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SilverStormm

BoJack Horseman

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Ah, yes, I do remember that now. I think because they presented Beatrice's memories as sometimes hazy and a conflation of past/present characters, I initially assumed that scene between her and Bojack to be an instance of her mental distortion. But the scene did end up playing pretty straightforwardly - I was also watching late at night, so I was a little hazy myself. I think also because most of the flashbacks were so far back in the past, I assumed all of the Beatrice stuff was "older" than the last 20 years.

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Just finished binge-watching the new season.  I guess I'm in the minority with the Diane stuff; I enjoyed watching her, and I kind of understood why she would be pissed at Mr. Peanutbutter for converting one of their rooms into a Belle library without her permission.  She's right in that Mr. Peanutbutter is always making these grand gestures as a way to make their marriage something it isn't.  Maybe my feelings for Mr. Peanutbutter influence my opinion, because I've never been able to stand the character.  Sure, he's nice, he's upbeat, but it isn't normal to be THAT nice and upbeat, all the time.  If I were Diane, I would get sick of it, too. 

The Beatrice stuff was very well done, and hard to watch.  Ditto, Princess Carolyn.  Todd, I couldn't care less about, but I am interested in where they take his asexuality next season.  Bojack and Hollyhock were charming together.  I'm glad he has a little sister, because I think it just might be the push he needs to get help and turn his life around.  She's the only family member who really likes him and wants him around.  For Bojack, that's HUGE.  Let's hope he doesn't screw it up.

Edited by Sweet Summer Child
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57 minutes ago, Sweet Summer Child said:

Maybe my feelings for Mr. Peanutbutter influence my opinion, because I've never been able to stand the character.  Sure, he's nice, he's upbeat, but it isn't normal to be THAT nice and upbeat, all the time

Isn't Mr. Peanutbutter a golden retriever? If so, yes, it is normal for him to be that nice and upbeat all the time. :) 

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7 hours ago, Loandbehold said:

Isn't Mr. Peanutbutter a golden retriever? If so, yes, it is normal for him to be that nice and upbeat all the time. :) 

Then I could never marry a golden retriever. ;)

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I thought Mr. Peanutbutter was a yellow lab - from the Labrador Peninsula! (Which: I mean, that's a dumb, not even a pun, but I laughed.)  Regardless, that kind of always happy upbeat enthusiasm is taxing to deal with in real life and I totally get where Diane is coming from.

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3 hours ago, Eeksquire said:

from the Labrador Peninsula

Which I didn't even know until this show that it was a real place.

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On 9/10/2017 at 7:10 PM, tennisgurl said:

I haven't watched most of the season yet, so I am trying not to look at the above posts, but I just wanted to say that I applaud this show for waiting until season Four to play Horse with No Name. That was great restraint they showed, and they used it at just the right time!

And they chose a really beautiful cover too.

On 9/11/2017 at 2:24 AM, Beatriceblake said:

The relationship stuff worked less well though. Would Ralph really go from wanting to have a child with Princess Carolyn to breaking up with her when she's clearly drunk and extremely upset? Also the Belle room being the thing that pushed Diane over the edge with Mr Peanutbutter felt contrived.

Yep, I thought both of those breakups felt off. They needed the couples to break up for drama or story purposes, but they didn't give us a good explanation of why those people actually wanted to end it.

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On 9/12/2017 at 9:46 PM, DrSpaceman73 said:

He tries to make a nice gesture, a wonderful one, and her response is basically "How dare you make my dream come true!!!"  Jesus.  I generally like her and relate to her, but that was pretty ugly how she got mad at him over it. 

I agree. In the first 3 seasons, I loved Diane. This season was iffy for me with her, and then that moment really pissed me off.

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On ‎7‎/‎21‎/‎2015 at 6:22 PM, random chance said:

Oh I know!  I was trying to figure out who the real life "Uncle Hanky" was (like, did they finish this before the Cosby business?) and then I realized that Hollywoo is probably filled with Uncle Hankys - Cosby is just the U.H. of the moment. 

As I keep reading about the Hollywood perverts lately for some reason this comment by you about this show just stuck in my head.  And you are being proven exactly right. 

There are FAR more Uncle Hanky's than any of us, at least outside the business, realized. 

So much so that Cosby almost seems to be the norm rather than the outlier. 

Not to the extent that Cosby did......... with the drugs and the hotel rooms (and the jazz and the pudding pops........), but more common in terms of the sexual indiscretions that I think most of us suspected. 

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On 9/12/2017 at 11:46 PM, DrSpaceman73 said:

This is the most depressing cartoon ever made. 

I guess you didn't watch the final season of Moral Orel.

 

Though, even with the very downbeat last season I thoroughly recommend you watch Moral Orel. I think you can get some of the episodes if not all of them on YouTube. It is by turns enormously funny and quite dark. It's set in bible-belt middle America, so it is not much like Bojack in setting or theme other than the common thread of how families seem to set up each succeeding generation for their own particular sorrow.

