Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[SusanM]

1 minute ago, absnow54 said:

Is Jim Bob allowed to attend if he's on the witness list? Or did the judge dismiss him?

Even if that's the case, where is Josh's mother?  Still living in denial that this is even happening?  I honestly have no idea how I'd react if my son was on trial for anything, let alone something like this, but I think I'd be in the courtoom, if not to show support, at least to be aware of what is taking place.

[CandyCaneTree]

I think that all the relatives are there not to support him but get to the truth. 

[Churchhoney]

11 minutes ago, Zella said:

I wouldn't put it past him, but if he did and then can't bothered to make an appearance himself, he's an even bigger than asshole than we already knew. 

Which is definitely not out of the question.....😬

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Before lunch break, the prosecution called Matthew Waller, according to a Sun reporter in the courtroom.

He was an employee of Josh's and a distant family member.

Edited December 2, 2021 by Lindsay Loo Hoo

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, SusannahM said:

Even if that's the case, where is Josh's mother?  Still living in denial that this is even happening?  I honestly have no idea how I'd react if my son was on trial for anything, let alone something like this, but I think I'd be in the courtoom, if not to show support, at least to be aware of what is taking place.

Exactly.

But I wonder whether she/they fear that she's so upset by this that she might just lose it in the courtroom....or is already so heavily medicated because of the multiple shocks here that it'd be very noticeable.......

Some of her video and social-media appearances over the past several years have been pretty wacked out as it is....And you probably wouldn't want to provide an additional spectacle for the public....or put her through something that she just might not be able to handle. 

Of course there's over a week of this trial to go yet, at least. So she may still make an appearance. She rode on a  parade float over the weekend, after all. 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Churchhoney

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Matthew Waller testified in court on Thursday that he worked at Wholesale Motors until mid to late April 2019, according to a Sun reporter at the trial.

His last check commission date was April 29, 2019.

The alleged crime occurred at the site in May 2019.

[hathorlive]

20 minutes ago, CandyCaneTree said:

I wonder if Jill testifies will they bring up the Megan Kelly interview where she said every family has a child molester in the family to downplay what he did? 

I would think the defense would be opening themselves up to "yes, I was brainwashed by family to think sexual abuse by your brother was normal".  

[Ijustwantsomechips]

I don’t like or feel sorry for Michelle. Nor do I understand the way she has handled things.  But I can almost, almost, give her a pass for not being there. I said almost.  While I would think I would want to be there to support my child, a mother also knows her child. She knows what he has done and what he is capable of doing.  Maybe she can’t be there because she knows there’s a possibility at least some of this is true (Spoiler alert: It’s all true), and she doesn’t really want to have that confirmed. I don’t know if I’d be able to treat my son the same after learning something like this about him. How do you love a monster? How do you interact with him knowing without a shadow of a doubt he did such horrendous things? Perhaps it’s easier to continue to deal with him this way. 

[CandyCaneTree]

2 minutes ago, SusannahM said:

 

 

 

16 minutes ago, Zella said:

But their defense is he didn't do it and it's not his, so it doesn't seem like that would help his defense. Their strategy isn't to say it's no big deal--it's to say that law enforcement zeroed in on him and didn't investigate other explanations. Never mind all the technical evidence that clearly places Josh as the one doing 

But the prosecutor could bring up the Megan Kelly interview. 

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Matthew Waller continued, saying that only he and Josh Duggar worked at Wholesale Motors when he worked there.

He testified that he never gave anyone else key codes except for himself and Josh, according to a Sun reporter at the trial.

He added that there were cameras and he was unsure if Josh could see him on the cameras.

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Then, Travis Story, a member of Josh's defense team, cross-examined him, according to the Sun reporter at the trial.

He asked about Josh's education and Matthew said Josh was homeschooled but he was not aware if Josh had his GED or college education.

FAMILIAR WITH PARTITION PASSWORD

Matthew Waller was asked about a password for partition software by the defense, according to the Sun reporter at the trial.

He said the password in question rang a bell.

