S09.E22: Stairway To Heaven

[Guest]

After a massive attack on the angels, Castiel calls Sam and Dean for help. As they leave, Dean’s eagerness to bring the First Blade doesn’t go unnoticed by Sam who is worried about the cost to his brother whenever he uses the Blade. Meanwhile, Castiel is shocked when he learns the angel that caused the attack was one of his followers and did it in his name. Dean discovers there is a conspiracy amongst Castiel’s angel followers and at the heart of it is Tessa, the Reaper.

 

 

[Jediknight]

So does Death just not care that Tessa went rogue, and joined Metatron?  You'd figure he'd have something to say about one of his reapers leaving, not to mention the havoc Metatron has caused.

 

Loved the Last Crusade reference.  Massive props for that.

[NoWillToResist]

I find it hard to believe that so many angels throughout the course of the show have been all "ooh, the rebel Castiel! You're famous! You're a legend!" yet continue to throw the "Dean or Us" ultimatums at Castiel. Like, do they not know how that shit always ends up? Good grief.

Edited May 14, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[ElleryAnne]

Aw, Castiel has been catching up on pop culture.  That's cute. 

 

Also cute - the Agents Spears and Aguilera stuff.

 

Less cute - everything else.  Dean is making me very uneasy.  I may be watching next week's episode with my hands over my eyes.

[NoWillToResist]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the whole "Cas chose Dean over his army" thing. I mean...that shit is HUGE.

 

Yeah, he's sided with Dean before but this? Cas has been trying to fix Heaven and right his wrongs since he slaughtered a bunch of angels when he was God. He went through a lot in S8 to try and close Heaven and that blew up in his face and he's been busting his ass in S9 to try and get his family back home. Yet, after all his efforts, he turned his back on it all rather than kill Dean. Wow.

 

Cas and Dean's reactions to Cas holding the angel blade were just loaded with the muted horror of deja vu (echoes of the crypt scene), IMO.

 

And Dean's face when Cas was given that ultimatum? You could almost see him assume that Cas would kind of HAVE to kill him. He didn't even plead for his life because IMO he knows how difficult a decision it would be for Cas but Cas would serve the 'greater good' and get his people home. Yet, Cas said no.

 

In the past, most of Cas' rebellious decisions really only had negative implications for himself but in this case, he's basically said "yeah, fuck y'all. I'm not hurting Dean for you, so you're on your own, assholes. Find your own way home, if you can." 

 

I am very glad that Dean has acknowledged that Cas did all of that for HIM. Not some higher purpose or greater good or lofty reason. He just chose Dean over his family and Heaven. Again. That loyalty better pay dividends!

[LittleIggy]

Please let Jumbotron get killed next week. He looks like a monkey, an ugly monkey.

[catrox14]

I teared up too many goddamn times in this episode.  I do not like scary!Dean. Jensen is too good and it's really upsetting me. Take it back, I don't want demon!Dean at all. :(

 

Cas choosing Dean over his army. I teared up. 

 

I just don't even know what to think at all. 

 

All I know is Jensen is awesome and I am scared to death for Dean's welfare :(. 

Did I mention that Cas chose Dean over his angel army? 

 

Cas CHOSE Dean over his angel army. 

 

Cas chose DEAN over his angel army.

[livelaughloveSPN]

Please let Jumbotron get killed next week. He looks like a monkey, an ugly monkey.

This.

Thank you.

[livelaughloveSPN]

The fact that Cas gave up his ENTIRE army for Dean (oh and despite the fact he knows Dean is losing it, just a bit...) made me love Cas more. I didn't even know that was possible. Smart move finally announcing that Misha is going to be a regular on season 10. Even though I don't see why there would have been any other option to consider in the first place.

In case anyone needed more evidence that Jensen is amazing, he scared me in this episode. And I'm convinced Dean will cause my heart to break into a million pieces during the finale. I guess that won't be much different than any other season finale of Supernatural, though.

At least this episode brought back the sass and humor us fans know and love.

"I assume it's because 7 is a prime number. Prime numbers can be intimidating."

