S08.E08: How It's Gotta Be

[AngelaHunter]

13 minutes ago, AllyS said:

I think that baby is at Hilltop. Maggie was holding a baby when she in the office talking to Enid and Jesus.

Thanks. Yes, I do remember that vaguely now. But then Maggie was in the convoy during the traumatic Shooting of Neil (whoever the hell he was) so I wonder who had the poor "Hot Potato Kid" then?

[CletusMusashi]

Maybe Gracie grew up to be Neil.

[AllyS]

1 minute ago, AngelaHunter said:

Thanks. Yes, I do remember that vaguely now. But then Maggie was in the convoy during the traumatic Shooting of Neil (whoever the hell he was) so I wonder who had the poor "Hot Potato Kid" then?

i guess she's with a nameless, faceless sorghum farmer, or Cal or maybe Man-Bun. I don't know any of the other Hilltoppers.

[qtpye]

17 hours ago, FierceCritter said:

Googling is hard.

Has anyone ever heard of producers changing direction on a show due to viewer complaint/demand?

And yes, I'm wondering if they might not realize what a ginormous mistake they just made, and call for reshoots in time to change things up before the 2nd half of the season.

According to what I've read, the cast didn't find out about what was going to happen in episode 8 until they were rehearsing episode 6. So obviously there's room for changes if need be.

And yes, I'm back from anger/acceptance to bargaining. :D

I'm not asking if they'd do that in this case. I'm wondering if it's ever happened before.

Google " Bobby Ewing steps out of the shower because that horrible season of Dallas was all just a dream"  This was a retcon done solely because the fans reacted badly to a main character dying.

[Nashville]

On 12/12/2017 at 2:34 PM, valandsend said:

How did this not tear up Rick's hands?

Because he’s RICK FUCKING GRIMES, bitch. ;>   

To RICK FUCKING GRIMES, barbed wire ain’t nuthin’ but a no-skid surface.

[AngelaHunter]

17 hours ago, FierceCritter said:

Has anyone ever heard of producers changing direction on a show due to viewer complaint/demand?

I know that Scott Buck decided not to let Isaak Sirko end up on Dexter's table because it seems the fans very vocally didn't want that. It was the first and only time one of Dexter's adversaries didn't wind up wrapped in plastic.

[Smad]

Is the whole 'keeping Negan alive' storyline also why they suddenly changed Carl's attitude this Season and put him on this 'all life is precious' path? I don't remember S7 well but wasn't Carl all for killing the Saviors? Wasn't he the one sneaking into the complex and killing them?

[AllyS]

26 minutes ago, Smad said:

Is the whole 'keeping Negan alive' storyline also why they suddenly changed Carl's attitude this Season and put him on this 'all life is precious' path? I don't remember S7 well but wasn't Carl all for killing the Saviors? Wasn't he the one sneaking into the complex and killing them?

Yup, he hid in a truck and came out shooting at the Sanctuary. Some where along the way, he must have crossed paths with Jesus who inadvertently dropped the pacifist stick and Carl picked it up. 

Edited December 14, 2017 by AllyS
typo

[SimoneS]

15 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

One thing is certain:  Rick will NOT be raising Judith.  He hasn't so far.  Judith has been raised by a series of surrogates including Tyreese and Father Gabriel.  Since Morgan is leaving, perhaps Ezekiel will take over Judith-duty.

This simply is not true. Rick has been raising Judith and there is nothing to indicate otherwise. We have seen moments where people babysit her, but most of these episodes are over the span of a couple days not weeks.  However, as the show moves forward with Carl gone, it will likely show more of Rick and Judith together.

Edited December 14, 2017 by SimoneS

[jls1792]

1 hour ago, Smad said:

Is the whole 'keeping Negan alive' storyline also why they suddenly changed Carl's attitude this Season and put him on this 'all life is precious' path? I don't remember S7 well but wasn't Carl all for killing the Saviors? Wasn't he the one sneaking into the complex and killing them?

