B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[Gudzilla]

So did Robin's baby shower happen or not ? 

Damn I hate not getting closure !

[CharlizeCat]

3 hours ago, Cool Breeze said:

Another thing I fail to understand is how these young men, i.e., Thomas and Liam, fall in love with Hope's "goodness" and "caring" and "selflessness".  If I recall correctly, that's not really what attracts a young man to a woman.  The response is usually more . . . visceral.  Physical.  Carnal.  The notion that these guys will obsess over Hope because of her wonderful qualities doesn't ring true. 

This made me laugh -- but in a good way. So. True. These are the only millennial men on the planet who seem to want to be MARRIED in the era of apps solely for hookups and FWB. Liam even said once that he preferred being married. SMH. Well, he certainly has enough experience under his belt for his age. Thomas? Don't get that, either, even crazy obsessed men, usually are more into the "thrill of the chase," and not daydreaming about marrying their conquest.  Wyatt also moves pretty quickly towards commitment, too, in having women move in with him shortly after meeting them.

Contrast RM Ridge at their age. He was bedding every hot woman in town. He also made no bones (see what I did there?) about the fact that he preferred them young and gorgeous and preferably upper-echelon -- until Brooke came along.  I think Lippy came from humble origins, too.

[TigerLynx]

Ridge still liked a challenge though.  Ridge was engaged to Caroline, but cheated on her the night before their wedding.  Ridge didn't get around to trying to get Caroline back until she decided to marry Thorne.  When Ridge was first involved with Brooke, he wanted Caroline.  When Caroline died, Brooke was with Eric, and suddenly she became more interesting to Ridge.  Taylor was dating first Storm, and then her ex-husband Blake.  You wouldn't know it now, but there was a time that Taylor and Brooke weren't such pathetic spineless doormats, and they didn't sit around hoping Ridge would choose them.

Hope is to much of a nonentity for me to believe she could hold a guy's interest.  She's attractive, but - I've got nothing else.  Most guys I know are interested in looks yes, but for the long term, both men and women need a personality, and a spine.  People might be willing to use or walk all over a doormat, but they don't usually love them.  And most of the women on this show end up being doormats.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Oh please, most of those "mourners" barely knew who Emma was.

I think that was a great color for Sally. Seems like more of a fall or winter shade though.

Wait, did Thomas run Emma off the road or was he just tailgating her?

Sally, no. Don't be begging the guy who cheated on you with his ex to take you back. Just ask him if he at least changed the sheets before he took her to bed. 😒

Quote

The notion that these guys will obsess over Hope because of her wonderful qualities doesn't ring true. 

Maybe Hope has good embouchure, if you catch my drift. 🎺📯🎷🍆🍌🥒

[Anna Yolei]

37 minutes ago, CharlizeCat said:

Contrast RM Ridge at their age. He was bedding every hot woman in town. He also made no bones (see what I did there?) about the fact that he preferred them young and gorgeous and preferably upper-echelon -- until Brooke came along.  I think Lippy came from humble origins, too.

Honestly, I don't think Ridge was that picky, as long as she was fairly attractive and willing to fuck.But he was all about the chase more than anything, like Tiger said. Honestly, if Bill Sr. had had a little more faith in his daughter and not got into Ridge's face, he probably would've moved on to the next pretty face with open legs.

20 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

Hope is to much of a nonentity for me to believe she could hold a guy's interest.  She's attractive, but - I've got nothing else. 

Pre-ToD Hope was actually okay. She had passion for life and was open about waiting without being obnoxious of so egregiously self-centered. That Hope, I could see guys falling for, sex or no sex.

I don't buy that young men in Los Angeles of all places would be fighting tooth and nail to get married when they'd still be young enough to get carded at their wedding, however.

But on a related tangent, I was in middle school during the Amber baby hijinks and my mom always shook her head about how hard Rick and CJ were fighting to take care of a baby that wasn't theirs. Especially Rick. 🤣At least Liam was wise enough to nope out of Amber's orbit the minute the paternity test came up negative.

[smijca]

I stopped watching this dreck long ago but have been keeping up by popping in and lurking and reading the awesome comments (thank you to all you still watching so I don’t have to).

Actually pulled up today’s episode since I read Sally girl was in it. Man, Courtney Hope (and the character of Sally) deserve SO MUCH better. She lit up the screen in the few minutes she was on more than any of these other characters have in a LONG time!