[starrysuki]

 

Cas chose DEAN over his angel army.

That was hugh and I hope Dean can finally get past Cas actions regarding the Purgatory souls and Godstiel. That scene with the two of them just warmed my heart. It's too bad it was cut short by Gadriel's arrival. For a moment there is almost looked like Cas was going to cry when Dean said he believed him. Great acting from the two of them. I'm excited but I also dread the finale. One more week than the long hiatus till the fall.

[Lrdmordain]

I thought Tessa was a reaper, not an angel?

[Guest]

I thought Tessa was a reaper, not an angel?

 

Tessa is a reaper.  Did they just backdoor some lore there?  Are reapers now supposed to be angels?

[NoWillToResist]

 

The fact that Cas gave up his ENTIRE army for Dean (oh and despite the fact he knows Dean is losing it, just a bit...) made me love Cas more.

 

I found it very interesting that, once they returned to the bunker, Dean went off on Sam but then 3 seconds later, is all sweet and smiling and supportive with Cas. Aww.

 

 

Please let Jumbotron get killed next week.

 

I don't like his apparent obsession with Cas. I mean, he's said how much he likes Cas, he listed off the traits which make him lovable etc. But the thing that worries me the most? That he was trying on a trenchcoat. I'm not sure whether that's an ominous sign (will try to 'replace' Cas?) or another sign that Metatron just doesn't get it: it's not how Cas appears which is so appealing/lovable, but what's INSIDE him...and Metatron can't hope to equal that. Because he's a total dick.

 

I did love Gadreel's constant side-eying at Metatron, particularly when Metatron insisted that he was lovable. Gad's raised eyebrow and entire facial expression just screamed "....dude, really? Wow."

 

And speaking of 'wow' - Dean's "wow" to Cas' FBI names was just like Crowley and Abaddon's reaction to Gavin's idiocy. Hee!

[elzin]

Maybe reapers are "angels of death." That's all I got.

[catrox14]

So apparently there is a bit of a meltdown in twitterland and there is a perception that this episode was a big fuck you to viewers that care about the Winchester brothers relationship. I didn't get that idea at all. 

 

I thought it was showing that Sam is trying to figure out what the deal with Dean is but that Sam still has his issues with Dean.  Dean going 'Deantatorship" apparently meant that Sam is being written out of the show or something.  I don't get that at all.

[Lrdmordain]

My issue with saying Reapers are now Angels ( of death) is that we saw, and correct me if I'm wrong, Tess get taken over by a demon to bring Dean out of his coma as part of his dad's deal with yellow eyes back in season 2. 

 

If Reapers are angels then that would mean that demons can posses angels which just raises huge questions of why they aren't doing that the time. 

Edited May 14, 2014 by Lrdmordain

[NoWillToResist]

 

there is a perception that this episode was a big fuck you to viewers that care about the Winchester brothers relationship /snip/ Dean going 'Deantatorship" apparently meant that Sam is being written out of the show or something

 

Oh, FFS. Yeah, Sam is being written out of SPN. Jesus Christ. (frustration not directed at you.)

 

I felt it was clear that the Blade is affecting Dean and is getting its hooks into him.

 

 

If Reapers are angels then that would mean that demons can posses angels which just raises huge questions of why they aren't doing that the time.

 

Which is why I was so shocked when we were presented with the Crowley/Gadreel/Sam clusterfuck. If a demon can possess an angelically occupied vessel, why did no demon ever try this in earlier seasons? Why aren't they trying it NOW?

 

Maybe this will lead to Metatron finding a way to possess Cas (foreshadowed by him trying on a trenchcoat at the beginning of the episode).

Edited May 14, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[Julia]

I thought Reapers were personifications of death (or maybe that's just Pterry Pratchett).

[ElleryAnne]

perception that this episode was a big fuck you to viewers that care about the Winchester brothers relationship.

 

 

I didn't see it as a fuck-you to the fans.  I did have serious problems with Dean acting that way, but I figured it was just meant to reinforce how messed up Dean is now.  It was horrible to watch, though, and I don't like Dean this way.  I'm consoling myself with the belief that, like Soulless Sam, MoC Dean is not permanent.

