The Starling City Times: News and Media about Arrow

[Starfish35]

34 minutes ago, tarotx said:

Maybe wait for them to load? The legends one has two former Arrow cast so I'll post it ;) 

Thanks.  No, they're not loading, but SpoilerTV never works very well for me on mobile.  But thanks for posting them! :) (and I see they've been posted in Mind Your Surroundings too.)

[tv echo]

Unsurprisingly, ComicBook.com reported on SA's recent HVFF-Atlanta comments as follows (I didn't quote SA's comments because they've been discussed at length in the Social Media thread)...

Arrow's Stephen Amell To Olicity Fans: "You Don't Always Get What You Want"
Jay Jayson- 11/23/2016
http://comicbook.com/dc/2016/11/22/arrows-stephen-amell-to-olicity-fans-you-dont-always-get-what-yo/

Quote

While the Olicity fanbase sulks, many fans are very happy that the show has focused on assembling and training Team Arrow 2.0, going after dangerous threats like Tobias Church (who is dead) and Prometheus, and having the new mayor try to fix Star City with his political muscles.

Last weekend, during the Arrow panel at Heroes & Villains Fan Fest, Amell was asked if it was fair and genuine of the showrunners to expect Olicity fans — a very invested and passionate fanbase that has been carefully cultivated over the years — to be content with Oliver and Felicity dating other people. ...

Edited November 27, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

ARROW STARS PICK WHO SHOULD BE STAR CITY MAYOR INSTEAD OF OLIVER QUEEN
POSTED BY SYDNEY BUCKSBAUM ON NOVEMBER 25, 2016
http://nerdist.com/arrow-stars-pick-who-should-be-star-city-mayor-instead-of-oliver-queen/

MG - picked Slade Wilson
WM - picked Quentin Lance
PB - still picked Oliver 
EBR - picked Felicity and also Harrison Wells
TR - picked Malone
MMcL - still picked Oliver
JD - picked Thea and also Felicity

ARROW STARS PICK THEIR FAVORITE FLASHBACKS FROM SET AFTER 100 EPISODES
POSTED BY SYDNEY BUCKSBAUM ON NOVEMBER 24, 2016
http://nerdist.com/arrow-stars-pick-their-favorite-flashbacks-from-set-after-100-episodes/

SA - picked scene with Susanna Thompson in S2
MG - picked death scenes with Tommy (CD) and also Moira (ST) and Laurel (KC)
EBR - picked humorous bts moment with Colton Haynes
PB - picked scenes with Laurel (KC)
MMcL and JD - picked team scenes this season

[tv echo]

I have to admit, some of these items are kinda cute (go to link to see pics)...

15 Gift Ideas for TV Fans Who Love Comic Book Shows
Robert Chan  November 25, 2016
https://www.yahoo.com/tv/15-gift-ideas-tv-fans-slideshow-wp-221831036.html

Quote

2 / 15
‘Arrow’ Olicity Necklace
When you want to show off that you have an unquenchable thirst to see Oliver and Felicity together, but you want to do it subtly and in a fashionably understated way, try a charm necklace. There are a number of different options, including "You have failed this omelette" and a necklace for fans of Diggolicity when just one ship won’t do. (Credit: Etsy.com)
*  *  *
3 / 15
‘Arrow’ Pen Stand
Until Orphan Black makes a stand that lets you jam a pencil into Rachel Duncan’s eye, this will be the coolest thing you can put on your desk to hold writing implements with. (Credit: Amazon.com)

Edited November 27, 2016 by tv echo

[bijoux]

That Meownard Snart T-shirt is really cute.

[tv echo]

I don't necessarily agree that this season is all that great, but at least this reviewer doesn't blame everything wrong with past seasons on Olicity...

Arrow Season 5: How the Show Got its Groove Back
Caroline Preece  November 28, 2016
http://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/arrow/260286/arrow-season-5-how-the-show-got-its-groove-back

[Chaser]

It's interesting. This season can be so much better because Olicity isn't a plot point right now, but there is no way the show is better because Laurel isn't on it anymore. Serious eye-roll.

[bijoux]

Non-spoilery bit from an article previewing tonight's episode.

Arrow boss previews Matrix-esque 100th episode - http://www.ew.com/article/2016/11/29/arrow-100-episode-spoilers

Quote

But Guggenheim also admits he harbors some regrets. “The truth is, I don’t think I’ve ever been involved with an hour of television on any show where there hasn’t been something I wanted to take back,” he says. “Doing 23 episodes a year, you’re just constantly running, so nothing ever turns out exactly the way you want it to. In other words, my list of regrets is actually incredibly long; it’s 100 episodes long. I’d say probably my biggest regret is I wish we had allowed the Oliver-Felicity storyline in season 4 to unfold at a more natural pace. We had set these tentpoles at the beginning of the season, and we were a bit too rigorous on how we hit them. That was a case where the planning overtook the storytelling. We didn’t do things as naturally and as elegantly as we should have.”

This is truly shocking to see.

[Chaser]

It wasn't the pace that lost me, it was the writing. The logic fails that insulted the characters.

It just didn't work.

[apinknightmare]

7 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Non-spoilery bit from an article previewing tonight's episode.

Arrow boss previews Matrix-esque 100th episode - http://www.ew.com/article/2016/11/29/arrow-100-episode-spoilers

This is truly shocking to see.

Interesting that he admits that they didn't tell the story quite right, but he continually goes on Twitter to berate the people who are upset because they didn't tell the story quite right and - this season - are pretending like that story never even existed. 

Edited November 30, 2016 by apinknightmare

[dtissagirl]

17 minutes ago, Chaser said:

It wasn't the pace that lost me, it was the writing. The logic fails that insulted the characters.

It just didn't work.

Imo the pacing made the writing all the much worse. I mean, there's no universe in which the baby mama drama would not be a pile of poo on fire, but the fact that they stuck with arbitrary time decisions -- Oliver must learn about demon spawn in 408, Felicity is 409's cliffhanger, Felicity is paralyzed from 410 to 415, break-up must happen simultaneously to Felicity getting her legs back so she can walk out hahahalol isn't this so clever at the dead end of February Sweeps in 415 -- legit made that pile of poo on fire fall on the audience's head.

