S14.E02: Gods and Monsters

[OtterMommy]

Quote

Sam finds a clue to Dean's whereabouts, so he, Mary and Bobby set out to investigate. Castiel imparts some sage advice on Jack, who, still desperate to belong, seeks out a familial connection

 

Original air date: 10/18/2018

[sarthaz]

Bucklemming? I expect to fall into a great depression in about an hour.

[ahrtee]

Beat the rush!  Join me there now, in anticipation. :(

[BoxManLocke]

6 minutes ago, sarthaz said:

Bucklemming? I expect to fall into a great depression in about an hour.

Dabb fucked up so bad last week a BuckLeming episode is legitimately more entertaining. This is how far we've fallen

[Casseiopeia]

Currently trending at #3 on the East coast...

[Myrelle]

SO!!! Much better than the premiere.

So far...

[gonzosgirrl]

Welp. Not even two full episodes for Michael!Dean. Even I didn't think Dabb could suck that hard.

Jensen was great, but I think I'm done.

The soap opera of Nickifer and woobie Jack is too much. This is not Supernatural.

Yeah. I'm done.

[Lady Calypso]

Um...ok, what? 

I did like this episode quite a bit, but that ending...so Michael just LEFT? 

Fourteen seasons in and I guess they decided to fuck it and just say "ok, he's gone. We'll explain why in about ten episodes and it probably won't make much sense."

[Katy M]

Yay, Dean's back.

I'm kind of excited about the super amped monsters since they've been depowering everything. 

We had werewolves, but they seemed to be the purebreds, again. It's kind of funny since they seem to outnumber the feral werewolves by about a million to one that S&D had never heard of them until Season 8.

I'm now kind of wondering if Nick killed his own family.  Or if Artie did.  Or if it was a monster kill.  I'm going to duck down to avoid the rocks, but I'm kind of intrigued by Nick.

I was soooo bored beyond belief of that scene with Michael and the two vampires discussing stuff.

I don't really care that much about Jack, but that scene with his grandparents kind of made me tear up a bit.

Bobby was funny with all his acronyms.

Edited October 19, 2018 by Katy M

[Lady Calypso]

As for the rest of the episode, I liked it. I'm not caring much about Nick and his PTSD over Lucifer, but Mark Pellegrino DID do a great job at the beginning of the episode, when he was remembering pieces of what happened to him all those years ago. 

Jack's stuff was interesting for me. I liked seeing him go visit his grandparents to meet them for the first time. I think it was important for him to get more in touch with his human side, and now that he has no grace for *insert appropriate amount of time here until they need his powers*, he's going to need to figure out how to be human.

The Sam, Bobby, and Mary stuff bored me since I don't like Mary and (unpopular opinion but) I've never been that fond of Bobby. I do think JP is doing an excellent job with Sam so far. 

I am glad that Dean's back, but the way he came back was really stupid.

There was some really clunky dialogue at the beginning of the episode. Otherwise, the episode was good. 

[Pondlass1]

They’re making us think Nick is the next Michael vessel? surely not?

It was dull and plodding. To much time wasted on characters we don’t know or care about. 

[SueB]

This definitely feels like "setup" versus any remote resolution.

I'm also wondering (like @Katy M) if Nick killed his own family.  

Since Michael drew Sam & company to him, I'm guessing he wanted to test his 'wolfgels' (anweres?) on the best hunters.  And they failed (but just barely).  So I don't know WHAT Michael is up to now.  But I don't think Dean is in the clear.  

Need a rewatch but Cas, sweetie, I realize both are technically adults but it's not babysitting if your charges take off from the bunker and you don't know where they are.

[Katy M]

3 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

They’re making us think Nick is the next Michael vessel? surely not?

It was dull and plodding. To much time wasted on characters we don’t know or care about. 

I guess Michael has to go somewhere, but I hope not.  First of all, because it would basically just be like Lucifer 2.0.  I guess  it could, maybe be interesting if Cas was right about part of Lucifer still being inside Nick (I know that's not what he said), and they Michael and Lucifer warred inside him, but I'm not sure how that would look.  Second of all, I want to see where Nick goes with his vengeance.  

