Figure Skating

[BelleBrit]

17 minutes ago, Darknight said:

The president of USA fed invested in her. Her father does too. They already decided she is their ice princess. So the federation never learns from their past mistakes. Alysa, her coach, and her dad look at the Russian jrs as inspirations.  Do they not know Russian skaters(not including Liza) do not last long. They get burned out and injuried. 

 

As much as i hate how much attention and now pressure Alysa is getting, a small part of me is happy the Today and Tonight show is covering a figure skater. Skaters are not popular here(not counting the legends and how skating use to be popular) like it is in Russia and Japan. So maybe more people will watch and follow skating. 

One thing that stuck out to me about the  Gracie article was how her mother said that it wasn't just her own expectations that were crushed by 2016 worlds, but that Gracie felt "the expectations of her country" and "the expectations of her agent" on her shoulders at 2016 worlds.  For one, figure skating is just not popular enough that Gracie should have felt like the country's expectations were on her. And secondly, I'm not even sure that the figure skating community's expectations were necessarily on her for 2016 worlds, even if she felt that way. I think they did hope that the "drought" would end, but didn't really care if it was Ashley or Gracie who got it done. She had just had disappointing performances at the grand prix final and 4CC that season (and even though she won 2016 nationals, she had a pop in the short program).  Heck, Gracie even bombed her short program at her first senior nationals in 2013, even though she pulled up to silver, so I feel like there was always issues with pressure there.  The agent, I just don't trust, she was still promoting Gracie as an Olympic contender in 2017 spring/summer when it was clear that she was losing her triples and spiraling downwards.  Now that same agent has Alysa. The circle of life. Even though Nathan's issues at the Olympics get blamed on his layout changes, it's telling that he is such a grounded and seemingly consistent person that the pressure got to him too in the Olympic year.

Edited January 28, 2019 by BelleBrit

[Darknight]

2 minutes ago, BelleBrit said:

One thing that stuck out to me about the  Gracie article was how her mother said that it wasn't just her own expectations that were crushed by 2016 worlds, but that Gracie felt "the expectations of her country" and "the expectations of her agent" on her shoulders at 2016.  For one, figure skating is just not popular enough that Gracie should have felt like the country's expectations were on her. And secondly, I'm not even sure that the figure skating community's expectations were necessarily on her for 2016 worlds, even if she felt that way. I think they did hope that the "drought" would end, but didn't really care if it was Ashley or Gracie who got it done. She had just had disappointing performances at the grand prix final and 4CC that season (and even though she won 2016 nationals, she had a pop in the short program).  Heck, Gracie even bombed her short program at her first senior nationals in 2013, even though she pulled up to silver, so I feel like there was always issues with pressure there.  The agent, I just don't trust, she was still promoting Gracie as an Olympic contender in 2017 spring/summer when it was clear that she was losing her triples and spiraling downwards.  Now that same agent has Alysa. The circle of life.

My heart breaks for Gracie. It really does. She seems like a perfectionist too. 

 

Again, when will the fed learn from their mistakes? Who is this agent and why is she allowed to do this? Alysa's father needs to keep that lady far away from her. 

[BelleBrit]

16 hours ago, Darknight said:

My heart breaks for Gracie. It really does. She seems like a perfectionist too. 

 

Again, when will the fed learn from their mistakes? Who is this agent and why is she allowed to do this? Alysa's father needs to keep that lady far away from her. 

Yuki Saegusa of IMG. She is also Mirai, Adam, the Shibs, Bradie, Nathan, Kristi, and Karen's agent (to name a few, haha). I'm sure she is not a bad person, she seems to have a particularly nice relationship with Nathan, she also went to Yale and seemed to really promote the idea of him going to college. I just wondered how much and what she knew about Gracie's downward spiral, though to be fair the NYT article did say that people were trying to help her for a while, and she was resistant.  I just remember Gracie having her tough nationals in 2017 and Frank dumping her, and it seemed like there was an instant effort for her team to launch a media offensive to show her sponsors that everything was ok (She came in 6th at nationals and still went on the Today Show afterwards to talk about her coaching change, and there was also a strange ESPN W article, linked below, that had a very "cleanup on aisle 4" feel. Plus, she was assigned to the Japan Open 2017 Fall IMG event in the summer, even though it was clear that she had lost her triples by Stars on Ice that Spring).  Not blaming the agent, but I'm sure she's very excited about Alysa and all of the money that she could potentially make off of her if she's "the next big thing".

