dubbel zout February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 As much as I didn't really take to NL as Emily, I did sort of like Rebecca meeting Aaron the Zander lookalike on the plane I kind of loved that because Chad Brannon looked so great. Rebecca was one of Guza's most pointless characters; Ron isn't the only one who indulges favored actors. 1 Link to comment
ulkis February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 I think Rebecca was all for Nikolas/Tyler Christopher - he certainly wasn't about indulging Natalia Livingston (forgive me if TC is who you meant in the first place). I find it really weird to remember that Rebecca was a thing in the first place that happened. Like . . . did they REALLY think that was a gonna be a hit? So bizarre. 1 Link to comment
TeeVee329 February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 I remember the Serial Drama girls making a lot of hilarious hash out of Guza's claims that he had, like, the coolest way to bring Natalia Livingston back if she ever wanted to return to the show. Link to comment
UYI February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 How long were NL and TC a couple IRL? I wonder if there was ever any awkwardness between them over acting together after they broke up (either while she was still Emily or when she came back as Rebecca). Link to comment
ulkis February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 Not very long. I think they got over it pretty quickly. Link to comment
Tiger February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 I find it really weird to remember that Rebecca was a thing in the first place that happened. Like . . . did they REALLY think that was a gonna be a hit? So bizarre. KIEV, the show spent weeks hinting that Rebecca actually was Emily and a Friday cliffhanger was going to resolve the issue, and then the next Monday it wasn't followed up on and th next we saw Rebecca whatever the story was had apparently been dropped and then they announced NL was leaving. Link to comment
dubbel zout February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 (edited) Before she had any sort of story, Rebecca spent about a month skulking around the halls of GH wearing a beret and heavy eyeliner, so we'd know she was "bad." It was so stupid. Edited February 15, 2015 by dubbel zout 2 Link to comment
WendyCR72 February 15, 2015 Share February 15, 2015 Before she had any sort of story, Rebecca spent about a month skulking around the halls of GH wearing a beret and heavy eyeliner, so we'd know she was "bad." It was so stupid. Don't forget the gum snapping. Positively edgy, I tell you. 5 Link to comment
cheyz February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 LOVED Original Zander/Emily. So much. As much as I didn't really take to NL as Emily, I did sort of like Rebecca meeting Aaron the Zander lookalike on the plane and hinting at something there since the inferior (to me!) Nik/Emily destroyed Zander to happen. To me, NL Emily/Zander always seemed forced and rushed. AT Emily and Zander broke up before she left, and then all of a sudden the recast was back in lurv with him and wanted to protect him from her breast cancer. It felt like they put them back together just to cause angst for the new pairing with Nik. Link to comment
ulkis February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 I don't remember all that clearly now but I'm pretty sure Emily was never genuinely back in love with him - she was forcing herself into it. I just remember thinking at the time that they had clearly cast this girl with Tyler in mind as her main love interest - Natalia was and looked older than Chad Brannon, and she looked like she was kinda taller than him too, but I may be wrong on that. It kind of amazed me how Guza burnt through obstacles for Nikolas and Emily like crazy. The forced marriage to Lydia could have lasted for years but it was rush rush rush. I wonder why Nik and Emily didn't get writing closer to Dillon and Georgie, more naturalistic. I guess maybe they were going for grand guignol/gothic romance with them, but it really didn't work. Well, for me at least. Nikolas and Emily were pretty popular. It's just too bad, because I definitely could have liked them under different circumstances. 3 Link to comment
dubbel zout February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 I guess maybe they were going for grand guignol/gothic romance with them, but it really didn't work. No, it did not. Emily was too sunny a character, especially when NL took over. Link to comment
Harmony233 February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 No, it did not. Emily was too sunny a character, especially when NL took over. I thought they turned NL too princessy or something while AT Emily could be a brat and she fit in more with the Q's IMO. Link to comment
ulkis February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 NL couldn't act for shit, that was the problem. Link to comment
cheyz February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 I really liked the first Lydia, they should have kept her around. That would have been more gothic. The second Lydia was just a giggly American, generically pretty. She wasn't the old money European heiress any more. 1 Link to comment
Melgaypet February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 I can't keep the Lydias straight - was the first Lydia the one with the crazy Joker smile or was she the skinny, red-headed one? Link to comment