I don’t know why the writers don’t seem to know what to do with her, and DEFINITELY don’t know how to do right by characterization. How can the same Sally who charged up Bill Spencer and went toe to toe with Steffy be the same girl who turns into a simpering women begging the idiots on this soap to choose her? I’m glad we at least got Sally declaring she’d end up being the one that got away even if the writers ruined it with having Sally go all Dolly Parton (“I will ALWAYS love you!”). 

Bradley loves trolling us, though, with Sally foreshadowing (maybe?) Wyatt finding out how perfect Flo ISN’T when he finds out about the baby switch. I just hope that the stupid writers give us the viewers the satisfaction of Sally being around to reject Wyatt when he goes crawling back to her all dopey like and to gloat over Quinn. 

Edited to add: If the writers were really up for making it all soapy, they’d have SALLY find out about Beth and eventually put a bullet to Thomas (we know she’s a shooter) when he eventually tries to off her, thereby being the only honorable one among the trifecta of morons who currently keep the secret and also saving the day. 

Edited June 26, 2019 by smijca

[TigerLynx]

1 hour ago, Anna Yolei said:

Pre-ToD Hope was actually okay. She had passion for life and was open about waiting without being obnoxious of so egregiously self-centered. That Hope, I could see guys falling for, sex or no sex.

I get the sex part.  Hope and Steffy (before JMW ruined her face) are beautiful girls.  It's the we must be married with a baby before 20 part that makes no sense.  Also, when dating someone people generally like to do FUN things, enjoy themselves.  That never happens with these people.  It's doom and gloom, crying, worrying about the guy leaving you for another girl from jump.  There is also a difference between being nice, and being completely spineless.

At least early on with Ridge/Taylor and Ridge/Brooke they were shown going on dates, going to events, parties, traveling, etc.

Now everyone jumps into a relationship, falls in love before the first date, and immediately starts having problems.  It makes me wonder why any of them bother going on a second date.

Sally and Wyatt looked like they were having more fun in the short time they were together than the rest of the couples on this show, and the writers just threw them under the bus.

[ASpring1900]

3 hours ago, Gudzilla said:

So did Robin's baby shower happen or not ? 

Damn I hate not getting closure !

Looks like FC used the food ordered for Robin's shower for Emma's memorial-- fruit salad, etc.

No sign of those cupcakes though...

[A-Lo]

14 minutes ago, AManfred said:

Looks like FC used the food ordered for Robin's shower for Emma's memorial-- fruit salad, etc.

No sign of those cupcakes though...

Who is Robin???

[Waldo13]

So TIIC ended the speculation as to Thomas’ involvement in Emma’s so called accident.  And yes, unlike misunderstanding night, which was revisionist history, there was no doubt that Thomas actually caused Emma to run off the road. 

TIIC revised their daily rhetoric from Raggedy Ann’s Tales of Woe to Thomas’ “I’ll do anything for you”. 

Sally is right, there is no perfect woman for Wyatt.  Sooner or later he’ll find out Flo is not perfect either. If he tries to run back to Sally, I hope she kicks him in the balls. Liam is a waffle but Wyatt is an Eggo.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

So TIIC ended the speculation as to Thomas’ involvement in Emma’s so called accident.  And yes, unlike misunderstanding night, which was revisionist history, there was no doubt that Thomas actually caused Emma to run off the road. 

I'm still not so sure about that. Two things happened: someone was tailgating Emma, and someone pulled up next to her a swerved their car at hers. She jerked her steering wheel trying to avoid a collision and ended up driving off the hill. I think Thomas was definitely riding her bumper and honking his horn but I don't think it was clear that he swerved his car at hers. Seems like they left an opening for it to have been another car. That road rage stuff between strangers probably happens on the freeway every day in LA.

[TigerLynx]

If Hope doesn't like thinking about Liam being with Steffy in that way, and Liam doesn't like seeing Thomas around Hope, why didn't they STAY married, and work on their problems.

What am I supposed to think when Hope calls Phoebe Beth?  That it's great Hope subconsciously recognizes her daughter?  That it's terrible people are going to think Hope is crazy when she's not?

Ridge and Brooke are still idiots.  Why don't you get Hope therapy Brooke?  Oh that's right, your parenting advice involves lingerie and screwing your daughter's husbands.  If it's not about sex, you can't be bothered.

OMG, Vinnie is even dumber than the three stooges.  Is this a one time appearance?