(here's the link-http://www.espn.com/espnw/life-style/article/18647109/gracie-gold-season-felt-tom-brady-first-half-super-bowl)

Edited January 29, 2019 by BelleBrit

[Minneapple]

16 hours ago, SeanC said:

Very, very few female skaters even train the triple Axel (beyond some doing it in harness for a lark) because it's so difficult.

They don't train it because nobody does it in competition -- until now. I'm sure Mirai landing the triple in the Olympics last year made other skaters sit up and take notice. Now we have Mirai and Alysa landing the triple in two major competitions in a relatively short period of time. Hey, if she can do it, so can I.

I'm not saying that girls shouldn't train the triple axel. But reading about all the injuries and the hip problems -- they should be careful, have the right coach, see whatever doctor they need to to stay healthy -- and pray to whatever god they pray to for a little luck. Maybe not copy the assembly line methods employed by the Russians. 

[Darknight]

1 hour ago, BelleBrit said:

Yuki Saegusa of IMG. She is also Mirai, Adam, the Shibs, Bradie, Nathan, Kristy, and Karen's agent (to name a few, haha). I'm sure she is not a bad person, she seems to have a particularly nice relationship with Nathan, she also went to Yale and seemed to really promote the idea of him going to college. I just wondered how much and what she knew about Gracie's downward spiral, though to be fair the NYT article did say that people were trying to help her for a while, and she was resistant.  I just remember Gracie having her tough nationals in 2017 and Frank dumping her, and it seemed like there was an instant effort for her team to launch a media offensive to show her sponsors that everything was ok (She came in 6th at nationals and still went on the Today Show afterwards to talk about her coaching change, and there was also a strange ESPN W article, linked below, that had a very "cleanup on aisle 4" feel. Plus, she was assigned to the Japan Open 2017 Fall IMG event in the summer, even though it was clear that she had lost her triples by Stars on Ice that Spring).  Not blaming the agent, but I'm sure she's very excited about Alysa and all of the money that she could potentially make off of her if she's "the next big thing".

(here's the link-http://www.espn.com/espnw/life-style/article/18647109/gracie-gold-season-felt-tom-brady-first-half-super-bowl)

I forgot about her and Frank. It was so heartbreaking to hear he dropped her and she had to find out from the media. I wish someone was advocating for Gracie and these other young skaters. What happens if Alysa doesn't make the team for 2022? What about injuries? 

54 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

They don't train it because nobody does it in competition -- until now. I'm sure Mirai landing the triple in the Olympics last year made other skaters sit up and take notice. Now we have Mirai and Alysa landing the triple in two major competitions in a relatively short period of time. Hey, if she can do it, so can I.

I'm not saying that girls shouldn't train the triple axel. But reading about all the injuries and the hip problems -- they should be careful, have the right coach, see whatever doctor they need to to stay healthy -- and pray to whatever god they pray to for a little luck. Maybe not copy the assembly line methods employed by the Russians. 

Also, men and women bodies are different. It's easier for a man to do a 3a and quads than a woman.  A 3a is also forward not backwards. Many skaters quit if they can't learn to do 2a because that is needed for ladies to be competitive.

 

Mirai got injuries doing the 3a. I think she was determined no matter what happened. I think learning any jump coaches, parents, and skaters need to be careful and take it easy. Not push and push. Seeing a skater doing quads and 3a does not mean you should do them when you don't have a good foundation first. 

Edited January 28, 2019 by Darknight

[iMonrey]

Quote

I get this is an unpopular opinion, but Jason Brown is just not up to snuff. I don't feel any particular emotion from him because I'm always so nervous that he's going to screw it up because he's trying things for which he doesn't have the skill. His expression is overwrought and ...almost comical. Third seems exactly where he should be. It matches his skill, but rewards him for his non-jumping technical proficiency. He doesn't deserve better

I'm right there with you. His artistry does nothing for me because he simply doesn't have the goods to be anything but a show skater. And I know this is shallow but I can't be the only one who thinks he's kind of creepy looking. 

I loved Alyssa's performance but she's only 13. She's going to hit a growth spurt pretty soon so there's really no telling if she can maintain her technical ability. 

