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Spoiler Discussion Thread: The Sequel

Door County Cherry

By Door County Cherry
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apinknightmare
apinknightmare

Anyone who actually thinks she's dead deserves the crushing disappointment they'll feel when they find out she isn't. 

Chaser
Chaser

“Felicity my love, let’s make a baby. I want to expand our family.” ”Oh Oliver...” ”That way a piece of me will always be with you.” ..........”What the Fuck did you do?”

apinknightmare
apinknightmare

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Chaser

Chaser

I’m not convinced BS killed Diaz. It feels like a red herring to me.

Theory time: Siren is being set up. She goes on the run. 7x18 is the others protecting her and the episode ends with her realizing it’s time for her to stop pretending (that line in this episode stood out to me). She gets a hero send off to E2 to become their BC.

I think KC is done and I don’t think they will send her down the Villain path again. They won’t kill her either. 

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

(edited)
9 hours ago, Angel12d said:

I think she definitely killed Diaz but it wouldn't shock me if they don't frame it as her being evil? She'll have done it for her friend or something like that, haha.

Yeah, evil was too lazy of a word on my part.  I guess a better way would be to say she falls back on old habits.  So BS killed Diaz and we can even tie it to her pep talk, she killed out of love to protect Felicity and baby not out of hate/revenge/fear.  However, she gets caught/found out and now her fake life pretending to be LL beloved DA is over.  She's wanted for murder and goes on the run.  Dinah/Sara (although really should be Felicity) go to stop her before she kills/hurts someone again.  We then get a big emotional scene where BS decides to go to prison for her crimes (not Diaz but, all the other people she killed).  This is kind of what i meant with the Faith from Angel situation.  BS actually earns her redemption the same way Faith did by, choosing/accepting responsibility and punishment.  

I mean there are plenty of alternatives too, she could get stopped by Sara/Dinah and, decides to return to E2 as part of her redemption, becoming E2s BC and doing good or something.

I'll say this my spec is never 100% right.  I said Curtis/Echo would leave but,  thought it was 714 and that he'd either die or go on some extended, super secret Argus mission overseas never to be heard from again.  Instead we got a 713 departure and he just took a job in DC.

I said Diaz was gone after 715 and, he would be killed by Dante (original spec) and then yesterday my crack spec of Felicity setting off the Argus Bomb to protect herself/baby but, I thought it would happen in 715.  Instead he is killed in 714 (we hope) and, it's most likely by BS.   Same for my crack spec, that was almost right in that Felicity did plan to explode the bomb in Diaz's head but, she changes her mind.  

Edited by Morrigan2575
tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Here's an alternative theory...

I think Dante is the big scary Big Bad that Diaz was supposed to be last year. Dante arranged to have Diaz killed at Slabside. The reason that almost nobody can identify Dante is that he kills or orders someone else to kill everyone who's seen him as Dante. That would put a big target on Oliver and Lyla, who have both seen him up close.

In another shocker (like the Emiko reveal), we find out that E2 Laurel is also working for Dante and had been tasked with getting close to the Queen family. But she develops a genuine affection for Felicity and a genuine liking for her new D.A. job, which gives her conflicting feelings when she's ordered by Dante to kill Felicity. Beth had comment about how we'll find out if Black Siren is really redeemed or whether she's still the same evil Black Siren. However, so far, E2 Laurel's been acting like she's already redeemed. So there's still got to be some reason that she has to make a choice later on in the season. So E2 Laurel will have to choose whether to side with Felicity or with Dante.

Also, what do you bet that Dante is still alive in the flashforwards and that Kevin Dale works for him? I wonder if Adrian Paul's contract extends into S8.

Edited by tv echo
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way2interested

way2interested

(edited)
17 minutes ago, tv echo said:

That would put a big target on Oliver and Lyla, who have both seen him up close.

Yep, but it did seem that Oliver already had a target on him though, since his plan already included Oliver/possibly Team Arrow since Emiko was out being the GA while Oliver was still in prison putting his trust in Emiko before Oliver even saw or really knew who he was.

17 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Also, what do you bet that Dante is still alive in the flashforwards and that Kevin Dale works for him?

I don't think he's still alive per se, but that his group that is essentially trying to take over the Glades in the present (assuming that the people Emiko was after in 7a is actually Dante's group and that she's actually working with them) is the villain in the FF.

Edited by way2interested
insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

Laurel knowing about Felicity's pregnancy could be another sign she's leaving (at least Star City) soon. There was just something about the way she said she wouldn't tell anyone that had me a bit worried. Plus, they're really pushing the Felicity/Laurel friendship and Laurel's redemption a little too hard. 

