Season 6: Info, Casting and Spoilers

[SimoneS]

I don't think that it matters who is next in line for the Iron Throne. The Throne belongs to who can take it and hold it which means someone with an army and if they have magic and three dragons to conquer the other armies then the odds are with them.

[paigow]

The Hound will be too busy avenging his pacifist buddies...no way he has time to meet the Mountain this season.

[spottedreptile]

9 hours ago, CofCinci said:

Who is King when Tommen dies?

Interesting question, it's all quite vague, which is why poor Tommen has to buy it, so all this disarray and chaos can ensue. Opportunities arise etc etc. Who does GRRM want to rule, really.

[Paws]

is there any Baratheon family tree that goes beyond Robert, Renly and Stannis? Because whoever is left would then be entitled to claim the throne. Other than that, chaos.

[Lady S.]

@WearyTraveler & @bunnyblue

[GrailKing]

3 hours ago, Lady S. said:

@WearyTraveler & @bunnyblue

 

Shit!

 

Someone said DR. said BF DIES off screen

.Hmm.m maybe

We will also see Jon, Sansa, Davos and Tormund going to Winterfell. But before leaving, Sir Davos finds the place in which Shireen was burned alive

Edited June 11, 2016 by GrailKing

[GrailKing]

Where are

Ghost and Mel?

Both must be super depressed.

[Chris24601]

13 hours ago, WearyTraveler said:

How would Tywin's ancestors be next in line? I've looked at the Lannister family tree as far back as it goes in AWOIAF starting from Tytos (Tywin's father) and Jeyne Marbrand (Tywin's mother) and there isn't a single Baratheon or Targaryen in there.

I'd love to see this research.  It's the first time I read there's any familial connection between the Lannisters and the Baratheons or the Targs.

Here's one site that did the research... http://mashable.com/2016/05/03/game-thrones-heir/#GAlxFwqxUuqu

Here's the gist of it...

"The leader of Robert's Rebellion acquired the throne by force. He had three kids, officially and legally at least, with Queen Cersei. Joffrey and Myrcella are dead, leaving only Tommen — and if the prophecy Cersei received from a witch is to be believed, the other blond-haired kid isn't long for this world either. 

The Throne would then pass to Stannis Baratheon, if he weren't pushing up daisies near Winterfell, then his faithful daughter Shireen Baratheon, if she weren't in cinders, then his younger brother Renly Baratheon, if he weren't in an advanced state of decomposition post-shadow baby. 

That exhausts this generation of Baratheons. And according to this unbelievably extensive Baratheon family tree, you have to go all the way back to Robert's great-great-great-great-grandfather to find anyone in his family who sired another line that survived.

A hundred and fifty years before Robert was even born, an aristocrat called Corwen Baratheon married a woman named Leyne and had six kids. One of them, Arion, was Robert's great-great-great grandfather. The next one down to have surviving kids was Elyanna, who married a Lord named Mathin. Lord Mathin Lannister. 

Mathin fathered Jason, who fathered Demon, who fathered Gerold, who fathered Tytos Lannister. And who was Tytos' firstborn son?

Tywin Lannister."

* * * *

It sounds crazy, but now that he has been released from his vows as a Kingsguard, Jaime is actually next in line for the Iron Throne if you follow the Baratheon line to determine succession.

If you want a REAL mind bender, consider this... the legitimate heir to the Iron Throne after Stannis death would actually be... Tommen. Jaime was in the Kingsguard and so not in the line of succession so the crown would pass to Jaime's eldest living son.

[WearyTraveler]

All right, here it goes.  He says he's analysing the teaser for ep. 8 and including bits and pieces from other websites and news reports.  Summary below.

The Hound:

Spoiler

We see the Hound branding his axe against someone, presumably from the BwoB. FD speculates that Sandor is way too far away from KL to be the faith's champion in the upcoming Cersei trial. Doesn't think there's time for the Hound to get to KL, gain the trust of the High Septon, and be named their champion. Mentions that Thoros will appear this episode, as confirmed by the actor in an interview and imdb.