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, Lindsay Loo Hoo said:

Then, Travis Story, a member of Josh's defense team, cross-examined him, according to the Sun reporter at the trial.

He asked about Josh's education and Matthew said Josh was homeschooled but he was not aware if Josh had his GED or college education.

So they are still pushing the stupid homeschooled theory?  

[Rootbeer]

10 minutes ago, hathorlive said:

I would think the defense would be opening themselves up to "yes, I was brainwashed by family to think sexual abuse by your brother was normal".  

All the Megyn Kelly interview does is confirm that Josh had an inappropriate sexual interest in young girls.  All the excuse making in the world as to why he does or how many other people do doesn't change the basic facts and doesn't give him a free pass to commit crimes against children.  I think the defense is going to want to spend as little time as possible on the many times members of the Duggar family have publicly admitted that Josh repeatedly sexually molested little girls.

 

So, the defense is now trying to use the excuse that Josh is too stupid to know how to use a computer to download CSAM?  They are really grasping at straws here.

Edited December 2, 2021 by Rootbeer

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

JUST NOW

MATTHEW WALLER CONTINUES TESTIMONY

The defense also asked Matthew Waller specifics about the office.

He said a main office was there in May 2019 but not a back office.

He testified that there was satellite internet but that the service changed in early April 2019, the Sun reporter at the trial said.

[Natalie68]

1 hour ago, Ijustwantsomechips said:

He looks like someone FaceTuned him about 20 years. Serves the fat fuck right. 
ETA: CouchTater beat me to it.

Doncha just want to swing a heavy bag of rocks at his face?  That is what looking at this serial molester does to me.  

[Churchhoney]

2 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

So they are still pushing the stupid homeschooled theory?  

I think Josh gave all his actually valuable information and assistance to the prosecution.

Could be karma.  

[hathorlive]

1 minute ago, Rootbeer said:

All the Megyn Kelly interview does is confirm that Josh had an inappropriate sexual interest in young girls.  All the excuse making in the world as to why he does or how many other people do doesn't change the basic facts and doesn't give him a free pass to commit crimes against children.  I think the defense is going to want to spend as little time as possible on the many times members of the Duggar family have publicly admitted that Josh repeatedly sexually molested little girls.

I would be shocked if the defense even cross examined Jill.  She  can add nothing but trouble to their theories. And it puts a name and a face to victim number whatever.

[SnapHappy]

2 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Derick must have a generous employee to allow him to take time off to attend the trial. Unless he somehow accrued a bunch of time off already. Or maybe he never did get a job.

Grub Hub doesn't really care what hours you work, only that the fries are still hot when you deliver them.  And you don't forget the ketchup. 

[GeeGolly]

They are bizarrely describing the car lot like a retail lot. "Employees" don't get commissions, they get bird dog payments. Bird doggers scout potential customers and if the buyer buys, the bird dogger gets a payment.

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Then, Dustin Roberts addressed Matthew Waller, yelling and asking if there was something Waller was not telling Roberts, according to the Sun reporter.

He said Waller didn't tell Roberts or law enforcement about knowing about the Intell password.

When Roberts said he thought Williams was hiding something from him, the defense objected.

Matthew testified that he did not remember the password when asked by Homeland Security, adding that it was "vaguely familiar" after the password was said to him.

[Rootbeer]

Just now, hathorlive said:

I would be shocked if the defense even cross examined Jill.  She  can add nothing but trouble to their theories. And it puts a name and a face to victim number whatever.

Me too, there is nothing she can say that will help him, presuming she tells the truth and I think that is exactly what she will do.  If anything, talking about how her parents tried to blame her and her sisters and forced them to forgive their brother and forced them to sleep all in the same room in street clothes is only going to show how the environment in which Josh was raised actually made it easier for him to justify his criminal acts.

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Travis Story, one of Josh's attorneys, then asked Matthew Waller about the password, according to the Sun reporter at the trial.

He asked if the government had asked Waller about the password - Intell1988 - and Waller said he could not recall.

"Did we tell you to tell the truth?" Story asked, which Waller replied to in the affirmative.

