19 Things I Hate About You: How the Duggars Infuriate

[GEML]

Even more than shame and fear in a typical religious household, they also have the television/income card to hold over their children. I grew up in a world where expectations in public were wildly out of sync with reality, but I never had anyone who said to me, "if you screw this up, you will be taking food and opportunities like you had from your younger sisters and brothers." And the older children, knowing how difficult those early years were before TLC became part of their lives have likely a sired this as a very genuine threat.

That, more than anything, I believe, keeps them in line.

[Wellfleet]

Even more than shame and fear in a typical religious household, they also have the television/income card to hold over their children. I grew up in a world where expectations in public were wildly out of sync with reality, but I never had anyone who said to me, "if you screw this up, you will be taking food and opportunities like you had from your younger sisters and brothers." And the older children, knowing how difficult those early years were before TLC became part of their lives have likely a sired this as a very genuine threat.

That, more than anything, I believe, keeps them in line.

 

I have no doubts that Boob would use this card, among others, to hold sway over certain kids who might get out of line. But eventually it's going to dawn on someone - Josiah maybe? Jana? that Boob is a millionaire, that they managed before TLC $$ came along and that they can manage again. Together or separately. There are just too many of them that they'll all remain like-thinking automatons forever. It's just a matter of time before Boob gets toppled and IMO, it'll happen sooner than later if he's threatening the kids behind the scenes. Even just one of them.

Edited March 29, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Jamiesmum]

The Benessa proposal episode has just been shown in Australia. The only part of the whole sideshow I liked was the glass chapel. But one thing I did really notice is that Jessa and Ben were free with declarations of love before they were engaged. And if I remember correctly, so were Jill and Derick. I had noticed this before but not quite so in my face as when JB made a big deal of Benessa holding hands for grace at the dinner with Ben's parents because they weren't engaged yet (even though the big clod had asked everyone to hold hands). But they have previously said I love you a number of times before.

They talk about keeping your heart and not giving pieces of it away, no holding hands, side hugs and no kissing. And God forbid, never being alone together. But a declaration of love is normal? Or do words not matter as much as physical contact? This is where I get totally annoyed at their whole courtship/ relationship process. To me it is totally backwards. Holding hands, sitting close, proper hugs, getting comfortable with the other person physically come before the I love yous. They always look so awkward physically because they are going against normal instincts.

[3girlsforus]

I just watched the wedding special last night that showed Jill's wedding. I was so annoyed that Jim Bob was at the ceremony and was the one to let Derrick know he could kiss Jill. Does he really need to dictate everything? I mean they were married at that point, couldn't he butt out?

At what point does that level of involvement end?

Also! And this is completely shallow, but if the girls are allowed to wear makeup to show their countenance, why can't they go to a dermatologist? I feel bad for them, acne sucks.

That part stuck with me when I saw it. It gave me chills it's just gross and inappropriate.

[Barb23]

Boob and MEchelle are so sex obsessed, I'm surprised they haven't done premarital genital inspections and provided a step-by-step guide to the "kids'" first sexual experiences.  Heck, I can see Boob and MEchelle sitting in the corner of the bedroom, directing the action.  Boob:  Okay Derrick, you can enter Jill now.

And remember how over-the-top ecstatic Boob was that his Jilly got pregnant so fast? (Once he figured out it was a honeymoon baby.) He told MEchelle something like "Oh they must have figured things out" yuk, yuk.

[Janet Snakehole]

Really, they have more in common with Kris Jenner and the Kardashians than they would like to think.

[3girlsforus]

You know what struck me when I was watching that clip... I have a friend who is as permissive with her child as the Duggars are restrictive. She views smoking pot with her kid as a bonding experience. She bought him condoms for his first date (at 13). Told him school was oppressive. Said getting a job wasn't necessary (they are both on welfare) etc. But the funny thing is she reminds me of JimBob. Both are wildly inappropriate and immature in their relationship with their children. Both make parenting decisions based on some bizarre philosophical idea rather than common sense and a desire to raise independent adults. Both are producing stunted human beings ill equipped to deal with the world. I bet both my friend and JimBob would be appalled that there are similarities between the two :-)

[dillpickles]

Really, they have more in common with Kris Jenner and the Kardashians than they would like to think.