jsbt February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 (edited) Original Lydia was the Joker, though I didn't think she was that crazy-lookin'. I thought she was something interesting but they dumped her immediately for the strange, skinny chick. I thought Natalia had chemistry with both Chad Brannon and TC, and I thought the story wrote itself for a triangle with Emily's two great loves. It had great potential, and you could've had Stefan scheme against them without going insane, or had Zander be a real rival. The problem was that wasn't the story they told. Edited February 16, 2015 by jsbt Link to comment
ulkis February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 (edited) And then I wonder if once the baby is born, Ned will hire a nanny and talk about them being a family while Olivia's face registers her growing discomfort at Ned going back on his word. I wonder if she'll thank him for everything he's done and how grateful she is, but remind him about their previous agreement, of her raising the baby alone, with him as a father figure, but that no, she won't be living with him and there won't be a nanny. I wonder if Ned's gentlemanly do-gooder mask will fall off and he'll coldly sneer that if she doesn't agree to HIS wishes, then maybe he'll tell Julian the truth and all that she's done to protect her kid will be for naught because Ned isn't getting what he wants. I was thinking this scenario - given the writers take this into account of course - can't really repeat itself since Liv has Dante and ick, even Sonny to turn to, but then I remembered Alexis should have been able to turn to Nikolas. Did they ever say why she never turned to him for help to get Ned to back off? Edited February 16, 2015 by ulkis Link to comment
Ambrosefolly February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 The main reason I believe they made Ned look that much of as an ass is because Ned wasn't a Guza pet and was more or less in competition with Kristina's real father, Sonny. The closer men not named Jason got Sonny's storylines, the worse they were made to look. 3 Link to comment
cheyz February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 I was thinking this scenario - given the writers take this into account of course - can't really repeat itself since Liv has Dante and ick, even Sonny to turn to, but then I remembered Alexis should have been able to turn to Nikolas. Did they ever say why she never turned to him for help to get Ned to back off? Was Nik on the show at that time? I can't remember, just that there were long gaps when neither actor was around. Link to comment
Tiger February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 Was Nik on the show at that time? I can't remember, just that there were long gaps when neither actor was around. Nik was around, but he was being played by that other actor with a thousand names and busy giving Lucky bedroom eyes. And I wish that sentence was a joke. 5 Link to comment
ulkis February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 (edited) Was Nik on the show at that time? I can't remember, just that there were long gaps when neither actor was around.Tiger Nik was around, but he was being played by that other actor with a thousand names and busy giving Lucky bedroom eyes. And I wish that sentence was a joke. Ah, okay. I thought it might have been him, but wasn't sure. Nik has only been absent from the show for about a year and a half, from July 2011 to March 2013. Otherwise he's been around in some form since 1996. Edited February 16, 2015 by ulkis 1 Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 16, 2015 Share February 16, 2015 The actor that kept changing his name! Link to comment
Vella February 17, 2015 Share February 17, 2015 ulkis, I don't recall much about Nikolas during that time, I just remember how horrible Alexis was treated by the writers. You could practically feel the waves of hate coming off the writing towards Alexis. These were the same writers that clearly decided Alexis killed Luis in the last quarter of the storyline, when in the firs 15 seconds of it, they'd eliminated her as a possible suspect since she was THERE was Luis splatted on the ground. Oh, but apparently she pushed him too. She ended up reaching out to Stefan, which led to the awful implosion of Stefan/Alexis and their relationship. It was awful. Zander stayed on her side and helped bust the 'Ned framed for statutory rape' case and then it all mercifully ended. But I have never hated Ned more, than in those scenes where he threatened to tell Sonny the truth about Kristina if Alexis didn't do what he wanted. 2 Link to comment
Cattitude February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 The head writer then was Guza, that's why I said Ron has basically left things as Bob fashioned them wherever Sonny's concerned. Guza wrecked and ruined A.J. every chance he got, he not only had him seen as the Cain to Jason's Abel by his entire family, but then he had Jason team up right alongside Sonny and they both targeted A.J., stealing Michael away from him in the most cruel and unforgivable way possible. Guza made A.J. the black sheep and Ron has just carried on that same twisted mentally, especially since Sean "insulted his honour" or whatever the hell he got his knickers in a twist about. Even now though he is dead, murdered, most characters still find a way to insult and demean and accuse A.J. as if he was just the most disgusting guy around. No one "wins" against Sonny, not really. You will either lose your life or lose your sanity, and some days I feel as if I'm in the latter category. I am genuinely curious about this. It seems to me that Jason and AJ were young men around Michael's age in 1998-2000, maybe that is a mistaken assumption. B/C to me it isn't like Guza ruined AJ so much is that is how he was b/c Guza saw him turn out that way as a man b/c of the Cain and Able stuff. So to me Ron continuing the role AJ was cast in from a young man is consistent with history. So if I'm wrong I just don't understand what kind of man AJ was before Guza. I don't think it's right the whole town spat on AJ but from the little I have seen of young AJ it seems his own family was the most to blame for him turn out the way he did. Was there an adult AJ before Guza who was well liked? 1 Link to comment
