S10.E11: A Moving Day

[WhosThatGirl]

17 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

He has always had a bad relationship with them and was kicked out of the house when he was a teenager.

Well he was 18 when he was kicked out. He was definitely out of high school, so yes he was a teenager but he had a plan to move in with Haley when she graduated high school and to sell t shirts and then Haley got into a college so the plan didn’t happen.

[biakbiak]

5 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Well he was 18 when he was kicked out. He was definitely out of high school, so yes he was a teenager but he had a plan to move in with Haley when she graduated high school and to sell t shirts and then Haley got into a college so the plan didn’t happen.

He was already out of the house when they went to the dude ranch which is before Haley went to college. He had been living in a friend’s garage.

[Evangeline]

They've never shown the Dunphy's to be wealthy enough to rent Haley an apartment or buy her a house. That requires far more money than they've ever been shown to have. L.A. real estate is expensive! Especially if you want to live in a good area, and they didn't indicate the garage apartment was in a bad area. That place probably would cost $1500 a month (you can't even find a studio apartment for $1,500 a month in the desirable areas, but I'm discounting for the hole in the ceiling). Dylan is a student, and I doubt Haley's job pays well enough to afford more than $1500 a month. Otherwise, I agree with the consensus. Having Haley and Dylan move above Mitch and Cam would be the perfect arrangement for multiple reasons.

[Blakeston]

This episode was so bad that I've decided I'm done with making a point to watch the show. If it happens to be on when I'm around, then maybe I'll pay it some attention, but that's it.

The decision to bring back Pam means that either a) the writers are either too clueless to understand that the character makes for terrible TV, b) too lazy to care, and/or c) outright contemptuous of the audience.

[Mrs. Hanson]

10 hours ago, Evangeline said:

Otherwise, I agree with the consensus. Having Haley and Dylan move above Mitch and Cam would be the perfect arrangement for multiple reasons.

And if we can magically change the father to Andy life would be awesome.

[readster]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

 

The decision to bring back Pam means that either a) the writers are either too clueless to understand that the character makes for terrible TV, b) too lazy to care, and/or c) outright contemptuous of the audience.

I see it as all 3. They would not be the first show on ABC or other networks that care more about a character they feel is "awesome" or will be genius writing. Basically ignoring actual feedback from their audience or critics. There is one thing where they go: "I will make everyone love this character if it kills me." to: "they are awesome, don't you get my amazing vision!"

[Blakeston]

2 hours ago, readster said:

I see it as all 3. They would not be the first show on ABC or other networks that care more about a character they feel is "awesome" or will be genius writing. Basically ignoring actual feedback from their audience or critics. There is one thing where they go: "I will make everyone love this character if it kills me." to: "they are awesome, don't you get my amazing vision!"

Oh man, if they actually like the character, that's the worst possibility of all.

My suspicion all along has been that Steve Levitan is recycling yet another idea from Frasier - when the writers don't know how to make two characters seem like a believable couple, just give them a really mean houseguest (like they did with Daphne's mother). 

But at least on Frasier, as awful as Daphne's mother was, Daphne and Niles were united against her, so the plotline at least gave them a common goal. Here, Cameron still seems to think Pam is a worthwhile person - so she's one more thing for Cam and Mitch to fight about.

[SimoneS]

15 hours ago, Evangeline said:

They've never shown the Dunphy's to be wealthy enough to rent Haley an apartment or buy her a house. That requires far more money than they've ever been shown to have.

Claire runs a multi-million dollar custom closet company which her father owns. Phil used to be a successful real estate agent and up and decided to buy a magic store. These people are rich by anyone's standards and in any state. 

Edited January 11, 2019 by SimoneS

[Suzn]

1 hour ago, Blakeston said:

... Here, Cameron still seems to think Pam is a worthwhile person - so she's one more thing for Cam and Mitch to fight about.

Just another irritating thing about Cam - he thinks his "family" can do no wrong.  And seems to forget that Mitch and Lily are also family - they are always second place to him.

[WhosThatGirl]

10 minutes ago, Suzn said:

Just another irritating thing about Cam - he thinks his "family" can do no wrong.  And seems to forget that Mitch and Lily are also family - they are always second place to him.

