Graceland - General Discussion

[RachelKM]

Don't forget that it was an accident i.e. he was emotional unstable, drunk, encountered by his worst enemy and the gun went off during a struggle. Considering all the other things they all have been involved in, I can see how she can "let it slide" eventually, however, letting her live with guilt over it its much much worse, it is a direct betrayal...

That and he buried the body.... Now, if only everyone would learn that he was Odin.  That shit was serious and even Jakes doesn't know his good buddy spent years actually engaging in drug trafficking (thereby being a party to countless deaths and human rights violations).  i know I said this before, but I continue to cringe when I think about Charlie apologizing for suspecting him of being Odin.  

Edited August 29, 2014 by RachelKM

[Madding crowd]

I don't like how dark the characters have become. Of course, they never seem like they report to anyone, but wouldn't the higher ups know something is going on? And Mr. Madding Crowd has been in law enforcement for over 20 years and agrees that no agency on earth would sanction bank robberies where innocent people could be hurt (and I know they didn't know in advance about this one, but there would be huge repercussions and media stories). These people act so terribly unprofessional.

 

I agree Mike has changed but I don't think he is a big a jerk as Briggs. Mike did the right think in pulling Page out of the sex dungeon, agents have to look out for each other. It would be one thing if it was just Page and the one girl but there were many girls being held so the protocol would be to save the agent in the hopes of continuing the operation and trying to save the rest of the girls.  He did the wrong thing in hiding the girl's murder, but he was not responsible.

Page is and has been acting unprofessional for a long time. And then we have Johnny who is sleeping with the daughter of a drug boss, Charlie who committed an armored robbery at a bar, Briggs who does something unprofessional every week and the other guy (blanking on his name now), whose personal life takes over his professional life as well. 

Edited August 29, 2014 by Madding crowd

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Even as the agents bait their final hooks against the Solano Cartel, it dawns that Sid may still have a few tricks of his own.

[Hero]

What was with the letter that Paige took from Lina's sister? I took it that Mike wrote it, but why did she ask about the way it was folded?

I really hope that they don't hurt or kill Johnny. I really like his character.

[lynny]

Actual conversation between my husband and I during this show:

 

Remember when these guys were elite agents ? Have they done one single thing this season they haven't fucked up? Because I can't think of one.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

As the arrests of Sid and the Solanos near, even the best laid plans begin to crumble.

 

Edited September 11, 2014 by ElectricBoogaloo

[BindsTheTuna]

WTF was that shit? 

[Madding crowd]

Page should be arrested for putting the life of a federal officer in danger and basically sending a killer after him. I understand Mike acted inappropriate but he didn't kill Lena and his goal was and should be the entire operation. Page is acting like it would be Ok for the entire group of girls including herself to be killed in order to save one person. That is never going to be the protocol for a large scale operation.

On top of that they all put themselves in constant danger by ignoring orders, going in to situations without back-up and getting personally involved with people in every case they work on.

[BindsTheTuna]

So, did Paige send Sid in from the beginning? "I sent you to Sylmar to get rid of him" or something to that effect.

 

I've never seen a show implode from suck right before my very eyes like this one has. 

[Pyewacket]

 

I've never seen a show implode from suck right before my very eyes like this one has

 

I cannot tell you how much I wish I did not agree with you one hundred percent. I kept waiting for it to get back on track this season, and it just never did. What a mess.

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

At the end of the previous episode, I thought well, I actually don't care what happens to any of these people. Charlie got kidnapped by Amber? Oh well. Briggs is about to road trip with a guy who knows he, Paige, and Mike all know each other? Okay.

As this episode progressed, it got even worse because I was actively hoping half these people would die. Paige going to Sid was the ultimate betrayal. Briggs giving the "go team!" speech sickened me considering all the ways he has lied to everyone in the house to protect his own lying murdering ass. Paige's attitude about Lena has bothered me from the beginning. She was always so focused on Lena just because of the exchanged two sentences that she didn't care about the safety of the other girls. She was fine with one of the other girls being sold into prostitution as long as it meant Lena got to stay. She wanted Mike to buy Lena to get her out of there, but to hell with all of the other girls stuck in that warehouse being abused and sold to perverts.