CPP83 February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 I am genuinely curious about this. It seems to me that Jason and AJ were young men around Michael's age in 1998-2000, maybe that is a mistaken assumption. B/C to me it isn't like Guza ruined AJ so much is that is how he was b/c Guza saw him turn out that way as a man b/c of the Cain and Able stuff. So to me Ron continuing the role AJ was cast in from a young man is consistent with history. So if I'm wrong I just don't understand what kind of man AJ was before Guza. I don't think it's right the whole town spat on AJ but from the little I have seen of young AJ it seems his own family was the most to blame for him turn out the way he did. Was there an adult AJ before Guza who was well liked? Guza took adult A.J. and turned him into a joke. I really don't think it had much, if anything, to do with an idea of who A.J. had turned into due to his upbringing but merely Guza picking A.J. to pit against his two "heroes", Sonny and Jason. Sean was in the role maybe a year when Guza took over and suddenly A.J. was basically public enemy number one, especially when he caused the accident that "ruined" Jason and then gave him the chance to "team up" with Sonny. To me Guza just loved having A.J. pitted against Jason and Sonny both but he never won. Those two literally got away with murder while A.J. was hung on a meat hook. A.J. really wasn't a very screwed up character, at least in my eyes, he did have a complex from being the black sheep of the Qs, but he also had a purpose and there was so much they could have done with him, with his history and connections to PC. But instead Guza took him and made him nothing more than the Corinthos'/Morgan personal punching bag to abuse. Guza even attempted to kill A.J. off by having him smothered to death by his ten year old son, the kid stolen from him and taught to hate him basically since birth. It was the ultimate insult and I was glad he was forced to change it because it was just too much, he'd already spent over a decade dragging A.J. through the mire, and yet he still wanted to end his existence in the most ghastly way possible. That's why I have such an issue with Guza's portrayal of A.J., it was as if he had a personal grudge against the character, the way he wrote him. And then coupled that with how he basically wrote Sonny and Jason as if sunshine shot out of their asses...it was just too much to take. 10 Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 AJ was always well liked by the audience. The two actors who played him were better than Steve Burton and the writing by leaps and bounds. The AJ history as I recall is AJ is the only biological child of Monica and Alan. He thought it was Jeff Webber's kid, but it was Alan's. Alan later had an affair with Susan Moore, hi Jason. Monica hated Jason as a kid till he was a toddler. Jason and AJ went to boarding school. They came back as bad boy AJ played by Sean Kanan and good guy Jason who wore Christmas sweaters. Jason dated Karen Wexler, fellow pre med student. AJ dated some girl named Nikki. AJ was a business major whom Edward was pushing as the next head of ELQ. It stressed him out. AJ boxed for fun on the side with Jagger. He actually beat up Jagger for stealing Karen from Jason. They were that close. Brenda lived with them. They saw the mess Sonny did to Karen and everyone warned Brenda away. Something happened, AJ started being an alcoholic suddenly. He went driving, Jason jumped in the car. Boom, Jason Morgan. Jason originally forgave AJ and he and Lila were the only Quartermaines Jason talked to. Till Carly. While Jason was dating Robin, he was banging Carly. One day, AJ went find his brother and saw Carly. They had sex while drunk. Carly was dating Tony Jones and wanted him to be the dad. Yeah this is Micheal. So Carly drugged AJ and did mean things to insure he'd be out of town. Jason turned his back on his brother for Carly. And.. there's more. 3 Link to comment
Cattitude February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 Thanks for the perspective. I can see that there are lots of hurt fans b/c the Qs are a legacy family and the potential of both legacy sons of Alan and Monica got screwed up in service of Guza's love of mobster stories. I agree if Guza didn't want to tell a mob story then the history of AJ and Jason may have gone so differently, though I still think AJ would have been a little screwed up from his family alone. 2 Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 Yeah, but AJ when he first returned in 2012 was the best writing AJ got since the 90s. And SK is actually trained in karate, martial arts. Fun fact, he was the bad guy in Karate Kid III. So the idea of AJ played by him getting his ass kicked by Sonny is ridiculous imo. 1 Link to comment