Yup. 

I’m starting to think the goal of the show now is to make me hate everyone on it until the series end. That seems to be how all shows finish themselves these days. They just make you hte everyone so you don’t care when it’s over. I miss the days when I was bummed a show was ending now it seems like all shows just need to end already because I don’t care about anyone

at all.

[Tosia]

On 1/9/2019 at 10:30 PM, WhosThatGirl said:

I mean  the problem is that Like we have stated many times over in different episodes this season and this one, Haley and her siblings will never be grown ups. They don’t have any adult life skills. Adult jobs(what presumably Dylan and Haley have, we don’t really get clarity on what Haley’s job is or what she makes) don’t necessarily make an adult. As I stated in a previous episode forum, Haley has more than likely never paid a real bill. And I base this on things I’ve seen in past episodes and how Phil and Claire would cover half of something for her. Also not to mention we were shown a scene this episode  where she has no damn idea about money where she told Dylan to pay more than what was needed for the tip on their diner bill, which was supposed to be funny but to me just showed that they’re trying to do a storyline that forces Haley into adulthood with some cluster funny moments but with a “it’ll all work out in the end!” Which.. ew. This honestly isn’t cute or charming and I’m still sad that they have decided to settle her with Dylan. Like sorry but to me.. that’s settling. I know some people here love him but I don’t get it. Granted I’m still not sure why the show decides that it was Dylan or Irvin. And acting like she and Irvin were some great love that should even be considered as a option. None of it made sense. 

But yeah.. Is that what Haley is going to do for the rest of the season now? Freak out all the time? I mean I get the freak out in the beginning and I get the freak out at having twins but I do feel like that’s all she’s doing now.  

And I get Claire trying to clam him down with her “I will always be here over your shoulder to help” but at the same time, isn’t that how we got here? I mean.. saying things like that makes me think that Claire is just setting herself up to be raising Haley and Dylan’s kids while they do whatever. I mean yeah that probably won’t happen because I’m fully expecting happily ever after where somehow Haley is just fine but in the real world, Claire has literally just said to Haley that she will raise her kids so Haley can get the beauty sleep she has to require.

Yep. Remember the episode where Haley manipulated Clare into making cupcakes for her class or something?  

Clare figured it out towards the end, and dumped the cupcakes so Haley had to do them herself.  

Guess, Clare forgot about that.  Wait till Haley and Dylan are going out and Grandma is stuck with the kids.  Bad, bad scenario set up for those idiots and overcontrolling Clare and marshmallow Phil. 

[WhosThatGirl]

3 minutes ago, Tosia said:

Yep. Remember the episode where Haley manipulated Clare into making cupcakes for her class or something?  

Clare figured it out towards the end, and dumped the cupcakes so Haley had to do them herself.  

Guess, Clare forgot about that.  Wait till Haley and Dylan are going out and Grandma is stuck with the kids.  Bad, bad scenario set up for those idiots and overcontrolling Clare and marshmallow Phil. 

I think at the end of the episode though, over the credits, Haley’s cupcakes had turned out terrible so Claire ended up replacing them with ones she made anyway. So yes Haley did have to make them but Claire fixed it anyway.

My guess is this is how life will be for

thrm now. Haley and yank will want Claire and Phil to do something for them. Claire will sort of do it and then somewhat force the hand of H&D to do it but the result won’t be right (or what Claire demands as right, control freak and all) and fix it and end up doing it her/the right way anyway.

Also... how did Claire end up raising her kids this way when she didn’t seem like she was raised to be self-sufficient? She was younger than Haley when she ended up pregnant and it seems like she was probably more than able to

stand on her own two feet.

Also it isn’t like she’s only like this with haley(her first born) all her kids are going to be lost in the world. Even Phil’s parents seemed to have raised him to be able to handle the world. Yes his dad is goofy but compared to how Phil’s three kids are, I don’t know.. it just feels strange.