BwoB, Lady Stoneheart:

Spoiler

GRRM told a fan called Preston Jacobs during a special dinner that LSH was eliminated by the producers. FD investigated Jacobs and found him trustworthy. Details of Preston's dinner are in www.winteriscoming.org and Preston's own Reddit. FD says that if Beric is in episode 8, then there's absolutely no way that LSH will make an appearance as Beric gives his life for hers.

Meereen:

Spoiler

We seem to be getting intentionally contradicting information. On the one hand we get pictures where it seems everything is fine and we seem to be seeing the results of the deal struck with he red priestess (working on the crowd to increase Dany's popularity); on the other hand, there are scenes that appear to be disquieting like the one of Tyrion looking up at the chandelier. FD believes that the great pyramid is under attack and this is the beginning of the events that will lead up to the explosion outside Dany's room that we saw in the pre-season trailer.

FD proposes two candidates for the attack: The Sons of the Harpy or the Slave Masters that negotiated a peace with Tyrion. Since the former are being paid by the latter, there's only one. proving that Grey Worm and Missandei were right, and that Tyrion apparently failed.

Will Tyrion release the dragons? FD doesn't think that will happen this episode.  He thinks it will happen in the finale.  He also thinks Daenerys should be very close to arriving to Meereen at this point.

The Riverlands:

Spoiler

FD thinks Brienne is trying to strike a deal with Jaimie: she convinces Blackfish to surrender the castle and he lets her takes the Tully army north.  From spoilers about the Northern battle, FD doesn't think that will happen.  He then shows a screenshot of iDigitalTimes (whose source was the spoilers in Reddit) where it says that Brienne fails and escapes, Jaimie forces Edmure to go into the castle, take it as its rightful owner and then surrender it to the Freys-Lannisters, and that the BF dies in an ensuing battle but off screen. FD thinks it's possible it's a fake out but thinks this might be the end of the BF

King's Landing:

Spoiler

Cersei and Lancel's standoff, the Mountain killing one of the sparrows, Cersei entering the throne room.  FD says the sparrows were there to take Cersei to the Sept of Baelor again.  Comparative screenshot of the Mountain's dented breastplate as he walks behind Cersei into the throne room and Lancel with his weapon.  They are a match. FD doesn't think this means that Lancel is dead.  He says he thinks that as soon as The Mountain attacks, the sparrows will scatter and that the Mountain will kill the slowest man running away (I think they're toast, myself, but who knows? maybe FD is right).

FD wonders what Tommen will do when he finds out his mother refuses to go to Baelor's.  He also wonders why Tommen called the court; he thinks that Tommen looks like he's about to give an important announcement to his court. FD thinks the trial will be in episode 10.  Shows the spoilers from Jonathan Pryce's interview with a Polish journalist.

Arya:

Spoiler

He discusses all the fan theories regarding Arya's recovery from the wound and dismisses them all (this discussion doesn't include the actress that she saved saving her).  Screenshot of the Waif with a man in shadows behind her.  Apparently that has fanned the flames of the theory that Syrio Forel is alive and will return because the guy in the shadow has a similar body type. FD says that based on Maisie's interview with IGN a while back where she confirmed the producers told her he was dead, he doesn't think so.

FD says that all Jaqen wants is a face for his wall.  He wanted Lady Crane's face, and he didn't get it, so, now he wants a face to put in her place.  FD says Jaqen will not care who wins between Waif and Arya as long as he gets a face (This makes sense to me, and I think Arya leaving the House of Black and White might not be as complicated as we thought it would be).

Pictures of the fight from the shoot seem to indicate Arya will kill the Waif. Jaqen will get his face and let Arya go.  He is not looking for vengeance, he just wants a face for his God.

FD says that there are two possibilities when it comes to saving Arya's life: Lady Crane or one of the many potions and powders they have in the House of Black and White (presumably after she hands over the Waif's face).

On Sunday he'll talk about Samwell Tarly and Valyrian steel swords.

[WearyTraveler]

1 hour ago, Chris24601 said:

Here's one site that did the research... http://mashable.com/2016/05/03/game-thrones-heir/#GAlxFwqxUuqu

Here's the gist of it...

