Episode Discussion: TFGH

[ulkis]

8 minutes ago, Melgaypet said:

Although, this show is totally confusing me here. Since when does being an unrepentant murderer mean a man has to lose his child(ren)? We are still in Port Charles, right?

That's only if you're a good mobster with a heart of gold or an okay mobster who is constantly ordered by other, bigger meaner people to do bad things.

[LexieLily]

12 minutes ago, Melgaypet said:

Lulu has been fairly psychotic herself in her baby rabies, though I grant you that she hasn't killed anyone over it. I don't have any problem with Lulu wanting Charlotte away from Valentin and Nina. I do have a problem with her being too stupid or selfish to grasp that Charlotte loves Valentin and being separated from him will be traumatic for her, no matter how necessary it may be for her safety. She seems much less interested in the kid's emotional well-being then she is in establishing herself as mommy.

Although, this show is totally confusing me here. Since when does being an unrepentant murderer mean a man has to lose his child(ren)? We are still in Port Charles, right?

So TPTB is going with the retcon that Valentin has raised Charlotte most if not all of these years? What happened to Claudette running off with Charlotte and Valentin coming after Claudette for stealing the kid from him?

[Melgaypet]

I guess? I admit, I haven't kept up with the various retcons, because I never really gave a damn about Claudette/Griffin/Nathan/Valentin backstory, but as it stands now - Charlotte seems to have a loving, established father-daughter relationship with Papa Valentin.

[ulkis]

Kate Hall (scriptwriter) said she's writing Tracy/Ned scenes, so at least there's that.

Edited January 20, 2017 by ulkis

[Linny]

51 minutes ago, ulkis said:

Would they dare to try to pair Nina and Griffin? There seemed to be some chem testing yesterday.

Griffin is so earnest and pious that I have a hard time picturing him in a romantic relationship. I feel like he needs someone who could get him to really loosen up. I almost wish they'd go for the crazy May-December pairing of Griffin and Lucy. It could be a casual and fun side pairing that would balance out all the other angsty couples. I like Griffin when he's a little disheveled and not so worried about being perfect.

Edited January 20, 2017 by Linny

[HeatLifer]

33 minutes ago, Melgaypet said:

Since when does being an unrepentant murderer mean a man has to lose his child(ren)? We are still in Port Charles, right?

This is what was always wrong/twisted about this show. Killers with a heart of gold vs. those against violence. The latter group was never well-received.

[ciarra]

Wherever Olivia has been all these years, clearly they didn't have a class in Photoshop.

[dubbel zout]

2 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

She's written badly here how? Because she wants the kid away from psychotic people?

IMO, Lulu is written badly because she's thinking about what's best for her, not Charlotte. Yes, Valentin is a murderer, but he's also the only remaining parent Charlotte has known. He's not wrong to want time for her to grieve Claudette before introducing Lulu as her bio mom.

2 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

I also find it disturbing that the writers think it's entertaining or funny or dramatic that Charlotte likes EVERYONE but Lulu. It's contrived.

I'm loving this, if only because Lulu is acting so incredibly selfishly. She needs to work with Valentin, not against him when it comes to Charlotte. Plus, kids have an excellent sense of who adults are. Charlotte clearly senses that Lulu is a bit desperate when she's around her.

Edited January 20, 2017 by dubbel zout

[HeatLifer]

4 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Yes, Valentin is a murderer, but he's also the only remaining parent Charlotte has known.

I just gotta agree to disagree with this argument that some have made. He's a killer. There's nothing else to analyze for me.

[Bringonthedrama]

37 minutes ago, LexieLily said:

So TPTB is going with the retcon that Valentin has raised Charlotte most if not all of these years? What happened to Claudette running off with Charlotte and Valentin coming after Claudette for stealing the kid from him?

Seriously, they need to get this straight. Also, Valentin and Lulu both look like jerks because Charlotte's physical and emotional well-being should both be important. This poor kid came to Port Charles w/Claudette and was calling her mommy, Claudette introduced Charlotte to first Nathan as "Daddy", and then Griffin. Claudette then abandons Charlotte with these people she's just met, and not long after that she's told that Claudette, aka "Mommy" is dead. Valentin sucks for telling Nina that Charlotte would "get over missing her mother soon" and Lulu sucks because all she cares about is that Charlotte ditches feeling attached to Valentin, gets over any negative feelings about Claudette's death, and insta-loves and accepts her as Mommy.  This poor girl has been through a lot - they need to let that *sink in* to their selfish brains, and give her some emotional safe space. I think someone should give awesome dad Mac Scorpio a call - have him remove Charlotte from Valentin and Lulu's toxicity. He surely remembers what it's like to be there for a young girl who's been through a lot of change/trauma. 

