S02.E06: It's No Fun If It's Easy

[formerlyfreedom]

Letty, Javier, and Jacob visit Letty’s grandmother Alice to ask her for help with a $50,000 problem. But Alice, a shrewd con artist in her own right, makes Letty work for what she needs and drags Letty into her own high-class con.

[justmehere]

This show.

-Holy cow, Christian married the beast! Neither looked too happy at the end, though. "No more champagne."

-The origins of Letty's behavior -- Alice must have seemed so glamorous to a young girl. Loved Letty's reaction to seeing Alice's secret room with all the wigs and outfits. Kid in a candy store. But Alice did Letty a favor, being honest with her and showing her how life will look 40 years down the line.

-Sean is still scum -- he and his girlfriend are so deluded. At least he shouldn't have any chance at custody now.

-Ava's girls not missing a trick -- but I feel bad for Ava. Another brutal man in her life, and she seems such a gentle person.

-Can't believe Teo threatened Jacob with a gun. Bad enough he used Ava, someone he knew and presumably loved at one time. I assume the father is pulling the strings... does he have something on Teo to force him to agree? Does Teo somehow think he's doing something noble? Doesn't look like Javier is done with him, so hopefully we'll discover more.

-Poor Jacob. He's taken so much in stride, but he couldn't not be shaken by that experience and by seeing Javier shoot someone. At least Jav didn't kill Teo in front of him. Letty's doing the right thing taking Jacob back to Estelle and Rob, but now he's basically going to lose his mother. The thing is, Javier could be a great dad and Letty could be a great mother; she tried to be. But they obviously aren't the right parents for Jacob without major life changes, and neither can do that right now. Guessing Letty will end up in a pretty dark place after this, at least for a time, and that we may really see a Bonnie and Clyde dynamic without Jacob in tow.

I love this show. Really hope it gets another season, even if it probably can't go too many more.

[TaraS1]

That ending was just crushing.  I mean, I get it, both in terms of what's best for Jacob and probably what's best for the show, but still.  Jacob loves his mother and wants to be with her, so him being separated from her again because she can't/won't get her shit together hurts my heart.  I love Letty, but damn.

Kudos to Michelle, JDB and Nyles, they did great work.

[attica]

Waiting on two teenage girls to look up from their phones is the modern day Waiting for Godot. I loved that scene. Javier is so good with kids, first the girls and then Jacob.

Holland Taylor doing a bad English accent, and Charles Shaughnessy (Mr. Sheffield!) doing a bad southern accent struck me as delightfully sick casting.  Also: "She's just like Angelina Jolie!" Heeeee.

Another excellent episode re: soundtracking.

[thesupremediva1]

This episode was like a giant bowl of raspberries and whipped cream until the last 9 minutes or so. My heart leapt into my chest when Teo pulled the gun on Jacob.

I think Teo is just the tip of the iceberg. I don't see him being the one and only person who killed Silk or has a vendetta out for Jav. I do think he's tied to Javier's father in some way.

Lashever and Christian got married? And she's still threatening Letty, Christian's prized charge? Eh, not sure I can buy that storyline anymore. 

Holland Taylor and Mr. Sheffield were gold. Loved her doing a fake British accent while he had to put on a Southern accent. It's great when casting goes the unexpected route. 

Grams is right about one thing, and I've been saying it since the latter half of season 1: Jacob belongs with Estelle. Letty isn't cut out for normal. Javier shouldn't be lumped in with normal, and Letty can still be a good mom to Jacob, but she has no business taking full-time custody of a child - in context of life or this show. 

Watching Javier play soccer with Jacob and console him after the "attempted carjacking" almost made me want to have children. I love Javier much too much. He's such a wonderful uncle. He's a rather svelte man but he projects a 7-foot, 300-lb. presence. It's a real testament to JDB's acting ability.

Michelle looked stunning this episode. I was in awe of her in that gown.

They both looked so broken at the end. This was Letty's equivalent of The Ballad of Little Santino.

