S03.E03: eps3.2_legacy.so

[Princess Sparkle]

Quote

The former interim CTO of E Corp returns  

[Milaxx]

This week's perk on the E-coin website was a sneak peek of the script.

Spoiler

 

It's a sneak peak of tonight script featuring a scene from the arcade the night Elliot started the 5/9 hack with Tyrell

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2017 by Milaxx
can't figure out how to spoiler tag image

[Milaxx]

Now I'm mad I missed the free  Echo dot that Ecion was giving out.

Anyway I need to rewatch and process this episode but *finally* it's confirmed that Santiago is dirty. 

I also think WR manipulated things so Elliot could get Flipper back because he's getting too depressed.

My guess is if Tyrell lives he will get his baby.

[Cardie]

So, if you were wondering what the heck was going on while Elliot was in prison, here's a primer . . .

On the one hand, it's a relief not to have this show be so opaque and obfuscating that the audience can't tell up from down. I'm imagining that complaints from viewers, critics and, probably, network brass have gotten Esmail to focus on the main narrative and clarify what has been mysterious. But on the other, I'm starting to view this as a standard crime thriller. Where has my maddening Mr. Robot gotten to?

So in the show's reality, it wasn't the Russians who put Trump in office but Whiterose. So fitting.

It never occurred to me that Tyrell was crushing on Elliot so hard. Subtext.

[HollyG]

8 minutes ago, Cardie said:

So, if you were wondering what the heck was going on while Elliot was in prison, here's a primer . . .

So in the show's reality, it wasn't the Russians who put Trump in office but Whiterose. So fitting.

It never occurred to me that Tyrell was crushing on Elliot so hard. Subtext.

"If you pull the right strings, a puppet will dance anyway you desire". Chilling.

[loki567]

I wonder if Esmail could go back a few years he'd make White Rose Russian. I'm not a fan of the Trump references that have already happened and probably going to increase. Blaming it on one hacker mastermind is way too pat. 

This was my favorite episode of the season so far which speaks to an increasingly serious issue I'm having with the show, I am extremely bored with Mr. Robot/Elliot relationship. I know that's the central dynamic of the show but it just feels so repetitive to me. At this point, I think I prefer the Elliot-light episodes. I thought Successor last year was the best episode of season two. 

[benteen]

5 hours ago, loki567 said:

I wonder if Esmail could go back a few years he'd make White Rose Russian. I'm not a fan of the Trump references that have already happened and probably going to increase. Blaming it on one hacker mastermind is way too pat. 

This was my favorite episode of the season so far which speaks to an increasingly serious issue I'm having with the show, I am extremely bored with Mr. Robot/Elliot relationship. I know that's the central dynamic of the show but it just feels so repetitive to me. At this point, I think I prefer the Elliot-light episodes. I thought Successor last year was the best episode of season two. 

Agreed about the references.  Though I disagree about the Elliot and Robot relationship, which I think has become more interesting as ever.

Interesting thought about how Whiterose might have been Russian if the show was made nowadays.  But I think China is a better fit here, given their growing status in the world.  But a Russian Whiterose would also be very intriguing.

I really enjoyed this episode too.  Tyrell was kept on the shelf for way too long last season and I'm glad this episode returned him to the forefront.  He's fascinating character and definitely carried this episode.  Very nice to see the return of Cisco and Elliot's jail protector.  Loved seeing Wallace Shawn appear on this show and that scene with Tyrell was excellent (and hilarious with his character sniffing a lot of coke).

[kat165]

The timeline seemed out of sync. Tyrell seemed to be in that
compound for several months. Yet he did not learn that his
wife is dead or that his baby has gone (I think) to social
services.

Towards the end Elliot and Tyrell were going somewhere
in a cab. Next we knew Elliot is being operated on. Was
this a flashback to when Elliot was shot last season? Did
this entire episode show us where Tyrell has been all this
time?

I enjoyed last night's ep, but I really missed Elliot as
Elliot.

[mrspidey]

3 hours ago, kat165 said:

The timeline seemed out of sync. Tyrell seemed to be in that
compound for several months. Yet he did not learn that his
wife is dead or that his baby has gone (I think) to social
services.

His wife died some time after he had shot Elliot.  Whe just haven't gotten to his reaction yet. I'm sure we will eventually.

[Cardie]

5 hours ago, kat165 said:

Was
this a flashback to when Elliot was shot last season? Did
this entire episode show us where Tyrell has been all this
time?

