tv echo November 5, 2016 Share November 5, 2016 (edited) All The Reasons 'Arrow' Shouldn't Keep Olicity Apart Any Longer, Since It Makes Absolutely No Sense By CAITLYN CALLEGARI 3 days agohttps://www.bustle.com/articles/192865-all-the-reasons-arrow-shouldnt-keep-olicity-apart-any-longer-since-it-makes-absolutely-no-sense Quote The explanation for that? Amell apparently told ET, "I think they both love each other very much and care about each other, but that doesn’t always mean that people are together." But why, Amell? Why? Unfortunately, it only gets more confounding from there. Rickards proclaimed something quite similar and said, "I feel like they still have a really deep connection and they just need to grow apart ... You do grow apart, sometimes, before you can grow together." I don't know about you, Arrow fans, but I'm just kind of like, "Huh?" If Oliver and Felicity "love each other very much" and "care about each other," why aren't they together? Or why aren't viewers seeing them trying to attempt to "grow apart" to get back to that point? I get breakups and time apart, but I don't get the neglect of this relationship and the connection between the two in general. Especially from Oliver, who has some serious apologizing to do. Anyway, here's why keeping Olicity apart makes no sense, because I am perplexed. * * *1. They Were Almost Married . . . ... These two superheroes lived together, were engaged, said actual vows to one another multiple times, and literally walked down the aisle. So now they're just ... pals with semi-decent banter? On what Earth does that feel in line with all of Olicity's progress? Why is Oliver still not begging for "his always'" forgiveness? * * *2. The Audience Is Invested In Them . . . ... Fans sat in front of that TV for four whole painstaking seasons watching them transition from head-butting partners to best friends to devoted fiancés. Heck, the reason I even started watching Arrow in the first place is because I heard about this "Olicity" and needed to witness such ~epic romance~ for myself. This kind of progression and build-up is not something that a committed and loyal audience easily forgets. * * *3. Fans Have Been Here Before . . . I get it, honest. The life of the Green Arrow is dangerous. Oliver is a dumb idiot who reverts back to his old self when put in a pickle. That's great. But like, it's Season 5, TPTB. Fans have seen that Oliver can change and was willing to, all with Felicity's help. So why are they rehashing this whole thing all over again? * * *4. Other Love Interests Will Inevitably Fall Short . . . ... He told Felicity she was his "always" and she was also the last thing he thought off before he was pushed off a cliff to what should have been his inevitable death. How does one even begin to compare? They can't. So what's the point? * * *5. Their Chemistry Has Only Intensified This Season . . . ... You can't duplicate this kind of on-screen sizzle and you shouldn't really try to either. Olicity is unique in its deviation from comic canon. Olicity is what works on screen. And this is a TV show I'm talking about here. Unless you're reading the subtitles, then I guess some kind of literature comes into play. But Oliver and Felicity's spark as a couple is what I like most about them anyway. Besides, um, if you know the comic book Oliver Queen, you wouldn't really like him much as a romantic partner for anyone anyway. Edited November 5, 2016 by tv echo 12 Link to comment
statsgirl November 6, 2016 Share November 6, 2016 On 2016-11-03 at 11:57 PM, BunsenBurner said: I am following @slanderent on twitter they are hilarious when they live tweet the show. Their That Arrow Show on you tube is also funny. They bring up a lot of good points. Their That Arrow Show is hysterically funny. Especially Eleven Fifty-Nine, where they added vodka to their orange juice and couldn't stop laughing. Not for anyone who is a fan of Laurel. 3 Link to comment
tv echo November 8, 2016 Share November 8, 2016 (edited) ‘Arrow’ Review: “Human Target” Yvonne November 7, 2016http://www.theworkprint.com/arrow-review-human-target/123 Quote Speaking of Prometheus, his costume (or, ha, identity concealment) isn’t especially terrifying either. I understand the costume department has made all of the costumes have an urban feel, which means muted tones, but Prometheus looks like a mix between The Hood and Ragman. I honestly mixed him and Ragman up several times throughout the episode. Whoops. (Editor’s note: You are not alone.) * * *I made a groundbreaking discovery during this episode. You know when Oliver is out interrogated people to get information? I’m pretty sure the writers of Arrow copy and pasted a scene just like it and changed the words up a bit. I’ve developed a step by step procedure to create an action scene such as this one: “WHERE. [Pause. Mustn’t forget the pause] IS HE?” “I can’t tell you, my boss will kill me!” “Your boss isn’t here. Guess who is!” “Okay, okay! [insert information lil guy gives here] I couldn’t believe that the writers of Arrow would make scenes like these so similar, but there may have been one of these scenes (playing out exactly as above) in literally each episode this season. Either that, or I’m getting massive déjà vu. * * * Let’s talk about that conversation between Olicity. 2 cute. Must date now. Can you feel the tension from here? 10/10. Edited November 8, 2016 by tv echo 2 Link to comment