[ByTor]

18 hours ago, TigerLynx said:

when dating someone people generally like to do FUN things

You mean you don't think watching Bob Hope movies, throwing around Dollar Store plastic parachute men, and eating truffle fries is FUN??? 🙂

[Anna Yolei]

Hope went full Michelle Stafford with that outfit 👀 joking aside, I dunno if I liked it overall or not. Too shimmery, and honestly way more than I ever see anyone here in Southern California wear to the beach.

Does My Cousin Vinnie ever shut his mouth?

Also, Thomas continues to be gross and now he's grooming his own child for adult business. This makes me livid on a personal level because I often was pulled in between my parents (albeit my mom making me call Dad to get his child support) and then later having to play therapist to her relationship drama as a teenager who didn't have the social skills to land a date without help in high school. Best believe I'll be nailing a 95 thesis to CBS's door when the next survey comes around.

KKL continues to be a stunning woman at any age, and the shorter hair is working. I still laughed about Brooke saying anyone's relationship is moving too fast, considering half the men she's been with weren't even legally separated when they got together and the other half were usually rebounds from Ridge. She isn't wrong, but still.

Liam is still clearly not over Hope and has no interest in Steffy's non-fat, no-carb milkshake, yet unlike his mewling about Quinn , I feel like he's legit concerned about Hope and less about being right that Thomas is The Worse(tm).

Also, it's cool to have the cousins over, but with that age gap, I would've grabbed my little bro Will if I were Liam so Douglas wouldn't be so bored (as they too are also cousins). I was the oldest of a group of four, the (slightly nicer) Angelica Pickles to a group of "dumb babies" 😛 so yeah, Dougie...honestly, same.

Fuck Ridge. He's really delusional if he thinks Thomas is a "great kid" after the way he laid into him for lusting after his last wife.

Liam cleaned up his beared, which makes him look a lot better.

Matthew Atkinson has nice and and arms. Too bad Thomas sucks so much I can't enjoy them.

[Gudzilla]

20 hours ago, A-Lo said:

Who is Robin???

I believe she's married to Loading Dock Guy.  😉

Before Emma died Pam was walking in on everyone talking about Robin's baby shower, then

when she dropped off Emma's stuff at Brookes' house* she mentioned her again. As far as I know "Robin" has never existed before.

*Why did she take that stuff to Brooke ?

[Waldo13]

Hope, what have TIIC done to you?  They give you god awful clothes in the wrong colors and make you into Raggedy Frumpy.  The one good thing is that Hope looked really good in that hat.  

Hey Thomas, how does it feel to know that Douglas is 10 times the actor you are. 

KM’s Hope could out cleavage Stuffy but  now Stuffy’s cleavage outshines AN’s Hope. If it wasn’t for having a baby, JW and AN would be close to being even. 

If Thomas just bought some Rohypnol and is planning another miss understanding night with Raggedy, 🤢🤢🤢🤮🤮🤮💩💩💩. 

[lightninggirl]

7 minutes ago, Waldo13 said:

Hope, what have TIIC done to you?  They give you god awful clothes in the wrong colors and make you into Raggedy Frumpy.  The one good thing is that Hope looked really good in that hat.  

She has the honest-to-god worst clothing on this show. It's like someone just cannot let go of their 1970s 'shroom trips and must express themselves through Dope's wardrobe. She'll get *maybe* a decent top every three weeks or so.

[TigerLynx]

Why does Liam never have any real competition?  It's so easy for him to bounce back and forth between Steffy and Hope (due to their lack of spine).  It's Ridge/Taylor/Brooke all over again only worse.

[Waldo13]

4 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I'm still not so sure about that. Two things happened: someone was tailgating Emma, and someone pulled up next to her a swerved their car at hers. She jerked her steering wheel trying to avoid a collision and ended up driving off the hill. I think Thomas was definitely riding her bumper and honking his horn but I don't think it was clear that he swerved his car at hers. Seems like they left an opening for it to have been another car. That road rage stuff between strangers probably happens on the freeway every day in LA.

Mulholland Drive, in the area where Emma went off the road would be only two lanes.  The only lights Emma saw was in her rear view mirror. Thomas flashing his high beams and beeping his horn would be very distracting especially on a dark road.  Emma was temporarily blinded so she didn’t notice the curve and that’s why she swerved.  

[Joimiaroxeu]

Oy, I don't know about that outfit Hope was wearing. Oh wait, I do know: MY EYES!!!! MAKE IT STOP!!!!

Good lord, Thomas may have watched American Psycho too many times. And those arms of his are insane and not in a good way, IMO.

