as Kingpin.

Interview is from The Washington Post. Since it's behind a paywall (I think?), see interview below:

Vincent D’Onofrio is the Kingpin of Marvel’s next gritty gamble, ‘Echo’

The actor’s star villain is helping Marvel Studios test out a bloodier, no-homework-required approach to storytelling

By David Betancourt

January 3, 2024 at 12:00 p.m. EST

Vincent D’Onofrio as Wilson Fisk/Kingpin in “Echo.” (Marvel Studios/Courtesy of Marvel Studios)

Back in 2015, actor Vincent D’Onofrio was given a seemingly impossible task.

Bring an iconic Marvel villain, the Kingpin, to life in a Netflix live-action without the influence of Marvel Studios. Not an easy assignment when you consider that Marvel Studios was at the height of its Hollywood popularity at the time, and that other Marvel franchises outside of its scope (Fox’s pre-merger X-Men and Sony’s Spider-Man) were losing cool points for missing out on the Marvel Cinematic Universe’s interconnective party. But then a funny thing happened.

He actually did it. And he did it very well.

Alongside Charlie Cox’s irreplaceable Daredevil, D’Onofrio’s Wilson Fisk/Kingpin, a top-tier bad guy in Marvel villainy in the pages of the comic books, became one half of what might just be the best and most violently intense Marvel rivalry on-screen, between Hell’s Kitchen’s Man Without Fear and the Kingpin of Crime.

D’Onofrio and Cox crafted definitive versions of their respective comic book characters, so much so that when “Daredevil” was canceled by Netflix in 2018 to make way for all things Marvel at Disney Plus, D’Onofrio was convinced that he would get to shave his head again sometime soon and return to the role.

That was not necessarily a sure thing. It was up to Marvel Studios and its president, Kevin Feige, to decide whether “Daredevil” and its universe would get a new life, as they gained control of the franchise.

“Charlie [Cox] and I talked about that all the time,” D’Onofrio told The Washington Post. “I actually just kind of knew that we were going to come back. My intuition told me that. I just couldn’t believe that they were just going to let that go. So it wasn’t a surprise to me that we eventually got that call.”

Now, D’Onofrio’s Kingpin and Cox’s Daredevil are Marvel Studios-certified. Cox made his first Marvel Studios appearance on the Disney Plus series “She-Hulk” as a love interest to the titular star (Tatiana Maslany). D’Onofrio made his Marvel Studios debut on Disney Plus as well, appearing on “Hawkeye.” Both actors will resume their Marvel main event on the upcoming Disney Plus series “Daredevil: Born Again.”

Hailee Steinfeld of ‘Hawkeye’ could become the next big star of the Marvel universe

The significance of D’Onofrio’s MCU arrival isn’t lost on him. His performance as the Kingpin on Netflix won such fanboy approval and credibility that casting anyone else in the role would have seemed almost criminal.

And now that the Kingpin is a part of the MCU, D’Onofrio knows fans are expecting a next-level performance as part of his return.

“We meet [Daredevil] fans all the time, and they remind us: … ‘Are you going to do the right thing? Are we going to get those characters from the Netflix shows [in the MCU]? Because that’s what we want,’” D’Onofrio said.

He is aware that the MCU was at peak power when he was making the Kingpin his own over at Netflix in the mid-2010s. Now that he and Cox are in the MCU, there is an irony that their arrival runs parallel to the first time Marvel Studios has gone through a rough patch with reviews, box office numbers and controversy. The MCU’s first flirtation with vincibility doesn’t weigh on D’Onofrio’s mind, however, as he prepares to do what he hopes is his best work yet as the Kingpin.

“I’ll speak for myself. Maybe I’m naive about it. I’m just not into [recent MCU criticisms] enough,” D’Onofrio said. “I’m not into the whole, ‘This is working and now it’s not anymore,’ kind of thing. It doesn’t affect me whatsoever. I have a job to do right now, and that is to kick ass with the story that we’re bringing forward.”

D’Onofrio has returned to the role of the Kingpin in the Disney Plus series “Echo,” which debuts its entire five-episode season on Jan. 9. D’Onofrio’s Kingpin once again stars alongside Maya Lopez/Echo (Alaqua Cox). The two both appeared on “Hawkeye,” laying down the foundation for their awkward adoptive father/daughter, uncle/niece, crime boss/protégée relationship that is explored further in “Echo.”

