S01.E01: So You're Not an English Teacher / S01.E02: Only the Best for Mrs. Diaz

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

Out of prison early for good behavior, Letty Raines is trying to be a better person. But after she overhears a hitman being hired to kill a man's wife, Letty sets out to derail the job while entangling herself in a dangerous relationship.

NOTE: This episode is being released early on-line and on demand. Entering this topic will spoil you if you have not viewed it.

Broadcast airdate will be Tuesday, 11/15/2016.

and the second episode;

Quote

Javier forces Letty to help carry out his next job by posing as his wife at an upscale resort. Letty befriends the target's wife as instructed, but when she tries to escape with the woman, her plan backfires, digging her into a much deeper hole.

[atlantaloves]

Just saw the sneak peak last night...I am loving this show....lots of twists and turns and it's very spicy....so far I recommend it. If you like Shades of Blue, this might be a good show for you folks out there.  She is outstanding in this new show!

[Chaos Theory]

I thought it was good too and has a good deal of potential.  I like the female lead.  The male assassin guy I am unsure of.  Actually my favorite scene was when the female lead was talking with her parole officer.  I am actually hoping there is more of him. 

[NumberCruncher]

1 hour ago, Chaos Theory said:

I thought it was good too and has a good deal of potential.  I like the female lead.  The male assassin guy I am unsure of.  Actually my favorite scene was when the female lead was talking with her parole officer.  I am actually hoping there is more of him. 

Considering Terry Kinney is getting 3rd billing on the show, I'm confident we'll be seeing more parole officer scenes.

I really enjoyed the pilot episode but I'm reserving judgment until I see a few more episodes.  I do like that the show is not afraid to show Letty at her absolute worst right off the bat, yet still make her sympathetic as she makes very human mistakes  Michelle Dockery is showing a lot of range and ability here that she never could do stuck in period dramas.  I also agree with you in being unsure about Javier.  I like Juan Diego Botto's portrayal, but I'm having a hard time with the notion that the show is inevitably going to try to make us sympathize with Javier and want him to have a relationship with Letty.  Dude's a killer (and not even one in the name of justice)...I don't know how you come back from that.

Edited November 14, 2016 by NumberCruncher

[magdalene]

After seeing the first episode I am in.  As this is fiction I don't have to like Letty and her killer, I only have to find them interesting. And so far they are interesting to me.

I am happy for Michelle Dockery, she must be having a ball with this role.

[zxy556575]

I really liked this although the previews show it taking quite a dark turn. I'm not familiar with either of the leads but there was believable tension and chemistry between them, especially on Javier's part. It should be interesting to see them try to one-up and outplay each other.

One minor quibble is making Letty's mother such a downmarket redneck. I understand tough love and needing to sever relationships with addicts, but she was a straight up asshole.

[Chaos Theory]

9 hours ago, lordonia said:

 

One minor quibble is making Letty's mother such a downmarket redneck. I understand tough love and needing to sever relationships with addicts, but she was a straight up asshole.

Like with most pilots there were a couple of info dumps.  It was necessary to explain why Letty was were she was in her life.  An addict a thief a chronic screw up an ex con.   Showing her mother being a first class bitch is a very evocative way of also showing why Letty does the things she does.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Chaos Theory

[SlovakPrincess]

I'm having a really hard time buying the premise of this show.  Why would Javier the Hitman decide he needed a sidekick after Letty nearly ruined his plan to kill Daphne?   Pretty sure guys like him like to work alone.  

I am rooting for Letty because she tried to save Daphne and she's smart and scrappy.  But the whole Javier / Letty dynamic doesn't work for me at all.  

 

Also, how were Robin and Letty not dead after drinking martinis all day long?

Edited November 16, 2016 by SlovakPrincess

[SimoneS]

So I watched this. All I could think is poor Letty, no foreplay, talk about having tons of bad sex and having to fake it. Ick. You can always tell when men are the showrunners/producers/writers.

Good to see the actor who played Tim MacManus on Oz as the parole officer. 