[NoWillToResist]

 

I did have serious problems with Dean acting that way, but I figured it was just meant to reinforce how messed up Dean is now.

 

Precisely. Dean's entire focus all his life has been Sam. For HIM to cut Sam out? That's a bloody big flashing red WARNING! WARNING! alarm.

[catrox14]

I will say that I agree it's not a fuck you to the fans or to Sam.

 

I did actually like the "dictatorship" line to the degree that Dean is like "Dude this is how it's gonna be" until Metatron is dead. And logically, based on mission needs, Dean is right here. Couple that with the 'no brothers' and 'more bad than good' thing and Sam still not really making it clear to Dean that he still thinks of them as brothers, I think Dean feels abandoned by Sam, rightly or wrongly IMO that is Dean's perception  Dean going this route with the Blade makes sense.  And given what we know about the supposed 'walking the earth alone' part of the Mark of Cain curse in common lore, the further separation from Sam, works.  I don't fucking like it because I'm so damn worried about Dean right now, but storywise...IMO it fits.

 

I just kind of shook my head at some of the things I read and wondered what y'all thought about it.

re Azazel and Tessa.  I thought that was a temporary possession of Tessa by Azazel to grant John's request.  I thought once Azazel was killed that he would be out of Tessa.  so to speak

[supposebly]

What I find problematic is that the show doesn't seem to know whether this is a good or a bad thing. Blade good, not focusing on Sam bad? Blade bad, not focusing on Sam good?

 

Is it supposed to be good not to focus on Sam? I think yes, that's what Sam wants and that's what Dean needs to learn since that's how they got here in the first place. However, will he have learned this after they get rid of the blade?

 

If the blade is the only reason not to focus on Sam, then it's not good. If it's resolved by getting rid of the blade and getting back to focusing on Sam, not so good.

 

I hope there is a better plan because his speech at the end of season 8 ties into his whole development. That there is nothing he would put before Sam.

 

Years of unsubtle writing makes me wonder if they know the difference between repercussions and actual character growth?

[NoWillToResist]

 

What I find problematic is that the show doesn't seem to know whether this is a good or a bad thing. Blade good, not focusing on Sam bad? Blade bad, not focusing on Sam good?

 

Hee. Welcome to the SPN writing: fucked either way.

 

The boys just need to embrace the motto: everything in moderation.   :)

[catrox14]

 

I hope there is a better plan because his speech at the end of season 8 ties into his whole development. That there is nothing he would put before Sam.

 

Taking this to the all seasons thread...(there is one right?)

[bluebonnet]

There are a lot of episodes this season that have been really terrible (nearly all of the MotW ones and definitely the Bloodlines pilot) but the serial plot has me really captivated.  When I go back and watch some of the episodes, I get really excited watching this slow build up to Dean being the big bad.  Ackles is incredible with this.  Over the years, we've watched Dean try so hard and get emotionally beat down.  The warmth in Dean was always still there but it has become a bit more muted than it was in the early seasons.  This season we've seen Dean sort of emotionally collapse, and he's starting to look and act like he did in "The End".  

 

I had thought that Abaddon and Metatron were the big bads.  That made the series feel so unbalanced because it just felt like too much and too scattered.  It's seeming more and more that these were mere plot devices to highlight The Dean Story.  He starts off with this noble act in I Think I'm Gonna Like it Here with saving Sam, but you know, good intentions roads to hell.  The manner of saving was violating and made me very uncomfortable with Dean at the time.  It also ended up jeopardizing most of his close relationships (though Charlie benefited because she would be dead without an angel nearby and btw I hope Charlie returns from Oz soon).  Then we have him jumping on board with the MoC, another good intentions thing, but again, road to hell, probably more literally this time.  The slow burn of the MoC was maddening for a while because I just really wanted to know what it was all about RIGHT NOW and they wouldn't give it.  

