S01.E03: Chapter Three: Body Double

[txhorns79]

Quote

Josie says that they call themselves the Pussycats because being black they have to claw their way into everywhere. But then I hear the songs and think they call themselves that for....other reasons.

I wanted Archie to respond to Josie's question by saying: "Because you have long tails and ears for hats."

[Sakura12]

4 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I wanted Archie to respond to Josie's question by saying: "Because you have long tails and ears for hats."

That would've been funny but it doesn't appear that Archie has a sense of humor. Which is probably why I find him so bland and boring. He speaks in a monotone and only has one emotion. Faux tortured soul. 

[angora]

People have brought up assorted actresses that Betty reminds them of in previous episode threads.  For me, it's Romola Garai - I especially see it when Betty smiles.

I agree that the show likely had its heart in the right place with the Chuck storyline and Josie's speech to Archie but that it fumbled both of them for different reasons.  I liked the overall idea of the "playbook" story, with the girls having each other's backs and working together to out the boys' bad behavior, and Betty taking it too far by conflating herself with Polly and Chuck with Jason was an intriguing way to go, but the scene was really uncomfortable for me to watch.  Both because, while Chuck is a sexist asshole (and apparently too dumb to live, thinking that two girls who've been righteously furious with him in the last 24 hours suddenly want to have a freeway with him,) I thought the punishment here was too extreme for the crime, and because the whole image felt pretty tone-deaf to me, with the handcuffs and the "good boy" and Betty pressing her foot down on Chuck's head.

I continue to enjoy this version of Jughead more and more, and I loved the Betty-Jughead friendship we got here; I may have squeed when she called him "Juggy."  Their whole teen sleuth/investigative journalist plot was fun.  I liked Jughead giving the Adventure Scout (and later Dilton) the shakedown, and I just loved that other-shoe-drops moment when Dilton mentioned Miss Grundy's car, knowing he won't be able to keep Archie out of this.

[Splishy Splashy]

This episode has been my favorite so far as I loved that they tackled this topic as I have seen this first hand in my very own high school. Even though I didn't like the choice of Chuck being the Dog Guy and thought Reggie would have been the better choice, but the show was still outstanding. I still love Lili Reinhart and the awesome job she is doing portraying Betty as well as the job Cole Sprouse is doing with Jughead.

[Mabinogia]

13 minutes ago, angora said:

I continue to enjoy this version of Jughead more and more, and I loved the Betty-Jughead friendship we got here; I may have squeed when she called him "Juggy."  Their whole teen sleuth/investigative journalist plot was fun.

Yeah, if the show as it is doesn't do well, I suggest they change it into a Nancy Drew/Veronica Mars show with Betty as the lead, Juggy and Veronica as her Bess and George/Wallace. I would watch the hell out of that show.

[jay741982]

1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

Yeah, if the show as it is doesn't do well, I suggest they change it into a Nancy Drew/Veronica Mars show with Betty as the lead, Juggy and Veronica as her Bess and George/Wallace. I would watch the hell out of that show.

I would too!

[dwmckim]

14 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Yeah, if the show as it is doesn't do well, I suggest they change it into a Nancy Drew/Veronica Mars show with Betty as the lead, Juggy and Veronica as her Bess and George/Wallace. I would watch the hell out of that show.

Awww...Veronica doesn't get to be...Veronica? ;)

[Danny Franks]

On 16/02/2017 at 4:52 PM, MV007 said:

This is ultimately meaningless but I don't remember the show stating that Archie is now the Quarterback of the team or that he had never played football before and was just trying out for the first time.  For some reason I thought he was supposed to be a wide receiver.  And I definitely remember the coach saying they were bringing up from JV to be on Varsity.  I don't remember the coach saying anything about how significant his role would be.  Regardless, its not crazy for a sophomore to be a great player on a high school team.

He said in the first episode that he was going to "try out" for the football team, and Reggie told him he'd be sure to get on it now he was all ripped and muscly.

And yes, the coach said that "usually sophomores only play JV", but that Archie was apparently impressive enough in his first practice that he immediately got Jason's old number. So I interpret that as saying that Archie has never played football before, but is already good enough to make the varsity squad. Already better than all the other sophomores who might be candidates to step up. It's not crazy for a sophomore to be a great player if he's been playing football before he was a sophomore, but that doesn't seem to be what happened here.

[MV007]

31 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

He said in the first episode that he was going to "try out" for the football team, and Reggie told him he'd be sure to get on it now he was all ripped and muscly.

