The Starling City Times: News and Media about Arrow

[Morrigan2575]

9 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

They need to wrap up the picture of doom for good, so it would be something like, Oliver glues the beard on his face, then looks at the picture of doom, then has ~a vision~ of St. Laurel -- cut to present time -- and he gives the picture of doom to Lance for ~feels~, or maybe to Tinah for lulz.

Similar I figured he'd have a flashback to some pre-island Laurel to go full circle on the Pilot. Maybe, some talk they had about the city and how she wanted to help people blah blah blah

[insomniadreams88]

13 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

They need to wrap up the picture of doom for good, so it would be something like, Oliver glues the beard on his face, then looks at the picture of doom, then has ~a vision~ of St. Laurel -- cut to present time -- and he gives the picture of doom to Lance for ~feels~, or maybe to Tinah for lulz.

If this happens, I'd love it if Tinah just decides to leave Star City. "You know what? This is just weird. I'm going to go back to Hub City/see if X City needs some help." 

[Sunshine]

18 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

They need to wrap up the picture of doom for good, so it would be something like, Oliver glues the beard on his face, then looks at the picture of doom, then has ~a vision~ of St. Laurel -- cut to present time -- and he gives the picture of doom to Lance for ~feels~, or maybe to Tinah for lulz.

Did he keep the picture of doom after Laurel died?  He gave it to her in the 4.18 flashback and then she showed it to him in 4.18 present day.  Did he put it in his pocket to remember her by again?  LOL!  4.19 is the one episode I have never rewatched so I don't remember what happened to it from there.  

Edited February 13, 2017 by Sunshine

[dtissagirl]

9 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Similar I figured he'd have a flashback to some pre-island Laurel to go full circle on the Pilot. Maybe, some talk they had about the city and how she wanted to help people blah blah blah

Oooooh. We could then have Oliver say the "Dinah Laurel Lance always trying to save the world" curse all the way before the Gambit 10 years ago, like a flashback within the flashback #flashbackception, cut to present time, Oliver says the curse to Tinah for ~symbolism~.

And then an anvil falls on our heads.

[Morrigan2575]

6 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Oooooh. We could then have Oliver say the "Dinah Laurel Lance always trying to save the world" curse all the way before the Gambit 10 years ago, like a flashback within the flashback #flashbackception, cut to present time, Oliver says the curse to Tinah for ~symbolism~.

And then an anvil falls on our heads.

I love it! Make it happen. 

In all seriousness, if ever there was a time to get a Tommy/Colin cameo I think 523 would be perfect. A little pre-island flashback to Oliver/Tommy.

Edited February 14, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[Chaser]

33 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

They need to wrap up the picture of doom for good, so it would be something like, Oliver glues the beard on his face, then looks at the picture of doom, then has ~a vision~ of St. Laurel -- cut to present time -- and he gives the picture of doom to Lance for ~feels~, or maybe to Tinah for lulz.

And the picture morphs to Tinah.

[dtissagirl]

11 minutes ago, Chaser said:

And the picture morphs to Tinah.

Okay, but then the anvil has to fall on her head, not ours.

[Willowtree]

I thought the comments to the GATV article were really interesting.....I know that Stephen Amell is only working four-day weeks this season, but I didn't know this was standard practice for some CW leads. Maybe we shouldn't be sorry for Willa, since she gets paid the same but lesser episodes? I really like her character and her acting, so I'd like to see more of her, but I'm not sure she's that disappointed with the current situation herself. It does give her time to do other stuff.

Edited February 14, 2017 by Willowtree

[Chaser]

3 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Okay, but then the anvil has to fall on her head, not ours.

What's another Arrow-induced concussion?

[Primal Slayer]

2 hours ago, kismet said:

I don't think QL has anything to do with Black Siren. Also I don't think the show will connect them. And I believe that QL should not be connected with BS at all. No offense, but OQ being obsessed over how much LL she was, was already too much for me. I don't need to see it with QL. I have very few positive memories of LL's time on Arrow. But the QL/LL relationship was special, I don't want to see that ruined by BS.

MG has already stated that he is interested in having Siren and QL meet. Now if that ever comes to fruition is something else but he seemed like he wanted to explore it and we all know how they love to make QL miserable. 

[Primal Slayer]

3 hours ago, wonderwall said:

Answering Arrow Season 5’s Greatest Mystery: Where’s Thea?

http://www.greenarrowtv.com/answering-arrow-season-5s-greatest-mystery-wheres-thea/

Now that raises so many questions/theories in my head. I am guessing that Willa could've renegotiated her contract after season 4, if it is nothing out of the ordinary (possible rehab) I am guessing that Willa is just over the show and wanting to move on or the shows budget got cut and they needed to trim the necessary people in order to make way for all the newbies. But her episode count getting cut in half is no me gusta.

In case of Smallville, getting Lois Lane on the show was a BIG thing and apparently a very expensive move so they were only allowed to have Erica in so many episodes and of course TVD everyone was basically a glorified extra outside of the big 3 so that was no surprise. 

But if they only have Willa for 14 episodes, why not actually write the girl a decent story where it makes sense that she isnt around? They did perfectly at the end of S2/beginning of S3. We just happened to see it. 

Edited February 14, 2017 by Primal Slayer

[lemotomato]

"Contracts, nothing we can do about it!" was also the reason TPTB gave for writing Roy/CH off the show. And then we found out later CH chose to leave because of personal issues he was dealing with at the time. Sounds a lot like this sudden explanation for WH not being around this season.

[Trisha]

58 minutes ago, Willowtree said:

I thought the comments to the GATV article were really interesting.....I know that Stephen Amell is only working four-day weeks this season, but I didn't know this was standard practice for some CW leads. Maybe we shouldn't be sorry for Willa, since she gets paid the same but lesser episodes?

The longer a show goes on, the more power the long standing players have when it comes to negotiating. So she could certainly have asked for less screen time - though you would think they would have spaced out her appearances better. The way this went down seems like there's more to it BTS. Does anyone remember how many episodes she was in last season? Because she's a regular she's credited for being in all of them, but she probably wasn't. 

As for MG teasing that KC might be returning by the end of the season, surely they'd be figuring that out soon if they haven't already? They're currently shooting 17 or 18 and there's only 23 eps in a season.

[Primal Slayer]

You would think you have all your ducks in a row by now with the season speeding to an end but it seems like they may be playing fast and loose like RM did with his Glee guest stars. 

Katie is on her way to Vancouver again, but it could be just to get some more of her stuff. 

Edited February 14, 2017 by Primal Slayer

[Starfish35]

Well I think they've started filming the season finale for LoT? So theoretically she could still show up there I guess.

[BkWurm1]

Quote

In case of Smallville, getting Lois Lane on the show was a BIG thing and apparently a very expensive move so they were only allowed to have Erica in so many episodes and of course TVD everyone was basically a glorified extra outside of the big 3 so that was no surprise. 

Lois on Smallville had a reduced appearance on the show because the show runners for many years didn't want her as anything but a part time regular.  The only reason she even showed up on the show in season four at all was because of a lawsuit that claimed Smallville was infringing on the copyrights of Superboy.  Since Lois wasn't a part of the Superboy comic legacy, WB thought adding her character would help their case.  

