Hoarders - General Discussion

[LeesburgLee]

3 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I also want Carl's storage unit of garbage to show up on, "Storage Wars."

Great idea! And I’m sure whoever won would tell us how he/she will make thousands of $$$ selling it. 🙄

[essexjan]

Carl was definitely a piece of work. I googled him and he has a long history of hoarding and neighbour disputes. He gave me the vibe of Anthony Hopkins in Psycho, and he's definitely in need of serious support or even intervention because of his mental health issues. I don't think he'll change, he'll probably die in that hovel, and not be found for months.

[Meowwww]

Carl is beyond help and isn’t fit to live alone.  I’ve only watched a bit, but him hiding behind those sunglasses is enough. 

[suzeecat]

On 11/8/2021 at 11:42 PM, Maria777 said:

Carl is mentally ill.  Period.

Hoarders has sunk to a new low.  This isn't hoarding; this is mental illness. 

Exploiting these people for better ratings is deplorable.  

There was nothing gained from this episode.  It was a waste of everybody's (including us viewers) time and money.  Once it was brought to their attention that there was no running water and Carl was using plastic bags for his human waste Adult Protective Services should have been called.  Get that man out of there, put him somewhere safe to live out his final days, and clear the property.  Plan B, let him live and die in that truck - it won't be much longer.  I can't even imagine how a person who "bathed" with bottled rain water while fully clothed must smell.  I can only hope that the neighbor was somehow compensated for what they put her through.  Bless her heart and soul, she is an angel on earth. 

[enoughcats]

Short of tying Carl to a bed in a home or forcibly medicating him into docility, there's  not much that can be done.  Put him in a safer place, unmedicated, and he'll walk home to where his history is. Carl wants what Carl wants and the rest of us don't count with Carl.

Lots of arguments can be made about the rights of a person to live as he chooses versus what his community expects of him, about can mental illnesses be cured and what is cured, and is changing someone to conform a cure or an imposition. 

Someone I know from that part of Florida died in a fire in his home and the Firemen couldn't get into the house because of all his belongings.  He was a lot younger than Carl, and my friend chose his life.  When I watched Carl, I thought of my friend and had a whole lot of "What if's" that have no answers.  

[Elizzikra]

Quote

Carl is beyond help and isn’t fit to live alone.  I’ve only watched a bit, but him hiding behind those sunglasses is enough. 

The sunglasses made sense to me given the recent cataract surgery but the peeing and pooping into grocery bags instead of a toilet convinced me that he shouldn't be living alone.

[auntjess]

On 11/8/2021 at 10:07 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

I can only imagine what lives in the house.   (He's wearing the sunglasses because he just had cataract surgery).  

I was surprised that we didn't see bugs and vermin, because I can't imagine them not being there.
There must be some money, to be able to afford storage units, and attorneys.
Michelle was a saint, and I can't figure why his trash wouldn't be bring vermin to the neighbors.

[CrazyInAlabama]

28 minutes ago, auntjess said:

I was surprised that we didn't see bugs and vermin, because I can't imagine them not being there.
There must be some money, to be able to afford storage units, and attorneys.
Michelle was a saint, and I can't figure why his trash wouldn't be bring vermin to the neighbors.

I wondered where it huge amount of money came from too.   I bet Tuesday morning, every storage place in the Tampa area looked at their list of patrons, to find out if he was hoarding garbage at their storage facility.    It doesn't seem that he was working, so unless the attorney is working for free, he must have massive legal and court bills, and he still has to pay property taxes.     Plus, he must have bought a lot of the hoard too.  

[auntjess]

52 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

wondered where it huge amount of money came from too.   I bet Tuesday morning, every storage place in the Tampa area looked at their list of patrons, to find out if he was hoarding garbage at their storage facility. 

Yes, because I'm betting he has more than one unit, and they're pricey, because other hoarders have had them, like the formerly rich Hollywood heiress with all the designer clothes, and several others.

 

[suzeecat]

Good points about where the money is coming from.  Social Security at the very least, I suppose.  Carl doesn't seem to be capable of following through on paying bills, and storage facilities won't keep your shit if you're not paying, so I wonder if his storage units have already been cleared and he isn't even aware. 

[theajw]

21 hours ago, enoughcats said:

 Someone I know from that part of Florida died in a fire in his home and the Firemen couldn't get into the house because of all his belongings.  He was a lot younger than Carl, and my friend chose his life.  When I watched Carl, I thought of my friend and had a whole lot of "What if's" that have no answers.  