Yes, I think it was 7x07 when Carl hid in the truck and went to the sanctuary ready to kill Negan. 

And in 7x16, once they found out Sasha was dead and a walker, it was Carl who started shooting up the Saviors first.

So Carl's change in attitude occurred between 7x16 and 8x01

[Raven1707]

On 12/11/2017 at 9:34 AM, sigmaforce86 said:

Question, Question, Question:  Anyone know who played Savior "AL"?  He's the guy that was in the pen with Gregory and the savior that Maggie shot.  He had about two sentences and a close up.  No big deal but he looks really familiar and I can't find his real name in the cast lists so just curious if he looks like another actor and that's why he's familiar or if I've seen him in something before.

I imagine someone's already answered this, but if not, I think the character's name was actually Dean. The actor is Adam Fristoe.

[TigerLynx]

2 hours ago, Smad said:

Is the whole 'keeping Negan alive' storyline also why they suddenly changed Carl's attitude this Season and put him on this 'all life is precious' path? I don't remember S7 well but wasn't Carl all for killing the Saviors? Wasn't he the one sneaking into the complex and killing them?

 

2 hours ago, AllyS said:

Yup, he hid in a truck and came out shooting at the Sanctuary. Some where along the way, he must have crossed paths with Jesus who inadvertently dropped the pacifist stick and Carl picked it up. 

 

57 minutes ago, jls1792 said:

Yes, I think it was 7x07 when Carl hid in the truck and went to the sanctuary ready to kill Negan. 

And in 7x16, once they found out Sasha was dead and a walker, it was Carl who started shooting up the Saviors first.

So Carl's change in attitude occurred between 7x16 and 8x01

Apparently, everyone gets bit by the pacifist bug when it's plot convenient, or decides they need a time out to deal with things (Carol, Morgan, Jesus, etc.).  Carl was very kill everyone take no prisoners for several seasons.

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, jls1792 said:

Yes, I think it was 7x07 when Carl hid in the truck and went to the sanctuary ready to kill Negan. 

And in 7x16, once they found out Sasha was dead and a walker, it was Carl who started shooting up the Saviors first.

So Carl's change in attitude occurred between 7x16 and 8x01

Yes, but all those actions were against Saviors - a bloodthirsty group Carl had watched bludgeon friends to death and kill people for teachable moments, a pack of murderers only interested in others for their utility as slaves for greater convenience.  

Siddiq is none of these; he’s scared, hungry, and on his own.  I think Siddiq reminded Carl of what CDB’s life was like pre-Alexandria - and how CDB would still be chowing down on fillet of Fido and grinding up acorns for Judith if Aaron and/or the ASZ had reacted to them the way Rick reacted to Siddiq.

[AngelaHunter]

45 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

Apparently, everyone gets bit by the pacifist bug when it's plot convenient, or decides they need a time out to deal with things (Carol, Morgan, Jesus, etc.).  Carl was very kill everyone take no prisoners for several seasons.

Yes, they seem to take turns putting on the "Love your neighbour" and "All life is precious" hat, until  - oops, I guess it's not, with Morgan being the worst offender. All that time spent on his pacificism and preaching, and with no point of any kind.  Maybe "All you need is love" is another virus.

[jls1792]

1 minute ago, Nashville said:

Yes, but all those actions were against Saviors - a bloodthirsty group Carl had watched bludgeon friends to death and kill people for teachable moments, a pack of murderers only interested in others for their utility as slaves for greater convenience.  

Siddiq is none of these; he’s scared, hungry, and on his own.  I think Siddiq reminded Carl of what CDB’s life was like pre-Alexandria - and how CDB would still be chowing down on fillet of Fido and grinding up acorns for Judith if Aaron and/or the ASZ had reacted to them the way Rick reacted to Siddiq.

Yeah, I totally get Carl wanting to help Siddiq.  I think the thing that's confusing people is Gimple and Chandler are saying Carl's death will be what keeps Negan alive and Rick showing people mercy.  It's one thing for Rick to not totally judge everyone as a bad guy, but why the heck does Carl dying and preaching mercy mean Negan has to survive?