 

Now that I've looked back and especially with Stairway to Heaven, I find it pretty exciting, even with some of the dialogue stumbles (and yeah, I'll admit that it really only works so well if I pretend most of the MotW episodes don't exist).  This new Dean doesn't come out of nowhere.  It's not confusing because it was a slow burn and feels earned.  It's chilling watching Dean not sleep or kill and torture with such fury.  That final scene where he just got this look of total rage before swiping Gadreel with the blade scared me in a way the monsters used to.  And the way he acted in the bunker, the Deantatorship speech, was so reminiscent of 2014 Dean in The End.  

 

I hope the MoC story carries over into next season and I really hope it doesn't fizzle out quickly.  I'd hate for it to be tied up in 10x01 like the Godstiel thing was.  Ackles can sell this so well and while it's troubling to watch Dean as 'the bad', it's still really exciting tv, imo.  It feels new and refreshing.  

 

Ok, that was long, but now more on the episode.  I'm so confused about reapers being angels.  I don't really have an issue of reapers being angels of death or whatever, but it just seemed odd because I can't remember a time when anything like that was mentioned.  It puts a bit hole in the demon possession thing.  I figured powerful demons could possess reapers, though i assume they wouldn't do it for fear of death or retaliation by other reapers or something.  I don't know, it made sense at the time.  Just like Crowly possessing Samdreel made sense because Gad/Sam was still injured and also powered down due to being locked up in angel proofing stuff.  But  now that reapers are supposed to be angels, and all the angels are/were several weakened and injured from the fall, why didn't the demons, especially abaddon, use that?  

 

I'm also a little disappointed that Tessa was so suddenly dispatched.  I understood that listening to the screams from the souls unable to enter heaven would be maddening, but it felt so unTessa.  She's always been the steadfast reaper, not easily threatened or rattled.  It's too bad there hadn't been another reaper we had gotten to know who could have taken her place in that plot.  We didn't even get Tessa mentioning anything about Death not responding to any calls of aid from his reapers.  Julian Richings might not be available (he's on Orphan Black right now) but still, a little bit of talk to let us know that the characters remember he still exists would have gone a long way to make Tessa's involvement more believable.  Because seriously, she was going to blow up a bunch of humans who would end up being more screaming souls in the veil?  That just didn't make sense, at least not for Tessa.  

 

Ok, sorry for the wall of text but I really liked this episode and really enjoying Dark!Dean.

[catrox14]

I can't say I'm "enjoying" dark!Dean because last night I actually cried after Dean attacked the angel with such ferocity.  But yet Ackles is so goddamn good that it's actually freaking me out and I want it but I don't. 

 

SystemRemote, I really like you pointing out future!Dean. I would be so fucking happy if they tied this MoC back to The End in someway given that we are in 2014 now. 

[NoWillToResist]

 

It's not confusing because it was a slow burn and feels earned.  It's chilling watching Dean not sleep or kill and torture with such fury.  That final scene where he just got this look of total rage before swiping Gadreel with the blade scared me in a way the monsters used to.

 

I was saddened by, but loved nonetheless, Castiel's observation that Dean was always angry but that he was even more so these days. Made me think of the Hulk. Guess we're about to see Dean's version of the big, green guy?

 

I also found it very interesting that Dean brought up the whole Godstiel/Purgatory business. Back in season 7's the Born Again Identity, Dean appeared to dismiss and forgive Cas' actions as "you did the best you could at the time" and then there was the whole "I'd rather have you, cursed or not" blah blah forgiveness-cakes. I have not had a whiff of disgruntlement or bad feelings from Dean re: Cas all season (quite the opposite, in fact), so I can't help but feel that there's a reason it was trotted out now. I'm just not sure whether it was to serve as a startling contrast to Cas giving everything up for Dean (again), thus reinforcing their trust/bond; or whether it was to show, along with his anger-dump on Sam, that All Is Not Well with Dean.

 

Dean seemed to be able to find his emotional equilibrium again with Cas by the end of the episode, presumably due to Cas' very clear demonstration of love/loyalty/support towards Dean. But it didn't transfer to Sam, who appears to still be lacking the Big Gesture which would allow Dean to feel loved, trusted and valued by him again.

