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Artistic Gymnastics: Stick the Landing!

HartofDixie

By HartofDixie
in 2016 Olympics

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GreyBunny
GreyBunny

Gabby has worked her ass off for years, has been a proud member of the US team, and is a great role model for young kids who are up and coming. To say that her not putting her hand over her heart nega

KBrownie
KBrownie

It's not about being "PC" as you put it.  He literally tried to erase her parents from her life to fit whatever narrative he has in his head about what family means.  It's not some trite quibble over

walnutqueen
walnutqueen

Protocol is not law, and has nothing to do with being an American.  Fortunately, Americans live in a free country where they have the right to disagree with your sentiments and still be Americans (and

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

1 minute ago, pivot said:

Man, Simone's routine looked like it was amazing. Unfortunately, NBC's shitty stream cut out the entire routine so I only got highlights. I also missed Aly's beam.

Simone is truly something special on floor. Just amazing. Aly's floor is great as well. Let us not talk about Aliya's. 

It's your internet connection. I saw her routine just fine. :)

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Growsonwalls

Growsonwalls

(edited)

You know no matter what you thought of their gymnastics respect to Aliya, Shang and the rest of the field for composing themselves with class throughout this competition. I wish the swimmers could show the same sportsmanship and respect for their competitors.

And this goes to Oleg too. I'm sure he will kick himself over that hop on the landing forever but he showed class and sportsmanship.

Edited by Growsonwalls
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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

(edited)

Is The Daily Dismount going to show the medal ceremony? I came back into the room just to hear Tanith say that they would be off tomorrow and Friday. 

eta: She said yes, just after I hit save. 

Edited by Sew Sumi
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Daisy

Daisy

12 minutes ago, pivot said:

Man, Simone's routine looked like it was amazing. Unfortunately, NBC's shitty stream cut out the entire routine so I only got highlights. I also missed Aly's beam.

Simone is truly something special on floor. Just amazing. Aly's floor is great as well. Let us not talk about Aliya's. 

I agree. Aliya's needs to be burned to the ground. 

10 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

You know no matter what you thought of their gymnastics respect to Aliya, Shang and the rest of the field for composing themselves with class throughout this competition. I wish the swimmers could show the same sportsmanship and respect for their competitors.

And this goes to Oleg too. I'm sure he will kick himself over that hop on the landing forever but he showed class and sportsmanship.

this is true. I don't mind the the screaming and the yays! and all but it is all very classy and respectful. It really seems in swimming it's very clique if that makes sense. Maybe it's just because of the type of sport it is? 

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Superpole2000

Superpole2000

17 minutes ago, pivot said:

And Simone shows why it was never going to be close and while she is considered GOAT.  She finished 2 points above Aly's best performance ever.

I still think Comaneci holds the GOAT title. She was successful at two Olympics, and she is one of the main reasons anyone is interested in gymnastics.

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Daisy

Daisy

(edited)
3 minutes ago, Superpole2000 said:

I still think Comaneci holds the GOAT title. She was successful at two Olympics, and she is one of the main reasons anyone is interested in gymnastics.

and Korbut before her (re: interest)
(and Shannon as well, really before Biles, the most decorated American I think before Biles?) 

And Ellie Black finished 5th, best Canadian finish ever. 
Hopefully in 2020, we can tumble with the best of them and get some individual medals. 

Edited by Daisy
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STFUFrank

STFUFrank

8 minutes ago, Superpole2000 said:

I still think Comaneci holds the GOAT title. She was successful at two Olympics, and she is one of the main reasons anyone is interested in gymnastics.

How successful was Nadia in 1980? I thought Nellie Kim of the USSR won the all around and Nadia had an uncharacteristic fall in those games. 

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

6 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

Its not the internet connection.  Mine cut out precisely in the same places.

Are you on the app or the website? Maybe it was that. I am on a laptop, using the website. 

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Elsydeon

Elsydeon

2 minutes ago, TotalHellion said:

How successful was Nadia in 1980? I thought Nellie Kim of the USSR won the all around and Nadia had an uncharacteristic fall in those games. 

Yelena Davydova won AA in 1980. Nadia and Natalia Shaposhnikova tied with 4 medals each.

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pivot

pivot

1 minute ago, Sew Sumi said:

Are you on the app or the website? Maybe it was that. I am on a laptop, using the website. 

I was using the Roku App. I had other Internet streaming at the same time and it was fine. That app is really glitchy.