“Echo” will be the first title under Marvel Studios’ “Marvel Spotlight” banner, an indicator that the show, while connected to the MCU, doesn’t require viewers to have an encyclopedic knowledge of every Marvel movie and streaming series that has ever existed. Along with the complicated relationship between the Kingpin and Echo, the show will also explore Maya’s relationship with her Indigenous roots, tracing back to the dawn of the Choctaw tribe. Even as it’s essentially a Marvel Studios stand-alone, D’Onofrio said, “Echo” can serve as a bridge to what he and Cox have planned in the future as “Daredevil: Born Again” prepares to resume filming.

“‘Echo’ is turning out to be the perfect introduction for my character in ‘Born Again,’” D’Onofrio said. “More than ever, we are connected to the original [Netflix] series. There’s a lot of great things happening when it comes to … the way Charlie and I get to approach the characters again.”

Marvel Spotlight is also much grittier and more violent than the PG-13-ness that prevails over most of the MCU. D’Onofrio said that “Echo” has a similar vibe to “Daredevil’s” TV-MA flavor, and that Feige gave him a green light to bring that same edge to the Kingpin’s return. This isn’t a watered-down Kingpin because he’s now in the MCU.

“I definitely felt the same as when I was bringing [the Kingpin] forward for the first time at Netflix,” D’Onofrio said, of balancing the Kingpin’s calmness and unpredictable brutality. “You’re really uneasy about this guy. He’s sort of sympathetic. You feel kind of empathetic towards him at times. And other times you’re just like, ‘Oh my god, this guy’s like a monster.’”

D’Onofrio already comes off like a seasoned Marvel Studios acting veteran. He knows what’s coming for the Kingpin on “Echo” and “Daredevil: Born Again.” He’s read the scripts. He knows fans will be excited, and, most of all, he knows he’s sworn to secrecy.

For now.

“There’s all these things going on in my head that I would love to tell … but I can’t,” D’Onofrio said. “But I just want [fans] to know you should expect something very cool.”

To quote Michael Corleone: "Just when I think I'm out...THEY pull me back IN!"

[Spaceman Spiff]

On 1/3/2024 at 3:39 PM, GHScorpiosRule said:

He's BAAAAAAACK!!!! Vincent D'Onofrio to return as Kingpin.

We already knew this 2 years ago when he appeared in the Hawkeye Disney+ show.

[Raja]

19 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

We already knew this 2 years ago when he appeared in the Hawkeye Disney+ show.

What's different is in order to promote Echo that the show runner is suggesting the Netflix Defenders run is in the "sacred timeline" with the Infinity Saga and using scenes from Daredevil with Kingpin and Daredevil. In its own way similar to how Avengers scenes came up in the last promotional blitz for The Marvel's 

[tv echo]

John Ridley: My Scrapped Marvel TV Series Was About the Eternals — and ‘So F–king Weird’
BY MATT WEBB MITOVICH   JANUARY 3, 2024
https://tvline.com/news/marvel-tv-series-eternals-scrapped-abc-john-ridley-explains-1235108015/  

Quote

Back when the project was first leaked, it was said that Ridley was “reinventing an existing Marvel superhero character or property” for ABC, but zero details ever followed.
*  *  *
As a guest on the Jan. 2 Comic Book Club podcast, Ridley was asked about said Marvel series. After pondering for a second if he ever signed an non-disclosure agreement — then surmising, “What are they going to do, fire me for the work I’m not doing?” — Ridley confirmed that the project is “not in the works anymore,” but “was a television version of the Eternals.

"But good,” he added.

Ridley proceeded to describe his take on the celestials eventually brought to life in the tepidly received 2021 feature film as “so f–king weird,” and repeatedly contextualized that “but good” comparison.

“There was my version, a good version, which is good to me…. which doesn’t mean anything,” he told the Comic Book Club podcast hosts. Eventually, “There was the version that [Marvel] ended up doing which… I don’t think that version was particularly good — I’ll be honest — and for all kinds of reasons.

Ridley shared that his series pilot opened with a kid in his teens holding a power drill, then turning it on, putting it to his ear… and pushing in. “And then I think you see another kid who has to sleep in the bath tub…,” he continued, before acknowledging what we’re all thinking right now: “It’s just a really weird story about these people.