 

Buried grievances are coming up and old, hurt feelings are resurfacing. Is this an effect of the MoC? Does it bring the dark, buried emotions to the surface and then consume the bearer of the mark, thus necessitating an outlet for that re-surfaced rage?

 

I will be interested to see whether a grand gesture from Sam would be enough to snap Dean out of the MoC's thrall.

 

ETA: on the lighter side...I love SPN fans...hee!

Edited May 15, 2014 by NoWillToResist

[Scaper4]

I was yelling at Dean at the end of episode.  He is definitely going to the "dark side".  The look on his face as Sam and Cas tried to pull him away from Gadreel was terrifying.  He just looked bloodthirsty.  I didn't appreciate the way he was treating Sam either.  

 

Loved the pop references in this episode--Lord of the Rings, Raiders!  Geek heaven!  And I answered the riddle before Sam did!  Cas' attempt to answer it was hilarious!

[2Old2BAFangirl]

 

ETA: on the lighter side...I love SPN fans...hee!

 

OMG, that's just hilarious!!  I don't ship Destiel in any way, shape or form, but that was just too freakin' funny!!  Thanks for sharing it!!

[NoWillToResist]

You're welcome. It's not even really Destiel, IMO; pretty sure Cas' loyalty/devotion to Dean is just factual at this point. :)

 

And considering that angels are STILL wasting their time asking him to choose between X and Dean is just...ridiculous at this point. Newborns in the SPN-verse probably know it's a waste of time!

 

No wonder God left. Probably got tired of these forgetful dimwits asking him shit they should already know. ;)

[catrox14]

I totally heard Cas' voice with the "DEEEEEANNNN"

[msbeesknees]

Please let Jumbotron get killed next week. He looks like a monkey, an ugly monkey.

 

Ugh, agreed. Booger as a villain just never worked for me. I mean, he's just... Booger. Will always be. Booger. With shitty teeth.

 

Also, Gadreel, Cas and Dean all together in one scene is giving me total eyegasms. It got me reminiscing about those wondrous Cas, Dean and Benny purgatory days of yore. Just lots of feels. Lots..

[Julia]

It's the Moonlighting curse again. A million years ago, the actor who plays Metatron was the office manager's annoying boyfriend for the last few seasons.

I want his character to be killed, because come on, but I think he's doing a pretty good job, all things considered.

[DittyDotDot]

My issue with saying Reapers are now Angels ( of death) is that we saw, and correct me if I'm wrong, Tess get taken over by a demon to bring Dean out of his coma as part of his dad's deal with yellow eyes back in season 2. 

 

If Reapers are angels then that would mean that demons can posses angels which just raises huge questions of why they aren't doing that the time. 

Oh man, there are just so many things wrong with reapers being angels...I don't think I can count all the ways.  But the first thing I thought of was if reapers ARE angels then a great deal of the plot of S5 falls completely apart. Angels were created by God, but the reapers work for Death who is as old as God? I have to stop now because none of it makes any sense.

 

Other than that I found the episode rather boring and meh.

[DigitalCount]

Maybe Death did the legwork initially, and then when angels entered the fray he contracted some of them out?

[NoWillToResist]

I was a little confused by Dean's assertion that the First Blade was the only thing that could kill Metatron. Did I miss the episode where this was established? Did someone stab Met with an angel blade and it didn't work (like with Cas when he was God)? Or is Dean just assuming that something that can kill a Knight of Hell should be able to take down the presumptuous former scribe of God?

[SueB]

I think Dean is speculating.  On the other hand, he KNEW he'd kill Abaddon so maybe there is something in his mojo that gives him a sense of these things.  Obviously it kills Reaper-class Angels and injured Gadreel. 

