GH History Lessons: Because History is Always Repeating Itself

[Chairperson Meow]

Then I'd like a scene where Ron "I love history" acknowledges the deceased Baldwins. I've accepted no Serena.

[jsbt]

I would vomit up my liver if I had to hear Franco invoke Karen and act all outraged.

[Harmony233]

Seriously, they took the time for that bullshit scene where Olivia declared Steven Lars and Franco had the same killer DNA (because what Steve did is totally in the same league as Franco's SERIAL KILLER antics, I guess), why can't they find time for Scotty to talk to Franco about his siblings?

 

Answer?  Because the show doesn't care about them being father and son, it was their bs way to justify the Carly pairing and keep Franco connected to Heather.

LOL true sadly I think they put more effort into Logan and scott and I never though I'd say that but at least Logan Knew he had a sister lol.

[Melgaypet]

Two sisters, actually. Three if you count poor dead Karen.

 

God, Franco. I remain utterly confused that they've made him Scott's son. Well, everything about Franco confuses me, because why is this character still a thing when literally nothing about him works, but this especially. How pointless and insulting.

[dubbel zout]

he barely mentioned Logan

 

I think the show wants to forget Logan ever existed. It wouldn't have been hard to recast if there was an investment in the character.

[Harmony233]

I think the show wants to forget Logan ever existed. It wouldn't have been hard to recast if there was an investment in the character.

Yes I never got why they never recast and god knows its not like his death gave story to scott other than it somehow became all about Laura leaving scott for luke.THat shouldn't have had anything to do with Logans death so lame.

[TeeVee329]

Question - I have to figure Sam and Helena have crossed paths before, but has Helena ever had scenes with Kristina or Molly?

[Chairperson Meow]

I'm going to say no on this Molly, but damn. Itd be kinda cool.

[dubbel zout]

A Molly/Helena scene needs to happen.

[Harmony233]

I don't think so Helena never seemed interested in Kristina or molly.

[TeeVee329]

I get Helena not being interested in Mikkos' bastard lineage, but you think she'd enjoy messing with Kristina or Molly to tick off Alexis.  You know, just to unwind at the end of a day of evil plotting.

Edited October 3, 2014 by TeeVee329

[dubbel zout]

If nothing else, you'd think she'd want to ensure her legacy somehow. The male line is completely hopeless.

[TeeVee329]

But I guess that's what the (ew) Stavros/Lulu embryo is for.

[jennifer6973]

dubbel zout

 

Alexis is Mikkos bastard child, unrelated to her.

 

So I don't think she cares about the bastard childs children.

[dubbel zout]

Maybe not, but they're her best chance. Her loss.

[Chairperson Meow]

Well, there's Danny. Son of Borg, kind of Cassadine ish. If I had to pick, I'd want the hand holder over Count Chocula.

[Harmony233]

I don't Know spencers pretty crazy already.I can only imagine how he will be when he grows up.

[Francie]

I don't Know spencers pretty crazy already.I can only imagine how he will be when he grows up.

Since he's Ron's Mini-me, he'll be petty and petulant, without a clue as to how to get along with people who don't kiss his ass.

[Cattitude]

Can someone explain Michael's two dads thing to me. Did Carly always knowingly lie about Michael's father? Did Sonny know he wasn't Michael's father from when? I know AJ and Michael just found out right before AJ died, but was Sonny also in the dark until recently or did he know for a while?

[Chairperson Meow]

Nope. Carly has always lied and Sonny always knew.

Get snacks. Sit down.

Carly was banging Tony Jones, but got drunk and banged AJ. Here comes Micheal. She tried to pass him off as Tony's. No bueno. Then passed him off as Jason's. There were carriage antics. Robin had a bad haircut. Carly was a bitch. Robin told AJ you are the father. Jason had a mad. Carly had a mad. Robin and Jason broke up. Carly and AJ married briefly. I think. Then Carly married Sonny because, power. She chose the unstable bipolar mobster with a criminal history to adopt Micheal, rather than allow the business man, AJ raise his son. Sonny knew all of this. Sonny had gotten control of Jason then. Micheal was named after Sonny by Jason, as Sonny means Michael in mobster.