BunsenBurner November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 ‘Arrow’ Review: “Human Target” Yvonne November 7, 2016http://www.theworkprint.com/arrow-review-human-target/123 Speaking of Prometheus, his costume (or, ha, identity concealment) isn’t especially terrifying either. I understand the costume department has made all of the costumes have an urban feel, which means muted tones, but Prometheus looks like a mix between The Hood and Ragman. I honestly mixed him and Ragman up several times throughout the episode. Whoops. (Editor’s note: You are not alone.) I believe that they are going all in on Arrow to make their bad guys looking somewhat like GA and Flash bad guys looking like the Flash. At least this season. This way they don't have to be original you know cause that's so hard. It's ridiculous. 3 Link to comment
tv echo November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 (edited) This article was linked in one of the fan reply tweets in that Ben Sokolowski twitter discussion (see Social Media thread) - the whole thing is worth reading so I didn't quote anything... Arrow Isn’t Arrow: Our Writers Weigh In Nov. 8, 2016 ALYSSA BARBIERIhttp://fangirlish.com/arrow-isnt-arrow-our-writers-weigh-in/ Edited November 9, 2016 by tv echo 3 Link to comment
BkWurm1 November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 1 hour ago, tv echo said: This article was linked in one of the fan reply tweets in that Ben Sokolowski twitter discussion (see Social Media thread) - the whole thing is worth reading so I didn't quote anything... Arrow Isn’t Arrow: Our Writers Weigh In Nov. 8, 2016 ALYSSA BARBIERIhttp://fangirlish.com/arrow-isnt-arrow-our-writers-weigh-in/ Great article. They are saying what we've been saying all along. This though struck me as new and taps into something I'd been feeling but not able to express. (The question was one thing you'd change about season 5) Quote Lyra: One thing? Really? Fine. If I had to change one thing in Season 5…be ready because it’s not what you’re expecting it to be…I’d bring Donna back. Hell I’d make it that Donna never left and that SmoaknLance were blissfully happy. Then when Season 5 started we would see a Quentin Lance, saddened by his daughters death, but strengthened by Donna’s resilience and love. He wouldn’t fall back into the same habits time in and time again. Instead he would be by Oliver’s side, helping to fix the city, and do whatever he must to stop people like Tobias Church and Prometheus. It’s a mystery why Quentin Lance is relegated to the role of broken man every single season. People like reading about an underdog rising above all the pain in his life. Why can’t we give that to Quentin and start building on it? Why can’t we give that to Donna as well and show that there is love after heartbreak and that you can rebuild your life, no matter how late it is? It feels like Arrow likes shuffling the females around because there is a quota that they are allocated each season. They can’t possibly show a strong woman supporting her daughter, having a loving adult relationship, and trying to start anew in a world where if you wear a mask you matter more. That right there might be my biggest problem to what they’ve done to Donna and Quentin. Throw Felicity and Thea onto this list too. If you don’t wear a mask it doesn’t make you a hero. And Arrow doesn’t have time for telling the stories of those that don’t have a leather fetish in Star City. I've been feeling for a while that Donna was shipped off under a cloud of shame, like the show suddenly was embarrassed by her, like she was the poster child for "Felicity and Friends" Without her character, they gutted Quentin's character growth and they took away our only chance for Felicity's PoV because she might be friends with Curtis, but she's not going to confide the really deep stuff and only Donna would asked the really tough questions. She could be silly, but that's on the writers because she was never JUST silly and if they wanted to do a more serious Donna, they could have and she'd have fit in with the more dour tone of the season just fine. Or keep her off screen. It could have easily been done. Quentin right now is a mess to write because every beat about his relapse is old news and depressing and disappointing and more than that, a 180 from where his character ended the season. Him coming back to Star City because he considers it the right thing to do but struggles to not fall off the wagon would be so much more interesting than Thea propping him up and Quentin failing repeatedly. And if Quentin was doing better, then Thea wouldn't be stuck back in the role of daughter. 10 Link to comment
kismet November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 Cute Cover, still doesn't make me excited for or wanting the crossover. 9 Link to comment
tarotx November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 I love all their smiles :) LOl they chose a tiny Ray to represent Legends :p 8 Link to comment
bijoux November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 1 hour ago, tarotx said: I love all their smiles :) LOl they chose a tiny Ray to represent Legends :p Ha! I wouldn't have noticed him if it wasn't for you. But it's really a great cover regardless, with the feel of a family get together they're trying to promote with these shows. It's like GA with his baby bro and sis. He even has them in a headlock. That's only a step below wedgies on the scale of annoying things to do to your siblings. 9 Link to comment
Thundercatmary November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 1 hour ago, tarotx said: I love all their smiles :) LOl they chose a tiny Ray to represent Legends :p Omg how cute, I didn't even notice lol 1 Link to comment
Starfish35 November 9, 2016 Share November 9, 2016 21 minutes ago, bijoux said: Ha! I wouldn't have noticed him if it wasn't for you. Me either. :) 2 Link to comment
looptab November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 The cover is nice :) However, since I'm turning bitter and I trust no one, I have to wonder if this "pushing" Sara the actors do is genuine or rather "suggested". 1 Link to comment