I kept thinking about the possibility of a fire, especially with all those old newspapers scattered about.  

The article mentioned above notes that he has been diagnosed with Asperger's.  I actually wondered if he was on the spectrum, the way that he seemed to lack the ability to see the forest for the trees.  

[Claire85]

So Carl is clearly very ill and detached from reality. He should be in a long term care facility. Michelle really tried, but you can’t reason with someone like that. 

[RobustRutabaga]

4 hours ago, suzeecat said:

Good points about where the money is coming from.  Social Security at the very least, I suppose.

I had also thought perhaps he had an inheritance from his deceased parents/family members. Even if they weren't "wealthy", some sheer savings there that might've gone to him. Although I suppose given how long ago they passed and also Carl's advanced age maybe that'd have run dry by now.

The million+ dollars of fines didn't seem to phase him, everytime I heard that figure I about fell off my chair but we know he's not of a rational mind in many respects. That million+ is letter of the law on daily accumulation, I'd be curious if they waive or reduce it to something actually payable/achievable. And what would that be? 500k? 250k? 100k? 50k? Inevitably down the road I'm sure the house ends up getting seized or defaulted upon and all that stuff shoveled to the trash.

[Elizzikra]

26 minutes ago, RobustRutabaga said:

I had also thought perhaps he had an inheritance from his deceased parents/family members. Even if they weren't "wealthy", some sheer savings there that might've gone to him. Although I suppose given how long ago they passed and also Carl's advanced age maybe that'd have run dry by now.

The million+ dollars of fines didn't seem to phase him, everytime I heard that figure I about fell off my chair but we know he's not of a rational mind in many respects. That million+ is letter of the law on daily accumulation, I'd be curious if they waive or reduce it to something actually payable/achievable. And what would that be? 500k? 250k? 100k? 50k? Inevitably down the road I'm sure the house ends up getting seized or defaulted upon and all that stuff shoveled to the trash.

In theory, his expenses are probably close to zero. The home is likely paid off and he clearly isn't paying anything for upkeep. Not sure what the property taxes are and whether or not he pays them. He doesn't buy anything, but seems to acquire most of his stuff from dumpsters or the side of the road. I guess he spends something on food. No utilities. Doubtful that he has insurance. Maybe he has Medicare since he did have cataract surgery. 

In short, I don't think he needs a lot of money. He could live on social security alone.

[suzeecat]

32 minutes ago, RobustRutabaga said:

The million+ dollars of fines didn't seem to phase him, everytime I heard that figure I about fell off my chair but we know he's not of a rational mind in many respects. That million+ is letter of the law on daily accumulation, I'd be curious if they waive or reduce it to something actually payable/achievable. And what would that be? 500k? 250k? 100k? 50k? Inevitably down the road I'm sure the house ends up getting seized or defaulted upon and all that stuff shoveled to the trash.

I don't understand why the city/municipality lets these fines accumulate.  Certainly property is seized by the government for nonpayment of residential taxes far less than this. It appears the city is enabling his behavior, perhaps because they don't want to have to deal with the mess.  But they will eventually anyway. 

[ItsHelloPattiagain]

Quote

There must be some money, to be able to afford storage units, and attorneys.
Michelle was a saint, and I can't figure why his trash wouldn't be bring vermin to the neighbors.

I'm always surprised that hoarders have money for storage units.  Recently I was checking the prices of storage units for a relative and they were over $130 for one that might hold furniture and household belongings (not even the biggest one). 

Perhaps the attorney was someone that represented Carl pro bono at some point since he had a criminal complaint and felt sorry for him afterwards. 

As for an inheritance, I wasn't getting the idea his parents were these wealthy yet eccentric types. The house wasn't impressive even before the hoard started.  Of course, he wasn't really paying any utilities because there was no water and likely no electricity (I cringe thinking of candles being lit in that place with all the newspapers).  Maybe he was paying the property taxes with whatever inheritance money he had. The house appeared to be in the outskirts of Tampa so the property values weren't as high as the city . 

Michelle definitely is a saint. It really took a lot out of her to help Carl with his hoard.  Of course, not many people want to see an elderly neighbor removed from his property (although her mind was probably changed once she took a look at that bathroom). 

While it was pretty awful watching this episode, I was fascinated watching Carl trying to work through a lot of his issues during the episode.  Thank goodness APS was called and hopefully he will get some help. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

A lot of places, civil penalties from codes enforcement often are applied as liens, so until a property is sold, or inherited, the fines just cumulate. 

[Lorna Mae]

I don’t know what I was thinking, trying to eat ice cream during this episode.

