Supernatural Bitterness & Unpopular Opinions: You All Suck

[Aeryn13]

I expected something completely different from Death`s last minute "the Darkness is the greatest evil that ever eviled" exposition in the Season 10 Finale but I guess my UO is then that I did like Amara as a character. And I liked the concept of her. That she wasn`t just out-and-out mustache-twirling but had a sympathetic side to her story. And Chuck wasn`t all golden. I also liked that she turned out to be his sister.

The entire lore of that, I really had no problem with. Even that the "fight" ended with a peaceful reconciliation was a nice touch. 

I just had problems with a lot of the execution. Her relationship with Dean was really underwritten because IMO the writers didn`t care so they half-assed it. Why did she not kill him but kiss him? Answer from the writers: "well, everyone can make up their own minds about it". Translation: "it really had no reason and we wanted to give the actors something to do in their scene, we don`t give a shit about that storyline". Yup, I noticed. 

And the reconciliation itself, the entire Finale was written lamely. Last second flower lady wasn`t needed to dilude everything so much. The Finale should have been much tighter written, drop the annoying interludes with Lady Toni, it`s enough she is in there as a cliffhanger at the end and make it a two-parter that is freaking epic. But nope, even the actors admitted everything was rushed to hell. Dabb just wrapped it up in a lackluster way to get to his new pet stories of BMOL and Mary for Season 12. And both were shit. 

Oh, and big UO: the standalone in Season 11 were godawful. Normally I like the standalones but apart from very few there were epic stinkbombs in this Season.

Edited May 7, 2018 by Aeryn13

[BabySpinach]

Quote

 

I expected something completely different from Death`s last minute "the Darkness is the greatest evil that ever eviled" exposition in the Season 10 Finale but I guess my UO is then that I did like Amara as a character. And I liked the concept of her. That she wasn`t just out-and-out mustache-twirling but had a sympathetic side to her story. And Chuck wasn`t all golden. I also liked that she turned out to be his sister.

The entire lore of that, I really had no problem with. Even that the "fight" ended with a peaceful reconciliation was a nice touch. 

I just had problems with a lot of the execution. Her relationship with Dean was really underwritten because IMO the writers didn`t care so they half-assed it. Why did she not kill him but kiss him? Answer from the writers: "well, everyone can make up their own minds about it". Translation: "it really had no reason and we wanted to give the actors something to do in their scene, we don`t give a shit about that storyline". Yup, I noticed. 

And the reconciliation itself, the entire Finale was written lamely. Last second flower lady wasn`t needed to dilude everything so much. The Finale should have been much tighter written, drop the annoying interludes with Lady Toni, it`s enough she is in there as a cliffhanger at the end and make it a two-parter that is freaking epic. But nope, even the actors admitted everything was rushed to hell. Dabb just wrapped it up in a lackluster way to get to his new pet stories of BMOL and Mary for Season 12. And both were shit. 

Oh, and big UO: the standalone in Season 11 were godawful. Normally I like the standalones but apart from very few there were epic stinkbombs in this Season.

 

I generally find that season 11 improves on rewatch. It was mostly focused all the way through and the story was pretty simple. I like that Dean got a cosmic win just by being himself and talking it out with God's sister, no shiny powers required. That nicely wrapped up the MoC arc, beginning with this ominous dark force that appeared only evil and destructive, then ending with that dark force finding peace herself. 

But while I liked the general outcome of the story, the execution could (as always) have been better. Dean and Amara's weird irresistible bond was never fully explained, and we got multiple possible answers that never solidifed. Is it because he was the first of God's creation she saw? Is it because his "light" drew her in? Is it because he bore the MoC? Is it because he was just a proxy for her brother? She obviously favored him, but how and for what reason?

I don't agree, however, that most of S11's standalones were godawful. I found them, in general, better than S10 and S12. Into the Mystic and Safe House are ones I find especially enjoyable. Red Meat and Just my Imagination may be the only ones that annoyed the shit out of me.

[DeeDee79]

1 minute ago, BabySpinach said:

I don't agree, however, that most of S11's standalones were godawful. I found them, in general, better than S10 and S12. Into the Mystic and Safe House are ones I find especially enjoyable. Red Meat and Just my Imagination may be the only ones that annoyed the shit out of me.