I'm sure I missed something. Someone smarter can fill in what I missed.

[rur]

Don't forget that Carly had post-partum depression and dumped Michael on Jason while she left town. Jason got the baby baptized.  Robin helped Jason tend to the baby while Carly was AWOL.

[Chairperson Meow]

Yes and Carly overheard AJ say that he'd go to out of state rehab if he relapsed, so she drugged him, shoved him in an ally and poured liquor on him. All so she could pass Micheal off as Tony's.

Carly has been about few things since day one: revenge, power, and herself.

[LegalParrot81]

And the topper to all of that history, Sonny had AJ hung from a meat hook until he agreed to give up his parental rights to Michael.

[dubbel zout]

Don't forget that Carly had post-partum depression and dumped Michael on Jason while she left town.

 

This was to accommodate SJB's real-life maternity leave.

 

And the topper to all of that history, Sonny had AJ hung from a meat hook until he agreed to give up his parental rights to Michael.

 

I was watching during this time (the meat-hook scenes were awful), but I forget: Did the Qs ever threaten to sue for custody of Michael? Given Edward's fixation on male heirs, I'd have thought he'd have been all up in this to get Michael recognized as a Quartermaine.

Edited October 4, 2014 by dubbel zout

[Cattitude]

Wait so ya'll are telling me even AJ knew he was Michael's father all these years? So Michael has always been cotton wooled by everyone?

[jennifer6973]

No when Michael was younger he knew AJ was his biological father.  Because AJ kidnapped him.

[Cattitude]

So now I'm totally confused. Why is everyone acting like adult Michael was just now getting to know AJ as his father if both AJ and Michael have known he was his father since childhood, how is Sonny coming between AJ and Michael? Seems like if AJ wanted to know Michael he could have.

[dubbel zout]

The character of AJ was offscreen for quite a while, and when he was around, Michael hadn't been SORASed. When SK returned as AJ, it was the first time with adult (well...) Michael. 

[TeeVee329]

So now I'm totally confused. Why is everyone acting like adult Michael was just now getting to know AJ as his father if both AJ and Michael have known he was his father since childhood, how is Sonny coming between AJ and Michael? Seems like if AJ wanted to know Michael he could have.

 

As stated above, Sonny hung AJ from a meathook until he signed away his paternal rights.  Sonny and Carly did everything in their power to keep Michael and AJ apart and AJ spent a lot of years scheming and failing to get access to him.

 

Only when he returned from the dead, when Michael was an adult, did Michael put his foot down and say he wanted to get to know AJ on his own terms and Sonny and Carly would have to deal with it.

[LegalParrot81]

 

Did the Qs ever threaten to sue for custody of Michael?

 

I don't remember them trying to get custody of Michael.  

[Chairperson Meow]

Carly and Sonny made the Q's seem like evil bastards to Micheal. Jason introduced baby Micheal to them. But I believe he was passing Micheal as his then. Or I'm not sure. But BW was AJ then. Lila got to meet Micheal and adored him. Then again, if Lila didn't like you, well, you were a piece of garbage. She even thought Sonny was charming. After Micheal's prison rape, to keep Micheal out of the mob, he did intern at ELQ with funny evil black guy. Who disappeared, but was hilarious and had great lines. He hated Michael and did not hide it. Edward and Monica and Alan tried for years to connect with Jason/Micheal, but Carly/Sonny always ran interference. However, after Jason "died" and AJ returned, Micheal told Fake Daddy and Carly F you and finally learned the truth.

He never knew about any of the reasons why AJ wasn't around, why the Q's were distant, why Jason/AJ were distant, what Carly's past was, and what Sonny/Carly did to AJ. Basically, the show shit on AJ and the Q's for years.