Edited January 11, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[Enigma X]

Finally watched this episode last night. I still enjoy Phil and Claire, the Dunphy kids, Mitch and Cam, and Jay (sometimes Gloria) but Manny, Joe, Dylan, Lily, and now Pam focused storylines bug. Since the latter are usually in a scene with the former, my enjoyment level is low but not all gone. 

Pam is the worst. But she was even worse than the last time we saw her? The writers have purposely made her wretched.

[Suzn]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I’m starting to think the goal of the show now is to make me hate everyone on it until the series end. That seems to be how all shows finish themselves these days. They just make you hate everyone so you don’t care when it’s over. I miss the days when I was bummed a show was ending now it seems like all shows just need to end already because I don’t care about anyone at all.

If that's their aim, it's working.

24 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I think at the end of the episode though, over the credits, Haley’s cupcakes had turned out terrible so Claire ended up replacing them with ones she made anyway. So yes Haley did have to make them but Claire fixed it anyway.

My guess is this is how life will be for

 

Exactly!  Haley will always be protected from harsh reality as long as Claire draws a breath.  I've never understood why she does that.  It is more than simply being controlling.

[possibilities]

55 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I think at the end of the episode though, over the credits, Haley’s cupcakes had turned out terrible so Claire ended up replacing them with ones she made anyway. So yes Haley did have to make them but Claire fixed it anyway.

My guess is this is how life will be for

thrm now. Haley and yank will want Claire and Phil to do something for them. Claire will sort of do it and then somewhat force the hand of H&D to do it but the result won’t be right (or what Claire demands as right, control freak and all) and fix it and end up doing it her/the right way anyway.

Also... how did Claire end up raising her kids this way when she didn’t seem like she was raised to be self-sufficient? She was younger than Haley when she ended up pregnant and it seems like she was probably more than able to

stand on her own two feet.

Also it isn’t like she’s only like this with haley(her first born) all her kids are going to be lost in the world. Even Phil’s parents seemed to have raised him to be able to handle the world. Yes his dad is goofy but compared to how Phil’s three kids are, I don’t know.. it just feels strange.

I have a theory about that. Fashions come and go in parenting, often in reaction to the previous generation's parenting style. I see a lot of people who were raised with "strict" parents, or parents who taught them to be more self-sufficient, turn around and become helicopter parents who keep their children from ever growing up and taking responsibility for anything. They think they are "fixing the mistakes their own parents made" but in reality they are just being rebellious and screwing up in the opposite direction. Likewise, I've seen kids raised by hippies who can't get off the farm and into urban professional settings fast enough, because they don't want to be like their parents. People are, very often, just plain reactive, and not really addressing their issues in a rational way. Rather than learning anything and improving it, they just do the opposite to create distance from it.

[WhosThatGirl]

4 minutes ago, possibilities said:

I have a theory about that. Fashions come and go in parenting, often in reaction to the previous generation's parenting style. I see a lot of people who were raised with "strict" parents, or parents who taught them to be more self-sufficient, turn around and become helicopter parents who keep their children from ever growing up and taking responsibility for anything. They think they are "fixing the mistakes their own parents made" but in reality they are just being rebellious and screwing up in the opposite direction. Likewise, I've seen kids raised by hippies who can't get off the farm and into urban professional settings fast enough, because they don't want to be like their parents. People are, very often, just plain reactive, and not really addressing their issues in a rational way. Rather than learning anything and improving it, they just do the opposite to create distance from it.

Yeah, that makes sense. But it is kind of funny to see how Claire(and Phil) raise her kids and her brother Mitchell barley raises Lily. I mean granted that’s all writing  and the show forgetting about her from time to time but even an episode pointed out that Mitxh and Can have no idea what’s going on with Lily. I remember when they found out she could skip a grade so they went in her room and were finding all of these things from school and were like, “what the hell?” Kind of interesting.

[Suzn]

On 1/11/2019 at 1:52 PM, WhosThatGirl said:

Yeah, that makes sense. But it is kind of funny to see how Claire(and Phil) raise her kids and her brother Mitchell barley raises Lily. I mean granted that’s all writing  and the show forgetting about her from time to time but even an episode pointed out that Mitxh and Can have no idea what’s going on with Lily. I remember when they found out she could skip a grade so they went in her room and were finding all of these things from school and were like, “what the hell?” Kind of interesting.