tv echo November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 (edited) EW reviewer gave 506 a grade of C+... Arrow recap: 'So It Begins' BY SARA NETZLEY November 9 2016 http://www.ew.com/recap/arrow-season-5-episode-6 Quote This week, Oliver and the Arrowlettes are faced with — eh, who cares? DOLPH LUNDGREN IS IN THE HOOOOOOOUUUUUSE! * * * One thing Oliver’s not reluctant to do is sit for an interview with Susan Williams, who brought her cameras this time. Of note in this scene: Thea interrogates Lance about his ongoing sobriety, and Susan encourages Oliver to call her (wink wink). Thea reminds Oliver that Susan can literally ruin his career, but Oliver says he hasn’t done anything yet. Yet? Ye gods, no. * * * Gotta be honest, this scene is ridiculously “There were horses and a man on fire and I killed a guy with a trident” chaotic. It’s a glorified farmers market with tents and tables, and dudes are just shooting guns into the sky, thinking they’re protecting themselves from TSK, who’s out there somewhere. The team evacuates the civilians and stop the good guys with guns. (Oliver does this by shooting an arrow into the muzzle of one of the shooter’s pistols, which is easily the best part of this scene.) * * *And now we come to the second installment of John Diggle, talk therapist. Oliver’s upset about his team’s horrified reaction to the reveal of his murdery past. John tries to make him see their surprise is a sign of how far Oliver’s come. * * * Now to the best part of this week’s episode: Anatoly’s teaching Oliver, who failed high-school chemistry twice, how to build a bomb. He also promises Oliver will learn other useful skills, like metal welding. I love that Bratva doubles as a trade school! Although, not a very good one, since Oliver accidentally detonates his practice bomb in the bar. * * * - Okay, no way is Quentin running around as Prometheus. That’s the least convincing red herring in the history of red herrings.- I’m softening on Billy, but still hate Susan with the fire of a thousand burning “SO IT BEGINS” on warehouse floors, although that’s mostly because of her unethical journalism. - Who’s down to try Rory’s family-recipe schnapps? Strong and a little sweet is just my style. (Insert Oliver Queen jokes here.) - Which arrow was better: parachute arrow, or arrow-in-gun muzzle? Edited November 10, 2016 by tv echo Link to comment
tv echo November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 (edited) A.V. Club reviewer continues to rave ecstatically about this season's episodes (I think the EPs are writing S5 for this guy)... Arrow moves forward even as it remembers its past By Alasdair Wilkins Nov 10, 2016 http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/arrow-moves-forward-even-it-remembers-its-past-245686 Quote Arrow’s resurgence remains one of the great unexpected joys of this television season. A big reason for this season’s success, and certainly a big part of why tonight’s episode works so well, is down to the pacing and the variety of the storytelling. The show is moving swiftly through its plots, as we’ve already dispatched Tobias Church and made Prometheus the new main enemy of Team Arrow, at least for the time being. And while a lot of the story beats here might appear familiar—Oliver is unnecessarily secretive, driving a wedge between him and a teammate—the sheer number of teammates means it’s easy for Arrow to mix things up. While previous weeks have mostly focused on Oliver and Wild Dog’s disagreements, tonight brings Artemis to the forefront, and that swap alone gives the episode something different to set it apart. “So It Begins” doesn’t hit the highest highs of last week’s beautifully directed episode, but no matter: It’s still a fantastic hour of television, with each part of the episode clicking together to show the many battles, past and present, that are in store for Oliver. * * * Everything else about “So It Begins” is just resolutely solid. Thea and Quentin continue to make what should be the most banal political subplots compelling, with the show subtly but definitely casting the two as the surrogate father and daughter figure that each desperately needs. Felicity comes clean to her boyfriend about her relationship with the Green Arrow, which gains only approval. The Russian flashbacks remain massively entertaining, with Dolph Lundgren making his debut as the terrifying Konstantine Kovar and Oliver dusting off his old douche persona in the surface of Bratva. Once more, Arrow isn’t necessarily doing anything revelatory—though it feels like we’re close to that sort of territory with what it’s doing in the Prometheus story—but every storytelling move it makes is logical and well-considered in terms of its characters, and there’s a real sense of forward progress with each episode. Keep it up, Arrow. * * * I appreciate Thea picking up on Oliver very specifically saying he hadn’t done anything with the sexy evil reporter… yet. Edited November 10, 2016 by tv echo Link to comment
way2interested November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 3 minutes ago, tv echo said: Once more, Arrow isn’t necessarily doing anything revelatory—though it feels like we’re close to that sort of territory with what it’s doing in the Prometheus story—but every storytelling move it makes is logical and well-considered in terms of its characters, and there’s a real sense of forward progress with each episode. Weird because this is actually the main problem I've had with the season, that there isn't anything revelatory in all of s5 and that this Prometheus thing won't be any different either from mixes of things we've already seen. Also that all we get is forward progress to no emotional resonance. 4 Link to comment
