All Episodes Talk: Celebrating Diversity

[ClareWalks]

Rachel is adorable. Her enthusiasm for her brother and his fiance is so sweet to see. I was glad her mom had that talk with her, though, because she was definitely coming on strong. Sean is annoying to me, sorry...he is way too much of a "ladies man" and it would be very tedious to be around, I think. Telling Rachel he didn't want a DS girlfriend might have been his way of letting her down easy, but maybe he really meant it in that moment. I'm not sure that wanting a "typical" girlfriend (as they said on the show...is that a common way to refer to non-DS people? I am ignorant) is going to work out for him, mostly because his maturity level is so low that there would be an inequality there that is not usually conducive to romance. Megan wanting a baby...yikes. I feel terrible for Megan's mom because she would probably be the one raising that kid. We haven't heard much from Megan about it but I get the sense that she has no clue what raising a child entails, and just thinks they're cute or something. I do wonder if Megan's mom would get her a pet, a cat is low maintenance and might be a good "starter" if Megan wanted to care for and mother something cuddly.

[camom]

ClareWalks, in the disability community it is common to use the word "typical" when referring to people without disabilities.  People think it's better than saying "normal" because that indicates that those with disabilities are abnormal.  This is true for all disabilities, not just DS.

 

I agree about Sean.  He's another one who seems to have been made the center of his parents' world and assumes he is the center of everyone's world.  

[configdotsys]

My least favorite is Megan's mom.  If Megan didn't have DS, I have a feeling her mom would want to go clubbing with her and would flirt with her male friends.  I could be completely wrong, but that's the impression I get.

 

You articulated my vibe of Megan's mom perfectly. I completely get that vibe about her too.

[Bastet]

Those conversations about boundaries Sean's dad claims to be having with him?  Need to happen more often.  Rachel is just as desperate for a partner, but she manages to speak of men as people, rather than objects, and asks their permission before touching them.  Sean is just seven kinds of inappropriate.

 

I really felt for Megan's mom at the group meeting, because right before she said she's the only one sitting there alone I had mentally noted she was the only one without a partner (and marveled that it was so -- most marriages don't last, and I would think those that result in a special needs child would have worse odds than the average, not better).  Her emotion that Megan's support would come from the system rather than family was moving.  I also felt for John's sisters.  It's great that they regard it as a given they'll take care of John after their parents die, but I'm also really glad there are two of them to split that between.

 

I'm always amazed how many people, especially people with kids, leave estate planning until later in life, so I shouldn't be so skeptical that these parents don't already have plans in place, but still ... I really hope this was for the show and they were talking about specifics in that meeting, not the general concept of "Gee, I should figure out who's going to care for my child and how."  And with someone talking about having a trust already established, I think that was the case -- more about specific documents to guide and instruct those who'll be helping these people manage their lives when the parents are gone than the need to provide, period.

[camom]

I had to laugh at Sean and the girl at the convention (Devon?)  After the kiss at the pool, she said, "You can go now."  But I agree, Bastet, he is all kinds of inappropriate.  I understand that he wants a girlfriend, just like any young man would.  He simply doesn't have the social skills to go about it in a good way.  I thought Megan was quite good in how she handled him.  And, it's got to be said, Sean's constant eyebrow raising is annoying.

 

 

Tonight I missed seeing more of Christina, was OK with not seeing much of Elena.  

[configdotsys]

I'm not a huge fan of John, but I love his family, especially Mom.

 

The whole Meganology thing is something I just have no interest in. There is something about Megan that rubs me the wrong way. I can't put my finger on it. Her whole storyline feels manufactured to me.

 

I love Steven. What a terrific guy he is.

 

Hooray for only a very small dose of Elena this week. 

 

Sean. Inappropriate to the max. 

[Trampolina]

It made me feel bad thinking of Rachel watching this at home and seeing Sean attempt to mac on two young women with down syndrome after he turned her down and said he wanted a typical girlfriend. Also, somebody needs to tell him that the eyebrow thing isn't cute.

I like that Megan's mom is trying to help Megan become independent but I don't want her to get too excited about the clothing line. Success in the online clothing industry is an extreme long shot.

[camom]

 

I am not sure how I feel about the college classes either.

 

Megan going to college is kind of pie in the sky thinking.  There are some wonderful college programs that are geared to people with developmental disabilities.  They help the students learn to live independently.  (I think Sean could benefit from such a program.)  And some take "regular" college classes.  It's pretty rare for someone with DS to go to college just like any other student.  And getting into a program like Chapman's film school is extremely competitive and simply isn't going to happen for Megan.  

Edited December 30, 2015 by camom

[Bastet]

I thought the eyebrow thing was involuntary, like a nervous tic or something.  If he's doing that on purpose as part of his "ladies' man" persona ... yuck.