"The leader of Robert's Rebellion acquired the throne by force. He had three kids, officially and legally at least, with Queen Cersei. Joffrey and Myrcella are dead, leaving only Tommen — and if the prophecy Cersei received from a witch is to be believed, the other blond-haired kid isn't long for this world either. 

The Throne would then pass to Stannis Baratheon, if he weren't pushing up daisies near Winterfell, then his faithful daughter Shireen Baratheon, if she weren't in cinders, then his younger brother Renly Baratheon, if he weren't in an advanced state of decomposition post-shadow baby. 

That exhausts this generation of Baratheons. And according to this unbelievably extensive Baratheon family tree, you have to go all the way back to Robert's great-great-great-great-grandfather to find anyone in his family who sired another line that survived.

A hundred and fifty years before Robert was even born, an aristocrat called Corwen Baratheon married a woman named Leyne and had six kids. One of them, Arion, was Robert's great-great-great grandfather. The next one down to have surviving kids was Elyanna, who married a Lord named Mathin. Lord Mathin Lannister. 

Mathin fathered Jason, who fathered Demon, who fathered Gerold, who fathered Tytos Lannister. And who was Tytos' firstborn son?

Tywin Lannister."

* * * *

It sounds crazy, but now that he has been released from his vows as a Kingsguard, Jaime is actually next in line for the Iron Throne if you follow the Baratheon line to determine succession.

If you want a REAL mind bender, consider this... the legitimate heir to the Iron Throne after Stannis death would actually be... Tommen. Jaime was in the Kingsguard and so not in the line of succession so the crown would pass to Jaime's eldest living son.

Well, the link referenced by that article about the extensive Baratheon family tree is broken.  Also, there's no character named Corwen Baratheon in AWOIAF, his alleged source for the article.  So, I think there are two possibilities:

1) The information is true: someone connected the dots and this leads to Tyrion actually having a claim to the throne being a Lannister, so no A+J=T.  Many fans have speculated that Tyrion is Martin's favourite character and that he'd end up ruling Westeros.  Once the info was discovered, Martin asked AWOIAF to remove it (it's my understanding they are friends) and they did.

2) The information is false: someone uploaded false info into a wiki (not the first time that happens) and the journalist found it or was tipped to it.  Upon discovering the fake info, the admin at AWOIAF deleted it.

Since there are a lot of characters referenced, and apparently they only appeared on a family tree picture file.  I'm going with the second option.  It'd be easy to do.  Meanwhile it'd be more difficult for admins at AWOIAF to delete chapter upon chapter about characters (like this Corwen Baratheon) and character mentions of those characters in other chapters (which would have been needed to create the incriminating picture file the journalist mentions in his article).

Edited June 11, 2016 by WearyTraveler

[parandroid]

3 hours ago, WearyTraveler said:

Arya:

  Reveal hidden contents

He discusses all the fan theories regarding Arya's recovery from the wound and dismisses them all (this discussion doesn't include the actress that she saved saving her).  Screenshot of the Waif with a man in shadows behind her.  Apparently that has fanned the flames of the theory that Syrio Forel is alive and will return because the guy in the shadow has a similar body type. FD says that based on Maisie's interview with IGN a while back where she confirmed the producers told her he was dead, he doesn't think so.

FD says that all Jaqen wants is a face for his wall.  He wanted Lady Crane's face, and he didn't get it, so, now he wants a face to put in her place.  FD says Jaqen will not care who wins between Waif and Arya as long as he gets a face (This makes sense to me, and I think Arya leaving the House of Black and White might not be as complicated as we thought it would be).

Pictures of the fight from the shoot seem to indicate Arya will kill the Waif. Jaqen will get his face and let Arya go.  He is not looking for vengeance, he just wants a face for his God.

FD says that there are two possibilities when it comes to saving Arya's life: Lady Crane or one of the many potions and powders they have in the House of Black and White (presumably after she hands over the Waif's face).

 

Is there any evidence to suggest that Arya survives to fight another day? If not, I think there is too much hope floating around for a series that is famous for crushing hope and dreams. The simplest theory is that Arya doesn't survive. She may get a brave death, but not life.