Steffy's wig today looked to me like it wanted to leap off her head and scurry away in shame.

KKL still has a killer body. Good on her. Meanwhile, I was wondering when JMW would bust out in a bikini. My bet was the 4th of July. Darn.

He's planning to drug somebody. Thomas can die now. Not tomorrow. Not next week. Not next month. Now. 🤐

Hope finally recognizes her baby on a visceral level. Bet she'll be convinced she's losing some of her marbles. Maybe she'll finally seek counseling.

Edited June 27, 2019 by Joimiaroxeu

[ByTor]

1 hour ago, Waldo13 said:

Hey Thomas, how does it feel to know that Douglas is 10 times the actor you are. 

I don't know where they found that kid, but IMO he could out-act anybody on this show 🙂

[TigerLynx]

Wyatt, you are a selfish jackass, and a dumbass.  Fortunately, for you, Thomas is currently on canvas, and he is a bigger bastard than you ever thought about being.  Please let karma come smack all these idiots soon.

[Anna Yolei]

^i have another 90 minutes before it airs in my market and I'm intrigued about what he said or did to get that comparison 😂

[Joimiaroxeu]

So playboy Wyatt was still keeping Sally in his back pocket in case things didn't work out with Flo? I'm surprised Flo didn't call him on that.

Heh, PhoeBeth was looking at Hope like, "Mommy? Can you pull it together please? Listen to your gut and take me home!"

I can't wait until Wyatt finds out what Flo did and has to use an industrial vacuum cleaner pick his stupid face up off the floor.

Oy, AN, you really should rethink those eyebrows. You're not Norma Desmond. 😕

Was that a mojito Liam was drinking or a margarita?

[Anna Yolei]

40 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

So playboy Wyatt was still keeping Sally in his back pocket in case things didn't work out with Flo? I'm surprised Flo didn't call him on that.

Flo dated Zoe's dad. She very clearly has no standards whatsoever.

I better never hear Wyatt fix his lips to chew out Liam ever again for flipping between women. WTF.

Denise Richards looked better today, but Shawna is trash. "Well, it's one less person that knows the secret"--granted, she doesn't know Thomas's role in this but...really?! I'm beginning to see why she was Quinn's bestie.

[ByTor]

On 6/27/2019 at 5:53 PM, Gudzilla said:

On 6/26/2019 at 8:45 PM, A-Lo said:

Who is Robin???

I believe she's married to Loading Dock Guy.

I would fall over dead if Pam said something about her being married to LDG!  That would be all the proof I need that TPTB are lurking 🙂

[Gam2]

Pam said that Robin worked in “cutting” or some department at FC when she was trying to force Thomas to choose which cupcake he wanted at the shower. 

[Gam2]

Also I’ll say that those two babies who play Kelly and Phoebe are two of the cutest kids I’ve ever seen in my life!!

[ChiefWiggum9-1-2]

By now Loading Dock Guy surely has told Pattern Cutting Lady who spilled to Joyce in Accounting. And everyone knows -  tell Joyce, tell the world. So next week? Sewing Machine Repair Man!

[Anna Yolei]

4 hours ago, Gam2 said:

Also I’ll say that those two babies who play Kelly and Phoebe are two of the cutest kids I’ve ever seen in my life!!

They are! I love Kelly's gigantic eyes especially, but I also loved how comfortable Phoebeth looked when AN held her. Babies mostly cry when I hold them lol

[Waldo13]

Flo, Mansion or Beach House, Mansion or Beach House.  What a dilemma. Living in a Mansion with a stogie old couple or at the Beach House with her first love?  Take the  Beach House and hope you don’t talk in your sleep.  

So Thomas drugs Liam not Raggedly. What is Thomas purpose?  I’ve read the spoilers but I still don’t understand how this would work. Once again, I will have to put my intelligence on hold and let TIIC shovel shit.

[Annmarie1111]

On 6/27/2019 at 5:07 PM, lightninggirl said:

She has the honest-to-god worst clothing on this show. It's like someone just cannot let go of their 1970s 'shroom trips and must express themselves through Dope's wardrobe. She'll get *maybe* a decent top every three weeks or so.

Agree, and she is the only one on the show with the gosh-awful wardrobe!

[Annmarie1111]

On 6/27/2019 at 6:46 PM, ByTor said:

I don't know where they found that kid, but IMO he could out-act anybody on this show 🙂

So so true, Thomas is horrible!