Yes. It tracks Tyrell from the execution of Phase One up until he has shot Elliot and Elliot has gone through surgery to remove the bullet. It's Mr. Robot in control when he wakes up. Elliot becomes conscious of himself only when he's been transferred to Angela's.

[Mumbles]

Liked the episode but I loathe that "If you Can Read My Mind" song. For years, on made-for-TV movies, that song telegraphed someone's upcoming untimely death. That and that song "If" by Bread. That's why I kept expecting him to learn of Joanna's death.

[kat165]

Thank you, Cardie. And mrspidey.

[scrb]

Would Tyrell be really broken up about learning that Joanna was killed?

Seems like Elliott is his true love.

Also with the weird stuff that Tyrell and Joanna were into, he doesn't seem the sentimental father type either.

[Anela]

3 hours ago, scrb said:

Would Tyrell be really broken up about learning that Joanna was killed?

Seems like Elliott is his true love.

Also with the weird stuff that Tyrell and Joanna were into, he doesn't seem the sentimental father type either.

I didn't think he was into it - I think he was just madly in love with his wife, and did whatever she wanted. Until this thing with Elliott. 

[thuganomics85]

Wallace Shawn on coke!  Got to love this show's casting!

So, basically, Tyrell was taken by Irving/Bobby Cannavale during Elliot's prison stint, and naturally hiding in a cabin in the wood.  Although he did almost get caught after trying to escape (I guess to get to Joanne?), but then is saved by Agent Santiago, who is now revealed to be part of Whiterose and the Dark Army.  They really do have their hands in every pocket, huh?

Fun seeing Cisco again.  And especially Leon!

Finding out the Whiterose/Dark Army are (or going to be) responsible for Donald Trump's presidency is a bit much, but I kind of suspected it was heading in that direction.

I do love Tyrell's bizarre obsession with Elliot.  The guy might be a dangerous creep to most, but when he cares about someone, he goes all in!

[shapeshifter]

18 hours ago, benteen said:

Interesting thought about how Whiterose might have been Russian if the show was made nowadays.  But I think China is a better fit here, given their growing status in the world.  But a Russian Whiterose would also be very intriguing

Russia and China share a long border.

 

So the Reddit posters were right all along about Tyrelliot being a love thing? (Rather than Tyrelliot being another Elliot alter?)

[Cardie]

As the consummate puppet master, did Whiterose subtly manipulate the son of one of her Washington Township engineers/victims to found fsociety so it could help further the Dark Army's goals? Or did she simply co-opt it? That would be a huge coincidence, and Whiterose doesn't seem to leave anything up to chance.

[shapeshifter]

I enjoy exploring the significance of the episode names. 

When I think of "Legacy" files, the backup server for my institution's website comes to mind, but the Wikipedia entry for "Legacy System" currently begins with:

Quote

In computing, a legacy system is an old method, technology, computer system, or application program, "of, relating to, or being a previous or outdated computer system."[1] Often a pejorative term, referencing a system as "legacy" means that it paved the way for the standards that would follow it. This can also imply that the system is out of date or in need of replacement.

…but also notes:

Quote

Even if it is no longer used, a legacy system may continue to impact the organization due to its historical role. Historic data may not have been converted into the new system format and may exist within the new system with the use of a customized schema crosswalk, or may exist only in a data warehouse. In either case, the effect on business intelligence and operational reporting can be significant. A legacy system may include procedures or terminology which are no longer relevant in the current context, and may hinder or confuse understanding of the methods or technologies used.

—all of which relates to the significance of the events in this flashback episode.

I often find the file extension meanings even more descriptive; according to file.org, regarding the .so file extension:

Quote

The SO files that are used by the computer applications contain shared program logic and other functions that are used to load common files into the library. This allows more than one program to use the same code base, even if they are running on different processes. 
 

^_ this can refer to Mr. Robot and Elliot sharing (at least) the knowledge of computer programming and hacking, but it can also refer to  Tyrell and Elliot's interactions (I'm still not ready to abandon the Tyrelliot-Alters theory) as well as the sharing of purposes/hacking results between The Dark Army and the victims of the corporate carcinogenic substance polluting, etc.

[atlantaloves]

I just finished re-watching all of season Two, and this show does not miss a beat, it all hangs together this season and is flawless. I just love love love it, and this mad love/need Tyrell has for Elliott, whoa. I'm just fan girling all over the place I can't help myself. This is the only place I can go to discuss this show, all my friends have given up on Mr. Robot, (fools) I think they got grossed out, not me! BD Wong and Bobby C. are knocking it out of server room! Okay, I'll go back to my basement now. 