[Eyes High]

Corwen Baratheon and Mathin Lannister exist in the noncanon Westeros.org MUSH universe, "Blood of Dragons." So I doubt that anything can be taken from that. Officially, we don't know who fathered Damon.

With that said, Jaime and by extension Tyrion in the original outline were in the line of succession. So maybe it's not all that crazy after all.

[WearyTraveler]

1 minute ago, parandroid said:

Is there any evidence to suggest that Arya survives to fight another day? If not, I think there is too much hope floating around for a series that is famous for crushing hope and dreams. The simplest theory is that Arya doesn't survive. She may get a brave death, but not life.

Apparently Martin has promised his wife he would not kill Arya, as she is her favourite character, and that if her fate is to die, he will not kill her until the very end.  Narratively speaking, if Arya's destiny is to die after her stay with the Faceless Men (in the books), that would mean Martin would just continue to write her there for two (possible three) more books. Why would he do that?

I realize that the show's depiction of Arya's training with the Faceless Men has been less than stellar, but I find it hard to believe that Martin would have sent Arya there and have us follow all her training step by step only to kill her without payoff.

Also, I don't think the show would have spent all that much time with her in Braavos if they didn't have a plan for her later.

[SeanC]

29 minutes ago, parandroid said:

Is there any evidence to suggest that Arya survives to fight another day? 

Basic storytelling logic suggests that, because otherwise, why have we been following Arya for the past six seasons (and in particular, for the two seasons in Braavos, where she had no impact whatsoever on any other story)?

22 minutes ago, WearyTraveler said:

Apparently Martin has promised his wife he would not kill Arya, as she is her favourite character, and that if her fate is to die, he will not kill her until the very end. 

That wasn't quite what he said (that particular statement has got through a million mutations; he just said she was his wife's favourite character and she threatened to retaliate if he killed her).

[WearyTraveler]

Glad to have the correct Martin quote, but I see that from a storytelling perspective, you do agree it seems as if Arya still has some more things to do.

[SeanC]

5 minutes ago, WearyTraveler said:

Glad to have the correct Martin quote, but I see that from a storytelling perspective, you do agree it seems as if Arya still has some more things to do.

Yes, I wasn't correcting the quote to suggest that she might die, just to say that GRRM didn't say that.

So many people talk about GRRM "subverting expectations" in ways that would render huge swathes of the narrative pointless.  Even, e.g., Quentyn Martell, whose abbreviated personal arc has been argued to be a bit of a shaggy dog story, died in the process of initiating a major plot development in the Meereen story that affects other characters, and his death will presumably have an impact on the Dornish characters and their narrative going forward.  If Arya died in Braavos right now, the past two seasons there wouldn't mean a damn thing (not even KL seems to have noticed that she killed Meryn Trant), and nobody else would ever know about it.

[paigow]

How is Syrio relevant? Dude is dead. If Thoros brought him back from the dead, somebody would have noticed. If one of the Faceless is pretending to be him, that would draw a lot of unwanted attention because he was not some generic merchant but a high profile dance instructor.

[WearyTraveler]

12 minutes ago, paigow said:

How is Syrio relevant? Dude is dead. If Thoros brought him back from the dead, somebody would have noticed. If one of the Faceless is pretending to be him, that would draw a lot of unwanted attention because he was not some generic merchant but a high profile dance instructor.

I think FD was just addressing all the theories he gets from fans.  I agree that Syrio is most likely dead.

[Maximum Taco]

1 hour ago, paigow said:

How is Syrio relevant? Dude is dead. If Thoros brought him back from the dead, somebody would have noticed. If one of the Faceless is pretending to be him, that would draw a lot of unwanted attention because he was not some generic merchant but a high profile dance instructor.

There's a lot of fan speculation that Syrio might have been a Faceless Man.

I agree with you that it doesn't make much sense. From everything we've seen of the Faceless Men they choose their identities to be discrete, and forgettable. A flamboyant water dancer who constantly brings up his history as First Sword of Braavos is the very opposite of that.