By giving Letty, a black son, the show avoids having people of color in the regular cast. The posters who are always ranting about "PC" must be so happy. *snark*

Edited November 16, 2016 by SimoneS

[formerlyfreedom]

I liked this more than I thought I would. Michelle Dockery is a revelation. I'll take the suspension of beliefs, because I'm just curious enough to see where this is going.

[magdalene]

I thought the second episode was just as compelling as the pilot.  Dockery and the guy who plays Javier have fantastic chemistry.  Letty only functions well when she is conning and thieving. On the surface Javier is more in control of himself but obviously he has a self-destructive streak too. The proof being him not killing Letty when she threw a spanner into his works during the pilot.

I found it ironic that if Letty hadn't convinced the wife to run away she would have gotten her freedom from her marriage through sudden widowhood. 

The reason for the hit tonight and the way Javier was so disdainful and emotional about it makes me obviously go - are we being set up for Javier the hit man with a heart of gold? Ala a less nerdy version of Grosse Point Blank? Are we going to find out that the victim in the pilot had something unsavory about her?

Will Letty make her appointment with Terry Kinney?  I am staying tuned to find out what's next.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

I love JDB's Javier.  He can go most any direction and it will be believable.  MD's Lettie less so, for me.  She's absolutely doomed, it;s just a matter of time.   The only chance she would have is to live a scrupulously, or shall I say, rigorously, honest life.   Any deceptions, on any level, would imperil her.  She is just too far gone.  The problem being - there goes the show if she does actually achieve genuine sobriety.

I thought the first ep was ever so much tighter than the second.   They were smart to just leave it to our imaginations how he escaped Daphne's home and how he disposed of the husband.  The 2nd one left way too many obvious openings for basic LE (law enforcement) to get them.  For one, there would have been an APB on that Tesla, which would stick out like a sore thumb on any road, within a very few hours as the hotel would report the couple missing.

I really do enjoy the small little reveals of their grifting brilliance.  I liked pondering if Javier was murdering Bill pro bono.  I loved his death speech to Bill.  The small detail of his being thrifty (gummy bears) was an excellent little piece of subtle exposition.  Javier was seen to be suave and sophisticated when not in the throes of violence - until then.  Ghetto lad from Buenos Aires?   His backstory will be a treat to learn.

Without question, this show deserves my serious attention.  It shall have it. 

[helenamonster]

8 hours ago, magdalene said:

I found it ironic that if Letty hadn't convinced the wife to run away she would have gotten her freedom from her marriage through sudden widowhood. 

The reason for the hit tonight and the way Javier was so disdainful and emotional about it makes me obviously go - are we being set up for Javier the hit man with a heart of gold? Ala a less nerdy version of Grosse Point Blank? Are we going to find out that the victim in the pilot had something unsavory about her?

Would she though? Robin was in the car when Bill killed the little boy...I got the impression that Javier knew that and was always planning on killing her too, but he just didn't tell Letty. I could be wrong, though. But after the second episode, I feel like Javier is more of just an arbiter of vigilante justice, not someone who will kill anyone for the right price. If that was the case, I think he would have killed Letty when he had the chance. Like you, I'm wondering if we're ever going to find out why he killed Daphne. Both Letty and Javier asked her if her husband had a reason to kill her, and the implication seemed to be that he did.

I really enjoyed it! I was mostly just curious to see Michelle Dockery playing someone completely outside of the Lady Mary mold, and boy did she deliver. I had no trouble buying her in such a different part. And even though Letty is a mess, I love how smart and savvy she is. She's especially good at getting people to like/trust her with her "I'm a writer" thing that she uses. I'm weirdly looking forward to the other books she'll say she's written (or ghostwritten, as the case may be).

I had seen a couple promos but I didn't realize the exact premise of the show, that Javier would basically trap Letty into working with him. It reminds me a little of this (rather garbage, honestly) book I just read about this guy that tricks a woman into marrying him and then basically keeps her prisoner, preventing her from escaping by always being five steps ahead of her.

The camera work/lighting/etc. on this show is also fantastic. Is it weird that I found the scene of Letty using a lightbulb to get high kind of mesmerizing and beautiful?