They still lost but Smallville was stuck with a character that was on the outside of the secret, wasn't the love interest and would have been completely redundant as a reporter since the show already had a full time regular that had that covered.  Lois basically had to be shoehorned into side plots for years before new show runners took over and decided to basically reboot the character. (IMO at the expense of the original regular that had been with the show since season one) 

WIth Willa, I'd say it's safe to say that if she has a reduced contract for 14 episodes, she's getting paid less than she was last year.  If it's really because of behind the scenes stuff with Willa, ok, I'll be understanding, but if it turns out she was just shafted to make room for all the waste of space newbies, I'm going to be pissed.   But that's not something we are likely to find out any time soon, is it.  

Edited February 14, 2017 by BkWurm1

[Starfish35]

I'm inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt on this one, not because I have anything against Willa. I love Thea and I've wanted better stuff for her for years.  But I remember suspecting that Roy was pushed out to make room for other people on the team (the whole "two year contract" story MG tried to sell just didn't sound legit), and it turned out they were covering for Colton needing to be off the show at that time.  Which I understand and support.  So I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt that they're not pushing Willa out. *shrug* Doesn't mean I'm not wrong, but I just feel like this has more to do with Willa, whether rehab/BTS issues or just wanting less time on the show.

[BkWurm1]

13 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

I'm inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt on this one, not because I have anything against Willa. I love Thea and I've wanted better stuff for her for years.  But I remember suspecting that Roy was pushed out to make room for other people on the team (the whole "two year contract" story MG tried to sell just didn't sound legit), and it turned out they were covering for Colton needing to be off the show at that time.  Which I understand and support.  So I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt that they're not pushing Willa out. *shrug* Doesn't mean I'm not wrong, but I just feel like this has more to do with Willa, whether rehab/BTS issues or just wanting less time on the show.

Yeah, I get that.  I think I need to acknowledge that I can be open minded about the reasons behind the lack of Thea and still be pissed by all the newbies at the same time.  

[Starfish35]

Just now, BkWurm1 said:

Yeah, I get that.  I think I need to acknowledge that I can be open minded about the reasons behind the lack of Thea and still be pissed by all the newbies at the same time.  

LOL. That's fair. :)

[tv echo]

At this point, I can pretty much predict who is going to speak against Felicity (coughPaulcough)...

Arrow Round Table: Did Felicity Go Too Far?
Paul Dailly at February 13, 2017 12:30 pm
https://www.tvfanatic.com/2017/02/arrow-round-table-did-felicity-go-too-far/

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TV Fanatics Steve Ford, Jim Garner and Paul Dailly discuss the Susan twist, Ragman losing his rags and Diggle's decision. 
*  *  *
What did you think of that Susan twist?

Steve: I always knew there was something up with Susan, but I could never quite put my finger on it. It's difficult to tell if she is developing feelings for him or if she is straight up playing him.

In any event, she could just end up being another victim of Prometheus, once again proving that anyone Oliver gets close to dies. Oliver really can't catch a break, can he?

Jim: Unlike Steve, I'm pretty damn sure she is just straight up playing him. I sad for Ollie because, yet again a women he likes has deep dark secrets that will blow up in his face.  

Paul: There's always been something not quite right with Susan. All I want is for Thea to return and kick her ass. 
*  *  *
Did Felicity cross a line?

Steve: If we're referring to working with Helix, then I don't believe so. It never hurts to have friends or acquaintances in the right places. If that means keeping her sources to herself, then so be it.

Oliver has kept plenty of secrets, Felicity is entitled to her own. I do wonder though if this new found "partnership" may end up with Felicity biting off more than she can chew.

Jim: I'm guessing this question is about using the info from Helix to blackmail the Russian for his login credentials.

While it may have been over the line, it was awesome seeing her bad-ass side come out and play hardball. It shows that Ollie is not the only one who can make tough choices.  

Paul: She did. She should have let her team know from the get-go. The team has been vocal in the past about people keeping things quiet. 

Edited February 14, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Review: “Bratva”
Nora Dominick   Feb. 13, 2017
http://emertainmentmonthly.com/index.php/arrow-review-bratva/

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Arrow season five has been all over the place in terms of quality episodes. Some episodes have soared, while others fell flat. The second half of season five has already been light years ahead of the first half. We’re excited to see the show we love once again. Arrow’s latest episode entitled “Bratva” brings back Original Team Arrow, hints at Felicity’s (Emily Bett Rickards) darker storyline and we even lose a member of Team Arrow.

Two things Arrow lost in the first half of season five? It’s heart and its characters. A show that thrived on showing both the good and bad sides of characters seemingly became obsessed with keeping up with other superhero shows. Ever since the critical success of The Flash, Arrow has lost sight of why fans have stuck with it for five seasons. The introduction of metahumans and an ever expanding superhero world has caused this show to lose sight of itself.

In order to compete, flashier storylines have become more important than character growth. Fans love the show for Oliver’s (Stephen Amell) development from a lone vigilante to a team leader. With this episode, Arrow has started to return to the character driven show we love. In the end, you can give us all the explosion and stunts you want, but we love these stories for the characters.
*  *  *
Team Arrow takes a little road trip to Russia this week and it’s honestly the best thing. Our favorite part of this episode has to be Oliver, Felicity and Diggle (David Ramsey) back together. While Diggle’s prison storyline felt a little rushed, we’re happy to see him on the outside with Team Arrow. While the new members have begun to blend in nicely, we still long for the season one days where Oliver, Diggle and Felicity saved the day. Amell, Ramsey and Rickards continue to work beautifully together and this week’s episode is a happy reunion for them.

One of the best moments for them comes towards the end of the episode. After Felicity and Diggle both do questionable things to gain information, Oliver tells them they need to stop. He gives a speech about how he does bad things so they can remain good. A heartbreaking moment for the three of them, Amell gives it his all. Ramsey and Rickards remain formidable acting partners for Amell and this week reminded us why we missed them all together.
*  *  *
Rickards has already begun to show a different side to Felicity in just these last two episodes. She’s a powerhouse that has driven Arrow to new heights and it’s a sigh of relief for her to finally have her own storyline. For once, Felicity’s not only around to serve Oliver’s storyline. She’s running her own path and we are so happy Arrow is giving it to us. 

In general, DCTV has a female character problem. Female characters aren’t given their own storylines and simply serve the main male characters. With Felicity gaining a darker, serious storyline, she moves away from simply being Oliver’s girlfriend or sidekick. Rickards has built this character from the ground up and deserves to pave her own path. We will be following right behind her as this storyline continues to take shape.
*  *  *
In a heartbreaking decision, Rory decides to leave Team Arrow because he’s now a liability. We are heartbroken by Rory’s decision. Dinicol is one of our favorite new additions to Arrow this season and seeing him go is very upsetting. From the moment he stepped on screen, Dinicol clicked with the entire cast, especially with Rickards. Even this week, Rory and Felicity have a great moment where Rory tells Felicity to be careful when hacking.

Edited February 14, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Everyone's confused by the history of Black Canary on Arrow...