Even the Kardashians are better than them, at least the girls can choose how they wanna whore themselves out for fame!

[andromeda331]

They talk about keeping your heart and not giving pieces of it away, no holding hands, side hugs and no kissing. And God forbid, never being alone together. But a declaration of love is normal? Or do words not matter as much as physical contact? This is where I get totally annoyed at their whole courtship/ relationship process. To me it is totally backwards. Holding hands, sitting close, proper hugs, getting comfortable with the other person physically come before the I love yous.

 

 

I completely agree. Saying I love you is bigger deal then hugs and holding hands. JimBob and Michelle did nothing to protect their daughters 'hearts', if anything they did everything they could to make sure if things went wrong they would get a bigger heartbreak then a normal. Flying Jill to Nepal the way she acted during the whole courtship, there's no way she wouldn't have been devastated if it didn't work out well. They moved Ben in with them because the relationship wasn't moving fast enough for the parents. 

[Wellfleet]

The thing that annoys me most about the duggars is the little experiences the kids are missing out on. Like, I get wanting "to protect the hearts of your children",but you just can't do that all the time. Your kids aren't going to be able to grow without a little heartbreak.

It feels like all the Duggar kids are just pre-approved versions of the people they should be. They'll never be in tune with themselves, and in turn, they'll never be truly happy.

 

Psychologists tell us you must be able to feel anger in order to feel love. It's my personal belief that you have to experience sadness to truly appreciate being happy as well. The Duggars are trying to eliminate all the negatives of Life for their kids, not realizing that they're also removing the point of reference for Happiness. Without experiencing heartbreak, loss, sadness - hell, even being chosen last for a basketball game - you can never really appreciate joy and that feeling of lightness that always comes with real happiness. If Boob gets his way, these kids are going to lead, for all intents and purposes, sad uneventful lives [whether they have a dozen kids or none at all]. And when real sadness and loss comes their way, they're not going to have any idea how to cope.

Edited March 29, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Barb23]

I was watching the older episodes this morning. Even tho MEchelle had the baby voice, she didn't have the wide bug eyes & she didn't talk all chopped up.

It drives me nuts when she says "Brother" or "Sister" when she talks to the children. "Tell Brother you want the ball." First I thought it was laziness or she forgot a kid's name. But one time she said Brother to Jenny then said Jackson in the same sentence. Maybe she thinks she has two extra kids named Brother & Sister.

I also can't stand when MEchelle says the baby version of their names in talking with the kids. "Jin-Jin" is going to take you to Jill's." Same episode she referenced Joy-Joy. Would someone remind her that her youngest child is 5 & she doesn't need to talk that way anymore? She is really stuck in a baby time warp. (Her babies, not grandchildren babies.)

[AmyFarrahFowler]

I can remember all of her kids names and I'm a heavy cannabis user. What's Nutchelle's excuse?

[GEML]

It's probably somewhat cultural. We refer to our children as "brother" and "sister" even though we only have one of each. My son will even say to his sister, "Throw brother the ball." Not sure if it's Southern or Appalachian or where I picked it up, because I grew up in an all girl household so it wasn't as obvious. But I know my parents used it in their households growing up, so old habits die hard, I guess!

[3girlsforus]

Psychologists tell us you must be able to feel anger in order to feel love. It's my personal belief that you have to experience sadness to truly appreciate being happy as well. The Duggars are trying to eliminate all the negatives of Life for their kids, not realizing that they're also removing the point of reference for Happiness. Without experiencing heartbreak, loss, sadness - hell, even being chosen last for a basketball game - you can never really appreciate joy and that feeling of lightness that always comes with real happiness. If Boob gets his way, these kids are going to lead, for all intents and purposes, sad uneventful lives [whether they have a dozen kids or none at all]. And when real sadness and loss comes their way, they're not going to have any idea how to cope.

 

Just like in Finding Nemo when the Dad fish says he wants to make sure nothing ever happens to Nemo and Dori responds 'well you can't have 'nothing' ever happen or nothing will ever happen'. Of course Marvin was seriously overprotective because of having lost his other children and wife. JimBob is just a control freak.

Edited March 30, 2015 by 3girlsforus

[Portia]

I was watching the older episodes this morning. Even tho MEchelle had the baby voice, she didn't have the wide bug eyes & she didn't talk all chopped up.