[scowl]

11 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Russia and China share a long border.

And have fought wars over that border for over a century. They've never been BFFs. 

[hnygrl]

I still can't decide  if The Dark Army/White Rose Designed and implemented FSociety, or if they simply took advantage of a drunken rant of one of the leaders and lead them in that direction. Notice they were at Fsociety headquarters before it ever WAS Fsociety headquarters?

Damn. China owns our ass don't they? That's a little too close to true to be anything other than completely terrifying.

This backstory though....if you're patient, and observant? It's extremely fascinating. 

It appears everyone knows about Mr. Robot now...Angela was telling Tyrell, so he knows, and I'm 100% positive White Rose knows...that man/woman is ridiculously observant.

Poor Elliot! How the HELL is he gonna get out of this mess? He seems to be the puppet whose strings everyone is constantly yanking on. Sooner or later those strings are gonna break and then what?

This show can't realistically last much longer. Maybe they can squeeze one more season out if it, but it's already getting too fantastical as it is. They went forward in time a YEAR or more...and all the White Rose/Dark Army manipulations are getting a little "OH COME ON!" On the Ridiculousness scale.

Still a good show but for how much longer?

[atlantaloves]

I don't want this show to ever ever end. Just give me Mamie Gummer eating a sandwich and I am so happy.  I am so sorry she won't be able to get the best turkey sandwich in the tri-state area any more. I love her, she kicks ass. 

[candle96]

On 10/25/2017 at 11:30 PM, Cardie said:

So, if you were wondering what the heck was going on while Elliot was in prison, here's a primer . . .

On the one hand, it's a relief not to have this show be so opaque and obfuscating that the audience can't tell up from down. I'm imagining that complaints from viewers, critics and, probably, network brass have gotten Esmail to focus on the main narrative and clarify what has been mysterious. But on the other, I'm starting to view this as a standard crime thriller. Where has my maddening Mr. Robot gotten to?

So in the show's reality, it wasn't the Russians who put Trump in office but Whiterose. So fitting.

It never occurred to me that Tyrell was crushing on Elliot so hard. Subtext.

ITA. I was pretty excited to have an episode about Tyrell's disappearance, but was a bit disappointed to find out he's just as helpless/powerless as Elliot. I was hoping he was more of the mastermind he appeared to be when he showed up in Elliot's cab the first time around. If this whole thing is being controlled by the Dark Army and White Rose, I'm a little let down. Here's hoping there's more to it than that.

Mr. Robot is one of the few shows where I don't mind being confused or lost and just go along with the beauty of it all. But I also realize that's not exactly a formula for successful commercial television. I'd watch Rami Malek read the phone book.

Did anyone else catch the Delorian outside the arcade before Irving and his goons busted Elliot and Tyrell?

[shapeshifter]

On October 27, 2017 at 2:00 PM, hnygrl said:

This show can't realistically last much longer. Maybe they can squeeze one more season out if it, but it's already getting too fantastical as it is

I see this show's writing on par with Breaking Bad, so 5 seasons seems doable. Or maybe 4—which is what you're saying anyway.

 

12 hours ago, candle96 said:

Did anyone else catch the Delorian outside the arcade before Irving and his goons busted Elliot and Tyrell?

Seriously? Got a screen grab? While I don't see literal time travel factoring into this show, I can picture Elliot wanting to so completely undo the hack that he travels back in time while in a fugue state.

Edited October 29, 2017 by shapeshifter
Silly autocorrect

[candle96]

14 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

I see this show's writing on par with Breaking Bad, so 5 seasons seems doable. Or maybe 4—which is what you're saying anyway.

 

Seriously? Got a screen grab? While I don't see literal time travel factoring into this show, I can picture Elliot wanting to so completely undo the hack that he travels back in time while in a fugue state.

Damn, I was wrong. My bad. It's a silver Pontiac Fiero. Getting my 80s cars confused! It's right after Mr Robot agrees to work with Tyrell, and gives him the gun back. Around the 6-minute mark. 

Having seen and heard this show's allusions to and theories regarding Back to the Future, I think I got a little too enthusiastic. I am squarely in the camp of hoping time travel of any type does not happen, other than in Elliot's mind. I like this show existing in the "real" world.