I found that horrifying!  Once she was no longer a baby or preschooler, she was of no further interest to them,

 

On 1/11/2019 at 1:43 PM, possibilities said:

I have a theory about that. Fashions come and go in parenting, often in reaction to the previous generation's parenting style. I see a lot of people who were raised with "strict" parents, or parents who taught them to be more self-sufficient, turn around and become helicopter parents who keep their children from ever growing up and taking responsibility for anything. They think they are "fixing the mistakes their own parents made" but in reality they are just being rebellious and screwing up in the opposite direction. Likewise, I've seen kids raised by hippies who can't get off the farm and into urban professional settings fast enough, because they don't want to be like their parents. People are, very often, just plain reactive, and not really addressing their issues in a rational way. Rather than learning anything and improving it, they just do the opposite to create distance from it.

I think this is exactly it.  No thought given, just merely reacting and being opposite.

Edited January 12, 2019 by Suzn

[WhosThatGirl]

Oh yeah Cam and Mitch are really bad parents to Lily but a lot of that I used to chalk up to the show forgetting she exists or something with how long they can work the actress, but then show made it a meta thing by having her do things without her fathers knowledge and yeah.. it’s not as funny as they want it to be, it’s just showing them to be awful parents.

[lynxfx]

17 hours ago, Evangeline said:

That place probably would cost $1500 a month (you can't even find a studio apartment for $1,500 a month in the desirable areas, but I'm discounting for the hole in the ceiling). Dylan is a student, and I doubt Haley's job pays well enough to afford more than $1500 a month. 

I just moved out of a nice 750 sq/ft 1 bedroom in Venice which was $1200/mo rent controlled. Across the street are multi-million dollar homes so a nice neighborhood. They could find something rentable on the westside if this was the real world. We just have to remember that this is a tv show where the writers tend to ignore reality. These are upper middle-class families living in a nice area of LA and they want us to believe that their kids would want to live in an inhabitable garage? This isn't Roseanne after all. 

Is this going to be the last season or are they still open to a season 11?

[Mittengirl]

Don’t the Dunphys have the ubiquitous-on-TV apartment over the garage (usually never seen or mentioned before) that twentysomething kids usually live in?

[salmondean]

To be honest, I just can't relate to the fact that the show seems to be making a big deal over Hailey being young and pregnant. She's like 25! I realize that being in your mid twenties doesn't mean you're automatically financially and emotionally capable of raising a child but she's not fresh out of high school and knocked up. But then again, most women in my family started popping out kids by the time they were 23 or 24 at the latest so that probably colors my perception. And I know that Hailey is too stupid to know how to save money but she does have a stable job (that she just got a promotion in) and Dylan inexplicably seems like he's going to do well in his future nursing role, so they're in a better place than a ton of pregnant couples I've known, even considering the crazy housing prices of LA. 

 

Also, I get that Phil and Claire don't want their grandchildren to be raised in a shitty little garage where owls will drop baby gophers on their heads or whatever but I would NEVER let my dumb kid and her dumb boyfriend and their newborn twins live in my basement. They're insane. 

[readster]

19 hours ago, possibilities said:

I have a theory about that. Fashions come and go in parenting, often in reaction to the previous generation's parenting style. I see a lot of people who were raised with "strict" parents, or parents who taught them to be more self-sufficient, turn around and become helicopter parents who keep their children from ever growing up and taking responsibility for anything. They think they are "fixing the mistakes their own parents made" but in reality they are just being rebellious and screwing up in the opposite direction. Likewise, I've seen kids raised by hippies who can't get off the farm and into urban professional settings fast enough, because they don't want to be like their parents. People are, very often, just plain reactive, and not really addressing their issues in a rational way. Rather than learning anything and improving it, they just do the opposite to create distance from it.

