S01.E02: Independence Day

[Bort]

Quote

Conrad receives the call he's been waiting for when a heart becomes available for a patient who has been on the transplant list for two years. But when a congressman is admitted to the hospital after a heart attack, he is prioritized and derails Conrad's patient's surgery. Meanwhile, Nic grows suspicious of one of the doctors after a file goes missing, Dr. Bell tries to manipulate Mina and Devon is put to the test when a patient's condition requires a split-second decision.

[Guest]

Wasn't brain dead girl a drug user who died from an overdose?  Would her heart have really been a viable donor candidate?  Seems a little convenient that the teacher had been waiting for months for his transplant (although appearing to be the picture of health) and suddenly there is an abundance of matching hearts available.

[Jlina]

I was thrilled to see Matt and Emily, and liked it enough to watch for awhile.  It's like Soaps meets Grey's Anatomy with some Night Court patients thrown in.  

Some medical missteps but ya know, I watched Grey's for awhile so at least no one operated on a deer. O.O

(Matt was pretty much Carey as a doctor, though. Same moral ambiguity, that was interesting.)

Edited January 23, 2018 by Jlina

[Happy Harpy]

This one was more run-of-the-mill, with the organ donor storyline. It has to be expected, if everybody died out of unfair treatment, the show would be too gloomy I guess.

And of course it was all a test! They're still overdoing Bad Bad Conrad, but they gave Devon a backbone so that's something, and Czuchry had a couple of nice moments where he didn't wear the smug mask.

My favorite scene was the difference between a male and a female doctor being hit on in the bar. So true!

I was afraid they'd make Bell way too evil to work on the long term, he was still a bastard but a sustainable one. And Mina could tell him off, at least.

The addition of Melina Kanakaredes didn't disappoint, even though the info dump on Lane was awkward. I kind of expected her to be in the "good" camp, like Stella on CSI:NY, but she's actually shaddy AF. She and Greenwood have excellent chemistry (the cast gels well together, in general). But the most interesting to me was how she was brought in as Nic's foe. It reassured me they're going to give EVC more to do, and develop storylines for female characters.

[thuganomics85]

Thought it was better then the pilot since more of the other characters were able to get fleshed out (still think Emily VanCamp is being wasted, but there is hope at least), and I thought Conrad was a little more bearable this go around, mainly since I could at least see why he was frustration with Bell's transplant games.  Still loving Bruce Greenwood here, even if Bell is about as one dimensional of a villain as you can get.

A few new regulars, I see.  Melina Kanakaredes is another doctor that seems shady as well (and she runs the cancer treatment section, I think?), and we briefly see Moran Atias as their public relations person.  I also noticed Merrin Dungey in the cast list, so I'm guessing her character will be introduced shortly.

I did feel for Devon when he realized that the patient he "saved" from the pilot would end up being the donor.  I'm sure his mistake will stick with him, but at least he can take solace that others will live (sure was a good thing Nic stopped Conrad from turning off her life support at the end of the pilot.)

[biakbiak]

I missed the pilot but found Bruce Greenwood's character so over the top evil and than Conrad's complete fucked up response beyond anything that could male me want me to be a regular viewer. My bf gives every show he likes the cast or the premise 5 eps so I will probably see some episodes but everything was so gross and inaccurate.

Edited January 23, 2018 by biakbiak

[Lady Calypso]

I guess this really IS The Bad Doctor before The Good Doctor. So many shady, shady characters, and the only three good characters are somewhat enabling the bad ones to an extent, but more for their own benefit.  

This episode was still fairly good and I still enjoy this show quite a bit. New characters are introduced, like Lane. I enjoyed Melina on CSI:NY, and I enjoy her here, even if her character is already introduced as one of the many shady doctors on this show. I do like how her character is connected to Nic, who will surely be investigating further into her cancer trials and patients. I guess it's better than Nic just mooning after Conrad and trying to convince Devon that Conrad's actions should be handwaved because he's a good doctor. 

Bell is still an irritating character. Even when he was in the OR, teaching Mina, they shared some kind of friendly smile and no, show. Just because he happens to be teaching her while continuing to have hand tremors, it doesn't mean he's a good person. He's only doing it to the benefit of himself, to put on a facade in front of others so that his real reasons aren't found out. So yeah, I'm glad Mina decided to help out only to further her career, and not to actually help him out. He really shouldn't be performing surgery with hand tremors. 