[Morrigan2575]

I don't care about Nick's story.

I'm actually intrigued about Michael's plan. I'm sure there is one, to be honest I didn't think he really left not sure if that's something he can hide. If he's really gone then I expect we'll get flashbacks to help reveal the Master Plan.

On a totally shallow note, I'm going to miss Dean/Michael because the man could dress. ?

I can't get over how much Jack mirrors Castiel. I'm guessing it's intentional on the actor's part and it's pretty cool, IMO.

10 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I'm now kind of wondering if Nick killed his own family.  Or if Artie did

 

2 minutes ago, SueB said:

I'm also wondering (like @Katy M) if Nick killed his own family.  

I was waiting for Artie to reveal that Nick had been the person he saw. I was convinced Nick killed his own family and then blacked it out.

[Katy M]

1 minute ago, SueB said:

'wolfgels' (anweres?)

You're channeling Dean. I love it.

 

2 minutes ago, SueB said:

So I don't know WHAT Michael is up to now.

I don't know, and I kind of like that I don't know, because this show has become kind of predictable.  Even if it turns out stupid, I'm glad to be left guessing, at least for now.

 

2 minutes ago, SueB said:

Need a rewatch but Cas, sweetie, I realize both are technically adults but it's not babysitting if your charges take off from the bunker and you don't know where they are.

I'll duck down again, but I have to say it.  Cas has never been particularly competent.  Not since S6 anyway.

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I'm actually intrigued about Michael's plan. I'm sure there is one, to be honest I didn't think he really left not sure if that's something he can hide. If he's really gone then I expect we'll get flashbacks to help reveal the Master Plan.

If he's still in Dean and Cas fails to see him once they've met up, I will be beyond annoyed.

[Myrelle]

They were SO!! stupid for not giving us more Michael!Dean. Jensen was Amazing in the role this week. Just Amazing. 

But I'm convinced that they were really worried that that was going to be the case and that's why it was cut short. Again.

I'm guessing that those who don't use social media are wondering if Michael really left Dean.

I'm just hoping that he didn't go into Nick and that Nick is just a homicidal human and that we'll never know or find out where Michael went for at least another 18 episodes.

I thought that this week's episode was 10 times better than the premiere. A hundred times better, tbh.

[MysteryGuest]

So does Mark P.'s name now appear above Jared and Jensen's?  If I wasn't a regular watcher, I'd swear he was the star of the show.  For the past few years now, I've really been hoping that the show could get back to what it used to be, but I realize now that was just a pipe dream.  With Dabb & Co. at the helm, we are doomed to limp to the finish line, I'm afraid.

I never wanted Dean/Michael, so if Dean is really back, then I'm all for it.  But I'm not buying it yet.  I have to assume that Michael will end up in Nick's meat suit at some point in the near future, otherwise, what's the point?  

The idea of a smarter, more savvy monster appealed to me back after the BMOL were dispensed with.  That would have been an organic storyline.  Monsters banding together to hunt the hunters out of revenge would have been perfect.  But this just seems silly.

And I love Jensen, but I'm not really digging his Michael.  The guy who played him last year (sorry, his name escapes me right now) was much more menacing, I thought.  It's possible that it's just my issue, and I can't help but look for Dean when I see Jensen, but all I know is that I'm really not enjoying it.

I obviously have no clue where the story is going to go this season, but with 3 less episodes, I had really hoped that things would be tightened up a bit.  I'm not seeing it.

[Katy M]

Just now, Myrelle said:

But I'm convinced that they were really worried that that was going to be the case and that's why it was cut short. Again.

I'm not entirel sure that makes sense.  Why would the show want to cut short something they thought would be amazing just because they thought it would be amazing?

[SueB]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I don't care about Nick's story.

I'm actually intrigued about Michael's plan. I'm sure there is one, to be honest I didn't think he really left not sure if that's something he can hide. If he's really gone then I expect we'll get flashbacks to help reveal the Master Plan.