[LeftPhalange]

Charlotte should run away and never been see r heard from again. Even better if she takes Avery with her. 

[Melgaypet]

6 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

I just gotta agree to disagree with this argument that some have made. He's a killer. There's nothing else to analyze for me

Well, sure. So are Sonny, Jason, and Julian. All four of them should be doing life for murder and child custody shouldn't even be an issue.

Like I said, I don't have a problem with Lulu taking the kid away from Valentin. I just think she's a tunnel-visioned idiot in her apparent belief that taking the kid away and then telling her she's her mother is all that's necessary to make them a happy family. Maybe look into some child therapists, Lulu?

[HeatLifer]

5 minutes ago, Melgaypet said:

Well, sure. So are Sonny, Jason, and Julian. All four of them should be doing life for murder and child custody shouldn't even be an issue.

Agree. 

[Aurora2]

2 hours ago, ulkis said:

Would they dare to try to pair Nina and Griffin? There seemed to be some chem testing yesterday.

I think that MS turns all of her scenes with good-looking men into chem tests with her body language and the way she looks intently at her screen partner.  

[Aurora2]

On several sites, I’ve been reading various opinions on telling Charlotte the truth (if it is the truth) about Lulu being her biological mother.

The bottom line is that every comment I have read agrees that Charlotte should be told the truth – even those criticizing Lulu’s specific actions right now.

The debate is, and has been all along, about the timing of this truth-telling and the manner in which the young child is told.

I’m aligned with those who think that the process should be developed and monitored. I especially agree that telling her at the wedding reception – when Charlotte was obviously very upset – was badly timed. I think that Lulu’s best approach would be first building a comfortable rapport with the child before revealing the complete truth. (As complete as forced retrieval of eggs and surrogacy can be made to a small child!)  I would also consider telling this truth with the assistance of trained professionals.  There are a couple of them close at hand!

For a few hopeful minutes yesterday, I thought Lulu had listened to the good advice given her and was following a wiser and more helpful path to comforting Charlotte and to creating a bond with her - and I was momentarily hopeful for the character Lulu's sake.  Lulu wasn't much older than Charlotte is now when she lost her mother's presence in her life when Laura went into a catatonic state and began years and years of hospitalization. When Lulu was SORAS-ed in 2005, we met a Lulu who had been very affected emotionally by Laura's absence in her life and by Luke's cynicism and absences. By comforting and empathizing with Charlotte, Lulu would have been sharing the honesty of a significant part of her own life experience with Charlotte and would have been creating an emotional bond with her child – a bond on which to build as other truths were gradually revealed.

The truth does NOT need to be told all at once. To a young, confused, emotional child, it can be told in increments. By comforting Charlotte with stories of a shared experience of having her mother taken from her life, Lulu would have being starting that incremental truth-telling process in a constructive way. The “ripping-the-bandaid-off” approach is NOT always the best choice.

I agree that Valentin is NOT a good person and that his delays in telling the truth have placed Lulu in an increasingly difficult situation.  However, her impatience and her perennial failure to take good advice to slow down and proceed with caution have, once again, caused Lulu to contribute to making a bad situation worse.  Something she has done a few times since the middle of 2015.  In 2015, for some, Valerie was the scapegoat because of the now-mistaken idea that the writers were writing Lulu this way to position Valerie more favorably.  But, as I said several weeks ago, the rush to unthinking actions is how the writers see Lulu's "Spencer-ness" – unfortunately. 

Edited January 20, 2017 by Aurora2

[LexieLily]

9 minutes ago, Aurora2 said:

I think that Lulu’s best approach would be first building a comfortable rapport with the child before revealing the complete truth. (As complete as forced retrieval of eggs and surrogacy can be made to a small child!)  I would also consider telling this truth with the assistance of trained professionals.  There are a couple of them close at hand!