Conrad is still getting way too much airtime. I personally would love more Devon. I like how he stood up to Conrad in the end, even though I could see the whole "pass the test" twist coming from the pilot. Conrad is just not likable for me. He was slightly better with caring for the school teacher,but he's still doing illegal things. I am only tolerating him because Nic at least attempts to call him out and stop him, though I wish she was more successful. 

There is some nice continuity. Patients aren't just disappearing after an episode, and we're hearing about the patients coming and going, which is different. Usually, shows just have patients only appear once and that's it. I guess these two episodes have been more of a two part premiere, but I'd actually like if this could continue. 

I really need this show to keep Devon, Nic, and Mina clean from doing illegal and shady things. However, I don't think that'll be the case for me. 

[notcreative enough]

This episode was horribly predictable. Young black teacher needs a heart and oh wait so does the rich old white guy wonder who will get it. Not really we all know what will happen. I feel like I seen the blood thing that Conrad did on a different show. 

When the cancer patient said she gets her treatment at the doctors clinic I had warning bells going off. I seen the Chicago crossover I know what that could mean. Maybe I would have given her the benefit of doubt but she was already aligned with with Bell and we all see what a jerk he is. 

How long was coma girl in a coma. Was it long enough for the drugs to leave her system can they leave her system? Was she really a viable donor or did they leave out her drug history. Are we going to get a story about some 6 year old going through withdrawal because he got junkie organs.

[biakbiak]

4 hours ago, notcreative enough said:

This episode was horribly predictable. Young black teacher needs a heart and oh wait so does the rich old white guy wonder who will get it. Not really we all know what will happen. I feel like I seen the blood thing that Conrad did on a different show. 

What Conrad did was completely insane but both Bruce Greenwood and Emily's character handwaved what Greenwood's character did as if it wasn't also bad and he never answered back and it drove me batshit!

Edited January 23, 2018 by biakbiak

[rab01]

A lot of drugs are surprisingly non-toxic to the organs.  A quick google search turned up a bunch of articles about how the opioid epidemic is clearing the organ donor backlog.

[needschocolate]

Bell does the right thing for the wrong reasons and Conrad does the wrong thing for the right reasons.  

I will give this show a few more episodes, just because I want to see Karma catch up with Bell.  However there will be a lot of ignoring things that don't make sense - like Conrad deciding that he isn't going to see any patients that day and go sit with one patient instead, or Davon, all by himself, getting patients from 20 doctors who are all leaving at the same time.  And I can't figure out if Conrad is an ER doctor or not - he sees patients in the ER, but then the patients seem to stay there for days or else he also is their doctor once they leave the ER.  

If the acting wasn't so good, this could be a fun show to make fun of.

[biakbiak]

1 hour ago, needschocolate said:

Bell does the right thing for the wrong reasons and Conrad does the wrong thing for the right reasons.  

I don'tsee how usurping the organ donor list because the patient waa a eich benefactor was the right thing. 

[needschocolate]

14 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I don'tsee how usurping the organ donor list because the patient waa a eich benefactor was the right thing. 

Conrad wanted Bell to talk to the family of the coma girl to convince them to take her off life support and donate her organs so that the teacher would get a heart. Bell refused. After the first heart was deemed not a good match for the rich guy (because Conrad did the wrong thing - switching the blood samples  - for the right reason) Bell talked the coma girl’s mother into taking her off life support. While he was talking to her, one of the characters (I think the nurse) said that Bell was doing “the right thing for thr wrong reason.” That is what I based my comment on. 

But he actually wasn’t doing really doing the right thing because, since his patient was the one who would benefit from the donation, it is against the rules for him to talk to the mom (which is why Conrad did not talk to her earlier).  One could argue that Bell did the wrong thing for the wrong reason, but two wrongs made a right. 

edited because I shouldn't post from my phone, especially if I am not wearing glasses.  