[Cherrio]

I guess because this is a reality show , they are focusing on entertaining type storylines like Meghan, her business hopes, all of their romantic hopes and the rest.

        I know very little about DS, but I agree with other posters that these dreams are totally unrealistic and damaging to each of them.  

        It seems that one facet of DS is that they are all extremely emotionally immature and have the potential to become out of control both verbally and physically. I think we are not seeing Sean and John when they melt down. We see the beginning of it, then it seems the rest is not filmed, then we see a manufactured cool down.

                      I would still watch and would rather see a show where all they concentrate on is teaching these young adults how to be independent , live in a group home and aim towards a job they could handle.  Imo, a few of them might not be able to handle any type of job or independence.

            Sean was extremely inappropriate and disturbing, especially with the woman and her boyfriend.     I am curious as to how this is dealt with irl.   Are DS able to comprehend to the point in a situation like this and stop this kind of behavior?    All we saw was him running outside to call his mother and the father talking about it in a rather light hearted and chuckling way.

               I also was disturbed by John's mother asking her daughters to care for John.   I understand why they would say yes, but I doubt either of them want to. I would never ask one of my children to assume care of their disabled sibling. Thats just me though.

[cooksdelight]

I thought the eyebrow thing was involuntary, like a nervous tic or something.  If he's doing that on purpose as part of his "ladies' man" persona ... yuck.

I think it's involuntary since he does it pretty much all the time. He needs some counseling regarding his quest for many girlfriends, and inappropriate behavior.

[sunsheyen]

I was thinking that Sean's parents need to talk to Rachel's parents and get tips on how to teach appropriate behavior and contact. It seems that he hasn't had much "reeling in" of his behaviors. I got this vibe in their initial talk about moving a few episodes when he refused to hear anything they said and talked over them and the parents just let it go. Maybe they gave him too much leeway as a child and now don't know how to turn it around? I think he does the eyebrow thing on purpose when he wiggles them. But either way, he gives off creepy vibes. 

 

An inherent grasp of those social cues and norms may not come as naturally to him because of DS, but they seem to be teachable based on watching Rachel and her interactions with others. In addition, Parth seemed fine with expressing that certain touches made him feel uncomfortable, so I doubt that the concepts are things that Sean can't grasp. It's more that he doesn't want to hear anything that's not what Sean wants to hear, IMO.

 

I hope we get a Steven centered episode as it seems that's the sort of track the show has been following. Each episode has one or two people as their main story. He seems cool. I wouldn't mind seeing more of Cristina too.

[Cherrio]

I was thinking that Sean's parents need to talk to Rachel's parents and get tips on how to teach appropriate behavior and contact. It seems that he hasn't had much "reeling in" of his behaviors. I got this vibe in their initial talk about moving a few episodes when he refused to hear anything they said and talked over them and the parents just let it go. Maybe they gave him too much leeway as a child and now don't know how to turn it around? I think he does the eyebrow thing on purpose when he wiggles them. But either way, he gives off creepy vibes. 

 

An inherent grasp of those social cues and norms may not come as naturally to him because of DS, but they seem to be teachable based on watching Rachel and her interactions with others. In addition, Parth seemed fine with expressing that certain touches made him feel uncomfortable, so I doubt that the concepts are things that Sean can't grasp. It's more that he doesn't want to hear anything that's not what Sean wants to hear, IMO.

 

I hope we get a Steven centered episode as it seems that's the sort of track the show has been following. Each episode has one or two people as their main story. He seems cool. I wouldn't mind seeing more of Cristina too.

I tend to agree with you that Sean's parents may of been too lax with Sean. I just did not want to assume something. But bringing up Parth was a great example of how he instantly was able to express himself and put a stop to Rachel.  And more important Rachel stopped.

             Sean's behavior could get him in trouble even he isn't taught to stop.   I would place him in a group home where he could learn instead of his own apartment. I do not think he is capable of living on his own.

[Chicago85]

Just echoing what others have said about Sean's inappropriate behavior. His parents are aware of it but they seem to chuckle along with or even perpetuate his behaviors with comments (his mom saying "it's your dream! 2 babes!" and taking a picture). This behavior should have been nipped in the bud years ago because now he thinks it's funny the way his parents kind of laugh along with him. It could really become a more serious problem to be honest.

I'm curious as to where Megan's mom is getting the funds to move them to LA, catapult a fashion line, and seemingly not have a job. Not being catty but I'm wondering if her ex is well off or if her parents are. They seem to be very well off for a single mom of a child with a disability.