[Melgaypet]

Here's how I remember it:

 

Carly started sleeping with her stepfather Tony Jones, in the beginning as revenge on Bobbie, but later, after that marriage fell apart, she started to really care for Tony, or more accurately, the stability and "respectability" he gave her. (In this sense, Carly was her mother's daughter.) Anyway, she was desperate to keep him. They had a fight, and Carly got drunk and naked with AJ, who at the time - and this gets forgotten a lot - was her friend, and ends up pregnant. The whole drugging-laundry cart thing was to protect her relationship with Tony. She did feel some slight guilt over it, and ran around for a little while trying to keep AJ from falling off the wagon for real.

 

Anyway, Carly and Tony finally blew up and Tony, who was super-invested in "his" baby, threatened to sue for sole custody. Terrified, Carly shows up at her former fuckbuddy Jason's doorstep and begs him to claim to be her baby's father. He does. Michael is born. It's a traumatic birth, and Carly has PPD. She leaves town. Jason and Bobbie both bond with baby Michael, Jason is the one who names him. Carly returns, starts bonding with her baby, but is still very dependent on Jason in dealing with him. Grateful at the care she's shown for Michael, Carly tells Bobbie she's her daughter. Bobbie does not react well. Virginia Benson, Carly's adoptive mother, shows up, Tony tells her everything Carly's been up to in Port Charles; shocked, Virginia has a heart attack and dies.

 

Tony, who has been on a downward spiral since finding out Carly's baby isn't his, kidnaps both Michael and Robin. This is nearly disastrous, since Robin didn't have her HIV meds, but Jason rescues them both and smashes Tony's hand, making him unable to perform surgery. Tony goes on trial and gets off, thanks to Alexis, who represented him on Stefan's orders for reasons I don't recall, and Robin, who felt sorry for Tony and gave very sympathetic testimony. Carly is outraged and shoots Tony in the courtroom. She's sent off to Ferncliffe, temporarily.

 

Cottage Hell. Carly, now fancying herself in love with Jason, shows zero respect for Jason and Robin's relationship and never hesitates to use Michael to manipulate Jason, despite the fact that Robin knows AJ is the real father. (Jason told her.) Finally, finally, Robin gets sick of this and tells AJ the truth. I cheer. Sonny and Jason both act like complete assholes and Robin leaves town.

 

AJ is pissed as hell, but eventually he and Carly actually get married. This should have been awesome. It wasn't love - Edward had offered AJ more power (maybe the CEO position?) at ELQ in exchange for getting Michael under the Quartermaine roof and Carly was still harboring delusions of happy-ever-after with Jason - but there was great love/hate chemistry between them and it could have been the start of Carly and AJ as the new Alan and Monica. But, instead, it turned into baby Michael apparently screaming his head off whenever AJ was near and only Jason the Baby Whisperer could soothe him. Blech.

 

Anyway. Carly sees Jason dancing chastely with Elizabeth, and has hate sex with Sonny. And it was truly hate sex - up to that point the two of them genuinely couldn't stand each other. She gets pregnant, takes a tumble down the Quartermaine stairs, miscarries, she and Sonny unfairly blame AJ, develop an all-consuming hatred for him and a sick, unhealthy bond with each other. Between them and Jason, AJ is never really allowed near Michael again.

 

Somehow, Jason, who has been acting as Michael's father up until now, decides that Sonny would make a better father for the boy. Both Sonny and Carly agree. The meat hook came at some point after this, but by that time the show really sucked and I was in college and was watching only intermittently.

Edited October 5, 2014 by Melgaypet

[CPP83]

Carly and Sonny with plenty of help from Jason practically made it impossible for AJ to even have a chance to wave at Michael from across the docks without being threatened. They spent years twisting Michael's viewpoint of AJ, and the Qs in general, during the evil red headed stepchild years of Michael especially. They wanted Michael to have nothing to do with his biological father or that side of the family, and they did so many unspeakably deplorable things to make sure of it that it's hard to count them all up but kudos to the posters who have.