I agree that Red Meat and Just My Imagination aren't ones that I rewatch. I did love Into the Mystic and I'd also add Plush for an entertaining standalone. 

[BlueSapphire]

I don't think Amara and Dean had any chemistry at all, and she was such a ridiculously laughable character.  I had no interest in her at all.  The actress was awful.

Edited May 7, 2018 by BlueSapphire

[BabySpinach]

26 minutes ago, BlueSapphire said:

I don't think Amara and Dean had any chemistry at all, and she was such a ridiculously laughable character.  I had no interest in her at all.  The actress was awful.

I completely disagree with everything you said.

[Myrelle]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

I expected something completely different from Death`s last minute "the Darkness is the greatest evil that ever eviled" exposition in the Season 10 Finale but I guess my UO is then that I did like Amara as a character

Your UO is mine also. I liked the character and the actress and I LOVED that she was so Dean-focused. I even loved the S11 premiere and was totally surprised by it given all the big new storyline for Sam pimping that we got out of Dabb from Comic Con onward that summer.

But then the second episode happened and the season took the turn that I knew it would take after the lame-ass S10 finale.

The premiere and the finale are the only two episodes of S11 that I can really remember in any detail and that's likely because to me they're the ones that made that season palatable at all. All the rest of the episodes are predominantly a blur of mostly wasted potential and waiting for them to give Dean's storyline away, which thankfully they did not do, but which I'm sure Dabb got a big laugh out of teasing the fandom with in that one episode towards the end with Chuck.

I hated that they brought Chuck in as God, even while I loved that Amara/The Darkness was God's sister. I think that would have been a good/better season to bring back Michael, especially because they dusted off Lucifer yet again and brought him back for the third or fourth time.

I can't really remember any of the standalones unless I'm reminded of them, but IA that this season would also probably be better for me on a re-watch because I wouldn't be dreading the always hated bait and switch any more.

Edited May 7, 2018 by Myrelle

[BabySpinach]

54 minutes ago, DeeDee79 said:

I agree that Red Meat and Just My Imagination aren't ones that I rewatch. I did love Into the Mystic and I'd also add Plush for an entertaining standalone. 

I wish they'd stuck with the creepy giant rabbit head all the way through! It was simultaneously terrifying and hilarious. The genuine creep factor was what made the episode stand out to me, then that all went away when the rabbit head did. I always love myself some Donna, though. She's strong without being abrasive or arrogant, and bonus, she genuinely laughs at Dean's jokes.

[BlueSapphire]

12 minutes ago, BabySpinach said:

I completely disagree with everything you said.

Well, this is the Unpopular Opinion thread, is it not?

Another UO:  I may be the only person here who never cared about Crowley and wish he only would have been around a couple seasons, at best.  I also find Mark Sheppard kind of off-putting (even though I think the way his departure was treated was pretty crappy).

Edited May 7, 2018 by BlueSapphire

[DeeDee79]

9 minutes ago, BabySpinach said:

I always love myself some Donna, though. She's strong without being abrasive or arrogant, and bonus, she genuinely laughs at Dean's jokes.

Yes! They were so cute in this episode :)

[Katy M]

43 minutes ago, BlueSapphire said:

I don't think Amara and Dean had any chemistry at all, and she was such a ridiculously laughable character.  I had no interest in her at all.  The actress was awful.

I have this rule that I never judge an actor based on one role.  I can't possibly know how much the writing, directing or me just having a different vision of the character (or possibly just not liking the character) is contributing to my judgment.  But, I saw her in two other small roles on different things, I felt she was flat everywhere. 

[BabySpinach]

2 minutes ago, BlueSapphire said:

Well, this is the Unpopular Opinion thread, is it not?

Given that it's a discussion, too, elaboration on why you have that opinion may open up it up for conversation a bit better. Your opinion was brief and blunt, so I matched it in my response, that's all.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

Your UO is mine also. I liked the character and the actress and I LOVED that she was so Dean-focused. I even loved the S11 premiere and was totally surprised by it given all the big new storyline for Sam pimping that we got out of Dabb from Comic Con onward that summer.

But then the second episode happened and the season took the turn that I knew it would take after the lame-ass S10 finale.

The premiere and the finale are the only two episodes of S11 that I can really remember in any detail

Yeah, the Premiere pleasantly surprised me. 