Edited January 25, 2018 by needschocolate

[twoods]

I like this show a lot. It doesn't sugarcoat medicine and I hope they keep most of the staff from hooking up and having platonic relationships. I remember being frustrated after medicine wasn't just about saving lives- there is business and bureaucracy ingrained in everything that hospitals do. I also loved how it showed how "regular" people react to guys vs girls being doctors at bars. I remember getting the "deer in a headlight" look when guys found out my friends and I were in medical school at bars. 

 

I am enjoying Devon being depicted as a competent intern who has no problems calling out Conrad. I'm interesting when her girlfriend Priya will show up, and how she has so much money to buy him a very expensive watch. I also missed the other nice intern from the pilot episode- I hope she shows up soon.

 

Bell is an asshole. I hate how he's manipulating Mina, and I hope she gets the best of him soon.

Edited January 26, 2018 by twoods

[Athena]

Love Matt Czurchy, really like Emily Van Camp, and I don't mind the Nigerian doctor either. However, the tone of the show flips a bit at times. There are times when it's cynically funny about the hospital (the selfies in the pilot, the nurses looking through the patient's porn on their phone), but also the dramatic moments. There were a lot of cliches and medicore dialogue. This episode was better than the pilot at least.

I am undecided. It is a procedural so I can usually have it on the background while doing other things. I'll keep at it if only because I want Czurchy and VanCamp to keep working.

[TV Anonymous]

I like Emily van Camp and think she deserved much better than her part on Revenge. However after two episodes in, this show is clearly about a group of medical professionals openly ignoring professional, ethical and even legal standards. It may or may not be how they do things in the health care sector in Atlanta - I personally never see behave like those in my entire professional life - but it is just not good entertainment for me.

I am out, the show is removed from my PVR.

[Bobcatkitten]

I liked this episode a lot even though I said out loud several times exactly what was going to happen. 

I enjoy Conrad a lot and he's the lead of the show from what I can tell so I don't feel like there is too much of him. 

[rhys]

On 1/26/2018 at 11:23 AM, twoods said:

 I remember getting the "deer in a headlight" look when guys found out my friends and I were in medical school at bars. 

 

Well, Frick and frack. I would have gone to med school too if I knew it was held in a bar.

[seniorpatriot]

On 1/23/2018 at 11:11 AM, notcreative enough said:

This episode was horribly predictable. Young black teacher needs a heart and oh wait so does the rich old white guy wonder who will get it. Not really we all know what will happen. I feel like I seen the blood thing that Conrad did on a different show. 

When the cancer patient said she gets her treatment at the doctors clinic I had warning bells going off. I seen the Chicago crossover I know what that could mean. Maybe I would have given her the benefit of doubt but she was already aligned with with Bell and we all see what a jerk he is. 

How long was coma girl in a coma. Was it long enough for the drugs to leave her system can they leave her system? Was she really a viable donor or did they leave out her drug history. Are we going to get a story about some 6 year old going through withdrawal because he got junkie organs.

I agree with you about the black teacher VS rich old white guy.  Very sick of any kind of race baiting on TV shows. I watch these dramas for the stories NOT so that some political point can be made. 

On 1/28/2018 at 12:55 PM, TV Anonymous said:

I like Emily van Camp and think she deserved much better than her part on Revenge. However after two episodes in, this show is clearly about a group of medical professionals openly ignoring professional, ethical and even legal standards. It may or may not be how they do things in the health care sector in Atlanta - I personally never see behave like those in my entire professional life - but it is just not good entertainment for me.

I am out, the show is removed from my PVR.

I live about an hour west of Atlanta and many patients in the surrounding areas are sent to Atlanta for surgery etc. We have Emory , one of the best in the nation. Northside is not too bad. But stay away from Piedmont! There are actually multiple reviews online about how bad it is. So yes I can see that at least that hospital could be full of money vs. patients. Or worse!

[Emily Thrace]

On 3/13/2018 at 12:30 PM, seniorpatriot said:

I agree with you about the black teacher VS rich old white guy.  Very sick of any kind of race baiting on TV shows. I watch these dramas for the stories NOT so that some political point can be made.

I think you may be watching the wrong show if your not into politics. This show seems to be trying to make a point about the medical system and its flaws, I don't think discussing race and how it impacts the care received is a bad place to start. The recent articles regarding African American rates of death related to childbirth compared to other populations alone is damming. Race does seem to  be a factor in care received in hospitals as a rule its something that pops up in multiple studies. The way race impacts care highlights what an absolute lie it is that a free market results in a egalitarian system better than almost any other factors.   If this show wants to be as timely and political as I think its does this won't be the last time it deals with race. I do think in this case the show was leaning harder on the economic disparity between these two patients then their races, though. You could have made the rich donor black and it doesn't have a big impact on the story.