“It was good to me, dot-dot-dot, which also means very little,” Ridley reiterated. “The stuff I like is the first stuff that gets cancelled.”

Edited January 7 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Exclusive: Jonathan Majors speaks out for 1st time after conviction in domestic violence trial
By Linsey Davis, Brianti Downing, Meredith Deliso, and Anastasia Elyse Williams  January 8, 2024
https://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/exclusive-jonathan-majors-interview/story?id=106140900 

[tv echo]

[rmontro]

I happened across the first Avengers movie on TV the other day and watched it.  It really struck me how perfect that movie was, for what it was.  And how good the MCU was until Disney really got its claws in and ruined it.

[Spartan Girl]

2 hours ago, rmontro said:

I happened across the first Avengers movie on TV the other day and watched it.  It really struck me how perfect that movie was, for what it was.  And how good the MCU was until Disney really got its claws in and ruined it.

I don’t blame Disney as much as K.E.V.I.N.

[rmontro]

2 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

I don’t blame Disney as much as K.E.V.I.N.

Him too, they were both on the same page.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

3 hours ago, rmontro said:

Him too, they were both on the same page.

Were they? I wonder, and really, even if they were, I don't think Disney does the day-to-day stuff. Hiring directors and writers seems like Kevin's purview, and it hasn't been all bad despite the new insistence that the earlier phases were perfection. (They weren't.)

[Kel Varnsen]

23 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Hiring directors and writers seems like Kevin's purview, 

I wonder if it would be 100%? Like if he is going to be spending 200 million dollars or more on a movie he probably does get to select the director, but I would be surprised if he didn't have to run his selections by Iger for his boss's approval.

[rmontro]

15 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Were they? I wonder, and really, even if they were, I don't think Disney does the day-to-day stuff. Hiring directors and writers seems like Kevin's purview, and it hasn't been all bad despite the new insistence that the earlier phases were perfection. (They weren't.)

I certainly would not say that the earlier phases were perfection, or even that the new stuff is all bad.  My major beef is I no longer feel that my interests as a comic book fan are no longer being valued.  When I see the original Avengers movie, I see the comic book characters come to life.  I don't really see that anymore in the Marvel movies.

[Morrigan2575]

3 hours ago, rmontro said:

When I see the original Avengers movie, I see the comic book characters come to life.  I don't really see that anymore in the Marvel movies.

They went from writer/directors who loved the comics to (in some cases) people who actively hate the source material.  Of course that seems to be a problem in general amongst the Hollywood crowd.

When Disney bought FOX I swore MCU would finally give me my X-Men. Now I'm worried they'll screw up just like FOX. At least I have X-Men 97 to look forward too.

Edited January 17 by Morrigan2575

[baldryanr]

1 hour ago, Morrigan2575 said:

When Disney bought FOX I swore MCU would finally give me my X-Men. Now I'm worried they'll screw up just like FOX. At least I have X-Men 97 to look forward too.

History says the first movie will be fairly well received unless there are external factors at play.  The second is can be hit or miss, with it more likely to be a miss if they give the first movie's director carte blanche or hire someone who isn't really a fan of the material.  The early MCU was remarkable for getting fans to ignore inferior sequels (Iron Man 2, Thor 2, Age of Ultron) while now crappy followups (Multiverse of Madness) are called out as proof the idiots in charge have ruined everything.

Of course, this isn't just an MCU problem.  Virtually every big franchise (Star Wars, DC, Star Trek, the Potterverse, Indiana Jones) has had its more recent work held up as franchise killers.

 

[Raja]

12 minutes ago, baldryanr said:

History says the first movie will be fairly well received unless there are external factors at play.  The second is can be hit or miss, with it more likely to be a miss if they give the first movie's director carte blanche or hire someone who isn't really a fan of the material.  The early MCU was remarkable for getting fans to ignore inferior sequels (Iron Man 2, Thor 2, Age of Ultron) while now crappy followups (Multiverse of Madness) are called out as proof the idiots in charge have ruined everything.

Of course, this isn't just an MCU problem.  Virtually every big franchise (Star Wars, DC, Star Trek, the Potterverse, Indiana Jones) has had its more recent work held up as franchise killers.