It drives me nuts when she says "Brother" or "Sister" when she talks to the children. "Tell Brother you want the ball." First I thought it was laziness or she forgot a kid's name. But one time she said Brother to Jenny then said Jackson in the same sentence. Maybe she thinks she has two extra kids named Brother & Sister.

I also can't stand when MEchelle says the baby version of their names in talking with the kids. "Jin-Jin" is going to take you to Jill's." Same episode she referenced Joy-Joy. Would someone remind her that her youngest child is 5 & she doesn't need to talk that way anymore? She is really stuck in a baby time warp. (Her babies, not grandchildren babies.)

Jeez, I'd annoy the stew out of you, then. I've always had 10,000 nicknames for each of my kids, including "Brother" (and its variants "Bubba" and "Bubby" for my son), and this habit has abated only a little as they've entered adulthood. For me it has nothing to do with baby talk . . . ask anyone, I NEVER use baby-talk with small children. (My kids brag that they developed their big vocabularies and strong communication skills because I never talked down to them.) To me, nicknames and diminutives are just a way of showing affection. I'm 50 and love it when my siblings call me by my childhood nickname. I adore relating to my children as fellow adults, but I won't refrain from calling them cutesy names from time to time unless they indicate that they don't like it anymore!

 

I'm definitely with you on hating MEchelle's sing-songy voice, though. There's an annoying young woman at my church who talks like that, and she doesn't even have children. She teaches college, and I hope for her students' sake that she shifts into "teacher voice" when lecturing.

[AmyFarrahFowler]

Jeez, I'd annoy the stew out of you, then. I've always had 10,000 nicknames for each of my kids, including "Brother" (and its variants "Bubba" and "Bubby" for my son), and this habit has abated only a little as they've entered adulthood. For me it has nothing to do with baby talk . . . ask anyone, I NEVER use baby-talk with small children. (My kids brag that they developed their big vocabularies and strong communication skills because I never talked down to them.) To me, nicknames and diminutives are just a way of showing affection. I'm 50 and love it when my siblings call me by my childhood nickname. I adore relating to my children as fellow adults, but I won't refrain from calling them cutesy names from time to time unless they indicate that they don't like it anymore!

 

I'm definitely with you on hating MEchelle's sing-songy voice, though. There's an annoying young woman at my church who talks like that, and she doesn't even have children. She teaches college, and I hope for her students' sake that she shifts into "teacher voice" when lecturing.

I had a boss that spoke like that. Everything ended as though she was asking a question. Her voice would lift at the end of her sentences. Blech.

[GEML]

I don't know why anyone would think the Duggar children haven't experienced anger or sadness or fear or love or happiness. They may be unable to share these things openly in their environment in a healthy way, but I think it's pretty clear that they still feel them.

[Wellfleet]

I don't know why anyone would think the Duggar children haven't experienced anger or sadness or fear or love or happiness. They may be unable to share these things openly in their environment in a healthy way, but I think it's pretty clear that they still feel them.

 

Yes, they have certainly experienced them. But as you said, they can't share them openly and what's even worse, they're taught they're wrong or bad if they feel anything but sweetness and happiness. 

[Jellybeans]

Re: the dry humping/golf course date, at least Jessa and Jill have seen it's ok to try other sex positions.

[RazzleberryPie]

Something that gets on my nerves, Michelle's whole, "And I delivered EVERY ONE." Well no $h!t, Sherlock, how else did they enter this world? Whether by vaginal delivery or a c-section, those babies weren't beamed out with a Star Trek transporter.

[Wellfleet]

Something that gets on my nerves, Michelle's whole, "And I delivered EVERY ONE." Well no $h!t, Sherlock, how else did they enter this world? Whether by vaginal delivery or a c-section, those babies weren't beamed out with a Star Trek transporter.

 

I think the "I delivered every one of them..." line is a dig on Me-chelle's part to all the large families out there who include adopted children. I get the definite feeling she feels quite a bit superior being the biological mother of so many. In her mind, you're not REALLY a mother if you didn't actual birth the child. Too bad she doesn't get it that being a mother is only 1% about giving birth and 99% about loving, raising and educating a child.