There is a spoiler for next week that has Kevin giving advice to Lulu and Laura being surprised by whatever the advice is. Perhaps it is about the Charlotte situation. Here's hoping that if that is the case Kevin can be impartial and put his feelings for Laura to the side, and explain to Lulu that yes, she ha a right to feel betrayed and hurt over all the time she's lost with her daughter, and yes Lulu's feelings are very important, but that right now the most important feelings are Charlotte's and how they can all create a situation that is best for HER.

[Aurora2]

6 minutes ago, LexieLily said:

There is a spoiler for next week that has Kevin giving advice to Lulu and Laura being surprised by whatever the advice is. Perhaps it is about the Charlotte situation. Here's hoping that if that is the case Kevin can be impartial and put his feelings for Laura to the side, and explain to Lulu that yes, she ha a right to feel betrayed and hurt over all the time she's lost with her daughter, and yes Lulu's feelings are very important, but that right now the most important feelings are Charlotte's and how they can all create a situation that is best for HER.

For someone who used to be a spoiler junkie, I have lost interest in following spoiler sources these days.  However, thank you for this one because it really interests me and could be a hopeful one. 

[LexieLily]

12 minutes ago, Aurora2 said:

For someone who used to be a spoiler junkie, I have lost interest in following spoiler sources these days.  However, thank you for this one because it really interests me and could be a hopeful one. 

It could if it was done properly, which I don't have high hopes for, but Kevin has his own reasons for disliking Valentin, so if Lulu sees him putting that to the side to advise her to do what is best for Charlotte, why can't Lulu do the same?

Edited January 20, 2017 by LexieLily

[ulkis]

17 minutes ago, LexieLily said:

It could if it was done properly, which I don't have high hopes for, but Kevin has his own reasons for disliking Valentin, so if Lulu sees him putting that to the side to advise her to do what is best for Charlotte, why can't Lulu do the same?

Cause he's a lot more removed from the situation than she is.

[LexieLily]

2 minutes ago, ulkis said:

Cause he's a lot more removed from the situation than she is.

I know. I meant that might be how Kevin might approach the conversation.

Lulu told Charlotte the truth and now all of them have to deal with the fallout. I agree with Lulu's decision to tell Charlotte the truth even though I don't agree with the time and place. Now Charlotte knows, and they can go from there.

[Asp Burger]

Would they dare to try to pair Nina and Griffin? There seemed to be some chem testing yesterday.

 

Pretty much the whole almost-year of Griffin has been a case of "We would...but we won't."  

[peachmangosteen]

7 hours ago, tveyeonyou said:

These writers suck and I don't know how these actors can get through the stupid they have to deal with every day. It must drive the actors crazy but a paycheck is a paycheck.

I always wonder how the actors deal with it. I mean obviously a lot of them just check out and go through the motions tbh. And there are the few who still try to make this shit work, which props because it can't be easy.

6 hours ago, Oracle42 said:

I think there's a fundamental disagreement about the best interest of the child here. I think Lulu  believes that spending another second with the man who murdered his nephew, and then moved himself and his psycho bride into that nephew's home isn't in the SORAS'd embryo's best interest - I tend to agree

I agree, too. I personally think it's easy to understand why Lulu is reacting the way she is. I think one of the problems is, as @ulkis pointed out, that imo there's little doubt that Lulu would still be acting like this even if Valentin wasn't evil. 

5 hours ago, Ambrosefolly said:

I really need more people, like Alexis, to either punch Ava in the face or remind her of that time she murdered Kate Howard when she goes in on them.  Better yet, have Sam find out that Ava ran over Jason and covered up another violent crime and do it, preferably while she is gloating about Alexis drinking.

Really though. When she was going on and on and on with needling/making fun of Alexis for the alcoholism/hit & run I was like damn girl maybe tone it down a bit since you're a literal murderer.

4 hours ago, ulkis said:

Would they dare to try to pair Nina and Griffin? There seemed to be some chem testing yesterday.

I want this so bad now. I can't even imagine how awful it would be. I would feel so bad for MC! But I would laugh through his discomfort.

Edited January 21, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[LeftPhalange]

6 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

5 hours ago, Ambrosefolly said:

I really need more people, like Alexis, to either punch Ava in the face or remind her of that time she murdered Kate Howard when she goes in on them.  Better yet, have Sam find out that Ava ran over Jason and covered up another violent crime and do it, preferably while she is gloating about Alexis drinking.