[nlkm9]

I'm curious as to where Megan's mom is getting the funds to move them to LA, catapult a fashion line, and seemingly not have a job. Not being catty but I'm wondering if her ex is well off or if her parents are. They seem to be very well off for a single mom of a child with a disability.

 

I was wondering that too...they moved into a residence inn, which is not cheap, and her mom doesnt seem to work. I wish I could understand why I dislike megan's mom so much--because she clearly seems to love her daughter....

[camom]

Thinking back to Sean applying for a job at the pizza parlor.  I can't imagine him lasting long at any job where he has to interact with the public because he would come on to all the female customers.  Boundaries and appropriate behavior can be taught to people with DS, but it takes a lot of time and patience for someone like Sean.  I think the eyebrow thing started as cute and now he does it without even thinking.  

 

I assumed that Megan's mom is a teacher since in the first episode she said they could try out L.A. during the summer.  But I wonder, too, how she is financing a summer in L.A. while obviously still having to pay for her house in Colorado.

 

I wasn't bothered by John's mom's talk with her daughters.  She didn't say she expected them to take him in, she said they needed to talk about what would happen to John when his parents aren't around any more.  It is a common concern for parents of disabled adults.  Even if he lived in a group home, there should be someone looking out for him to make sure he is well taken care of and not taken advantage of.  Personally, I never told my other children that they would be responsible for their sister, but, fortunately, they are willing to do so if and when the need arises.

[configdotsys]

Another thing that disturbed me about Sean was when he was at the pool and hanging out with Devon he said "Bye, Girlfriend." I don't know if it is because of his disability but there was something extremely impersonal and I dare say callous when he referred to her using a generic term rather than treating her like a person and using her name. I am still irritated by his behavior on the show last night so maybe I am being too picky but for someone who so desperately wants a girlfriend, I can see him leaving the poolside, talking to another girl, calling her "girlfriend" and not having any sort of feeling that what he was doing is just not okay.

 

The poster above who said that they believe we are not seeing meltdowns and only manufactured cool downs was really spot on with regard to last night's show. Sean was very arrogant at the table telling Sean 2 that he essentially did not care that Sean 2 was in any way upset about the Facebook messages and such. Then he got pissed, went outside to call his mother and out of nowhere he was back inside again, calm and said he would change his ways. Something was edited out there because that scene was very confusing.

[Cherrio]

camom,

  Thanks for the insight on being the parent of a disabled child.   I didn't mean to imply what John's mom did was wrong, just not something I would ever do. I should of added that I can't imagine the worry and fears, plus that every family has to make the right decision for them.

                I guess I am also bothered by John's family encouraging a career that will never happen.  If it is just a storyline, its even worse because I don't think John is capable of understanding it's not real.

          I would much rather see him learning to live at a group home and learning how to work at a real job he can handle.  Swimming lessons are a must too. With bad decision making skills and lack of impulse control, he should really know how to swim.

[pandora spocks]

I wish I could understand why I dislike megan's mom so much--because she clearly seems to love her daughter....

 

To me, I think Megan's mom is setting Megan up for failure (even if it's well-intentioned).  All good parents want their kids to succeed but, in her mom's case, she is encouraging Megan to aspire for goals that's beyond her reach.  When the show first started, Megan wanted to be a film producer, was an inspirational speaker, and sold online clothing on the side. Now Megan had added film director to the mix and wants to go to film school.  Megan's mom needs to encourage just one goal that's achievable for her daughter.  Anything more than that is doing a disservice to Megan. 

 

This is off the subject but the angled close ups of the young people before commercials make them look like characters in a Kubrick film. 

[cooksdelight]

The thing that worries me about Sean is that he may one day be hitting on a girl, and her boyfriend decides to hit back.

[Zanne]

This behavior should have been nipped in the bud years ago because now he thinks it's funny the way his parents kind of laugh along with him. It could really become a more serious problem to be honest.

 

       

I've taught children with special needs for several years, and this show has brought up several issues that I've had to deal with (or been forbidden to deal with) in my classroom. Many people have mentioned Sean's eyebrow quirk, as well as other behaviors that are viewed as inappropriate. I see this kind of thing develop in my population because parents consider it cute when their kids do certain things at a young age. Maybe Sean's eyebrow thing developed after watching Home Alone (it definitely reminds me of that) and calling women "babes" was from something else he saw. The problem is what is considered cute in a 6-year-old is far less cute when that kid hits thirteen, or sixteen, or twenty. Parents often don't recognize this and excuse it because their child has a disability, when if it had been addressed when they were younger, it would be far less of an issue when it hits the point of being a social problem. I have current issues in my classroom I wish I could address with the parent(s), but have been told by administration that it's outside my scope as teacher.