[annzeepark914]

21 hours ago, Tippi said:

 

Love Jason's grown up look.  Hoping that next year he won't get old man music and sweaters.  That had Brian Orser written all over it--if 50 year old Brian was skating in a show somewhere in 2019.

 

Great observation! What is it with some of Brian's skaters, emulating his early skating style, music & costumes? I've always liked Brian but it really bothered me to see Javi disappear one year after going to Orser. He'd show up at competitions wearing slacks & a sweater, and actually skating just like Brian. It was *very* weird. Then, Javi skated a program as, I think, Charlie Chaplin and it was so eerie, like he'd become the new Orser. Maybe this is the male version of the Stepford Wives. Brian keeps recreating himself so he can watch "himself" compete again 😎  

[SeanC]

4 hours ago, Minneapple said:

They don't train it because nobody does it in competition -- until now. I'm sure Mirai landing the triple in the Olympics last year made other skaters sit up and take notice. Now we have Mirai and Alysa landing the triple in two major competitions in a relatively short period of time. Hey, if she can do it, so can I.

The triple Axel has been a part of women's figure skating since Midori Ito in the late 1980s.  Female skaters have always known it was possible, and valuable if they could do it.  It requires exceptional Axel technique to have a shot, and few have made a serious effort at it for that reason.

Quote

I'm not saying that girls shouldn't train the triple axel. But reading about all the injuries and the hip problems -- they should be careful, have the right coach, see whatever doctor they need to to stay healthy -- and pray to whatever god they pray to for a little luck. Maybe not copy the assembly line methods employed by the Russians.

No Russian skater out of the "assembly line" performs a triple Axel.  The only one is Liza, very much Alexei Mishin's prize pupil of the last ten years.

3 hours ago, Darknight said:

I wish someone was advocating for Gracie and these other young skaters.

"Advocating" for what?  Why are you so eager to frame Alysa as some poor waif who needs to be rescued?  She has, to all appearances thus far, a smart father/family and supportive, intelligent coaches who've nurtured her talents quite exceptionally, and seems to be very much enjoying her career.

Quote

What happens if Alysa doesn't make the team for 2022?

Then, as with every other figure skater aiming to make the team, she'd be disappointed.

Quote

What about injuries? 

What about them?  Pretty much all figure skaters get injured at some point.

[Minneapple]

23 minutes ago, SeanC said:

The triple Axel has been a part of women's figure skating since Midori Ito in the late 1980s.  Female skaters have always known it was possible, and valuable if they could do it.  It requires exceptional Axel technique to have a shot, and few have made a serious effort at it for that reason.

No Russian skater out of the "assembly line" performs a triple Axel.  The only one is Liza, very much Alexei Mishin's prize pupil of the last ten years.

My point was that the triple axel hasn't been a regular part of women's skating. But Mirai and now Alysa have done it within such a short period of time in major competitions, and have gotten a lot of attention for it, so more young skaters might see that as a goal to try for.  

I didn't say that any Russian skaters had performed a triple axel. I only meant that their factory technique might not be the greatest to aspire to.

[Darknight]

23 minutes ago, SeanC said:

The triple Axel has been a part of women's figure skating since Midori Ito in the late 1980s.  Female skaters have always known it was possible, and valuable if they could do it.  It requires exceptional Axel technique to have a shot, and few have made a serious effort at it for that reason.

No Russian skater out of the "assembly line" performs a triple Axel.  The only one is Liza, very much Alexei Mishin's prize pupil of the last ten years.

"Advocating" for what?  Why are you so eager to frame Alysa as some poor waif who needs to be rescued?  She has, to all appearances thus far, a smart father/family and supportive, intelligent coaches who've nurtured her talents quite exceptionally, and seems to be very much enjoying her career.

Then, as with every other figure skater aiming to make the team, she'd be disappointed.

What about them?  Pretty much all figure skaters get injured at some point.