[3girlsforus]

I think the "I delivered every one of them..." line is a dig on Me-chelle's part to all the large families out there who include adopted children. I get the definite feeling she feels quite a bit superior being the biological mother of so many. In her mind, you're not REALLY a mother if you didn't actual birth the child. Too bad she doesn't get it that being a mother is only 1% about giving birth and 99% about loving, raising and educating a child.

 

Interesting... I take that comment as a response to all those people who ask parents of big families 'are they all yours'. I have several friends who have 7 or more kids and their biggest pet peeve is being asked if they are really theirs so I assumed that's what Michelle meant. But you could be right. They are really anti-adoption.

[RazzleberryPie]

I think the "I delivered every one of them..." line is a dig on Me-chelle's part to all the large families out there who include adopted children. I get the definite feeling she feels quite a bit superior being the biological mother of so many. In her mind, you're not REALLY a mother if you didn't actual birth the child. Too bad she doesn't get it that being a mother is only 1% about giving birth and 99% about loving, raising and educating a child.

As appalling as it sounds, I think you're onto something there. No, wait, I think you're 100% on the money. When they made it their sole goal in life to breed as many as possible, Michelle's only use for babies over 6 months old was to do the cooking, cleaning, childrearing and also posing for pictures.

[Muffyn]

MEchelle parted like the Red Sea and a new life burst forth from her womb.  Oh those horrible people who open their hearts and homes to children in need.  What are they thinking?  You would almost think that Christ talked of love and caring rather than simply procreating.  

[Barb23]

Jeez, I'd annoy the stew out of you, then. I've always had 10,000 nicknames for each of my kids, including "Brother" (and its variants "Bubba" and "Bubby" for my son), and this habit has abated only a little as they've entered adulthood. For me it has nothing to do with baby talk . . . ask anyone, I NEVER use baby-talk with small children. (My kids brag that they developed their big vocabularies and strong communication skills because I never talked down to them.) To me, nicknames and diminutives are just a way of showing affection. I'm 50 and love it when my siblings call me by my childhood nickname. I adore relating to my children as fellow adults, but I won't refrain from calling them cutesy names from time to time unless they indicate that they don't like it anymore!

I'm definitely with you on hating MEchelle's sing-songy voice, though. There's an annoying young woman at my church who talks like that, and she doesn't even have children. She teaches college, and I hope for her students' sake that she shifts into "teacher voice" when lecturing.

No you wouldn't annoy me. I didn't realize Brother & Sister were used as nicknames & they are a cultural thing. Only time I have heard them used in that way is when MEchelle says them.. I understand completely about nicknames & what they mean to a family. My brother-in-law's nickname is Bubba and my husband's aunt is called Sis by the family, because their younger sibling couldn't pronounce her real name correctly. My son, nieces & nephews refer to her affectionately as Aunt Sis. When someone actually calls her by her real name it sounds weird. I also like it when my mom refers to me in the name I was called when I was 5 years old which is the name I wanted my name to be, not my real name.

It's just MEchelle in her baby voice calling Jinger "Jin Jin" that strikes me weird because she directs it to the younger kids, I've never heard anyone else in the family call Jinger "Jin Jin". Same goes for Joy Joy.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Barb23

[Barb23]

I think the "I delivered every one of them..." line is a dig on Me-chelle's part to all the large families out there who include adopted children. I get the definite feeling she feels quite a bit superior being the biological mother of so many. In her mind, you're not REALLY a mother if you didn't actual birth the child. Too bad she doesn't get it that being a mother is only 1% about giving birth and 99% about loving, raising and educating a child.

Definitely agree. Remember the large family that stayed with them who had adopted & special needs children? Boob made sure we knew that when introducing them.

[RazzleberryPie]

MEchelle parted like the Red Sea and a new life burst forth from her womb.  Oh those horrible people who open their hearts and homes to children in need.  What are they thinking?  You would almost think that Christ talked of love and caring rather than simply procreating.  

You'd even think one of his commands was to take care of widows and orphans.........(James 1:27)

[Wellfleet]

No you wouldn't annoy me. I didn't realize Brother & Sister were used as nicknames & they are a cultural thing. Only time I have heard them used in that way is when MEchelle says them.. I understand completely about nicknames & what they mean to a family. My brother-in-law's nickname is Bubba and my husband's aunt is called Sis by the family, because their younger sibling couldn't pronounce her real name correctly. My son, nieces & nephews refer to her affectionately as Aunt Sis. When someone actually calls her by her real name it sounds weird. I also like it when my mom refers to me in the name I was called when I was 5 years old which is the name I wanted my name to be, not my real name.