On a totally shallow note, I'm going to miss Dean/Michael because the man could dress. ?

I can't get over how much Jack mirrors Castiel. I'm guessing it's intentional on the actor's part and it's pretty cool, IMO.

 

I was waiting for Artie to reveal that Nick had been the person he saw. I was convinced Nick killed his own family and then blacked it out.

I always thought the demons killed Nick's famly when Lucifer couldn't get to Sam.  So they took a psuedo-compatible vessel, destroyed his life and then Lucifer made an offer.  BUT, now it's looking like Nick is multiple personalities in the first place or something.

[trudysmom]

The best thing about this episode was looking at Jensen, all shaven and pretty.  I'm beyond sick of Mary, Super Hunter.  I didn't care for all the yelling at Cas, so shut up Jack and Nick.  Who are you to call Cas names, be all judgey and blame him.  Yeah, NIck  has more than a bit of Lucifer left in him.  Jack looks like a typical teenager full of angst and tunnel vision.  

IF the end result of MIchael's experiments resulted in new races of super monsters and that means the boys have to figure out how to kill them, and we can see some good monster-of-the-week episodes, then I'll forgive the stupidity that led up to this storyline.  

[Myrelle]

1 minute ago, Katy M said:

I'm not entirel sure that makes sense.  Why would the show want to cut short something they thought would be amazing just because they thought it would be amazing?

Honestly, its a B vs J issue, but if we get more of that Michael!Dean in flashbacks AND Dean retains his badassity, it would at least mean something to this Dean/JA fan.

[BoxManLocke]

More focused episode than last week, and better on the character development. Those are two things I though I'd never say about a BuckLeming episode.

 

Maybe years of exposure have just made me more tolerant of Supernatural's bullshit. Not that tolerant though, because this was nowhere near good. Just better than the absolute garbage the last 3-4 episodes have been.

 

Anyway, let's start with Michael. I didn't care for Michael's plan at all, but it was nice to see Jensen starting to have some fun this time around...

 

... and it was over just like that. That ending was one big joke. Fuck all the people involved in hyping up this storyline, as well as those who created it in the first place. And definitely fuck Dabb and co for lying. Again.

 

The Nick thing is one giant Who Gives A Fuck and took up way too much screentime. Can't believe this crap's probably going to run for the entire season and maybe even become the main antagonist. We'll never be freed from this shit.

 

The parts with Castiel and Jack are the only things I actually enjoyed, even though Cass is again shown to be completely useless and unable to keep two humans in the bunker. Also, what a great idea to tell Nick is whole family is dead when his brain is still screwed up from years of possession.

I'm enjoying watching Jack discover himself, and I think what he said about Michael was the right thing even though it came out of fucking nowhere, right in the middle of a really sweet scene.

 

So I liked maybe 10 minutes out of 40 and this is still somehow better than last week. That tells you all you need to know about the dire state this show is in.

[Pondlass1]

I’m not finding Michael Dean as charismatic or as chilling as Demon Dean. 

[MysteryGuest]

1 minute ago, BoxManLocke said:

So I liked maybe 10 minutes out of 40 and this is still somehow better than last week. That tells you all you need to know about the dire state this show is in.

And this pisses me off no end!  This show could write itself.  I don't know why it's so difficult for this group of writers to take some iconic characters and give them something interesting and entertaining to do.  They so suck at their jobs.  I still want my Netflix version of Supernatural with Sam and Dean and Cas against some bad ass monsters.  No demons or archangels need apply!

[Lady Calypso]

I kinda wish they weren't going this Revenge route with Nick, as I fear it'll turn into him having killed his family. I always thought the demons killed his family to push him into saying yes, so with it possibly being Lucifer choosing Nick because he's some psycho murderer? That doesn't interest me. If we have to keep Pellegrino, I would have actually liked to see him play the actual good guy trying to deal with his Lucifer PTSD. I wish it was going that way but I'm pretty sure it's not. 