[BingeyKohan]

I thought Michelle Dockery was fantastic and agree with other posters about the production design, although the second episode didn't have quite as nice a balance between sleek posh settings and the grime of Lettie's "real" life, which I enjoyed in the pilot. (Although sometimes even the "grime" seemed phony, like the slatternly way her mother wore her cardigan down off the shoulder on top of that silly camisole. While smoking of course. But with an expensive-looking highlight job, I thought.) Too much time spent in that 12K a night inn. And I hope Lettie takes on more agency in the relationship if the two of them are to be bound together for plot contrivances; she seems too much like a kept woman now. She would know she could cop an advantageous plea by turning him in. But I love the way Dockery is building the character ... I don't know if it's in the books or not but I liked the way she sort of squinted each time she stole a peek at the dossiers on each intended victim - the first time I assumed her vision was blurred from her hangover, but she seemed to do it with the second target as well, as though she sort of needs glasses but is too vain to get them. 

[zxy556575]

I enjoyed Letty's dedication to her affirmation tapes.

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm really enjoying this show.  I like the female lead, but, I do wish they would be a little more realistic about how a woman with her skills, talent and ability to con would be that down on herself.  I just have trouble buying it.  And with her skills, she would be able to manipulate things with her mom to get the visitation she wants.  People like her make things happen, they don't take stuff from people.  She may play the victim to her advantage, but, that's an act.  Maybe, some of this will come about in the upcoming episodes. At least, I hope so. 

[magdalene]

6 hours ago, helenamonster said:

The camera work/lighting/etc. on this show is also fantastic. Is it weird that I found the scene of Letty using a lightbulb to get high kind of mesmerizing and beautiful?

I found that beautiful too, including the moment in her drug-induced stupor where suddenly she is in day light embracing her son, right before Javier bursts into the room.

[Dowel Jones]

I don't know if I can stay with this one, simply because of the way the plotline is shaping up.  The acting and the production values may be top rate, but I'm not really interested in seeing a hitman work his way through the population with her help, pretty clothes and hair notwithstanding.  I'll give it another episode or two, but I hope there's something else there.

[TaraS1]

I have never been a fan of any of TNT's original shows, so I was prepared to slog my way through this, whether I liked it or not, because I loved Michelle Dockery so much on Downton.  But I didn't just like this show, I loved it.  You know that feeling we TV nerds sometimes get when we watch a new show and immediately realize we're about to become obsessed with it?  That's me and this show lol.  I haven't felt that since S1 of Elementary (which subsequently went to hell in S2 and broke my heart), but I was already completely hooked on this one before the second episode started.

I thought Michelle was fantastic and obviously got to show so much more range than she did as Lady Mary.  The scene in the motel where she first calls her mom and then breaks down in tears?  I had no idea she could do that.  I mean, as much as I loved her as Mary, I never thought she had that in her.  I also thought the writing was great and that the chemistry between Letty and Javier was perfect.  I wasn't familiar with the actor playing Javier, but he was fantastic.  He had the whole sinister/sensitive/sexy thing down pat.

The previews for the rest of the season looked awesome, so I can't wait to see where this goes.

[Hanahope]

I saw this in a TNT survey/pre-advanced screening, just the first episode.  Nothing changed with the premier, and I wasn't sure I'd go with the show. 

I have to say, it was a good idea to show the actual premier it with the second episode.  At first, you're thinking Javier is just a smart assassin in it for the money (even if he did offer to give Letty the 50k and the suv), but the second episode appears to show that there's more of a reason for his actions.  A bit of an extreme form of Leverage.  Perhaps that's why he saved Letty, because he realized that she was trying to do good (even if there was a good reason for Daphne to die - I wonder if we'll ever find that out), and that she has a good heart, even if she tends to make bad choices.  Perhaps eventually he'll let her in on the reasons for his actions and she'll become a full partner.

That is what will keep me interested, at least for another couple of episodes.  That and the actors have good chemistry together and its great to see Michelle Dockery show a lot more acting range.