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3 hours ago, nosleepforme said:

I'm not good with titles either, but since it's the season of Philbert, what about:

  • "Season 5: What Bojack Is It Right Now.Com"- Discussion

I like that a lot! Does everyone agree? I'll leave it until Thursday.  And thank you, @nosleepforme for all the articles and links you post. ?????❤️ It's wonderful to know someone who loves BoJack as much as I do (probably more).  

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Free Churro hit me very hard having gone through the exact gamut of emotions when my mother died—and I fully expect to do the same when my father passes. I absolutely loved this episode for putting so many of my (and others’) emotions into words. And for understanding that one of the coping methods for growing up in a bitterly dysfunctional family is to cultivate a dark sometimes morbid sense of humor. 

This is honestly one of the best series I’ve ever seen. 

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I binge watched the season, yesterday.  It looks like I'm on a different page than everyone else, because I thought Free Churro was the weakest episode of the season.  I just didn't like it, much.

Also, I've read some comments elsewhere about how Diane has become just as bad as Bojack, which confuses the crap out of me.  Diane wasn't at her best this season, it's true, but in what universe is she just as bad as Bojack, who has screwed many, many people over, without consequence?  Is it because Diane is female and does a couple of selfish, crappy things, this season?  Is that enough to make a woman just as bad as a man who does the shit Bojack does?

Oh, who am I kidding, of course it is. *sigh*

Edited by Sweet Summer Child
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26 minutes ago, nosleepforme said:

I liked it, though it is very hard for me usually to just follow a monologue for a longer period of time.  But I think how high you rate this episode really depends on your own relationship with your parents.If yours is similar to Bojack's, then it's easier to relate to it. Though generally, I think the episode did a great job at portraying these conflicted emotions of regret, anger and grief, as well as the realisation that you'll never get something that you desperately wanted from a person, because they're no longer among you.

See, I do have a similar relationship with my mother, but I still couldn't get into it. To me, it felt like a rehash of everything we already knew about the Bojack/Beatrice relationship, so it felt like the season was put on pause with that particular episode.  I didn't like the undersea episode from season three, either, so I think I'm just the odd one out.

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6 minutes ago, nosleepforme said:

But that's kind of the point of grief, isn't it? When somebody you know dies, your life kind of comes to a halt and all your left with is your memories and the things unsaid/undone, which leads you to ponder about the past. While this episode may not have brought new knowledge or advanced the storyline, it did really convey these feelings of loss, regret, pain and stillness really well and for an episode that's basically only a monologue with little background jokes, it's actually quite impressive how it is still captivating.

I can see your point, it just wasn't working, for me.  It's a well written episode, though, and I really liked the final gag.  That was pretty good.

If I had to pick a favorite episode from this season, it would probably be The Amelia Earhart Story.  I liked what it revealed about Princess Carolyn, what drives her, and why she wants to be a mother, so badly.  It was also just the right amount of dark, with PC's mom talking about losing numbers, and what-not.  Ouch.

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I used to love this show, but I'm four episodes into the new season and I'm really not into it anymore. The dialogue oftentimes seems forced and unnatural, especially during the many times when the show creators are on a soapbox about something (of course shows should discuss social issues if they want to, but I feel like this show is heavy-handed in the execution). The show is also very...faux-cutesy in the forced Tumblr-esque way that "woke" millennials often are...I hope you understand what I mean. Also I just feel like the show is getting repetitive at this point and the characters have not experienced much emotional growth. How long are we going to watch these privileged rich 1%-er people thinking they have real problems when they really don't and creating the same problems for themselves over and over again? The season parodies prestige TV but I think it also has a lot of the same problems as many prestige TV shows. Plus that plotline with Yolanda's family was just bizarre. Overall I feel like I'm watching a show created by Redditors or something.

I don't think the show changed but probably I changed and I'm not the target audience anymore.

Edited by BuyMoreAndSave
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What bugs me about Judah is that he clearly has Aspie traits, yet it's never called that, but made fun of for comedic purposes. Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt also did that. Why is ASD considered fair game to laugh at (and not named) in otherwise intelligent, insightful comedies? It gets passed off as your normal nerdy shy behaviour when it clearly ain't. We now have 1 in 68 kids diagnosed with it (+more undiagnosed girls), so I wish TV writers would keep up with the program.

Todd's asexual behaviour is never made fun of in the same way for instance. Its also given a label and explained that it's OK to be that way multiple times.

Beatrice's and her mother's life are excruciating to watch because all of the suffering is a product of insititutionalised misogyny. Beatrice's bad mothering is a scapegoat for it. This type of 'evil mothers' only exist because they're pushed into motherhood by patriarchy in the 1st place and are powerless and filled with resentment (which gets poured out onto the kid).