 

What's missing is that The Avengers was a known "endgame" and Joss Whedon brought it home. Which then caused other franchise rights owners to try to shortcut and replicate Disney's cash cow 

[rmontro]

3 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

When Disney bought FOX I swore MCU would finally give me my X-Men. Now I'm worried they'll screw up just like FOX. 

I feel much like you, although in my case I'm a big fan of the Fantastic Four (comic), Stan Lee's flagship.  And Fox screwed up with the FF way more than they did with the X-Men.  I was so excited when Marvel got the rights, because I thought Marvel Studios would finally do the FF justice.  But as time goes on I get more and more apprehensive.

One thing I personally always wanted to see with the X-Men was the original team (although I admit that is probably not in high demand with modern crowds).  Sort of like First Class, except with the right members.

[JustHereForFood]

18 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

They went from writer/directors who loved the comics to (in some cases) people who actively hate the source material.  Of course that seems to be a problem in general amongst the Hollywood crowd.

Who hates the source material?

[Cobalt Stargazer]

On 1/17/2024 at 10:46 AM, rmontro said:

I certainly would not say that the earlier phases were perfection, or even that the new stuff is all bad.  My major beef is I no longer feel that my interests as a comic book fan are no longer being valued.  When I see the original Avengers movie, I see the comic book characters come to life.  I don't really see that anymore in the Marvel movies.

Fair enough. Alternately, we seem to have reached a point where a sense of satisfaction with anything is impossible. The manufactured outrage directed at The Marvels is the most recent example, and while it's not the best movie ever it isn't the worst thing in the history of cinema either. We don't like jokes because Taika Waititi and James Gunn "make everything too silly" (and mind you Gunn worked with movies involving a talking raccoon and a sentient tree). I had to dip out of a Twitter thread about the good Rotten Tomatoes reviews of the Disney streaming shows because I couldn't stand the stupidity anymore, the insistence that those reviews were engineered by Disney, as if that wasn't exactly what happened before Captain Marvel hit theaters and that's why the site had to change their rating system. It's been two years since Hawkeye ended, and I'm still having to listen to the whining about Kingpin being nerfed, as if he didn't walk off getting shot, hit with a car, blown up and then shot again. Now we've got Echo, and...well...if I never have to hear Matt Murdock's name again it'll be too damn soon. And this is just some of the stuff I know about. And yes, I can be just as bad, since I think Sam Raimi and Michael Waldron bear most of the blame for Multiverse of Madness being so terrible, but I also make time to talk about the things I enjoy, because otherwise why even watch any of it?

[Raja]

29 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

Who hates the source material?

The real question, are the sources 50 years old or 10 years old  reboots with a much smaller base of fans/gatekeepers?

[kiddo82]

I think D'Onfrio's acting as Kingpin is distractingly bad.  I can't even take the character seriously.

Edited January 19 by kiddo82

[Morrigan2575]

On 1/18/2024 at 11:44 AM, JustHereForFood said:

Who hates the source material?

Apologies for the delay, I kept forgetting to reply because of work.

MCU or Hollywood in general? The people that did The Witcher hated the books, which seems crazy to me, especially if you pitch the project but, maybe that was Netflix finding the wrong show runner.

MCU wise, I guess Hate might have been too strong of a word as I don't legitimately know or have heard that they hate the comics. I do think some of the recent writers/directors/show runners shit on the source material. 

I'm not a purist, it doesn't have to be exactly like the comics, especially since comics retcon their stories all the time. All they have to do is honor the spirit which, is what the earlier show runners seemed to do better, IMO.

Maybe when they were smaller and Disney wasn't milking the cash cow there was more control, I don't know. Just lately MCU went from mostly great/entertaining movies with a few duds sprinkled in to a boat load of crap with the occasional gem found in the muck (No Way Home, GotG Vol 3, Moon Knight, Loki S2 and Hawkeye).

Obviously, this is just my opinion 

 

[Raja]

1 hour ago, Morrigan2575 said:

MCU wise, I guess Hate might have been too strong of a word as I don't legitimately know or have heard that they hate the comics. I do think some of the recent writers/directors/show runners shit on the source material.

I would say they do hate the current editions of the classic comics characters and particularly hate the characters introduced in the past decade. They keep going on about Disney shows given to characters  whose comics run ended in a relatively short time compared to Spider-Man since the 60's or the best loved X-Men team of the 80s 

[Morrigan2575]

2 hours ago, Raja said:

I would say they do hate the current editions of the classic comics characters and particularly hate the characters introduced in the past decade. They keep going on about Disney shows given to characters  whose comics run ended in a relatively short time compared to Spider-Man since the 60's or the best loved X-Men team of the 80s 

That's a shame,  especially when you think back to the start of the MCU, making stars out of C/D list characters. 