It was kind of weird then, though, to bring Amara in as a baby and age her up when we already had seen her final form. I`d prefered either one thing or the other, as in bring the baby and age her up or have her be the Amara we met in the Premiere from the start.

The one standalone I can remember is the case of Lizzie Borden or something. That was pretty neat.

I liked Emily Swallows and had no problem with her chemistry with Dean. 

Of course I don`t think that in general the actors have sparked a lot with various longterm onscreen female partners. Dean had the best dynamics with some women in standalone episodes, as did Sam IMO. At least when it comes to anything that was played as "romance". 

Which might seem funny considering one of those dynamics led to a real life marriage but it just wasn`t one of those things where you know actors are dating and their characters, no matter what they do onscreen, just seem to set the screen on fire. Ruby 1 wasn`t that good and she had better chem than with Jared than Ruby 2.

Meanwhile, I`ve not seen Jensen spark so electrically than with Jessica Alba back in the day of Dark Angel.

In fairness sake, SPN is not and never was that kind of show. Which is okay.    

Edited May 7, 2018 by Aeryn13

[gonzosgirrl]

43 minutes ago, BabySpinach said:

Given that it's a discussion, too, elaboration on why you have that opinion may open up it up for conversation a bit better. Your opinion was brief and blunt, so I matched it in my response, that's all.

I could. not. stand. her or her character in The Mentalist (though possibly she suffered some hate-by-association of where they went with the show in general), but I quite liked her as Amara. And Emily Swallow herself is a truly delightful person - at least the person she shows herself to be on SM and at cons. She's a tiny little thing, and girlfriend can sang!

[Res]

My UO:

Don't like Donna - both the actress and the character rub me the wrong way.

I liked Amara ok and the actress but could tell that the writers didn't give a flip about actually doing anything with it. 

Another reason that I didn't care for any of S11 was it was supposed to have the worse evil EVAR! (even worse than Leviathans) release as a result of lifting an "unbreakable curse" that was the MoC which "created the 'Father of Murder'", started the KoH and created a reign of terror that lasted millenia. A curse that Cain could NOT in ALL his LONG life find the means to break. IOW, MONUMENTAL stuff!!! Should have HUGE consequences, right? 

Yeah, not so much. In the end, less people than were killed in the Apocalypse died, probably even less than Eve killed, and all this MONUMENTAL EVIL wanted was a good chat with big bro. 

MAJOR UO I HATED that they removed the Mark, especially for that crap.

[belbar]

14 minutes ago, Res said:

MAJOR UO I HATED that they removed the Mark, especially for that crap.

I loved the MOC arc too. People frequently complain that we didn't see anything. I don't agree. We saw the struggle in Dean. How we was loosing his battle with it. We saw his suffering and Jensen portrayed it beautifully. I liked the badass Dean, but I understood they couldn't take it any further. I wouldn't have like it if they'd done it because in the end it would've made Dean a villain. And I like him to be the good guy. Flawed but the good guy. So I uderstood that it was a limited story with a short life. What I hated is what they did with it.

All that drama and what we got in the end was Amara needing family therapy and God eating chinese with his feet on the table? really people? that was the best you could come up with?

[AwesomO4000]

13 minutes ago, devlin said:

I would love it if someone could ask the TPTB why they refuse to acknowledge the fact that dean has been to hell...

I have a theory, but it's in hindsight, and is probably up there with the probability of alien abduction in terms of being the actual reason, so I'd actually be interested in what they would say also... But on the minuscule chance that my theory was right, they wouldn't want to answer with the truth anyway.

[belbar]

26 minutes ago, AwesomO4000 said:

I have a theory, but it's in hindsight, and is probably up there with the probability of alien abduction in terms of being the actual reason, so I'd actually be interested in what they would say also... But on the minuscule chance that my theory was right, they wouldn't want to answer with the truth anyway.

I frequently have thought that it's Singer influence. His view of the character is very limited and constricted to the first view that Kripke had of it. He hasn't moved from it. It has worked that way until now. Let's not change it.

[BoxManLocke]

1 hour ago, DeeDee79 said:

So much word to this. What's laughable is that I actually saw fans complaining on Tumblr about why Sam's hell time has never been properly explored when they dared to mention Dean's hell time in The Scorpion & the Frog. Say what now???!!!