 

Another issue I see is the extreme closeness between the parent(s) and child. I see this mostly with Megan and her mother, where it seems to me that they've been in each other's pockets their entire lives. While it seems ideal to be best friends with one's child, it can lead to socialization or even just adaptive issues because in some cases, the child literally cannot do anything without the parent present. I don't see this as much with Megan, who seems very socially capable, but I do think some of the ways in which Megan approaches things comes from having Mom as BFF rather than same age peers. I once had a conversation with a student's family regarding taking a step back to help with independence and Mom called the office to complain about how it was none of my concern. I did not get in trouble because the entire office agreed that something needed to be said, but you can see how sometimes families cannot take that step back to see things from a clearer perspective. They want the best for their child, even if it appears from the outside to be a mistake.

 

From what I've seen on the show, I think these families have raised some wonderful children. Yes, some expectations are high, and some may not be high enough, but it's wonderful to see the families are so supportive of their children with special needs. I've seen families who love their children, but don't expect much from them because they happen to have a disability, so they don't push them to be the best person/student/citizen they can be.

Edited December 31, 2015 by Zanne

[Chicago85]

Zanne I am giving your post a resounding "Amen!"

I mentioned it previously in the thread but I have worked with students in the DS population (as well as other disabilities) for 6 years now and I feel like I have seen it all regarding parents. Like one mother who swears up and down her daughter can read and will attend college one day. Meanwhile at school her daughter can't stop stimming long enough to engage in conversation or get from Point a to Point b without adult supervision. Megan's mom kind of reminds me of that in the way that yeah her daughter is WAY higher functioning than my student who has DS but gosh, let's put some goals in attainable reach here. I can see some success with an online clothing line for a fun hobby but producing a movie? Yeesh. I'm all about going for your dreams but a typical person rarely breaks into the biz.

Also in agreement with being treated as a perpetual 6 yo which can lead to problems as a young adult. Yes DS typically function at a lower maturity level but that doesn't mean they can't be taught what is appropriate or inappropriate. DS has a wide variety of mental impairments but let me tell you, an 18 yo DS student of mine doesn't know her colors or letters or shapes, but the minute someone gets in her personal space, she lets them have it. If she can be taught personal space then Sean should KNOW what personal space is because he should have been taught it years ago.

[gunderda]

Sean doesn't know how to take no for an answer which may eventually turn into a scary situation for the other person and possibly him. 

There was a previous episode where the red head was really boy crazy and asking all her friends if they wanted to be her boyfriend but she seemed to understand some sort of boundary.  She was quick to ask them to date her but was always asking if what she did was ok and if they said no then she backed off (even though then her feelings were hurt). 

[ClareWalks]

I was really annoyed with the way Other Sean and Hillary handled Sean's obnoxious come-ons. It would have been nice if Hillary had handled it herself, She could have said "I'm flattered that you have a crush on me, but your behavior makes me uncomfortable and I just want to be friends." Instead, it was Other Sean basically saying "hands off my girlfriend, because she's MY girlfriend," which only reinforces Sean's opinion of "babes" as basically being objects and property.

[Chicago85]

I was really annoyed with the way Other Sean and Hillary handled Sean's obnoxious come-ons. It would have been nice if Hillary had handled it herself, She could have said "I'm flattered that you have a crush on me, but your behavior makes me uncomfortable and I just want to be friends." Instead, it was Other Sean basically saying "hands off my girlfriend, because she's MY girlfriend," which only reinforces Sean's opinion of "babes" as basically being objects and property.

I could see that. But I could also see Hillary not being comfortable enough addressing the issue because maybe she doesn't know how to have that conversation with someone who has cognitive disabilities. Maybe Other Sean knows him better and knows how to "handle" him. And ,of course, Other Sean being the confronter could have been suggested for the sake of reality TV

[ClareWalks]

I could see that. But I could also see Hillary not being comfortable enough addressing the issue because maybe she doesn't know how to have that conversation with someone who has cognitive disabilities. Maybe Other Sean knows him better and knows how to "handle" him. And ,of course, Other Sean being the confronter could have been suggested for the sake of reality TV

 

Very good points! I'm sure there is more backstory than we saw. I just thought maybe she should have spoken at some point to make it clear that it wasn't okay with HER, either. Or Other Sean could have said "it makes Hillary uncomfortable, and it makes me uncomfortable" if he wanted to do all the talking.

[camom]

One thing I really like about this show is that they are showing the unique personalities of everyone involved.  People often lump all people with Down syndrome together -- they're all so sweet, they're all childlike, etc.  We are seeing that they are individuals, flaws and all.

[Bajovane]

I was very uncomfortable for Sean's situation.  Some guys will not take it too well at all with Sean's flirting with their girlfriends - regardless whether she would reciprocate or not.  He definitely needs to learn boundaries.