And the piece of flaming poo that fell right into the audience's mouth was the moment when Malcolm told Oliver he knew about the demon spawn, and Oliver didn't do anything about it because the pre-determined beats were set in stone.

Edited November 30, 2016 by dtissagirl

[looptab]

Team Arrow Looks Back on 100 Epsiodes

Worth quoting because LOL and because it's 100 episodes and we should celebrate and we shall never forget

Quote

Katie Cassidy, "Laurel Lance"
"Putting on the [Black Canary] jacket for the first time.

To be fair, she also says some nice things about Emily and Paul.

[Chaser]

Her acting was non existent in that scene but I can see how that could be a fav of hers. That jacket represented everything she thought she signed on for.

[MariaHill]

2 hours ago, dtissagirl said:

And the piece of flaming poo that fell right into the audience's mouth was the moment when Malcolm told Oliver he knew about the demon spawn, and Oliver didn't do anything about it because the pre-determined beats were set in stone.

*takes giant swig of coffee to wash the flaming poo out of my mouth*

[insomniadreams88]

You know what I can't wait to see? What MG says a year from now he wishes he had changed about S5. It'll probably depend on what's going on in S6 at the time, of course.

[Chaser]

21 minutes ago, MariaHill said:

*takes giant swig of coffee to wash the flaming poo out of my mouth*

Do you drink? May want to try something a little stronger.

Edited November 30, 2016 by Chaser

[tv echo]

Arrow Boss Looks Back on 100 Episodes
By Matt Webb Mitovich / November 29 2016
http://tvline.com/gallery/arrow-100-episodes-marc-guggenheim-favorite-scenes-memories/#!8/lone-gunman-7/
http://tvline.com/gallery/arrow-100-episodes-marc-guggenheim-favorite-scenes-memories/#!9/city-of-heroes-36/
http://tvline.com/gallery/arrow-100-episodes-marc-guggenheim-favorite-scenes-memories/#!12/a-w-o-l/

Quote

ON THE ‘HAPPIEST ACCIDENT’
“This borders on cliché, but it's at least true — the happiest accident was Emily [Bett Rickards],” who debuted as Queen Consolidated “IT girl” Felicity Smoak in the series’ third episode — and was promoted to series regular not long after. “It was just a one-off role, one day's worth of work,” Guggenheim recalls. “What a lucky thing.”
Which begs the next question….
*  *  *
ON THE POWER OF ‘OLICITY’
If Guggenheim had known how well the Oliver/Felicity relationship would play, would he have leaned into it sooner? Or hold it for later? “That's a great question…,” he says, pausing to ponder. “I get a lot of s–t online, for reasons, but the way it played out for us was very organic. Like any showrunners, we react to the dailies and we started seeing these two actors have chemistry. So, no, I wouldn't do anything different.”
*  *  *
ON WHAT HE WISHES PEOPLE APPRECIATED MORE ABOUT ARROW
“I'll be honest, so much of the buzz about this show is given to us by the ‘shippers. I love their passion, but at the same time, there's a lot of times where I'll be like, ‘Can't people watch the show just to be entertained?’ I mean, does rooting for one particular relationship over another have to be the be-all and end-all of someone's enjoyment? We don't really write for the ‘shippers. We don't write for a particular segment of the fandom. We really are just trying to do the best episodes we possibly can, and sometimes we succeed, and sometimes we fail. But at the end of the day, the goal is always to be entertaining.”

[misstwpherecool]

New to the Arrow board and have been an interloper til this fall when reruns started on TNT. Apologies if this topic has been posted else where. I've been catching up and curious about about the movie 'Suicide Squad'. But I noticed some character treatment especially after seeing there would be the crossover event.

This article about the death or elimination of the characters Dead Shot and Amanda Weller caught my eye. Along with no Harley Quinn

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2016/06/01/arrow-actress-confirms-dc-killed-their-harley-quinnsuicide-squad-storylines/#6ef778309cf8

Can't have overlap on tv and the big screen- Huh? But it helps explain the last two years of Arrow.

 

[lemotomato]

2 hours ago, misstwpherecool said:

New to the Arrow board and have been an interloper til this fall when reruns started on TNT. Apologies if this topic has been posted else where. I've been catching up and curious about about the movie 'Suicide Squad'. But I noticed some character treatment especially after seeing there would be the crossover event.

This article about the death or elimination of the characters Dead Shot and Amanda Weller caught my eye. Along with no Harley Quinn

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2016/06/01/arrow-actress-confirms-dc-killed-their-harley-quinnsuicide-squad-storylines/#6ef778309cf8

Can't have overlap on tv and the big screen- Huh? But it helps explain the last two years of Arrow.

 

Welcome to the board!

TPTB have sort of been wishy washy about this point. There were times when the showrunners have outright said that a character was taken off the show because the movies wanted them, but then starting this season, MG (or SA, I can't remember) kind of backtracked and said that no character is off the table just because of the movies, they just have to ask for DC's permission. Which might explain why Supergirl was allowed to have Superman guest star this season, and Arrow got Deadshot.

Edited December 1, 2016 by lemotomato

[BkWurm1]

What I found so interesting is the show runner has revealed that DC pretty much asked them to do a Suicide Squad episode to kind of test the waters and the interest of the audience.  

[looptab]

Access Hollywood: 'Arrow' 100: EP Marc Guggenheim On The Diggle Twist & Those Callbacks To Earlier Episodes 

Quote

Executive Producer Marc Guggenheim told Access Hollywood that fellow EP Greg Berlanti came up with the twist for Dig.

"I think the reason we all sort of gravitated towards it was for a couple of reasons. First of all, we have a great affection in the writers' room for Diggle wearing the hood. So we just love any opportunity to do that, No. 1. No. 2 – we were dealing with a sort of alternate reality where the premise was, what if Oliver never got on the Queen's Gambit? And if Oliver hadn't gotten on the Queen's Gambit, then he never would have been marooned on the island and he never would have been in a situation where he needed to have a bodyguard. Basically, he gets a bodyguard once he comes back after five years marooned -- at least that's what's established in the pilot. So there was no real reason to make him a driver, [and] the idea [was] that Star City still needs a vigilante and why wouldn't that vigilante be Diggle, who's clearly got a lot of skill and tactics from his experience in the military. Everything kind of lined up and made a certain amount of sense -- the appropriate amount of sense."