 

That was definitely not the best time to complain about it, but it is true that Sam's hell hasn't been explored in a way that's not extremely superficial and repetitive since season 7. That's precisely why it's been boring for a very long time ; they're not telling us anything new (well except the true face crap which makes no sense and was more about Rowena than Sam). The writers should have stopped talking about it long ago, but that would require them to create new stuff for Sam and they've been struggling with that for so, so long.

 

Totally agree that Dean's hell time has been shoved into the darkest, most remote corner of the writers room after season 4, which is a shame, and I totally understand people wanting more out of this. But seeing how they've been treating Sam's hell for such a long time, I'd say be careful what you wish for.

Still, I get why everyone got ecstatic at the sheer mention of that during the fake Crowley heist episode. It's an untapped well of potentially really cool stories involving one of the brothers. There ain't a lot of them left on the show.

Edited May 8, 2018 by BoxManLocke

[trxr4kids]

2 hours ago, SueB said:

With the personification of Dean's torment killed in S4, they'd need to come up with a different way of making his hell time a plot point.  

I'm just spit ballin here but maybe a good time would've been after he'd become a demon and been cured but still retained the mark and the potential to become that again. Sigh.

[Bobcatkitten]

It's interesting that we all see different things in the same show. I feel generally like Dean has had the lion's share of the storyarcs and is the badass/better character. That's what I see maybe because I fixate on Dean.

[belbar]

2 hours ago, Etoile said:

. The tenor of those complaints was that they were ignoring Sam's Hell issues in favor of Dean and enough with erasing Sam's trauma. As if it wasn't explored and referenced to so many times nobody can ever ignore or forget it (that makes those complaints biased IMO that they came on the heel of referencing Dean's Hell storyline after years of complete silence). Personally I didn't need to fanwank that Dean quailified for the spell because it was sort of made clear by the episode that the crossroad deal was the relevant part, but I see how that didn't work for everybody. It was badly written and I definitely agree with that but it is even more badly written that in years of torture references and exploration of trauma related to it,  especially in recent episodes, they act as if Dean wasn't a victim of torture as well. Does Dean not qualify for it? I think it's evident he does. So why they go out of their way to ignore that life-changing experience in one of their two leads when they are dealing with the same subject? This is what I can't understand and there is no explanation  that makes that bad writing work for me. 

Totally agree.

[gonzosgirrl]

17 minutes ago, belbar said:

Not a lot of Sam's stories you mean? because Dean's stories have always been systematically ignored.

Then again, you're right, be careful what you ask for. So sad.

This is where my bitterness lies. I've become so disheartened with where Dabb takes the stories that I'd rather he doesn't touch my darlings, like Dean's Hell, or Benny, or a potential Dean/John confrontation. I'd rather they leave me to my head-canon than butcher something into actual canon that I wouldn't be able to live with. See: Mary Winchester. No thank you.

[belbar]

8 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

This is where my bitterness lies. I've become so disheartened with where Dabb takes the stories that I'd rather he doesn't touch my darlings, like Dean's Hell, or Benny, or a potential Dean/John confrontation. I'd rather they leave me to my head-canon than butcher something into actual canon that I wouldn't be able to live with. See: Mary Winchester. No thank you.

Totally agree. (You see our psyquic connection at hard work again) ;)

[gonzosgirrl]

26 minutes ago, SueB said:

At SPNUK Jared flat out said the actress was lovely but Sam wouldn't have moved in with her.  Did you know that?

What was the question that precipitated that response? Did he elaborate, ie, poor writing/characterization? It's not often we hear either of them criticize actual content of the show. I'm fascinated!

[Bobcatkitten]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

What was the question that precipitated that response? Did he elaborate, ie, poor writing/characterization? It's not often we hear either of them criticize actual content of the show. I'm fascinated!

Someone asked if they ever get scripts and say "what the heck. X would never do that." That was when Jared said Sam would never have lived with Amelia. And they said all the time. Said sometimes they push back and writers still win and they must play it whether they agree or not. Sometimes writers find a middle ground to meet them. Sometimes J2 simply changes it without telling them. 

[gonzosgirrl]

41 minutes ago, Bobcatkitten said:

Someone asked if they ever get scripts and say "what the heck. X would never do that." That was when Jared said Sam would never have lived with Amelia. And they said all the time. Said sometimes they push back and writers still win and they must play it whether they agree or not. Sometimes writers find a middle ground to meet them. Sometimes J2 simply changes it without telling them. 