Oh that's  my thoughts too. Being a teacher and my wife and I's own raising, it's pretty common. Hell, I have neighbors where that happened. We have one where her parents were very strict and then she let her three kids run around and do whatever after her divorce. While her daughters learned to be self sufficient, the oldest went to college. The youngest (little brother) did stupid stuff from almost getting hit by cars playing in the street to telling teachers they didn't matter. Now, he is in his mid teens and is tired of "getting into" trouble. When his mom bailed him out all of the time and now she is tired of doing it and he keeps going: "I'm tired of going to the principal's office." They tell him: "Well, how about you stop doing stupid stuff you know you are getting in trouble for?" That's what you get with Haley, Alex and Luke. Claire has to just be in charge of things (why the hell she didn't figure a way to get Haley into at least Community College, who knows). Phil's father, while goofy himself and at times aloof, wasn't trying to get his son's best friend, which Phil did do (of course Phil tries to be everyone's friend). Jay just saw the world a specific way and had a dad that really avoiding trying to show that he was "loving". So, Claire became a control freak and Phil became trying to be the "cool dad". As for Mitch... I put the blame on Dede. She was so crazy and so forth and Mitch tried to not be like her, but look what he turned into. 

[qtpye]

As a woman I feel that the writers are afraid to have the husbands ever really stand up to their wives because they think it will come off as too aggressive and sexist. This also includes Mitch and Cam, since Cam was originally in the traditionally feminine role as the househusband who stays home to take care of the baby. As a result we see people bending over backwards  to accommodate their demanding and nast spouses. It was interesting to me that Claire never even discussed Hailey moving back in with Phil. Gloria grits her teeth and goes insane any time Jay does not jump to her commands. Poor Mitch ends up losing his miles and an income stream because of Cam’s sister. He also has to accompany him to that god awful festival.

The funny thing is they have no problem being sexist in other ways. Even though both actresses are charming, the fact that Hailey is the stereotypical pretty girl who is coddled through life because of her looks and Alex is the genius with no social skills,are two broad caricatures in themselves of how women have been portrayed.  In the Middle, Mike had no problem ever calling out Frankie for doing something stupid. He was never afraid or bullied by his wife into doing something that was ridiculous. He was far from perfect but just standing up to his wife once in a while  did not make a sexist caveman.

[readster]

2 hours ago, qtpye said:

As a woman I feel that the writers are afraid to have the husbands ever really stand up to their wives because they think it will come off as too aggressive and sexist. This also includes Mitch and Cam, since Cam was originally in the traditionally feminine role as the househusband who stays home to take care of the baby. As a result we see people bending over backwards  to accommodate their demanding and nast spouses. It was interesting to me that Claire never even discussed Hailey moving back in with Phil. Gloria grits her teeth and goes insane any time Jay does not jump to her commands. Poor Mitch ends up losing his miles and an income stream because of Cam’s sister. He also has to accompany him to that god awful festival.

The funny thing is they have no problem being sexist in other ways. Even though both actresses are charming, the fact that Hailey is the stereotypical pretty girl who is coddled through life because of her looks and Alex is the genius with no social skills,are two broad caricatures in themselves of how women have been portrayed.  In the Middle, Mike had no problem ever calling out Frankie for doing something stupid. He was never afraid or bullied by his wife into doing something that was ridiculous. He was far from perfect but just standing up to his wife once in a while  did not make a sexist caveman.

That's how the Middle differed in marriage on TV. Mike wasn't afraid, he didn't do smart things himself or really was so intreverted, he hated how people made a bid deal about things or called things "stupid" even though he did some very stupid things that he got called on too. However, Mike and Frankie felt like a normal married couple. Phil comes off looking like he has no word on anything and Claire still doesn't get her over controlling and helicoptering parenting is what lead to the disaster that is Haley and Dylan. Jay has gotten to the point of why does he ever bother to try and do anything "fun" for himself. Gloria tries to get her way and doesn't see that Manny is going to end up like Haley at his rate. As for Cam, he is so bent on forgiving his family for all the bullshit they do daily or have done. Yet if Mitch has any free will, he is guilt ed or told he is a fraud by Cam it has become almost abusive. Of course how Pam hasn't gotten herself killed at this point in time doesn't many any sense either. 