SmallScreenDiva November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 Should Arrow End After Season 5? Stephen Amell, EP Marc Guggenheim Discuss Maybe it's just me being a negative lately but I got the sense SA really bought into the whole "Felicity & Friends" complaint last season. I mean, there were a ton of things wrong about last season, but given the lack of a decent Felicity story line, lack of Mama Smoak (although that may be more about money than plot) this is what occurred to me. 3 Link to comment
Angel12d November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 (edited) IDK, I'm incredibly negative about things but IMO it came across like he was as frustrated about the second half of the season as the rest of us. And that could cover a number of things tbh. Mainly the shit writing. Edited November 10, 2016 by Angel12d 3 Link to comment
looptab November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 I think everyone is going to interpret that quote according to their own issue with the latter part of the season, and feel their opinion validated. 8 Link to comment
kismet November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 Haven't seen the comment... but I can't imagine it sits well with SA's ego, that people watch the show for a female character or that he might not be their favorite character. I also think he liked Olicity, but not to the point it overshadows him. SA does not seem like a person that likes to come in 2nd or be seen as less. And at the end of s4, they weakened a lot of his character for the sake of the less experienced people on his team. All the sudden OQ was a weaker fighter, not able to lead a team and needing to defer to people with no experience. At least this year they gave him Daddy duties to make him feel bigger. But at the end of the day - if s6 is going to be more of this let's integrate the B team, I would say from my opinion I wish the show would end. I'm not here for some big team effort to save Star City. Sorry, I'm here for OQ/Arrow & OTA because they helped make Arrow who he is - not Team Arrow, the New Class. Frankly, Star City can sink into the ground at this point. I have zero attachment to the mission to save the City. 9 Link to comment
Ophanim November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 Yep on what @kismet said... I think it's all about ego, and boy, SA has it big. JMO 3 Link to comment
apinknightmare November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 I'll preface this by saying that there's a lot to criticize about SA, and his ego is one of them. But...S4 went off the rails - there were a ton of messes and a lot of things that needed to be cleaned up. He mentioned several times that he didn't like the magic, and he didn't like having to set up for spin-offs. I'm sure there were other things he didn't like, and I can't say they're all things I would've complained about because I think he has shit taste when it comes to storylines, but writing them all off as ego is unfair. If he'd petitioned for changes to a show that was perfect, sure. But he petitioned for changes on a show that was a mess. 24 Link to comment
kismet November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 @apinknightmare I didn't say it was all related to his ego. I just think his ego played a part in his opinion. Your other points are valid. The show has been off the rails for awhile now. Anyone can petition for a lot, but the show is caught in a nose dive in my opinion, sure they can changed change the velocity or the trajectory but I think it is still headed for a crash landing without some major improvements. And s5 is not providing any solutions or improving the problems. For example, making OQ a father of a surprise child from his playboy days was actually a good idea. I agree with SA, that I would like to see OQ as a father in small doses. Surprise kid in another city is a perfect way to do that, especially if the Mother is stable & doing a good job. It would help bring some growth to his characters, especially with his parental issues. But the execution from every angle from writing to casting was horrible and brought down the entire season, the show as whole and 2 major characters. So petition for changes doesn't always make a difference. 8 Link to comment
apinknightmare November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 5 minutes ago, kismet said: @apinknightmare I didn't say it was all related to his ego I know you didn't. But @Lidach did, and that's the post I was replying to. :) 1 Link to comment
Ophanim November 10, 2016 Share November 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said: I know you didn't. But @Lidach did, and that's the post I was replying to. :) I agreed with @kismet in all parts, season 4B was a mess, for more reasons which are already discussed here, but maybe I was little critical toward SA. My mistake. It's not all about his ego, but it had a part, for sure. 1 Link to comment
Primal Slayer November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 3 hours ago, SmallScreenDiva said: Should Arrow End After Season 5? Stephen Amell, EP Marc Guggenheim Discuss Maybe it's just me being a negative lately but I got the sense SA really bought into the whole "Felicity & Friends" complaint last season. I mean, there were a ton of things wrong about last season, but given the lack of a decent Felicity story line, lack of Mama Smoak (although that may be more about money than plot) this is what occurred to me. How many times will they rinse and repeat? They werent happy with S3 so S4 was going to get the show back on track, now they arent happy with S4 so S5 is going to get things back on track....geezus. Just get a brand new team bts. 14 Link to comment