[Katy M]

3 minutes ago, BoxManLocke said:

So I liked maybe 10 minutes out of 40 and this is still somehow better than last week. That tells you all you need to know about the dire state this show is in.

I actually liked most of it.  Would I like more Winchester?  Absolutely.  But, I still enjoyed the rest of it for the most part.  

[MysteryGuest]

Did they even mention the phone call from Sister Jo from last week?  I might have missed it, but I didn't hear anything about it.

[SueB]

Just now, MysteryGuest said:

Did they even mention the phone call from Sister Jo from last week?  I might have missed it, but I didn't hear anything about it.

Yes, that's how they knew to start in Duluth. Once they looked there, they found the dead angel-smited bodies. 

[ILoveReading]

That's it?  Seven months of story build up for it to end just because....reasons?

It's obvious Michael is going to end up in Nick. 

Do we really need As the Supernatural World Turns and the majority of this episode focusing on Nick.  I dont' care who killed his family and I don't care about Jack.  This episode should have focused on finding Dean. 

Screw Jack.  When Dean questions whether Jack is threat he's an asshat.   I don't like the double standards. 

I'll give Misha credit for doing a good job with the Lucifer scenes.  You could feel Cas's revulsion towards the guy that looked like Lucifer.  I get they want to show Sam as perfect, but its too far with Sam doing nothing but sticking up for Nick.  It feels forced. 

Buck/Lemming both said that Lucifer was their favorite character and that's obvious. 

The Michael storyline could have been interesting but it ended up being a bust because its clear not a single writer actually gave a crap about it.

If that is still Michael and Lucifer then if I was a Cas fan I'd be ticked that Cas can't tell.  He should be able too. 

This is why I don't believe Dean is still in Michael.

But now Jensen's acting-

Where do I ever start.  I'll start at holy hell he was good.  Michael was so cold and calculating.   Not a trace or ounce of sympathy in him.  So different from Dean that sense.  Michael's eyes are completely dead.  He was damn meancing. 

Its to bad they didnt' give him time to find the character before cutting it off again at the knees.  Seriously screw Dabb.

That mirror scene.  Despite being so short, once again Jensen does need tricks or effects.  I could tell instantly.  Also when he walked into the church I knew immediately that was Dean.

Seriously, screw Dabb. 

I'm going to spoiler tag this just incase it comes up in a later episode

Spoiler

What happened to the AU hunters supposedly wanting Dean dead.  It's like Dabb read someone wondering that, said "oh yeah" and threw it in there. 

I wonder if that is what the flashbacks will be.   Showing how Michael came into contact with Nick.

 

9 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

I’m not finding Michael Dean as charismatic or as chilling as Demon Dean. 

I thought he was going more for sauve and debonair, plus menacing.  I thought it was there.  Michael showed signs that he could be scary if he wanted too. 

It also hard to develop a character when you get no help from the writing staff. and barely get to play him. 

This is why I feel like Jensen was so great.  He not only spins straw into gold, but he makes the straw too.

He should get story credit.

[Aeryn13]

I really don't care one whit about Nickifer and Jack being a lip-wibbling piss-ant. 

Seeing as there were only two lousy episodes of it, couldn't they have devoted at least one to Michael!Dean? Sam got bis pimpage hour last week.

Still better than the Premiere, though.

[Pondlass1]

Was there a promo for next week? We don’t get it in Canada. 

Was anyone else laughing at the teeth on the vamp in the red dress? 

Edited October 19, 2018 by Pondlass1

[MysteryGuest]

2 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

That mirror scene.  Despite being so short, once again Jensen does need tricks or effects.  I could tell instantly.  Also when he walked into the church I knew immediately that was Dean.

This scene was particularly good, I have to say.  But for the most part, I'm finding Jensen's Michael to be a bit too flippant maybe?  It feels like they're trying to squeeze a little humor out of his comments when it should be deadly serious.  As usual, Jensen's being called on to create magic out of thin air.

Thanks for the response, SueB.  I figured I must have missed something.