[WhosThatGirl]

20 hours ago, salmondean said:

To be honest, I just can't relate to the fact that the show seems to be making a big deal over Hailey being young and pregnant. She's like 25! I realize that being in your mid twenties doesn't mean you're automatically financially and emotionally capable of raising a child but she's not fresh out of high school and knocked up. But then again, most women in my family started popping out kids by the time they were 23 or 24 at the latest so that probably colors my perception. And I know that Hailey is too stupid to know how to save money but she does have a stable job (that she just got a promotion in) and Dylan inexplicably seems like he's going to do well in his future nursing role, so they're in a better place than a ton of pregnant couples I've known, even considering the crazy housing prices of LA. 

 

Also, I get that Phil and Claire don't want their grandchildren to be raised in a shitty little garage where owls will drop baby gophers on their heads or whatever but I would NEVER let my dumb kid and her dumb boyfriend and their newborn twins live in my basement. They're insane. 

This. For me it’s not a big deal because the show is writing her as not her age. Also I still can’t buy that Dylan is going to be fine. Because really Dylan to me is soyi a doofus. 

So it shouldn’t be a big deal but Haley and Dylan are still idiots. As I said adult jobs don’t make adults. Case in point where they were choosing to move in. They thought this garage apartment wit an open window  would be fine. That’s.. real Dumb. Also as viewers we are supposed to laugh and giggle at all this, when in reality it’s like, “these two are about to raise babies. It’s not cute. Or adorable. Or funny. It really truthfully is awful. It makes Haley look like she’s a teen mom and not the adult should be. Because she doesn’t know how to be a adult. As I said before she has an adult job but that means nothing.

[seacliffsal]

I think they put Haley and Dylan in the garage at the beginning of the episode as they're taking story lines from "Reba."  Reba and Van had their office in the garage and when they accidentally opened the garage door, all of the items put on shelves and in bins on the door fell.  Also, Reba's daughter and Van moved in with Reba when they found out the daughter was pregnant (and they didn't get married until later).  So, I guess to change it up, the writers wrote for twins... Coincidence?  Hmmm....

Maybe they are running out of ideas...

[WhosThatGirl]

1 minute ago, seacliffsal said:

I think they put Haley and Dylan in the garage at the beginning of the episode as they're taking story lines from "Reba."  Reba and Van had their office in the garage and when they accidentally opened the garage door, all of the items put on shelves and in bins on the door fell.  Also, Reba's daughter and Van moved in with Reba when they found out the daughter was pregnant (and they didn't get married until later).  So, I guess to change it up, the writers wrote for twins... Coincidence?  Hmmm....

Maybe they are running out of ideas...

Actually in Reba I believe they got married before the

baby was born in the first season.  It wasn’t a big wedding but a few seasons later they had a vow renewal but it ended up being not great because at that point they were having problems in their marriage because they had gotten married young and now as adults wanted different things.

And yes they are running out of ideas. I’m also not sure how the show is going to handle adding two new babies to the show. Lily worked because that’s how the show started and she was good when he was littke(now her deadpan doesn’t always land right) but joe hasn’t always worked as a baby/child actor. And Cal has the same problem. Now we’re getting two new babies.

[readster]

13 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Actually in Reba I believe they got married before the

baby was born in the first season.  It wasn’t a big wedding but a few seasons later they had a vow renewal but it ended up being not great because at that point they were having problems in their marriage because they had gotten married young and now as adults wanted different things.

And yes they are running out of ideas. I’m also not sure how the show is going to handle adding two new babies to the show. Lily worked because that’s how the show started and she was good when he was littke(now her deadpan doesn’t always land right) but joe hasn’t always worked as a baby/child actor. And Cal has the same problem. Now we’re getting two new babies.

Plus also to clarify from Reba. It was in the last season that Van got his real estate license because Sheyanne was pregnant again and Van needed to start working a career that made good money. However, Reba even told him why he didn't use the basement instead of the garage. Of course, Van was played to be hit in the head too many times with a football or didn't think minor things through like the garage door going up. He knew how to write out bills, save money, even build things. Dylan can't string numbers, looks at his phone battery dying when he is driving on the road and is told one address and then goes to the house next door. How he can be a nurse or get into nursing school is really, really unbelievable. 