[rmontro]

I wonder if Stan Lee's death several years ago has had any effect on the way the movies are made.  It seemed like a lot of the earlier ones were made with a lot of respect and affection toward his creations, and the attitude since his passing has been more along the lines of "Well, we own this now, and we'll do whatever we want with it".

[Raja]

1 hour ago, rmontro said:

I wonder if Stan Lee's death several years ago has had any effect on the way the movies are made.  It seemed like a lot of the earlier ones were made with a lot of respect and affection toward his creations, and the attitude since his passing has been more along the lines of "Well, we own this now, and we'll do whatever we want with it".

I don't think Stan Lee had anything to do with the movies beyond providing a good feeling with his cameo. For sure less than Roddenberry trying to change The Next Generation and Star Trek movies and more like Lucas and Star Wars but with the traditional cameo. It was all the other stuff in Disney's offices between the TV and movie folks now that Feige controls the TV.

Edited January 20 by Raja

[rmontro]

1 hour ago, Raja said:

I don't think Stan Lee had anything to do with the movies beyond providing a good feeling with his cameo. 

Oh, I wasn't trying to imply that he did.  But when he was alive and around, and there were people praising his work, and they could see how beloved he was, I'm sure it made an impression. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 1/18/2024 at 10:19 PM, kiddo82 said:

I think D'Onfrio's acting as Kingpin is distractingly bad.  I can't even take the character seriously.

Same. And I say this as someone who loves D’Onofrio. He’s a very good actor. After seeing him play a good guy for many years on Law & Order: Criminal Intent, it’s difficult for me to see him as a villain. He’s Bobby Goren for me.

 Post L&O, he was also in the second to last Jurassic movie. But his Kingpin is not…good.

That said, I’m still gonna watch the new Dare Devil because Charlie Cox.

 

On 1/18/2024 at 12:06 PM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Now we've got Echo, and...well...if I never have to hear Matt Murdock's name again it'll be too damn soon.

You’ve got me curious. I watched that and am confused.

[kiddo82]

3 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Same. And I say this as someone who loves D’Onofrio. He’s a very good actor. After seeing him play a good guy for many years on Law & Order: Criminal Intent, it’s difficult for me to see him as a villain. He’s Bobby Goren for me.

 Post L&O, he was also in the second to last Jurassic movie. But his Kingpin is not…good.

That said, I’m still gonna watch the new Dare Devil because Charlie Cox.

 

You’ve got me curious. I watched that and am confused.

Yeah.  I've seen enough of Vincent D'Onfrio in other things to know he's a good actor.  But I just don't like his choices as Kingpin.  It's like a Nicholas Cage performance before Nicholas Cage was in on the joke.

[Raja]

On 1/2/2024 at 7:40 PM, BetterButter said:

Steven Yeun Will Not Star in Marvel’s ‘Thunderbolts’

I wonder if Steven Yeun saw the gatekeeper comments about Sentry's body and didn't want to be treated like Tom Cruise was by the Reacher gatekeepers?

[Cobalt Stargazer]

3 hours ago, Raja said:

I wonder if Steven Yeun saw the gatekeeper comments about Sentry's body and didn't want to be treated like Tom Cruise was by the Reacher gatekeepers?

I wouldn't doubt he saw comments that were a lot more unpleasant than that. No one can seem to get their story straight about Thunderbolts, though, since for a while Hannah John-Kamen was rumored to be out of the project, but she's apparently still involved. If Yeun did drop out, it could be something like scheduling issues, since Beef might get a second season even if it hasn't been renewed yet.

[Raja]

30 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

I wouldn't doubt he saw comments that were a lot more unpleasant than that. No one can seem to get their story straight about Thunderbolts, though, since for a while Hannah John-Kamen was rumored to be out of the project, but she's apparently still involved. If Yeun did drop out, it could be something like scheduling issues, since Beef might get a second season even if it hasn't been renewed yet.