 

They even had it written in that Michael smothered AJ to death in bed, supposedly due to being so traumatized when AJ kidnapped him, played by Billy Warlock then, but basically the fans about lost their minds over that turn of events so the show quickly turned it around that it only seemed as if Michael had killed his own father, but the actual murderer was this nutso doctor with a stupid name, Asher Thomas, who was also revealed as being hired by AJ to kill Jason, yes they went there and tried to make it appear that AJ was capable of something that unforgivable, after the car accident, hence giving the doctor good cause to want AJ dead as he'd been blackmailing him to keep his mouth shut ever since. It was all very...shitty and stupid and insulting.

 

Really they were just trying to turn AJ into the most despicable and despised character on canvas at that point, imho, and then just have him killed off after completing the character assassination. They truly didn't hold back on the ruination of AJ in any capacity, Guza had a very unhealthy dislike for the character it always seemed to me.

 

He just couldn't do enough to make AJ into a creep, a drunk, a loser, a bad father, a bad son, a bad husband, a bad person in general, and all the while Sonny and Jason were frolicking through fields of daisies with hardly a care in the world, holding hands while the town of PC sung their collective praises, and now I feel a rage blackout coming on...

Edited October 5, 2014 by CPP83

[Chairperson Meow]

Yes. To recap, imo the victims of Sonny/Carly were:

AJ, Tony (who never quite recovered from Carly and her terrible decent into his life), Jason (who was brain damaged and became their hit man puppet), Micheal (who never stood a chance to be a kid nor a decent person and was prison raped), Robin (who was kidnapped, put in danger, shot, etc), Edward & Alan (who missed out on time with their son and grandson), and many others.

Why? Because they're insecure and petty people who need to win.

[Cattitude]

Wait not only Sean Kanan but my beloved Billy Warlock also played AJ and that block of wood SBu got the shit all over him! Well my great goolie mooglie. No wonder so many people loathe Sonny, and Jason. Carly I get b/c she even I dislike.

 

Thanks for all the great background stuff. I would say sorry I missed it, but I'm really not.

[Harmony233]

Wait not only Sean Kanan but my beloved Billy Warlock also played AJ and that block of wood SBu got the shit all over him! Well my great goolie mooglie. No wonder so many people loathe Sonny, and Jason. Carly I get b/c she even I dislike.

 

Thanks for all the great background stuff. I would say sorry I missed it, but I'm really not.

I had to stop watching I was sick and tired of the AJ never wins train.I've said it once and I'll say it again this show went to hell when it started to revolve around sonny and don't even get me started on what they did to por Tony.

[CPP83]

Wait not only Sean Kanan but my beloved Billy Warlock also played AJ and that block of wood SBu got the shit all over him!

 

 

 

 

 

It was during Billy's years that AJ really got worked over the most, at least until Sean returned under Ron.

[Chairperson Meow]

Yeah. BW got most of the gut punches to AJ, but SK got the big kick in the balls for the finish.

I'm hoping that this is leading to Micheal renouncing the Corinthos/Benson bs and going Q. Jason as well.

[nilyank]

 

So now I'm totally confused. Why is everyone acting like adult Michael was just now getting to know AJ as his father if both AJ and Michael have known he was his father since childhood, how is Sonny coming between AJ and Michael? Seems like if AJ wanted to know Michael he could have.

 

Basically, Sonny got AJ to renounce his rights to Michael and adopted him with Alexis' help. AJ eventually told what Sonny did to him to a whole room full of Quartermaines with Sonny, Carly, Alexis, Zander and Mac present. Guza had it that no one cared, believed AJ, or just blamed AJ for it.

 

AJ would try to get back at Sonny by going after his new discovered idiot sister Courtney and ended up falling for her real. They were in love and married but the Qs hated her and disowned AJ. AJ gets into a car accident (can't remember if he was drunk) and crashes into Coleman's strip club. Stupid Courtney decides to become a stripper to pay off the debt instead of asking the Qs, her parents, or her bigtime criminal brother for help. She only allows Sonny to help her by having Jason become her bodyguard to make sure that no one bothered her at the club and AJ secretly begins stalking her. In the end, the marriage implodes and stupid Courtney hooks up with Jason.