Interesting, thanks! I've heard them say things a few times about lines - the time they said they switched lines between D/S and it worked better comes to mind - and I recall something about Dean talking about Cas's trenchcoat after he exploded into Leviathan goo. But whole storylines - that's a first for me. 

[BoxManLocke]

1 hour ago, Bobcatkitten said:

Said sometimes they push back and writers still win and they must play it whether they agree or not. Sometimes writers find a middle ground to meet them. Sometimes J2 simply changes it without telling them. 

 

I'm not sure how I feel about this tbh. Lack of communication is clearly already a huge issue between the writers themselves, and if it carries on between writers and cast/crew as well, is it really such a good thing ?

Nevertheless, I can't wait for Jared & Jensen to share their Dabb/BuckLeming stories as well. They always wait a few years until people leave before spilling the beans, which is the right thing to do. But to see them constantly praise hacks like BuckLeming because they have no other choice is physically painful.

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, Bobcatkitten said:

Someone asked if they ever get scripts and say "what the heck. X would never do that." That was when Jared said Sam would never have lived with Amelia. And they said all the time.

I don't know why Jared would even say that. Sam lived with Jessica. Why wouldn't he live with Amelia?

I am not doubting that Jared said it, but I don't know what he's thinking.

Edited May 8, 2018 by catrox14

[MysteryGuest]

Regarding season 11, I also tend to like it more now on re-watch than I did the first go round.  Part of my issue with Amara was that I couldn't figure out exactly where they were going with her character.  I don't think they could either, frankly.  But I really enjoyed Emily's performances in the last few episodes of the season.  I thought she was especially good in her initial confrontation with Chuck.  You couldn't help but feel for her, and it didn't paint Chuck in the best light.  Ultimately, I liked how the season ended.  And I enjoyed the stand-alone episodes, for the most part.  I'll even confess to liking Red Meat, in spite of the implausibility of it all.  I thought the female guest star was very good, but the guy who played her husband made my skin crawl for some reason.  

Edited May 8, 2018 by MysteryGuest

[BoxManLocke]

Amara may have failed to live up to the insane promises of early season 11, but she was still a really interesting character for the mythology and most importantly she actually had a valid reason to be pissed at the world. This alone makes her more interesting and fleshed out than any other big bad since season 5.

Edited May 8, 2018 by BoxManLocke

[companionenvy]

53 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I don't know why Jared would even say that. Sam lived with Jessica. Why wouldn't he live with Amelia?

I am not doubting that Jared said it, but I don't know what he's thinking.

I'll buy Sam living with Amelia myself, but Sam's in a really different place by S8 than he is when he was living with Jessica. I suppose Jared thinks that Sam was beyond wanting or thinking he could have a normal life. 

I guess my UO on the Amelia arc is that while I'll agree it was awful all-round, I don't actually think that Sam not looking for Dean or running away from hunting was that terrible. The only really bad thing he did was give up on looking for Kevin. Early S8 Sam was obviously grieving under the assumption that Dean was dead, and I can see him simply not having the emotional resources for what must have looked to him like a pretty hopeless search for Dean - especially given the results of his last futile effort to save Dean from his deal and then to get him out of hell. Yes, it would have been preferable for him to continue at least low-key research into possibilities for where Dean was (Purgatory was a reasonable guess, but not the self-evident destination)  and whether there might be a way of saving him, but again, I can see where a depressed Sam coming off a year of Hellucinations, the death of Bobby, etc decided that he couldn't do it. I think the show could have done a better job articulating or otherwise conveying this, but again, I don't think the decision itself is the problem. 

Here's a counterfactual: what would have happened if Sam had committed himself to saving Dean and Cas? I suppose, if he assumed that they were in purgatory, he could have started by looking up lore on Purgatory - with limited resources, given that this was pre-bunker and post-destruction of Bobby's -- as a low-risk option. But at some point, it presumably would have required the usual insanely risky behaviors: binding Death, summoning demons, seeking out reapers, trying dangerous spells, making a bargain with Crowley, etc. In other words, exactly the kind of stuff he did last time, and led to an apocalypse. Not incidentally, also the same stuff he did next time, causing another apocalypse. 