[...]

While Felicity Smoak was back on Earth in the real Arrow cave, working with Curtis, Cisco, Rene and Rory on trying to hack alien tech to free their friends, a version of her was featured in the alien dream. She was part of Diggle's Arrow team (with a very Season 1-esque 'do), and Ray Palmer's fiancée. In the bar, before the wedding reception, keen eyes will have spotted Felicity in a familiar royal blue dress. Guggenheim told Access they specifically put that dress in the script, "to recall her date with Ray Palmer in Episode 215."

[...]

There was a sweet nod to actor Colin's role on NBC's "Chicago Med" in a sequence between Thea and Malcolm Merlyn (James Barrowman), where the proud father talked about his son being a doctor in Chicago. (Colin stars as Dr. Connor Rhodes on the Dick Wolf series, which airs Thursdays on NBC.) And, Guggenheim said Colin got a sneak peek of the scene. "Yeah, I sent him a clip of it, and he wrote me back immediately. He was tickled," the producer said.

In the original "Arrow" pilot, Oliver gave his sister a Hozen he'd brought back from the island. In Wednesday's 100th episode, Thea gave it to Ollie as a wedding gift. Asked about the selection process for adding in callbacks like that, Guggenheim said it was an easy one.

"I can't speak for Wendy [Mericle], but when I was writing my portions of the script, I didn't go into it with a laundry list of items I wanted to check off. For better or for worse, part of the advantage of having been so intimately involved with the show since the beginning is all these little nods are sort of little things that are just already in my memory. Even like turns of phrase, like Robert saying, 'That's not going to finish well.' Oh, I know he says that, so I can work that in. The Hōzen, the beginning [of the 100th episode] where Oliver's running and we reveal the mansion – none of these things were sort of in the original break, it was just things I sort of found in the writing. … The  only challenge was to avoid the temptation to do it every single scene."

Guggenheim said what ended up in the episode came down to balance.

"It's something you feel in the writing, and in some cases, it starts with just thinking like, 'Well, how does the scene start?' I know what the scene's about from the break, but how does the scene start? What's the downbeat on the scene?" he said. "For example, like Thea giving Oliver a gift in advance of his wedding, that seemed like just an appropriate downbeat, and from there the idea comes. 'Well, she could give him a Hozen,' and then you get a little connection. My process is very instinctual."

Fight Coordinator James Bamford, who has directed several episodes of "Arrow," and appeared in the pilot, directed the "Arrow" 100th.

"We had Bam direct it because he was quite simply the best man for the job. He was the guy," Guggenheim said. "I love his visual style, I love the performances he gets out of the actors. He finds a way to convey scope and production value in a way that pushes the envelope of the show. I'm an enormous fan of his work and he's never let us down."

 

It was episode 307, Guggie, haha. Also the stuff about Bam is always pretty funny.

[looptab]

How did ‘Arrow’ 100 pull off those surprise cameos?

Variety: Arrow’ Producers Explain How the 100th Episode Became Oliver’s Flashpoint

Quote

“This was, sort of, Oliver’s version of ‘Flashpoint’ or ‘For the Girl Who Has Everything’ from ‘Supergirl,'” he said. “There’s a reason why these stories are iconic or familiar tropes in comic books. When you show the protagonist the path-not-taken — and you basically put them in a situation where they can choose to stay on that path or go back to their life with all its ugly aspects — and they choose the selfless choice, it makes your character stronger.”

Guggenheim said this Elseworlds-like story will strengthen Ollie’s resolve heading into next week’s midseason finale.

“Oliver has a new sense of purpose,” he said. “The events of [episode] 508 forced him to emotionally double down on his mission. He also has a reaffirmation of his bond with Thea, because they chose each other.”

I like this^ a lot.

[bijoux]

Quote

She was part of Diggle's Arrow team (with a very Season 1-esque 'do)

What? Do they mean something other than hair here? Because the only commonality was that she's still blond.

[looptab]

6 minutes ago, bijoux said:

What? Do they mean something other than hair here? Because the only commonality was that she's still blond.

Yeah, I wondered about that, too, haha.

Deadline: ‘Arrow’ EP Marc Guggenheim On Tonight’s 100th Episode, CW’s Mega-Crossover & What’s Next (some mild spoilers for 509)

[Morrigan2575]

215? He means 307, right? Damn MG really is bad with numbers. Hopefully he has a good accountant.

[Sakura12]

Why do think giving their audience motion sickness from the spinning camera and clunky camera movements is good directing? I had to look away from the Oliver and Diggle convo because I was getting dizzy and missed some of what they said. I'm not one to really notice directing on tv shows, but most of the camera work on this crossover has been so bad, I had to notice it. 

[Morrigan2575]

I complained about that stupid camera move in the episode thread. It was soooo bad.

[calliope1975]

4 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I complained about that stupid camera move in the episode thread. It was soooo bad.

I missed the first half and that spinny scene was where I came in. It was so bad and distracting and borderline nauseating, I had to look away. I can't believe that made it to the final edit. 

[tv echo]

Arrow recap: 'Invasion!'
BY SARA NETZLEY   November 30, 2016
http://www.ew.com/recap/arrow-season-5-episode-8

Quote

How many different things did tonight’s episode of Arrow need to be? Let us count the ways: It needed to continue the conflicts set up in The CW’s ambitious DC crossover. It needed to balance non-Arrow characters within its narrative. And it needed to honor the milestone of the show’s 100th episode. So how did it do?

It hit a bullseye. Right in the heart.
*  *  *
Supergirl joins Flash, Mr. Terrific, and Wild Dog to take the doctor down, although Wild Dog must first make it clear how much he distrusts metas and aliens whose godlike powers don’t make the world a better place. Listen, if Rene isn’t willing to let Supergirl, a.k.a. the nicest woman on the planet, into his heart, he’s dead to me.
*  *  *
... Naturally, Rene has the fastest turnaround ever in his feelings about metas and aliens. It’s rushed and sloppily done, but the rest of this episode is so perfect I don’t care.
*  *  *
Then Oliver gets his goodbye, telling Laurel he isn’t the person she fell in love with and she always deserved better.