I'd still put Biles above Shannon for sure as Greatest of All Time (GOAT). Shannon was not nearly as dominant in her time period as Biles. It's hard to compare Olga or Nadia because the sport was so simple back then. It's a whole new sport now in comparison. 

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Daisy

Daisy

1 minute ago, PoshSprinkles said:

Greatest of all time. 

I go back and forth in WAG. Nadia and Shannon tend to be my top two. 

Kohei is obviously the MAB GOAT. <3 

Shannon is the reason why i got into the sport to begin with. I cried big fat baby tears when she hurt herself in 2000 and she couldn't go to Sydney. 

I do think Simone is amazingly good and she'll set the bar high, and yeah in this period in time she'l truly be the mark to beat and maybe no one will. But I was saying it during the MAG (and WAG), I think the sport needs a revolutionary. As it is right now, it's really, really sloppy, a lot is focused on the athletic side of gymnastics (which to be fair, is fair play considering the huge emphasis on artistry and super duper hard tricks were punished). But I think the next GOAT will be someone who can equally tie in artistry and the tumbling. (like it doesn't look like "Here is my bag of tricks, and shimmy, hip, hip shimmy). Pointed toes, straight legs, etc. 

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DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

41 minutes ago, Elsydeon said:

The US is the first country to win 4 straight women's AA titles. Not even the USSR in their prime could manage that.

True since they boycotted '84. Otherwise, they would have 5, '80-'96,  if you count the old Soviet Republics.

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pivot

pivot

One of the reasons Simone is considered GOAT is that she has artistry and difficulty. She isn't just a tumbler.  Her form is light-years above a Johnson or Raisman who are considered tumblers. 

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AuntieDiane6

AuntieDiane6

Quote

Nadia and Shannon tend to be my top two.

Well, Olga brought the sport from the days of old ladies with buns to young daredevils.  Nadia brought perfection.  MaryLou taught everyone how to hit when it counts.  (Her vault still holds up even though her choreography on floor was old-school Romanian tacky.)  Shannon was good but she always looked like she had cramps when she performed ... she always had a pained expression as I remember her.   Carly?  Not really memorable.  Nastia?  Elegant but not ground-breaking.  Gabby?  Her career has been very interesting.  Simone?  Wow.  Just wow.

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Jillibean

Jillibean

I am so, so happy for Simone and Aly. It was so wonderful to see the emotion as they achieved their dreams--especially for Aly, who came back this quad for essentially this exact purpose. 

I think Simone is probably the greatest of all time, but Shannon will probably always be my favorite. I just thought she was so beautiful and graceful. In compulsories she could have been the person demonstrating the routine on pretty much every event. You would see the same moves that looked weird or sloppy when others did them and she found a way to make them look beautiful.

On the other side of things...

Quote

Breaking in quickly to mention that Sam posted to his Instagram that he was "6 for 6" yesterday. I guess not falling off the horse counts as a victory? 

So...does he think that since not much of the competition aired in primetime that he can just make up his own version of what happened and people will go with it? Or is he just bad at math in addition to being bad at competing under pressure? Nice vault, Sam. 

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Cherpumple

Cherpumple

43 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

I'm so proud of Eythora Thorsdottir's 9th place, best any Dutch gymnast has ever done at the AA :)

She definitely wins "best name" in my opinion. When they announced her in the arena, I back-tracked three times to hear the pronunciation because it did not sound at all like I would have said it. The actual pronunciation is much better than the one in my head!

4 minutes ago, kathy42977 said:

When do they compete for medals on the individual apparatuses?

I'm  assuming Simone and Aly will compete on all but the uneven bars. Is that right?

The individual events are Sunday-Tuesday, with both men and women competing each day. I haven't looked at the participant lists yet.

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DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

3 minutes ago, Jillibean said:

I am so, so happy for Simone and Aly. It was so wonderful to see the emotion as they achieved their dreams--especially for Aly, who came back this quad for essentially this exact purpose. 

I think Simone is probably the greatest of all time, but Shannon will probably always be my favorite. I just thought she was so beautiful and graceful. In compulsories she could have been the person demonstrating the routine on pretty much every event. You would see the same moves that looked weird or sloppy when others did them and she found a way to make them look beautiful.

On the other side of things...

So...does he think that since not much of the competition aired in primetime that he can just make up his own version of what happened and people will go with it? Or is he just bad at math in addition to being bad at competing under pressure? Nice vault, Sam. 