'Injustice 2' Characters: New Girls Trailer Reveals Catwoman, Cheetah [Video]
Patrick Frye  Feb. 14, 2017
http://www.inquisitr.com/3981231/injustice-2-characters-new-girls-trailer-reveals-catwoman-cheetah-video/

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This time, the Injustice 2 characters revealed in the trailer include Catwoman, Cheetah, Poison Ivy, and Black Canary, as revealed by Shack News. Cheetah and Poison Ivy appear to be the only metahumans on the female list, while Black Canary and Catwoman are more realistic takes on the archetype. It’s not yet known if Talia Al Ghul or any other characters from The CW‘s “Arrowverse” will be added besides Supergirl, but it was announced that the game would have the greatest number of playable DC Comics characters in the history of video gaming.
*  *  *
Black Canary is a vigilante who, according to The CW, started out as the sister of Green Arrow’s fiancee. Both have since become major characters, though Black Canary uses a sonic enhancer to turn her screams incredibly loud. You can probably expect a lot of melee from her, just like with Cheetah.

[bijoux]

El oh el.

[kismet]

So FS does have a secret sibling according to the CW based on that Inquistor article. I could believe DDrake is FS sister. Of course, then we might run into the sister swapping again.

[statsgirl]

13 hours ago, tv echo said:

Did Felicity cross a line?

Paul: She did. She should have let her team know from the get-go. The team has been vocal in the past about people keeping things quiet. 

 

I'm amused that it's not torture or killing (because Oliver & co. just did a ton of that last episode)  that crosses the line, it's keeping a secret.   However, it's fine that Oliver kept secret his Bratva mission to bomb and hurt the guy for Anatoly. Bad, Bad Felicity.

[Trisha]

Wow. Of all the sites that could call out the poor treatment of Felicity, I wouldn't have guessed it would be Hollywood Life: http://hollywoodlife.com/2017/02/15/arrow-gun-control-season-5-episode-13/

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Whether they notice we notice or not, Arrow has avoided Felicity, her experiences, her voice, her emotions, and her connection to Oliver nearly all season.

This kind of avoidance can be overlooked on a more superficial level, though incredibly frustrating when character and relationship continuity is concerned. But when it comes to an issue as big as this, avoiding Felicity is a glaring misstep. Not because I enjoy the character or because I think she’s due equal screen time. It’s because this character was brutally gunned down and paralyzed just last season.

Felicity might have her mobility back, but it doesn’t mean the emotional and mental scars still don’t linger. Now, when I saw Felicity avoiding the gun control issue, I initially thought they were going to address that because of the turmoil she went through, talking about it would be too much for her. But, no. Nothing was said of Felicity’s shooting. Not even Oliver, who listed the deaths of every friend and family member, even mentioned his ex-fiance nearly dying in his arms. Why? I wish I knew. Oliver used to be concerned about Felicity, whether they were romantically involved or not. Then again, the show used to care about her, too.

For Arrow to insinuate that Felicity doesn’t have an opinion on the matter is not only a mischaracterization, it’s just plain wrong. How can you have a gun control episode, tie in a new character’s backstory to it, and not have one of the main characters address her direct victimization? The answer is that you can’t. Because no matter what flowery language Oliver uses, or the way the episode was neatly tied together at the end by marrying the ideas of both for gun rights and for gun control, they glazed over the heart of the matter. If you’re going to tackle a real life issue on a fictional show, it has real life implications. Meaning, that the show did a disservice to those who have been subjected to gun violence, by silencing the character who went through that very experience.

They simply skipped over what an actual shooting victim’s thoughts, feelings, and sensibilities were post-attack. And while she wasn’t the one targeted in this episode, not one character even had the decency to ask her if she was okay. As if she wouldn’t be affected by her ex-fiance and friends suffering an almost identical fate to hers.

If Arrow wanted to take on gun control and mean it, they shouldn’t have conveniently forgotten they subjected their own beloved character to a grizzly fate at the hands of men armed with multiple machine guns.

And if Arrow wants us to care about the goings on of this season, they should no longer sideline a character that is central not only to the success of show, but to the heart and soul of the main character.

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ recap: 'Spectre of the Gun’
SARA NETZLEY FEBRUARY 15, 2017 
http://ew.com/recap/arrow-season-5-episode-13/

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The Green Arrow comics have a long history of depicting Oliver Queen as liberal. Incredibly liberal. Like, to a Marxist/Communist degree. Heck, kids in the ‘70s and ‘80s learned about apartheid, ecology, and feminism from the comics. This history, combined with our current national climate of anger and unrest, means it’s not a total surprise that the minds behind Arrow would take on a deeply divisive subject like gun control.

How did the show do? Like the issue itself, I suspect that answer is personal and varies from viewer to viewer.
*  *  *
Once Edlund’s in custody, Oliver returns to Pollard with a proposed citywide gun control ordinance that he and Rene worked out. He says it doesn’t make it harder for people in Star City to buy or own or carry a gun, or to protect themselves. Soooo what does it… do, exactly? Pollard sniffs that she’ll extract a political price for this someday, but she can live with the proposal. “Good. ‘Cause living is the whole point,” Oliver says.
*  *  *
That night on the City Hall steps, Oliver leads a vigil for the shooting victims, and he gives a right pretty speech about not being desensitized and answering violence with violence. “Hard choices require bravery,” he says. “And we don’t run from hard choices.” He says they’ll rise up and make those decisions together, starting with the Star City Firearms Freedom Act, which respects both freedom and lives.

OKAY, BUT WHAT ARE THE DETAILS OF THIS POLICY, OLIVER? A CONFUSED NATION WOULD LIKE TO KNOW MORE ABOUT YOUR GRAND COMPROMISE! ALSO, YOU’RE A CITY, AND WHEN YOU CREATE ORDINANCES LIKE THIS, IT CREATES A PATCHED-TOGETHER NETWORK OF POLICIES THAT AT TIMES CONTRAVENES STATE AND FEDERAL LAW TO THE DETRIMENT OF EVERYONE’S SAFETY, BUT OKAY, YOUR HEART’S IN THE RIGHT PLACE, I GUESS.

“Spectre of the Gun” was an ambitious episode, and it’s always interesting to see larger-than-life shows take on real-world problems. Was this topic handled perfectly? No. The debate was fairly shallow, the compromises were vague, and I’m not sure it exposed any new solutions or areas of agreement. It pointed out what a frustrating political climate we’re in right now without tackling larger issues like the influence of lobbyists or money or technological advances in firearms safety. But it tried. It started a conversation, and that’s something.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

You know an episode's pretty bad, when even the A.V. Club reviewer criticizes it (and this guy's been giving a tongue bath to just about every episode this season)...

Arrow gets political in the wake of a mass shooting
By Alasdair Wilkins  Feb 16, 2017  1:30 AM
http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/arrow-gets-political-wake-mass-shooting-250436

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And, seemingly out of nowhere, Arrow gets political. Oliver has been in the mayor’s office for nearly a year, yet “Spectre Of The Gun” is the first episode to use that position to place Team Arrow right in the middle of a hot-button debate. In doing so, the show at last embraces the biggest missing piece of Green Arrow’s comic book legacy, at least the one that doesn’t require Stephen Amell to grow a goatee he’s reportedly sworn off ever getting. Portrayals always vary, but the canonical Oliver Queen of the comics is an outspoken lefty agitator of the first order, and for the show to present this Mayor Queen as an essentially apolitical, well-meaning public servant is to miss the whole point of why the Green Arrow bothered to become mayor of Star City in the first place. Tonight’s episode addresses that previous elision, with series creator Marc Guggenheim penning a story about a mass shooting and the gun violence debate.