 

Ava would just start crying and whine about how hard the thug life is and how everything she does is for her children.

[ulkis]

10 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I agree, too. I personally think it's easy to understand why Lulu is reacting the way she is. I think one of the problems is, as @ulkis pointed out, that imo there's little doubt that Lulu would still be acting like this even if Valentin wasn't evil. 

I did not say that. :p I said I could see how people could think that.

I think I could only enjoy the ucg of Nina-Griffin for a day before it got too awkward lol. 

[peachmangosteen]

4 minutes ago, ulkis said:

I think I could only enjoy the ucg of Nina-Griffin for a day before it got too awkward lol. 

I feel like it would be the kind of awkward I could watch over and over. But I kinda feel like it would get boring really quickly, like everything else Griffin does.

This reminded me, I am still so confused about what happened with the Franci/Liz/Griffin triangle they were promoting. Like is that still coming and it just has the worst pacing in the history of time or did they weirdly drop it?

Edited January 21, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[LeftPhalange]

Griffin really shouldn't be forced to deal with that girl and her rapist serial killer boyfriend. He's been through enough. 

[dubbel zout]

5 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

This reminded me, I am still so confused about what happened with the Franci/Liz/Griffin triangle they were promoting. Like is that still coming and it just has the worst pacing in the history of time or did they weirdly drop it?

Who knows? I don't really want to watch Griffin do a Thorn Birds, but if it gets Elizabeth away from Franco, Thorn Birds away. 

[Asp Burger]

That's one of the most curious things (not-)going on right now, because they even put it in a winter promo. But they've missed out on a number of opportunities to show us it's still a thing, if it is. Elizabeth could have been confiding in him about the Franco/Tom situation. They're coworkers and friends, and he's obviously a priestly sounding board for everyone else in town.  

[peachmangosteen]

I feel like Liz/Griffin would bore the shit out of me, but at least I could watch them (through fast forward) without feeling nauseous.

I wonder if they had a plan for Griffin and they just gave up on it or if they never had any real idea what to do with him. It's comical how much his character is just twisting in the wind.

Edited January 21, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[dubbel zout]

TFGH that they bring on a new character and then run out of ideas for what to do with him.

[Darklazr]

Lulu with her baby rabies crap is why she should have given Charlotte time to grieve Claudette's death, and not make this all about HER.  Charlotte clearly loves her father and to be honest, I could care less that the child can't stand Lulu and hope it never changes.  But, we all know in the end that Lulu will end up winning Charlotte's love and pushes Valentine out of the picture.

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

I wonder if they had a plan for Griffin and they just gave up on it or if they never had any real idea what to do with him. It's comical how much his character is just twisting in the wind.

It's so dumb, because the initial character description was as another doc, for which Griffin was likely conceived as a replacement for JT's departing Patrick. But then the show went the odd priest route in the process. So I don't think anyone ever had a clear idea as to what Griffin was about.

[Ambrosefolly]

11 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

It's so dumb, because the initial character description was as another doc, for which Griffin was likely conceived as a replacement for JT's departing Patrick. But then the show went the odd priest route in the process. So I don't think anyone ever had a clear idea as to what Griffin was about.

 

Was that RC's stupid idea or Jelly's?

 

56 minutes ago, Darklazr said:

Lulu with her baby rabies crap is why she should have given Charlotte time to grieve Claudette's death, and not make this all about HER.  Charlotte clearly loves her father and to be honest, I could care less that the child can't stand Lulu and hope it never changes.  But, we all know in the end that Lulu will end up winning Charlotte's love and pushes Valentine out of the picture.

 

I am not so sure. Unless the order comes from above, I think Jelly will continue trash characters like Lulu and Liz without giving them even a little bit of redemption, because I don't think Jelly particular likes those character. I remember Sam mentioning how Liz was one of those woman who play the victim or some shit like that, and then we saw how unsympathetically they wrote Lulu during Dante/Valerie's affair. For some bizarre reason they like Nina, making her totally more awesome at as an editor in chief of a fashion magazine than Maxie, who worked directly with Kate Howard the entire time Kate was leading Crimison, ran it almost solely when Kate lost her mind and has always had a general interest in fashion while Nina could never held down a retail job and couldn't even dress herself. They probably love writing for Valentin, mostly because they just make up whatever and not have to study te history of the show. Unlike Valerie, Valentin might have a longer shelf life because he is a soft hearted villian instead of a flawed good guy.