And if Laurel does end up betraying Felicity (leading to the 718 episode), that could contribute to Felicity's "paranoia" in the future, as Mia put it. She trusted someone, and they used what she told her against her. Therefore, Felicity decides that she can't trust anyone else with Mia's existence, hence anyone who's not part of OTA and especially not in SC — Roy and Dinah, I still say she leaves at some point this season in the present — is out of the loop. (I could see Felicity trusting Roy, which is why she sends William to him, but if he's not around to tell, I don't see her trying to find him to tell him, you know?) 

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

16 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Laurel knowing about Felicity's pregnancy could be another sign she's leaving (at least Star City) soon. There was just something about the way she said she wouldn't tell anyone that had me a bit worried. Plus, they're really pushing the Felicity/Laurel friendship and Laurel's redemption a little too hard. 

I said last night, i thought she would Rat Felicity out.  Now, there's always the question of is this scripted or KC's crap acting?  You really never know.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

Son of a Bitch, Diaz might still be alive

Quote

The Ninth Circle is an international criminal organisation and bank. The board of directors are corrupt executives from varying, multinational corporations, who wear masks to conceal their identity. The lower members are forced to join: they're either kidnapped by the organisation itself, or they enlist the Underground Men. The captives are then given a "rebirth" in lava, burning their skin and somehow brainwashing them into mindless servants. To symbolise their membership, coins of nine circles are inserted in their eyes.

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KenyaJ

KenyaJ

1 hour ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Laurel knowing about Felicity's pregnancy could be another sign she's leaving (at least Star City) soon. There was just something about the way she said she wouldn't tell anyone that had me a bit worried. Plus, they're really pushing the Felicity/Laurel friendship and Laurel's redemption a little too hard. 

It reminds me of the episodes right before Laurel died when the show kept having Laurel/Oliver scenes to remind us they were friends so there would be some kind of emotional impact from her death.

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Trisha

Trisha

(edited)

Since William made a point of saying that the mini cassette looked like the one his grandparents' answering machine used, and we saw Oliver fill up Will's VM, are we all assuming that next week they're going to listen to the tape and it'll be filled with Oliver's messages begging the grandparents to put him in contact with William? Because that would be heartbreaking.

Edited by Trisha
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)
17 hours ago, Angel12d said:

I think she definitely killed Diaz but it wouldn't shock me if they don't frame it as her being evil? She'll have done it for her friend or something like that, haha.

Her biggest objection to killing Diaz was being the number one suspect so would him being back in slabside give her better access while also keeping her off the suspect list?  

What if it's just the guards that wanted revenge for him burning the prison and their coworkers?  The 9th Circle creepy thing is sounding more likely but Diaz has no shortage of people that would like to see him dead.  

6 hours ago, apinknightmare said:

I very much want him to quit but I don't see how he can quit and continue Green Arrowing without getting arrested at this point. 

Which is why Oliver should never have freaking outed himself no matter what.

12 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Since William made a point of saying that the mini cassette looked like the one his grandparents' answering machine used, and we saw Oliver fill up Will's VM, are we all assuming that next week they're going to listen to the tape and it'll be filled with Oliver's messages begging the grandparents to put him in contact with William? Because that would be heartbreaking.

It would be.  But still would't explain why Oliver and Felicity then never approached him ever.  I could kind of buy them being tricked by the Grandparents that William didn't want him to contact him and that Oliver would back off while he's a kid but once he hits 18, why wouldn't he approach him?  Are we supposed to believe that they just bought it so completely they never tried to mend fences ever again?  

Edited by BkWurm1
insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

2 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

It would be.  But still would't explain why Oliver and Felicity then never approached him ever.  I could kind of buy them being tricked by the Grandparents that William didn't want him to contact him and that Oliver would back off while he's a kid but once he hits 18, why wouldn't he approach him?  Are we supposed to believe that they just bought it so completely they never tried to mend fences ever again?  

Yeah, it's messy. I feel like the grandparents would have to convince Oliver and Felicity that 1) William hates them and blames them for everything that's happened to him, and 2) William's life would be in serious, serious danger if they even talk and if they care about him, they'll leave him alone?

Then they'd have to convince William that Oliver and Felicity never want to see or hear from him again? 

I don't get how any of this will make any sense. 

Also, stop making Oliver and Felicity suffer! 

I really hope that when they find Felicity, William finds out that it's his grandparents' fault and they don't just brush it aside. Seriously, why can't the Claytons ever be in the wrong? First Samantha's stupid ultimatum and the disappearing check to help her side, now her parents? 

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statsgirl

statsgirl

4 hours ago, insomniadreams88 said:

And if Laurel does end up betraying Felicity (leading to the 718 episode), that could contribute to Felicity's "paranoia" in the future, as Mia put it. She trusted someone, and they used what she told her against her. Therefore, Felicity decides that she can't trust anyone else with Mia's existence, hence anyone who's not part of OTA and especially not in SC — Roy and Dinah, I still say she leaves at some point this season in the present — is out of the loop. (I could see Felicity trusting Roy, which is why she sends William to him, but if he's not around to tell, I don't see her trying to find him to tell him, you know?) 