Look, I was never a Laurel fan, but this was wrenching. The Oliver Queen who returned from the island five years ago returned with a heart full of love for Laurel. That the Dominators would try to exploit that makes sense, particularly in an episode designed to commemorate the previous 99 episodes.
*  *  *
- Season 5 salmon-ladder count: 3.5. One for Oliver, 1.5 for Curtis, one for Rene.
- The best part of this episode was the palatial bathroom in the Queen mansion. Want.
- The second-best part of this episode was Curtis’ disillusionment with the mean aliens. Poor guy!

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[looptab]

I'm reading people calling this the best Arrow episode ever, and I just don't see it. I liked it well enough, but it wasn't this perfect hour of television some are saying. To each his own I guess.

[tv echo]

A series-best Arrow imagines an Oliver Queen without heartbreak
By Alasdair Wilkins Nov 30, 2016  11:10 PM
http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/series-best-arrow-imagines-oliver-queen-without-he-246701

Quote

What’s brilliant about tonight’s episode is that it doesn’t simply present a fantasy existence for Oliver, or even an individual dream for each of our heroes, but rather a shared vision for all five of them. The focus is mostly on Oliver in the early going, and Sara is the only other captive who betrays any initial sense that something is wrong when she gives Laurel that extra hug. Thea, John, and Ray are so enmeshed in their perfect existence that one could be forgiven for forgetting they aren’t just constructs in Oliver’s dream. But that’s what makes the episode so fascinating. Diggle isn’t just the Green Arrow because somebody had to fill the role in Oliver’s absence, but because he needs to be a hero in his own right. Some of that, I suspect, is a matter of narrative convenience, but there’s an intriguing subtext here: Oliver’s path to becoming the Green Arrow was essentially accidental, something that could be undone by simply not having him get on board the Queen’s Gambit. Diggle, on the other hand, is fundamentally a soldier, and even allowing him a world where his brother is alive and incarcerated can’t entirely erase the trauma he carries.
*  *  *
The episode abounds with perfect little touches. Thea gets a world where both her father and her mother are alive to watch her grow up, yet she also receives unambiguous affirmation from her biological father Malcolm. Ray is engaged to Felicity, even as he briefly realizes that she isn’t even the former lover he should be gladdest to be reunited with. Oliver earns kind words from Detective Lance, who isn’t an alcoholic in this world, without having to suffer through several years of hell first. Sara is more vocal about being LGBT than she ever really got to be when she and Laurel were alive at the same time (an amazing thing to have to qualify), with the passing implication that part of the reason she never had an affair with Oliver was because she didn’t have to conceal her primary attractions. Look, maybe that’s too big a leap, but tonight’s episode is the rare Arrow episode that feels like it can support such deeper, possibly tenuous analysis. The writing, the direction, and especially the acting—both by the five “real” people and all the others, who just want Oliver to go ahead with that damn wedding of his—all convey a world designed around the desires of its inhabitants, both big and small. Figuring out all the ways that that manifests is part of the story’s appeal.
*  *  *
“Invasion!” could have been an unholy mess, balancing the needs of a three-part (plus one scene of Supergirl) crossover with the Arrow-specific celebration of the 100-episode milestone. But the decision to focus on the show’s past and bring back old favorites like Moira, Deathstroke, Robert, and Moira—Moira is worth listing twice—ends up giving the show a way to develop the power and the threat of the Dominators without this crossover just being three straight episodes of heroes and aliens punching each other. Tonight’s episode also once again proves that Arrow doesn’t need to be gloomy or choked by petty interpersonal conflict to tell effective stories—it’s amazing I spent last night’s The Flash missing the warmth and emotional maturity of Arrow, but that’s where we’re at in 2016—as even the disagreements Oliver has with Diggle and Thea are well-motivated and resolved with minimal fuss.
*  *  *
Like “For The Man Who Has Everything” and “Perchance To Dream” before it, this episode tells us everything we need to know about its heroes by temporarily removing what makes them who they are, and then just trusting their true selves to reemerge in due course. When Oliver looks back that last time at all those he has lost—not just those who have died, but the versions of people like Roy and Felicity who are now gone, perhaps never to return—we are left to recognize how much our hero has sacrificed along the way. That he so quickly turns and leaves to face his next battle is the enduring reminder that Oliver is indeed our hero. If this is how Arrow marks 100 episodes, then here’s to 100 more. If this isn’t the best episode in Arrow’s history, it’s damn close.
*  *  *
My favorite running gag of the episode was how obsessed all the non-real characters were with Oliver getting married, with Felicity’s random reference in the Arrow Cave particularly good.

Since Lyla appeared in The Flash part of the crossover but not tonight’s fantasy, I suppose it’s worth wondering what it means that Diggle’s fantasy life didn’t include his wife. My guess is it’s along the same lines as his role as Green Arrow: Diggle’s self-loathing is so total that even a perfect life for him has to involve some punishing loss.
*  *  *
I miss Laurel more than most, but it was dashed sporting of Katie Cassidy to get in some confused face acting one last time for the road as Oliver told Laurel he couldn’t stay.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[Starfish35]

Quote

with the passing implication that part of the reason she never had an affair with Oliver was because she didn’t have to conceal her primary attractions.

Really?  Seriously?

[ladylaw99]

This is far from being the best episode Arrow has ever made.

[JenMD]

6 minutes ago, looptab said:

I'm reading people calling this the best Arrow episode ever, and I just don't see it. I liked it well enough, but it wasn't this perfect hour of television some are saying. To each his own I guess.

Seriously.  Now I feel like I'm trapped in an alien-induced dream world. 

[looptab]

3 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

Really?  Seriously?

I didn't get that impression at all. This is just this reviewer's impression.