[ByTor]

6 hours ago, Waldo13 said:

Thomas drugs Liam not Raggedly. What is Thomas purpose? 

My 1st thought is so Liam could pass out & wake up with Steffy & think something happened when it didn't.  Thomas would have to hope Steffy would go along with that lie, and I'm sure he'd assume she would since she went along with the "Caroline is sick" lie. 

[ByTor]

5 hours ago, Annmarie1111 said:

So so true, Thomas is horrible!

I'll give Thomas a pass, I think he'd be fine as a cutie new love interest for Steffy or Hope (I say them so one of them could finally stop with the Liam nonsense), but think he's miscast as a villain.

[TigerLynx]

4 hours ago, ByTor said:

My 1st thought is so Liam could pass out & wake up with Steffy & think something happened when it didn't.  Thomas would have to hope Steffy would go along with that lie, and I'm sure he'd assume she would since she went along with the "Caroline is sick" lie. 

Most of these characters have no problem going along with a lie if it benefits them.  Their problem is they can't keep their damn mouths shut so everyone finds out anyway.

I'm very disappointed in Thomas.  He's a lame villain.  He was supposed to be the serial killer who rid the show of at the very least - Zoe, Flo, and Xander.

[A-Lo]

What were Thomas' last words on yesterday's episode...
"Goodbye, Liam"   or

"Goodnight, Liam"???

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

What were Thomas' last words on yesterday's episode...
"Goodbye, Liam"   or

"Goodnight, Liam"???

According to the show transcript, he said "Goodbye, Liam."

Which made me think it would've been interesting if Liam had an allergic reaction to whatever Thomas put in the drink (molly?), had a seizure or gone into anaphylactic shock, and had to go to the hospital. Then when they tested his blood they'd find the drug and everybody would wonder where it came from. Plus, Liam having a medical emergency would likely upset Hope and make her have second thoughts about that quickie annulment. But no, Liam has to be turned into a live sex robot again.

[Anna Yolei]

7 hours ago, ByTor said:

I'm sure he'd assume she would since she went along with the "Caroline is sick" lie. 

 Thomas doesn't know about that one...but he does know about Cabo and the text lie to split up Bridge and all her other lies and schemes she's done to keep Liam on a leash, so yeah I'm sure he thought she'd be fine with this too 😑

[Gam2]

14 hours ago, Annmarie1111 said:

Agree, and she is the only one on the show with the gosh-awful wardrobe!

Well, I’m not sure I agree with that comment. Have you seen Flo’s “outfits” or Zoe’s? BLECH.

[CharlizeCat]

What are those weird high-waisted pants that Flo's been wearing the past few days?  She has it paired with a very low-cut light blue blouse.  Fug. 

I am going to guess that Hope's clothes lately are to make her look fragile and delicate.  I couldn't figure out what that gauzy flesh colored thing was she had on at the cliff house. Was it a swimsuit cover-up? It was a terrible color and make AN look so washed out, but I think maybe that was the point? I sure hope so.

Recent best dressed goes to Sally and her red dress she wore over to Wyatt's to get dumped in.

[ByaNose]

I guess TPTB think Hope needs to look lost fragile & on the edge. I don’t think they even add make up on her any more. The baby switch storyline is sooooo damn depressing. Now, we have psycho Thomas and there seems to be no end in sight for either storyline. I know it’s a half hour show but nothing else is going on plot wise on the show. Where is the summer fun for B&B?    

[Petunia13]

The only women who consistently dress great are Brooke, Quinn, and Sally. 

[Gam2]

Hope is blond with pale skin so to dress her in these mostly colorless clothes just makes her fade away. The contrast between her and Steffy’s dark hair/dark eyes is perhaps the writers attempt to contrast good and evil. Or maybe I’m giving them way, way too much credit for having any ideas at all. At any rate, Hope is drab and dull and has had only one line to speak in the past 6 months. She must be more sick of this whole thing than we are. If that’s even possible.

[La di Diva]

Very early in Hope's return, she and Liam had lunch at Il Giardino, She was wearing a lipstick red sheath dress several inches above the knee,, camel blazer, nude stilettos (Loubutines I think) and red lipstick.  She looked great, very professional, fashionable, exactly like someone who works at FC should look.  Red was definitely her color.  

Now she's all washed out, faded, float-y, Stevie Nicks-ish, earth mother-y.  I have to believe that it's to emphasize her fragile state of mind, and to contrast her with strong brave single mom Hauxdi.  KMHope did not dress like that.  A Hope who spent several years in Milan around European fashion would not dress like that.