Let’s not kid ourselves here: Tonight’s episode is ham-fisted and unsubtle and generally basic in its arguments. It sets up obvious sides to the issue, with Curtis and Lance arguing for fewer guns while Rene and Dinah make the case for their efficacy, all while Felicity tries to shut out the debate and Oliver navigates the middle. Indeed, this isn’t the episode where Oliver reveals he’s been listening to A People’s History Of The United States on audiobook or working through some Marxist explainer playlists on YouTube—I’m not sure any of us can fathom just how milquetoast that final set of compromise ordinances he and the councilwoman put forward are. Oliver is implicitly positioned as the Democrat in his office debate, what with him apparently being for free speech and abortion rights but against gun rights, but that’s about it for anyone hoping for Oliver the lefty firebrand to show up.
*  *  *
... But I’ll say this: If every Arrow episode from now on were as political as tonight’s and of roughly the same quality, then damn, that sounds terrible. But if this is just a first effort, a fumbling initial attempt to figure out how a generally apolitical show like Arrow can engage with real-world issues, and that the show is going to get more sophisticated in its argumentation from here, then that’s something worth encouraging. Honestly, I suspect this is mostly just an aberration, but if this stands as the one great, explicit justification for going to the trouble of making Oliver mayor on the show, then I’d say the episode has done its job.
*  *  *
I know I’ve said this before, but it’s staggering how dumb Oliver is being about Susan Williams. Thea is generally right about most things, but she’s super mega ultra right about this one.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[bethy]

Quote

It started a conversation, and that’s something.

This is such a non-thing I don't even know what to say about it. MG said the same thing in one of his interviews, I think. This episode did not "start" a conversation about gun control. The conversation has been going on for years. And it's such a self-righteous, condescending attitude, in my opinion. "You poor peons hadn't even thought to talk about this! But I will serve you some vegetables by writing about this issue because you are children and would othewise not thought to have even considered the points I will show you through the mouths of my vigilante, people-killing (but with arrows!) characters."

Bleh. 

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Recap: An Afterschool Special Gone Wrong
Robert Chan   February 16, 2017
https://www.yahoo.com/tv/arrow-recap-an-afterschool-special-gone-wrong-120642696.html

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Less than a month after the terrorist attack of 9/11, The West Wing put out an episode called “Isaac and Ishmael” that was, for all intents and purposes, a stage play where a lot of the nation’s unprocessed feelings about the attack were put into Aaron Sorkin’s trademark rapid-fire prose. It’s preachy, but a noble effort to use entertainment to address real world issues.

“Spectre of the Gun” is a similar effort, but for the topic gun control. Oliver and company argue for and against gun rights in a way that feels a little like an after school special, a little like your Facebook page, and very little like an episode of Arrow.
*  *  *
Hooray, We Solved the Gun Debate
A lot of time is given over to everybody’s stance on the role of guns in society today. Curtis and Quentin are pro-gun control; Rene and Dinah think everybody has the right to protect themselves. Both sides get little monologues explaining why guns are good or bad. The problem is that the show’s writers don’t have a solution and wrap up the episode by having Oliver and Rene come up with gun control legislation that — they say — is a sensible compromise that both sides are happy with and don’t explain what that compromise is.

On that level, the show fails. One valuable point the show does make is that we used to be able to talk about these sorts of divisive issues and still be friends afterwards. There was such a thing as healthy debate where two people could argue an issue and not cling so doggedly to their convictions that friendships were ended. Though it doesn’t do much to make for an exciting or engaging episode of Arrow, it’s a damn good point and maybe we’ll get back to a place — as a nation — where politics can be dinner conversation and not bloodsport.
*  *  *
The vague explanations of Thea’s absence, says showrunner Marc Guggenheim, are the result of Willa Holland only being under contract for half of this season’s episodes. Bad news for Ollie, who could really use a sisterly smack on the head every time he thinks dating Susan Williams is a good idea.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

ARROW: "SPECTRE OF THE GUN" REVIEW
Jesse Scheeden   Feb. 15, 2017
http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/02/16/arrow-spectre-of-the-gun-review

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It does seem like the show missed a major opportunity as far as Ollie is concerned, however. In most other incarnations, Ollie is or eventually becomes a devout, hardcore liberal who isn’t afraid to make his political beliefs known to one and all. It’s one of his more unique character traits, and it’s something that I often find myself missing in this series. I would have liked to see Ollie finally take a hardcore, left-leaning stance on something and have those around him try to rein him in. At some point you have to wonder why the writers even bothered making Ollie the mayor if they’re not going to draw from the character’s more politically charged adventures.
*  *  *
But Gonzalez’s performance in these scenes didn’t really help, either. It felt like he was trying to draw a firm distinction between past and present like Amell does most weeks, but it didn’t work. He felt strangely stiff and unnatural in the flashbacks, lacking his usual charisma. I assume it’s only a matter of time until the show flashes back to Rene’s ill-fated military days, so hopefully it works out better the second time around.

Diggle and Dinha featured in a small but charming little subplot as Diggle helped her acclimate to living a semi-normal life again. This helped build up a stronger bond between Ollie’s oldest partner and his newest one. Hopefully not too close a bond, though. I’m sure I’m not the only one who detected a bit of sexual tension in the room there. Hopefully that’s unintended, though, as I can’t think of many worse plot twists than having Diggle cheat on his wife with the new Black Canary.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Review: A Very Special ‘Arrow’ Tackles ‘Spectre of the Gun’ Control
Kevin Fitzpatrick | Feb. 15, 2017
http://screencrush.com/arrow-spectre-of-the-gun-review/

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As you can probably imagine, “Spectre of the Gun” does tend to walk the line between legitimate commentary and “a very special episode,” even if it’s admittedly something of a strange topic for a darkly violent show like Arrow to weigh in on in the first place. All sides are well-represented, between the hardened Rene feeling from personal experience that guns ultimately save lives, Curtis’ idealism and race informing his desire for transparency, and Felicity feeling like the discourse has become so contentious in America, that there’s little point in repeating the debate.

What trips me up a bit, is that Arrow very much has its own problems drawing lines of morality around killing or guns, and while some of that garnered lip service, “Spectre” didn’t really land anywhere on the criminality of their own vigilante pursuit. It’s a strange sight, to have one scene arguing the nuance of constitutional rights, and immediately follow that with a helmeted vigilante assaulting someone in an alley, absent due process. If anything, the focus on gun control* offered the clearest showcase for Stephen Amell, both as a beleaguered politician, and someone who could take down the bad guy with an appeal to their shared interest in a better future, rather than a hood and a bow.