And yes, the coach said that "usually sophomores only play JV", but that Archie was apparently impressive enough in his first practice that he immediately got Jason's old number. So I interpret that as saying that Archie has never played football before, but is already good enough to make the varsity squad. Already better than all the other sophomores who might be candidates to step up. It's not crazy for a sophomore to be a great player if he's been playing football before he was a sophomore, but that doesn't seem to be what happened here.

If a kid is a great athlete, regardless of his prior experience, a football coach will put him on the team.  I don't have an issue with the believability here.  Now, if he is the QB then thats a different story but again I don't think that was ever said. 

[Danny Franks]

13 minutes ago, MV007 said:

If a kid is a great athlete, regardless of his prior experience, a football coach will put him on the team.  I don't have an issue with the believability here.  Now, if he is the QB then thats a different story but again I don't think that was ever said. 

And if that kid gets anywhere near the field before he's learned how to actually play football, then the coach is pretty terrible at his job. I coached under-18s football for a few years (in the UK, so at nowhere near the same level, even of high school football), and it doesn't matter how athletic you are. If you haven't learned the fundamentals of the game, most importantly how to play safely, then you're not going to be getting any snaps, not even on special teams.

Even as a WR, if he's not learned how to run routes, how to get separation hell, even how to line up and understand the play-calls, he's not playing.

[MV007]

3 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

And if that kid gets anywhere near the field before he's learned how to actually play football, then the coach is pretty terrible at his job. I coached under-18s football for a few years (in the UK, so at nowhere near the same level, even of high school football), and it doesn't matter how athletic you are. If you haven't learned the fundamentals of the game, most importantly how to play safely, then you're not going to be getting any snaps, not even on special teams.

Even as a WR, if he's not learned how to run routes, how to get separation hell, even how to line up and understand the play-calls, he's not playing.

From this post I'm guessing you're from the UK.  If that is the case, then I'll add that American boys grow up playing football.  I'm not talking organized football.  I'm saying that while they grow up they leave the house and round up their friends and play football.  So while they may need some slight coaching on the fundamentals of things like tackling, by no means would it take much to coach a stud American athlete on how to play football.  Every high school coach in Texas is probably trolling the fields of other sports looking for "athletes" that he can steal from other sports and stick into his program.  And he does this knowing they have some general knowledge on how to play.  This isn't like asking him to play field hockey.

[Danny Franks]

21 minutes ago, MV007 said:

From this post I'm guessing you're from the UK.  If that is the case, then I'll add that American boys grow up playing football.  I'm not talking organized football.  I'm saying that while they grow up they leave the house and round up their friends and play football.  So while they may need some slight coaching on the fundamentals of things like tackling, by no means would it take much to coach a stud American athlete on how to play football.  Every high school coach in Texas is probably trolling the fields of other sports looking for "athletes" that he can steal from other sports and stick into his program.  And he does this knowing they have some general knowledge on how to play.  This isn't like asking him to play field hockey.

But we don't know that any of this is true of Archie. We just know that he tried out and was so good that he got a spot on the team immediately. On it's own, it would be daft, but not a big deal. When you add that to the two prettiest girls in town being gaga for him (although Veronica doesn't seem that fussed, based on the episodes we've seen), all the kids in school thinking he's great, and his talent for both writing and playing music, he just comes off as a ridiculous fantasy character.

His one 'flaw' that we've seen so far is that he's just so attractive that older women want to bang him, and he's happy to do it.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Danny Franks

[Mabinogia]

40 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

But we don't know that any of this is true of Archie. We just know that he tried out and was so good that he got a spot on the team immediately. On it's own, it would be daft, but not a big deal.

And they could have fixed this so easily by throwing in some comment about Archie remembering all he learned in pee wee football, or that he practiced all summer (though we know that's not true since he spent all summer with his tongue down his lying music teachers throat) or anything that made it seem like he'd, you know, practiced or played the sport before. But yeah, the way it was written, he is some Marty Stu who is a chick magnet, natural football star after getting abs one magical summer. There must be steroids down NotGrundy's throat.

[Splishy Splashy]

50 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

And they could have fixed this so easily by throwing in some comment about Archie remembering all he learned in pee wee football, or that he practiced all summer (though we know that's not true since he spent all summer with his tongue down his lying music teachers throat) or anything that made it seem like he'd, you know, practiced or played the sport before. But yeah, the way it was written, he is some Marty Stu who is a chick magnet, natural football star after getting abs one magical summer. There must be steroids down NotGrundy's throat.