I think my point is she is a young skater. That's  the issue. Yes, she needs to have someone protect and advocate for her. She does not have a career yet, it's  just starting. We've all seen this happen many times before with the USA federation. They want the next ice princess. They don't let skaters grow or look at themselves to grow skaters. They just hype skaters up and burn them out. They're telling everyone she is the future of skating and will make 2022. She will compete and win against the Russian and Japanese ladies. She skates better than them. What if that doesn't happen? Especially now with all the pressure and I'm sure sponsors she has. What happens if she gets injuries? Will she feel she let everyone down?  It's not just about the disappointment for herself but for everyone too. Her family, the federation, her sponsors, fans. Then the media turns on skaters who don't live up to the hype. Let the kid skate and grow. Not put the whole federation on her back and hype her up. Also, injuries in developing young skaters can be very serious. Especially with quads. Their bodies are still growing. I want to see Alysa grow and be competitive. I don't want her to be hyped up and to be pushed by the USA federation so much that she gets burned out and/or feels as if she is letting everyone down if she doesn't live up to the hype. 

[KittenPokerCheater]

It seems like most skating federations  want metals; shiny gold objects they can brag about.  They don't care about injuries, or if a skater is too young.  It's turning me off the sport.

[displayname]

10 hours ago, SeanC said:

It requires exceptional Axel technique to have a shot, and few have made a serious effort at it for that reason.

I don't think it's exactly this reason. Mostly I think it's because mostly it wasn't needed. After Ito retired, we'd have to get all the way to Asada to see another consistent 3A, and she was against Kim. Kim WAS training a 3A; since she had much better quality toe jumps, got more of an advantage on PCS, and Asada got dinged on URs far too often, she focused on pushing her quality of execution more.

I don't think the women with good axel technique have suddenly become more ubiquitous. I did use to think that it would happen if the 3A became a staple element (which it slowly will become IMO). But it more looks like the focus is on getting it rotated, using the modern technology to squeeze your body tight, than any excpetional technique.

Edited January 29, 2019 by displayname

[Dr.OO7]

Something else that's really interesting about the triple Axels phenomenon among the women skaters:

When Tonya Harding and Midori Ito landed theirs, it was noted how strong and muscular they were and assumed that that was the reason they could do it.  The 8 women--or girls, in Liu's case--who have landed it since are all delicate-looking things, making it truly remarkable that they can pull it off.

[displayname]

26 minutes ago, Camille said:

Something else that's really interesting about the triple Axels phenomenon among the women skaters:

When Tonya Harding and Midori Ito landed theirs, it was noted how strong and muscular they were and assumed that that was the reason they could do it.  The 8 women--or girls, in Liu's case--who have landed it since are all delicate-looking things, making it truly remarkable that they can pull it off.

Because the technology is simply different. The skaters now know exactly how to place their body and squeeze tight to rotate the jumps. It makes Ito's (and Harding's, although her technique on it wasn't the best) achievement MORE impressive on it, because of it. The zinger? I've read that the boots then were around 1kg heavy!!!! And they both JUMPED HIGHER than any girl who's attempted it since then.

[Darknight]

14 hours ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

It seems like most skating federations  want metals; shiny gold objects they can brag about.  They don't care about injuries, or if a skater is too young.  It's turning me off the sport.

USA want medals but also want to show off in my opinion. I mean we use to be dominate.  Some feds care about medals and winning like Russia but USA really wants to prove they're amazing. It's pride. I don't think they care about injuries or the skaters. They never learn their lesson at all. They never look at themselves. They just push the next big thing and pray it goes well. Then all we have are burned out skaters who think they're failures if they don't win or live up to the hype.  I'm sure they're pushing quads now for the ladies now to yell that their ladies have quads too. 

 

I wish they would develop their skaters and stop worrying about Russia and Japan. We are not Russia and Japan. We are USA. Stop hyping skaters up to show off and make sure they have the right skills and right technique. Let young skaters grow and make mistakes. They're kids. 

Well Worlds will not have any USA, Japanese, or Russian judges for ladies and I think men's. Finally. It's about time. Judges should not be allowed to judge skaters from their own countries. ISU must be getting the message that judges should not judge skaters from their own country. 

[caracas1914]

22 hours ago, BelleBrit said:

Yuki Saegusa of IMG. She is also Mirai, Adam, the Shibs, Bradie, Nathan, Kristi, and Karen's agent (to name a few, haha). I'm sure she is not a bad person, she seems to have a particularly nice relationship with Nathan, she also went to Yale and seemed to really promote the idea of him going to college. I just wondered how much and what she knew about Gracie's downward spiral, though to be fair the NYT article did say that people were trying to help her for a while, and she was resistant.  I just remember Gracie having her tough nationals in 2017 and Frank dumping her, and it seemed like there was an instant effort for her team to launch a media offensive to show her sponsors that everything was ok (She came in 6th at nationals and still went on the Today Show afterwards to talk about her coaching change, and there was also a strange ESPN W article, linked below, that had a very "cleanup on aisle 4" feel. Plus, she was assigned to the Japan Open 2017 Fall IMG event in the summer, even though it was clear that she had lost her triples by Stars on Ice that Spring).  Not blaming the agent, but I'm sure she's very excited about Alysa and all of the money that she could potentially make off of her if she's "the next big thing".