Ophanim November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 12 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said: How many times will they rinse and repeat? They werent happy with S3 so S4 was going to get the show back on track, now they arent happy with S4 so S5 is going to get things back on track....geezus. Just get a brand new team bts. Wow, you're right. It never hit me, till now. They are their own enemies. Maybe season 10 is their lucky number :/ Link to comment
SmallScreenDiva November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 30 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said: How many times will they rinse and repeat? They werent happy with S3 so S4 was going to get the show back on track, now they arent happy with S4 so S5 is going to get things back on track....geezus. Just get a brand new team bts. Was chatting about this with friends. Arrow, IMO, needs an infusion of creativity because their stories are tired as hell, IMO. Better writers needed. Less ego, more talent, please. Also, a veteran show runner who knows how to better pace a serialized 23-episode show. But I doubt GB would drop his buddy Marc. So we're stuck. 8 Link to comment
tangerine95 November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) Yeah when I think about it they do always sell the next season as some sort of fix for the previous season lol.I think that's a weird way to go about it, Idk why they feel the need to act like they're reinventing the show every season, I don't think that's necessary tbh. Edited November 11, 2016 by tangerine95 9 Link to comment
statsgirl November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) I think adding WM has helped somewhat with the writing for plot but they really do need some new writers who can bring some new plots. Also to stop idolizing anyone who wears a physical mask (as opposed to an emotional one like Felicity or Quentin). That Arrow Show takes on So It Begins. (they nail the ridiculousness of some of the storylines): Edited November 11, 2016 by statsgirl 4 Link to comment
looptab November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) What's weird to me is Stephen openly expressing his displeasure with the writing. Does he want to keep working, or does he want to end up like Drake Ramoray? Edited November 11, 2016 by looptab 1 Link to comment
dtissagirl November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 What's the funniest part to me is the this-is-my-limit thing that's making me not want to watch is Steve's acting this season. I had a ton of trouble with his acting in 1A present time. I got over it by rewatching S1 in full after it ended, and realizing he stopped with most of the ticks that bugged me in his acting by the end of the season. I took it as actual character development that he stopped doing the weird shit that bugged me. The robot arms, the not looking anyone in the eyes, the never ending passive-aggressive eye-rolling and half-sighing he makes Oliver do whenever any other character has a line that lasts longer than 3 seconds to be delivered. He never fully stopped doing some of these, but he toned them down. Then I was super fine with him as an actor until 423. And now all the ticks are back, and it's making me think that more than anything, he is the one I'm finding unwatchable. 13 Link to comment
looptab November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 Seeing all those things listed here like that just reminds me that if it wasn't for that Moira twist at the end of the pilot I'd never have kept watching, because I found him awful. I'll never not laugh at him not watching people in the eye. OTOH, though, no dorector has told him anything? Does he justifies it as a Oliver thing, like the stiffness? 2 Link to comment
Password November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 It often takes me out of the scene, the not looking people in the eye. Eye contact is very important. 2 Link to comment
dtissagirl November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 The little eye-rollings when someone else's line takes longer than 3 secs bugs me more than the eye-contact avoidance. I can fanwank the lack of eye-contact as a trauma side effect. He doesn't trust people, so he doesn't want them to see his eyes, because our eyes betray our feelings more often than not. But the eye-rolling takes me out of scenes a lot. Is it Oliver or it is Steve who's impatient/dismissive as fuck? I can't tell a lot of times. 2 Link to comment
tv echo November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 Prometheus ties it all back to Season 1 in latest episode of Arrow Trent Moore Wed, Nov 09, 2016 11:38pmhttp://www.blastr.com/2016-11-9/prometheus-ties-it-all-back-season-1-latest-episode-arrow Quote Balancing all the new members of Team Arrow has been a tough tightrope to walk, but “So It Begins” did an excellent job of fitting everyone in without bogging the story down. Bringing Diggle back really seems to have been a stabilizing factor in the overall dynamic, and hopefully the show will remain this seamless in the future. It’s relegated to a B-plot, but we get to see the new recruits dealing with some jealousy when Oliver starts keeping secrets and using Diggle and Felicity as an inner circle to handle the Prometheus situation. Sure, it makes sense they’re his go-to group, but he went to the trouble of recruiting and training a new team — just use them. Seeing the team stand up to Oliver was solid growth, and the growing pains for Team Arrow are finally starting to fade. The newbies were also (understandably) not psyched about the fact Oliver used to kill people. It was another callback to Season 1, and that’s a story that’s been mined a lot over five years, so it was actually kind of nice to see that one largely breeze by. * * * A popular fan theory is that Prometheus could turn out to be the long-lost Tommy Merlyn, and considering how they’re planting seeds to connect back to Season 1, that would be an excellent twist (how they’d do that, story-wise, is TBD obviously). But for now, we’re thinking Lance is just a fake out. * * * Felicity’s cop boyfriend now knows she works for the Green Arrow, and he takes it … really well. This guy still doesn’t exactly pass the smell test, but we’re curious to see where it goes next. 1 Link to comment