 

AJ grows more obsess with stupid Courtney. Eventually after he was assumed to have been killed, he comes back later to kidnap Michael, Krisitna and Morgan. He tells Michael that Carly and Sonny don't want him because they have their real son Morgan and don't need him anymore. He shoots Alan in the back and Jason goes after him and eventually dies again.

 

Michael didn't have a chance to know AJ because Carly, Sonny, and Jason kept him away when he was a young child, and then as he got older Guza had AJ do extremely terrible things and then killed him off. AJ apparently didn't die but was hidden away by Monica until he got better (and Jason died) and came back to Port Charles when Michael was an adult.

[LegalParrot81]

I've hated the triad since the destruction of Tony Jones.  He really was their first victim.

 

I never could figure out why Guza hated the character of AJ so much.  It seemed a little pathological.  AJ could never do anything right, could never measure up to St. Jason, could never get any approval from his parents.  I thought it was so bizarre how much Monica adored Jason, the child of her husband's affair (who she bounced on his head as a baby), but could barely stand to be in the same room with the child she gave birth to. The child she almost lost when he was a baby.  

At his core, AJ was never a bad guy.  I think after years of hearing how worthless he was, he believed it and became his own worst enemy.

Edited October 5, 2014 by LegalParrot81

[ch1]

Wait not only Sean Kanan but my beloved Billy Warlock also played AJ and that block of wood SBu got the shit all over him! Well my great goolie mooglie. No wonder so many people loathe Sonny, and Jason. Carly I get b/c she even I dislike.

Thanks for all the great background stuff. I would say sorry I missed it, but I'm really not.

 

 

When Sean Kanan was let go the second time Billy Warlock tweeted that it was sad because AJ never got a fair chance.  And he's absolutely right.  

 

I've been an off an on viewer for years but to have the writers make AJ wanting Jason dead after the accident that brain damaged him - the accident that caused AJ to be consumed by guilt - talk about a rage black out. Its really annoying how a character that at most was gray was turned into this so called monster just so the real bad guys of the show didn't look so bad.  Just f'd up and biased writing.

 

And to have the character come back just so they can destroy him again - ugggghhh!

[Chairperson Meow]

I'm so glad I mentally blocked a lot of Courtney out.

Jason and Courtney was one of the dumbest stories ever. Also, hated AJ and Courtney only because of the way it once again made AJ look bad. But hearing SK tell it to Connie or someone made it sound so much better, I rewatched it on you tube and was like pissed again. SK should have just recapped all of AJ's life.

[nilyank]

 

I've hated the triad since the destruction of Tony Jones.  He really was their first victim.

 

Sonny wasn't around for Tony's destruction and when he did return to Port Charles, Tony was already removed from any story involving Jason or Carly. He became like Mac. In the background, barely used and eventually killed in the latest Guza-catastrophe when the actor decided to leave the show.

[LegalParrot81]

Sonny wasn't around for Tony's destruction and when he did return to Port Charles, Tony was already removed from any story involving Jason or Carly. He became like Mac. In the background, barely used and eventually killed in the latest Guza-catastrophe when the actor decided to leave the show.

 

True.  After all these years the triad are so deeply ingrained in my mind.  It should have been duo of destruction, Carly & Jason, with primary responsibility falling directly at the feet of Carly.  They were directly responsible for Tony's slow descent into his breakdown, his decision to kidnap Michael and then Robin when she found them.  It was so sad that in the end, Tony had become a shell of his former self.  

 

The last substantial story Tony got was when he revived the previously thought to have broken his neck and died, Stavros.

Edited October 5, 2014 by LegalParrot81

[dubbel zout]

The Interwebs weren't around when all this stuff was going on, so I wonder how many viewers actually hated AJ. For me, the deck was so absurdly stacked against him that I rooted for him even as I found him completely pathetic. I wonder why Guza hated the character so completely, too. It really was pathological, as LegalParrot91 mentioned.