I would guess given the set up Ghost is the one character going in that we know blipped without anyone going quantum for her in that 5 years. I guess she could be the third prominent recasting done for a reason besides age in the MCU. Make that forth since Netflix Defenders saga is now the sacred timeline and Kingpin's wife  Vanessa has recast.

As for Beef, I would make it an anthology like Fargo and work in the production Even if a show bible has a three story run I see no reason to drag the two into something else as we would have to jump through more unbelievable hoops to get them free and then back together

[Morrigan2575]

3 hours ago, Raja said:

I wonder if Steven Yeun saw the gatekeeper comments about Sentry's body and didn't want to be treated like Tom Cruise was by the Reacher gatekeepers?

I thought it was related to the strike and all the scheduling/rescheduling that's happened since the Strikes ended. 

[Raja]

1 hour ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I thought it was related to the strike and all the scheduling/rescheduling that's happened since the Strikes ended. 

With the gossip press looking at announced projects and  not seeing much there.

[Morrigan2575]

On 1/20/2024 at 11:50 PM, kiddo82 said:

I've seen enough of Vincent D'Onfrio in other things to know he's a good actor.  But I just don't like his choices as Kingpin.  It's like a Nicholas Cage performance before Nicholas Cage was in on the joke.

Is there any CGI involved? I just saw a video of D'Onfrio doing press for Echo and talking about filming DareDevil and he's much thinner than Kingpin. I wonder if the issue is CGI or padding to make him bigger which impacts his performance?

I don't have an issue with it. Although,  something felt off about Kingpin in Hawkeye but, I blamed the Hawaiian shirts 😆

[arc]

On 1/16/2024 at 7:03 PM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

despite the new insistence that the earlier phases were perfection. (They weren't.)

These days, I like Avengers 1 except for all the distinctly Whedon-ish touches esp in the dialogue, and there's more than a few of those. But it's at least pretty good. I found Avengers 2 very disappointing. I get the sense most fans thought the Russo brothers did a better job overall with Civil War aka Avengers 2.5, then 3 (Infinity War) and 4 (Endgame) than Whedon's 1 & 2 taken together.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

On 1/22/2024 at 6:26 PM, Morrigan2575 said:

Is there any CGI involved? I just saw a video of D'Onfrio doing press for Echo and talking about filming DareDevil and he's much thinner than Kingpin. I wonder if the issue is CGI or padding to make him bigger which impacts his performance?

I wondered that too, although he's a big dude to begin with and his weight has fluctuated over the years due to health issues. He probably wears a padded suit now, since adding more pounds at sixty-four might not be the best thing.

 

 

5 hours ago, arc said:

I get the sense most fans thought the Russo brothers did a better job overall with Civil War aka Avengers 2.5, then 3 (Infinity War) and 4 (Endgame) than Whedon's 1 & 2 taken together.

There is every possibility that I'm misremembering, but what I recall about the reaction to Civil War are the complaints about characters not named Steve being in the movie, much less being allowed to do stuff. (Exaggerating. Kind of.) Apparently "It's Steve's movie" translates into "Why are all these other people here?", which is something no one ever said about any of the Iron Man movies. Never mind that the Russos saw fit to turn both Tony and Wanda into blame-magnets to protect Rogers, because "It's Steve's movie" also translates into "Everyone else has to suck", which again no one ever said about the Iron Man movies. You'd think the complainers about screen time would have been happy, since even Natasha was mostly just there to make sure Steve never put a foot wrong.

[Raja]

51 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

I wondered that too, although he's a big dude to begin with and his weight has fluctuated over the years due to health issues. He probably wears a padded suit now, since adding more pounds at sixty-four might not be the best thing.

 

 

There is every possibility that I'm misremembering, but what I recall about the reaction to Civil War are the complaints about characters not named Steve being in the movie, much less being allowed to do stuff. (Exaggerating. Kind of.) Apparently "It's Steve's movie" translates into "Why are all these other people here?", which is something no one ever said about any of the Iron Man movies. Never mind that the Russos saw fit to turn both Tony and Wanda into blame-magnets to protect Rogers, because "It's Steve's movie" also translates into "Everyone else has to suck", which again no one ever said about the Iron Man movies. You'd think the complainers about screen time would have been happy, since even Natasha was mostly just there to make sure Steve never put a foot wrong.

I also can't see  Kingpin's size being the expensive CGI root for such an easy practical effect. Especially for a designed for TV production. Even with home screens getting better at an exponential rate. Now if he was the size of the Miles Morales movie Kingpin okay.