tv echo November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 Arrow 4.6 Review – “So it Begins” November 9, 2016 | Posted by Michael Haigishttp://411mania.com/movies/arrow-1-6-review-so-it-begins/ Quote The episode was hamstrung by many of the same issues that plague Arrow in general: the shows reliance on contained, weekly stories that feel shallow and insignificant because of their brevity; the fleeting character conflicts that feel no more substantial. Tonight, internal crisis met Artemis, who went from having serious reservations about following Oliver to apologizing for being a jerk in a mere half hour of screen time, and after exactly no new information was introduced. * * * “So it Begins” was an uptick from last week. That episode was the end of the beginning; it was odd, uneven, and ineffectual. Tonight, the beginning of phase two, presented a show with more momentum. Even if some of Arrow’s worst qualities were on display, the inevitable clash between Oliver and Prometheus is compelling enough to provide some real entertainment, for now. 3 Link to comment
tv echo November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 Arrow 5×06 Review: The Flaw in Reinventing the Past November 10, 2016 ALYSSA BARBIERIhttp://fangirlish.com/arrow-5x06-review-flaw-reinventing-past/ Quote This season is basically a reinvention of season one. And why? It makes no sense. There have been four years of character evolution for all of the remaining characters that have been there since season one. Recreating season one doesn’t make sense. It doesn’t work. So why is Arrow trying so hard to make it happen? * * * Here’s the sad thing, I don’t feel that emotional connection to Arrow that I’ve felt since I first started watching the show four years ago. It’s the reason that Arrow has always been my favorite of the superhero shows. It was so much more than the superhero that bore the show’s title. Arrow was about the characters — Oliver Queen and those important in his journey so much that they became worthy of journeys of their own. * * *There was a moment in this episode that depicted what Arrow’s fifth season has come down to: comic book opportunities. This new team was assembled on top of a roof looking down, all perfectly lined up and posing like on the cover of a comic book. It suddenly dawned on me: creating comic book moments like this is more important than the actual story. The focus isn’t on the story, as this season has proved. It’s about generating as many costumed heroes as humanly possible so every week they can create one of these moments to please the comic fanboys. * * *Arrow used to be a show where the writers let the characters drive the plot. Now it’s become a show where the plot drives the characters and even takes them in a direction where they’re out of character.... * * * Ew. Just hearing Oliver say those words “not yet” makes me cringe. It’s so uncharacteristic of Oliver and even Thea and Quentin were nauseous. We know that Oliver is going to sleep with the reporter and the other women that come on this show. Remember, Arrow is rewriting season one in season five, which means manwhore Oliver is returning. But it won’t ease the blow of the inevitable sewage that will be that sex scene and the regression of a character who has come a long way in four years. 7 Link to comment
tv echo November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) Arrow Review: Here’s Something New … Ollie Likes His Secrets BY CRAIG WACK · NOVEMBER 10, 2016http://oohlo.com/2016/11/10/arrow-review-heres-something-new-ollie-likes-his-secrets/ Quote Another day on Arrow, another situation where Oliver Queen keeps secrets from people he should trust, and the people he does trust seemingly betray him. Oliver’s love of secrets feels like it’s been hammered home six times this season; the main reason this time is to give Artemis the kind of solo spotlight that’s previously been shined on new team members, Wild Dog and Ragman. * * * But, for a guy who has a knack for giving out his secret identity like Halloween candy and whose secret lair has an open door policy, it feels like the show is going out of its way to use secrets as a way to create dramatic tension. * * * This feels like a total misdirection play, if only because the entire episode established the elaborate lengths Prometheus went to mess with Ollie, and that Quentin has never seemed smart or sober enough to spell his own name correctly, much less go on some sort of anagram-related killing spree. Edited November 11, 2016 by tv echo 1 Link to comment