[magdalene]

10 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

I don't know if I can stay with this one, simply because of the way the plotline is shaping up.  The acting and the production values may be top rate, but I'm not really interested in seeing a hitman work his way through the population with her help, pretty clothes and hair notwithstanding.  I'll give it another episode or two, but I hope there's something else there.

The producer said this wasn't going to be case of the week, or hit of the week like TNT usually does. 

From all the teasers and previews this looks more to me like a darkly romantic relationship drama with conning, wigs, and the occasional hit gone awry. 

[TaraS1]

The previews at the end of the second episode had me excited like this was a show I had been watching and loving for years.  And they gave me the same vibe you got from them @magdalene.

[magdalene]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1aC1ueu9Iw&list=FLsX0dPIwrJU2dhGSgQ0cMpQ&index=1

Has anybody else watched this character profile of Javier? I found that very illuminating and it changed most of the preconceptions I had about the show and these characters.

I am going to spoiler my thoughts as there is stuff in this profile  that is spoilery...

Spoiler

I had originally thought this was going to be a "The Grifters" type show - hot people do lots of bad stuff and have self-destructive sexy times, etc.. But instead this is shaping up to be  a love story where they are good for each other and are trying to help each other.  Not so much with Bonnie and Clyde and more of a loving partnership down the line?

[bourbon]

Loving this so far. Agree about Michelle Dockery as a revelation. I was never a fan of Lady Mary, and I thought her performance was fairly one-note. But she's terrific here. There are wonderfully talented English or Aussie actresses -- Kate Winslet, Cate Blanchett, and Keira Knightley come to mind -- that I never really buy as American. The accent, the bearing -- it's all wrong. I totally buy MD. As believable as she was as early 20th c. British aristocracy, she is equally as believable as 21st c. white trash And the chemistry between the leads is bananas.

[SunnyBeBe]

Mary's character was never a favorite of mine on DA, but, I thought the actress did a great job making me dislike her.  I do like this character though.  One thing that impresses me is that she does a GREAT job with a southern accent.  Southern accents are tough for most actors.  Most make me laugh.  If you aren't from the south, you might be easily fooled, but for real southerners like me,  there's a fine line between being on point and ridiculous.  Michelle has it down!  She's really natural and must have really applied herself to get this down so perfectly.  

The show is set in NC and and is also filmed in NC, (my home state) so, I'm super happy with that. 

[Eolivet]

What an...interesting show! Like others, I was getting very uncomfortable at the idea of Letty being kept prisoner by Javier, like Bonnie & Clyde, with a dose of Stockholm Syndrome (and in their first, er...intimate encounter, I was like "Did he really just grab her by the..." and then I had to think about politics, and I did not want to do that!) Anyway, I kept watching because Dockery was so likable in her....unlikability. The line about not keeping Robin's wallet because it was ugly was almost perfect. I kept reading how dark this was, but making Javier a vigilante killer kept it at an acceptable level for me.

I wish the show was more "spy vs spy," because Javier's whole "You cannot leave, you work for me, don't try to escape" is pretty squicky. No matter how much chemistry they have together (heh, both her Downton leading men looked like dead fish compared to the actor who plays Javier. Oh, Lady Mary never had it so good).

I'm intrigued, I'm thrilled to see Dockery on my screen again...I'll keep watching. It's not high art, but it's pretty darn watchable, and since I really don't see it setting the ratings world on fire, I hope it leads to good things for Dockery in the future.

(The only thing is I cannot stand the opening?! What the heck is that? Is it supposed to be irony? Because as far as I can tell, they ditched the motivational speeches at the end of the Pilot, and I keep thinking Stuart Smalley is going to show up...)

[Swansong]

I remember her playing a rape victim whose younger brother was murdered on Waking the Dead and she was great in that so I've always known she had the acting chops. I really like her in this, but I'm not sure how seriously I can take a murderer lecturing someone on their failings because they killed someone.

[Joimiaroxeu]

What happened to Javier's body between episode one and episode two? In the latter he seemed to have developed a slight case of moobs. He's still gorgeous though.

I really like this show but I don't know if they can do the "will she get away from him this time?" in every episode. That'll get old fast.