The difference between the second and third Iron Man movies compared to the third Captain America. In Iron Man you only had his best friend, who happened to pilot his second tier armor, in Rhodey/War Machine-Iron Patriot. Meanwhile with heavy universe building along with Steve's two best friends in Bucky/Winter Soldier and Sam/Falcon you had to introduce Black Panther and Spider-Man along with make room for all of the rest of the lower powered Avengers with Ant-Man and Spider-Man subbing in for the big sticks Thor and the Hulk. So in effect it "really wasn't a Captain movie" compared to a Iron Man movie, Hence the Avengers 2.5 shots.

Edited January 29 by Raja

[Kel Varnsen]

5 hours ago, arc said:

I found Avengers 2 very disappointing. I get the sense most fans thought the Russo brothers did a better job overall with Civil War aka Avengers 2.5, then 3 (Infinity War) and 4 (Endgame) than Whedon's 1 & 2 taken together.

When I think about Age of Ultron compared to Civil War it always seems like AoU is a great idea executed poorly while CW is a dumb idea executed really well. Like as much as the whole Sokovia accords thing is stupid, it's a really well paced action movie with some really cool scenes. Which is especially impressive when you consider the number of movies it had to set up (or did set up after the fact). By my count it's 5 other movies it set up (Homecoming, Black Panther, Ant man and the wasp, Infinity War, and Black Widow).

[Raja]

I think that all they had to work with in Phase 2 for Age of Ultron was that S.H.I.E.L.D. was no longer around compared to the culmination of the origin stories in the first film. 

[tv echo]

Director Matthew Vaughn Says ‘Deadpool 3’ Will ‘Save’ The MCU: ‘Bring That Body Back To Life’ (Exclusive)
BY ERIC ITALIANO   JAN 30, 2024 
https://brobible.com/culture/article/matthew-vaughn-deadpool-3-will-save-marvel-cinematic-universe/ 

Quote

“The few snippets that I know about Deadpool vs. Wolverine — or Wolverine vs. Deadpool, I’m sure that argument between Ryan and Hugh is happening as we speak — are unbelievable,” Vaughn told BroBible’s Post Credit Podcast ahead of the release of his new film Argylle.

“That’s going to be the jolt… the Marvel universe is about to have a jolt of them and it’s going to bring that body back to life… I think Ryan Reynolds and Hugh Jackman are about to save the whole Marvel universe.”

Edited February 5 by tv echo

[tv echo]

From MegaCon Orlando on Saturday...

Paul Bettany on how he got Jarvis gig
Brothascomics Podcast  Posted Feb. 4, 2024

Paul Bettany explains his process of playing Vision in the MCU
Brothascomics Podcast    Feb. 4, 2024

[JustHereForFood]

20 hours ago, tv echo said:

Director Matthew Vaughn Says ‘Deadpool 3’ Will ‘Save’ The MCU: ‘Bring That Body Back To Life’ (Exclusive)
BY ERIC ITALIANO   JAN 30, 2024 
https://brobible.com/culture/article/matthew-vaughn-deadpool-3-will-save-marvel-cinematic-universe/ 

I don't even think MCU needs saving, but I'm really looking forward to that movie.

[baldryanr]

7 hours ago, JustHereForFood said:

I don't even think MCU needs saving, but I'm really looking forward to that movie.

The MCU needs something.  We can argue all we want about the reasons why, but there's no doubt that the reception to their post-Endgame output has been much more mixed, both critically and financially, than what came before it.   The sentiment used to be "we can trust these guys to deliver": now it's these guys suck and are going to ruin the X-Men, FF4, etc.

[Morrigan2575]

7 hours ago, JustHereForFood said:

I don't even think MCU needs saving, but I'm really looking forward to that movie.

I'm cautiously optimistic.  I loved Deapool, felt Deadpool 2 was mid at best, mostly a disappointment. I'm hoping they can control Reynolds enough to get a decent story in 3.

[Morrigan2575]

30 minutes ago, baldryanr said:

The sentiment used to be "we can trust these guys to deliver": now it's these guys suck and are going to ruin the X-Men, FF4, etc.

That's so me.

[HoodlumSheep]

once in a blue moon I pop in here with an update on viewing the mcu movies and I gotta say it's been awhile. I wanna say 3 years but it feels longer than that? Idk.