[luckyroll3]

I can't believe Mike walked out of the Solano house and left Sid alive.  The fuck!  Shoot his ass in the head, get rid of the weapon (they were in Mexico, right) and take it from there.  Sid is really a psychopath if he could just kill his entire team like that.  How did he explain away why he and the rest of his team were in Carlos Solano's house in the first place?

 

And Johnny.  You know Carlito is insane.  Why did you not have a weapon nearby just in case he pulled something, like he always does.  A gun, a knife, a bat, something.  How many times has he watched Carlito just kill someone for fun?  Dummy!

 

Don't even get me stated on Paige. 

 

Everyone on this show, with the exception of DJ the drunk, were doing straight up stupid ass dumb ass shit these last few episodes.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

What made no sense to me is that Mike was willing to keep Lena and the other girls in Pervert Central for the sake of the investigation and then he was willing to burn the body and conk himself in the head to create a story for Paige to believe, but he isn't willing to shoot Sid. Dude, the guy just set you up for mass murder. Your fingerprints are already on the gun. If ballistics is going to trace all those bodies back to Mike, he might as well add one more to the pile.

 

Hell, he then he could have wiped his fingerprints off the gun, put it in Sid's hand, and put the blame squarely back on Sid. He could have just said that he and Sid struggled, Sid took his gun, and then freaked out and started shooting his own people. But no, just run away and hide in a warehouse. That seems like the best option.

[luckyroll3]

My sentiments exactly, ElectricBoogaloo! (Love the name - one of my fave movies, by the way.)

 

He already went above and beyond on the other stuff, including forging and sending the letter (when in the hell did he have time to do that), but he couldn't put in that much effort to help clear his name on the murder of several officers of the law??  Foolishness.

[RachelKM]

What in the name of all that is holy did I just watch?

 

I've never seen a show so totally decimate everything and everyone in it the way this one did.  Every character was proven psychotic, a moron, or both.  Paige was off her nut and over personalized her case and then apparently just aimed a heat seeking psycho at Mike; Johnny was a hair less unstable, but twice as emotionally compromised; Dale spent half the season unspooling over his personal life and helped Paul cover a killing; Charlie was fucking gas lighting her boyfriend and almost got everyone killed screwing with his mind; Paul was actually the least insane this season despite playing savior to the widow of his victim, but is still the bastard who ran a fucking cartel and almost killed Mike when he thought he knew about Badillo.

 

Holy shit! These people shouldn't be allowed walk around without supervision, let alone carry guns.

Edited September 14, 2014 by RachelKM

[dirtydi]

Yeah, I was reading over at TV guide.com and they are ripping this episode and season, a new one.  Deservedly so. What was that?  I'm not a really a big fan of Mike, but he didn't deserve that from Paige.

[WasntMe]

This...

WTF was that shit? 

 

and this.

 

I've never seen a show implode from suck right before my very eyes like this one has. 

 

I had to force myself to watch it and then just... I don't even know. I don't even know what else to say except what everybody else said.  Gah.

[RachelKM]

I had to force myself to watch it and then just... I don't even know. I don't even know what else to say except what everybody else said.  Gah.

I know the feeling. The last two episodes sat on my DVR for a bit before I could bring myself to watch them.  

[Irishmaple]

You did better than me.  I bailed two weeks ago.  The show was never flawless but I really enjoyed the first season.  I just can't figure out how the second could go so badly off the rails.  It's like TPTB want to get cancelled.  There's no excuse for the crap they put on screen this season.

[RachelKM]

Is it better?  I wish I had bailed around the 3rd or 4th episode of the season as soon as it became clear that DJ, Mike and Paige were all going south (it took longer for Johnny and Charlie and Paul was already  a psycho, so).

Edited September 16, 2014 by RachelKM

[Beezella]

I so don't understand. Are there different writers from the first season? Different creative people, producers, showrunners, whatever? Or was this all a misguided attempt to be edgy? Such a fail.