(here's the link-http://www.espn.com/espnw/life-style/article/18647109/gracie-gold-season-felt-tom-brady-first-half-super-bowl)

Did Frank Carrol callously “ dump her”?  Mind you, of course it’s a possibility but it could also be he had valid and justifiable reasons for terminating the coaching.   I don’t think we’ll ever know the complete story and skating stories like life are mini “Rashomons.”

[BelleBrit]

37 minutes ago, caracas1914 said:

Did Frank Carrol callously “ dump her”?  Mind you, of course it’s a possibility but it could also be he had valid and justifiable reasons for terminating the coaching.   I don’t think we’ll ever know the complete story and skating stories like life are mini “Rashomons.”

I didn't mean to imply a negative connotation with the word "dumped".  I do think that it was very clear that the coaching relationship wasn't working anymore.  Simply put, in this case, Frank seemed to be the dump-er rather than the dump-ee (like when he "dumped" Nagasu and Goebel, but unlike when he was the "dump-ee" of Michelle Kwan).

Edited January 29, 2019 by BelleBrit

[HartofDixie]

The Skating Lesson has returned to Twitter and has made their YouTube videos from the past year public again. Still not back on Instagram/Facebook.

[annzeepark914]

On 1/28/2019 at 1:32 PM, Darknight said:

As for Starr, by heart breaks for her. Her mom picks her music. Her mom is very specific on what she wants. I think her mom is the problem too. On top of her coaching issue. Her mom also has heart disease and had multiple heart attacks. I don't understand why they wouldn't let her stay in juniors. Maybe due to her fultz. Starr is not competitive and her mom needs to back off a bit. Money is tight but her coaching is not good. If something doesn't change then Starr will be left behind even further. 

This makes me sad. Had no idea.  Yes, sounds like Mom is the major problem here, maybe living her dreams through her child.

[Souris]

ESPN article: 'Nothing about it is easy': Skater's suicide leaves more questions than answers

[wintrygal]

On a different topic, I was watching a recent episode of Murdock Mysteries (here in Canada) last night, and an actor came on the screen who seemed to be very familiar, turns out it was Elvis Stojko!  It was a small role but he did very well, kudos Elvis!

[Jeddah]

6 hours ago, Darknight said:

Well Worlds will not have any USA, Japanese, or Russian judges for ladies and I think men's. Finally. It's about time. Judges should not be allowed to judge skaters from their own countries. ISU must be getting the message that judges should not judge skaters from their own country. 

If there are no judges from any of the countries with skaters competing then it will be judges from countries with very little connection to skating. They might not be as knowledgeable, and they definitely won’t be as experienced. A judge from a country with no figure skating presence isn’t necessarily going to be less biased than someone from the US, Russia, or Japan.

I think I’m in the minority on this board because I do like jumps and pushing the sport forward technically. To me that makes it as close to objective as possible judging-wide. Of course GOEs, levels, and underrotation calls are still subjective, but at least each jump has a set base value to start with.

[KittenPokerCheater]

This is wonderful and funny (and I agree with the author's opinion about how there should be an age requirement like they have in gymnastics). 

https://www.gofugyourself.com/its-time-the-us-figure-skating-championships-were-this-weekend-01-2019

[Mellowyellow]

Ok so thanks to you guys I now know Nathan's coach and the same as Mariah's coach. The coach really amuses me! It looked like he was still explaining stuff to Nathan when they were waiting for scores and then when the scores came up he looked mildly pleased and gave Nathan a pat. I dunno why but I found that really funny. 

He's not mean like Eteri right? Free Alina and send her to him! 

ETA: I watched the full Alina training video and it was heart breaking. I don't know what was being said but I sat through the entire footage and basically she was sent to skate, told off, sent to skate again, told off, rinse and repeat with Alina looking more upset and tired each time.