[Oracle42]

9 hours ago, ulkis said:

Kids also adore eating a gallon of chocolate in one sitting, doesn't mean they should get it.

I could see though that Lulu would/might be acting like this even if Valentin were an A + swell guy.

I mean, if he were an A+ swell guy Charlotte wouldn't exist. 

[LeftPhalange]

1 hour ago, Oracle42 said:

I mean, if he were an A+ swell guy Charlotte wouldn't exist. 

Didn't Helena hire some woman to assault him and steal his sperm? I thought he didn't find out about Charlotte until after she was already born?

[stlbf]

3 minutes ago, LeftPhalange said:

Didn't Helena hire some woman to assault him and steal his sperm? I thought he didn't find out about Charlotte until after she was already born?

Meh, not one God damn word of this Valentin crap has made one iota of sense. Not once. I'm not even buying that Charlotte is the spawn of Lulu. I don't buy that Nik is dead. I don't buy that Claudette is dead. And am I still hoping that Griffin is an operative for Valentin. That is the only damn way to make this shit fest even remotely interesting. The ONLY WAY.

[LexieLily]

40 minutes ago, stlbf said:

Meh, not one God damn word of this Valentin crap has made one iota of sense. Not once. I'm not even buying that Charlotte is the spawn of Lulu. I don't buy that Nik is dead. I don't buy that Claudette is dead. And am I still hoping that Griffin is an operative for Valentin. That is the only damn way to make this shit fest even remotely interesting. The ONLY WAY.

Valentin admitted the truth to Lulu awfully quickly that she was Charlotte's biological mother. That's not the Cassadine way, telling the truth when confronted, especially not telling the truth to a Spencer. I don't know what Valentin has to gain by lying, though, because he wasn't ever a part of the Cassadine/Spencer feud. Isn't he supposed to hate Helena and his entire Cassadine family?

And, for the love of God, Lulu, don't put your blind trust in DNA tests done in Port Charles.

Didn't the original birth certificate have Charlotte being born in May 1992?

Edited January 21, 2017 by LexieLily

[LeftPhalange]

1 hour ago, stlbf said:

Meh, not one God damn word of this Valentin crap has made one iota of sense. Not once. I'm not even buying that Charlotte is the spawn of Lulu. I don't buy that Nik is dead. I don't buy that Claudette is dead. And am I still hoping that Griffin is an operative for Valentin. That is the only damn way to make this shit fest even remotely interesting. The ONLY WAY.

I'm going to react if we had to deal with this bullshit for so long only for Jelly to decide Lulu isn't the mother after all. Though it would give me the opportunity to laugh at Lulu, so there's that. 

[rags]

Robin: Look, it's David Hasselhoff!

[dr. gailey]

I hate that Jelly have me feeling sorry for Lulu. This mess they are writing for her is some straight bullshit. I just can't hate on her for wanting her child back. She is a victim in this mess as much as Charlotte is. She didn't ask for her eggs to be stolen and fertilized by a psycho that killed her brother and did other shit to her friends and family. I can't take this shit anymore. That kid has been passed from parent to parent like a fucking offering plate in church. I find it hard to believe Lulu is the cause of her mental anguish when they got her bratty ass out here playing happy family with that ginger bitch she just met and Valentin. I used to call this same shit out when they always tried to act like Sonny was the better parent than any of his baby mamas. Just hell no.

I also am down with Charlotte not even being hers in the end if it would mean her little ass was leaving town like Claudette. She can also take Avery with her.

I also hate Valentin. I lost all interest in his ass the minute they stuck him with Nina. Then they can't even make up their minds what they are doing with him. Helena was scared of a fucking hunchback. Pity the thought.

[Perkie]

Quote

So TPTB is going with the retcon that Valentin has raised Charlotte most if not all of these years? What happened to Claudette running off with Charlotte and Valentin coming after Claudette for stealing the kid from him?