[hathorlive]

1 minute ago, Lindsay Loo Hoo said:

Then, Dustin Roberts addressed Matthew Waller, yelling and asking if there was something Waller was not telling Roberts, according to the Sun reporter.

He said Waller didn't tell Roberts or law enforcement about knowing about the Intell password.

When Roberts said he thought Williams was hiding something from him, the defense objected.

Matthew testified that he did not remember the password when asked by Homeland Security, adding that it was "vaguely familiar" after the password was said to him.

Mr. Waller, you need to consider carefully if you want to go to jail for perjury.  This is what I hate about these recaps.  What is an Intell password?  The windows password? The password for the car buying program? The Linux partition password?

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Roberts then asked Waller again about the password, asking if he didn't think to tell them he know, and noted they had asked Waller for the password.

Waller testified that he didn't know it, but that when defense mentioned it, it sounded familiar.

Roberts asked about the password for the HP computer and Waller said that he didn't know what the password was because he used "a sticky note."

When asked again about knowing the Intell password but not the HP one, Waller reiterated that the Intell one had sounded familiar.

[Rootbeer]

1 minute ago, hathorlive said:

Mr. Waller, you need to consider carefully if you want to go to jail for perjury.  This is what I hate about these recaps.  What is an Intell password?  The windows password? The password for the car buying program? The Linux partition password?

I dunno, I forget passwords all the time.  Ask me about the password on my work computer 2 and a half years ago and I wouldn't remember it either.  I don't get what they are trying to discern here.

[SusanM]

I;m confused by this line of questioning.  What is the defense trying to prove?  That others had access to the computer?

[Rootbeer]

Just now, Lindsay Loo Hoo said:

Roberts then asked Waller again about the password, asking if he didn't think to tell them he know, and noted they had asked Waller for the password.

Waller testified that he didn't know it, but that when defense mentioned it, it sounded familiar.

Roberts asked about the password for the HP computer and Waller said that he didn't know what the password was because he used "a sticky note."

When asked again about knowing the Intell password but not the HP one, Waller reiterated that the Intell one had sounded familiar.

Sounds to me like the defense is grasping at straws here.  Some guy who worked there more than 2 years ago didn't remember one password but did remember another when prompted?  So what?

[CandyCaneTree]

10 minutes ago, Natalie68 said:

Doncha just want to swing a heavy bag of rocks at his face?  That is what looking at this serial molester does to me.  

His eyes just pierced me right through my soul. 

[Rootbeer]

3 minutes ago, SusannahM said:

I;m confused by this line of questioning.  What is the defense trying to prove?  That others had access to the computer?

I think that's the idea and they are trying to act as if Matthew Waller is shady and has something to hide because he didn't tell the defense that he kinda recognized one of the passwords that LE told him about.  Because the only reason that Waller could possibly say he did not remember the password is because HE was the one downloading CSAM on that computer.  Like I said, grasping at straws.

Edited December 2, 2021 by Rootbeer

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

The prosecution then called Jeffrey Wofford to speak about the Covenant Eyes software, the Sun reporter revealed.

He said Covenant Eyes is used to monitor activity on devices and is used to detect pornography.

If pornography is detected, an accountability partner is emailed.

[GeeGolly]

Just now, Rootbeer said:

I think that's the idea and they are trying to act as if Matthew Waller is shady and has something to hide because he didn't tell the defense that he kinda recognized one of the passwords that LE told him about.

Looking for some reasonable for the jury, wherever they can.

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Jeffrey Wofford said Anna Duggar, Josh Duggar's wife, is his Covenant Eyes accountability partner.

He looked at an accountability report and the Sun reporter at the trial noted that Homeland Security subpoenaed Josh and Anna's records for the program.

Josh first subscribed in 2013.

[CandyCaneTree]

3 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

I dunno, I forget passwords all the time.  Ask me about the password on my work computer 2 and a half years ago and I wouldn't remember it either.  I don't get what they are trying to discern here.

I can't even remember the password for my work computer that I changed this morning but I can remember my first childhood phone number. 