I'm also having trouble with their having sex. Letty is basically Javier's prisoner so it seems rape-y to me, even if she does tell him not to stop and seems to be into it.

[magdalene]

The first thing I ever saw Michelle Dockery in was this period drama series.  Before Downton Abbey.  Tom Hiddleston was in it. And Judi Dench.  I remember it was very good and she was very young and of course beautiful in it. 

Obviously for Letty and Yavier to have any kind of positive relationship he would have to let her go.  If she then wants to stick around him that might be foolish considering him being a hit man. But their relationship would take a step towards being on more equal grounds.  Right now he knows a lot about her and she knows almost nothing about him - other than that he is dangerous and that she is attracted to him. I don't get a rapey vibe from them though.

[TaraS1]

On 11/17/2016 at 9:49 PM, bourbon said:

Loving this so far. Agree about Michelle Dockery as a revelation. I was never a fan of Lady Mary, and I thought her performance was fairly one-note. But she's terrific here. There are wonderfully talented English or Aussie actresses -- Kate Winslet, Cate Blanchett, and Keira Knightley come to mind -- that I never really buy as American. The accent, the bearing -- it's all wrong. I totally buy MD. As believable as she was as early 20th c. British aristocracy, she is equally as believable as 21st c. white trash And the chemistry between the leads is bananas.

ITA that Michelle does white trash beautifully.  And I live in WhiteTrashVille, USA, so I feel as though I'm an expert on the matter.  Like you said, I don't feel like I'm watching an English actress try to "act" American.

On 11/18/2016 at 2:44 PM, SunnyBeBe said:

Mary's character was never a favorite of mine on DA, but, I thought the actress did a great job making me dislike her.  I do like this character though.  One thing that impresses me is that she does a GREAT job with a southern accent.  Southern accents are tough for most actors.  Most make me laugh.  If you aren't from the south, you might be easily fooled, but for real southerners like me,  there's a fine line between being on point and ridiculous.  Michelle has it down!  She's really natural and must have really applied herself to get this down so perfectly.  

The show is set in NC and and is also filmed in NC, (my home state) so, I'm super happy with that. 

I'm from the south too, and bad southern accents are the bane of my TV/movie watching existence.   They always stick out like a sore thumb and take me out of whatever I'm watching.  But yeah, I give Michelle credit for clearly putting the time and effort into getting it right, and kudos to her dialect coach.  It's not always 100% perfect, but it's damn good most of the time.

15 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I really like this show but I don't know if they can do the "will she get away from him this time?" in every episode. That'll get old fast.

I admit that as many times as I've seen it done, it still made me laugh when Letty tried to climb out the window and Javier was standing there.

[Hanahope]

So late last week, Kindle offered the "Good Behavior" novellas, 3 of them, for the collective price of $5.99.  It came with comments/notes from the author about the story and relationship with the TV show.  The first novella is the direct basis for the pilot (though 'Javier' was called 'Arnold'), with the TV show adding details, introducing of all the characters (the parol officer showed up in the third novella and the name "Javier" was used for a crime 'facilitator' in the second novella - but a different guy per the author), and a slightly changed ending.  The novella also explains why the hit on Daphne, which supports the theory that Javier is a bit of a vigilante hit man.  I wonder if the TV show will explain it, and if it keeps the same reason, or alters it a bit.

[magdalene]

3 hours ago, Hanahope said:

The novella also explains why the hit on Daphne, which supports the theory that Javier is a bit of a vigilante hit man.  I wonder if the TV show will explain it, and if it keeps the same reason,

Why the hit on Daphne in the novella if I may ask?

[formerlyfreedom]

4 hours ago, Hanahope said:

So late last week, Kindle offered the "Good Behavior" novellas, 3 of them, for the collective price of $5.99.  It came with comments/notes from the author about the story and relationship with the TV show.  The first novella is the direct basis for the pilot (though 'Javier' was called 'Arnold'), with the TV show adding details, introducing of all the characters (the parol officer showed up in the third novella and the name "Javier" was used for a crime 'facilitator' in the second novella - but a different guy per the author), and a slightly changed ending.  The novella also explains why the hit on Daphne, which supports the theory that Javier is a bit of a vigilante hit man.  I wonder if the TV show will explain it, and if it keeps the same reason, or alters it a bit.