[Nashville]

5 minutes ago, jls1792 said:

Yeah, I totally get Carl wanting to help Siddiq.  I think the thing that's confusing people is Gimple and Chandler are saying Carl's death will be what keeps Negan alive and Rick showing people mercy.  It's one thing for Rick to not totally judge everyone as a bad guy, but why the heck does Carl dying and preaching mercy mean Negan has to survive?

Because Rick misinterprets and fucks things up on a regular basis.  ;>

[Smad]

28 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Yes, but all those actions were against Saviors - a bloodthirsty group Carl had watched bludgeon friends to death and kill people for teachable moments, a pack of murderers only interested in others for their utility as slaves for greater convenience.  

Siddiq is none of these; he’s scared, hungry, and on his own.  I think Siddiq reminded Carl of what CDB’s life was like pre-Alexandria - and how CDB would still be chowing down on fillet of Fido and grinding up acorns for Judith if Aaron and/or the ASZ had reacted to them the way Rick reacted to Siddiq.

I'm not asking because of Siddiq. That I understand. I was confused by the beginning flashback. The Rick and Carl convo where he became Jesus all about 'we have to live with these people afterwards'. Also something about picking strawberries with Negan if that's possible, or something along those lines. And that confused me because I thought he was all about killing the Saviors last Season and then he became Morgan/Jesus literally over night.

Just seems to be a lot of the Carl stuff is because they don't know how to get out of the mess they have created. Hiring good writers is apparently an option they didn't consider. Instead Carl becomes Jesus/Morgan so his father will have to honor 'all life is precious, including Negan'. And the splintering of the group will probably also come to an end and they will pull it together in honor of Carl. Poor kid, he had to die because the show is done/written by morons.

Edited December 14, 2017 by Smad

[Mu Shu]

18 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

Hee! That too. It was only from reading here that I knew the GPK ran off.

Where did you think they went?  I thought they were running toward the sanctuary. 

Am I high, or did Aaron and Enid go to a distillery?  Did they say something about not showing up empty handed?  I interpreted the whole thing as they were going to bribe the saviors with booze, but Cindy got the drop on them after Enid shot granny Anananaya or whatever her name is.

ill just go watch something like bananas in pajamas now. 

[AngelaHunter]

7 minutes ago, Mu Shu said:

ill just go watch something like bananas in pajamas now. 

Naughty Banana Emojiis are more entertaining than this show. The "Banana Boink" is particularly good. At least it, unlike Negan, actually does something. For all his bragging about his wives, how hot they are and how with Coral's interruption, he'd only have time to screw one of them, have we ever actually seen him DO anything with them? Oh, silly me. I forgot we're only allowed to see bodies cut in half with axes, little girls shot dead, throats slit  and prolonged shots of guts spilling on the street. No sex, please. AMC viewers might start pearl-clutching and faint dead away at even a whisper of s-e-x.

8 minutes ago, Mu Shu said:

Am I high, or did Aaron and Enid go to a distillery?  Did they say something about not showing up empty handed?  I interpreted the whole thing as they were going to bribe the saviors with booze, but Cindy got the drop on them after Enid shot granny Anananaya

I have no idea, but I like that scenario. I like it much better than whatever the hell I watched. But... what did Cindy get the drop with? Rick and his merry band stole all their weapons. The very same Rick who bopped Negan with the handle of a baseball bat instead of killing him.

Gee, I guess I'm the only one who gives not a single furry rat butt about Sadiq? I just have to wonder why they give us yet more characters that we're supposed to feel for, when we have scores of new, anonymous people we already don't give a shit about.

[AllyS]

32 minutes ago, Mu Shu said:

Where did you think they went?  I thought they were running toward the sanctuary. 