That house didn’t look like anything special even in the early photos. And even if it’s just a matter of preserving The Family Home, he was literally shitting on his memories! Also, I loved the logic of “These stuffed animals only got ruined because there was no room for them in the house, but now I’m gonna have room in the house, so I can keep them in the house!” I think Carl is psychologically impaired to the point where he can’t see dirt and water damage and mouse damage. Like an anorexic who looks at their emaciated body and sees fat.

————————————————————————————————

Now about the episode before this, Paul. I’m confused about Skippy’s age. The plaque at his high school said Class of 1953, which would mean he was born in 1935. But those modeling shots appeared to be from the ’80s, and he didn’t look like he was in his fifties. Or did I read the plaque wrong and he was born in 1953?

Skippy’s ashes being lost is one of those moments I love, on this and the other shows. Once it was Dad’s medals and the flag from his coffin; another time it was genealogy charts that the hoarder had stolen (!) from another family member, and she couldn’t find them to give them back. They always get found (else we wouldn’t be hearing about them), but it’s still something that cannot be replaced, that has immeasurable value, but that the hoarder still treated with as much care as they would a used tissue. Maybe even less, since these are people who hang onto garbage.

Edited November 15, 2021 by Lorna Mae

[RobustRutabaga]

18 hours ago, Lorna Mae said:

I don’t know what I was thinking, trying to eat ice cream during this episode.

————————————————————————————————

Now about the episode before this, Paul. I’m confused about Skippy’s age. The plaque at his high school said Class of 1953, which would mean he was born in 1935. But those modeling shots appeared to be from the ’80s, and he didn’t look like he was in his fifties. Or did I read the plaque wrong and he was born in 1953?

I hear you on the ice cream thing... a lesson we've all learned! 🤢

I still had this episode on my DVR so I had to go back to investigate the age thing! I love a good Sherlock'ing. There are four different moments screen-captured here that I composited into one image.

1) Top Left. You're correct in that the plaque said "Class of 1953" so 1935 for a birth date is reasonable.
2) Top Right. Skippy is obviously the more elderly man in the white hat in that picture.
3) Bottom Left. Shown while talking about Skippy so that's got to be from I'm thinking at earliest the 1960s, but more likely the 1970s or into the 1980s - kind of a "middle age" thing?
4) Bottom Right. About the "modeling shots" you mention, I think that's Paul actually in that shot and another one they showed. Same long, more rectangular face, angular features (sharp eyebrows) and curly hair (but now is white). Since Paul is a younger man than Skippy they match up better with the Paul timeline. The voiceover is slightly ambiguous because it's under Paul saying "I believe what Skip really liked about me is that I was outgoing, because he was so shy. I think he wanted to be more like me, and I wanted to be more about him."  So they cut to old photos of Paul at that moment I guess.

[Elizzikra]

35 minutes ago, RobustRutabaga said:

I hear you on the ice cream thing... a lesson we've all learned! 🤢

I still had this episode on my DVR so I had to go back to investigate the age thing! I love a good Sherlock'ing. There are four different moments screen-captured here that I composited into one image.

1) Top Left. You're correct in that the plaque said "Class of 1953" so 1935 for a birth date is reasonable.
2) Top Right. Skippy is obviously the more elderly man in the white hat in that picture.
3) Bottom Left. Shown while talking about Skippy so that's got to be from I'm thinking at earliest the 1960s, but more likely the 1970s or into the 1980s - kind of a "middle age" thing?
4) Bottom Right. About the "modeling shots" you mention, I think that's Paul actually in that shot and another one they showed. Same long, more rectangular face, angular features (sharp eyebrows) and curly hair (but now is white). Since Paul is a younger man than Skippy they match up better with the Paul timeline. The voiceover is slightly ambiguous because it's under Paul saying "I believe what Skip really liked about me is that I was outgoing, because he was so shy. I think he wanted to be more like me, and I wanted to be more about him."  So they cut to old photos of Paul at that moment I guess.

Good sleuthing!

[LGraves65]

There's too much talking in this Carmen shitshow. She's ready! Throw stuff out! Stop talking, Zaz!

[CrazyInAlabama]

Carmen, Richmond, TX a retired data management specialist.   House is 3400 sq. ft. and she's lived there for 20 years.   If she doesn't want to hoard, then why does her front stoop look like a UPS truck threw up on it?   She collects used drink cups, clothes everywhere, and has Lymphedema (paging Dr. Now) so sleeps in a recliner.   She also collects the holiday villages for every occassion.   Carmen doesn't even open the boxes.  I don't buy the story, she was online shopping already, and when he was diagnosed, she accelerated it.    He hasn't been gone that long, so the hoard is growing dramatically.    The refrigerator needs to be taken out intact by a haz mat team.   