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In a season that was darker, at least ended much darker, than Season 4, I laughed a lot this season. Not sure what that says about me. Will Arnett gave a phenomenal performance in Free Churro. And, given that BoJack is so self-centered and his eulogy demonstrates this over and over, the final bit had me in stitches. I also liked The Show Stopper. It was trippy and awful and funny and awful. Trying to figure out whether we watching Philbert or real BoJack was confusing, but satisfying, if that makes any sense. 

Todd can be annoying, so an episode where he's front and center usually ranks near the bottom of the season and Planned Obsolescence fell into that category. But, I liked Diane's and Princess Caroline's episodes. Mr. Peanutbutter's episode not as much. He doesn't do much for me as a main character. I much prefer him in a supporting role. But, I was impressed w/ him as Philbert's "dead partner" and was shocked every time he cursed. 

And, we got a Character Actress Margo Martindale sighting! I thought we'd see more of her. I guess Season 6 can bring her back to Hollywoo. 

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I have to say that the Home Improvement joke(s) during the Halloween party, and Mr Peanutbutter doing the Tim Allen grunting noise and the jack o'lantern scene change made me laugh very hard and even now, days later, I'll remember it and laugh. 

 

And i I never liked Home Improvement...

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11 hours ago, nosleepforme said:

I was intrigued by them going into a direction with Mr. Peanutbutter where he is unlikeable and also messed up. I think so far he have only gotten to the "happy-go-lucky"-guy and comic relief in him so I thought that this season finally developed him beyond that.

I really liked the fact that MPB messed up, and even regressed a little, at the end.  I never found him particularly interesting, so hopefully, it will give him a much more interesting arc in season six.

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Can we take a moment to talk about the awesomeness of Whattimeisitnow.com ?? They are trying to make people to forget the time is right there in the corner of their computer screen--brilliant. The writing and acting on this show are exemplary. While I haaaate Bojack and often strongly dislike Diane, I appreciate that it's all in the way they're written and Alison Brie's amazing performance. Diane's ringtone is the perfect touch. It's one of those subtle character details this show does so well.

Did Flip remind anyone else of the head writer on "The Comeback" with Lisa Kudrow? Yikes, that character was epically creepy. 

I love the way this season tackled #MeToo. Gina just accepting Flip's harassment because she has a mortgage in SoCal is the realest explanation of why women don't come forward I've seen thus far.

Flip's being a soft-spoken harasser made him so creepy--I wonder if he purposefully sounded like Woody Allen? *shudder* He reminded me of the "nice" guy at work who asked me if my "titties are real"  (I don't miss being 24 and shy).

I work with actors and I live in California so I meet the Diane and Bojack archetypes at least once per week. That delusional pretentiousness, turning minor inconveniences into major emotional meltdowns, deplorables who bemoan unions, voted Obama and are only slightly racist *sigh* (i.e. Diane's boss).

Yay Issa Rae and Wanda Sykes as the lesbian couple!

All in all great season...very dark but great.

Edited by Drumpf1737
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I thought this was another great season, although I liked last season better. Maybe I liked all the stuff about the Horseman family, maybe I thought it had more stand out episodes (The Old Sugerman Place was one of my favorites episodes of any show last year), but I just enjoyed last season more. Not that this season wasn't great too, I think I just liked last seasons vibe more. 

Still, I thought this season had a lot going for it. The parody of overly convoluted cop shows with tough anti heroes was hilariously spot on, and the episode with Issa Rae and Wanda Sykes as a couple who are telling stories about the main cast was pretty awesome. I do hope that next season, we get some more real progression from the main cast. I get that a big part of the show is how hard it is for people to change for the better (if its at all possible) and that people mess up and fall into old habits a lot, but as a viewer, its just exhausting to have Bojack get closer to some kind of breakthrough every season, only for it all to fall apart by the following season. Last season was probably Bojack at his best, and this season ends with him at his lowest. Same with most of the other characters. They inch towards some development, and fall apart. 

 Officer Meow-Meow Fuzzyface as a very obvious undercover cop might have been my favorite joke of the season. 

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Princess Carolyn and Diane, at least, are in distinctly different places from where they've been before, so the next part of their path has to be at least somewhat different.

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I posted a while ago about how I watched the first four episodes of Season 5 and hated it. I wasn't going to even finish the season but my husband wanted to watch it so, I ended up watching it too. Anyway the season picked up after episode 4 although I still didn't like it all that much. I feel like we're getting the same ending every season (right down to the "altered consciousness" thing that already happened twice in the penultimate episodes of previous seasons!). Bojack did some terrible shit and alienated someone else, Diane is even more depressed and dissatisfied after purposely fucking up her life even more for idealism, Mr. Peanutbutter is avoiding his problems, Princess Carolyn is pretending like she isn't about to prioritize her career over everything and everyone else even though we all know she will, and Todd bounces off aimlessly to the next zany scheme. Todd and Diane in particular have become pretty insufferable. I doubt I will watch the next season and after five seasons of going in circles the show had better do something else with the characters or just pack it up.

Edited by BuyMoreAndSave

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