 

Little bits I picked up from finally getting to do a proper rewatch:

- Dean turns away when Tessa impales herself.  He looked straight into Zacharia's eyes OTOH when he stabbed him thru the neck.  To me, that doesn't mean she shed a more powerful light but that he didn't want the kill.  Of course, whether or not he wanted the kill, he still has a killgasm.  (THERE, I said it, you ALL were thinking it.... Dean has a kill-gasm when the blade dumps whatever pleasure-mojo it dumps into his system.  Someone even pointed out he licks his LIPS at the end. As in... tasty).  That's like 6 kinds of wrong and 6 kinds of hot. 

- Sam was coming back into the room and spotted Gadreel. So while I was unhappy he walked away from Dean (because it seemed a wee bit childish), upon reflection I think he walked away to figure out what Dean said (because he can't just take anything at face value now that he knows about the Mark's effect) and dump his stuff in his room.  Then he came back to continue working.  Whether or not he was going to argue the topic or discuss with Cas later we don't know because Gadreel showed up.

- Jesus Christ Superstar was the musical Tessa was going to torch.  I kind thought those tunes were catchy... yeesh, Tessa...harsh.

 

I wonder if Death is not bothering fixing this mess this time because he's done cleaning up "Team Free Will" messes.  I can see him not having much tolerance there. 

Edited May 19, 2014 by SueB

[catrox14]

 

(THERE, I said it, you ALL were thinking it.... Dean has a kill-gasm when the blade dumps whatever pleasure-mojo it dumps into his system.  Someone even pointed out he licks his LIPS at the end. As in... tasty

 

Well, thanks a lot for making Cain!Dean hotter than he already is. I've been actively pretending to not notice his post kill-tal face. Sigh :(.  Jensen Fucking  Ackles.  Why are you so good at EVERYTHING???

[Happytobehere]

While I love Castiel choosing Dean over the angel army, part of me was curios to see what would have happened if Cas had tried to kill him. I mean can Mark of Dean be killed?

I would love to see Tim O. Back as Cain either in the finale or next season. Love him and his scenes with Jensen were awesome.

[DittyDotDot]

This episode...ugh...so much potential with it. Sigh. It's just so wrong to me that Tessa is literally an angel of death rather than reapers being their own species who could care less about the battle with heaven and hell. Death should really write a strongly worded letter to TPTB about this nonsense!  I do love Tessa, though, so I guess I'll take what I can get.

 

I'd totally forgotten about Cass's pop cultural knowledge download...did they forget they did this too? I don't recall him being oblivious or knowledgeable in the current season, I'll have to pay attention better going forward. Cass's army is a bit too drunk on the Kool Aide for me too take it seriously. I was thinking the other day that what might've made this storyline kinda intriguing was if they hadn't had Cass power back up with stolen grace, but try to lead this army of angels as a mortal. As it was, it feels like a retread of S6 to me. I guess Cass did choose Dean this time though.

 

I find the attitude the angles have towards Dean to be very apt for them--one army's hero is another's terrorist and war criminal and all that--this was the one point of the episode that really worked well for me. I wish they'd dealt with idea of suicide bombers and their recruitment and programming better. I'm still not 100 percent sure if Tessa was brainwashed and truly believed Cass recruited her or if she was in on the con.

 

Even though, I don't care for Marvatron, I did think it was funny he was trying to dress like Cass to be one of the cool kids. This is actually one of the few times I've actually found not-so-marvy-Marv interesting.

 

Dean's progression in this episode works really well for me. He's amped up and so much is boiling just under the surface and it feels like he could explode at any moment. Nice job selling me on that crap Mr. Ackles. Deantatorship seems perfectly apt to where Dean is at right now. I guess, I'm not at all interested in Sam and Cass's diversionary side trip, but Sam felt very Sam-like to me, so whatever. I really feel like they needed to scale back some of the plot in this episode, but it being the penultimate to the season, I don't exactly expect it or anything.

 

The good to end on: Seven eight nine! 12-year-old humor for the win! ;)

[sarthaz]

Been on a binge rewatch lately, and I can't escape that Tessa is my favorite recurring character.  Perfectly written and perfectly cast.  And every time she shows up, now all I can think about is how much I hate how they shit on her character in this episode. :(

[Goldmoon]

Cas and Dean.  Yeah.  Missed Crowley.  Cas chose Dean over an army, but as said above, haven't they heard about the rebel angel's love for the Winchesters?  Especially Dean?  Don't trust Gadreel.