At one point Eteri walks out and takes Alina's plushy tissue holder toy (I am totally WTF at this stage) and then Alina looks teary and skates a bit more and then leaves with the male coach.

She started out not too bad but by the time I got to the end of the video she seemed to be doing worse and worse after all the telling off.

Seriously what the hell is their strategy? Tell her off until she gets it? It's not like she was wafting around and needed a stern lecture to focus. She was trying and then seemed to get worse the more they told her off. 

Edited January 30, 2019 by Mellowyellow

[Jaded]

Has this movie about Sonja Henie been mentioned previously?

Watch a Figure Skater Take Hollywood by Storm in ‘Sonja – The White Swan’ Trailer

[SeanC]

5 hours ago, Mellowyellow said:

He's not mean like Eteri right?

Raf’s students would describe him as a loveable curmudgeon.

[HartofDixie]

[Darknight]

21 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

This makes me sad. Had no idea.  Yes, sounds like Mom is the major problem here, maybe living her dreams through her child.

Her mom is a former skater too but had to quit. It is sad. 

Well, look at what article came out. https://olympics.nbcsports.com/2019/01/27/european-championships-analysis-female-russian-skaters-stars-rise-fast-but-burn-out-too-soon/

[Darknight]

The biggest issue with Eteri is her way or no way and the multiple repetitions. You can't keep doing that to skaters. Their bodies can't handle it. Puberty and the teen years requires a change in technique. I'm sure next year Eteri will blame Alina for being lazy. They need to change choreographers too. Dannii's choreography is not good. I'm sure with a different program that allows her to breathe will help her 

 

Also, I didn't know Russian media hates Eteri too. Yikes that's shocking to read. I also read some Russian fans are pissed to see Rika doing quads because she is going to ruin the Eteri skaters dominance. They want Eteri skaters to go undefended like Evengenia did for two years. Well, two years ago Rika was not a senior. She is now and is killing it. 

[Mellowyellow]

The denial of what was likely happening in that video by Eteri fans is just disturbing.

I've seen people say unless Alina publicly says she's been abused there is no proof she's being treated badly. Yes because poor Alina is really gonna have the balls to do that if she's been treated badly.

Like the fact that she constantly looks stressed out and teary means nothing? Or when Zhenya happily told a story about being dragged around on ice because she fell too often and acted like it was a completely normal thing (this was so disturbing and I'm so glad she woke up). Or the fact that Eteri, a woman in her 40s revealed private messages to slander a teenager. 

I'll drop this. I've just really got my hackles up about this.

[SeanC]

Evgenia is going to be touring with Canadian Stars on Ice this year.  That should be interesting.

[HartofDixie]

3 hours ago, SeanC said:

Evgenia is going to be touring with Canadian Stars on Ice this year.  That should be interesting.

I wish SOI was a North American too. Canada had Javi last year. Not too many skaters listed yet. Wonder who they are waiting on?

[SeanC]

7 hours ago, HartofDixie said:

I wish SOI was a North American too. Canada had Javi last year. Not too many skaters listed yet. Wonder who they are waiting on?

The cast list up so far is the same size as last year.

Returning:  Patrick, Elvis, Kaetlyn, Meagan & Eric, Kaitlyn & Andrew, Jeff

Minus:  Gabrielle, Javier, Tessa & Scott

Plus:  Evgenia, Kurt, Piper & Paul

[alexa]

That was a good article, because I know I have lost track of the Russian skaters over the years.  They all run together because some are new, some only last a year at the top, some disappear and you don't even notice.  I have to listen to the commentators to see if it is someone I should know or remember.  And it bothers me, although they earn their medal, that they win the Olympics but then have nothing after that to really prove they deserved it.  I guess I just feel like if you win the medal you should have something to show for it afterwards, and not have it just be a one time thing.  I like that Medvedeva (sp?) has moved on and is kind of reworking herself.  In the end, she will be a stronger skater for the long term.  I hated when she was winning everything, because it just felt like there had to be someone to beat her eventually, but then at the Olympics I felt bad for her that she worked so hard, won so much, and then lost to a newbie (who is now struggling some).  The whole thing is kind of a mess.  

[annzeepark914]

14 hours ago, SeanC said:

Evgenia is going to be touring with Canadian Stars on Ice this year.  That should be interesting.

It will be good for her in many ways, not just figure skating.  Wish Zagitova could be a part of this as well--poor kid.