*If you’re wondering about the specifics of a “Firearm Freedom Act” that would appease both sides, you’re not alone. As producer Marc Guggenhiem apparently puts it, the details were left intentionally vague. “We wanted to leave that open to the audience as almost like a Rorschach test.”
*  *  *
Understandably, the focus on gun control left a lot of other stories dancing around the edges; likely the most under-served of which was Diggle helping Dinah re-acclimate to the trappings of real life. I couldn’t help noticing some of the chemistry between Juliana Harkavy and David Ramsey either; handwaved away easily enough, I’m sure, but it could offer an intriguing wrinkle to Lyla’s absence. The hour also gave us a brief chance to check in with Vigilante (seeming more juxtaposed with Adrian Chase than ever), and even Thea got to come back form her offstage exile!
*  *  *
Still very down for Rene/Thea shipping, whenever that finally gets off the ground.
*  *  *
I don’t even have kids, but if you came home with your daughter and saw signs of a struggle in the house, YOU TELL HER TO WAIT OUTSIDE, OR GO TO A NEIGHBOR.

Also, if an intruder in your home already has a gun to your wife’s head, I have to imagine surprising him with a gun of your own isn’t the greatest plan.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Recap: “Spectre of the Gun” – A Missed Opportunity to Take a Stand
BY ALLISON KEENE      11 HOURS AGO
http://collider.com/arrow-recap-spectre-of-the-gun/

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Similarly, gun violence is an issue that rises and falls in our public consciousness after tragedy upon tragedy occurs, but it’s something that is woven into the very fabric of a show like Arrow. The Green Arrow uses a bow instead of a gun, but he’s surrounded by guns and gunmen, and is himself a killer. As Vigilante taunts, “the only difference between you and I is I use a more efficient weapon.” As such, gun violence is something that deserves to be more than a “very special episode” of Arrow — it’s something the show should always be addressing.

Instead, we got “Spectre of the Gun,” which wasn’t bold enough to really take a stand either way on the issue. A mass shooting at City Hall killed seven people, but none were characters we know. It’s not that that has to be the case or that Arrow hasn’t had characters killed by guns in the past (or like Felicity, maimed for a time), but it allowed “Spectre of the Gun” to remove itself personally from the debate. Instead, Curtis and Renee lobbed facts at each other (though no hard numbers) about the pros and cons of things like a gun registry, which was the crux of the gunman’s desire to shoot up City Hall. But Renee’s argument that if he had had his gun things would be different with his wife’s death was flawed — he was able to get his gun, but it ultimately didn’t save her.

“Spectre of the Gun” wanted us to see the juxtaposition of a guy like James Edlund losing his family and becoming a killer of innocents in his rage versus Renee, who also lost his family but instead became a vigilante force for good. But that also reinforces Renee’s pro-gun argument. The show is trying to have it both ways. While Oliver says to Thea that gun reform is “not about politics, but about safety and security,” it feels hollow when the ordinance he drafts with Renee’s help doesn’t prohibit anyone from buying, owning, or carrying a gun, to make sure everyone can still protect themselves. So what exactly does it do? What are we meant to learn from this?
*  *  *
“Spectre of the Gun” came with a warning before the episode that it would be rated TV14 for violence, and yet, this hour didn’t feel any more violent than a regular episode. It mostly felt like a missed opportunity to take a stand one way or another on a very complicated issue, and let that play out over the rest of the season. If Season 5’s desire is to focus on legacy and have Oliver confront the sins of his past, why not incorporate this into it as well? That would be revolutionary.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow 2.13 Review – ‘Spectre of the Gun’
February 15, 2017 | Posted by Katie Hallahan
http://411mania.com/movies/arrow-2-13-review-spectre-of-the-gun/

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This was not Arrow‘s best work, and it’s not for lack of potentially interesting things to say on the issue here. Superhero shows often jump through hoops to avoid having their heroes use guns, and Arrow is no exception. While Oliver has used them on occasion, it’s obviously not his weapon of choice and never has been, even in the days when he was guiltlessly killing people for failing his city. Add to that the fact that this show centers on a vigilante, who has been a serial killer but now makes almost every effort to not kill people, and who has recently added to his team a man with anger issues who uses guns almost exclusively, and there is plenty to work with here. As well, the writing on this show also has the potential to tackle the topic of gun violence/gun control adeptly, and the topic is a hot one in our world today to be sure. So, in theory, there’s fertile ground for a good episode here.
*  *  *
Instead, we got a rather poor episode with a lot of clunky, ham-fisted, hit-you-over-the-head preachy writing that not only offers nothing new to say on the topic, but also neatly evades offering any innovative solutions. So many things get in the way of this being a good episode that I almost have to wonder if they were asked specifically to write the episode on this topic and in this way. The entire plot is divorced from the continuity of the main season-long arc and from the show’s past. There are plenty of past tragedies and mass violent events that could have been worked into this, but instead they make up a mall shooting that we’ve never heard of before as the spurring event for the man behind the shootings here, Edlund. They give that man a rather weak motivation about getting revenge on the city for failing-slash-forcing them to enact the gun registry bill by creating more of a problem, which is not just nonsensical, it’s not realistic. There are so many reasons from real life situations like this that could’ve been used, but instead they went with this one?
*  *  *
This "very special episode" tries to tackle the hot-button issue of gun violence/control but even the actors being committed to selling it can't save the clunky, preachy writing from hitting the viewer over the head. The blunt presentation that this is a contentious issue we should all care about where there's a lot to say on both sides is given no subtlety or nuance, and has nothing to new to say about it. Arrow ignores having four seasons' worth of backstory it could tap to tie this issue to the overarching plot of the show, making it obvious that this is a filler episode. Worst of all, they try to wrap it up in a nice bow by claiming to have a perfect middle-ground solution, but never offer any details or insight into what this may be. And the bad guy of the week has poorly-designed motivations to boot. Rene's much more genuine backstory saves this from being a total clunker, but only barely.

[tv echo]

Arrow Season 5 Episode 13 Review: “Spectre of the Gun”
Chris King+  February 15, 2017
http://www.tvovermind.com/the-cw/arrow/arrow-season-5-episode-13-review-spectre-of-the-gun

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I really admire this week’s Arrow. “Spectre of the Gun” is unlike any other episode we’ve seen from the show this season, as it tackles the very topical and highly debated issue of gun control, and it does so in a respectful way, allowing both sides of the debate to share their views and arguments for why the buying and selling of firearms should be more or less restricted. However, while Arrow executive producer Marc Guggenheim does an admirable and respectful job of showcasing the current political climate and the conflicting viewpoints on gun control, he does an incredibly poor job of making an entertaining episode of television.