[shapeshifter]

Maybe the not-quite-Delorean was supposed to catch the eye of 80s car aficionados. ;-)

[green]

I stumbled (TV surfing) upon the guy that plays Tyrell a day or two ago.  He was being interviewed on a local station.  Don't know why or how as I came in mid way through the mini interview.  But the two women interviewing him at least seemed to actually know the show as opposed to typical interviewers.  They were asking abut his relationship with Elliot that we especially saw a lot of this past episode and he said yeah Tyrell does have a very strong love for Elliot.  Whether it is "shipping" (they used that term) or more platonic it definitely is there. 

He didn't give anything away per se and didn't really seem to know what the writers have in mind ultimately.  But his main take away has always been that his character loves Elliot first and foremost because he does see them as "gods" together in this undertaking.  If it morphs into a human relationship, fine and good.  But if not they will always occupy Olympus together in Tyrell's mind.  That if he does have the hots for Elliot it is entirely born out of his pov that the two of them are so much more than mere mortals.  That they both are that special.

OT:  He mentioned that the first season they were getting the episodes one at a time as everyone was scrambling to keep up with the suddenly green lighted series time wise.  It wasn't until Episode 8 on the first season that the entire cast sat down for a big read at the table together and that was when the actors all learned for the first time about who Mr Robot really was.  He said there were big gasps all around the room at that moment.  Would have been fun to be a fly on the wall in that room then.

[KaleyFirefly]

On 10/28/2017 at 5:32 PM, atlantaloves said:

I don't want this show to ever ever end. Just give me Mamie Gummer eating a sandwich and I am so happy.  I am so sorry she won't be able to get the best turkey sandwich in the tri-state area any more. I love her, she kicks ass. 

Actually, it's her sister Grace Gummer who plays Dom in Mr. Robot. Easy mistake though, because they really look a lot alike, and of course, both look so much like their mom, Meryl Streep.

I enjoyed this flashback episode. The scene at the beginning was really interesting, where Mr. Robot seemed quite surprised to find out that Tyrell is a bit crazy and in love with Elliott. I thought he would have known that already since he was the one who had been working with Tyrell on the hack all along. I mean, at least half the time it would have been Mr. Robot and not Elliott, right?

I wish, though, that we'd gotten a bit more insight into Tyrell's motivations. How did he go from being a CTO of Evil Corp, obsessed with money and power, to being a pawn in the Dark Army's plan? Was it just because he fell in love with Elliott? What is his stake in this whole thing? We know why Angela is in it -- to get justice for her dead mother. We think we know why White Rose is in it -- power, or mutliple dimensions, etc. But why is Tyrell in it? To the point he'd give up his wife and son?

I loved seeing Wallace Shawn, one of my favorite character actors, in this show and I hope he pops up from time to time. It was also nice seeing Leon again -- I actually miss him! We need more Leon!

I appreciated the cynicism of the view of the world during White Rose's conversation with his PR guy. Telling him to blame Iran for F-Society, talking about Trump as the perfect puppet...it's all pretty sad but true.

Edited November 4, 2017 by KaleyFirefly

[atlantaloves]

Whoops, sorry, my bad....I was having a Hollywood Senior Moment. Thank you for the correction! Grace Gummer, of course. 

[KaleyFirefly]

16 minutes ago, atlantaloves said:

Whoops, sorry, my bad....I was having a Hollywood Senior Moment. Thank you for the correction! Grace Gummer, of course. 

Here you can see how all 3 Gummer sisters look alike.

 

 

[atlantaloves]

Holy Hedy Lamar, they truly are total clones. WOW....Good, that wasn't a senior moment I was having. Well, I love all those Gummer gals.  They look and sound like her as well, and there is nothing wrong with that! Great picture, thanks. 

[Hanahope]

I loved getting backstory of what was going on while Elliot was in prison, all the machinations by the Dark Army while he was there (both the friend and the warden), what happened to Tyrell.  Tyrell may love Elliot, but he's going to be devasted when he learns about Joanne.  And now that we know the lead FBI agent is Dark Army, I'm sure the baby is being held by the Dark Army to keep tyrell in line, once he does find out.

It was also a great opportunity to show how Irving has been involved ever since Phase 1 went live, and show why we didn't see him last season.