[ChicksDigScars]

5 hours ago, SeanC said:

The cast list up so far is the same size as last year.

Returning:  Patrick, Elvis, Kaetlyn, Meagan & Eric, Kaitlyn & Andrew, Jeff

Minus:  Gabrielle, Javier, Tessa & Scott

Plus:  Evgenia, Kurt, Piper & Paul

Oh, Tessa must be pregnant again, so they have to skip the tour...how many secret children are they up to, now? [/snark]

[SeanC]

Scott and Tessa are doing their own touring show at some point this year, so I don’t expect to see them in the Stars cast as long as that’s a thing.

[HartofDixie]

11 hours ago, SeanC said:

The cast list up so far is the same size as last year.

Returning:  Patrick, Elvis, Kaetlyn, Meagan & Eric, Kaitlyn & Andrew, Jeff

Minus:  Gabrielle, Javier, Tessa & Scott

Plus:  Evgenia, Kurt, Piper & Paul

I meant the US tour. Canada had Javi last year and Med this year. The US isn’t trying to get any European or Japanese skaters. So far Ashley and 3 dance teams are confirmed to do all the shows. Nate and Jason are only doing a few shows.

https://www.starsonice.com/the-skaters.html

[HartofDixie]

https://deadspin.com/does-figure-skating-really-need-age-minimums-1832204461

[Mellowyellow]

9 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

It will be good for her in many ways, not just figure skating.  Wish Zagitova could be a part of this as well--poor kid.

I think Canada has been good for her, skating issues and home sickness aside. 

Jason Brown has been really sweet to her (picked her up from the airport when she first moved there) and she's often seen doing a lot of normal teeny things with the rest of the gang. It's really lovely to see and yes I always wish the same for Alina.

[NUguy514]

2 hours ago, HartofDixie said:

https://deadspin.com/does-figure-skating-really-need-age-minimums-1832204461

...yes, obviously.  I found this article to be pretty irresponsible, and I take exception to the author's use of the word "quad" in relation to any jumps landed by the Russians girls because they are effectively triples with all of the cheats on the takeoffs and landings.

[peachmangosteen]

On 1/30/2019 at 5:46 PM, Mellowyellow said:

The denial of what was likely happening in that video by Eteri fans is just disturbing.

Can you link to this vid, please. I must have missed it initially and I can't find it when I go back through the pages.

[Mellowyellow]

38 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

Can you link to this vid, please. I must have missed it initially and I can't find it when I go back through the pages.

Link wasn't posted here. I got it somewhere else but here it is. It is loooong!

 

[ML89]

On 1/30/2019 at 9:37 AM, Jaded said:

Has this movie about Sonja Henie been mentioned previously?

Watch a Figure Skater Take Hollywood by Storm in ‘Sonja – The White Swan’ Trailer

I had heard something about it but the trailer is promising - the skates are right, the skating looks right. I can't speak to the rest but I definitely am interested. thanks!

[Darknight]

I see many on other forums defending Eteri and the Russian methods. I just don't think people understand what skating does to the body. Especially to young girls. Also, skaters only having one good season then being replaced is bad for the sport. Sports are a business first and foremost. People get attached to certain skaters. Just like in Tennis- Williams sisters, Baskteball- James/Curry, Gymnasts- Biles, Swimmering-Phleps, Golf-Tiger Woods. They bring in money and viewers just by their names alone. So if different skaters skate each season due to puberty or burn out, or being replaced, that's a huge issue that the ISU needs to look at. What sponsor wants to sponsor a skater who only has one good season? 

 

There should not only be age limits but quads should be banned on the junior level. No 13 or 14 yo needs to land a quad. Quads should only be for seniors. Heck, in the dance world it's advised not to allow young girls do pointe work until 11/12. Some teachers even wait until 13/14 because pointe work is hard on the body. Of course there are teachers who allow pointe work at 7,8,9 years old then years later the child has an injury and can't dance anymore. 

 

Also, there are so many good Russian skaters. I just watched the most beautiful program by 14 yo Anastasiia from Russia. She was underscored and I don't understand why. She has huge jumps and nice technical skills. She could work on her musicality but overall her program was beautiful. For some reason Russia fed invests so much in Eteri skaters. Another young skater is Alena K from snow leopards. Sadly, they don't have much funding so they don't have a good ring.