[Lady Calypso]

Ok, so I get what they were trying to do with Mike all season (still a new, young, inexperienced agent whose only experience is through the field so he was trying to prove himself by doing everything as good as he can). Ok, well, not really but I can see, with his only role model being Briggs, why he went all crazy. But what the hell's the matter with the rest of them?! They have more experience than Mike and they screwed up more than he did! Paige disappoints me the most, with her obsession with one girl. She couldn't care less about the other girls, which is really sad. Johnny....well, that boy just got in over his head with a freaking triangle. DJ, well, he at least got his head screwed on relatively straight by this finale. As for the other two? I have no words for what they were doing.

 

I remember pre-season, Aaron Tveit said that he told the producers that he was fine if they made him into an asshole if it fit the story, and an asshole they did make. The thing is, as much as I detested Mike's actions, I can still see him as a good guy just trying to do the right thing but having crappy role models along the way. He didn't even deserve what Paige did to him. If she thinks him covering up a murder is wrong, she just got him killed! Well, technically killed right now! 

 

This season blows. Sorry Mike, but you are no leader. I much preferred watching him actually be good at something and not make too many mistakes. This season is definitely the season of obsession. I'll only tune in to next season's premiere, if it even gets picked back up, only to see what Mike does to Paige when he finds out she got him killed by a psycho cop.

[StalkerNinja]

Graceland Renewed for Season 3

[BindsTheTuna]

Let's try this shit again. #gluttonforpunishment

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Haha, perfect hashtag. It's hard to believe this is only the third season because I feel like I've been dread watching this for much longer.

 

Episode description:

Briggs takes part in a high-risk undercover operation involving the Armenian Mafia.

[Lady Calypso]

Well...I liked this episode more than I liked most of last season, to be honest. It felt more put together and less jumbled. Maybe because everyone was kind of working together. Well, except for Johnny, who's still in cahoots with Carlito to save his girlfriend from last season...and now giving Sid a ride? To where? It better to be to a damn prison, but probably not. Johnny's probably pretending to be on his side so they can get a confession at the end of the season.

 

Paige has resigned, but will be sticking around until Sid's arrested? So...that'll give her plenty of time to change her mind.

 

Man, Mike is a much better person than I would be. I applaud him for being the better person and forgiving Paige. He understands that people make mistakes, like he has. And he doesn't want anyone blaming Paige for his almost death. Good for him. I like him much more than last season. He's finally back on track. Who knew it almost took a near death experience to make him really likeable again? Though...weird scene with Mike and Briggs in his hospital room, near the end of it. Was it just my television screen, or did it seem that his eyes glowed a little bit, or I guess they dilated when he got more morphine? 

 

This show is pretty, but sometimes the lighting is too much, especially with the Mexico scenes. 

 

Briggs is being blackmailed to work undercover with some high end guy who likes to harvest organs and probably would have killed that cop himself. Great. But good for him for being honest with his team for once.

 

Ultimately, a much better premiere than a lot of the episodes from last season. But I actually would be fine if the show was cancelled after this season. Season 1 was amazing, but season 2 was utter crap. Season 3 I hope is going to be better.

[BindsTheTuna]

Hey, it didn't suck!

 

Bearded Aaron Tveit is the best Aaron Tveit. I hope they don't go down the addiction route, which is what I thought the weird eye thingy was.

[portfino]

 

Man, Mike is a much better person than I would be. I applaud him for being the better person and forgiving Paige. He understands that people make mistakes, like he has. And he doesn't want anyone blaming Paige for his almost death. Good for him. I like him much more than last season

That was the most unrealistic thing on TV in 2015, including the dragons on Game of Thrones. An attempt to get the audience to forgive Paige.

 

Briggs was terrible as usual. The only way I will continue to watch this show is if I hear that they've turned his incompetence and hypocrisy into the real Big Bad.

[Lady Calypso]

Hey, it didn't suck!