I also felt it was getting into the borderline exploitation showing him with his new girlfriend in Arizona.  I am not comfortable with showing his initial getting to know a girl/first kiss situation.  That's something that should remain private.

As for John's situation - I didn't see his Mom expecting the sisters to take him in.  In my own family's case, my Uncle Edward was special needs - possible developmental delays, cerebral palsy - born in 1930 - he never had any schooling.  There was no way he could have lived independently, so after my grandparents passed away, my uncle lived with each sibling (four) for part of the year.  They divided up the year by quarters and each took turns which part of the year they would have him.  It worked out well enough until my father died, and his youngest sister moved to New Mexico.  Eventually, he moved to NM as well and lived with my aunt full-time.  She never would have had it any other way. 

I know my grandmother was "encouraged" to put my uncle in an institution when he was a baby - but there was no way she would have done that.  As my hometown had a "home for the feeble-minded" (that was what it was actually called!) - she knew the living conditions.  No way.  Thank the heavens that isn't the situation any more.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Bajovane

[bourbon]

Very interesting to hear from some teachers. I taught special ed for a couple of years about a decade ago, and I found that most parents fell into two groups: the group that could not accept that their child was not going to go to college and hold a 9 to 5 job and would complain to the administration if there were any suggestion otherwise. And the group that had no interest in setting goals for their child, treated school like a free babysitting service, and did absolutely no work with their children at home. I had a conference with one mom where we (the teachers) expressed concern about the lack of progress in developmental things like getting dressed, fork skills, recognizing boundaries, etc., and the mom said we were the "experts" and that was our job to teach all those things. (The kids were awesome. The parents were the reason I changed careers.)

 

The parents on this show seem an interesting mix. If you take Sean's parents, they're obviously encouraging him to go out on his own to some degree, but on the other hand, they're not doing him any favors infantalizing him by encouraging the "ladies' man" persona. It's cute when it's a 6 year old, because 6 year olds are sexually non-threatening with the "hey babes" and eyebrow waggling. Sean's a grown man with a man's body and man's desires -- he just isn't equipped with the skills to handle those things. 

 

I can't decide about Megan's mom. They seem very close and loving, but it borders on unhealthy to me. It was interesting how she approached the topic of not having kids with Megan. When she was talking to Beatriz, she was saying how she didn't think Megan should have kids because she was not mature enough to handle it and the mom didn't want to end up raising the child. That is all understandable and reasonable, but when she spoke with Megan about it, she phrased it in terms of Megan being too busy with her career to have a child. It might seem gentler and less painful for Megan to hear it on that level, but it doesn't seem to be helpful to Megan to talk in terms of giving up one dream in favor of a dream that is probably equally unreasonable. 

[auntjess]

I agree with much of what's been said here, about Sean and Megan and her mom.

Sean MUST be taught boundaries, and when he can and can't initiate contact with a woman.
Would he always take a "no" well, or might he get angry and act out some time.
I'm sorry for Devon, because I don't see Sean having any feelings for her in particular, just for a "girlfriend."

Megan and her mom seem all sorts of delusional.  I looked at the Megology website, and it offers tie-dyed items, but nothing unique.
She does seem higher-functioning than some of the others, but film production seems like a demanding and cutthroat career, at least from how it sounds from the outside.

I think John has a lot more chance to find a place (clubs?) as a rapper, than Megan.
I've known several siblings who took on care of a sister or brother, just as a natural thing.
I'd bet John's family discussed this a long time ago.
I want to see more of Steven.

[goodolmom]

Megan does seem to have some success and exposure before the show.  http://megology.com/

[Bastet]

Watching Speedy get left behind, I almost quit the episode before it really got started, but I continued on.

 

The moms getting together was the kind of staged crap I hate in "reality" TV, but it worked okay here.  I found myself surprised so few had undergone prenatal testing, so I'm off to research the history of amnio to see if it's a more recent development than I thought.  I'm glad no one - that made air, anyway - spouted off condemnation of women who'd opt to abort.

 

I've been trying to figure out where Megan and her mom are staying; footage at their place when they were around the fire with the building's gym in the background looked like a place in Glendale, but the pool scenes didn't, plus I'd assume they'd take a place closer to the center's location.  But the grocery shopping trip in tonight's episode was in Burbank.  It's a great market, run by great people, so it was probably just chosen by virtue of them being open to filming.

 

John's family financially supporting him while he pursues his music annoys me every bit as much as it does with any other person with zero chance of making it, but whatever.  Hearing him talk about his volunteer position as if it was a means of supporting himself, though ... come on.  I just don't know where the proper line to be drawn is with supporting his dreams and refusing to coddle his delusions.