peachmangosteen February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 (edited) So the idea of AJ played by him getting his ass kicked by Sonny is ridiculous imo. LOL remember when they fought at the boxing gym. I mean honestly how is anyone supposed to believe MB could take SK there. I have to believe even the most loyal Sonny worshipers had to know that was unbelievable. Edited February 20, 2015 by peachmangosteen 7 Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 My bf who barely watches soaps, but knows Karate Kid movies had the best reaction. He pretty much Kanyed it. He was like "How the hell does Karate's next bad boy lose in a fight to a fake mobster?" He hasn't been that upset by a soap since he realized he was never going to see KeMo's boobs. *In the movie, they constantly referred to SK's character as Karate's Next Bad Boy Link to comment
ch1 February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 (edited) If SK was MB they would have incorporated his karate skills into the character. But you know, AJ=loser so he must always have his ass handed to him. Edited February 20, 2015 by ch1 4 Link to comment
dubbel zout February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 I agree if Guza didn't want to tell a mob story then the history of AJ and Jason may have gone so differently, though I still think AJ would have been a little screwed up from his family alone. I think they could have told the mob story without completely vilifying AJ. Jason's transformation was kind of clever, IMO, and the problem wasn't that AJ drove the car into the tree, it was that once he drove the car into the tree, nothing else he did mattered. It was the beginning of the end for AJ. I'll never understand why he became such a scapegoat. There was a lot of material to mine. But AJ wasn't the only character who suffered once Guza was determined to have his daytime Sopranos. He probably suffered the most, though. 5 Link to comment
ulkis February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 AJ was always well liked by the audience. The two actors who played him were better than Steve Burton and the writing by leaps and bounds. There were actually three actors who played grown AJ. That Gerald Hopkins fellow. And I gotta disagree. I think Steve Burton was a better actor than Sean Kanan, at least in the 90s. Billy Warlock was leaps ahead of both of them though, but he wasn't a hunk, so I can see why Jason kept his popularity against his AJ. I am genuinely curious about this. It seems to me that Jason and AJ were young men around Michael's age in 1998-2000, maybe that is a mistaken assumption. Well Jason was in his mid 20s but I have no idea how old AJ was supposed to be at that point, since he was played by Billy Warlock, and BW was definitely not mid 20s. Link to comment
dubbel zout February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 I think they cast Warlock precisely because he didn't physically overwhelm MB. I giggle when MB and LW square off, because she looks capable of clocking him into unconsciousness. 8 Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 My guess? AJ was always only a couple years to three years older than Jason, if that much. Jason was like a college freshman and AJ was junior. SK has better movie success. He actually has more movie credits and no I'm not referring to Karate Kid. Imo if Jason weren't paired with Robin,he wouldn't have retained popularity. AJ never had a sweet girl to play off of. SK can play different roles. As can BW. SBu can do a few things. Link to comment
CPP83 February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 Thanks for the perspective. I can see that there are lots of hurt fans b/c the Qs are a legacy family and the potential of both legacy sons of Alan and Monica got screwed up in service of Guza's love of mobster stories. I agree if Guza didn't want to tell a mob story then the history of AJ and Jason may have gone so differently, though I still think AJ would have been a little screwed up from his family alone. Oh being a Q basically means one is unstable one way or another, heh, they are biologically destined to have "issues". A.J. was very much a guy who was imperfect with flaws from his teens on, which I always thought made for some of the best characters on soap operas, not 100% perfect and good but they also aren't total villains. They're as close to being "human" as you can get. However Guza didn't write him as a man who struggled with a drinking problem, who was trying to better himself and prove himself to his family with both some success as well as failure, as he was written before Guza came on board. Guza turned A.J. into this bumbling carton character who would nearly trip over his shoes if Sonny so much as looked at him because that's the kind of "hold" Sonny had over him. A.J. was this losing, pathetic wimp and Sonny was made out to be this "big bad-ass" who was everything A.J. wasn't/ Sonny was the kind of "man" that A.J. could not even dream of ever becoming, respected and loved and appreciated by his home town or family. That is what gave me such rage blackouts back then. 6 Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 Especially since Jason Quartermaine dated Karen and both he and AJ were pissed about what Sonny did to Karen. This was when people could hate Sonny. I remember AJ and Jason warning Brenda away from Sonny (Brenda lived in the Quartermaines mansion then and was a good friend). It's always made zero sense that Jason, who loved his brother so much would choose anyone, let alone Carly and Sonny over AJ. It's made zero sense that Jason would work for the monster who hurt Karen. Ugh. Link to comment