Yes. Shannon had great form and was very artistic. She was first after compulsories in '92 and was 2nd in compulsories in '96. The way she completely refocused the US team after a horrible beam compulsory in Atlanta just shows you how laser focused and good she could be. She had the highest compulsory beam score in Atlanta. 

Like I said earlier, her Barcelona beam routine is one of the most artistic routines in existence. The flow and execution along with some really interesting skil. Plus her opening tumbling from the split handstand to the piked two foot layout. And she was one of the few that did the back handspring into 3 layout step outs in '92. And the first American female to do the full twisting double dismount (same as Simone's) of the beam. That the fact she was doing that from around '91-'96 and the dismount is rated as least an F over 20 years later is incredible. I still to this day think that judges would have given Miller a 10.0 on her first all around vault if Nunno hadn't been so loud and obnoxious. Then she would have been the '92 champ.

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Daisy

Daisy

1 minute ago, DawnDavenport said:

Yes. Shannon had great form and was very artistic. She was first after compulsories in '92 and was 2nd in compulsories in '96. The way she completely refocused the US team after a horrible beam compulsory in Atlanta just shows you how laser focused and good she could be. She had the highest compulsory beam score in Atlanta. 

Like I said earlier, her Barcelona beam routine is one of the most artistic routines in existence. The flow and execution along with some really interesting skil. Plus her opening tumbling from the split handstand to the piked two foot layout. And she was one of the few that did the back handspring into 3 layout step outs in '92. And the first American female to do the full twisting double dismount (same as Simone's) of the beam. That the fact she was doing that from around '91-'96 and the dismount is rated as least an F over 20 years later is incredible. I still to this day think that judges would have given Miller a 10.0 on her first all around vault if Nunno hadn't been so loud and obnoxious. Then she would have been the '92 champ.

Ohoo I totally agree. Nunno was totally .. guhh.. 
Everytime I watch Atlanta and she took that big step out i was like whyy. WHHHYYY....

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DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

6 minutes ago, Cherpumple said:

She definitely wins "best name" in my opinion. When they announced her in the arena, I back-tracked three times to hear the pronunciation because it did not sound at all like I would have said it. The actual pronunciation is much better than the one in my head!

The individual events are Sunday-Tuesday, with both men and women competing each day. I haven't looked at the participant lists yet.

Vault: Biles (qualified 1st)

Bars: Kocian (1st), Douglas (3rd)

Beam: Biles(1st), Hernandez (3rd)

Floor: Biles( 1st), Raisman (2nd)

Who cares about the men. They qualified to every event except for Rings and someone will eek out maybe a bronze but don't hold your breath. Sam qualified 1st for floor but more than likely he'll end up 5th or 6th. I think Parallel bars is too deep for the US to be competitive. Same with Naddour on Pommel Horse. I think High Bar is out of reach for the US as well. Too much depth. 

I want the men to be #NoMedals. I stopped caring after the shit show they produced on Monday. 

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Daisy

Daisy

1 minute ago, DawnDavenport said:

Vault: Biles (qualified 1st)

Bars: Kocian (1st), Douglas (3rd)

Beam: Biles(1st), Hernandez (3rd)

Floor: Biles( 1st), Raisman (2nd)

Who cares about the men. They qualified to every event except for Rings and someone will eek out maybe a bronze but don't hold your breath. Sam qualified 1st for floor but more than likely he'll end up 5th or 6th. I think Parallel bars is too deep for the US to be competitive. Same with Naddour on Pommel Horse. I think High Bar is out of reach for the US as well. Too much depth. 

I want the men to be #NoMedals. I stopped caring after the shit show they produced on Monday. 

Tears of Nothing fistbump Dawn. 

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Scovies

Scovies

6 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Ohoo I totally agree. Nunno was totally .. guhh.. 
Everytime I watch Atlanta and she took that big step out i was like whyy. WHHHYYY....

Because Steve Nunno was an idiot who insisted Shannon do a double layout on floor. Dude was obsessed with that skill -- I remember him mentioning it to Shannon after a floor routine either in the '92 Olympics or the '91 Worlds. Shannon was never a power gymnast and it was stupid of him to make her try it. 

1 minute ago, DawnDavenport said:

Vault: Biles (qualified 1st)

Bars: Kocian (1st), Douglas (3rd)

Beam: Biles(1st), Hernandez (3rd)

Floor: Biles( 1st), Raisman (2nd)

Who cares about the men. They qualified to every event except for Rings and someone will eek out maybe a bronze but don't hold your breath. Sam qualified 1st for floor but more than likely he'll end up 5th or 6th. I think Parallel bars is too deep for the US to be competitive. Same with Naddour on Pommel Horse. I think High Bar is out of reach for the US as well. Too much depth. 