[MysteryGuest]

8 minutes ago, companionenvy said:

Not incidentally, also the same stuff he did next time, causing another apocalypse. 

There's an apocalypse around every corner on this show...we really need to get used to it.

[Casseiopeia]

2 hours ago, catrox14 said:

I don't know why Jared would even say that. Sam lived with Jessica. Why wouldn't he live with Amelia?

I am not doubting that Jared said it, but I don't know what he's thinking.

Jared has said a few times lately that he didn't like the Amelia story line.  I think that maybe because Sam and Amelia had absolutely no chemistry with each other might have played a part? Or that could be my personal opinion.

[enaiowen]

12 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

This is where my bitterness lies. I've become so disheartened with where Dabb takes the stories that I'd rather he doesn't touch my darlings, like Dean's Hell, or Benny, or a potential Dean/John confrontation. I'd rather they leave me to my head-canon than butcher something into actual canon that I wouldn't be able to live with. See: Mary Winchester. No thank you.

This is exactly my concern about any Dean/Michael storyline.

It's not something I've ever really wanted to begin with so if I do have to be subjected to it AND they screw things up in process, it will be a *double* whammy for me and I will not be a happy camper.  At all.

[AwesomO4000]

1 hour ago, companionenvy said:

Not incidentally, also the same stuff he did next time, causing another apocalypse. 

Heh - yeah they were going to go there anyway... I personally would've rather skipped Amelia and the closing hell's gates that wasn't going to happen myself and gone straight to the consequences. Then Dean could've had some more time in purgatory - as I suspect was originally intended by sending him there - and Sam could've saved Kevin and had some nice bonding of his own, and together Sam and Kevin could've done stuff to get Dean out and started the apocalypse that way. Dean could've still gotten the mark of Cain to somehow help with the apocalypse fighting  - Abaddon still could've been involved somehow  or just go straight to Metatron (who I loved to hate) - and maybe Sam could've done something also. Dean could've become brothers in arms with Benny without the questionable Benny needing Dean in order to escape thing or they could've kept that, but made it an unknowing joint effort between both sides. Just about anything but what we got in my opinion.

Most of the arcs in season 8 just seemed abbreviated and not leading to anything anyway, so I wouldn't have minded skipping them and getting right to the point. And I didn't like the flashback way of telling the stories. They were often awkwardly fit into the episodes and couldn't really evolve satisfactorily anyway, in my opinion. Just tell the story from where we left off with other ways to show passage of time over the season.

[catrox14]

11 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

Jared has said a few times lately that he didn't like the Amelia story line.  I think that maybe because Sam and Amelia had absolutely no chemistry with each other might have played a part? Or that could be my personal opinion.

I get that he didn't like it. That's not new information from Jared. What I think is weird is that he thinks Sam wouldn't have lived with her.  I don't see why he wouldn't since he was out of the hunting life and seeking normal.  

[AwesomO4000]

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I get that he didn't like it. That's not new information from Jared. What I think is weird is that he thinks Sam wouldn't have lived with her.  I don't see why he wouldn't since he was out of the hunting life and seeking normal. 

Even though I'm not sure I agree with the choice to have Sam go for normal again - I thought they were past that - say I went with it... even then the scenario seemed bizarre to me. Sam as a handyman? Why? That's not even one of Sam's skill sets that we knew of. Somehow to me it seems odd he'd just be able to all of a sudden fix air conditioners and garbage disposals. If Sam was going to work with his hands - which I imagine would be cathartic for him and a way to do something and still grieve -  I would imagine something with plants or animals... why not have bitchy lady have him help out at the shelter with the dogs - which Sam loves - or on a ranch or something. Something more up Sam's alley, in my opinion. A handyman just seems so random to me and not something I would consider Sam not getting restless doing and then wanting to go right back out in the field to go hunting again.

As for Jared thinking Sam wouldn't have lived with her, maybe it was the "too soon" thing on Amelia's and his part. With Dean's loss hanging over Sam and her husband's loss hanging over Amelia, maybe Jared thought it was too soon for both of them?

[Casseiopeia]

31 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I get that he didn't like it. That's not new information from Jared. What I think is weird is that he thinks Sam wouldn't have lived with her.  I don't see why he wouldn't since he was out of the hunting life and seeking normal.  