It's just MEchelle in her baby voice calling Jinger "Jin Jin" that strikes me weird because she directs it to the younger kids, I've never heard anyone else in the family call Jinger "Jin Jin". Same goes for Joy Joy.

 

I'll bet this is Me-chelle's way of looking closer to her kids than she really is, especially the little ones. Using these baby nicknames make her look all cuddly and warm. 

[Gemma Violet]

OMG.  I've been hearing about JimBob's dry-humping in the golf video but I hadn't seen it.  I wondered if it was as bad as was described.  I just saw it--I see it's on the previous page--and Ewwwwww....I can't believe a grown man would do that in public, much less in front of his daughter.  

Edited March 31, 2015 by Gemma Violet

[Wellfleet]

OMG.  I've been hearing about JimBob's dry-humping in the golf video but I hadn't seen it.  I wondered if it was as bad as was described.  I just saw it--I see it's on the previous page--and Ewwwwww....I can't believe a grown man would do that in public, much less in front of his daughter.  

 

It's that bad. I never saw it when originally aired - but had obviously seen tons of comments here about it, and I never really believed it could be as bad as people said. I stand corrected - it was. How absolutely incredible that two people who yammer so everlastingly about modesty and morals could be seen - IN PUBLIC and in front of their own children - doing that.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Literata]

OMG. I've been hearing about JimBob's dry-humping in the golf video but I hadn't seen it. I wondered if it was as bad as was described. I just saw it--I see it's on the previous page--and Ewwwwww....I can't believe a grown man would do that in public, much less in front of his daughter.

Holy crap. I hadn't seen it either. How ironic that a clip of a "pure and wholesome" Duggar show should probably carry an NC-17 rating.

[Apple Clark]

I've considered Googling the dry humping clip, but I seriously can't bring myself to do it. SO MUCH DISGUSTINGNESS.

[cmr2014]

 

It's just MEchelle in her baby voice calling Jinger "Jin Jin" that strikes me weird because she directs it to the younger kids, I've never heard anyone else in the family call Jinger "Jin Jin". Same goes for Joy Joy.

 

I think that she uses these names to show us how loving she is and how bonded she is with her children -- and it has the opposite affect. I really think that she doesn't know (or care) what nicknames her children use for themselves. Maybe she called Jinger "Jin Jin" when she actually cared about her -- when she was under 6 months old -- but no one else seems to use that name.

 

She really is an awful mother. I know that there are a lot of styles of parenting, but she manages to be both overbearing and completely hands-off at the same time. She is completely uninterested and uninvolved in their activities, but prevents them from exploring and learning on their own. She is lazy and self-absorbed, but her eldest daughters are expected to slave away all day caring for her house and her children and to maintain a "servant's heart" at all times. 

[Wellfleet]

I think that she uses these names to show us how loving she is and how bonded she is with her children -- and it has the opposite affect. I really think that she doesn't know (or care) what nicknames her children use for themselves. Maybe she called Jinger "Jin Jin" when she actually cared about her -- when she was under 6 months old -- but no one else seems to use that name.

 

She really is an awful mother. I know that there are a lot of styles of parenting, but she manages to be both overbearing and completely hands-off at the same time. She is completely uninterested and uninvolved in their activities, but prevents them from exploring and learning on their own. She is lazy and self-absorbed, but her eldest daughters are expected to slave away all day caring for her house and her children and to maintain a "servant's heart" at all times. 

 

Great observation, and very true. That Me-chelle is both overbearing and hands-off at the same time. Pretty tricky - the rest of us would really have to work at that but it seems to come pretty naturally to her.

[Barb23]

Since TLC ends up mysteriously deleting scenes that the public finds offensive, is the dry humping part still in the episode reruns? Whoever is brave enough to watch again, please advise & thank you for taking one for the team.

[Jamiesmum]

Another thing that annoyed/intrigued/puzzled me in the Benessa engagement sideshow was Jessa's reluctance to go up to people who were expecting her and ask them for the red rose. (She had to collect 12 to get the next "clue"). As Jessa seems to have a bit more spirit that some of the others, I was truly surprised by this.