 

Also, the USA federation can talk about safety and age limits but it's pure bs. They support Lui learning a quad and are pushing quads with Ting and Hanna too as well as other young skaters. 

Edited February 1, 2019 by Darknight

[Harry24]

I'm curious how Medvedeva's move and work in Canada is being funded.  Does the Russian federation still support her?  Does she have private sponsors that provide funds?  I ask because I would assume the Russian fed might wash their hands of her.

[SeanC]

4 hours ago, Darknight said:

For some reason Russia fed invests so much in Eteri skaters.

Because they win a lot of stuff.

3 hours ago, Harry24 said:

I'm curious how Medvedeva's move and work in Canada is being funded.  Does the Russian federation still support her?  Does she have private sponsors that provide funds?  I ask because I would assume the Russian fed might wash their hands of her.

She receives federation funding.  Evgenia has a lot of support from the Russian federation; big players like Tatiana Tarasova and Evgeni Plushenko are vocally in her corner.  You could see that at Russian Nationals where the judges did everything they could to boost her up the standings in the free skate.

Edited February 2, 2019 by SeanC

[Darknight]

3 hours ago, SeanC said:

Because they win a lot of stuff.

 

Other Russian skaters can win too. If given the chance from Russian Fed. There are winners from other rings but for some reason they go unnoticed. 

I heard Russian fed only pays for Evgenia's travel and housing fees. They said they can't afford Brian to coach her and her other expenses. I don't know how true that is. It does make sense they think a North American coach is expensive compared to what Russia pays their coaches. I read coaches don't make much in Russian. If the coaches have medals they get more funding and more pay. I don't know how true that is but it makes sense

 

And of course Russian Fed loves Medeveva. She has support from Tatiana and the president of federation. They've been nothing but supportive of her. 

[SeanC]

3 minutes ago, Darknight said:

Other Russian skaters can win too. If given the chance from Russian Fed. There are winners from other rings but for some reason they go unnoticed. 

"Unnoticed" how?  Plenty of non-Eteri skaters are given Grand Prix and Junior Grand Prix assignments (the latter being more relevant this year since Alina is currently Eteri's only senior).  But at the events that determine the big ISU Championship assignments, Eteri's skaters dominate.  She had the entire podium at Russian Nationals this year, and not undeservedly based on how everybody skated.  We'll see how the Junior Nationals goes, but the odds would favour a repeat sweep.

[caracas1914]

So sorry if this was discussed ad nauseum when it was first released but the other night NPR ran their 2016 Surya Bonaly story which implied strongly she was a victim of racism in the skating world.

https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/edge

 

This synopsis is thus given:

“Surya Bonaly was not your typical figure skater.  She was black. She was athletic. And she didn’t seem to care about artistry.  Her performances – punctuated by triple-triple jumps and other power moves – thrilled audiences around the world.  Yet, commentators claimed she couldn’t skate, and judges never gave her the high marks she felt she deserved.  But Surya didn’t accept that criticism.  Unlike her competitors – ice princesses who hid behind demure smiles – Surya made her feelings known.  And, at her final Olympic performance, she attempted one jump that flew in the face of the establishment, and marked her for life as a rebel. “

 

OK , first of all I realize that the people who did this story probably all had nonskating backgrounds but several things scream out to me.

First, Surya  burst out in the skating world in the senior level in 1989, but one of the most known skaters right before her emergence was Debbie Thomas, 2 time US national champhion,  3 time World Medalist including the 1986 World Champhion and who was in 1st place after the SP and was  a clean LP program away from winning the 88 Olympic Gold over Katarina Witt ( She stumbled badly and got the bronze).  Debbie was athletic and Black.

The radio show slights her more than somewhat pretending Debbie Thomas never existed.

Plus talking about Bonalys athleticism when she skated in the era of both Midorito Ito and Tonya Harding who were both IMO more athletic and combined both skating and HUGE jumps.

Lets not get me started on the assumption that in 1994 because Surya placed 4th at the Olympics and the top 3 didn’t go to Worlds she was a slam dunk at Worlds where she lost by a whisker to Yuma Sato who had  finished 5th at that same Olympics.

The  thing is I liked Surya at the time even while I recognized her glaring skating weaknesses.

However the axe to grind on that show just annoyed me.

Edited February 2, 2019 by caracas1914