Kitchen is disgusting.   Plumbing is broken, so no bathrooms.      If she's so disgusted about her hoarding, then stop doing it.  Her daughter, Melissa, and Melissa's husband seem nice.   

Carmen married and divorced, and then in 2007 she reconnected with her high school boyfriend, Mike. Carmen and Mike were soul mates, after several years together they married in Vegas (no, don't know if Elvis presided), but then a year later Mike was diagnosed with liver cancer, and died just over a year later.  With Mike sick, Carmen started online binge shopping, and hid it in the garage. the entire sunroom is full of Amazon boxes.    Mike died about two years after they married (apparently about 4 years ago).   Then, the buying accelerated dramatically.   

At least Carmen could throw away empty drink cups and trash.      The new organizer will have a big problem with Carmen. Carmen can't find her jewelry, and her very expensive wedding ring.   Zasio shows up, and the new organizer, Carolina,  is on this one.   The refrigerator (Zasio shouldn't have opened it) is full of used drink cups, and take out containers (yes, Chick-fil-A, Checkers/Rally,  and Sonic are a lot of them).    Stand Up Guys are the junk removal again this week.   

Melissa and her husband, Eric say either the clean up starts today, or they're done.  Some of the famly haven't been in the home since the husband died two years ago, when the hoarding massively accelerated.  As usual, Carmen is so cooperative at first.   Melissa and Eric haven't been in the home in over two years, the late husband's sister Robyn and brother Scott, haven't been in the home for four years, and they're disgusted, and appalled.   There's dog feces all over the kitchen.    

Carmen says she wants to donate a lot and clean up, but she's keeping tons of table cloths, and multiple duplicates of stuff, like multiple sets of silverware she's never used.  Carmen is loving Zasio kissing up to her.     Carmen only agreed that only 20% could go on day one.  Zasio asks the daughter and hubby (Melissa and ERic) how they're doing, and they say hopeful and optimistic, but Zasio says she heard they were not hopeful, and Zasio wants them to admit that on camera.   Carmen is loving all of the attention, and everyone sucking up to her.  Melissa tells her mother the truth, so now Carmen is sick.  

Carmen's another crafter, I'm guessing she never does any crafts. Carmen is keeping about 80% of the stuff.  It looks like only actual garbage is getting tossed. I feel so sorry for the daughter and son-in-law, they're trying to use logic with someone who doesn't care.   The daughter was talking about consequences, but if she's talking adult protective services, she can forget help from them.  Zasio tells Carmen if she cleans up, people will visit, however, she doesn't want people bothering her.  Melissa is angry that her mother is keeping almost everything, and is venting to a producer. 

Melissa (the daughter) lays down the law to Zasio, the other relatives.   SHe's sick of coddling Carmen.    The house will be full of junk, after the 'clean out'.  The son-in-law is willing to be the bad guy, but Zasio says they can't push Carmen.    Zasio gives Carmen another pep talk on day two.   They're going to put a pile of trash or donate, vs. keep, and keep is virtually everything, 117 keep items, vs. 27 get rid of.   Carmen is keeping over 80% of the stuff.   Carmen ignores everything, and claims she wants to keep almost everything, and wants everything put back in the house. Then, Carmen doubles down, and tells her daughter, and hubby she doesn't want them here, or the rest of the people who put their lives on hold to come to this s*#$ show.   

Carolina meets with Charles, a collectibles buyer.  There are two full closets of collectibles, and some other places.  Mostly little houses, and theme statues.    Charles verdict is a lot of holiday ceramics are sellable, but the prices are down, because they usually appeal to the older crowd.   Charles offers $3,000 for the boxed collectibles, Carmen refuses. 

Zasio wants the relatives to write Michael a goodbye letter (from the Lola school of head shrinking, from my 600 lb Life?).  The family meetings are doing nothing to get Carmen to let go.    It's just reboxing, and churning stuff at this point. It's a waste of time to work with Carmen. Melissa is calling her grandfather, Carmen's dad, to talk her into cooperating.  Carmen's donating more now, but she still is keeping too much.   Carmen's letting some stuff go, but still had tons of stuff she already kept. 