[GirlyGeek]

Really liking the arc of this season on rewatch. I was so hate watching in S8 and most of S9 the first time around that I gave it no chances, lol.

Now that I'm just about through with S9, I find how much the progression of MOC Dean has impressed me, watching him go darker and darker. The writers and Jensen really earned it, with the slow burn of it throughout the second half.

Jensen as Dean terrified me in this episode, and his remarks to Sam about the dictatorship and them not being a team were shocking, given Deans usual 'we're family/team free will' company line.

Cass (I'm trying to remember to spell it right, ok?!) choosing Dean was all kinds of awesome, though not unexpected.

On ward to the finale, which I do not remember any of, so that'll be fun!

[RulerofallIsurvey]

• I got a kick out of Dean waking Sam up with the blaring guitar riff.  But forget the not sleeping stuff, you know something is wrong with Dean if he's complimenting Sam's hair.
• I understand Sam's hesitance about Dean toting the First Blade around, but what if they came upon Metatron and got a shot at him while the blade was at the bunker?  Not a real smart strategy there.  Also, the "magic comes at a price" line is straight off Once Upon a Time.  And I'm so tired of it on that show already.  I don't recall ever hearing it, or something similar, on this show before, so that felt really clunky.
• Spears and Aguilera.  Hahahahaha!  
• Marv is just a petty little...skeezy...what bowling angel guy said.
• Why doesn't Sam get an automatic lock pick doodad like the kid in Bloodlines?
• I like the elementary joke as the answer to the riddle.  
• What was the point of the Pray, Montana fake doorway to Heaven?  Just a decoy?  A trap for Castiel which Josiah inadvertently stumbled into?  I don't get it. 
• Reapers being angels or not aside, I thought Tessa's speech about the screaming seemed true to her character at least.  But I wonder if she knew it was Metatron putting her up to it.  She said 'when Castiel came to her', making it sound like Cas personally asked her to be a suicide bomber.  I know she was lying to throw off Cas' side, but even with the unbearable screaming, it didn't seem like something Tessa would fall for.  I was thinking someone (Marv?) appeared to Tessa as Cas, but that's probably giving the show more credit than it deserves.
• No Angel CCTV to watch what was going on in the interrogation room?  Seems pretty irresponsible of them to me.  
• So Angel Justice is An Eye For An Eye, huh?  Hope Hannah remembers that when it's her ass on the line.
• Saw that coming at the end when Dean held out his left hand to shake.  

[DittyDotDot]

13 hours ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Reapers being angels or not aside, I thought Tessa's speech about the screaming seemed true to her character at least.  But I wonder if she knew it was Metatron putting her up to it.  She said 'when Castiel came to her', making it sound like Cas personally asked her to be a suicide bomber.  I know she was lying to throw off Cas' side, but even with the unbearable screaming, it didn't seem like something Tessa would fall for.  I was thinking someone (Marv?) appeared to Tessa as Cas, but that's probably giving the show more credit than it deserves.

Originally I was kinda annoyed they didn't explain this better, but now I wonder if that wasn't the point. Do we ever really understand why someone would strap on a bomb and blow up a bunch of folks? I'm still kinda disappointed they didn't delve into this part of the episode more, though. They could've easily cut out Sam and Cass looking for the portal to heaven bit and instead had them working something that had to do with the suicide bomber storyline. 

13 hours ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

What was the point of the Pray, Montana fake doorway to Heaven?  Just a decoy?  A trap for Castiel which Josiah inadvertently stumbled into?  I don't get it. 

I can't really remember much about this side of the episode--except for seven ate nine!--but, yeah, I think it was a trap set to kill Castiel. If I remember right, Josiah was supposed to be the bait and thus became collateral damage. 