Oh -- and that dress PsychoCreepyTom designed for her was awful on her -- simply awful.  It probably would have looked just fine on Hauxdi or Ivy though, maybe even on Sally

Edited June 30, 2019 by La di Diva

[movingtargetgal]

Taylor and the Taytots have not been the same since the second time she came back from the dead.  Ridge and Brooke had a happy blended family. Thomas, Steffy and Phoebe were happy and well adjusted.  I think that whatever treatment the doctors Omar hired used to revive Taylor  caused her to develop some extreme mental illness.  She was not the same person she was before she "died".   

The Taytots loved Brooke, Hope and RJ, however, after their mother came back, the Taytots told Brooke to take her children and leave their mother's house.  They wanted their family back.  As Taylor slipped further and further into the deep end, her children followed her.  Steffy was a horrible mess but seems to be getting better. (The baby switch reveal could cause her to go dark again)  Thomas is dangerously mentally ill.  He has tried to kill Rick twice (arson and planting a BOMB), lied about sleeping with Brooke during their Boinkin Berry haze so he could get Stephanie's shares of Forrester, slept with Caroline while she was impaired and now everything he has done while stalking Hope.  If Phoebe had not died, I wonder how she would be doing.   

[Anna Yolei]

Phoebe I imagine would've been another Bridget, getting run over by her shitty ass family. I mean, Taylor was fooling around with Rick for months before she happened to stumble upon them and after getting herself killed to screech on Steffy's behalf, they didn't even wait till her body was cold to cram tongues down one another's mouths.

She's better off for getting to die a whole season before Liam showed up and the whole cast and crew took a side in all that ToD spectacle.

[bannana]

On ‎6‎/‎29‎/‎2019 at 9:14 AM, TigerLynx said:

I'm very disappointed in Thomas.  He's a lame villain.  He was supposed to be the serial killer who rid the show of at the very least - Zoe, Flo, and Xander.

Well, he apparently took care of Emma! ☹️

[ByaNose]

I just hope they put poor Hope out of her misery and she finds out that her baby is alive. I know it's a soap but it's sooooooo depressing. Then you throw in crazy Thomas and I'm about to turn this show off until I find out that the storyline is over and I can return. I get that it's a half hour soap but B&B (Brad Bell) can only write 2 stories at a time. Actually, I think the baby switch storyline is the only storyline now, right?

[TigerLynx]

9 hours ago, bannana said:

Well, he apparently took care of Emma! ☹️

Not good enough.  If they are going to have a legacy character go psycho, they really need to commit and deliver.

There are so many problems with the not dead baby SL, but the most glaring is they whitewashed Hope out of her own story.  There were weeks of the three stooges arguing over and over again about telling Hope the truth.  That time could have been used to show Hope going to therapy, spending time with Phoebe (which Steffy has been perfectly fine with), have Hope and Liam try to go to the movies or dinner and Hope being to depressed to enjoy any of it.  In the mean time, Steffy has moved on with a new guy making Hope's insistence that she and Liam need to divorce so Liam can be with Steffy and the girls even more bizarre.  Instead not only do they waste time with the trio of idiots from hell (in this instance Zoe, Flo, Xander, not Steffy, Liam, Hope), they also allow Thomas to so obviously manipulate Hope, it's ridiculous that ALL of the characters don't see he is manipulating her, including Hope.  There is no subtlety.

I think Taylor should have stayed dead, but I don't think she's the problem with Thomas, Steffy, and Phoebe.  Steffy had a completely different personality when she first returned from Europe, was dating Marcus, and working in the mail room.  I think Brad Bell is the problem.  He changes the characters personalities at a whim, and then he writes them out when he gets bored.  The only SL he really seems to care about is the triangle of Steffy/Liam/Hope, and that SL started out horrible and went down from there.

I think Brad Bell's whiplash writing started a while back to.  One SL that comes to mind is Eric and Ridge trying to keep Brooke away from Thorne.  Stephanie was recovering from a stroke, and their justification was it might upset Stephanie, and she could die.  Then once Thorne remarried Macy on the rebound, and Stephanie found out about Thorne/Brooke, Stephanie was the one trying to keep Thorne/Macy together, and Brooke away.  At which point, Eric tells Stephanie she should stay out of it, and let Thorne make his own decision.  WTF?  Why didn't Eric and Ridge stay out of it in the first place?