[dubbel zout]

4 hours ago, justmehere said:

Loved Letty's reaction to seeing Alice's secret room with all the wigs and outfits. Kid in a candy store.

That was great. And of course she has to immediately start trying things on.

I love Javi's relationship with his nieces. I know they don't see one another much, but they know how to contact him, so why aren't they texting or calling? It's easy enough to erase history if Ava and/or Teo check their phones.

Teo made a huge mistake pulling a gun on Jacob. I think Javi would have reacted that way if it had been any kid, but of course Jacob made it a million times worse. Poor Jacob. He is better of with Estelle and Rob, but it's obvious he loves Letty and Javi (and has Letty's ability to lie convincingly on the spot), so it's going to be tough for him wherever he is. Letty and Javi aren't ready to settle down and live relatively stable lives, no matter what Letty tries to tell herself.

I don't want to see a custody dispute between Sean and Letty. Resolve it offscreen, please.

[TaraS1]

11 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Poor Jacob. He is better of with Estelle and Rob, but it's obvious he loves Letty and Javi (and has Letty's ability to lie convincingly on the spot), so it's going to be tough for him wherever he is. 

I died when he told Alice's friends his name was Emamu, or whatever it was lol. 

And I love that they still have his red soccer ball from last season.  Javier is going to be devastated to be separated from Jacob on top of missing his nieces.

[red.]

Favorite episode this season, I think. Great acting with tons of little hysterical things thrown in: Holland and Charles swapping accents, Porn again, Jacob as Imamu and more. Such great acting and range from MD, JDB and Nyles. MD slays every outfit. Do we think Teo is going to stay stuck in that hotel room? I feel like we'll see him again. Also, at the beginning of this season I was so over Jacob still being around, but he was perfect in this ep - we really got to see how Letty and Javier's behavior and actions affected and changed him.

[TaraS1]

I wonder if Ava's being held under duress by Teo?  She's too smart and strong of a woman to let some guy, even an ex, move in with her and her teenage daughters right after their father dies, and be so passive around him.  Something seems really fishy about that, especially now that we know for sure he's a bad guy.

[Crs97]

I was thrown by Alice telling Letty that Estelle is a great mom, especially when we know she was never around and partly blames herself for the way Letty turned out.  Don't retcon this, powers that be.  Estelle might be a great grandmother, but I thought it was pretty clear she was a bad mother.  Or am I forgetting something?

I loved that RJ knows her accent is fake, but won't let her out of the marriage because he loves her.  He was awesome, although I am from the South and we do not flirt like that.

Edited November 21, 2017 by Crs97

[EtheltoTillie]

9 hours ago, thesupremediva1 said:

Holland Taylor and Mr. Sheffield were gold. Loved her doing a fake British accent while he had to put on a Southern accent. It's great when casting goes the unexpected route.

I'd never have recognized Mr. Sheffield!  Thanks.

 

This was a great episode.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Dumbfcuk Teo. Javier told him he was good at what he did and he was. But poor Jacob having to experience that.

Honesty paid for Letty. Miracles never cease.

What I don't get is why Javier didn't kill Teo. A week isn't long enough to starve or die of thirst. All Javier has done is upped the ante. Next time Teo will grab Letty.

[TaraS1]

15 hours ago, Crs97 said:

I was thrown by Alice telling Letty that Estelle is a great mom, especially when we know she was never around and partly blames herself for the way Letty turned out.  Don't retcon this, powers that be.  Estelle might be a great grandmother, but I thought it was pretty clear she was a bad mother.  Or am I forgetting something?

I took it as Alice saying Estelle was a good mother to Jacob, not to Letty.  Like you said, I don't think there's any way to retcon what we know about Estelle and Letty's mother/daughter relationship.

[dubbel zout]

13 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

What I don't get is why Javier didn't kill Teo.

Probably because Ava would never forgive him. It wouldn't be too hard to connect the dots.

3 hours ago, TaraS1 said:

I took it as Alice saying Estelle was a good mother to Jacob, not to Letty. 