Jared did say that nothing against Liane she is very sweet but he didn't think Sam would have lived with her.  He didn't elaborate but I thought he meant that she was supposed to be the love of Sam's life.  I don't think Jared felt like that came off very well because there just wasn't any chemistry between the actors/characters.

[catrox14]

8 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

Jared did say that nothing against Liane she is very sweet but he didn't think Sam would have lived with her.  He didn't elaborate but I thought he meant that she was supposed to be the love of Sam's life.  I don't think Jared felt like that came off very well because there just wasn't any chemistry between the actors/characters.

That's interesting. I never thought Amelia was the love of Sam's life but didn't question him moving in with her.  I figured it was about right.  The handyman thing seemed more unlikely than Sam living with her.

I just always find it interesting what the actors think compared to what I think and interpret.  

[AwesomO4000]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

I never thought Amelia was the love of Sam's life but didn't question him moving in with her. 

Maybe Jared equated those things because Sam lived with Jess who Sam did love and considered marrying.

As for Amelia being the love of his life, I didn't see it either... but I think the show wanted us to for some bizarre reason. I got that idea from that ridiculous (for me) scenario in "Goodbye Stranger" where Sam discusses Amelia with Meg of all people, and it is implied that Sam thought Amelia had been worth giving up hunting for and made him think he wanted "normal" with etc. etc. - so still trying to push Amelia as this great love of Sam's life even when it obviously wasn't working. Bleh.

[gonzosgirrl]

Off the current topic, but man, remember when we had scenes like this? So much tension and suspense and not an archangel in sight. I miss this so much.

[FlickChick]

7 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Off the current topic, but man, remember when we had scenes like this? So much tension and suspense and not an archangel in sight. I miss this so much.

No kidding - look at that excellent editing! I'm lucky in that I can still watch the early seasons (or the best of the later ones) and still appreciate what a great show it is - current problems notwithstanding. My problem lies with watching the current season with back-to-back poorly written, edited, or presented episodes each week and a great lack of the boys I came to watch. Too bad...

[Pondlass1]

Nowadays a  great scene like that would be interrupted by Luci fiddling with his grace.  

It's interesting that Jared would say Sam would never have lived with Amelia - has he ever admitted Sam would never have not looked for Dean?

Edited May 10, 2018 by Pondlass1

[Myrelle]

Sorry, wrong thread.

Edited May 10, 2018 by Myrelle

[Lemuria]

9 hours ago, Pondlass1 said:

It's interesting that Jared would say Sam would never have lived with Amelia - has he ever admitted Sam would never have not looked for Dean?

Yep.  Around Comic Con (between season 7 and season 8), JP said that Sam had no idea where to start and nobody to turn to and he took as his cue, so he decided not to even look.  He now had "no anchor" and he was "free" and he decided to make a clean break.  Also, he "enjoyed" himself.  

Dean who?  Kevin who?  And really, Sam, there were no experienced hunters left to look up, even if you'd never met them before?

[Casseiopeia]

9 hours ago, Pondlass1 said:

Nowadays a  great scene like that would be interrupted by Luci fiddling with his grace.  

It's interesting that Jared would say Sam would never have lived with Amelia - has he ever admitted Sam would never have not looked for Dean?

He has at a few conventions in the last few years and Sam has said it too.  My issue wasn't that he didn't look for Dean if we buy into the fact that he believed that Dean and Cas were dead.  It was that he abandoned Kevin.  I never understood why Carver and Singer didn't think that through a little more.  They threw the character way too far under the bus.   I have read in retrospect Carver admitted they tried to move on as quickly as they could because that story line clearly was not working.

[mertensia]

My newest UO: I don't actually care who gets what kill. 

[MysteryGuest]

32 minutes ago, mertensia said:

My newest UO: I don't actually care who gets what kill. 

I don't either.  I'd be thrilled if the cleaning woman took out Lucifer.

[mertensia]

7 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I don't either.  I'd be thrilled if the cleaning woman took out Lucifer.

Or Marvin the Martian at this point.

[Jeddah]

1 hour ago, mertensia said:

My newest UO: I don't actually care who gets what kill. 

I agree with that too! Even John Winchester sent the boys to kill the YED in Salvation. If that obsessed man just wanted the job done, and didn’t care who did it, then I won’t worry about it either.