[Dobian]

Dean, you asshole.  Yes, I know you're being influenced by the Mark of Cain and blahblahblah, but I saw a lot of unadulterated Dean douchebaggery coming through in those scenes.

The "Spears and Aguilera" line cracked me up.  Same with "seven eight nine" (even though I was yelling that one out before even Sam did).

One problem I had with this one was after Dean killed Tessa at CSI Angels HQ, the angels were able to subdue him even though he "put up a fight".  Well I certainly can't see how that didn't end in blood shed since he was holding the freaking First Blade.  They would have had to kill him before he took out a bunch of them.  They should have just said he stood down quietly until Cass and Sam came back.

[DittyDotDot]

On 8/15/2016 at 6:45 PM, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Reapers being angels or not aside, I thought Tessa's speech about the screaming seemed true to her character at least.  But I wonder if she knew it was Metatron putting her up to it.  She said 'when Castiel came to her', making it sound like Cas personally asked her to be a suicide bomber.  I know she was lying to throw off Cas' side, but even with the unbearable screaming, it didn't seem like something Tessa would fall for.  I was thinking someone (Marv?) appeared to Tessa as Cas, but that's probably giving the show more credit than it deserves.

Okay, memory refreshed. It does seem like they did somewhat answer this and I must not have been paying attention. Towards the end of the episode Gadreel says to not-so-marvy-Marv, "Tessa, Constantine -- I recruited them, and you brainwashed them into blowing themselves up." I think what could've helped this episode is if they had started it from Tessa's POV and her recruitment. It could've been a really twisty story, but in the end I feel like it was rather boring and somewhat maudlin.

However, Tessa's speech about hearing all the screaming and then everything seemed quiet after she had a purpose again. Man was heartbreaking. Well played, show, well played. Too bad you failed to wrap up this souls-trapped-in-the-veil plot, though. Can't just be happy you did one thing right, I guess? ;)

On 8/15/2016 at 6:45 PM, RulerofallIsurvey said:

What was the point of the Pray, Montana fake doorway to Heaven?  Just a decoy?  A trap for Castiel which Josiah inadvertently stumbled into?  I don't get it. 

And now that my memory is refreshed here too, yes, it was a trap for Castiel and Josiah was the bait. 

On 8/15/2016 at 6:45 PM, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Saw that coming at the end when Dean held out his left hand to shake.  

I know, right. Not just because it was his left hand, but also because the camera lingers on it and Dean has been amped up and looking for a fight the whole episode...that was one over-telegraphed handshake, if you ask me. And, I'm just gonna say it, I laughed at Dean's growling. Way over-the-top, IMO.

On 8/31/2016 at 10:57 AM, Dobian said:

One problem I had with this one was after Dean killed Tessa at CSI Angels HQ, the angels were able to subdue him even though he "put up a fight".  Well I certainly can't see how that didn't end in blood shed since he was holding the freaking First Blade.  They would have had to kill him before he took out a bunch of them.  They should have just said he stood down quietly until Cass and Sam came back.

Except they wouldn't have gotten the funny bit of Dean's mouth being taped shut with duct tape. ;)

Edited October 17, 2016 by DittyDotDot

[Demented Daisy]

20 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Too bad you failed to wrap up this souls-trapped-in-the-veil plot, though.

Hey, it's Carver, whatcha gonna do?  ;-)

Spoiler

But at least Dabb wrapped it up with the soul bomb.

[DittyDotDot]

Funny you say it's Carver because Dabb wrote this particular episode. 

But, 

Spoiler

I'm not so sure he did. The bomb didn't go off, so what happened to those souls is yet to be determined. Maybe they're all still stuck in the veil?

[Demented Daisy]

14 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Funny you say it's Carver because Dabb wrote this particular episode.

Well, yeah, but Carver has final say, right?  Maybe he had a plan for the veil that fell apart? (Whew, that was hard to type.  Carver and plan, that is.  ;-) )

Spoiler

I could have sworn that Chuck made a comment about the souls being in Heaven after he removed the bomb from Dean's chest, but I just double-checked and no.  That's what I get for relying on my memory, eh?