Another person who lost their loved one's ashes in their bedroom.  Then, Charles the collectible buyer gets told no by Carmen, and Melissa agrees for now.  Charles is right, the collectible stuff like Carmen bought is not valuable.   I bet Carmen spent 10 times the $3,000 he offered on that stuff.   He only wanted the stuff still in boxes too. 

I pity the people that cleaned that revolting toilet and tub.   

There is still an entire room, stacked to the ceiling with collectibles.  The dining room is clear, the family room is stacked to the ceiling with U-Haul boxes of holiday decor.  Three dumpsters of trash went, one dumpster of donation, and everything else came back in the house.   They opened thousands of boxes. Kitchen and bedroom are clear, sunroom is clear.  Carmen's ring was found.  

BSOJ-Carmen is still going through the house, with Carmen is going to aftercare, and others are helping with the cleanup, and other issues. 

[JudyObscure]

Carmen  -- most boring hoarder ever.

[AZChristian]

How many times did she mention curtains (still in the wrapper) for the breakfast room?  I heard her at least twice.

However, once they got them out of the wrapper and up at the windows, they looked very nice!!!

I can almost understand buying yourself things to cheer yourself up . . . but how does leaving trash in the kitchen and wiping your poopy butt on toilet paper that you then have to throw away (because your hoarding and lack of taking care of your home have destroyed the plumbing) make you feel happy?

[Burning Rubber]

Eh... I don't believe she's only been hoarding since Michael died... because what are the chances the plumbing stopped working in the interval and she didn't have it fixed?

 

She's on disability for neck sprain? She still looks physically capable to me.

Wanna buy something to cheer you up? Treat yourself to two hours of a plumber's time!

[AZChristian]

1 minute ago, Burning Rubber said:

Eh... I don't believe she's only been hoarding since Michael died... 

Nor do I.  I think one of the voiceovers or chryons said that the hoarding got worse after he died.  

When we saw that master bedroom, all I could think of was, "If my beloved husband died in this room, it would be an immaculate shrine, not a dumping ground."

[RobustRutabaga]

12 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Kitchen is disgusting.   Plumbing is broken, so no bathrooms.

Another fine write-up/synopsis, @CrazyInAlabama! Thanks for doing those. If I can't get to the episode for a day or two I'll rundown the synopsis and then check out the episode afterward.

Funny how plumbing issues are such a constant amongst these hoarders. When I saw that line of your summary I thought, "Oh, of course, because is there more than an episode or two that goes by before that's the story?". It should be a drinking game, everytime the water was shut off, or is on but various taps or bathrooms are non-functional. Or a severe leak developed in a hot water heater or something. I guess combine serious neglect of the house and individual rooms and/or life instability (and not working or barely earning, leading to utility shut-offs years ago - or dumping the "poop bags" everywhere) and that's what happens.

I've been watching that "Dirty Rotten Cleaners" that was mentioned earlier in this thread and many of the sites are plumbing nightmares too! They're often doing the big initial clean (to "stabilize" the environment as one of the cleaners on the show puts it) before the tradespeople come in to make repairs.

[Ligeia]

19 minutes ago, RobustRutabaga said:

Funny how plumbing issues are such a constant amongst these hoarders. When I saw that line of your summary I thought, "Oh, of course, because is there more than an episode or two that goes by before that's the story?". It should be a drinking game, everytime the water was shut off, or is on but various taps or bathrooms are non-functional. Or a severe leak developed in a hot water heater or something. I guess combine serious neglect of the house and individual rooms and/or life instability (and not working or barely earning, leading to utility shut-offs years ago - or dumping the "poop bags" everywhere) and that's what happens.

Hoarders usually have plumbing issues because their houses are so stacked and filthy that no plumber could ever hope to access the actual pipes and stuff. Hoarders are also usually wary and/or ashamed to let a stranger into their home. And of course taking care of things in general, including house maintenance, is definitely not their forte. So for all these reasons, when some plumbing issue inevitably accurs at some point, it is never taken care of and then things quickly escalate.

Thanks for the comments on the Carmen show, it seems boring, I think I'll skip this one and watch an old show instead. Old seasons were the real deal !

Edited November 16, 2021 by Ligeia

[sempervivum]

This could have been covered in an hour-long show. Carmen was a stubborn self-pitying pig who clearly had been a hoarder well before Mike died, possibly even before she re-connected with him(?)

However, they padded this out with all the stuff I hate, including 'family meetings' to plot strategy, various participants pitching fits and Dr. Z's 'deep thoughts' and feels.

Didn't the daughter say initially that Carmen should take the $3K to help cover the cost of plumbing-was there any mention otherwise of her being short of funds?