But then today I was reading some older blog entries from "Heresy in the Heartland" and came across one from over 2 years ago about socialisation. And then it really hit me. Jessa did not know how to speak to people she did not know. Not even for something that she really wanted. Most of her growing up would have been in the fundie/gothard style where family was all she was told she needed. I was then surprised that Jinger was able to go up to these people, but she was in charge of keeping to a timetable and knew what was at stake, so had to put nerves or reticence aside and get on with it.

It seems such a natural thing for most people, mixing and doing all sorts of things with people from many and varied backgrounds. Even growing up strict Catholic and going to Catholic schools, my brothers and sisters and I did other things like swimming, dancing, football, gymnastics, basketball and so on where we mixed with all sorts of other kids. Any questions we had about differences were discussed at home. And we were taught about tolerance, variety, and how to sort out for ourselves who we wanted as friends (within reason).

What the Duggars and their ilk do is make it impossible for their kids to have normal interactions with just people in general. I can't imagine not being able to have a short chat with someone I don't know about what is going on around me, or what is in the news, or the weather. It is part of life. But the Duggars actively avoid this unless someone recognises them and asks for their autograph or a picture. I had never realised how important socialisation is to kids until I connected all this. No wonder some of the kids have looked half scared when they are on their trips. They are afraid of what people might do.

[GEML]

The Duggars have specifically trained (deliberate word choice) their children to shun people. I think Jessa is probably a natural introvert, for all her brashness within the family, whereas Jinger is a natural extrovert, for all she's not a leader. We also saw that at the coffee shop, where Jinger was more easy going with customers, and Jessa more forced, but better organized and quicker about learning how things were done.

[SoSueMe]

Since TLC ends up mysteriously deleting scenes that the public finds offensive, is the dry humping part still in the episode reruns? Whoever is brave enough to watch again, please advise & thank you for taking one for the team.

I have the clip of the mini golf course shenanigans courtesy of another poster if anyone is interested. I recommend having the eye bleach at the ready.

 

[Portia]

Another thing that annoyed/intrigued/puzzled me in the Benessa engagement sideshow was Jessa's reluctance to go up to people who were expecting her and ask them for the red rose. (She had to collect 12 to get the next "clue"). As Jessa seems to have a bit more spirit that some of the others, I was truly surprised by this.

That's an interesting observation. It seemed like she'd never been on a scavenger hunt before, and that makes me sad. My kids participated in lots of them, including some that were organized by their youth pastor. To me, scavenger hunts are a fun, silly, harmless aspect of being a young person. Usually the winner is the one who is crazy enough to enlist complete strangers in completing the tasks on their list.

[3girlsforus]

As a big introvert myself I can commiserate with Jessa. I am not incapable of going up to people I don't know for something like the scavenger hunt but that doesn't mean I'd want to, like to, or would be gung ho about doing it. It definitely wouldn't be how I would want to get engaged. Of course my husband would know that about me. Makes me wonder if Ben knew her well enough to know she's an introvert and wouldn't be thrilled with that approach either.

[GEML]

I wonder how much say Ben and Jessa had about the whole engagement episode - would a 19 year old really have cared about dinner on a train for all of the women in the family? No. He cared about the part at the chapel with the rose petals and the ring. The rest was to fill a TLC episode.

[Barb23]

Jessa even commented & seemed concerned about having to get the rose from the "single looking guy."

[andromeda331]

I think that she uses these names to show us how loving she is and how bonded she is with her children -- and it has the opposite affect. I really think that she doesn't know (or care) what nicknames her children use for themselves. Maybe she called Jinger "Jin Jin" when she actually cared about her -- when she was under 6 months old -- but no one else seems to use that name.

 

Yeah, that was another one of those attempts to show she really is a good mom. Look she has cute nicknames for her kids. Michelle, most moms don't have to prove their a good mom.

[Apple Clark]

I have the clip of the mini golf course shenanigans courtesy of another poster if anyone is interested. I recommend having the eye bleach at the ready.

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVjRiQw9KLw

OH MY GOD. EYE BLEACH. I NEED SOME.