[Lemuria]

Quote

Was there a promo?

There was a promo. 

Spoiler

They were trying to figure out what happened with Dean and Michael, including Cas trying to read his mind--one of the flashbacks we were promised--and I believe we see Jody (I'm not sure as I glanced away for a minute).

Edited October 19, 2018 by Lemuria

[SueB]

2 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

Was there a promo for next week? We don’t get it in Canada. 

Posted in spoiler thread.

6 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

That's it?  Seven months of story build up for it to end just because....reasons?

It's obvious Michael is going to end up in Nick. 

 

I don't remotely think the Michael storyline is over.  I think the weregels failed so Michael is off doing more research.  They made a point of reminding us angels measure time in months or centuries... he's not in a rush.

I don't think Michael is going to Nick.  I think Nick is damaged goods.  Possibly damaged BEFORE Lucifer took him.  Definitely a mental scramble now.

[Pondlass1]

40 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I’m done.

We will miss you gonzo. ?

[Res]

1 minute ago, Pondlass1 said:

Was there a promo for next week? We don’t get it in Canada. 

Yes. It will probably be up on youtube or the CW facebook site soon. Standard MotW crap. 

This ep was better than the premiere but the only parts I liked were the Jensen parts. The end was a WTF moment but I expected no less from these idiot writers and their special pets that I don't give a crap about. Still it wasn't enough to keep me that interested in staying tuned in that much, if at all.  

[Lady Calypso]

10 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Screw Jack.  When Dean questions whether Jack is threat he's an asshat.   I don't like the double standards. 

To be fair, Jack was talking more about Michael, and he knew Dean wouldn't want the world going to shit just to save him. They all know what Michael did in Apocalypse World and Jack's main concern was that, so he's not wrong. While with Dean questioning Jack, it was more out of uncertainty since he didn't know whether or not Jack was going to be evil and he was erring on the side of caution. So they are two different situations. 

If Michael was in Nick's body or in someone else's body who's not a main character, there'd be no question about killing Michael at the first chance that they could. That's where this season is heading, after all. Michael is going to have to die or else he becomes Lucifer 2.0. Hopefully it happens this season, likely in the finale. 

I assume Michael!Dean isn't done yet. I assume, despite him being gone for now, that he'll jump back into Dean's body at some point. 

[Myrelle]

2 minutes ago, BoxManLocke said:

The Nick thing is one giant Who Gives A Fuck and took up way too much screentime. Can't believe this crap's probably going to run for the entire season and maybe even become the main antagonist. We'll never be freed from this shit.

Never. Or at least not until we're rid of Singer and his wife and her writing partner.

I also am so over Pellegrino and all the screen time that he's sucking up.

I thought Misha was great in this episode, and even the Nougat Baby didn't rankle as much as he usually does to me; and his scene with Kelly's parents was terrific, IMO. 

The Sam, Bobby, and Mary Susan stuff sucked.

I just hope that Michael didn't leave Dean for what he thought would be a better/stronger vessel-or if he did, I hope that it comes back to haunt him in a very bad way.

And as short as it was, I still LOVED! the mirror scene so much. Best scene of the episode, IMO. 

[Katy M]

16 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Screw Jack.  When Dean questions whether Jack is threat he's an asshat.   I don't like the double standards. 

Cas wasn't around when Dean was questioning Jack's threathood.  At least not postbirth.  And Sam wasn't around when Jack said Dean was less important than the entire world.  So, I don't see a double standard.  Plus, Cas seemed to disagree with him anyway.  Although, I think Jack was right. In theory anyway.  I obviously don't want Dean to die.  And, I also thought Dean was right and was disappointed that Jack didn't turn out evil.  I was still holding out hope, but now that Nick is turning out bad, they're probably not going to go that route.

[Bergamot]

There actually was a little seed of a good storyline with Michael!Dean that started to emerge here, but instead of tending it and feeding it and letting it flourish and grow (it should have dominated the episode), the writers were busy dumping their fertilizer on the Nick story and the Jack story.