2 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

It would be.  But still would't explain why Oliver and Felicity then never approached him ever.  I could kind of buy them being tricked by the Grandparents that William didn't want him to contact him and that Oliver would back off while he's a kid but once he hits 18, why wouldn't he approach him?  Are we supposed to believe that they just bought it so completely they never tried to mend fences ever again?  

Beth got her gotchas for Mia and Oliver and Felicity abandoning William but I'll take my hat off to her if she can write her way out of this. We're twisting ourselves into knots trying to make this fit the characters that we know. The Oliver who took on William when Samantha died and the Felicity who defended him with her life wouldn't just give up like that. At the least, they would have had Barry look in on him from time to time.

2 hours ago, Trisha said:

Since William made a point of saying that the mini cassette looked like the one his grandparents' answering machine used, and we saw Oliver fill up Will's VM, are we all assuming that next week they're going to listen to the tape and it'll be filled with Oliver's messages begging the grandparents to put him in contact with William? Because that would be heartbreaking.

If we see that, I'm going to demand that Samantha's parents end up in jail, or at least be severely retaliated on. There is really no justification for keeping William away from Oliver given that they love each other. It's not just hurting Oliver and Felicity, it's hurting William too.

But doesn't William have his own phone? Unless his grandparents too it away, of course.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

5 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

But doesn't William have his own phone? Unless his grandparents too it away, of course.

He has his own phone. Felicity also set up an encrypted messaging thing for him to talk to Zoe while he was away. Central City is not on the other side of the planet or on another Earth. Oliver and Felicity will probably be there at some point during COIE, maybe even before all the craziness so they may have time to fit in a visit. (I have no idea how they'll set up/lead into/kick off COIE, so maybe not?) NONE OF THIS MAKES SENSE. 

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calliope1975

calliope1975

3 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Her biggest objection to killing Diaz was being the number one suspect so would him being back in slabside give her better access while also keeping her off the suspect list?  

True, but is anyone really looking for who (please oh please) killed Diaz? He was in a prison that until very recently treated its prisoners like crap, and oh by the way, he broke into it that one time specifically to kill a guy. And that one time he took the city hostage and the rest of the world shrugged.

I think the authorities could chalk it up to don't start none, won't be none and move on the next Big Bad who will terrorize the city in May.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

3 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Her biggest objection to killing Diaz was being the number one suspect so would him being back in slabside give her better access while also keeping her off the suspect list?  

Wasn't that because the plan was for BS to get close to Diaz and then set off the bomb? I thought her objection was as much to the plan?

BkWurm1

BkWurm1

2 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Wasn't that because the plan was for BS to get close to Diaz and then set off the bomb? I thought her objection was as much to the plan?

She didn't want to be caught. And the relatively public plan made her a main suspect though anyone in the know would blame Felicity just as much I would have thought.  (The tech)  Honestly if Felicity could remote hack his brain not sure why anyone would have to be anywhere close to set it off.   

KenyaJ

KenyaJ

Quote

Hudson will appear in episode 719 titled “Spartan” in the CW series. He portrays a Four Star General of the DIA (Defense Intelligence Agency) that Diggle (David Ramsey) is forced to reconnect with for a Team Arrow mission despite unresolved tension from their past.

This is awesome casting. I love Ernie Hudson so much. I have to assume the general is Diggle's dad and I'm so interested to find out why they have a strained relationship. (Although, are characters allowed to have anything other than strained relationships with their parents on this show?) Mostly, I'm just happy that after Monday night, I care about a storyline involving Diggle again.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Why oh why didn't they do a big casting announcement for Adrian Paul? Man, has he aged well!

FYI: Ernie Hudson is an American actor, who's best known for Ghostbusters - age 73, height 6'0" - here's his social media links...

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001368/
https://twitter.com/ernie_hudson
https://www.instagram.com/ernie_hudson/
http://erniehudsonofficial.com/

Edited by tv echo
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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

He's playing General Stewart. So if he turns out to be Diggle's dad, then that means John Diggle's real last name is Stewart!

Hmm... that certainly would be game-changing.

Quote

-- Per 719 casting breakdown for the role of General Stewart: "[GENERAL STEWART] Male, 60s-70s, African-American. A decorated American general who crosses Team Arrow's path on a dangerous mission. Stewart's brilliant military mind afforded him great success in a decades long career in the Army, but his greatest regret is his broken relationship with his mentee from the military, John Diggle... POSSIBLE RECURRING GUEST STAR." (Feb. 14, 2019 casting page in reddit user n80r's post, page 103 of Spoiler Discussion Sequel thread)

Edited by tv echo
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