[tv echo]

Why Arrow's Crossover Was The Perfect 100th Episode
BY LAURA HURLEY November 30, 2016
http://www.cinemablend.com/television/1592000/why-arrows-crossover-was-the-perfect-100th-episode

Quote

The best part? The episode didn't even need to make all of the cameos and callbacks make sense. The entire scenario was a hallucination that was falling apart into glitches the longer that Oliver and the others stayed immersed. Arrow could go nuts with rules and logic and physics, and it didn't even make a difference. The emphasis could be on emotional impact rather than plot because the plot specifics just didn't really matter. "Invasion!" brought most of the key players from the history of the show together at Queen Mansion for a wedding, and it actually worked in fantasy where it might have backfired spectacularly in whatever stands for reality these days..

The hallucination world of "Invasion!" also managed to honor the very real bonds that Oliver has forged over the years on Arrow, even if the scenario was fake. Oliver's sparks of recognition when he met with his best bro John Diggle and his lady love Felicity in the bizarro Arrow Bunker gave tribute to the original Team Arrow that started it all back in Season 1, and I'll admit that I teared up a little bit when Oliver saw images of all of his loved ones right before he left the hallucination world forever. He even got to see Roy and Tommy on top of everybody else, and my heart grew three sizes like the Grinch discovering the meaning of Christmas.

Was the episode perfect in and of itself? Not really. The music was crazy loud, but unfortunately not loud enough to drown out Wild Dog's escalating complaints about...pretty much everything. Curtis and Rory both stole lines that would have gone to Felicity prior to the invasion of newbies into Team Arrow, and the escape pod looked like the unholy offspring of the TARDIS from Doctor Who and the drop ship from The 100. So no, "Invasion!" wasn't faultless television, but it was the best 100th episode we could have possibly gotten in the middle of such a wild crossover. Besides, we got the reveal that Tommy couldn't make it to the wedding because he's a doctor in Chicago. What's not to love about meta-references with meta-humans in the area?

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[Sakura12]

Wouldn't the more obvious reason be that in a dream world Sara would not have pursued her sister's boyfriend, because he's her sister's boyfriend. 

[Chaser]

I think this is the first time I've disagreed with Hurley's opinion.

1 minute ago, Sakura12 said:

Wouldn't the more obvious reason be that in a dream world Sara would not have pursued her sister's boyfriend, because he's her sister's boyfriend. 

You and your logic.

[catrox14]

This is far from the best episode of Arrow. Just no. I can name at least 20 episodes that are better.

[Sunshine]

Wasn't there a tweet somewhere from a LOT writer saying that Sara had to be a lesbian and not bisexual because of a network demand?

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Recap: “Invasion!” – Arrowpoint
BY KAYTI BURT  November 30, 2016
http://collider.com/arrow-recap-invasion/

Quote

“Some things you just can’t fix,” Sara (Caity Lotz) tells Hallucination!Laurel (Katie Cassidy) as she hugs her goodbye in “Invasion!” the third part of this week’s “Heroes v. Aliens” crossover event. It’s one sentence that encompasses the entire lesson Oliver (Stephen Amell), Thea (Willa Holland), Ray (Brandon Routh), Diggle (David Ramsey), and Sara must accept in order to leave their Dominator-caused shared hallucination. More than that, it’s the lesson the entire CW superhero universe (most especially Arrow and The Flash) has been trying to hammer back into its narrative since the start of the season; a superhero universe in search of a sense of consequence.
*  *  *
Both Barry and Oliver have to ask themselves during this season: If you had the chance to save the people you had lost, would you? Oliver told Barry in last night’s The Flash that, if he had the chance, he would make the same decision Barry did. He would try to save his parents. In tonight’s episode, he is given that chance (let’s call it Arrowpoint, shall we?), and he makes a different decision than Barry did. To be fair, Barry is the eternal optimist, while Oliver is the eternal pessimist. Oliver is still trying to accept that he is worthy of happiness. The 100th episode felt like a big step on that journey.
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Though the shared hallucination gimmick might lack long-term narrative consequence and feel like a bit of a “Look, It’s The 100th Episode!” plot device, it works because of the performance of all of the actors (including many returning ones) and the sentiment that this show has genuinely inspired in people. Even if Arrow doesn’t make you feel things in Season 5, it probably made you feels things in seasons one through four. If you’re here for the 100th episode, you care about this show and its characters on some level and, like any good 100th episode, this installment is a love letter to its fans.
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Some fan service tactics worked better than others. It was nice to see Laurel and Sara’s sisterly relationship again and for them to get a goodbye because they never had that chance. (Though I wanted to see more Thea and Laurel, as they became very close before Laurel’s death. It would have been nice to see Thea discuss her decision to leave Team Arrow with her bestie.) I was less into the exploration of Laurel and Oliver’s romance. It’s hard for me to believe that these two end up happy in any corner of the multiverse, at least not one that includes a backstory where Oliver so disrespected her in the early years of their relationship. (And I am even less convinced that there is a version of the multiverse where Lance approves of Oliver marrying Laurel.)
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— “I thought you were a rich, entitled punk.” “I was.” Oliver has some serious self-awareness in this universe. Do we really believe that, if The Queen’s Gambit hadn’t sunk, he would have gone on such a journey of personal growth?

— Felicity and Diggle were weirdly put on the back burner in this episode. I know this was a busy episode, but Felicity and Diggle have been integral parts of this universe, so it was sad they didn’t get more to do. It was also strange that the episode almost completely ignored its Olicity history, which I know is a contentious topic for some, but has been a big part of this show.
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— Felicity trying to be cool after Sara steals Ray away from her at the rehearsal dinner. Rewatch this scene if you did not notice it the first time because it is the most real party moment The CW has ever pulled off.
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— It wasn’t weird to me that Oliver saw his dead loved ones before he left the hallucination world. It was weird to me that Felicity and Roy were there, too. They’re still alive, dude. They don’t have to join the Arrow Museum Hall of Holograms.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Season 5 Episode 8: Invasion Review
Arrow episode 100 is part of the big Invasion crossover, and also the best episode of the season so far.
Tyler McCarthy   November 30, 2016
http://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/arrow/260361/arrow-season-5-episode-8-invasion-review