[nksarmi]

It seems to me that Marg can't be pregnant and provide Tommen an heir. I say that only because they had to age Tommen up in the series for sex to even be an option between them. I'm not certain why they did that - maybe they thought it would all just play better this way (especially since Natalie Dormer is pretty darn far away from 15 or however old Marg is suppose to be in the books). Or maybe they thought it would be odd to have a king playing with kittens.

Either way, I don't think we have any kind of king when Tommen is dead. Now in the books, that doesn't really matter because Aegon is already in Westerous fighting for his crown and both Tommen and Myrcella are still alive. Ergo, there will be an "heir apparent" in the books when Robert's children all die. Dany owns that plot entirely on the show so maybe they will have a bit of chaos in KL (perhaps the Faith will take over temporarily) before she arrives as the conquering hero. Even an armed faith won't be able to do shit about a dragon queen leading a Dorthraki horde, Unsullied, and Iron Born (if they have joined her side at that point). And if there is no king in King's Landing, I wonder how much resistance she will meet on the show.

I know season seven is supposed to have battles and such and I'm sure someone might have an inclination to resist her. But with no king on the throne, why wouldn't the lords just send envoys out and say "You are welcome to pass through our lands - just please no raping or pillaging along the way, ok?"

[paigow]

1 minute ago, Maximum Taco said:

There's a lot of fan speculation that Syrio might have been a Faceless Man.

Baseless spec. Why would he take chump change from Ned for dance lessons, when big money comes from contracts? Is he like Clive Owen in Bourne Identity? Giving piano lessons as a cover ID while waiting for an assignment?

[Maximum Taco]

7 minutes ago, paigow said:

Baseless spec. Why would he take chump change from Ned for dance lessons, when big money comes from contracts? Is he like Clive Owen in Bourne Identity? Giving piano lessons as a cover ID while waiting for an assignment?

Of course it's baseless spec. Most spec is baseless.

But yeah, most people think he's on assignment in King's Landing, and then after he makes his kill he uses the opportunity of the attack on Ned and his kids as a cover to kill "Syrio" and take another face (Jaqen).

I don't buy it myself, but that's the theory that a lot of Syrio Survivalists use.

Edited June 11, 2016 by Maximum Taco

[paigow]

Call me Stannis...but speculation is supposed to be an educated guess.  Anything else lacking even a tenuous grounding in observed or implied events / info is wishful thinking. 

[RedheadZombie]

19 hours ago, CofCinci said:

With the High Sparrow ordering Margaery to get pregnant....  I wonder if she'll be pregnant (or desperately try to get pregnant) or even state that she's pregnant after Tommen's death in order to secure the Throne.

I think claiming pregnancy will be the quickest way for Margaery to die.  She seems way too smart to try that tactic.  Her usual strategy is to simply marry the next king or claimant of the throne.  That's why I'm so interested in how Margaery and Olenna would react to a Dany reign.  They'll be all "girl power!", then realize they're usual strategy won't work.

If Dany ends up on the throne and Tormund/Brienne don't work out, I would like Brienne to be in the Kingsguard.  I can't imagine a more loyal protector. Tormund can relocate to KL and devote his life to seducing her.

[Greta]

Random speculation.  What if Cersei sets fire to KL just as Dany arrives on Drogon, meaning Dany gets the blame?  No one close enough to watch the wildfire actually being set off would survive, so any survivors who fled the city would recall a dragon flying overhead and the city in flames, making the logical connection. And it's not like  Dany's multi-year history throughout Essos would scream "she would never do such a thing!"

It could be enough to unite at least several of the Houses against her.

[GrailKing]

So the latest I saw is

Brienne returns or attempts to return Oathkeeper to Jamie

Picture tells different but it could be a thing later.

Edited June 11, 2016 by GrailKing

[CofCinci]

17 minutes ago, GrailKing said:

So the latest I saw is

  Hide contents

Brienne returns or attempts to return Oathkeeper to Jamie

 

Picture tells different but it could be a thing later.

I hope he doesn't accept the return.  She needs it for next season. 