“Spectre of the Gun” is certainly well-intentioned, but it lacks any form of subtlety while dealing with this important issue, leading to a heavy-handed hour that pauses the action and excitement of Team Arrow’s fight against Prometheus in favor of big speeches and constant debates. For most of its running time, “Spectre of the Gun” feels like the worst version of a Glee “very special episode”; it forces the show’s characters to become mouthpieces for different political parties, using nearly every bit of screen time they have to preach about what America should be like or to throw out statistics to back up the arguments that they are making. The two worst offenders of this are Curtis and Quentin, who serve no other purpose in this episode than to clash against Rene’s pro-gun views and to instruct Oliver on how he should take on this issue as mayor after James Edland, whose family was killed in a mass shooting at a mall, attacks City Hall and plans to open fire again at Star City General.
*  *  *
Despite how admirable the intentions of “Spectre of the Gun” are, there’s no denying that it’s easily the weakest Arrow Season 5 episode yet. Everything connected to the main storyline falls flat, especially the dialogue, and the strong side stories involving Rene and his family and Diggle and Dinah aren’t enough to salvage the heavy-handed nature of the episode as a whole. Hopefully, next week’s Arrow returns the show’s focus to the characters and their journeys, because that’s when this show is at its best, not when it’s trying to tackle major issues but when it tells entertaining and emotional personal stories about Oliver Queen and the rest of Team Arrow.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

Glad to see the reviewers seem to match the board reactions

[tv echo]

"Spectre of the Gun" – Arrow S0513 Review
By Gislef   Feb. 16, 2017
http://www.tv.com/shows/arrow/community/post/spectre-of-the-gun-arrow-s0513-review-1487231257/

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So this is the one where an alien race traps the team in a mental landscape and... oh wait, they did that. This is the one where they discover that Squidward's evil twin has turned all the buildings in Star City into false fronts with almost nothing behind them except bare-bone furniture and… oh wait, somebody did that, too.
*  *  *
"Spectre of the Gun" is basically a message episode. The message is that more gun control is better than less gun control. It presents Rene as the primary "natural spokesman" in favor of mostly unregulated guns and limited gun control. Him and a never-seen-before councilwoman. While Curtis and Quentin as the primary "natural spokesmen" for increased gun control. The rest of the team gets in a few words edgewise--Dinah says that she basically agrees with Rene--but that's about it.
*  *  *
Oddly, in the comics, Zoe Lawton is the daughter of Floyd Lawton, aka Deadshot. And has issues with her daddy being a guy who shoots guns and isn't very nice. I'm not sure if the selection of first name was intentional or not.
*  *  *
The elephant in the room is the gun control issue. I'm not an adherent to one side or the other, so the politics don't bother me one way or another. I think the writers cheated in one regard, and erred in another.

The cheat is that they have Oliver and Rene hammer out a solution that manages to address the concerns of more and less gun-control advocates alike. But… we're never told what it is. If there were some kind of "make everyone happy" solution, it'd sure be nice to know what it is. The creative team claimed in interviews that they had a solution ("There's a way to have the second amendment and still have some reasonable limitations on gun ownership."). But then they said that they didn't want to present it because it would seem like they were taking sides. If it's fair and balanced to both sides... why would it seem like they're taking sides?
*  *  *
I'd say the issue has arisen and still remains a bone of contention because finding a solution that manages to address the concerns of both sides doesn't exist, and there are so many omissions on both sides (to say the least) that no one-size-fits-all answer is possible. So if the creative team has a solution like they claim... it seems kind of odd not to present it.

The error is their claim (and putting the claim in Curtis' mouth: "There's nothing wrong with a little healthy debate.") that people refusing to debate issues is some kind of thing because people are afraid of being rude. With all the cable news and debate shows and Internet forums, lack of debate isn't really a thing these days. It's also an oddly contradictory statement because then the creative team doesn't put their own solution up for debate. So they don’t seem to think it's very healthy, either.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Review: Spectre of the Gun (Season 5 Episode 13)
February 16, 2017Lissete Lanuza Sáenz
http://telltaletv.com/2017/02/arrow-review-spectre-of-the-gun-season-5-episode-13/

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Arrow Season 5 Episode 13 “Spectre of the Gun” chokes on its intentions, and like everything this show does, it does so in spectacular fashion.
*  *  *
Am I the only one who sees the hypocrisy of a show that glorifies violence, one that stars a hero who doesn’t really seem to have any compunctions about killing anymore – and who doesn’t seem that broken up about it, EVEN after he killed an innocent man by mistake – to tackle the subject of gun violence?

Am I the only one who finds Oliver’s It’s not your call to make to the shooter the height of double standards? He doesn’t get to make the choice Oliver makes every day, but we’re supposed to be fine with that because Oliver is the Green Arrow?

While we’re at it, am I the only one who thinks Felicity’s non-opinion on the subject is about as much of a stretch as anything this show has ever done? Do you remember what happened to her last season, Arrow?

You know, when she was SHOT and almost ended up paralyzed forever. That thing.

I kind of figured someone who’d gone through that – someone who’s seen all Felicity has seen – would have an opinion one way or another.
*  *  *
That’s not even the worst part of this episode, though, the worst part of this episode is that it’s about as boring as Arrow has ever been. If the show is going to give backstory to a secondary character, it needs to be someone we actively want to see more of.

Aka not Rene Ramirez.
*  *  *
We want the show to go back to what worked, to what we fell in love with – OTA, Olicity and Delicity.

And, we’d also like Arrow to stay away from tackling subjects as gun control if it’s not prepared to point out the hypocrisy of a show like this tackling such a subject, if it’s not ready to give an actual victim of gun violence a voice and if it’s just going to come up with a magical solution that everyone agrees with in a few hours.

Tackling big, important subjects is fine; it’s more than fine, it’s necessary. Treating them like something that can be solved in one episode is not.
*  *  *
There are plot holes, and then there’s Lance having absolutely NO reaction to Dinah Drake having the SAME NAME as his ex-wife.
*  *  *
Is Susan Williams only around when it suits her secondary investigation? Is she actually a reporter?
*  *  *
Oliver, of ALL the people you’ve lost, only one has died because of a gun, and it was a suicide. Just in case you needed a reminder.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[Starfish35]

From the Hollywood Life article above:

Quote

to a grizzly fate

LOLOLOLOL.

Sorry.  It was a good article otherwise.  :)

[Bort]

36 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

From the Hollywood Life article above:

Quote

to a grizzly fate

LOLOLOLOL.

Sorry.  It was a good article otherwise.  :)

I would have been all over this episode if there had been a bear in it!

But yeah, wow.

[tv echo]

It's Oliver vs. gun violence in a Very Special Episode of Arrow
Trent Moore  Feb. 16, 2017
http://www.blastr.com/2017-2-16/its-oliver-vs-gun-violence-very-special-episode-arrow

Quote

The episode never goes overboard on one side of the issue or the other, though it's likely a call for any basic safety regulations and compromise will be seen as biased. But, for a superhero show, it made for a surprisingly nuanced take on a deeply divisive and complicated issue. Not bad at all.
*  *  *
The episode ends with Oliver introducing a mythical new gun ordinance that seems to appease the gun advocates and control advocates — and if Star City really has this magical unicorn of legislation, they should share it with the real world, because it's proven quite elusive. Curtis makes a call for civil debate while Oliver approaches the issue and makes it clear he sees it as a safety issue, not a political one. This is all great, logical and makes a whole lot of sense.

But for anyone who follows the news, it's also bordering on fantasy. America has had mass shooting after mass shooting, and none have been able to galvanize political leaders to make any real changes. Seeing it happen in this story gives us something to aspire to, no matter how far away it might seem. With all its dysfunction, it seems Star City is run more efficiently than pretty much all of the United States. Anyone else thinking Oliver Queen for president in 2020?
*  *  *
So, Felicity is still using her super-shady thumb drive. We still don't know where that story is going, but hang tight, because you know it's going somewhere. Well, probably. This episode also brought us some nice growth for the new Canary as we see Dinah bonding with Diggle and trying to figure out how to find some semblance of normal now that her vendetta mission is over. Teaming pretty much anyone up with Diggle makes them more likable, so it was a good episode for Dinah — even if she does still reek a bit of fan service.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Someone actually likes Rene the best of all the new recruits...