tv echo November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) Arrow Review: So It Begins (Season 5 Episode 6) November 10, 2016 Lissete Lanuza Sáenzhttp://telltaletv.com/2016/11/arrow-review-so-it-begins-season-5-episode-6/ Quote There’s so much wrong with Arrow Season 5 Episode 6, “So It Begins,” that I don’t even know where to begin – pun not intended. I could focus on the total and complete annihilation of Felicity Smoak, my favorite character – and a role model for little girls everywhere. I could probably write an essay about how this woman used to be one of the best developed female characters on TV (wait, I have!) and yet that Felicity is nowhere to be found these days. Now she’s been reduced to batting her eyelashes at her boyfriend to get information out of him, making puns and looking pretty in dresses while spouting some marginally useful information. I could focus on the fact that they relegated Diggle to the wise black-friend-who-can-get-our-titular-hero-to-see-the-light role, when he used to be a three-dimensional character with his own struggles, and a distinct personality. I could focus on the fact that they expect me to care for the team of little brats that Oliver and Felicity recruited, even though they have given me no actual reason to. They’ve just told me I should. * * * Or, I could focus on the fact that, five seasons in, they suddenly want to make Quentin Lance the bad guy. Not just any character, no, but straight as an arrow Quentin Lance. You know the one who couldn’t stand vigilantes because the end did not justify the means in his mind. * * * Maybe Donna isn’t even alive. Maybe instead of breaking up with her he killed her, cut her up in pieces Hannibal style and ate her. * * *Of course, I could also focus on Oliver Queen, our so called hero. And I use that term loosely, because, despite Diggle’s pep-talk about how much he’s changed, all I see is the man from season 1 – or even the man from the conveniently placed flashbacks. * * * I don’t know what this show is – but I’m about ready to stop calling it Arrow. In my mind, Arrow, the show I loved, ended about a season ago, in the loft, with Oliver admitting to Barry that he was happy. Back when I still loved these characters. Edited November 11, 2016 by tv echo 5 Link to comment
tv echo November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 'Arrow': 5 Lessons Olicity Taught Us About Relationships Kartik Chainani November 09, 2016http://www.buddytv.com/articles/arrow/arrow-5-lessons-olicity-taught-62006.aspx 1. Supporting Each Other Isn't Always Easy 2. Finding Time for Romance Is Difficult 3. Sometimes You Have to Call Each Other's BS Out 4. Try to Always Give Your Partner the Benefit of the Doubt 5. It's Important to Be Vulnerable Around Each Other 2 Link to comment
looptab November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 I usually find the telltale's reviews fun to read - even if I don't always agree with everything, I can appreciate the snark. But, boy, that seems a bit fatalistic. So, I wanted to ask you guys, what are your issues wrt how Felicity is written this season? Not Olicity, Felicity specifically. Aside from the sneeze and you miss it Havenrock thing. Honest question :) Link to comment
tangerine95 November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) Havenrock being so rushed is my biggest issue tbh.I like how it was solved but I feel like her guilt should have been shown actually affecting her life for a few episodes at least before they did the whole resolution with Rory. Also the bf isn't really about her imo and is more about giving Oliver a reason to date as well and probably for plot related reasons. We haven't really gotten a reason why or how she suddenly wants to give this guy a real chance and I think there were ways they could have explained the bf that actually make sense but they're not bothering to do that. But imo that's not an issue that's just about Felicity, most characters and even Oliver a lot of the time are written to suit the plot and the writers don't really care to show us character motivations. I dislike them not adressing why she doesn't have a job.I think it makes sense that she would focus on team arrow stuff and not be ready to try to take back PT or start her own company but I think they should like spare a scene to explain that instead of ignoring it.I know it's an issue of not having the PT sets anymore but they can easy turn her lack of job into a character choice with basically one scene. I don't agree that they're regressing her back to a strictly comic relief role tho tbh. I like her role on the team as basically co leader with Oliver to the newbies and I don't think her relevance on the team has been reduced from previous seasons. Edited November 11, 2016 by tangerine95 7 Link to comment
doesntworkonwood November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 For me, my biggest issue is that they're not writing for her, but writing around her. On paper Havenrock and DTH look like stories about Felicity, but in practice they haven't been. Havenrock lasted all of two episodes and maybe 5? short scenes. She literally watched a bomb being dropped on a city, and in the circumstances it would make sense that she would internalise that to a significant degree. Honestly two episodes is not nearly enough time to deal with that, and the fact that the writers seem to think they have is ridiculous. The thing about DTH is that he himself is nothing but a plot contrivance, which means during a lot of Felicity's scenes with him she becomes that too. The scenes are nothing actually to do with her, and that's evident by the fact that we don't know Felicity's actual feelings on DTH besides that she doesn't know if he's 'real'. The story line is far more about how Felicity has moved on and therefore Oliver can too than anything actually strictly relevant to Felicity. If it was about her we'd know how a) she feels about DTH, b) how she met him, c) why she chose to be in a (at least on his side) serious relationship with him and d) if she's actually happy with him. Obviously there's a lot more and I admit that with my biases it would be difficult for me to like DTHs anyway, but the fact that this is all certainly a plot point and hasn't forwarded the story line and character development of Felicity (or even taught us anything new about her) shows that the story isn't about Felicity at all. It's a bit early to judge maybe, but these and the bunker seems to be her only story lines. I admit that I have liked her scenes so far in the bunker, and I think most of them have been in character and interesting. I'll also admit that I always enjoy Felicity in the bunker as it reads to me as 'her place' (not in a put her in her place kind of way, but in a this is her home and her is where she runs the show way). However, her bunker story isn't actually a story. She's just there as that's part of the narrative of the show. This isn't actually a story line at all. 11 Link to comment