I do think it was mentioned by both Reggie and Moose that he was on the team the year prior but really wasn't used. Than Reggie made all the comments about how he was ripped now and he was for sure to make the team this year. I may misunderstanding what I heard and just took it as that. 

[The Crazed Spruce]

We're starting to veer off-topic here. A bit of digression's fine, but please try to stick to the episode at hand. (Or at least to the general vicinity of it.)

[ByTor]

On 2/11/2017 at 4:46 AM, dirtypop90 said:

i...don't...like....betty...so it is very weird for me to see all the praise she is getting. 

I like Betty just fine, but what I'm not getting is the sentiment that Archie would be into her because she's hot.  Cute?  Pretty?  Definitely.  Hot?  Not even close (IMO), especially when comparing her to Veronica & Cheryl.

[Chaos Theory]

1 minute ago, ByTor said:

I like Betty just fine, but what I'm not getting is the sentiment that Archie would be into her because she's hot.  Cute?  Pretty?  Definitely.  Hot?  Not even close (IMO), especially when comparing her to Veronica & Cheryl.

If anything my tastes have changed over the years.  I find Betty more attractive then Veronica.  Cheryl is...well crazy hot to me.  I have weird tastes.   

[ByTor]

12 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

If anything my tastes have changed over the years.  I find Betty more attractive then Veronica.  Cheryl is...well crazy hot to me.  I have weird tastes.   

I wouldn't say "weird", personal taste is personal taste.  It reminds me of the movie A League of Their Own, where out of a baseball team full of pretty women, 2 guys had a crush on the Rosie O'Donnell character.  I'm speaking as a straight female, but of the 3 I find Cheryl the hottest.

[jay741982]

On 2/22/2017 at 11:50 AM, ByTor said:

I like Betty just fine, but what I'm not getting is the sentiment that Archie would be into her because she's hot.  Cute?  Pretty?  Definitely.  Hot?  Not even close (IMO), especially when comparing her to Veronica & Cheryl.

Personally all three are hot to me. But I find Betty the overall most attractive. Girl next door most approachable type. Doesn't think she's the hottest. 

[LucyHoneychrrch]

I feel pervy as hell, but I watch this show exclusively for Jughead. He would have ticked all my teenaged-emo boxes, and then some.

[Bruinsfan]

On 2/10/2017 at 7:31 PM, Mabinogia said:

 disturbs me how much stock US high schools put in football (I'm from the US so this is not a country bashing thing, it's just, from what I know other countries do not give a shit about high school sports, they don't even care about college sports, that's a true American thing as far as I can tell), that just because you're a football player you get away with shit like that.

Yeah, it's a pretty systemic thing across middle America. I'm just glad that the BMOC jocks in my high school were also mostly nice guys who were raised right. If they'd been inclined to take advantage of the admiration they were afforded, things could have gotten very bad.

[Mabinogia]

51 minutes ago, Bruinsfan said:

I'm just glad that the BMOC jocks in my high school were also mostly nice guys who were raised right. If they'd been inclined to take advantage of the admiration they were afforded, things could have gotten very bad.

Nice to know there are still some people out there who don't automatically take advantage of the "system". I think Archie would not. He, surprisingly given his father is off trying to date a married woman, was raised right. Speaking of, where is Archie's mom? Did they mention anything on the show or is this something one has to consult the comics to ascertain? I can't remember hearing anything about her, though I don't give the show 100% of my attention when Archie or his dad are on so I may have missed it.

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Speaking of, where is Archie's mom? Did they mention anything on the show or is this something one has to consult the comics to ascertain? I can't remember hearing anything about her, though I don't give the show 100% of my attention when Archie or his dad are on so I may have missed it.

I've been wondering about Archie's mom, too. I feel like I remember Luke Perry (idk his character name lol) mentioning her in the last ep, but I don't remember what was said.

[MarkHB]

Regarding Archie's mom:

Spoiler

We will be seeing her, she has been cast.  If you want to go looking for spoilers they're out there, but if you're unspoiled I suggest waiting for the reveal.

[dwmckim]

19 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Nice to know there are still some people out there who don't automatically take advantage of the "system". I think Archie would not. He, surprisingly given his father is off trying to date a married woman, was raised right. Speaking of, where is Archie's mom? Did they mention anything on the show or is this something one has to consult the comics to ascertain? I can't remember hearing anything about her, though I don't give the show 100% of my attention when Archie or his dad are on so I may have missed it.