[SusanM]

1 minute ago, Rootbeer said:

I think that's the idea and they are trying to act as if Matthew Waller is shady and has something to hide because he didn't tell the defense that he kinda recognized one of the passwords that LE told him about.

Anyone on the jury who uses computers in any capacity has absolutely no doubt experienced not remembering a password.  This is the best they can do???

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

As Wofford was testifying about Covenant Eyes, Joy-Anna Duggar entered the courtroom, according to the Sun reporter at the trial.

She sat and her husband Austin Forsyth put his arm around her.

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, Lindsay Loo Hoo said:

Jeffrey Wofford said Anna Duggar, Josh Duggar's wife, is his Covenant Eyes accountability partner.

He looked at an accountability report and the Sun reporter at the trial noted that Homeland Security subpoenaed Josh and Anna's records for the program.

Josh first subscribed in 2013.

I'd be interested to know if Anna has been alerted to any (legal) porn use over the years.

[RedDelicious]

36 minutes ago, CandyCaneTree said:

I think that all the relatives are there not to support him but get to the truth. 

Can you imagine the fallout when they hear the actual truth and compare it to Jim Bob's version of the truth, as told to the family? And yet, I think some family members, e.g., Michelle, will continue to believe Jim Bob.

[lascuba]

7 minutes ago, hathorlive said:

Mr. Waller, you need to consider carefully if you want to go to jail for perjury.  This is what I hate about these recaps.  What is an Intell password?  The windows password? The password for the car buying program? The Linux partition password?

According to someone on twitter, the password at the time that Waller worked there was intell1988. When the defense asked him if he knew that password, Waller replies that it "faintly rang a bell." The prosecutor jumped on that, and according to Anna Darling's twitter, "Prosecution was not happy to hear this. Calling him out for not remembering any passwords when being interviewed by investigators. Also implying he had been prepped by defense"

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Wofford testified that Covenant Eyes has different rating levels.

He said Josh's was "mature teen," according to the Sun reporter at the trial.

He said it was common and could detect pornography.

He also said it would detect peer-to-peer networking.

[merylinkid]

2 hours ago, Ijustwantsomechips said:

He looks like someone FaceTuned him about 20 years. Serves the fat fuck right. 
ETA: CouchTater beat me to it.

Who the hell adjusts their freaking tie while getting their temp check?   It's not a dating app JOSH.

2 hours ago, Coldplay said:

Got some random thoughts about Josh.

He must have known from a very early age what his....interests are, which apparently are young girls between 5 and 9. I once read somewhere that not everyone who sexually abuses children is a pedophile, but sometimes these sickos just abuse kids for "domination." I don't think thats the case with Josh, I do believe he is a pedophile and KNOWS deep down that there is sth wrong with him. 

IMO, he never wanted to marry Anna, and he never wanted the M & M's, cause I think he was secretely afraid he would start abusing his own kids. We don't know yet if he ever did- the two oldest girls NEED to get questioned from someone who knows how to deal with SA of children.

I also think that the whole Ashley Madison affair was a somewhat desperate attempt from Josh to see if hey, maybe it's Anna why I cant get sexual satisfaction (🤢) maybe I just need to f**k another woman. Or two. Maybe in his sick mind he thought if he tries sleeping with other women, his fantasies about young girls would stop.

They did not, and in May 2019 he probably just could not control his sick desires any longer, and he did what he did. IIRC, Anna was pregnant with Maryella in May 19, she was born in November 19. Maybe that made Josh snap? Another girl, another daughter that he badly wanted to $%&? 

I might be wrong, but I think it's almost impossible to treat pedophiles, since their brains are wired in that way. He is a danger to society.

Also, I think he did look smug and almost relieved in his mugshot- and I think he enjoys to slap all this into JB's face. He never wanted the life his Daddy Dearest forced him to live, and I think for him, this is some sick game of revenge. I think he wants to plead guilty, but JB is forcing him through this circus of a trial to "save" his public image.