Am I high, or did Aaron and Enid go to a distillery?  Did they say something about not showing up empty handed?  I interpreted the whole thing as they were going to bribe the saviors with booze, but Cindy got the drop on them after Enid shot granny Anananaya or whatever her name is.

ill just go watch something like bananas in pajamas now. 

You are correct, Enid detoured to a distillery , and Aaron drove a truck full of it Oceanside. Who needs guns when you have booze!

13 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

Gee, I guess I'm the only one who gives not a single furry rat butt about Sadiq? I just have to wonder why they give us yet more characters that we're supposed to feel for, when we have scores of new, anonymous people we already don't give a shit about.

And if Sadiq turns out to be an asshole after Carl get's bitten, then dies I am done! Period, that will really piss me off!

Edited December 14, 2017 by AllyS
spelling is important

[rmontro]

8 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

But then Maggie was in the convoy during the traumatic Shooting of Neil (whoever the hell he was)

NO!  Not Neil?!  Why Neil?  Why?!?   WHY!??

Wait, who's Neil?

Gimple would probably say that Neil was the driver that we all loved.

Edited December 15, 2017 by rmontro

[Ohwell]

Siddiq and Carl were walking in the woods and came upon the zombies having dinner and minding their own business.  It looked like the zombies didn't even notice when those two approached them.   It seemed to me that they both were at fault for interrupting the zombies' dinner when they could have quietly crept away.  So my question is, why is it Siddiq's fault that Carl got bit?  Seems to me that they both were at fault.

Oops, I think I remembered something.  Is that when Siddiq was talking about his mother and releasing ghosts or some bs?  

Edited December 15, 2017 by Ohwell

[Smad]

8 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Siddiq and Carl were walking in the woods and came upon the zombies having dinner and minding their own business.  It looked like the zombies didn't even notice when those two approached them.   It seemed to me that they both were at fault for interrupting the zombies' dinner when they could have quietly crept away.  So my question is, why is it Siddiq's fault that Carl got bit?  Seems to me that they both were at fault.

Oops, I think I remembered something.  Is that when Siddiq was talking about his mother and releasing ghosts or some bs?  

Siddiq talked about it at the plastic bag zombie trap. I think Carl said 'this is for your mother' or something before they went after the deer eating zombies. So basically Carl did it to entertain Siddiq's stupid delusion.

[Ohwell]

17 minutes ago, Smad said:

Siddiq talked about it at the plastic bag zombie trap. I think Carl said 'this is for your mother' or something before they went after the deer eating zombies. So basically Carl did it to entertain Siddiq's stupid delusion.

Oh, ok, thanks.  So Carl was stupid.  I can't put all the blame on Siddiq.

[Smad]

22 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

Oh, ok, thanks.  So Carl was stupid.  I can't put all the blame on Siddiq.

In so many ways was Carl stupid. If your field of vision is limited because you only have one eye and impractical hair, you don't use a little knife against walkers. You at least use a machete or sword but your best weapon is a gun with a silencer. You can't let them get close to you when you can't see well. And even if you just see 3 there, they multiply like the Matrix thanks to their ability to teleport. Also the cardinal rule is fighting together, back to back.

This so reminds me of a mix of S2 Carl and Rick. S2 Carl sneaking away into the woods to do stupid things and Rick supporting Hershel's delusion. S8 Carl got the death S2 Carl probably should have gotten. And it's so ironic that Lori turned out to be right when she said to Rick that maybe Carl shouldn't live in this world, a short brutal life only to end up dead. Really Gimple, did you have to make Lori right?

[tricknasty]

Caution: Rant regarding deaths on this shit show is happening right now. Hershel's death pissed me off so much, but I comforted myself with the knowledge that he lived a full life since he died at an old age. Glenn's death pissed me off cause he was the heart and soul of the group. He was the best and his death was brutal and uncalled for. Carl being bitten and obviously dying in 2 months pissed me off because it is senseless.  I hated the little prick when he was younger but he has earned my affection when he got older. I watched this child grow up right in front of my eyes. His death angers and saddens me. After reading spoilers that it was not the actor's decision to leave the show has pissed me off even more. Maggie has lost her whole family and only has baby Rhee. Rick has lost his wife and now his son. Everything is done for shock value on this show and I am tired of it.  Please hire better writers. As I have ranted before, when/if Rick and Chonne dies, I'm out. Peace.