Her house was beautiful (the cleaned parts), but if she's too 'disabled' to even work a desk job, how on earth is she going keep 3400 sq. ft. clean, to say nothing of taking care of a huge yard?

[JudyObscure]

I know the primary problems with hoarders and plumbing are: they never call them, lack of access, fear of being reported to the fire department, etc.

However we, who have no hoard, have not been able to get a plumber to fix the leak under our sink and we've been trying for six months.  We have to keep bowls under there to catch the water.  One plumber yelled at me for mispronouncing his name before he told me he was too busy,  The others promise to call back and never do. 

The man who painted our house a few years ago charged four times the average rate (according to Google).  Repair people can just pick their jobs and charge what ever they want, these days, so of course they wouldn't want to do Carmen's house.

[Maria777]

I felt sorry for Melissa, the daughter, and her husband. It was clear they were desperate to get Mom to clear out and clean up what is...or was...a beautiful home. As for the sister of Carmen's late husband, my heart broke watching her exasperation and pain seeing how her brother's memory was trashed in that bedroom, never mind his ashes lost in the hoard. It seems to always be the family members who suffer the most.

Despite a great crew (I liked Carolina) and Dr. Zasio trying everything in the book...and then some...I didn't see any resolution. In my opinion and observation, Carmen won't change and her immediate family will continue to suffer until they choose to walk away. Sometimes you reach the point where there's no choice but to get outside authority involved. Call Adult Protective Services, call code enforcement, call the fire department, whatever it takes. At least these people don't cuddle around.

As for Dr. Zasio, she finally admitted towards the end of the show (something most of us have already figured out) that 90% of hoarders go back to...you guessed it...hoarding.

 

[enoughcats]

OK, guys, let's talk about calling someone to do the jobs we don't want to do.  The workers we bring in, for the most part, aren't any smarter than we are.  

My husband and I reroofed our old farm house, he did the rewiring, we did the sheetrock, we installed the solid wood flooring, I did a huge amount of the painting and varnishing the wood floors. (We moved the bathrooms, etc.  because in our county we could without permits.)

This was something we taught ourselves. We both had office jobs in the oil industry.  But we figured we could retire early if we did things ourselves. 

For the plumbing, go to your library and borrow a how to book. Readers Digest made a great one (I had one before we got married and so did my husband.) check u-tubes on plumbing repair.

Being able to do things for yourself is more empowering than you can imagine, until you do "it" the first time.  

With the hoarders, they seem to get power from imposing on the people who love them.  They play the "poor pitiful me" card to the max. 

When you have the power to replace the cords in a venetian blind, to use duct tape to force stop a pesky leak before you have the time to get the right tools to take that pipe apart, to open a cardboard box, to repair a rip in a sheet that is otherwise usable,  then you and I have the power to make our own decisions. To rule our roosts. 

 

 

 

 

[theajw]

8 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Carmen  -- most boring hoarder ever.

My streaming service does not have A&E, so I have an Amazon subscription. I noticed that the episode was only about 50 minutes and wondered why. At some point during the Melissa freakout during day two, the episode abruptly ended.

Normally, I would be annoyed, but I found her story to be boring, so I didn't really care.  Reading the summaries here will suffice, and as I've been saying, I don't know why the newer episodes are so drawn out.  Keep the runtime at an hour, A&E.  

[CrazyInAlabama]

Since there's an entire room, and two giant closets with collectibles, mostly still in boxes, and still a huge amount of boxes in the house, Probably other rooms we never saw full of junk, the other bedrooms, I see zero chance that Carmen won't fill the house up again.   

They did show the garage being filled to the rafters, and maybe storage sheds too, so most of the hoard is still there.   I think the three dumpster loads were mostly actual trash, like the drink cups, empty boxes, and the small amount of stuff that Carmen actually let them trash.    I bet Carmen kept at least 70% of her hoard, a good start on rehoarding the house.

I guess that the double hoarders in one hour are much more expensive than two hours in one location, and with one crew working on it.    It's all about the money.  

Edited November 17, 2021 by CrazyInAlabama

[RobustRutabaga]

2 hours ago, enoughcats said:

Being able to do things for yourself is more empowering than you can imagine, until you do "it" the first time.  