 

Bearded Aaron Tveit is the best Aaron Tveit. I hope they don't go down the addiction route, which is what I thought the weird eye thingy was.

 

I agree with this statement. Bearded Aaron Tveit is definitely hot. I also agree with that

though, judging by the third episode's description and an interview Aaron did recently, it looks like they are.

. 

 

That was the most unrealistic thing on TV in 2015, including the dragons on Game of Thrones. An attempt to get the audience to forgive Paige.

 

 

I don't know if it's the most unrealistic thing, but it is up there. I didn't enjoy it that much, but I think with his recent near death experience, it put a lot of things in perspective for Mike. I guess it just made him be a more forgiving person and I don't think I would have liked seeing angry, bitter Mike at Paige for a whole season. Briggs seems to have that role covered, as does Paige herself. I think most people wouldn't have forgiven her, but hey, this is television and I don't mind them going a different route if it means something different and potentially more interesting. I don't forgive Paige, but I acknowledge her guilt and remorse and can see that she's heavily affected by her choices and was willing to risk her life to put Sid away. 

 

Also...now that I'm thinking about it because of the tape coming back up, does anyone know about Briggs being Odin? I know they didn't know by the end of season 1, but I can't remember if any of them found out in season 2. 

[tomatoflyer]

I liked it. It felt like a course correction from season 2. Besides Johnny's girlfriend, I'm already feeling this season's arc more interesting. I missed likeable Mike - it was nice seeing him again. Charlie still has the cheesiest lines.

[RachelKM]

It was ...better... but I'm still gun shy.  And was that Johnny driving Sid at the end?

[ParadoxLost]

I doubt I'll be watching again unless I really can't find anything to watch.  I tuned in to see how they were going to handle Mike's attempted murder and resurrection.  Not a fan.  Last season was pointless and Mike is going to become a drug addict,  Yea! Not.

 

I was expecting Briggs to hide Mike and let even the roommates think he was dead.  Mike would help out Briggs with undercover until the season arc with Sid was sorted out.  I naively didn't expect them to expect me to ignore all that stuff.  So, last season Mike had to go into hiding because Sid framed him for mass murder.  This season, the FBI just believes Mike but without enough corroborating evidence to arrest Sid instead of continuing the investigation.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Briggs tries to keep control of Ari Adamian while Charlie struggles with the decision to terminate her pregnancy.

 

Promo:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2ExrzJ3nC4

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Briggs has done a lot of terrible things (as he admitted to his housemates in this episode) but now we finally see where the line is for him. All the shady shit we learned about him in S1 was okay in his book, but cutting out a guy's kidney is too much. Good to know.

 

I agree that Mike looks a lot hotter with the scruff. When his face came out of the MRI machine, I thought hey, who's the hot new guy? It took me a second to realize it was Mike.

 

I kind of love that Jakes was so annoyed by the house being a mess. Yes, there is a lot of crap going on but that's why you want to come home to a house that isn't messy and full of chaos!

[33kaitykaity]

I guess maybe I'm easy, but I enjoyed the stuffing out of that.  Forgiveness and stuff even!  Finally something I know I can watch, not hey, I'll try this, no, that sucked, and so on.  

[ElectricBoogaloo]

While Mike's visions and addiction to pain medications start affecting his ability to function in the field, Briggs coaxes a former FBI agent out of retirement to help take down Ari.

 

Promo:

[ElectricBoogaloo]

So we're really going to do this Mike get addicted to his pain meds storyline?

 

When Briggs told Charlie that she's going to be a mother so she should start acting like it, I was like whoa, okay, well you're about to be a father so why don't you start acting like it? I wish she had gone through with the abortion. I don't see the point in letting him think that she did. Is she going to tell him that she's going undercover for the next nine months and then give the baby up for adoption?

 

I know this sounds mean, but I don't care about Paige's pain.

 

What is this retcon with Briggs suddenly having a conscience? So it was okay for him to do all kinds of crazy crap the first season and now he's clutching his pearls about dangling a guy off the side of a bridge? I mean, no, it's not nice (and clearly Ari is nuts) but Briggs is acting like he hasn't done thing just as bad or worse.