 

I liked Megan's mom* compassionately showing the basic things Ms. I Want to Live on My Own cannot do, and admitting it's past time she should be teaching some of those basic skills.

 

I continue to like Cristina's mom* -- she just has such a way about her.

 

I hope those Angels tickets Rachel consigned to waste were comped.  I know jack all about Adam Lambert, but from my former career in the music industry I know how tedious meet and greets are, so kudos to him and his fan club for putting together a nice evening for her (even if it was done, at least in part, for the cameras).

 

*I hate referring to these women simply by their roles as mothers, but I can't remember most names.

[Zanne]

I liked Megan's mom* compassionately showing the basic things Ms. I Want to Live on My Own cannot do, and admitting it's past time she should be teaching some of those basic skills.

 

 

I was shocked when Megan's mom admitted how little she has taught her daughter in regards to life skills. She's encouraged her daughter to follow her dream of becoming a singer/songwriter/producer/director, but hasn't taught her how to make a bed or do her laundry? She hasn't made her independent enough to ask for ground beef? Can Megan even cook a meal for herself, or does mom do that for her? Megan keeps talking about not being limited, and it seems her mom had been the one who has most limited her. It angers me when I see parents who do not try to teach their children with special needs to be as independent as possible, even if the children may never be able to live on their own. These types of skills are the ones the parents need to take charge of, and not wait for a teacher to do it. They need to do it before it becomes a problem, like in the case with Megan where she very obviously wants to be on her own, and cannot without some type of guardian because she lacks facility with money, shopping, and home skills to take care of herself. Mom should have been teaching Megan the basics long before the "move" to California.

 

On the positive side, I loved the bike riding lessons and Rachel meeting Adam Lambert. I also loved Christina's (life) philosophy - "I'll just get up and try again!" I need to adopt that attitude more often.

[Bastet]

Oh, I agree it's a bit mind boggling the things Megan hasn't been taught, but I think it's great to see on this show because I can so easily understand it happening under the circumstances -- yet it's a crippling thing, to fail to teach such basic skills.   (Hell, there are any number of "typical" people who don't have to do their own laundry until they move out on their own, but at least they have a better frame of reference to pick it up.) 

[kathyk24]

Why didn't Rachel's parents get her earplugs if she has sensitive hearing? That way she wouldn't miss out on anything. I wonder if Megan's mother never thought she'd be living on her own so she never bothered to teach her life skills. There are also some parents who are codependent with their children.

[Chalby]

 I love how they're all boy and girl crazy, just like most people that age. I'm in on this show! Especially since everything is on forever hiatus.

I am very concerned about Sean's 'girl craziness'. He is obsessed with girls, and it's not because he loves them or whatever. He responding to his basic 'needs' and given his reactions when he's turned down... well, I anticipate a girl being bullied into a relationship she's not ready for. I feel bad for Sean because he has clearly learned this behaviour somewhere. His comments, combined with the eyebrow thing may have been cute when he was 10, but it's downright creepy now. I hope this passes because he is so sweet and kind otherwise. He's got to keep his mind off of a physical relationship.

[Chalby]

I want to see more of Steven.

I agree! I really enjoy this fellow and would like to see more of his parents. I want to hear about his life growing up, how they dealt with his relationships, etc. He seems to be very high functioning - is this a result of parenting and schooling, or 'luck of the draw' with DS?

[Chalby]

Elena's dad seemed like he acknowledged that her behavior was problematic

 

If Elena was a 7 year old, and not have DS I would assume that her behaviour was a result of negative reinforcement. She acts out, storms around, etc. because that is the only way she knows how to get attention. I understand how she is 'stuck' socially given that she is 20 years behind thanks to Mom not having a support system. Elena's behaviour can be changed, but it will take a lot of patience. Unfortunately, her new DS friends all respond to her bad behaviour, which will not change anything. Elena's reaction to anything boy-girl related is so immature, she reminds me of kindergarten kids when they freak out upon seeing a couple kiss. I don't see that changing any time soon. Poor gal has a lot of things stacked against her. Let's hope this show opens up some avenues for her.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Chalby

[Chalby]

When the show first started, Megan wanted to be a film producer, was an inspirational speaker, and sold online clothing on the side. Now Megan had added film director to the mix and wants to go to film school.  