 

42 minutes ago, magdalene said:

Why the hit on Daphne in the novella if I may ask?

Let's take the discussion of the books over to The Letty Dobesh Chronicles topic, please. Thank you!

[pasdetrois]

Quote

One thing that impresses me is that she does a GREAT job with a southern accent.  Southern accents are tough for most actors.

I so agree with this. I've lived in five southern states, and the accents vary. She nailed the accent when she was in the bar and restaurant wearing the blonde wig and trying to inveigle her way in with Javier. Also, she nailed the southern mannerisms - the self-deprecating flirtiness. 

So far I like this. Dockery has disappeared into the role, and a lot of the actors look and talk like real people (e.g., Heidi). I'm curious how the writers will sustain our interest.

[Swansong]

Quote

ITA that Michelle does white trash beautifully

Well she is an Essex girl at heart. lol

[PBSLover]

On 11/17/2016 at 7:38 AM, TaraS1 said:

I thought Michelle was fantastic and obviously got to show so much more range than she did as Lady Mary.  The scene in the motel where she first calls her mom and then breaks down in tears?  I had no idea she could do that.  I mean, as much as I loved her as Mary, I never thought she had that in her.

Michelle was always a more believable crier than Laura Carmichael.

On 11/18/2016 at 1:44 PM, SunnyBeBe said:

Mary's character was never a favorite of mine on DA, but, I thought the actress did a great job making me dislike her.  I do like this character though.  One thing that impresses me is that she does a GREAT job with a southern accent.  Southern accents are tough for most actors.  Most make me laugh.  If you aren't from the south, you might be easily fooled, but for real southerners like me,  there's a fine line between being on point and ridiculous.  Michelle has it down!  She's really natural and must have really applied herself to get this down so perfectly.  

There was special done for the last season of DA where Michelle does different British accents.  She’s great with them.  In addition, most Brits will tell you the easiest American accent to do is Southern.  The drawl is similar to their accent (I don’t know why).

  Did anyone catch her slip in the first scene with Terry Kinney? Her Brit accent slipped through on one line. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I think that Brits do better American southern accents than native Americans.  Most Americans over do it.  While I adore Kyra Sedgewich, her accent on The Closer was so horrible, that it prevented me from watching the show. lol  

[Nanu160]

On 11/17/2016 at 0:25 AM, Dowel Jones said:

I don't know if I can stay with this one, simply because of the way the plotline is shaping up.  The acting and the production values may be top rate, but I'm not really interested in seeing a hitman work his way through the population with her help, pretty clothes and hair notwithstanding.  I'll give it another episode or two, but I hope there's something else there.

So don't stay. But you're missing a great fictional arc. This show rules

Stay for Michelle's performance!

[TaraS1]

Because I am now fully obsessed with this show (damn it!), I was watching some of the behind-the-scenes clips that TNT has up on YouTube and there's one where the actors and Chad Hodge (writer/creator) are doing a table read of Letty and Javier's dinner date in the pilot.  I thought it was so cool that Michelle was the one who suggested Letty put on a different persona/accent in that scene.

[Anela]

I haven't seen Downton Abbey - my parents and sister watched it, though, and Dad was the one to tell us to give this show a try. I saw an advert for it this morning, so I found the episodes on-demand.

I like it, but I'm also against the whole "you're going to work for me" thing, with this guy controlling her every move. They do have great chemistry, but I don't find it sexy at all. 

I noticed her slip in the accent occasionally, but she's doing much better than I ever could (and I started out with an American accent, as a kid). I'll keep watching on-demand, later on. I needed a distraction today, so I'm glad I found it on there. I should have known it was created by Blake Crouch. I've read a few of his books (or skimmed, when they got annoying). The few books I read, seemed to have a high body count, and the actress did a good job showing/expressing that horror when it comes to his killing.