I agree with this! I'm not "handy" in the least, but I had a loose, wiggly door knob on an inside room door that was irritating me. I wondered if I could repair that myself easily without replacing the doorknob outright or calling a handyman - I actually had no idea. I found a number of Youtube videos that showed there was a little groove at the bottom of the plate at the base of the handle flush against the door that you can gently use to pry loose and slide it away and the internal piece you see has multiple screws. Several of them were loose. Tightened them nicely with a matching bit from my socket set, put the plate back, and the doorknob was now tight and as good as new. As silly as it sounds, and it's "just" a doorknob, but now whenever I use that doorknob I have a flash of pride that I restored its functioning to what's expected and it cost no money for a fix. Youtube is amazing for educational/how-to videos where still pictures sometimes don't show the progression or a nuance.

To bring this back to "Hoarders", I'm sure a number of those houses have got to have loose and wiggly doorknobs - I can just feel it in the depths of my soul - but it's the least of the property's worries! 😄

[Elizzikra]

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I don't know why the newer episodes are so drawn out.  Keep the runtime at an hour, A&E.  

Twice as many hours of content for the same amount of money? I think they shoot the same amount of footage and just use two hours' worth instead of one.

[Ligeia]

6 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Twice as many hours of content for the same amount of money? I think they shoot the same amount of footage and just use two hours' worth instead of one.

Exactly. Except it's not even twice but four times as many hours of content for the same price, since it's one hoarder per show instead of two as it used to be. It's an easy decision for an executive. As a result the show is four times less interesting unfortunately !

[JudyObscure]

This time of year, I love to go to YouTube and watch the home videos people have made of their Lemax Christmas villages, with music and little trains running through them. Sigh

My father had half the basement taken up with a model railroad layout, so I don't know if it's the villages themselves or the people who took the time to make them that gets me all misty eyed...

but then we find this nasty woman with all the little houses and a bathroom full of poop bags in the same house and it made me just sick!  It's blasphemy!

[essexjan]

I initially felt sad for Carmen, because it was obvious she was mired in grief. But once the cleanup began and she wanted to keep everything, my sympathy evaporated. I'm glad Melissa and her husband went off on the producers, saying that the "kumbaya" approach wasn't working and they needed to get tough. I'm guessing the softly-softly way of dealing with hoarders is led by the psychologists, because that's how they are on most hoarding shows. But the hoarders are in the situation they're in because they can't make good decisions - why do the doctors think they'll miraculous begin making the best choices just because there's a crew of people there?

I hate ornaments and collectables (just another name for junk). I had a co-worker who used to collect the "Piggin'" ornaments (I don't know if they were a thing in the USA, but they were everywhere in the UK in the 1990s). They were just bits of Chinese-made resin, with no actual intrinsic value (by which I mean, they weren't made out of expensive porcelain or anything like that, just moulded in a machine). She had hundreds of them, and must have spent at least £10,000 on them. Okay, fine, she liked them and thought they were cute and fun. But, as the collectables guy said in this episode, the market for this kind of junk is older people. Who else is going to want them? They're destined for landfill.

I thought it was smart to fill the garage with neatly-stacked boxes up to the ceiling like the warehouse at the end of the Indiana Jones movie.  There's not a chance in hell Carmen is ever going to be able to get round to looking at those and then when she eventually dies, it'll be an easy enough thing for Melissa to have all the boxes loaded into a dumpster and bye-bye.

[LGraves65]

1 hour ago, essexjan said:

But, as the collectables guy said in this episode, the market for this kind of junk is older people. Who else is going to want them? They're destined for landfill.

My mother has at least $10k worth of Dept. 56 (I kept laughing at the collectibles guy trying so hard not to say "Dept. 56."  You know it took multiple takes.) Dickens Village.  She puts it up every Christmas with fake snow and little trees and lights.  It's beautiful.

But when she passes away, that shit is going right into an estate sale (minus a couple of pieces I really like) and pray some other old lady wants them.

[Elizzikra]

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Exactly. Except it's not even twice but four times as many hours of content for the same price, 

Sigh. Math was never my strength.

[all4mom2]

On 11/15/2021 at 5:37 PM, LGraves65 said:

There's too much talking in this Carmen shitshow. She's ready! Throw stuff out! Stop talking, Zaz!

I can't stand Zaz (unpopular opinion?).  She looks like the Bride of Dracula, wastes time with her stupid psychobabble, and is almost creepily fakety-fake mournfully compassionate while being completely ineffectual.  My least favorite psychologist ever on this series (along with Dorothy, my least favorite organizer).  Something tells me the doc is a producer this season!  Too much talk, too little action.

Why is everyone so touchy-feely now with the laying on of hands?  The son-in-law was especially "ick."