This is giving him faaaar too much credit for trying to do the right thing.   More like, he liked, he did it, he found there were no REAL consequences for doing it, so he kept doing it.   Heck, not only no REAL consequences, he was still touted as the GOLDEN BOY, the heir to the kingdom EVEN AFTERWARDS.   he got given a submissive wife who will NEVER question what he does, who will always think him perfect.   I will believe he never wanted kids.   But only because he would no longer be the center of the universe.   Kids would make it HARDER for him to do the things he wanted to when he wanted to.   that's it.  

 

I do feel for the siblings.   Families are complicated.   It's easy to say "Well if my brother molested me I would never ever speak to him again and I would hate my parents for protecting him."   But its more complicated than that.   So I feel for all the innocents in this.   All the siblings and all the kids.   They didn't ask to be part of this circus.   Anna, JB and Michelle, no sympathy at all.   

[libgirl2]

3 minutes ago, CandyCaneTree said:

I can't even remember the password for my work computer that I changed this morning but I can remember my first childhood phone number. 

I remember my high school locker number and combination. I graduated in 1983.... oh and my gym locker combo too! 

[Zella]

Who is this wofford guy? 

[Lindsay Loo Hoo]

Wofford said during the trial on Thursday that Covenant Eyes might not detect the other side of a computer partition, that it would not catch or report it, according to a Sun reporter at the trial.

[SusanM]

1 minute ago, libgirl2 said:

I remember my high school locker number and combination. I graduated in 1983.... oh and my gym locker combo too! 

Wow, am suitably impressed! Some days I'm not even sure of my house number.  I usually remember the street name.

[merylinkid]

5 minutes ago, SusannahM said:

Anyone on the jury who uses computers in any capacity has absolutely no doubt experienced not remembering a password.  This is the best they can do???

When your client won't take a plea, you gotta go with whatever defense your client will let you make.   All they got is "Some Other Guy" and Josh is a moron without any education.   You gotta work with the hand you're dealt even if all you got is a busted flush.   That or withdraw which means no more $$$$ or publicity from the case.   They know its a loser.   But they get paid either way.   AND people know its a loser but see them still fighting for their client, so when someone else is in trouble they go "I want THAT guy, he fights for his clients."

[libgirl2]

4 minutes ago, SusannahM said:

Wow, am suitably impressed! Some days I'm not even sure of my house number.  I usually remember the street name.

Oh, I forget many of my computer passwords. AT least 90% of the time! 

Edited December 2, 2021 by libgirl2

[irisheyes]

7 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

Who the hell adjusts their freaking tie while getting their temp check?   It's not a dating app JOSH.

I hate Josh with the fire of a thousand burning suns, but I think that’s his mask, not his tie. 
 

Still hope he rots in prison. 

[hathorlive]

6 minutes ago, Lindsay Loo Hoo said:

Wofford said during the trial on Thursday that Covenant Eyes might not detect the other side of a computer partition, that it would not catch or report it, according to a Sun reporter at the trial.

Uggg.  There is no other side to a partition.  There is another partition, but it's not on the same partition.  I hard drive, partitioned into two partitions.  One windows, one Linux.  Covenant Eyes does NOT support Linux, so the correct answer is "no, our software can't "see" Linux file systems".   

4 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

Oh, I forget many of my computer passwords. AT least 90% of the time! 

The entire point to this line of questioning is to let the jury know that other people had or might have had access to the password where the naughty stuff was found.

[SusanM]

1 minute ago, hathorlive said:

The entire point to this line of questioning is to let the jury know that other people had or might have had access to the password where the naughty stuff was found.

How helpful is that if the prosecution can show that the naughty stuff was accessed after this fellow left Smuggar's employ?  Is the jury really going to buy that this was on the computer and everyone and his uncle accessed except Smuggar??  Wow.

[Trillium]

Pretty sure they have evidence that Josh was there via text and phone location data exactly when it was downloaded. But yeah sure, one of these random people was also there in the tiny ass office downloading  CSMA when Josh was there and Josh didn’t notice. 
 

 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Trillium