I think we're supposed to beleive that they've been a happy little family all along until recently when Val "became dangerous" so Claud took off with Charlotte.  Doesn't explain why Charlotte so easily believed that first Nathan than Griffin were her father if she already had a father.  

Quote

Wherever Olivia has been all these years, clearly they didn't have a class in Photoshop.

Of my gosh this made me laugh.  Are you saying you didn't like how the 50 something year old woman cut out photos of her face and Elmer glued them on top of someone else's face

 

15 hours ago, Aurora2 said:

I think that MS turns all of her scenes with good-looking men into chem tests with her body language and the way she looks intently at her screen partner.  

MS always looks  like she's ready to unhinge her jaws and swallow her partner whole.  She even gave Nathan that look and I was all "ew gross, he's your brother"  

 

6 hours ago, LeftPhalange said:

I thought he didn't find out about Charlotte until after she was already born?

The story he told was that Helena hired Daphne to sleep with him and steal his junk.  Then Valentin found out that she had mixed it with Lulu's egg but had not yet implanted it into Daphne.  So Val stole the embryo, hired Claudette to carry it.  

Is it possible that this Valentin Cassadine isn't the real Valentin Cassadine?  The story that the Cassadines, especially Helena was scared of Valentin doesn't jive with Igor the hunchback stutterer who was at the WSB.  Is it possible that Igor, who was likely a janitor and not a trainee, who was all googly over Anna but she dismissed him (because of the hunchback stutteriness).  So he somehow, somewhere takes on Valentin's identity and comes looking for the Cassadine fortune (you know, 20 years later, just like everyone else who waits for revenge)

Edited January 21, 2017 by Perkie

[LeftPhalange]

20 minutes ago, Perkie said:

So Val stole the embryo, hired Claudette to carry it.  

...why? Reasons? Helena? Commercial break?

[Perkie]

8 minutes ago, LeftPhalange said:

why? Reasons? Helena? Commercial break?

Why did he hire Claudette?

 Because he couldn't flush the embryo down the drain?  He wanted a baby to love?  

[LeftPhalange]

10 minutes ago, Perkie said:

Why did he hire Claudette?

 Because he couldn't flush the embryo down the drain?  He wanted a baby to love?  

How about throw it in the trash and move on. Ugh this story is so incredibly stupid and ridiculous. It's tied with Nelly's revenge, Julian's rectconned redemption, drunk ass loser Alexis, everything involving Freako and Liez, everything involving Anna, the relationship between a woman and her tree, Who Fake Killed Morgan?, whatever Ava's story is, Kaka/Dullen, and Single White Female Olivia Jerome for being the worst story on the show.

[Perkie]

sorry, double post.  I blame stupid greasy haired Franco

Edited January 21, 2017 by Perkie

[ulkis]

5 hours ago, dr. gailey said:

I also am down with Charlotte not even being hers in the end if it would mean her little ass was leaving town like Claudette. She can also take Avery with her.

Johnny's guys gotta come back and drop her off on a farm.

[peachmangosteen]

Quote

I remember Sam mentioning how Liz was one of those woman who play the victim or some shit like that ...

Well ...

6 hours ago, dr. gailey said:

I hate that Jelly have me feeling sorry for Lulu. This mess they are writing for her is some straight bullshit. I just can't hate on her for wanting her child back. She is a victim in this mess as much as Charlotte is. She didn't ask for her eggs to be stolen and fertilized by a psycho that killed her brother and did other shit to her friends and family. I can't take this shit anymore. 

This is all so true and Lulu should be coming off as undoubtedly and completely sympathetic and rootable in this story. And yet. I do think a lot of it is the writing, of course, but honestly I think ER's acting is also contributing to Lulu coming off more unhinged than righteous. She goes for the crazy eyes too much. And she doesn't really convey enough pathos in the scenes where she goes off on Valentin or looks wistfully at Charlotte with Nina. That being said, lately I have been more on Lulu's side. I thought ER was better with this in the scene with Charlotte in the closet. And lately when she's been yelling at Valentin I've been cheering her because I'm starting to get tired of Valentin's smug smile. I enjoyed it at first, but it's getting boring now. 

2 hours ago, Perkie said:

I think we're supposed to beleive that they've been a happy little family all along until recently when Val "became dangerous" so Claud took off with Charlotte.  Doesn't explain why Charlotte so easily believed that first Nathan than Griffin were her father if she already had a father.  