 

Johnny is totally off the rails. Dale is the only one sane, rational one left in that house.

Edited July 3, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Lady Calypso]

Yep, I called a lot of that happening. Johnny/Sid working together so he can save his girlfriend, Charlie having to choose between her baby and her job (though she conveniently might have found a way for both), Mike being addicted to pain meds, Paige not wanting her award.

 

Johnny, you've gone so far off the rails with one girl, it's not even funny. He's now killed Sid and is still working for Carlito. All because of a girl, mind you. It's the same thing that got me hating Paige last season. At least now I feel bad for her.

 

So, Charlie doesn't go through with the abortion, but tells Briggs that she did just so she can go on her one last mission. Clearly this is not going to end well, and clearly Charlie will do something stupid to get her and her baby in serious trouble. I was proud of her for going to the abortion clinic to begin with; she and Briggs do not seem ready for a child and it's ok to admit that. So for the somewhat cliched ending? I was not happy.

 

Goddamnit, Mike. I like you more than last season, but don't do anything stupid. Nope, too late. But I like this Mike, who is clearly not a leader (demonstrated by his meeting with Agent Jackass) but is trying to be there for people. 

 

Jakes, you're the last sane one in that house. Please stay that way!

 

Briggs is....I don't know, he's toned down a LOT since the first season. He's now not willing to do these shady things because it'll implicate him and the Bureau will know it? Man, it seems like he's worried because they know he'll be doing these shady things and can surely pin things on him, not because he actually cares about the actions he does. Or maybe he does care and it's just a somewhat retcon from the first season. Either way, Briggs is no Odin anymore. 

 

This season is still heaps better than last season, but I'm worried about all the characters. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

There has only been a handful of TV regulars who have had abortions, to the best of my knowledge. I shouldn't have been surprised that Charlie wasn't among them. That she apparently wanted to mislead Briggs about whether or not she had an abortion is ridiculous.

 

I'm getting a little tired of these undercover folks having not realized that they are just causing major problems for themselves and the house by withholding key information or straight-up lying to one another.

Also boo to rescuing Lucia and not taking her with when trying to take down Carlito. 

Edited July 6, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[ElectricBoogaloo]

When Ari Adamian has no recollection of his actions, Briggs helps the Armenian gangster piece together the disturbing details of his lost night.

 

Promo:

[luckyroll3]

Johnny is an idiot. He should have put a bullet in Carlito's head when he had the chance.

So do your eyes flash when you take oxy or is Mike possessed by a spirit that took a ride back from his trip to the afterlife. <eyeroll> That did not happen when Briggs or Charlie were getting high.

Can we change the show to just following Ari around doing crazy as shit? I think I would enjoy that show more.

[Madding crowd]

No post yet on this episode. I like the actors in the show but I often have a hard time keeping up with what everyone is doing. Does anyone else have that problem? I get the big pictures, but when I look at each scene, I am often confused as to what is going on. Not really invested in seeing Mike addicted to pain pills and as someone who took pain pills for a back injury, my eyes never flashed, and I never felt any kind of euphoria. Mike doesn't seem to be taking large amounts of the drug, so his reactions are kind of heavy handed.

 

I dislike Page for trying to have Mike killed, and the others seem very unprofessional even for undercover FBI.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I really hate that tv cliche where someone says he is SO BUSY that he can't spare one whole minute to let another character fill him in on something important. If Briggs had just let Johnny tell him what was going on instead of blowing him off, would that have made any difference?  Maybe, maybe not. But the point is more that no matter how freaking busy you are, you probably have time to let your coworker/friend/housemate tell you something important. If you have time to eat, shower, poop, etc. then you can spare five minutes to let someone who is clearly upset and begging you to let him tell you something explain what he is so keyed up about.