[seniorpatriot]

On 3/16/2018 at 11:21 PM, Emily Thrace said:

I think you may be watching the wrong show if your not into politics. This show seems to be trying to make a point about the medical system and its flaws, I don't think discussing race and how it impacts the care received is a bad place to start. The recent articles regarding African American rates of death related to childbirth compared to other populations alone is damming. Race does seem to  be a factor in care received in hospitals as a rule its something that pops up in multiple studies. The way race impacts care highlights what an absolute lie it is that a free market results in a egalitarian system better than almost any other factors.   If this show wants to be as timely and political as I think its does this won't be the last time it deals with race. I do think in this case the show was leaning harder on the economic disparity between these two patients then their races, though. You could have made the rich donor black and it doesn't have a big impact on the story.

I think the show was MORE on track by having the black dr who assists the chief of staff all the time ,by  playing her as a genius. Whether it was poverty/riches or race that caused the rich old white guy to get the heart doesn't matter. What DOES matter is the fact that yet again a poor black guy gets portrayed as a victim. What the ??Just sick of that mentality in TV. Just more to stir up the masses. 

Not sure where you get your facts about black children and moms being more likely to die in childbirth, but most of the successful births are due to how well mom takes care of herself and her unborn child for 9 months. There are plenty of free helps for this. So are you saying then at the moment of childbirth, black moms are more neglected, when care should have been long before then?

[auntiemel]

I'm just now catching up on Hulu. Between the "create lifesaving tools from random objects at hand" and the "choose between saving the rich white donor or the everyday young black guy - hey, why not save both?" plots in this episode, I was getting serious shades of the Royal Pains pilot in this episode! :D

[Emily Thrace]

On 22/03/2018 at 7:28 AM, seniorpatriot said:

I think the show was MORE on track by having the black dr who assists the chief of staff all the time ,by  playing her as a genius. Whether it was poverty/riches or race that caused the rich old white guy to get the heart doesn't matter. What DOES matter is the fact that yet again a poor black guy gets portrayed as a victim. What the ??Just sick of that mentality in TV. Just more to stir up the masses. 

Mina's inclusion in the show is an interesting one. One the one hand it shows that TPTB are aware of the tropes and are not making her to much of a Benton right off the bat. On the other hand the cast is still pretty white for an Atlanta hospital. Also as a Nigerian she is oddly placed to make commentary on the US racial system since she is not a product of it.   I would like to see more of Conrad's Internal Medicine Attending as more of a rounded character and less of an obstacle. 

The young teacher in this story was a being victimised by the system. His story shows how money and power effect who lives and who dies. What it is more powerful and purposeful than that? This show is trying to piss people off and its why I like it.

On 22/03/2018 at 7:28 AM, seniorpatriot said:

Not sure where you get your facts about black children and moms being more likely to die in childbirth, but most of the successful births are due to how well mom takes care of herself and her unborn child for 9 months. There are plenty of free helps for this.

This simply isn't true.  Particularly if you live in the rural south or inner cities as many black mothers do. In fact it probably one of the root causes of the following statistic and why the US does so poorly overall in maternal health rates.  Obstetrics is one of the least profitable specialities and hospital maternity wards are closing or shrinking because of it. Its a topic I would love to see the show get into. 

According to the CDC Black women are 3-4 times more likely to die while giving birth or from complications directly after giving birth than any other racial group in the US. Here's a particularly poignant article on the subject https://www.propublica.org/article/nothing-protects-black-women-from-dying-in-pregnancy-and-childbirth. Even taking into account African American's higher genetic risks for preeclampsia and gestational diabetes it the numbers still don't add up unless their is some kind of bias when it come to quality of care. 

There also the recent study pointing out the black patients routinely receive less pain meds than white patients do. Here

Edited March 25, 2018 by Emily Thrace

[Chas411]

I'm watching this but can't help but think it'd be a lot more interesting if Bell and Conrad were estranged father/son.