[Gobi]

3 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

Naughty Banana Emojiis are more entertaining than this show. The "Banana Boink" is particularly good. At least it, unlike Negan, actually does something. For all his bragging about his wives, how hot they are and how with Coral's interruption, he'd only have time to screw one of them, have we ever actually seen him DO anything with them? Oh, silly me. I forgot we're only allowed to see bodies cut in half with axes, little girls shot dead, throats slit  and prolonged shots of guts spilling on the street. No sex, please. AMC viewers might start pearl-clutching and faint dead away at even a whisper of s-e-x.

Wasn't there a discussion at one point about Negan's inability to get any of his "wives" pregnant? 

[AllyS]

2 minutes ago, Gobi said:

Wasn't there a discussion at one point about Negan's inability to get any of his "wives" pregnant? 

I don't recall that conversation, but vodka smooths the edges and leaves one less aware. All I know is baby Gracie can't possibly be Negan's kid, she entirely too quiet and doesn't squirm and move around constantly.

[Gobi]

9 minutes ago, AllyS said:

I don't recall that conversation, but vodka smooths the edges and leaves one less aware. All I know is baby Gracie can't possibly be Negan's kid, she entirely too quiet and doesn't squirm and move around constantly.

I seem to remember the doctor examining Dwight's wife, and her being glad she wasn't pregnant, with the implication that this was an ongoing  problem with Negan.

[AllyS]

1 minute ago, Gobi said:

I seem to remember the doctor examining Dwight's wife, and her being glad she wasn't pregnant, with the implication that this was an ongoing  problem with Negan.

Then that explains his incessant gloating about his stupendous dick, it doesn't work.

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, Ohwell said:

So Carl was stupid.  I can't put all the blame on Siddiq.

What pisses me off is seeing any main character being killed off in such a mundane, stupid way.  If he had to go, his death could have been dramatic and had some meaning, not resulting from being dumb enough, at this point in time, to get bitten by some barely mobile, half-rotted corpse. It's pretty insulting, both to the kid and to us, but I guess Gimple wanted it that way. How he keeps his job, I'll never know.

So barring a dramatic, or even heroic death for Coral, I just bet his demise is going to be dragged out with long, tedious flashbacks, visions and mournful music, maybe even longer than the 90 minutes we got for Tyrese to kick the bucket, with Beth singing in his head and ours while he bled at least five quarts of blood, without even passing out. No way will I be able to endure that again.

As for Glenn, well, he'd also had most of the personality we came to love stripped away beforehand, and TPTB managed to blunt the impact of his death - first by the stupid, cliched dumpster fake-out, and then by Abe going first, so by that the time Glenn got it, I  was, "Oh, well." Actually, his death was made to be rather ridiculous with the eyeball and the "I'll find you." I know that was in the comics - the eyeball thing anyway - but it could have been changed to not be just a big gross-out moment.

[AngelaHunter]

10 minutes ago, AllyS said:

Then that explains his incessant gloating about his stupendous dick, it doesn't work.

Well, maybe he can't do two things at once. He never, ever stops talking, so...

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

Well, maybe he can't do two things at once. He never, ever stops talking, so...

If his dick doesn't work and he's yammering all the time,  he can't even please anyone orally, ever. What a loser

Edited December 15, 2017 by catrox14

[FierceCritter]

13 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

If his dick doesn't work and he's yammering all the time,  he can't even please anyone orally, ever. What a loser

I'm waaaaaay too visual for this line of conversation... o.O

[Iguessnot]

On ‎12‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 3:21 PM, DearEvette said:

But if it is another fake=out then they are massively out of touch with their viewers because they already did it once with Glen.  It would absolutely send the message that they aren't trying to tell a story, but are just fucking with their fandom.