[GrailKing]

BIG SPOILERY STUFF

 

On Reddit Trudee was on briefly and post this:

First and last post self.freefolk

submitted an hour ago by truede

Hey, so my inbox is full of messages to post here. Just want to clear up that I may have remembered wrong and Wun Wun does indeed die after the battle. Honestly don't remember.

Also, https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/4nler0/spoilers_for_rest_of_the_season/ is legit. Not sure about point 2 though.

Frikidoctor is not legit. Seems like he's speculating based on spoilers out there already and previews.

Bye.

[paigow]

52 minutes ago, Greta said:

It could be enough to unite at least several of the Houses against her.

Yes. It would unite them all in a fiery death scene...

57 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

If Dany ends up on the throne and Tormund/Brienne don't work out, I would like Brienne to be in the Kingsguard.  I can't imagine a more loyal protector. 

How about several thousand Dothraki & Unsullied?

[WearyTraveler]

29 minutes ago, GrailKing said:

BIG SPOILERY STUFF

 

On Reddit Trudee was on briefly and post this:

  Hide contents

 

First and last post self.freefolk

submitted an hour ago by truede

Hey, so my inbox is full of messages to post here. Just want to clear up that I may have remembered wrong and Wun Wun does indeed die after the battle. Honestly don't remember.

Also, https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/4nler0/spoilers_for_rest_of_the_season/ is legit. Not sure about point 2 though.

Frikidoctor is not legit. Seems like he's speculating based on spoilers out there already and previews.

Bye.

Well, that's what Frikidoctor is doing now, after HBO made him take down three videos.  I think he got the same spoilers other sites got and spilled what the other sites didn't.  But now he's just doing the same thing we do with all the information we get.  It's nice that he does it by episode, though, because then we are reminded of spoilers from long ago that are just now being revealed.

Spoiler

Fuck! I don't want to lose Wun Wun!

 

1 hour ago, Greta said:

Random speculation.  What if Cersei sets fire to KL just as Dany arrives on Drogon, meaning Dany gets the blame?  No one close enough to watch the wildfire actually being set off would survive, so any survivors who fled the city would recall a dragon flying overhead and the city in flames, making the logical connection. And it's not like  Dany's multi-year history throughout Essos would scream "she would never do such a thing!"

It could be enough to unite at least several of the Houses against her.

WIldfire is green, and it was green on the show (Blackwater episode).  So, I don't think anyone would mistake it for dragon fire.

[GrailKing]

3 minutes ago, WearyTraveler said:

Well, that's what Frikidoctor is doing now, after HBO made him take down three videos.  I think he got the same spoilers other sites got and spilled what the other sites didn't.  But now he's just doing the same thing we do with all the information we get.  It's nice that he does it by episode, though, because then we are reminded of spoilers from long ago that are just now being revealed.

  Reveal hidden contents

Fuck! I don't want to lose Wun Wun!

 

WIldfire is green, and it was green on the show (Blackwater episode).  So, I don't think anyone would mistake it for dragon fire.

RIP Phil Simms.

[Mya Stone]

Please move SPECULATION to the proper thread. 

 

As far as the SPOILERS that were posted on Reddit...here it is under spoiler bars. 

Spoiler

-Beric Dondarrion is alive. Still the leader of the brotherhood. Those three guys were acting alone. No LSH. 

-Beric Dondarrion knows about the white walkers!

-Arya serves Frey Pie at the Twins in episode 10. She kills Walder Frey.

-Brienne returns oathkeeper to Jaime

-Episode 9 has two locations. Winterfell and Meeren (three dragons).

-Ramsey will be "meat for his hounds".

-Lancel does not die in episode 8. 

[WearyTraveler]

Here's what I'm wondering about the latest info from TrueDe:

Spoiler

How the heck do you forget seeing a GIANT die? Or did the show not spend enough time shooting his death and characters reacting to it? Was it that inconsequential that someone who has apparently seen the show forgot the scene completely?

With regards to Arya:
 

Spoiler

 

I read through the posts at Reddit and the post (and thread) that TrueDe verified as true, somewhere in there it says that Arya poisons the pies and those are the ones she serves the Freys, so it seems that she's not serving the book version of Manderly's Frey pies, but she is killing Freys with pies.  This may just be my OCD acting up, but I wish they wouldn't call it Frey pies, if that's the case.  It's definitely not the same.