[truthaboutluv]

Well look at that. I guess getting completely snubbed by the Emmys after multiple nominations the year before and Rami winning, made Sam come correct this season. Enough of this vague, faux deep, dragging out of stuff. Things are actually being fully explained. I loved this episode for all the backstory it provided of all the shit that went down going all the way back to the Season 1 finale. And I guess this answers the question of Tyrell being an Elliot alter (though I'm sure some will still hold onto that theory). It's still a bit odd and well kind of creepy how obsessed Tyrell seems to be with Elliot, especially as they had no relationship until he sought Elliot out to work with him because he figured out Elliot was the one behind the hack. So this blind, obsessive loyalty he has for Elliot is just weird. Wonder how he'll react when he finds out Joanna' s dead. 

Bobby Cannavale's character is fun and I like how you can tell he's convinced that both Tyrell and Elliot are completely batshit crazy (totally knew he was full of shit with that story about his wife and kids). Thing is at least Elliot has the excuse of suffering from multiple personality disorder. Still trying to make sense of Tyrell's crazy. We at least now know there's some daddy issue there. I mean you know dude is completely nuts when even an alter looks at him like he's nuts, as when he first met Mr. Robot. Good call by the posters who suspected that the FBI agent guy was on Dark Army's payroll. 

It was nice to see Leon again and I cracked up at his talking about killing the Neo-Nazis, while making it very clear that he totally respects all human life. And of course missing that the point of the question was asking about Elliot. I do find it odd that for as connected and seemingly all knowing as so many of these people are, many of them don't know or haven't figured out that Elliot suffers from multiple personality disorder. We know Elliot has been hospitalized in the past because Angela and Darlene have both referenced his mental issues from when they were younger. So how did so many of these people not know about this? Bobby Canavale seemed genuinely confused as to why Elliot spoke to him like he'd never met him in the season premiere. 

eta: A few months ago, I would have enjoyed that little wink, wink moment of White Rose apparently being behind the push to make Trump President but uh yeah, with where this world is right now, just a little too close for comfort. 

Quote

On the one hand, it's a relief not to have this show be so opaque and obfuscating that the audience can't tell up from down. I'm imagining that complaints from viewers, critics and, probably, network brass have gotten Esmail to focus on the main narrative and clarify what has been mysterious. But on the other, I'm starting to view this as a standard crime thriller. Where has my maddening Mr. Robot gotten to?

YMMV, I've always seen this show as a psychological crime thriller and it is still that. What happened in Season 2 is that Esmail got a little too cute and in love with his own cleverness and genius, like many writers/creators have done in the past and it ended up hurting the show. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Season 2 as a whole for what it was but the fact is many did not respond to it as well as I'm sure Esmail and company expected. And it led to their completely falling out of favor with the critics to the point that Rami, who won the previous year, didn't even get a nomination for Best Actor at the Emmys.

He needed to reset and get the show back on a proper track and that's what's happening right now, IMO. Of course as I've always said, I felt like some viewers confused themselves versus the writers being confusing because they were over thinking the whole show and making it way more complicated than it really is. 

Quote

I didn't think he was into it - I think he was just madly in love with his wife, and did whatever she wanted. Until this thing with Elliott. 

We do know that he is into guys though, as we saw him hook up with that one guy in Season 1 and Joanna was nowhere in sight. I'm pretty sure she knew it was happening because she seemed the type that would know but I don't think he was doing it for her benefit, as opposed to his just being into men. And he also admitted to cheating on her during the long interrogation. 

 

Quote

I was pretty excited to have an episode about Tyrell's disappearance, but was a bit disappointed to find out he's just as helpless/powerless as Elliot.

YMMV but I thought it's been obvious since the first season and then definitely the second season that Tyrell wasn't controlling anything. The showdown scene between him and Elliot at the end of Season 2 made it clear that he was deferring to Elliot, which is why he couldn't understand why Elliot was backing out from the plan. Tyrell seems completely beholden to Elliot who we know isn't fully in control of what's happening since he has no real hold on reality due to his multiple personality. That said, I do think this is all heading to the Dark Army underestimating Elliot, because he is mentally unwell. 

 

Quote

Mr. Robot is one of the few shows where I don't mind being confused or lost and just go along with the beauty of it all. But I also realize that's not exactly a formula for successful commercial television. 

It's also a recipe for many viewers to then complain about being confused and nothing makes sense and that the show is trying to hard to be deep and clever and then they stop watching. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[AudienceofOne]

On 28/10/2017 at 6:00 AM, hnygrl said:

Poor Elliot! How the HELL is he gonna get out of this mess? He seems to be the puppet whose strings everyone is constantly yanking on. Sooner or later those strings are gonna break and then what?

He’s the Messiah. There’s no way out.