I am not so much as outraged that Carl might be dead, I am mad that his death might just be one more death in the show that means nothing except to get fans talking about a major death.  If he is dead, will it galvanize Rick?  Michonne? Will it represent some sort of sea change in the direction of the story?  What does it really accomplish except them being able to say they killed off yet another major character.  What is worse, where is his emotional replacement?  In early seasons before we lost a characters with history, we got introduced to newer characters that we could get to know.  In S2 we lost Shane but we got Maggie, Hershel & Beth.  In S3 we lost Lorie, but we got Michonne, Tyreses and Sasha, in S4 we lost Herschel & Beth but we got Abraham, Eugene and Rosita.  And we actually got a sense of them as characters with some background and built history.  But since the Saviors came we only seem to have gotten Jesus.  (Ha!)  And his characterization is as thin as paper.  I don't feel like we really have anyone to care about anymore because they aren't taking the time to give us a story with stakes to make use care.

 

 

I honestly think they were trying to take a page from The Wire.  The character of Omar was such a bigger than life personality on the show, you just knew that if he was gonna die, he was gonna die spectacular.  But in the end he died kinda ignominiously.  And it was sad but it worked as a great coda for the character.  Like I said above, Carl dying, no matter how great or glorious or little and sad, doesn't really mean anything, because the show itself just feels so diminished.

I believe Negan's introduction was a great downfall because they stopped telling a story, and catered to hype and self congratulations. Similar to how Daryl became a rock star at the prison.

I don't remember if it was season 6 or 7, but Negan's name was dropped repeatedly yet he wasn't revealed until the last minutes of the finale. Since I wasn't a comic reader, I found this insufferable. 

Not showing Abraham's death until after the break and twenty minutes into the episode further alienated me. Granted Negan is a cartoonish character, but the masturbatory writing has been a horrible misstep. TPTB put all its eggs into the Negan basket but things have not fared well. I don't know if they originally planned for Carl to be bitten at this point, but the critical reaction to the Negan storyline might have caused them to regroup.  At least from this crummy season, I found the ending very touching, though sad. 

Back to plot problems. Why am I supposed to care about the OB coming back? I know Maggie's pregnancy will be a plot point, but she has recovered at least temporarily from whatever crisis she had before Abraham and Glenn got bashed. She's not in dire straits so I need Father Gabriel to worry more about whether the doctor can attend to him. I've seen at least one woman in the kingdom in the late stages of pregnancy and some infants. She could check resources over there. In any case, Maggie isn't visibly pregnant and there's no NICU in the zombie apocalypse so her pregnancy storyline is still 8 months from being of any interest to me. 

[rmontro]

1 hour ago, Iguessnot said:

I don't remember if it was season 6 or 7, but Negan's name was dropped repeatedly yet he wasn't revealed until the last minutes of the finale.

They were really starting to stretch things out by that time.  At the rate things are going, Maggie will be due to have her baby around 2030.

[Gobi]

4 hours ago, rmontro said:

They were really starting to stretch things out by that time.  At the rate things are going, Maggie will be due to have her baby around 2030.

Then the show is going to have stretch marks.

[sigmaforce86]

17 hours ago, Raven1707 said:

I imagine someone's already answered this, but if not, I think the character's name was actually Dean. The actor is Adam Fristoe.

Thanks - that's actually the Savior that Maggie killed, there was another guy but using the name in your answer I found him.  Character is Aiden (I thought they said Allen) and played by Callan McAuliffe.  Turns out he's not in anything else I've seen he just looks a little like a cross between young Scott Foley and young Jason Ritter (to me anyway) and I guess that's why he was familiar.

 

Adding to show discussion:  The more I think of Carl's bite the worse the makeup seems, a perfectly straight upper/lower mark, with no torn flesh.  Even if his shirt had hiked up so the walker wasn't biting through cloth I can't picture how that's practical or realistic.  The walker would have to have no nose (possible) and to have let go own their own otherwise it's normal to turn your head and if they were forced off or actually took a "bite" it should have looked much worse.  But what walker takes a perfect bite like Snow White and her apple then lets go?  