I want the men to be #NoMedals. I stopped caring after the shit show they produced on Monday. 

Eh, I at least want to see Jake Dalton walk away with a medal. He can do it on floor, too; he qualified in 2nd.

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DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

6 minutes ago, Daisy said:

Ohoo I totally agree. Nunno was totally .. guhh.. 
Everytime I watch Atlanta and she took that big step out i was like whyy. WHHHYYY....

Yeah. Atlanta was tough for her. She was really only competitive on beam. Her bars were not up the international standard any longer and her floor too inconsistent. I heard she had a hamstring injury in Atlanta and couldn't do the tumbling she had planned. Vault was ok but she only did her 9.9 vault in the all around. She she's amazing. 3 bronze, 2 silver, 2 gold in two Olympics is great for a female gymnast.

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Daisy

Daisy

1 minute ago, DawnDavenport said:

Yeah. Atlanta was tough for her. She was really only competitive on beam. Her bars were not up the international standard any longer and her floor too inconsistent. I heard she had a hamstring injury in Atlanta and couldn't do the tumbling she had planned. Vault was ok but she only did her 9.9 vault in the all around. She she's amazing. 3 bronze, 2 silver, 2 gold in two Olympics is great for a female gymnast.

She also had the wrist issue, that's why she had to petition to get on the team and she had a crap tonne of cortizone in there. I firmly believe if she had been healthy, she could have done some serious damage. 

NBC. there is 1 reason why i watch you. 
because you used to bring the fluff. the movie theme highlighting everyone. Why you stop this? 

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DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

1 minute ago, Daisy said:

She also had the wrist issue, that's why she had to petition to get on the team and she had a crap tonne of cortizone in there. I firmly believe if she had been healthy, she could have done some serious damage. 

No doubt about it. Was the wrist injury from her probably overcompensating for the elbow surgery she had in '92? I assume that the tendonitis was probably due to that? That seemed to plague her starting around '93 or '94. She recovered so quickly (John Tesh would not shut up about her elbow screw!). Plus she was 2 time all around world champion and one individual world titles on every event except vault.

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scarynikki12

scarynikki12

I think it was smart of NBC to have Courtney and Jonathan as the streaming commentators.  I like that she lets him take the lead during the men's competitions and he does the same with her for the women.  They each understand that there's only so much they can relate to when commenting on the other's field (take a note, TIM, who acts like he's the expert on all things women's gymnastics when Nastia's right there).  I still don't know the name of the third guy but I like him too.  He's able to relate to the sport even though he's a spectator and isn't afraid to ask actual questions.  Good team. 

I'm still on rotation 2 but I really like that Courtney pointed out that she could tell Simone would stick her landing based on her placement in the air.  AND THEN WENT ON TO EXPLAIN WHY!  She made a point to say that it was specific to the full-in dismount and it was just refreshing.  Meanwhile Tim always acts like he's clairvoyant when it comes to dismounts (when he's just commenting on the tape and we'll never know what he really said when watching live).

To join the general conversation, I still love Shannen's gymnastics but she was all grace and little power.  At first, Nunno did well in playing up her strengths while masking her weaknesses but I think he was so determined to see her win the All Around that he just forgot that she wasn't capable of the big things (double layout on floor and bars, 1.5 twist on vault).  All she needed was 3 routines worth a 10, she didn't need the fancy skills.  The judges LOVED Shannen's form and that was always reflected in her scores when she hit but Nunno forgot all of that.  If he hadn't been such an ass about her tumbling then she probably wouldn't have made the big mistakes and earned a second medal (maybe even gold if she'd kept the full-in bars dismount instead of the double layout).  Even with the 9.0 vaults she would have done it.

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megwhite

megwhite

Gah! Steven Nunno sucked!! She was a beautiful Artistic gymnast not a powerhouse, and he couldn't get over that, I think he was trying to over compensate for Barcelona when she lost to Tatiana Gutso by the .05 margin, I think he was lucky to have Shannon at his gym.

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DawnDavenport

DawnDavenport

4 minutes ago, megwhite said:

Gah! Steven Nunno sucked!! She was a beautiful Artistic gymnast not a powerhouse, and he couldn't get over that, I think he was trying to over compensate for Barcelona when she lost to Tatiana Gutso by the .05 margin, I think he was lucky to have Shannon at his gym.