Is it possible that this Valentin Cassadine isn't the real Valentin Cassadine?  The story that the Cassadines, especially Helena was scared of Valentin doesn't jive with Igor the hunchback stutterer who was at the WSB.  Is it possible that Igor, who was likely a janitor and not a trainee, who was all googly over Anna but she dismissed him (because of the hunchback stutteriness).  So he somehow, somewhere takes on Valentin's identity and comes looking for the Cassadine fortune (you know, 20 years later, just like everyone else who waits for revenge)

I mean I knew that these writers were hacks who had no plan whatsoever, but seeing in writing just how nonsensical and retconned these two stories have been just really illuminates how awful they are. And then you have the Julian story and Nelle. Is there any story right now that hasn't been retconned to death/makes any kind of logical sense?

Edited January 21, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[Darklazr]

14 hours ago, Ambrosefolly said:

Was that RC's stupid idea or Jelly's?

 

I am not so sure. Unless the order comes from above, I think Jelly will continue trash characters like Lulu and Liz without giving them even a little bit of redemption, because I don't think Jelly particular likes those character. I remember Sam mentioning how Liz was one of those woman who play the victim or some shit like that, and then we saw how unsympathetically they wrote Lulu during Dante/Valerie's affair. For some bizarre reason they like Nina, making her totally more awesome at as an editor in chief of a fashion magazine than Maxie, who worked directly with Kate Howard the entire time Kate was leading Crimison, ran it almost solely when Kate lost her mind and has always had a general interest in fashion while Nina could never held down a retail job and couldn't even dress herself. They probably love writing for Valentin, mostly because they just make up whatever and not have to study te history of the show. Unlike Valerie, Valentin might have a longer shelf life because he is a soft hearted villian instead of a flawed good guy.

I think it all boils down to pets / gets and BH and maybe ER are not part of that agenda.  

The writing for Elizabeth and Nik turned nasty in 2009 and for Jax in 2011 when the show tried to get rid of all three actors in 2011.  FV clearly saw no value in keeping BH who by the way has been popular since day one and is only using her now because Franco sucks, hard. The writing for Julian was really bad and we now know WvD's contract is up for renewal, so FV clearly has a pattern in trying to get rid of his non pets / gets.

[Ambrosefolly]

Quote

 

Quote

I remember Sam mentioning how Liz was one of those woman who play the victim or some shit like that ...

Well ...

 

 

 

I know, but it isn't exclusive to Liz. It is Ava and Kiki's favorite card, but no calls them out on it, except Michael if they can pry him away from his latest dull pairing. Sam has probably played it a few times herself. ReHe has put in more years into GH than KeMo, is arguably as popular as her while never having her character getting the hard push to accept her into the canvas, yet KeMo not only seems to have the OTP in BM's Jason and got paired with Michael Easton's characters twice and JT's Patrick (which wasn't bad, just badly done), not to mention she is now related to most of the canvas by blood. For whatever reason they torpedoed Liz's most promising pairing with AJ and now she is stuck trying to make Franco less terrible.  The only reason Liz has a sister is for Rachel's benefit, not hers. I think the greatest evidence of the distain for Liz is the Tom Baker. Jelly made it clear this entire thing was about Franco, not Liz and boy, was it ever! Tom Baker could have a great storyline for Liz to finally confront her own issues, but it was Franco being locked in dog cage. The only small silver lining is that Tom, not Franco turned out to be the most sympathetic person in the story, meaning that their Franco postive story back fired. 

Edited January 21, 2017 by Ambrosefolly

[HeatLifer]

Quote

yet KeMo not only seems to have the OTP in BM's Jason

I mean, if you're a person who believes having an OTP is important...I think the problem with Liz in that area happened the second this show no longer considered Lucky to be the love of her life. That was Liz's OTP. But when show decides to make it JASON for Liz, when Jason already had an OTP himself (and other characters he placed above Liz, as well), it's Liz who suffered. She was then placed in various different relationships that the show (and several regimes) never took seriously because they wouldn't move her beyond Jason at the end of the day. Even now with Franco, they still continue to have Liz connected to Jason and Sam when she should have a relationship with a man who has NOTHING to do with those characters, IMO. 

Edited January 21, 2017 by HeatLifer