dubbel zout February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 It's made zero sense that Jason would work for the monster who hurt Karen. Ugh. It wasn't Jason Q who went to work for Sonny, though. It was someone with no memories whatsoever of his previous life. Link to comment
Melgaypet February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 (edited) Yeah, not to defend Jason Morgan, who is probably my Most Loathed Soap Character Ever, but he had lost all memories of Karen and she herself was out of town by then. I don't recall a specific scene where he finally learned about the Sonny-Karen history, but he wouldn't have cared. Because he sucked. Edited February 20, 2015 by Melgaypet Link to comment
UYI February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 (edited) There were actually three actors who played grown AJ. That Gerald Hopkins fellow. And I gotta disagree. I think Steve Burton was a better actor than Sean Kanan, at least in the 90s. Billy Warlock was leaps ahead of both of them though, but he wasn't a hunk, so I can see why Jason kept his popularity against his AJ. Well Jason was in his mid 20s but I have no idea how old AJ was supposed to be at that point, since he was played by Billy Warlock, and BW was definitely not mid 20s. *ahem* Billy Warlock is a MAJOR hunk to me, thank you. :P And given that I'm 5'4 1/2, I'm sure he's still taller than me. ;) Also, here is some Gerald Hopkins as AJ, back when he was first engaged to Nikki Langton. Edited February 20, 2015 by UYI 2 Link to comment
ulkis February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 So am I! woo hoo, height twins. Except I don't know if I'm 5'4 AND a half. I might just be 5'4. Or 5'4 and three quarters. :) 1 Link to comment
tvgoddess February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 (edited) I always loved Billy Warlock since I first saw him on Days as Frankie, but to quote Buffy, "I mean, the guy's like three feet tall". Very cute, but way too short for my taste. Kind of the same way I feel about Dante. And I'm 5 feet half an inch. Yes, I will add the half inch every time. Edited February 20, 2015 by tvgoddess Link to comment
Melgaypet February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 (edited) Billy Warlock obviously has a hideously aged portrait in his attic. I used to feel a little guilty about laughing at jokes about Sonny/MB's shortness, when Billy is so wee himself, but whatev. And you know, despite the height difference, Billy always looked like Stuart Damon's son to me. THAT was a handsome man, in his prime. ETA: According to the internet, Billy Warlock and I are the same height, 5'7". I...rather doubt this, and too short for my personal taste even if true (my husband is 6'3"), but he is still good-looking. Edited February 20, 2015 by Melgaypet 5 Link to comment
UYI February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 More Gerald Hopkins as AJ. Go to 5:10 onward, where Alan tells AJ how disappointed he is in him and wishes he was more like Jason, which he overhears. Poor AJ. :( Alan and Monica get locked in the attic, and a very young AJ and Jason come rescue them. Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 I swear I thought Gerald guy played teen AJ. So the order has to be Gerald, Sean Kanan, Billy Warlock, and then Sean Kanan again. Btw, Sean Kanan is handsome now, but I crushed on his fine ass so hard back then. Link to comment
JeezumCrow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 Billy Warlock obviously has a hideously aged portrait in his attic. I used to feel a little guilty about laughing at jokes about Sonny/MB's shortness, when Billy is so wee himself, but whatev. And you know, despite the height difference, Billy always looked like Stuart Damon's son to me. THAT was a handsome man, in his prime. ETA: According to the internet, Billy Warlock and I are the same height, 5'7". I...rather doubt this, and too short for my personal taste even if true (my husband is 6'3"), but he is still good-looking. Hee! I met Billy Warlock a few (oh God probably a dozen) years ago. I'm 5'2", and I'd say 5'7" is a reasonable figure. Link to comment
Chairperson Meow February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 Regarding the ages: AJ's birthdate originally was December 13, 1979. Jason's original birthdate was September 14, 1981. Jason was SORAS'D in 1991 when Steve Burton was cast. Jason is supposed to be 34. AJ is supposed to be 36, if we go by the original birthdates. However, AJ's birthdate was changed on his two different graves. And allegedly no one celebrates Jason's birthday, which gives the writers freedom to make it whenever. So actually, Billy Miller is the correct age if the writers now want Jason to be his accurate age. Link to comment
Harmony233 February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 I was watching some old GH eps maybe 87 or 88. A.J wanted monica to come see his sceince fair but she had o work. Somewhere in this time frame. AJ runs away but Monica and lan think he was setting a bad example for Jason.Even back then I felt bad for AJ. 2 Link to comment
ch1 February 20, 2015 Share February 20, 2015 I was watching some old GH eps maybe 87 or 88. A.J wanted monica to come see his sceince fair but she had o work. Somewhere in this time frame. AJ runs away but Monica and lan think he was setting a bad example for Jason.Even back then I felt bad for AJ. AJ was screwed from the beginning. Its just amazing how far down the writers took him. 1 Link to comment
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