   Sheyanne on Reba was the pretty blonde, but she was a good student, new how to balance a paycheck, actually wanted to be a dentist like her father. She just jumped to decisions without thinking. Haley... where do you want me to begin? 

  It's like with Pam, she brings nothing to the show, at least with Cal with Cam and Mitch that did make sense, since that was talked about for a years about them having a baby boy. In a way it wasn't too bad, but then when they turned it into: "Lilly can appear when we FEEL like it!" That is why kids start becoming problems on TV shows. They don't know what to do with them as writers, they can't find kids that are really that good at acting. Plus, they do it because: "We don't know anything else to do." So they think throwing in new characters like Pam, twin babies, ect will revitalize the show... but it's not. Similar to the problem that happened over in Black-ish, they brought in Baby Demonte because the original creator decided to use his own experience of having a baby later in life after his own kids were almost out of the house. However, they ignore the baby most of the time and when they do use the baby, they come across looking like idiots. Because they didn't know what to do with Bow's character for the season and it backfired on them. 

[WhosThatGirl]

1 hour ago, readster said:

Plus also to clarify from Reba. It was in the last season that Van got his real estate license because Sheyanne was pregnant again and Van needed to start working a career that made good money. However, Reba even told him why he didn't use the basement instead of the garage. Of course, Van was played to be hit in the head too many times with a football or didn't think minor things through like the garage door going up. He knew how to write out bills, save money, even build things. Dylan can't string numbers, looks at his phone battery dying when he is driving on the road and is told one address and then goes to the house next door. How he can be a nurse or get into nursing school is really, really unbelievable. 

   Sheyanne on Reba was the pretty blonde, but she was a good student, new how to balance a paycheck, actually wanted to be a dentist like her father. She just jumped to decisions without thinking. Haley... where do you want me to begin? 

  It's like with Pam, she brings nothing to the show, at least with Cal with Cam and Mitch that did make sense, since that was talked about for a years about them having a baby boy. In a way it wasn't too bad, but then when they turned it into: "Lilly can appear when we FEEL like it!" That is why kids start becoming problems on TV shows. They don't know what to do with them as writers, they can't find kids that are really that good at acting. Plus, they do it because: "We don't know anything else to do." So they think throwing in new characters like Pam, twin babies, ect will revitalize the show... but it's not. Similar to the problem that happened over in Black-ish, they brought in Baby Demonte because the original creator decided to use his own experience of having a baby later in life after his own kids were almost out of the house. However, they ignore the baby most of the time and when they do use the baby, they come across looking like idiots. Because they didn't know what to do with Bow's character for the season and it backfired on them. 

And now this show is bringing in not just one new baby but two! I mean adding new babies is tough for any show but adding them so late into a series is really bad. And you are correct this show doesn’t know how to write kids at all. Hell, they can barley manage to write for the adult and young adult characters anymore. Sometimes we don’t see certain characters for quite some time. 

[Evangeline]

On 1/11/2019 at 9:28 AM, SimoneS said:

Claire runs a multi-million dollar custom closet company which her father owns. Phil used to be a successful real estate agent and up and decided to buy a magic store. These people are rich by anyone's standards and in any state. 

 

I would guess both Claire and Phil each make somewhere between $150k and $300k per year.  Solidly middle class for a family of 5.  Nowhere near rich by L.A. standards.  And there is no indication the magic store is profitable, and they never suggested it was, so buying it is hardly a display of wealth (not to mention that buying it would have cut into their savings and it's entirely possible that store is in fact costing them money).  When you factor in 3 kids, plus their retirement, they've given us no reason to think that they have that kind of extra money, including the implications of renting or buying a house for Haley (I think some help in some fashion would be understandable, e.g. subsidizing them living over Cam and Mitch's or letting them live at home, but I'm objecting to the notion that they would or could just rent or buy a nice place for 1 of their 3 kids -- having them live at home is exactly what I would expect in that situation, and that's what the writers did.).  I took the garage apartment scene as Haley and Dylan's display of independence -- not a decision reached through a well-thought out analysis of their options with input from their parents (as we know by Phil and Claire's horror at the place).    