[galax-arena]

Being an introvert isn't synonymous with being shy. Of course, Jessa could be both, especially if she's been stunted by years of being trained to shun outsiders. 

 

I always get annoyed when my friends express surprise that I'm capable of socializing with strangers without being completely awkward about it. I can do it, I just don't like to!

Edited March 31, 2015 by galax-arena

[Wellfleet]

Another thing that annoyed/intrigued/puzzled me in the Benessa engagement sideshow was Jessa's reluctance to go up to people who were expecting her and ask them for the red rose. (She had to collect 12 to get the next "clue"). As Jessa seems to have a bit more spirit that some of the others, I was truly surprised by this.

But then today I was reading some older blog entries from "Heresy in the Heartland" and came across one from over 2 years ago about socialisation. And then it really hit me. Jessa did not know how to speak to people she did not know. Not even for something that she really wanted. Most of her growing up would have been in the fundie/gothard style where family was all she was told she needed. I was then surprised that Jinger was able to go up to these people, but she was in charge of keeping to a timetable and knew what was at stake, so had to put nerves or reticence aside and get on with it.

It seems such a natural thing for most people, mixing and doing all sorts of things with people from many and varied backgrounds. Even growing up strict Catholic and going to Catholic schools, my brothers and sisters and I did other things like swimming, dancing, football, gymnastics, basketball and so on where we mixed with all sorts of other kids. Any questions we had about differences were discussed at home. And we were taught about tolerance, variety, and how to sort out for ourselves who we wanted as friends (within reason).

What the Duggars and their ilk do is make it impossible for their kids to have normal interactions with just people in general. I can't imagine not being able to have a short chat with someone I don't know about what is going on around me, or what is in the news, or the weather. It is part of life. But the Duggars actively avoid this unless someone recognises them and asks for their autograph or a picture. I had never realised how important socialisation is to kids until I connected all this. No wonder some of the kids have looked half scared when they are on their trips. They are afraid of what people might do.

 

So true! Socialization is absolutely critical, especially for young children. When I was student-teaching [eons ago at a college laboratory school], every classroom at the preschool and kindergarten level was equipped with round tables, because studies had shown that children are far more sociable when they can all see everyone's faces, whereas children at rectangular tables will interact almost exclusively with only those directly adjacent to them. In addition, you really can't say "sit at the head of the table" when it's a round table, so there is the element of equality there as well. I used to look for this effect at social events, workshops etc and found it to be true with adults as well, pretty much as you would expect. Made quite an impression on me - even influenced my choice of a big round dining room table for my home.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Ilovemylabs]

Re: the dry humping/golf course date, at least Jessa and Jill have seen it's ok to try other sex positions.

I just saw this episode again and I had forgotten how vile JB was.  Yech!!!!!

I've considered Googling the dry humping clip, but I seriously can't bring myself to do it. SO MUCH DISGUSTINGNESS.

Don't do it.  I really had forgotten how...well there are no words!

[Seashell Lover]

Their bullshit Nike as if a male could get turned on seeing a female in clothing then why do they have male cameraman filming the births? Don't they realize the cameraman sees everything? 

[3girlsforus]

Their bullshit Nike as if a male could get turned on seeing a female in clothing then why do they have male cameraman filming the births? Don't they realize the cameraman sees everything? 

 

They worry that a lot of bizarre things will cause sexual feelings but maybe even they realize that child birth is not sexy LOL.

 

Seriously though - I completely agree. Just another inconsistency in the name of making a buck. 

[GEML]

I knew I should have typed out what introvert and extrovert mean, but I was being lazy, so I apologize for anyone who mistakenly thought I meant Jessa was shy about asking about the roses. I don't think Jessa is shy at all. But I think it requires energy from her to interact with people whereas someone like Jinger (or Josh or Jim Bob or other extroverts) gains energy by interacting with people. And you can be shy and still be an extrovert. Shyness has nothing to do with any of this.

So here is Jessa, who has been forced to interact with people all day, now having to approach total strangers (who are enjoying interacting with her) and then she has to interact with her entire family on the train - I think the poor girl was emotionally exhausted by the end. Again, that has nothing to do with being shy.

(And it is somewhat different being on camera. In her head she knows thousands, even a million people will see something, but her immediate brain tells her it's just the camera crew she knows really well. The brain is good about compartmentalizing like that.)