I cannot express how little I care about Nick or Jack or their stories. Nothing personal, Mark Pellegrino, but I am so sick of your face. His continued presence and the way it keeps consuming my show is like watching a flesh-eating bacteria eat up the body of a loved one. Is there no way to cleanse him from the show?

As for Jack, I don't despise the sight of him as I do Nick, but the actor has no charisma and I don't believe I am ever going to care what happens to his character. Watching him deal with the loss of his grace is like watching a tired retread of a story that the show has done better in the past.

[Lemuria]

11 minutes ago, Myrelle said:

I just hope that Michael didn't leave Dean for what he thought would be a better/stronger vessel-or if he did, I hope that it comes back to haunt him in a very bad way.

Maybe for a less cantankerous one!

[Myrelle]

The Nougat Baby will never be anything worse than what and how he was in this episode. They want to keep the character as vanilla as they can even if he's the son of the Devil. IMO.

[BoxManLocke]

35 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

And this pisses me off no end!  This show could write itself.  I don't know why it's so difficult for this group of writers to take some iconic characters and give them something interesting and entertaining to do.  They so suck at their jobs.  I still want my Netflix version of Supernatural with Sam and Dean and Cas against some bad ass monsters.  No demons or archangels need apply!

I know what you mean. Things have become so stupidly convoluted, when what SPN needs and thrives in is simplicity.

 

Jensen and Jared have the power to reboot the show, so to speak, since it wouldn't continue without them. They could request and get a change in the writing room. Unfortunately we're not there yet and might never be. It's a shame. Fire BuckLeming and Dabb and I'm confident things would get instantly better, as the other writers have fresh ideas and are clearly not as into the SPN Ensemble Show as the current PTB.

 

Btw I agree with those who are praising Misha. He hadn't been able to flex his acting muscles like this in a long time. But it's just ridiculous that it takes BuckLeming and fucking Nick to get that stuff out of Castiel.

Edited October 19, 2018 by BoxManLocke

[ILoveReading]

18 minutes ago, SueB said:

I don't remotely think the Michael storyline is over.

I don't either.  But Dean's part is.  That's all I cared about.  So it might as well be.

[bozodegama]

I was going to say that Supernatural has become painful to watch without Dean.  But he’s back and I don’t even care why. Seriously, I’ll watch 50 mins of bad writing just to hear Dean say, “Sammy, I’m back.”  

[Binns]

I’m sort of into this Nick storyline for some reason. Didn’t think I would be. I don’t want it to take up a ton of time though...still want to see the brothers in action. 

 

I feel its really unlikely that Michael just left. Maybe he’s just...hiding in Dean or something. Or acting like Dean (though that was pretty good acting). 

58 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I kinda wish they weren't going this Revenge route with Nick, as I fear it'll turn into him having killed his family. I always thought the demons killed his family to push him into saying yes, so with it possibly being Lucifer choosing Nick because he's some psycho murderer? That doesn't interest me. If we have to keep Pellegrino, I would have actually liked to see him play the actual good guy trying to deal with his Lucifer PTSD. I wish it was going that way but I'm pretty sure it's not. 

I would have preferred that too. 

[ahrtee]

Some thoughts (some in answer to questions above, but I can't remember who asked what, so apologies if things are in no particular order):

1.  If Michael just "left" after that whole big setup to lure Sam, Mary and Bobby to the church, that's the stupidest move of all times.  He spent a lot of time baiting the trap to just have it be about a few werewolves.  I'm going to hope/believe? that Michael hasn't really left, he's just gone into hiding (in Dean) so he can spy on the enemy.  That's better than him looking for another, better vessel.

2.  By setting up that Cas can still feel Lucifer in Nick, that could be the explanation of why he might be able to feel Michael in Dean.  Maybe Michael can damp himself down enough that only a trace escapes, which can be overlooked.  At least that makes more sense than Nick being alive at all.