'Arrow' Recap: Oliver Steps Up as Mayor to Deal with Gun Control 
Derek Stauffer  Feb. 15, 2017
http://www.buddytv.com/articles/arrow/arrow-recap-oliver-steps-up-as-63295.aspx

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Given how much violence there is on Arrow, it should be hard for the show to adequately approach the topic of gun control with some grace. Surprisingly though, Arrow pulls of the debate quite effortlessly. The arguments that break out about gun control among the characters following the attack aren't exactly subtle. Every character says exactly what they mean in the boldest terms at every opportunity. Rene is stubbornly for gun ownership, Curtis is stubbornly for high restrictions on guns and Felicity just thinks that arguing about any issue does nothing but make everyone mad. Everyone gets a chance to say something though.
*  *  *
The shooter in question is probably the weakest part of "Spectre of the Gun." He should be an interesting multi-layered antagonist. He turned to gun violence after his family died in a public shooting and the city government (before Oliver) refuses to sign into law a gun registry. Really though, the shooter is just the traditional superhero villain that Arrow needs to exist. 
*  *  *
Rene has been the real stand-out of the new recruits in season 5, despite the show giving us almost nothing on his past. This finally changes as we learn in the flashbacks that Rene was married to a woman name Laura and they had a child, Zoe, before season 5 began. Rene and his wife lived in the Glades before moving out and trying to start over. Laura wasn't as committed to a new life and she continued to take drugs. It is because of her drug habit that Laura was killed in a struggle with her drug dealer. As a result, Zoe is now in foster care. 

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow 5×13 Review: ‘Spectre of the Gun’
Alyssa Barbieri   Feb. 16, 2017
http://fangirlish.com/arrow-5x13-review-spectre-gun/

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Throughout its five-year story, Arrow has glorified violence as it has made it a significant part of its hero and his story. Not only has our hero experienced this violence – gun violence included – but he’s also dealt it. There have been multiple killings with a multitude of weapons, including guns, where this issue was never brought to light. Until now. Until the writers wanted to make a stand; to get attention it seemed like.

Everything from the warning before the episode to the central focus were indicators. This felt like it was made to get attention. You can’t glorify violence and then decide that you want to preach gun violence awareness because you want the attention.

Here’s the thing, gun violence absolutely deserves attention. In fact, it demands it. But you need to be mindful of the platform from which you’re preaching. A show where, for five years, there has been copious amounts of violence – including gun violence – and where there was hardly ever a moment of reflection or consequence makes the message that Arrow is preaching fall a tad short. You come off as hypocritical.
*  *  *
The fact that Felicity was silenced during an hour where she should’ve been one of the commanding voices was downright infuriating. It once again illustrates how Arrow is so pent up on its new cast of characters that it fails to recognize its veteran players (not named Oliver Queen.) It’s moments like this where I’m reminded of how the Arrow writers are losing grip on their preexisting characters as this show grows into something else. Something not as good.

You cannot tell me that Felicity doesn’t have an opinion about gun violence. She’s lived it. And that trauma isn’t something that just fades away. It sticks with you. We got to see how it stuck with Rene, so why weren’t we allowed to see that with Felicity? Oh, that’s right, because she’s not one of the newbies and therefore deemed insignificant in the broader scope of things.
*  *  *
1, Why was Felicity not allowed to have an opinion? Is it because she’s a woman? Is it because the show doesn’t care? Because if someone on Team Arrow should’ve had a strong opinion about gun violence it’s Felicity. And yet she was made out to not give a damn. And we know damn right that’s not Felicity.
*  *  *
5. Thea’s disgust for Susan Williams is my new aesthetic. While Thea might be vomiting a little in her mouth at the mere mention of Oliver and Susan, we’re vomiting buckets as we have to watch it unfold. The countdown continues for the end of Susan Williams.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

MISFIRE: ARROW 5X13 REVIEW (SPECTRE OF THE GUN) 
jbuffyangel   Feb. 16, 2017
http://jbuffyangel.tumblr.com/post/157309757488/misfire-arrow-5x13-review-spectre-of-the-gun

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When the entire episode is built towards finding a political solution and then you fail to offer that political solution, that is an EPIC fail. 
*  *  *
Perhaps, Arrow’s intent is to simply spark the debate. This ties in closely with Curtis’ lecture to Felicity about the necessity of healthy debate. I agree with Curtis. Healthy debate is a necessity and is the life blood of a democratic society. However, I don’t agree that we’ve stopped talking to one another. I don’t think Arrow needed to jump start this debate again. This debate has been waging for decades now. Talking isn’t the problem. The problem is… we’ve stopped LISTENING to one another.
*  *  *
I didn’t see a lot of listening on Curtis’ part in that “debate” with Felicity. Rather, it is Felicity being lectured to. I don’t necessarily think Felicity is the right character to represent the “talking about politics is impolite” group. A strong stance about gun control would have made a little more sense to me coming from Felicity, the person who uses weapons the least on Arrow, rather than Oliver.

However, Felicity can, on occasion, shut down and retreat. So, I didn’t find it wildly out of character, but it is frustrating. Instead of being talked to, it feels like she was being talked at. Once again, it feels like Felicity is being silenced to prop other characters. The reason why many get particularly upset about Felicity is because she is the female lead of Arrow. We heard from Dinah, who has all of two episodes under her belt. We heard from random councilwoman. Yet, we didn’t get a clear view on Felicity’s perspective. She is the front and center female character on Arrow. Her silence feels a little illogical. In an episode that’s all about characters’ viewpoints, we’d like to hear from the primary leads.
*  *  *
Diggle is also conspicuously silent too. He is too busy finding Dinah an apartment with a garden. Well, that is a crisis. Best get on that. 

I found this shocking as well. Most military people I know have strong opinions about guns. Does leaving two of three members of Original Team Arrow out of the discussion feel odd to anyone else? It felt odd to me. Perhaps this is a protective technique? They don’t want to embroil some of their fan favorite characters in such a sensitive issue and risk alienating audience members? So they offer secondary characters like Curtis and Rene as sacrificial lambs? Perhaps. No real way of knowing.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow 5x13 Review: “Spectre of the Gun” (A Very Special Episode™)
Just About Write   Feb. 16, 2017
http://www.itsjustaboutwrite.com/2017/02/arrow-5x13-review-spectre-of-gun-very.html