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Plot points aside, it was a smart move for Arrow to use the crossover as an invitation to try out an alternate timeline story of its own. Why should The Flash have all the fun? Not only did fans get some really deep Season 1 callbacks such as the Hōzen, but they got to see some of their favorite characters happy and grounded once again. It’s no secret that the reality of the entire Arrowverse has flown a bit off the rails since the introduction of metahumans. That change was, obviously, for the better - but it’s important to show things like Sara and Laurel (Katie Cassidy) being friendly and loving. This helps put the former’s current plotline, captain of a time machine desperately seeking vengance on the man that killed her sister, into perspective.
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Will Sara drop her thirst for revenge? Would Ray have ended up with Felicity? Is Oliver changed for having admitted his love for Laurel out loud? Will Thea resent not staying behind in what was, ostensibly, a heavenscape? Diggle wouldn’t have become The Hood on his own… I’m just calling that one. Spartan? Maybe.
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If there is a gripe with this episode, it’s the tone. Relative to a normal installment of Arrow, it was a high-concept romp, but relative to last night’s epic crossover episode of The Flash, this episode slowed things way down. It was like a DJ playing LMFAO’s “Shots” followed immediately by “Abby Road.” Two great songs, but not a stellar pairing. However, if this was the “Heroes vs. Aliens” way of making viewers eat their metaphorical vegetables in this delicious crossover meal, and squeeze a bit of emotional weight and future setup, then mission well-accomplished.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Review: Invasion! (Season 5 Episode 8)
November 30, 2016  Lissete Lanuza Sáenz
http://telltaletv.com/2016/11/arrow-review-invasion-season-5-episode-8/

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Arrow Season 5 Episode 8, “Invasion!” tries to take us on an emotional journey and reinforce this final conclusion. And I say tries, because it mostly fails.

But hey, we can at least give it this – it goes out swinging.

The cameos are everywhere, and they’re not just unimportant figures, no. Laurel is back, Robert and Moira are back, there’s a reference to Tommy alive and well and hey, there’s all those holograms when Oliver’s about to enter the portal.

But, as much as some moments truly hit the mark – Oliver saying goodbye to his parents, that Thea and Oliver conversation, some moments miss by so much that the end result is just …uneven and confusing.

Pretty much like this entire season of Arrow.
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Even when it falters, though, this is certainly the best Arrow has done this season, not just because of the nostalgia factor, but because of the real people inhabiting this hallucination.

The problem with the message, however, is that, for a moment that seems to last for far longer than they probably wanted it to; we sort of want this reality to be  our reality. We want these people to stay.

Not because we necessarily love them, no. But because they’re, at least, closer to the people we used to love than what we’ve seen so far in Season 5.

Oliver is grumpy, but relatively good-hearted and a hero at heart. Felicity’s happy, kicking ass and taking names as both a career woman and a vigilante, and oh, yes, she still has a loving man at her side. Diggle is the Hood.
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In the end the episode that was supposed to be a love letter to fans is just a painful reminder of some of the things season five has been missing. And hey, if this is all meant to be a wake-up call before a much-needed return to continuity, then great, but even if it is – why did it take eight episodes?

And, if it’s not, then ….what’s even the point anymore?
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- Hallucination!Felicity gets to wear her hair down. I wonder if that’s one of Oliver’s fetishes or something.
- Real!Felicity’s characterization was ALL OVER THE PLACE. Was she ever worried about Oliver? She certainly didn’t look it. All she looked was …giddy.
- Do I have to remind the writers AGAIN about the engagement? The first 4 seasons are on Netflix. It’s not that hard.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Review 5.08 – “Invasion!”
November 30, 2016 | Posted by Michael Haigis
http://411mania.com/movies/arrow-review-5-08-invasion/

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Something is happening between Arrow and me. I know this, because “Invasion!’’ is an episode of television that right in my hatred wheelhouse. Crossovers like this (or theme nights, as other networks have featured in the past) are almost always useless. Because it’s a stunt, “Invasion” is a diversion from the plot of the season thus far. Because it is so clearly a cheap device designed to harness eyeballs on all four DC Comics shows, I was predisposed to treat it as what it is – a cynical trick. Because this is also Arrow’s 100th episode, “Invasion” also played the role of clip show, without the clips. It was a nostalgic trip down memory lane, using that most contrived of plot devices – the hallucination – to service fan’s sentimental needs.

Yet, here I am writing the following: “Invasion!” was actually a pretty damn good episode of Arrow. Artful, it was not. But it managed to be both thoughtful and not-entirely-irrelevant, which is an achievement when it comes to event programming like this.
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Here, the show veers towards the fan service-iest of all the fan service it would dabble in during “Invasion!” On their way back to reality, Arrow and Co. are blocked by Oliver’s Rogues Gallery from the first five seasons – Deathstroke is there, alongside Malcome Merlyn, Damian Darhk, and other goons.
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The reason this episode was so surprisingly palatable is pretty simple; they did a remarkable job cushioning all the bald, pointless fan service with character beats that were actually impactful. Before confronting all the old villains (little more than an opportunity for hordes of fans to tweet “DEATHSTROKE #arrow”), Oliver must confront the fact that he is leaving Thea behind. She can’t bear to leave her parents once more. When she decides to ultimately follow Oliver, tacitly acknowledging that her reality – while not perfect – is better than this saccharine falsehood, it truly pivots her character toward the future. When the show is grounding itself in that way, who could be mad at the fun, action packed trips down memory lane that follow.

Oliver and co. beat their foes handily, and head into Smoak Technologies (and apparently across some sort of plane, marked by fog). Here Oliver is forced to part ways with Laurel – for a long time, the second lead and an emotional anchor of Arrow – as well as many other figures from his past, who appear to offer messages from the past. It’s super trite, and sickly sweet. But Arrow is hardly the first show to look backwards when reaching a milestone like 100 episodes; the fact that they did so while still moving forward is truly the achievement here.
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The show wasn’t trying to do a million things; it was simply telling a small, closed-loop story. That format suits Arrow, a show that doesn’t always excel at the long game. The nostalgia of the evening never morphed into gross sentimentality, and the momentum of the season wasn’t derailed; instead, we were given some of the most effective character work of the season, and those among us who are most excited to see The Flash and The Green Arrow on the same TV screen can rejoice as well. I wish the aliens could invade every week.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Review: ‘Arrow’ Keeps ‘Invasion!’ in Stasis With 100th Episode Celebration
Kevin Fitzpatrick   Nov. 30, 2016
http://screencrush.com/arrow-invasion-crossover-100th-review/