3.  I'm not sure of the timeline, but it seems to me that Nick's family was killed before Lucifer was released from the Cage.  And Luci expected Sam to be his vessel--he was on site, ready and waiting--so there would have been no need to prepare Nick.  Of course, that means that the writers have to remember (and follow canon.)  

4.  The woman in red was a werewolf, not a vampire, hence different teeth.  They still didn't look like "normal" wolves in any event.  And how do the purebloods, who live normal lives, with houses and families and jobs, fit in with Michael's "they live only to eat" philosophy?  

And my own thoughts:

1.  They gave Nick all of Dean's story:  he got the flashbacks, the trauma, the angst and the OTT emotional backstory, which doesn't leave anything much for Dean except to comfort everyone else because he "understands."  

2.  I really have no interest in Nick or Lucifer.  None at all.  I don't care if Nick was a psychopath before Lucifer took over or not until later.  With the amount of time and buildup they gave, IA with whoever said upthread that it seems like he's the star of the show.  No.  Just no.

3.  This was the least offensive I found Jack.  But still not interested.  And Cas, honey, the reason everyone was hunting Jack before was for his power.  Jack - power = nothing of use to anyone.  No one should be hunting him any more.  

4.  Did he say it would take (I didn't hear...centuries? or something) to regrow his grace, and that his human side would slow it down?  But wasn't it his human side that made the grace extra-super-special?  Shouldn't that also speed healing?  

5.  Yes, Cas makes a very bad babysitter.  Did he just let Jack and Nick walk out of the bunker?  (And how did they get--wherever they wound up.  Delaware for Nick, wherever Kelly's family lived?  They didn't even have Baby for supersonic transport!)

Edited October 19, 2018 by ahrtee
typo

[Katy M]

5 minutes ago, ahrtee said:

4.  Did he say it would take (I didn't hear...centuries? or something) to regrow his grace, and that his human side would slow it down?  But wasn't it his human side that made the grace extra-super-special?  Shouldn't that also speed healing?  

Don't be silly. Everything is situational.

 

6 minutes ago, ahrtee said:

5.  Yes, Cas makes a very bad babysitter.  Did he just let Jack and Nick walk out of the bunker?  (And how did they get--wherever they wound up.  Delaware for Nick, wherever Kelly's family lived?  They didn't even have Baby for supersonic transport!)

They have a garage full of cars.

[Ninamags]

I'm sort of intrigued that Nick might have killed his family. I know Lucifer sold Nick on the idea to get revenge for his family but why was Lucifer drawn to Nick? What caught his attention in the first place? Maybe Lucifer saw how fucked up Nick was and thought he could get in? 

I Guess it was sweet that Jack went to meet the grandparents. 

Would it really take 3 FBI agents to see about some dead bodies? 

I liked this better than last week, but not by much. 

[Bergamot]

In regard to Jack's visit to Kelly's parents, I have to say that it makes me very angry that the writers are STILL trying to shove down our throats the narrative that Kelly's story was essentially nothing more than an illustration of a perfect and pure mother who loved her precious baby Jack so much. Aww, look how happy her parents were to learn about Jack's birth! What a blessing he was!

The fact is that Kelly was raped by Lucifer when he possessed the body of her lover, and then even though she chose to die rather than be used by him to bear his offspring, she was then brainwashed by the supernatural creature inside of her into happily serving as his incubator. (Which killed her, by the way, although among all his angst and self-pity Jack never seems bothered by this.) It infuriates me that she was NEVER ONCE allowed to express her rage at Lucifer for what he did to her, but instead the writers had her simper to Jack about how it was natural that he would want to get to know his father. She was literally never allowed to say one bad word about him. It is horrible, and I think Dabb and his writers should be ashamed of themselves. At the very least they could stop bringing her up and using what happened to her as some kind of simple and heartwarming story.

Also, I don't agree with Castiel that it was "kind" of Jack not to tell her parents that she was dead. I think it was cowardly. He didn't have to tell them what really happened, he could have made something up, but now they will never know or understand why they will never hear from her again, and it seems very cruel to think of them waiting for news about Kelly and the grandson that they were so happy about.