Same here.

[Hanahope]

It sounded like Letty is too much like Alice, so Estelle couldn’t really be a good mom to Letty, but Jacob is different (at least somewhat for now).  Estelle seems to have raised him well, but Letty is exposing Jacob to the wrong life and giving him bad role models.  Letty needs to get get life together, and Jav’s Too before they can really parent Jacob.

 

Seriously, porn again?  Porn for married Christians?  Did the wife/girlfriend  really believe that? Or is she just gullible? 

Teo must be bought by Javier’s father, or planned to exploit Ava.  No other reason to come back at Jav like that.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

This was really, really, good.  The whole byplay with the rich dude and his vixen "niece" (Southern Charm, indeed!)  was so well layered.  The understanding the writers simply must possess of old Southern money is quite large.  The respect given what could be widely seen on the surface as horrendous behavior was entirely refreshing to me.   It was a war of Northern Aggression - but it was a necessary aggression, imo.  

Seeing a virile Javy in full again was also most satisfying.  I was relishing each moment in the motel room as he was restraining Teo.  I was loving imaging what he will do to him.  I can scarcely wait to see what comes next!

The one false note in the Javy arc was when Teo was in the diner addressing Javy and he pronounced Ava with a long a, and not the "Ahva" which he, and Javy, would have used in her presence without fail - and had used without fail in prior scenes.  Surely, one of the actors or the continuity person would have caught that?!

Love, love, love, Alice.  She'll be back.  She is much too good and significant a character to not be used again.  The final touch when she showed Letty the necklace was beyond delicious.   

[heckkitty]

Quote

Did the wife/girlfriend  really believe that? Or is she just gullible? 

Pretty sure she’s an idiot. Sean probably spouts religion to her to get her to do what she wants, & she goes alone because Jesus. 

[dubbel zout]

Christian porn exists. There's every kind of porn.

[attica]

Rule 32! If a thing exists (even fictionally), there's porn about it. 

[Nessie]

On 11/20/2017 at 10:19 PM, Joimiaroxeu said:

Dumbfcuk Teo. Javier told him he was good at what he did and he was. But poor Jacob having to experience that.

Honesty paid for Letty. Miracles never cease.

What I don't get is why Javier didn't kill Teo. A week isn't long enough to starve or die of thirst. All Javier has done is upped the ante. Next time Teo will grab Letty.

I assume Javi is planning on going back to question him.  Then I'm pretty sure Javi will kill him, because releasing him would be beyond stupid.

After a kind of shaky start to the season, I've loved these last two episodes.  

[ethalfrida]

I really hate the role the child plays in this series. He is an awesome actor but it just unnerves me.  And I don't want Letty and Javi changing either. The kid's part in it just makes the mom in me skeevy.

[UNOSEZ]

Teo pulling the gun on Jacob was so jarring.. It scared me a lil... Poor kid.. But he has the liars gene like his mom and great grandmother weve seen it over and over...what the hell is up with ava?  Even before teo did what he did dude seemed sketchy... And if ur kids can't stand a guy si bad they run away.. You need to rethink the guy... I hope javi lets her know that because if her creepy cokehead ex pulled a gun on a kid javi doesn't get to be stepdad of the year.. I want him to go nuclear on her

[leighdear]

Do we know for a fact that Teo isn't at least one of the girl's bio dad?   I think the actor is unattractive, so the skeevy vibe is very pronounced to me.

Beautiful reaction by Jacob, you could just see the tracks of tears running down his face, while Teo held the gun on him.  Exactly the reaction of a normal kid, it was perfect. 

And agreed, Michelle looked absolutely stunning, sitting at the dressing table putting on her makeup, then strolling into the party.  The dressers really do right by her, giving her a very flattering wardrobe.  

Edited November 26, 2017 by leighdear

[madam magpie]

This was probably my favorite episode so far. Really great stuff. Holland Taylor and Mr. Sheffield were fantastic. 

I felt terrible for Letty in this episode. We really got to see why she struggles as she does. And whew. Poor Jacob.