Not that I'm complaining, I'll be happy to see Walder and his brood get what's coming to them, but revenge is not served in the form of Frey pies here.

 

Episode 9:

Spoiler

Also somewhere in those posts, there was a screenshot of a PM where the OP clarified that (three dragons) means we will see three dragons in the Meereen scenes, so, someone frees the dragons (or they freed themselves) to attack, one presumes, when Dany arrives.  I don't know how I feel about having the battle of Meereen in the same episode as the Battle of the Bastards.  D&D love those damned dragons so much, I fear they will overshadow anything happening in the North, which, to me, is the most important part of the story at the moment. Then I read some comments by people complaining that they didn't want to see any more Dany speeches, so, maybe it won't overshadow the North.  But it's hard to imagine since it's three dragons, y'all!!! (plus the Dothraki, plus the Unsullied) :-/

ETA: Also, why does Dany need so much firepower to defeat the Sons of the Harpy and the Slave Masters? Exactly how big is this combined force that you need a horde of Dothraki riders, around 5,000 Unsullied (maybe more? not sure how many thousands she bought in the show?) and THREE dragons to defeat it?

Meanwhile, in the North, all you need to defeat the combined forces of the Boltons, the Umbers and the Karstarks (the biggest houses in the North according to the show) is 2,000 Wildings, 62 Mormont soldiers and the Knights of the Vale.

The more I think about this, the more I think that D&D really aren't doing the North storyline justice.

Edited June 12, 2016 by WearyTraveler

[Lady S.]

8 hours ago, Eyes High said:

Corwen Baratheon and Mathin Lannister exist in the noncanon Westeros.org MUSH universe, "Blood of Dragons." So I doubt that anything can be taken from that. Officially, we don't know who fathered Damon.

Right, mr. and mrs. w.org's little role-playing game is not really a research reference. Most of the characters in the family trees were invented by them, not Martin. I believe they even had to change some of the trees after working on the World Book, when Martin finally got around to expanding the family histories. The only house with a comprehensive family tree is Targaryen, but even there the marriages and children of Egg's sister were left off because there wasn't enough room or because he's saving things for Dunk & Egg. There's no way to actually tell who the Baratheon heir would be with Stannis, Myrcella, and Shireen dead. Dany's heir would be a descendant of one of Egg's sisters, but that's a moot point assuming R+L=J.

 

1 hour ago, WearyTraveler said:

With regards to Arya:
 

  Hide contents

 

I read through the posts at Reddit and the post (and thread) that TrueDe verified as true, somewhere in there it says that Arya poisons the pies and those are the ones she serves the Freys, so it seems that she's not serving the book version of Manderly's Frey pies, but she is killing Freys with pies.  This may just be my OCD acting up, but I wish they wouldn't call it Frey pies, if that's the case.  It's definitely not the same.

Not that I'm complaining, I'll be happy to see Walder and his brood get what's coming to them, but revenge is not served in the form of Frey pies here.

 

 

Truede said in his first post that he wasn't a book reader, so I think that's why they're misusing the term. But I'm also still very skeptical of all the riverlands spoilers. The only thing we can be certain about is that they return to the Twins, based on the shot of Walder and the Lannister soldiers celebrating in the trailer.

[bunnyblue]

1 hour ago, WearyTraveler said:

With regards to Arya:
 

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Considering the time constraints, Arya poisoning the pies makes far more sense than her killing Freys and somehow baking pies. And I agree that it should be

poisoned pies because calling them Frey pies implies something entirely different.

[InsertWordHere]

2 hours ago, bunnyblue said:

 

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Considering the time constraints, Arya poisoning the pies makes far more sense than her killing Freys and somehow baking pies. 

Spoiler

Maybe Hot Pie will show up to help her.

[Spartan Girl]

Awww, so Arya won't get to use Needle on Walder Frey?

[GrailKing]

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

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Awww, so Arya won't get to use Needle on Walder Frey?