On 1/11/2019 at 1:01 PM, lynxfx said:

I just moved out of a nice 750 sq/ft 1 bedroom in Venice which was $1200/mo rent controlled. Across the street are multi-million dollar homes so a nice neighborhood. They could find something rentable on the westside if this was the real world. We just have to remember that this is a tv show where the writers tend to ignore reality. These are upper middle-class families living in a nice area of LA and they want us to believe that their kids would want to live in an inhabitable garage? This isn't Roseanne after all. 

Is this going to be the last season or are they still open to a season 11?

"Rent controlled" being the key words.  Is your landlord currently renting it out for only $1,200? (If so, is it still available? Link?)

Edited January 15, 2019 by Evangeline

[possibilities]

Buying an unprofitable business of any kind, just because you want to and not because you have any kind of business plan to make it profitable, is a sign they are very well-off, indeed. If they weren't rolling in dough, they wouldn't have been able to do that.

[lynxfx]

2 hours ago, Evangeline said:

"Rent controlled" being the key words.  Is your landlord currently renting it out for only $1,200? (If so, is it still available? Link?)

It is rented out before you move out. This particular one was part of Scott Properties. They have a bunch of properties on the west side and are typically lower priced than anyone else in my experience. Lived in two of their complexes, one in Venice and one in Palms. Plenty of other rent controlled apartments but they don't sit on the market so you have to seek them out and get yourself on the list to be first in line when one opens up. You can't just wait for it to show up on Westside Rentals. 

[TheLastKidPicked]

On 1/11/2019 at 12:43 PM, possibilities said:

have a theory about that. Fashions come and go in parenting, often in reaction to the previous generation's parenting style. I see a lot of people who were raised with "strict" parents, or parents who taught them to be more self-sufficient, turn around and become helicopter parents who keep their children from ever growing up and taking responsibility for anything.

And this is where the show is missing an opportunity-- to explore the generation gap.

Imagine this:

Jay has a friend who offers Dylan or Haley a good, solid job.  Jay explains,  "This is how you raise a family.  You get a good job with a Fortune 500 company, 40 hours a week and two weeks vacation.  Then you have the babies."

 

And Dylan and Haley respond with,  "That's not how we do it now, Grandpa.  It's not 40 hours a week and two weeks vacation.  When it's time to buy diapers, one of us will turn on our Uber App and drive for a while.  When it's time to buy formula, one of us will turn on our AmazonDelivers app and deliver some packages.

Not saying which side is right or wrong, but it would be interesting to contrast the two.

Edited January 15, 2019 by TheLastKidPicked

[biakbiak]

2 hours ago, TheLastKidPicked said:

Jay has a friend who offers Dylan or Haley a good, solid job.  Jay explains, 

Dylan is in school for becoming a nurse which is a good and solid job and Haley has a job at a GOOP equivalent which is a great job for her that fits her they don’t need Jay.

[chitowngirl]

6 hours ago, biakbiak said:

Dylan is in school for becoming a nurse which is a good and solid job and Haley has a job at a GOOP equivalent which is a great job for her that fits her they don’t need Jay.

Then they should act like the adults they are and not some clueless adolescents!!!

[readster]

19 hours ago, chitowngirl said:

Then they should act like the adults they are and not some clueless adolescents!!!

That's exactly it and it's not like Dylan isn't use to paying: rent, utilities, gas for his car. Yeah, Haley has had everything handed her living with her parents, but she still has had to buy: food, gas for her car, uber, ect. Yet they continue to act like they are 17. 

[SnarkySheep]

On 1/9/2019 at 11:34 PM, readster said:

Yet, Haley is still: "Whatever, I'll be famous one day!" Umm... 25 not 18 anymore.

If they play this character trait straight, it'd get pretty ugly fast. Imagine Haley, always thinking she's so gorgeous and wanting to be center of attention, suddenly realizing life is no longer all about her when she has two tiny, super-needy infants. Then throw in a few extra pounds she just can't lose and maybe some postpartum depression...