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Arrow’s retrospective is earned; both cast and crew have every right to lean back and enjoy the some of the series’ highlights, if only perhaps to ignore the myriad questions from mashing these two events together. Why would a shared hallucination of the primary Arrow players (in which neither Felicity nor Laurel nor Quentin have any real emotional role) present as an alternate reality that slowly awakens them to the truth? Why would “Smoak Technologies” offer them an exit to stroll out of, once imaginary villains were defeated? Who was guarding these five in stasis, and apparently drunk at the wheel?
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That’s the thing about these kinds of parties; you’re never accomplishing much more than a stroll down memory lane and a few glasses of bubbly, so you mingle to pad the time. In this case, that amounts to Oliver and company sharing the same slow realizations over and over in different settings, occasionally pausing for the cameo from the series’ past, while the outside world butts in to remind everyone of what’s at stake with the crossover.

It’s a format that steps on emotional resonance, like the idea of Oliver accepting Thea’s choice to stay within the simulation for fear of losing her family again. There’s something to be said of Thea’s attachment to her parents, as well as Oliver’s willingness to respect his sister’s more destructive choices, but the span of a commercial break sees Thea changing her mind offscreen anyway. After all, what was she going to do, stay on the alien ship? How was Arrow ever going to follow through on any of the emotional beats presented tonight?

The outside story only fares so much better, largely serving to keep the Arrow players busy while reminding everyone that Supergirl and Flash are still involved. And like Thea’s breakdown, there might have been a larger story to tell behind Rene’s prejudice against superpowers, but not one “Invasion!” had the resource to expand beyond Barry and Kara saving him … you know, once. To say nothing of one of the more weirdly-specific one-off villains to introduce, and dispatch in a single hour.
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The idea of Oliver Queen’s Wonderful Life (or more aptly, his own Flashpoint) is a potent one, and I’m intrigued by Thea’s notion that human heroes could embrace Metas as a cushy reward for their sacrifice as well. None of that was really a great fit for the second act of this particular crossover, however, and ends up dragging both down.
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It’s a testament to Katie Cassidy that Laurel seemed so heartbroken by Oliver and Sara leaving, to the point I’d hoped it was somehow genuinely her. Whatever happened to that series regular deal, anyway?
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I understand the impulse for an all-out brawl to showcase Arrow’s stuntwork, but it was hard to make out who was who in all that dimly-lit rain.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Season 5 Episode 8 Review: “Invasion!” 
Chris King+  December 1, 2016
http://www.tvovermind.com/the-cw/arrow/arrow-100-episode-review-invasion-crossover

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But in addition to all of that, “Invasion!” was also a damn fine hour of television, one that used the tried and true “dream world” concept to tremendous effect, as we watched Oliver, Thea, Diggle, Sara, and Ray struggle to break free of the illusion that the Dominators had stuck them in. Unlike the real world they live in, the universe that the Dominators created didn’t have loss or tragedy; Robert, Moira, Laurel, and Tommy were all still alive, and it appeared that, on the surface, Oliver had everything he wanted: a relationship with his parents, the love of Laurel, and even the approval of Quentin. However, as we’ve seen so many times before in these types of episodes, what seems too good to be true always is, and it’s not too long until Oliver, Thea, and the rest of the group begin to see the cracks in the Dominators’ world. As good and as happy as their lives seem now, they start to understand that none of it is actually real, and while it’s an appealing option to remain in this dream-like state, it wouldn’t be better than truly living.
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There’s such incredible emotion, so much pain and longing and hope, throughout Oliver and Thea’s short conversation, and it’s easily some of the best work that Stephen Amell and Willa Holland have ever done on Arrow. Despite the heightened circumstances of the situation, both actors make Oliver and Thea’s words and actions feel so unquestionably real, and when Thea urges Oliver to stay and then reemerges by his side as he and the rest of the group fight against enemies from their past, it all feels honest and earned because of how strong the writing is for these characters and because of how uniformly fantastic the performances are.

As several different characters mention throughout tonight’s episode, Oliver Queen doesn’t have superpowers. He can’t run as fast as Barry or fly like Supergirl, but the greatest strength he possesses, something more powerful than any type of ability or technology, is his determination. Throughout Arrow, we’ve seen Oliver get discouraged or become hopeless; we’ve even seen that type of behavior from him early on in Season 5. However, no matter how much he sacrifices or how high the odds are stacked against him, Oliver always finds a way to keep fighting, to keep saving people’s lives, and to keep pursuing his mission of protecting his city. “Invasion!” acts as a reminder of not just Arrow‘s history but of how the show’s titular hero will always continue to be a hero, whether he’s wearing his green suit or not.
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My sole complaint with this episode is that, much like last night’s The Flash, everything felt a little too fast-paced, a little too rushed, and that did detract somewhat from the impact of the hour’s more emotional scenes.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

ARROW: "INVASION!" REVIEW
Jesse Scheeden   Nov. 30, 2016
http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/12/01/arrow-invasion-review

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This week’s Arrow had a tall order to fill. It was not only the middle act of the massive Invasion crossover, but also the 100th episode of the series. How do you go about trying to push the larger crossover forward while also taking the time to celebrate such a significant milestone. The solution, it seems, was to worry less about the former and more about the latter. This episode definitely worked better as “Arrow: Episode 100” than it did “Invasion: Act Two.”

This episode revolved around a pretty common trope in superhero storytelling, with the hero being shown the life they might have had if they had never put on their costume and resisting the urge to stay in that false reality forever. It’s a story that’s been told in many forms over the years, with a couple notable, DC-themed examples being Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons’ “For the Man Who Has Everything” in Superman Annual #11 and the Batman: The Animated Series Episode “Perchance to Dream.” We’ve even seen it done in the Arrow-verse before, as Supergirl did its own take on “For the Man Who Has Everything” earlier this year.