I hope part of Carl's goodbye isn't insisting Rick get Neegan somehow so Carl can tell him to just be nice from now on - it's not a logical way for the story to be but the way things have been going lately the writers may not pass up a chance for more talking and more be peaceful/be a fighter debates.

[stormy weather]

9 minutes ago, sigmaforce86 said:

Adding to show discussion:  The more I think of Carl's bite the worse the makeup seems, a perfectly straight upper/lower mark, with no torn flesh.  Even if his shirt had hiked up so the walker wasn't biting through cloth I can't picture how that's practical or realistic.  The walker would have to have no nose (possible) and to have let go own their own otherwise it's normal to turn your head and if they were forced off or actually took a "bite" it should have looked much worse.  But what walker takes a perfect bite like Snow White and her apple then lets go?  

 

I guess that, since no one seems to have seen a zombie bite Carl in the scene with Saddiq, they had to make it really clear that it was a bite and not some other regular looking gash, wound or tear of the flesh that would probably look more realistic but that could be the result of any random injury.

Maybe if they had shown the "zombie attack" more properly and then left us wondering what had actually happened, the final scene with Carl revealing the wound would've been way more powerful (because it would've looked real, at least) and less "oh, look, I have a perfectly round mark that shows teeth have sunk into my skin. It sure looks like a zombie bit me, but then again, you figure it out by yourself!" 

This is all very sad and disrespectful of the viewers. They stretched out the plot so much that there's actually no plot anymore. It's just them perpetually driving around thanks to endless supplies of fuel, getting food, gathering weapons, making plans and sabotaging themselves from one random shocking death to the other. I think the only smart thing to do now would be to hurry things along and have a second half of the season where Carl kills Negan and then dies, Maggie gives birth, all the survivors are reunited and they MOVE ON to the next place, where they'll meet new people and have new adventures. I know, I know. But a girl can dream.

[Primetimer]

The Grimes boys end up getting everyone into deep crap.

View the full article

[TigerLynx]

22 minutes ago, stormy weather said:

This is all very sad and disrespectful of the viewers. They stretched out the plot so much that there's actually no plot anymore. It's just them perpetually driving around thanks to endless supplies of fuel, getting food, gathering weapons, making plans and sabotaging themselves from one random shocking death to the other. I think the only smart thing to do now would be to hurry things along and have a second half of the season where Carl kills Negan and then dies, Maggie gives birth, all the survivors are reunited and they MOVE ON to the next place, where they'll meet new people and have new adventures. I know, I know. But a girl can dream.

I feel sorry for any new people they meet.  If their track record is any indication, things will be going okay (for a ZA) for these people, Rick's group will show up, and everything will go to hell.

[AngelaHunter]

16 hours ago, Ohwell said:

Oops, I think I remembered something.  Is that when Siddiq was talking about his mother and releasing ghosts or some bs? 

I do not recall a single word of that conversation. I think my mind is doing a "Peanuts" thing, where all the adult voices just become a "Wah wah wahhh."

3 hours ago, sigmaforce86 said:

The more I think of Carl's bite the worse the makeup seems, a perfectly straight upper/lower mark, with no torn flesh.

The bites always look like dental impressions that were copied and stencilled unto the skin of whoever the sad victim may be.

[AngelaHunter]

3 hours ago, PreviouslyTV said:

The Grimes boys end up getting everyone into deep crap.

That recap is a zillion times better than this episode!

[Persnickety1]

3 hours ago, TigerLynx said:

I feel sorry for any new people they meet.  If their track record is any indication, things will be going okay (for a ZA) for these people, Rick's group will show up, and everything will go to hell.

Maybe any new people they meet will be smart like the folks at Grady.