I tend to think she could wait till

the guest die like flies and save Needle just for Lord Walder; saying the Starks or the North remembers or the Starks give their regards.

[Maximum Taco]

12 hours ago, InsertWordHere said:

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Maybe Hot Pie will show up to help her.

That would be awesome.
 

Spoiler

 

Hot Pie: No no no no!!! We can't use inferior ingredients! And that needs to bake for at least another 5 minutes! You're ruining the flavors!

Arya: They are gonna die as soon as they eat the pies, Hot Pie! It doesn't matter how they taste, no one will even know.

Hot Pie: I'll know! And I don't bake inferior pies! Even if they are just murder pies!

Arya: Damn it Hot Pie!

 

[Oscirus]

I can see why people would think this is Serio and I learned a long time ago not to trust what cast members say. But in this case, I'd say that's not him. Hell, it looks like that person's back is to the Waif.

[spottedreptile]

4 hours ago, Oscirus said:

But in this case, I'd say that's not him. Hell, it looks like that person's back is to the Waif.

Yes, whoever it is is walking away from the scene. I'd say they put that silhouette in just for a little fun. If it's Syrio I'll eat my hat.

[Maximum Taco]

47 minutes ago, spottedreptile said:

Yes, whoever it is is walking away from the scene. I'd say they put that silhouette in just for a little fun. If it's Syrio I'll eat my hat.

I don't think it's Syrio, but if it is I'll require a video of you eating a hat.

[bunnyblue]

About the preview for episode 9:

Holy crap, I felt sick just watching it, I don't know how I'm going to survive watching the entire battle. But damn, does it look great!

Who's Sansa referring to when she tells Jon he doesn't "know him"? Is it really Ramsay or a misdirect and she's actually referring to Littlefinger?

This is where we get Jon telling Melisandre not to bring him back if he dies again, which is what Kit said in the EW article. Sigh.

Davos at the site of Shireen's burning. I'm prepared to ugly cry.

Jon is looking quite epic and (dipping into the shallow end) really DAMN HOT. Where the hell is Ghost?!

[SeanC]

So, from the promo, Jon's battle strategy is to charge pell-mell at a much larger army with archers out in front?  Clearly Robb got all the military genius in that generation of Stark kids.

[WearyTraveler]

Make room for me in the shallow end @bunnyblue.... DAYUM!!!

[WearyTraveler]

7 minutes ago, SeanC said:

So, from the promo, Jon's battle strategy is to charge pell-mell at a much larger army with archers out in front?  Clearly Robb got all the military genius in that generation of Stark kids.

You know it really is a pitty that D&D have decided to make Jon this reckless.  I was just re-reading the chapters where Jon escapes from the Thenns, fights them when they reach Castle Black, and then commands the Night's Watch during all the Wildings' attacks upon the Wall.  In the books, he really is a good strategist and a good commander.  The men respect him and listen to him and he makes smart choices.  Sigh!

Edited June 13, 2016 by WearyTraveler

[Jazzy24]

The title The Battle of the Bastards sounds like fanfic. 

[jjjmoss]

So do y'all think the episode will be Blackwater/Watchers on the Wall style with just the one location? The trailer makes it seem that way, but it could be misleading.

[Oscirus]

12 minutes ago, jjjmoss said:

So do y'all think the episode will be Blackwater/Watchers on the Wall style with just the one location? The trailer makes it seem that way, but it could be misleading.

Spoiler

The dude who spoiled this said that this upcoming episode has two locations Mereen and the North.  They probably hyped up the botb because that's a big event

[InsertWordHere]

I think it's going to be more like Hardhome, with two locations, 

Spoiler

Winterfell and Meereen. Ice and Fire again.

Since Jaime now knows about Sansa and Jon trying to take back Winterfell, I wonder 

Spoiler

if he will meet Arya at the Freys (is he supposed to be at the celebration at the Twins or is he back in King's Landing in time to see it burn?) and earn some shred of redemption by telling Arya to head to Winterfell and her family or maybe even offer (and this is probably highly unlikely) to escort her there. The trouble is, I don't see Arya believing anything Jaime Lannister has to say.