I could never understand donating - and hate seeing them trash - new or usable things when they can be sold, but it's also frustrating to see them (again) turn down a decent offer on their stuff, such as the collectibles this time.  

Two hours for one hoarder is much too long; it's like they're struggling to fill the air time with drama.

I prefer the reruns!

Edited November 17, 2021 by all4mom2

[Mondrianyone]

1 minute ago, all4mom2 said:

I can't stand Zaz (unpopular opinion?). 

I don't know if it's unpopular, but I share it. She seems to love the camera way too much, and she uses every psychobabble cliché in the book. My least favorite of the therapists by far.

[theajw]

I don't know if it was here or on TWoP where Zaz was named Dr. Tonya Hoarding, but that might be my favorite nickname ever.  

[sempervivum]

The network is also saving money on travel, compared to how they used to do shows from all parts of the country. Now they can plop a crew down in Richmond, TX for a week, and there's the episode.

36 minutes ago, Mondrianyone said:

45 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

I can't stand Zaz (unpopular opinion?). 

I don't know if it's unpopular, but I share it.

I agree. My pet peeve is the ridiculous way she dresses to go through rooms full of poop, pee, roaches, dead animals, rotting food, etc.

However, I do sympathize with the annoying way her hair is refusing to turn grey in back🙂

[CrazyInAlabama]

I dislike the way all of the therapists, especially Zas, kiss up to the hoarders.   They all do anything to keep the cameras filming, and get their two hours of usable film.     

[Pj3422]

1 hour ago, theajw said:

I don't know if it was here or on TWoP where Zaz was named Dr. Tonya Hoarding, but that might be my favorite nickname ever.  

It was TWOP. A couple years ago she called in to play one of the games on “Wait Wait Don’t Tell Me” and I screamed, “Dr. Tonya Hoarding!”

[JudyObscure]

5 hours ago, LGraves65 said:

She puts it up every Christmas with fake snow and little trees and lights.  It's beautiful.

That's how I feel.  I love looking at the stuff and wish I could see your mom's set-up, but I doubt if I would want to own it and deal with the getting out, setting up, packing up, storing, every year. 

Maybe when I get a few years older I'll think it's worth all the trouble, heh.  The collectibles guy annoyed me with his remark that only old people wanted it.  Our money not good enough for you, buddy?  Too wrinkly for you?

--------------------

Those of you who don't like the Zas should check out the famous pickle/ Nadene episode.   Dr. Zasio comes out on the porch where Nadene is smoking like the haggard old chimney she is and the Zaz calls out all smarmy sweet, "Oh here's the lady of the house!"  Nadene looks straight at the camera and rolls her eyes. LOL!  I like the Zaz but it cracks me up every time.

[RobustRutabaga]

28 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

Those of you who don't like the Zas should check out the famous pickle/ Nadene episode.   Dr. Zasio comes out on the porch where Nadene is smoking like the haggard old chimney she is and the Zaz calls out all smarmy sweet, "Oh here's the lady of the house!"  Nadene looks straight at the camera and rolls her eyes. LOL!  I like the Zaz but it cracks me up every time.

LOL! Yes! 😁  Season 2, Episode 12, "Dennis & Nadene"/"Erin & Malinda". Also the famous "river of poop" episode.

That's one of the more famous "The Zaz" moments - I was just thinking about this post earlier before you mentioned it too!

 

[ItsHelloPattiagain]

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However we, who have no hoard, have not been able to get a plumber to fix the leak under our sink and we've been trying for six months.  We have to keep bowls under there to catch the water.  One plumber yelled at me for mispronouncing his name before he told me he was too busy,  The others promise to call back and never do. 

I had a gigantic salad bowl underneath my leaky upstairs air handler for quite a while because I couldn't get an AC guy to come and replace the unit.  The bowl would fill, I would pour it out and replace it.  For MONTHS until I could get the guy to come. 

I got locked inside my house one day.  The lock straight up jammed and I ended up having to take the whole handle off the door just to get out.  I stuffed some paper towels in the gaping hole, drove to Home Depot and bought the whole assembly and watched You Tube videos and pretty much just changed the whole lock assembly by myself.  I'm not terribly mechanically inclined but I'm stubborn and didn't have any family around to help me. 

My guess on hoarder plumbing problems is that they stop paying the water bill and the water gets shut off.  Then any paper and "debris" (aka poop) going down gets stuck and plugs up the system . They keep using the toilet until *voila*, "plumbing problems" have arrived.  I'm guessing it's bad enough to snake out a few day old plugged toilet, but one with layers of debris and feces has got to be a challenge.