 

And what exactly is going to happen when Johnny shows up with Jakes? Crazy Carlito won't mind at all? I mean, it was nice and all of Jakes to offer to go with Johnny (which makes sense since Jakes is currently the only person in the house who doesn't have his head up his own ass) but how much is he going to help since Johnny can pilot the boat by himself? I just hope Carlito doesn't go batshit crazy when he sees Jakes and accuse Johnny of trying to bring in an extra person to somehow rescue his girlfriend. He has shot people for less.

[Lady Calypso]

I agree. All Johnny had to do was take Briggs aside for a MINUTE and fill him in. But apparently, his own mission was so important that a conversation couldn't happen. Johnny literally said it couldn't wait, and Briggs just dismisses it and asks Johnny for help.

 

So, I guess Johnny's the one this season to go off the rails. First Briggs, then Paige and now Johnny. Yeah, having Jakes along isn't going to end in disaster. Oh, no way. But I'm glad Jakes did decide to stick with Johnny, knowing something was wrong. That was good of him.

 

Mike's pain killer addiction? Is it really that eurphoric that he got hooked on them to the point where he can't go without them? I mean, I know he was in the hospital for, like, three weeks, but still! I swear though, if Mike's afterlife dream is somehow the key to stop Carlito, I'm gonna break something. I HATE that cliche more than anything, especially in a show that is not supernatural in any sense. 

 

I do want Paige gone still, but I do like where they've taken her. She clearly hasn't forgiven herself, and I don't think she ever truly will. Which makes sense because she did get Mike killed for six minutes. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I swear though, if Mike's afterlife dream is somehow the key to stop Carlito, I'm gonna break something. I HATE that cliche more than anything, especially in a show that is not supernatural in any sense.

Ugh, I totally agree. It's one thing to do that on a supernatural show with magic, ghosts, vampires, etc. but on a show like this? No. It just comes off as hokey and ridiculous.

 

Unless Briggs was planning to use a transporter beam to get to The Mission, why couldn't he have let Johnny talk to him in the car on the way? Or while he was upstairs getting geared up and putting on his bulletproof vest?

[catrice2]

I was excited for this show, but now I have a hard time following. Don't know what is going on with Charlie and the criminal, and  think Mike's drug addiction story was unnecessary and cliche. I get it with EVERY undercover show I've ever seen....they can't maintain healthy romantic relationships, check....they get lost in the "character" they are playing...check.....they sleep with co worker or some "skell," (usually a prostitute or something) to maintain their cover ....check...and/or they are hooked on drugs or alcohol...check, check, check, check......Briggs, Charlie, Jakes and Mike.  I get it, I really, really do! 

 

Both Sid and Carlito have exceeded their interesting date...so glad Sid is gone...and I am not interested in the Briggs redemption story.  The only thing worse than that will be watching Paige redeem herself...which means naturally she will be the one to "save" Mike.

[Lady Calypso]

I found myself liking the set up of the episode. The black and white and red flashbacks was actually kind of neat to see. It actually was a pretty good episode, overall. Most of the focus on Briggs and Ari, with the flashbacks of the team helping to set up the plan.

 

But come on, who didn't call the undercover agent getting caught and killed? And now Briggs is in big trouble for his lies to Ari. Damn, one tiny misstep. If they had only put the lit match in the right hand.....I mean the left hand. 

[Shriekingeel]

I wanted the Armenian mob boss to take some "unguent" from the convenience store.

[methodwriter85]

I really hate abortion fakeouts like that. Either have the balls to go through with it, or don't do it all.

 

It's really been less than three months between the time that Charlie found out she was pregnant and currently? Damn.

[Turtle]

I really like this show and I don't even know why- when you break it down to its individual parts, I hate it. Paige, Johnny, and Charlie all annoy me to no end, I don't understand why Briggs isn't serving a half dozen life sentences. There is no way a person goes from one prescription of oxy while in severe pain to skulking around street corners in a hoodie looking to score pills in the course of, what, two days? And like others, I am frequently confused about all these storylines especially Johnny's girlfriend and especially especially why Briggs robbed her.

Yet, somehow, I enjoy watching it. It's a mystery.