You don't have to go to the comics** - in the comics Fred and Mary are happily married.

I think (though not with 100% certainty) it's been mentioned on the show that they're separated.  

**Though there is a new comic book out that just was released this week that's a tie-in to the show.  Also simply called, "Riverdale", it contains four stories, each focusing on the four main characters, showing what they did during the summer leading up to where the show began.  Written by the same writers as the show, this was actually originally intended to come out before the show debuted, but it got pushed back.  The Archie's parents issue is among the things addressed.  Also much more detailed backstory of what went down between Archie and Jughead.

[MarkHB]

14 hours ago, dwmckim said:

**Though there is a new comic book out that just was released this week that's a tie-in to the show.  Also simply called, "Riverdale", it contains four stories, each focusing on the four main characters, showing what they did during the summer leading up to where the show began.  Written by the same writers as the show, this was actually originally intended to come out before the show debuted, but it got pushed back.  The Archie's parents issue is among the things addressed.  Also much more detailed backstory of what went down between Archie and Jughead.

Is that that $20 graphic novel that was being promoted, or is it something else (cheaper)?

[dwmckim]

Cheaper.  It's standard ("floppy") comic book as opposed to a graphic novel.  I think the one you're referring to is a collection of stories from the Archie reboots being used as a cross-promotion with the show but not really having to do with the actual series itself.  This is a comic actual featuring the world of the show.

It's a stand-alone one-shot issue, but i believe a regular Riverdale comic is also forthcoming.

[peachmangosteen]

On 3/3/2017 at 9:00 AM, dwmckim said:

Though there is a new comic book out that just was released this week that's a tie-in to the show.  Also simply called, "Riverdale", it contains four stories, each focusing on the four main characters, showing what they did during the summer leading up to where the show began.  Written by the same writers as the show, this was actually originally intended to come out before the show debuted, but it got pushed back.  The Archie's parents issue is among the things addressed.  Also much more detailed backstory of what went down between Archie and Jughead.

\Have the writers indicated at all whether they're going to get into those things on the show or do I need to seek out this comic to get the backstory with Archie/Jughead and Archie's mom?

[dwmckim]

I haven't kept up with all the press interviews, but Archie's mom is definitely coming (big name actress was cast - not revealing here but spoilers thread should mention it.).  Jug/Arch would, i think just by common sense, be delved into more - but really we got the basic gist already but this goes into much finer detail.

[MarkHB]

10 hours ago, dwmckim said:

Cheaper.  It's standard ("floppy") comic book as opposed to a graphic novel.  I think the one you're referring to is a collection of stories from the Archie reboots being used as a cross-promotion with the show but not really having to do with the actual series itself.  This is a comic actual featuring the world of the show.

It's a stand-alone one-shot issue, but i believe a regular Riverdale comic is also forthcoming.

Thanks; I just picked it up and look forward to reading it tonight.

[millennium]

I would have liked Archie Comics a LOT more as a kid if Mistress Betty had been a character.

Kudos to the show for featuring actresses who aren't anorexic.

[thuganomics85]

Third episode in and they're already trying to tackle slut-shaming and white privilege.  Ambitious, aren't we, Riverdale?

So, Betty is just a bit nuts, huh?  Sure, Chuck definitely deserved retribution for his scummy behavior, but she took it just a wee bit too far, I see.  Lili Reinhart was great as Dark Betty, although I got the sense I was suppose to be all "Damn, that's hot!" with her outfit and wig in that scene, and yet I still thought Veronica was easily hotter in her one piece.  But it was great seeing the two team up with Cheryl and the other victims (including Barb... err, I mean Ethel), to take the tool bags down.  Of course, according to Jughead's narration, this will end up causing major problems down the line, so their victory is short-lived, I guess.

Could care less about the Archie/Josie stuff, since while Archie does have it easy and the entire story was basically to just have the entire band be wowed by his magical song lyrics, Josie doesn't seem to automatically hate him for reasons the show never really explains.

Alice is still an asshole, but this was the most fun she was by just raising hell at the mayoral ceremony.  I see plenty more slaps coming her way!

I totally think they might try something with Fred/Luke Perry and Miss Grundy, just to make the entire situation even more creepy and disturbing.

So, the gunshot was actually just Dilton shooting one, because he's a survivalist and is trying to teach the scouts to survive.  But he then reveals that he saw Miss Grundy's car, so there is no way she won't end up getting involved now.  Uh oh!