After shooting Dawn, when Rick made his spiel about how any of them could leave to join up with him and his group, I literally LOL'd when no one chose to leave the sanitary safe confines of Grady to team up with the band of smelly, dirty, malnourished, half-crazed renegades standing before them.   As much as I despised that whole Grady story line, that single scene *almost* made it worth the frustration.

On a side note, interestingly CR's dad removed (or at least hid from his timeline) his post outlining CR's termination from the show.  I'm betting AMC was behind that.  

[AngelaHunter]

4 minutes ago, Persnickety1 said:

After shooting Dawn, when Rick made his spiel about how any of them could leave to join up with him and his group, I literally LOL'd when no one chose to leave the sanitary safe confines of Grady to team up with the band of smelly, dirty, malnourished, half-crazed renegades standing before them.

That was awesome. Yeah, they'll leave the lights, safety, fresh water and medical care and food and laundry and run off with a bunch of feral kooks who looked like they'd been living in a cave for the last year.

Another good moment was when Andrea refused to leave Woodbury and go on the run with Michonne, for no reason(I never read the comic). I could see her thinking, "Okay I can either stay here where there's electricity, it's warm and clean, where the food is good and I have an attractive man in my real, soft bed every night OR I can go with you, huddle on the hard cold ground, eating bugs and twigs and waiting to get eaten alive any moment. Let me think about that and get back to you, Michonne."

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

That recap is a zillion times better than this episode!

“...and here’s Chris Hardwick.”  :D

[TigerLynx]

They did a horrible job with Andrea and Michonne at Woodbury, and when they finally did some flashbacks of the two of them before they got to Woodbury.

If I was one of the slave/workers at the Savior Compound, or one of the communities they were extorting supplies and food from, I would probably sign on to get rid of them if it was with a group who could actually get the job done.  Rick's group couldn't stick to the plan for even one day.

To survive in this ZA, you need the Carol who took out Terminus, the Michonne who first showed up, Glen who called Rick the dumbass in the tank (how right Glen was), quick draw Carl who shot three Saviors before anyone else got their gun out (not the Carl who got bit by a Walker), Sasha, and Daryl from Season 2.

[peach]

34 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

Another good moment was when Andrea refused to leave Woodbury and go on the run with Michonne, for no reason(I never read the comic). I could see her thinking, "Okay I can either stay here where there's electricity, it's warm and clean, where the food is good and I have an attractive man in my real, soft bed every night OR I can go with you, huddle on the hard cold ground, eating bugs and twigs and waiting to get eaten alive any moment. Let me think about that and get back to you, Michonne."

And ICE.  And the medicine that saved her life!  You couldn't have dragged me out of Woodbury for anything.  I liked the scene when she went to see them at the prison (and was so happy to see them again, and they all acted like assholes, never mind they left her behind in the first place), and she was like, omg, you live HERE?  Come to Woodbury, we have cookies.

6 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

To survive in this ZA, you need the Carol who took out Terminus, the Michonne who first showed up, Glen who called Rick the dumbass in the tank (how right Glen was), quick draw Carl who shot three Saviors before anyone else got their gun out (not the Carl who got bit by a Walker), Sasha, and Daryl from Season 2.

Now I have another sad about Carl and how they're ending him, with the life is precious bullshit.  Carl's life was precious, idiots.

[AngelaHunter]

3 minutes ago, peach said:

And the medicine that saved her life!  You couldn't have dragged me out of Woodbury for anything. 

Agree! Especially after knowing what the alternative was.

5 minutes ago, peach said:

Come to Woodbury, we have cookies.

And lemonade! A fairytale place where barbeques are held and Doberman Pinschers are not on the menu!

[Mu Shu]

15 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

Agree! Especially after knowing what the alternative was.

And lemonade! A fairytale place where barbeques are held and Doberman Pinschers are not on the menu!

But that’s just what they told those Mayberry doofuses.  The BBQ was actually some pit bull mutt mix. 

But the supercool gladiator fights were a hot ticket.  Merle was like the Kimbo Slice of the ZA.

Edited December 15, 2017 by Mu Shu