I totally agree. As good as Gutsu was, I think her winning in Barcelona was the start of the emphasis on power over form. Gutsu was over scored on vault and floor. Her beam was more difficult than Shannon's but her execution was not very good. Always looking at her feet and her posture and extension was terrible. Very little tension in her body so everything just seemed flat. Don't get me started on her vault. There's no way anyone can justify giving Gutsu a 9.950 for a questionably stuck vault with leg separation on her preflight, bent over on landing and her feet weren't together. Compare that to Miller's first vault which she essentially landed basically standing up and she got a 9.975. 

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Daisy

Daisy

9 minutes ago, DawnDavenport said:

No doubt about it. Was the wrist injury from her probably overcompensating for the elbow surgery she had in '92? I assume that the tendonitis was probably due to that? That seemed to plague her starting around '93 or '94. She recovered so quickly (John Tesh would not shut up about her elbow screw!). Plus she was 2 time all around world champion and one individual world titles on every event except vault.

I can't remember specifically, but honestly it wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.. it really seemed that the more Nunno tried to push her to be more power-specific the more beat up she got. The puberty stick hit her hard too, I remember Shannon saying, like she gained weight, inches, etc, and i bet Nunno wasn't easy on her for her adjusting to it. (and I bet you that didn't help her case. I bet Nunno was like, Boom, you're a few inches taller,  you're heavier you can do the power moves now). She had the hamstring/wrist in 96, and then the hamstring again in 2000 which cost her. Though, I think she easily could have gone with Amy/Dominique to Sydney. Just adding that extra bit of experience and savvy to the team could have helped. 

7 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I'm still on rotation 2 but I really like that Courtney pointed out that she could tell Simone would stick her landing based on her placement in the air.  AND THEN WENT ON TO EXPLAIN WHY!  She made a point to say that it was specific to the full-in dismount and it was just refreshing.  Meanwhile Tim always acts like he's clairvoyant when it comes to dismounts (when he's just commenting on the tape and we'll never know what he really said when watching live).

To join the general conversation, I still love Shannen's gymnastics but she was all grace and little power.  At first, Nunno did well in playing up her strengths while masking her weaknesses but I think he was so determined to see her win the All Around that he just forgot that she wasn't capable of the big things (double layout on floor and bars, 1.5 twist on vault).  All she needed was 3 routines worth a 10, she didn't need the fancy skills.  The judges LOVED Shannen's form and that was always reflected in her scores when she hit but Nunno forgot all of that.  If he hadn't been such an ass about her tumbling then she probably wouldn't have made the big mistakes and earned a second medal (maybe even gold if she'd kept the full-in bars dismount instead of the double layout).  Even with the 9.0 vaults she would have done it.

Right? I want like. Tim. EXPLAIN STUFF. super angry face here. 

And I agree with you. Like if you watch Barcelona (which I think I am going to do later LOL i am fully in remember when mode now) Shannon was so incredibly graceful, and she just.. floated. like I remember her final vault and I was like that was the most beautiful thing I had ever seen in my entire life. just hit it, and bam. 

 

1 minute ago, megwhite said:

Gah! Steven Nunno sucked!! She was a beautiful Artistic gymnast not a powerhouse, and he couldn't get over that, I think he was trying to over compensate for Barcelona when she lost to Tatiana Gutso by the .05 margin, I think he was lucky to have Shannon at his gym.

Exactly. 
And I wonder how much influence Peggy Liddick had as well. because remember, Shannon takes a break, Peggy splits to Australia. You never heard from Nunno again, while Peggy is the Australian National coach. Shannon comes back, and its' just Nunno and the poor thing just breaks down and retires. 

(Dawn - I agree. I don't think it really took hold in 96/00 because Sveta was dominating, but def after 00 and the code change...)

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megwhite

megwhite

I was so happy for the Gold on the beam!, she was perfect while others had wobbles, her best event was the beam. Peggy Liddick was her beam coach after 96' hightailed it to Australia, knowing Steve was a sinking ship. I think Shannon was one of the best.

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scarynikki12

scarynikki12

I also give Peggy full credit for why Shannen's beam was so consistent and why it was (in my opinion) always her best event.  Peggy was in charge of beam and consistently played to Shannen's strengths while Nunno was kept behind the partition.  I also think Shannen privately liked Peggy more (though she'd never say so), and I definitely think that Peggy would have pursued a head coaching job much earlier had Shannen not stayed with the sport.

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