Last ones I watched were Thor 3, gotg 2 and infinity war and those were a really enjoyable group of movies to watch back to back so to speak.

Since then I hadn't watched any of the movies from endgame and beyond nor any of the shows. I've followed along decently enough by ways of social media though so I pretty much know what goes on in all of those for the most part.

This weekend I binged The Marvels, Shang Chi and Multiverse of Madness. at this point I'm so behind I don't care about the watch order.

maybe it's bc I've essentially been away from the MCU for 3 yrs but I didn't think any of them were all that bad? I feel like that saved me from a good chunk of the Marvel fatigue that's hit everyone else.

Anyways, not super fantastic but not terrible. I enjoyed them.

The Marvels:

Fun. I liked the shorter length too tbh. a couple of bonkers moments with the Disney princess planet and the cats/memory scene but I liked it. Liked the trio. They worked well together. definitely was reminded of Spaceballs with the whole stealing a planet's oxygen/resources thing and I would have to say Spaceballs did a better job of it. Biggest flaw was the completely unmemorable villain. Hammer lady. maybe I misheard it, but did she not mention having a sick child (?) thnx to the war and stuff? I don't understand why they didn't use that angle to make her a more compelling villain. It would have fit perfectly with the different family units presented in the movie (Kamala and her fam, Carol and Monica and Maria)??? Lost opportunity there.

I feel like you could make a drinking game out of how many times they said 'jump point.'

Shang-Chi:

maybe it's bc I watched this right after the Marvels and I paused a couple of times due to various reasons, but oh boy you could feel the length of this movie. I really enjoyed the first two-thirds of the movie and am bummed that it devolved into a mystical monster fest right at the end. That giant soul sucking dragon was not needed. Like at all, especially when you have a compelling enough villain with the dad! Like he was great! And then they switched to the dragon :/

Multiverse of Madness:

wish they would have committed to the horror aspect just a bit more. I really enjoyed Scarlet Witch as the villain. up until the MCU's version I only really knew her from the X-Men: Evolution cartoon so I'm glad to see her in a more antagonistic role like we got in the cartoon and AoU at least. Stephen and Christine :'(

wish they would have taken bigger risks with the multiverse world stuff. They definitely played it safe.

Out of the three I think I prefer MoFM. less glaring issues at least to me lol.

Edited February 11 by HoodlumSheep

[Anduin]

Yep, everyone says that about Shang-Chi. It's great until it isn't. :)

[Raja]

9 hours ago, HoodlumSheep said:

The Marvels:

Fun. I liked the shorter length too tbh. a couple of bonkers moments with the Disney princess planet and the cats/memory scene but I liked it. Liked the trio. They worked well together. definitely was reminded of Spaceballs with the whole stealing a planet's oxygen/resources thing and I would have to say Spaceballs did a better job of it. Biggest flaw was the completely unmemorable villain. Hammer lady. maybe I misheard it, but did she not mention having a sick child (?) thnx to the war and stuff? I don't understand why they didn't use that angle to make her a more compelling villain. It would have fit perfectly with the different family units presented in the movie (Kamala and her fam, Carol and Monica and Maria)??? Lost opportunity there.

I really don't remember any specific line about her family. But she was the leader of all of the Kree. In a way all of the children were hers. Maybe another shot of the ordinary Kree like the city scenes in the first movie. Just something beyond folks standing around to die when the sudden introduction of atmosphere happens. would have helped.

[tv echo]

GOTG VOL. 3 Director James Gunn Says He Couldn't "Legally" Work For Marvel Again Even If He Wanted To
By Mark Cassidy   Feb. 6, 2024
https://comicbookmovie.com/guardians-of-the-galaxy/vol-3/gotg-vol-3-director-james-gunn-says-he-couldnt-legally-work-for-marvel-again-even-if-he-wanted-to-a209235#gs.4v7oby 

Quote

On Threads, Gunn was asked if there was any chance he might write a fourth Guardians movie or the planned Star-Lord spin-off, and the filmmaker made it clear that he could not "physically or legally" work for Marvel Studios while acting as co-CEO of DC Studios.

Edited February 11 by tv echo

[Anduin]

Contract, of course. As for physically, maybe he doesn't have any good ideas? That's never stopped some writers, though. :)