Quote

“Spectre of the Gun” was Arrow’s way of pretending it could tackle a political current event while adding something to the conversation. It, of course, did not add anything. In fact, I would argue that this episode actually undermined all the good work that a show COULD do in tackling the complexities of gun control. Because my soul was filled with waters of rage by the end of the episode (and, let’s be honest, just some downright confusion about why the show felt the need to even talk about this subject at all), let’s dive right into those waves.
*  *  *
And I’ll tell you why I felt nothing: because violence is nothing new for this show. In a series where bodies drop with such relative frequency that I barely even blink anymore, an episode about a masked man shooting City Hall who isn’t some Big Bad or Prometheus isn’t really impactful. I’ve watched for five years as heroes and villains alike have maimed, killed, or tortured others. What made this episode different? Nothing. Though Marc Guggenheim did a really blatant and heavy-handed job of trying to tell us WHY this week was different: our perpetrator was a normal person. He was a nobody.
*  *  *
Returning to my three-point checklist above, Arrow is not the show to address the subject of gun control or violence. As I noted, this is a show in which violence has been prevalent since the very beginning. CHARACTERS HAVE WIELDED GUNS SINCE THE BEGINNING. Yet suddenly we’re expected to believe this is the first time in five or more years that anyone has ever thought about or talked about gun control? Additionally, the dialogue surrounding the subject was so stilted and ripped-from-the-headlines that it was eyeroll-inducing. Yes, people do have deep and complex conversations about this subject in real life. But what would ever lead me to believe that Curtis and Rene would have a conversation about it? Has there been any prior evidence that they would? Maybe on Rene’s part, but not on Curtis’.
*  *  *
Arrow just wanted to be a part of a conversation it didn’t need to have. A show that’s all about violence can have a viewer discretion warning, but I’ll be honest: it wasn’t necessary. I’ve literally watched Slade Wilson drive a sword through someone’s chest. I saw Oliver shoot people in the eye with arrows. I’ve watched Sara Lance fall off a dang roof. This was nothing new. And it wasn’t worse than anything I’ve already seen on the show.
*  *  *
One more thing: the worst character on the show to present an argument or stance about this subject is Oliver Queen. As I like to say, he’s pretty but he’s also pretty dense. I, personally, do not even feel remotely qualified to have a debate or good conversation about this subject. The fact is, I’m just not educated on this topic and I would never want to inject myself into a conversation where I’m not qualified to talk about the subject matter. But that’s exactly what Oliver Queen does. Suddenly, he’s spouting off opinions and facts and having educated debates when this is the guy so dense that he’s simply called Mayor Handsome in headlines?

(Sorry, Oliver Queen stans. Sometimes I love the guy but he’s not the right person to be in charge of this topic. You know who would be? A POLICE OFFICER LIKE QUENTIN LANCE. OR A GUN-OWNING SOLDIER LIKE JOHN DIGGLE. PEOPLE WHO HAVE OPINIONS AND EXPERIENCE.)
*  *  *
I think if Arrow would have left the conversation open-ended (which it tried to do, but it still literally said it provided a solution without giving the viewers any DETAILS as to what the solution looks like), the episode might have been a little bit better. But it didn’t, so it wasn’t.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Review: Team Arrow Wades into Real Life Gun Control Debate
BY CRAIG WACK · FEBRUARY 16, 2017
http://oohlo.com/2017/02/16/arrow-review-team-arrow-wades-into-real-life-gun-control-debate/

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Arrow deserves credit for trying to have an even handed discussion about the plague of gun violence in America. However, the series’ own casual relationship with gun violence (remember, Diggle and Rene carry guns on missions, and Vigilante is a walking arsenal, Punisher type) sometimes made the points raised ring hollow.
*  *   *
This isn’t the first time Star City has experienced mass shootings. They are the No. 1 killer of Star City mayors and hell, even Felicity was paralyzed in one such attack. It felt like a point of tone deafness on the show’s part that a mass shooting by masked goons under orders of a Slade Wilson or Damien Darhk, is treated as somehow less tragic than a random citizen, upset at the city’s inability to pass gun control measures lashing out in violent fashion.
*  *  *
Although this wasn’t a typical episode of Arrow, credit has to be given for using the episode to hold a mirror to one of the many difficult issues that are dividing the nation. While the execution was often inelegant, the ultimate message of open-mindedness and political compromise made the time well spent.

[kismet]

6 hours ago, tv echo said:

‘Arrow’ Recap: An Afterschool Special Gone Wrong
Robert Chan   February 16, 2017
https://www.yahoo.com/tv/arrow-recap-an-afterschool-special-gone-wrong-120642696.html

That episode of WW "Isaac & Ishmael" was a poignant 1 hr play. They even announced it as such at the beginning. They had the entire show be a separate entity from the actual show with no specific point on the timeline. It was also after a major terrorist attack, that even Hollywood struggled with how to ease back into storytelling and how to handle the topic. Having just recently watched it again, I would say the episode could still air tonight and be relevant and educational. Yes, it was preachy but it also was substantial.

Arrow's afterschool special didn't even come close to it. It was random bullet points with no coherent message or resolution. I've seen other shows handle gun violence and gun control far better than Arrow. It wasn't it's preachiness that got me, it was it's self-indulgent self-exultation that they were going to add to the conversation when it was unclear if they had ever even been versed in the conversation in the first place.

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Again Proved It’s Tough To Mix Superheroes And Real Problems
Dan Seitz   Feb. 16, 2017
http://uproxx.com/hitfix/arrow-gun-control-episode/

Quote

Superhero stories tend to be power fantasies. The whole appeal of Superman or Batman is he knows what’s right and just and can just do it without our petty human concerns. But that makes them hard to mix with real social issues, and last night’s episode of Arrow, “Spectre Of The Gun,” just illustrates how tough that is.
*  *  *
Part of the problem is that Wild Dog and Diggle (David Ramsey), two of Ollie’s fellow vigilantes, shoot a lot of people every single episode, which doesn’t seem to bother Ollie. And they’re nothing next to Ollie, a former assassin and secret agent who is likely in the triple digits for homicide himself and who is currently having a subplot set in his past where he’s trying to kill a Russian gangster. That they’ve all suddenly got an opinion about gun violence feels a bit hypocritical considering what we see them do week in and week out.

Another factor is that the show simply isn’t prepared to deal with the sheer complexity of gun violence and gun control. For example, a key predictor of a terrorist committing a mass shooting in America is domestic violence....
*  *  *
It’s hard to fault Arrow‘s production team for wanting to be more than just a show about rich ninjas. While the show has an ongoing theme of Ollie struggling with whether or not his means are justified by his ends, it’s particularly poignant this episode as Ollie wonders if he’s inspiring hope or just copycat crimes. The issue is simply that the show is so apart from our own reality it really can’t grapple with the issues we face. Starling City has been invaded by superpowered mercenaries, nearly destroyed by an earthquake machine, and last season was nearly wiped out by a nuclear weapon. It’s a train ride away from a city that regularly sees a man who can run faster than a fighter jet who next week is visiting an alternate reality full of talking gorillas. A terrorist with an assault rifle isn’t a shocking event in this city; it’s a Tuesday.

Edited February 16, 2017 by tv echo

[LeighAn]

So there's two reviews of about 10 that liked the episode while the rest thought it was a major garbage fire. Sounds about right.

Like that most reviewers single out silencing Felicity as a mistake and laughing at almost all the reviewers talking up Diggle and Tinahs chemistry haha. 

[calliope1975]

7 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

So there's two reviews of about 10 that liked the episode while the rest thought it was a major garbage fire. Sounds about right.

Like that most reviewers single out silencing Felicity as a mistake and laughing at almost all the reviewers talking up Diggle and Tinahs chemistry haha. 

I feel vindicated!