SmallScreenDiva November 11, 2016 Share November 11, 2016 (edited) Folks, discussion about Felicity might be better suited in the character thread. Edited November 11, 2016 by SmallScreenDiva 3 Link to comment
tv echo November 12, 2016 Share November 12, 2016 (edited) Agents of GEEK Podcast Episode 50 Craig Wack & Tatiana Torres 11/11/2016http://agentsofgeekpodcast.com/wordpress/ -- Craig said that this was another episode of Oliver not trusting his team, which Craig found very frustrating. Tatiana liked this episode and noted that Oliver was trusting Felicity and Diggle, and that Diggle also didn't trust the new kids. Tatiana also liked that Felicity was trying to keep the entire team "cohesive together." Craig said that it's time for Oliver to start trusting his team. -- Tatiana liked that they fleshed out Evelyn's character a little more, but she was confused about the ending with Quentin. Craig said that it was supposed to make you think that Quentin is Prometheus. Tatiana: "There's no way." -- They noted that when Felicity told Billy about working with the GA, instead of getting angry, Billy just got "aroused" and became like this GA "fanboy." Tatiana: "Do you want a date with him? Calm down!" Craig said that "that went in a weird, romantic direction in a hurry." He wondered why they made EBR "arch her back and twist her hip" like that, saying that that "must have been the most uncomfortable kiss in the history of television." Tatiana said that it was just a "sign" that they shouldn't be together because it was "awful." Craig said that it will just lead to "terrible back problems" for Felicity if she continues dating Billy. -- Craig said that Oliver is "just a terrible leader." Right now, Oliver is just seeing the new recruits as "pawns." Craig noted that there are "two certified geniuses" among the new recruits: Curtis and Evelyn (who last season took Cisco's Canary Cry device and "souped it up in about an hour"). So he should have Evelyn make some tech and help out Felicity on the investigation side. Tatiana said that Oliver is bad at delegating. Craig said that Oliver sees all the new recruits like Wild Dog. Rory is "legitimately superpowered so you don't have to worry about him." But Curtis and Wild Dog need some tech to help them out in the field. -- They both liked the episode overall though. Edited November 12, 2016 by tv echo 5 Link to comment
tv echo November 12, 2016 Share November 12, 2016 (edited) Allison Brennan and Lavinia Kent analyze 'Arrow' episode 'So It Begins': Who is Prometheus? By: Allison Brennan and Lavinia Kent | November 11, 2016 5:08 pmhttp://happyeverafter.usatoday.com/2016/11/11/allison-brennan-lavinia-kent-recap-arrow-so-it-begins/ Quote AB: Felicity once again used her relationship with Detective Malone to get evidence to help Team Arrow learn more about their nemesis, Prometheus. In fact, instead of just lying or manipulating Malone, she steals evidence off his desk — major crime. She ends up admitting it (because, well, Felicity is not a very good liar) and tells Malone that she works for the Green Arrow. At first he’s stunned, then he’s OK with it (after all, Arrow IS working with the police Anti-Crime Initiative, of which he is part). I thought when I saw this about your observation, Lavinia, that Malone is only in episodes that Prometheus is in. It seems to be too obvious … and I don’t think Arrow is that obvious. Also, Malone is a little scrawny and Prometheus seems much taller. Bulk? Yes, a costume can add bulk, but height? Five-inch elevator shoes? Don’t know about that … yet Prometheus is almost always viewed from a height or by someone really short (like Evelyn on the train). So maybe I’m just being sucked in by the way they film. LK: I have such mixed thoughts about this. I see all the signals that Malone is Prometheus and when I rewatched the scene of Felicity revealing the truth, I could definitely see that his reactions might make sense. First, shock and horror — “You are a criminal” — and then his slowly realizing that he can turn it to his advantage — “where does he live?” On the other hand, it could certainly be a red herring. I have to confess that I like Detective Malone and don’t want him to be the Big Bad — even if it would make for a fun season. * * * Also, Lance is a drunk and self-destructive. He’s still grieving over Laurel’s death. He may still deep-down blame Oliver, but I think he’s gotten past that over the last couple of seasons. I don’t see him harboring the deep hatred and then pretending to like and work with him. He’s not that sneaky. He’s never held back his emotions about anything — why now? Plus — when did he learn to shoot arrows so well? Not a skill that can be picked up overnight. And then there’s the issue of Prometheus being someone Oliver “accidentally” created. So no, it’s not Lance. Unless, of course, that split personality … Edited November 12, 2016 by tv echo Link to comment
looptab November 12, 2016 Share November 12, 2016 15 minutes ago, tv echo said: when did he learn to shoot arrows so well? Not a skill that can be picked up overnight. If Arrow taught us anything is that, indeed, it is. Everyone's an archer! Link to comment
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