[Chairperson Meow]

I always found AJ more interesting than Jason and Sonny. The only reason Jason gets a pass from me is Billy Miller playing him now, Monica, and a thing Jax said long ago about Sonny taking advantage of him. Robin helps also. But AJ was always the more rootable character. I'd be like, leave him alone. And I always wanted Brenda with Jax.

[Dandesun]

The Interwebs were very much around during this time. It was those archaic things called newsgroups back in the 90s where people would talk about the shows. I remember well someone used to do recaps and referred to Sonny and Jason as Joe and Frank Harvey (tongue firmly in cheek) and called out GH in general for trying to paint Jason as the perfect Baby Whisperer... Some coment about AJ taking Michael home and the sound crew feverishly punching the baby cry tape recorder because, lo and behold, the child didn't burst into immediate tears upon being held by AJ.

That was the period that ran me off of GH and I've never been back for any length of time since then. It was fucking rage inducing.

[Chairperson Meow]

Even though SK wasn't AJ then, he's mostly thought of as AJ, so that story was very hilarious to me because I recall Baby Eric being calm mostly around SK and not Jacob Young (who would later play Yelly Lucky) on B&B.

[cheyz]

First the show did Dangerous Liaisons with Damien Smith and Lucy Coe. This was pre-Kevin, or at the very beginning of them. Lucy picked Bobbie for him to seduce, because Tony and Bobbie were the strongest couple she could think of. Tony saw them kissing right before BJ was killed, that's why he threw Bobbie out. She slept with Damien afterwards, but eventually she and Tony got back together. But then she started having dreams of a rose.

 

Bobbie and Luke started talking about the child she'd given up when she was hooking, who had never been mentioned before. Luke started trying to track down the kid. In the meantime, new physical therapist/candy striper Carly shows up. Bobbie doesn't like her, and every time Bobbie is around Carly screws up. Dr. Tony is much friendlier to the newbie. Bobbie also talked about BJ as her golden child, her only daughter, to Carly. So basically Carly came to town for revenge, but everything that happened once she got there just reinforced her feelings. Yes she was adopted by a comfortably off couple, but the husband abandoned them within 6 months. So while Carly was raised by an adult non-hooker, she was a poor, overwhelmed single mother. When Carly did track down her birth mother she found a rich professional who had never looked back.

 

Carly wasn't friends with AJ to start with, she didn't know he was Jason's brother when she slept with him. She'd been looking for Jason at the time. She had fallen for Tony for real though. I thought he kicked her out after she set up Bobbie finding them together in some cabin.

 

Carly and AJ were married for a while, but show had AJ so paranoid that Jason was going to win again that it couldn't have lasted. Carly was afraid of the Quartermaines, she didn't have any money yet and no power. Bobbie is the one who told Sonny that she was pregnant (Bobbie and Carly were getting along by then). Carly went with Sonny because he promised her that the Quartermaines wouldn't take Michael away. They didn't start getting closer until after the miscarriage.

 

I think Alexis defended Tony because Bobbie and Stefan were married by then. They had a great business marriage until show decided to go with Katherine Bell in the nighttime episode.

 

Back to Luke, by the time he found out Carly was Caroline, Bobbie already knew she was sleeping with Tony so he never told her. I'm not sure when she found out that Carly was her daughter, but I thought it was before Michael was born and before Virginia came to town. Bobbie was already married to Stefan when she found out Luke had known.

[UYI]

 

Grateful at the care she's shown for Michael, Carly tells Bobbie she's her daughter. Bobbie does not react well. Virginia Benson, Carly's adoptive mother, shows up, Tony tells her everything Carly's been up to in Port Charles; shocked, Virginia has a heart attack and dies.

 

I wasn't watching way back when--I caught up with this story via a wonderful YouTube channel that has the entirely of SJB's run as Carly from 1996-2001--but I thought Virginia died of a stroke? IIRC, Monica told Carly about Virginia's medical record in Florida (where Carly was raised, of course) saying that she had had a stroke sometime before that.