I was wondering about all of these goals (and especially the baby goal) when the first show aired. After viewing Megan's panic over ordering a pound of beef, I realized - who are we kidding? These are not Megan's goals. Her mother has jumpstarted everything. But she's not jumpstarted anything as a 'dream maker'. I believe that Megan goes through hours of practise, just to give one speech. The meeting with her team regarding Megology, was rehearsed. She did beautifully, but I would love to see her be asked to lead the next meeting, without mom around, or practising with her prior. I felt so bad (and worried) when I realized her independence and confidence is a facade.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Chalby

[ClareWalks]

 I found myself surprised so few had undergone prenatal testing, so I'm off to research the history of amnio to see if it's a more recent development than I thought.  I'm glad no one - that made air, anyway - spouted off condemnation of women who'd opt to abort.

 

Not sure if it's this way for every state (or for every insurance company), but at my hospital/clinic prenatal visits, they gave me a brochure at 12 weeks that had a bunch of "optional tests" (i.e. "you have to pay for them"), and the DS test was included, along with a ton of other tests. If you wanted to be tested for everything, it would cost about $1500, and it wouldn't definitely tell you the baby has DS, it would just say the baby is more likely to have DS. I wouldn't object to someone aborting a pregnancy with a positive DS test, even though it isn't a definite result, but I'm sure a lot of women would choose to take a chance that it 1) wouldn't be DS, and 2) they could handle that situation if they needed to. Personally, I didn't bother getting the test, because after dealing with infertility I figured none of the tests would change my mind about proceeding with the pregnancy, so why bother? So they might have gotten the tests done (and paid the $$) but decided to proceed anyway :)

Edited January 6, 2016 by ClareWalks

[camom]

Amnio started being done in the early 70's.  I was offered it with my son in 1974 (I had a daughter with DS in 72).  But in those days there was no ultrasound, so they would just be going in blind and hoping to hit the amniotic sac and not the baby.  No thanks.  I think most of these moms probably had their kids with DS before age 35; after that age amnio is more likely to be offered.  Now there are blood tests.

 

The level of Megan's incompetence with everyday living skills was quite evident in this episode.  As shown in the first episode when she was introducing herself as "Megan's mom" and forgetting to say her name, being Megan's mom is Kris's identity.  I'm sure she is very conflicted now that Megan is trying to be independent. 

 

Loved John working with the dogs.  I'm sure he gets SSI, so his parents aren't fully supporting him financially.  Many adults with developmental disabilities are not able to hold down regular jobs so they volunteer, go to day programs, workshops, etc.  The dog place seems like a good fit for John.  He likes it and he is providing a service to the community.

 

The bike class was great.  I really liked seeing their success and determination.

 

I wonder if Elena was too much trouble for the other cast members and/or the production crew.  That could explain why we haven't really seen her in the last two episodes.

[Bastet]

So they might have gotten the tests done (and paid the $$) but decided to proceed anyway :)

 

No, at the moms' gathering, John's mom talked about doctors advising an abortion after the DS diagnosis, and someone (Megan's mom, maybe) asked if anyone else had a prenatal diagnosis.  I don't think anyone else raised their hand.  Or maybe one.  But, at any rate, they brought it up, and the vast majority did not know until after birth.

 

I was a little surprised by that, but I know very little about pregnancy beyond the fact I've devoted my adult life to avoiding it.  The age thing makes sense; John's parents are older, so that may be why she had the test.  But I wonder why you have the test if you're going to continue the pregnancy regardless.  It was such a brief topic of conversation - and I can understand why; their "kids" are all adults now and any decisions they made or would have made back before they even existed have long since become moot - but it sparked my curiosity a bit.  As I said, I was just glad not to hear a "How dare anyone abort just because of DS" reaction, because a friend who practices disability rights law hears that fairly often.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Bastet

[camom]

 

But I wonder why you have the test if you're going to continue the pregnancy regardless.

 

Sometimes parents just want to know so that they can be prepared.  Personally, I wouldn't have amnio if I knew I was going to continue the pregnancy, since there are risks with the test.  But with more non-invasive testing available now parents are more likely to have the diagnosis during pregnancy.  When these people were born, amnio was pretty much the only option and would have been offered only if there were particular risks (like maternal age).

 

I really, really like John's mom. 

Edited January 6, 2016 by camom

[ClareWalks]

Sometimes parents just want to know so that they can be prepared.  Personally, I wouldn't have amnio if I knew I was going to continue the pregnancy, since there are risks with the test.  But with more non-invasive testing available now parents are more likely to have the diagnosis during pregnancy.  When these people were born, amnio was pretty much the only option and would have been offered only if there were particular risks (like maternal age).

 

True, if money had been literally no object (like I had millions of dollars laying around), I probably would have gotten all the tests, just to have some idea of what I might be up against and do some research before the kid was born. There are probably a lot of resources someone could have in place if they knew. I'm not too surprised that a bunch of the moms on the show hadn't gotten tests, though, because they have gotten less invasive since these adult children were born. Amnio has small risk of miscarriage but it's still a risk most people (I'm guessing statistically most pregnant women don't get amnios) aren't willing to take.