The bit about Estelle being a good mother, though? What?? I’m guessing we aren’t supposed to take Holland Taylor as a reliable narrator.

[gibasi]

Do we know that Estelle was a bad mother?  I have a horrible memory so I am truly wondering.  I just assumed that Letty's and Estelle's problems started when Letty was a teen and running wild.  That Estelle was trying to control her behavior.  Did I make that up in my head?

 

And I absolutely agree that Estelle is better for Jacob than Letty.  I think that he will go live with Estelle and that will also open up more story possibilities for Letty and Javier.  I think the show knows it would be pushing the boundaries way too far to have Jacob involved in any more of their escapades.  Even when Jacob is on the periphery of their cons and exploits it has been hard for me to turn off the mom in me-the one that wants to snatch Jabob to safety.

[mochamajesty]

Letty met her match in Alice. I would love to see Holland Taylor and Charles Shaughnessy again.

When RJ asked how much Letty needed, she shocked me by telling the truth.  I would have at least doubled the amount.

Alice was right and Letty knew it. 

I am not sure that I believe Ms. "Southern Charm'. I have never sat on any male's  lap as an adult unless I were doing him.

[dubbel zout]

With a kid of her own, I think Letty has a lot more empathy for Estelle now. Letty knows she was a handful. I bet Estelle did what she could. It’s easier with Jacob because he’s a more malleable kid, for one thing. I don’t think Letty ever had a problem with how Estelle patented Jacob; the problem was it wasn’t Letty.

[Crs97]

I think of Letty describing herself to Rose as, "My mom would say I am shit but then again she was never around" and Rob telling Estelle she wasn't mad at Letty but instead blamed herself for how Letty turned out.  There might have been more in the pilot, but I definitely got the feeling Estelle wasn't mother of the year.

[TaraS1]

I don't remember anything specific in the pilot @Crs97 but yeah, Estelle was definitely not a great mom to Letty.  During the Rob/Estelle wedding episode, Letty mentions how Estelle wasn't around when she cut herself shaving so badly as a kid that she had to go to the hospital.  And there was also the mention of the husband who beat Estelle and broke her arm, but they didn't indicate how old Letty was when that happened.

[helenamonster]

The show's been moving in this direction all season so it's nice but also heartbreaking to see the payoff: Letty and Javier do not lead the kind of lifestyle that is safe or sustainable for raising Jacob. Letty is doing the right thing by taking him back to Estelle. I think she's known that's what she needs to do for a while, but she needed to hear it from someone like Alice for it to really sink in.

Holland Taylor is a treasure. And she's dating Sarah Paulson so things are going pretty well for her!

Even though Letty is a bad influence on Jacob, I can't help loving how good of a liar he's learned to be from her. Making up stories about his ancestors so RJ would stop hinting at how great the antebellum times were? Slick move.

Porn Again. Dear Lord. Look, I'm a sex positive feminist who supports every consenting adult's right to express their sexuality in whatever way they see fit, but Jacob is a child. Sean sees him, what, twice a year? Eve blowing Adam (thanks, Letty!) can't wait until next Tuesday?

[Jadzia]

Considering the actress who plays Estelle is only 12 years older than the actress who plays Letty, are we supposed to think that Estelle was a teenage mom? Or is Letty supposed to be younger than the actress who plays her. I was shocked when Alice said she was pregnant with Estelle in 1968, which makes her only 3 years older than me. I can't imagine having a daughter Letty's age!

Edited December 1, 2017 by Jadzia
typo

[Nessie]

On 12/1/2017 at 2:31 PM, Jadzia said:

Considering the actress who plays Estelle is only 12 years older than the actress who plays Letty, are we supposed to think that Estelle was a teenage mom? Or is Letty supposed to be younger than the actress who plays her. I was shocked when Alice said she was pregnant with Estelle in 1968, which makes her only 3 years older than me. I can't imagine having a daughter Letty's age!

Taking my response to the episode 9 thread.