But if the concept is hardly novel at this point, it was certainly handled effectively. Much more so than in “For the Girl Who Has Everything,” frankly. For one thing, it wasn’t just Ollie who struggled with the temptation of a false life, but several of those closest to him, too. The premise played nicely on the idea that Ollie, Thea, Sara, Ray and Diggle have lost so much over the years. There’s a real draw in seeing a world where Ollie never got on that boat and never caused that chain reaction of tragedies and hardships that have defined his life ever since. A world where his parents are still alive, Queen Consolidated still exists, his relationships with the Lance family never suffered and where a bright, promising future still calls to him. It’s little wonder our heroes found it so difficult to leave.
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Things didn’t fare quite so well in the real world. For the most part, the scenes with Cisco, Team Arrow and the rest felt like glorified filler. I’d compare it to the TV version of an RPG fetch quest. They have to track down “Oliver and company, but first they need to hack the alien databanks. But they can’t access the databanks without the right processor. But they can’t use the processor without a doodad. But the doodad was stolen by this random supervillain. Time to go fight the random villain and steal back the doodad.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[ladylaw99]

Well I must have been in an hallucination because I don't see how this ep was a damn fine hour of television. 

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Recap: What If … ‘Arrow’ Never Happened?
Robert Chan  Dec. 1, 2016
https://www.yahoo.com/tv/arrow-recap-what-if-arrow-never-happened-125434159.html

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With these ever-growing Arrowverse crossovers, the motto seems to be “go big or go home.” Somewhat paradoxically, though, the Arrow episode of the Invasion arc reaps huge rewards by going small. Sure, there are huge fights and alien space battles, but the main focus of the show is on a What If…? version of everyone’s life, if Oliver had never got on the Queen’s Gambit five years ago, and it hits all the emotional points that make the show great.
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On the one hand, it would have been great if they had found a way to not have the 100th episode of Arrow be part of a four-part alien invasion crossover. Have Team Arrow drugged by the League of Assassins and give us more time to explore this vision of a Green Arrow-less world. It was wonderful to see Susanna Thompson and Jamey Sheridan back as the Queens and Katie Cassidy as Laurel. It was nice to think that maybe Oliver would have straightened out on his own and that Quentin wouldn’t think of him as a “rich, entitled punk.” It was heartbreaking to see Thea choose the fantasy over reality and it was thrilling to see her eventually make the right call (even if it only took one commercial break to do it).

On the other hand, we did get all that AND Oliver blasting Dominators with a ray gun on an alien battleship — so we kind of got to have our cake and eat it too.
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- And the award for Most Ungrateful SOB goes to… Rene Ramirez for “I don’t do apologies, sweetheart,” to a woman who just saved your life.

- And the award for Most Likely to Get Their Butt Kicked by an Alien goes to … Rene Ramirez for calling Supergirl “sweetheart.” Anybody who condescendingly calls someone with heat vision “sweetheart” deserved to get punched into the stratosphere.
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*There’s a moment — right after Sara pulls Ray away — where Felicity is looking around the party like a video game character whose controller has just been flung on the floor. The beautiful part about that moment is that it works if it’s the result of the alien program glitching, or if it’s just Felicity’s natural awkwardness when left alone at a party where she doesn’t know anybody.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

What Could’ve Been and What Was Meant to Be
ALYSSA BARBIERI   Dec. 1, 2016
http://fangirlish.com/arrow-5x08-review-couldve-meant/

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Given that Arrow’s 100th episode was part of this crossover event there was definitely some bitterness from some of the fandom, myself included, given the fact that this pivotal milestone should be about Arrow and only Arrow. Even after seeing the episode I remain firm in that regard. But also after seeing the episode it wasn’t as bad as I’d expected.
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This was definitely the best episode of the season thus far (Lauriver nausea included), which kind of shows you just how disappointing this season has been so far. But this was definitely an episode that fans of Arrow could find something they loved about this series over the years. And perhaps that’s what they meant by “love letter,” although that’s not an accurate definition. There was a little something for everyone that has watched over the years. For the fans that love Olicity, for the fans of Thea and Moira’s beautiful relationship, for the fans of Original Team Arrow, hell, even for fans of the ship that was always doomed from the start Lauriver.

No doubt what made this episode solid was the emotion that hit the audience so profoundly. Arrow at its best has always thrived on the emotional dealings of its characters. It’s why this season 5 has felt so alien (pun not intended). We haven’t gotten to see these characters really experience or address their emotions. Those emotions have been pushed aside in favor of action sequences or new characters. But Arrow’s 100th episode brought back that emotional element that we’d been missing. And it was glorious.
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Arrow’s 100th episode centered around the idea of what could’ve been and what was actually meant to be. While “Invasion” presented us with this idea of what could’ve been had Oliver never gotten on the Queen’s Gambit, it also made it damn clear that Oliver was meant to get on that boat and he was meant to live the life he’s currently living. Who would’ve thought five years of hell would’ve been the best thing to happen to Oliver Queen? But it’s the truth. He’s a better man for it.
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Stephen Amell was absolutely flawless in that scene. It was so much more powerful than on paper because of what it meant to Stephen personally. It was such a gut-wrenching and bittersweet moment for Oliver where he finally got his chance to say goodbye. Even though he could’ve chosen to stay locked in this false reality, he did what a hero does: he sacrificed his happiness for the greater good. He understood that he couldn’t stay here and let others fight the good fight alone. He has a responsibility and duty to his city. But more than that, there was so much that he’d be giving up in the process.

He’d be giving up Felicity. And regardless of where the two stand at present, there’s no doubt in my mind that not only will they find their way back to each other but that there’s no way Oliver would give up the chance to be with her. This false reality might’ve told him that he was supposed to be with Laurel, but that’s why it was a false reality. It wasn’t real. It was his subconscious creating this scenario of what might’ve been, what was probably expected of him. But it’s Felicity Smoak, the blonde IT girl that stole his heart from the first moment he met her, that is his always. She is who he’s supposed to be with. And there’s nothing in this world – even a false reality that teases bliss – that could keep him from her. Hell, it was his flashes of Felicity that prompted him to realize and admit that something was wrong — that this reality wasn’t reality. He belonged in a reality where this exists:
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-There was not nearly enough Felicity Smoak in an episode that’s Arrow’s milestone episode, a series that Felicity has been a significant part of in its success. Just saying.

Edited December 1, 2016 by tv echo