[Cherrio]

I was shocked by the fact that Meghan can't make a bed or do laundry. I liked seeing John with the puppies. He seemed like he was being more authentic and I preferred seeing that side of him to seeing John the rapper/entertainer. I liked seeing more of Steven and I didn't mind looking at Adam Lambert. He's a class act after the way he was unceremoniously dumped from Demi's tour last minute and didn't say anything negative about the whole experience.

I felt exactly the same about John and his experience working at the pet store. He seemed much more capable than most of the others in taking good care of the pets, answering the phone and taking care of the customer. I would have no problem hiring him as long as he left the rapper persona and slang at home. The John in this episode I think is the authentic John, not the street, rapper persona he tries to emulate.       I hope IRL his parents and siblings are promoting a realistic life and goals for him, not the music stuff.

   Same with Megan. Its very clear she is not capable of living on her own. Its (imo) a combination of her ability and her mom together, not just her mom not having taught her enough.   Her DS makes it nearly impossible for her to do simple math. I have a feeling that is something she cannot be taught because of her disability, not because they haven't tried.

        As I said last week, while I understand that the parents probably refuse to film what really happens , specifically the full meltdowns, it is cheating the viewer of not getting a true picture of what really happens.    But, I think most of us are able to figure out what does happen and I am fine that they are not exploiting these young adults.

       I am sure if pushed once more by her mother at the grocer, Megan probably would of had a full blown tantrum.   It would of been better though if her mother told her not to talk to her the way she was, in ordering her mother to stop.  Some of the other parents allow this too and I guess I would be working on this along with the other basic life skills.     

       I liked the Rachel scenes, but something seemed very fake about her all of a sudden losing her fear of loud noise. One minute she looks like she is going to explode, then she walks down to the stage?  Then after the concert it was still very loud and she was not wearing the earphones.  Casino's are very loud and the people yelling, the noises from all the slot machines are upsetting to a typical person, but she was not phased.    So, again while I am glad she got to meet Adam, I did not believe the rest of the story.

[camom]

I actually did believe Rachel's story.  Once she took a risk - and getting close to Adam while he sang was the push she needed - she discovered that her fears were mostly unfounded.  She probably is uncomfortable with loud noises (and possibly crowds), but given the right incentive she was able to get past her fears.  Whether or not that will translate into future outings is anyone's guess.  Someone upthread wondered about the Angel game tickets.  Probably it was a work outing and everyone paid for their own tickets.  Rachel's parents were willing to let her try but also knew when to back off and take her home.  I was hoping that she would at least try to attend the game.

[Cherrio]

I believe at one time Rachel could not handle loud noises, but it was mostly producer driven with some liberties taken.    I don't think she could go from not even getting out of the car at the ballgame to how she acted at the concert, especially (again) being able to be in a casino with all that extra noise.

      It is to me the same as not seeing the full story, but as I said I am fine with that because I would rather not see it, than these fine young people being exploited.

[Momof2boyz]

I loved the Rachel story this week.  I literally cried during the concert scene I was so touched. Regarding amnio it is advised for older mothers precisely because of the risk of Downs Syndrome.  I was 34 going on 35 with my first pregnancy and I was advised to do it.  I did it although I would not have aborted because of DS, but there are other, more serious conditions that can be detected.  I have absolutely no recollection of getting it done with my second pregnancy, although I must have had it.  I just can't remember having it done. 

[camom]

Born This Way has been renewed for a second season.

[Zanne]

Yeah, I'm positive that that speech was heavily rehearsed after seeing this episode which gave a lot of information regarding Megan's limitations.

 

 

That speech was not written by Megan and is likely her "go to" speech when called upon to speak. Her catchphrase is "don't limit me" or a variation; I have heard it from her several times and have seen it on the tags of her Megology clothing when they flashed them on the show. Do you think that was her idea? I don't. The clothing line was also Mom's idea (and Mom run) since it would take a lot of planning to put that into place, rent a space at a flea market, and buy the items in bulk, all of which would include talking to strangers and discussion of money. While it is great that Megan has become a public speaker and participates in the clothing line, I am bothered that they are trying very hard to give the impression it was 100% Megan when she obviously required a lot of help. Working with children with special needs as I do, I'm all about celebrating the small victories (which is why I was so upset Megan's mom had not been stressing life skills with her daughter) and working toward larger ones, but I also don't feel it is beneficial for Mom to layer all the credit on Megan when she is far from independent. It builds false expectations in her daughter that everything will be easy, someone else will do all the work, and Megan will get all the money and credit. This can lead to crushing disappointment/complete shutting down when things turn out to be not so easy.