S01.E08: Dead Air

[Saje]

Why does everyone cringe at Liv's family, me included? And I like the acronyms, even when I don't get them, they're easy to figure out. And yup, Major's boring. Majorly.

[KAOS Agent]

I thought that they kind of made it plain that Liv and Lowell are just sort of together because they're both zombies and have great sex. Liv even said that they have nothing in common and wouldn't be together without the zombie-ism. It's not that they can't grow into a deeper relationship, but I liked that they had Liv (or more precisely, Liv's brain of the week) explicitly say why they were together. I kind of expect Lowell to die by the end of the season, but maybe not. He just seems more like a good rebound for Liv to get her confidence up and feel a little better about her future.

 

Maybe he'll survive just in case there's a huge fan push for their relationship (like the most popular ship from the show that must not be mentioned), but I see Liv moving on to other things and the show not wanting her to be stuck in a relationship that formed in episode 5. That's why I saw them have Liv point out exactly the reasons they're together and those reasons aren't a huge basis for a long term relationship. You'll notice too that Lowell's response to her was pretty bland. It was basically, well, yeah, but the sex is great, so why are you complaining?

Edited May 10, 2015 by KAOS Agent

[FurryFury]

I've found it funny how realistic it was. I mean, on TV, romance tends to be hugely overstated, even with temporary couples, but it's rarely like that in real life. A lot or people, especially in their 20s, are in it for sex and fun without giving it much thought. I guess I'm just tired of this forced 'epicness' everywhere in many shows I watch.

And hello KAOS Agent, nice to see a familiar face from another board I frequent!

[Delwyn]

Seeing Irene took me back to when I really enjoyed Ryan Reynolds. Good times.

Liv and Ravi are still the best things about this show.

Gah! Thank you for pointing out Irene. It was driving me nuts trying to figure out where I knew her from, and IMDB didn't have her listed for the episode at first. That show was my introduction to loving RR aand Nathan Fillion. And, well. I still love Nathan Fillion.

I agree that the Liv/Ravi scenes are the best. All Liv's other interactions are awkward fibbing and it's nice to see her being open with him. Their mutual weirdness and camaraderie really sells me on the show when the plot and fake policing are D minus. Season two could easily shed 60% of its current business and be more watchable for it.

[tennisgurl]

Liv and Ravi are adorable together. I actually really never want them to be more than friends. For one thing, he`s her boss. Which is just not appropriate at all. For another, they`re adorable as friends. They're both so quirky and cute! I squee whenever I see them.

 

Also, I think Ravi and Peyton are near the same league. He`s nice, good looking (he really does have great hair), has a sexy British accent, and is a doctor. He seems like a catch to me. The only thing some people might be put off by are his quirky nerdiness (which is NOT a bad thing to me), and that he works in a morgue, which might weird some people out. Most people I cant imagine would care. I don't think Peyton would.   

[Saje]

I don't care about Ravi being Liv's boss at all because... well I just don't recognize that false 'authority' thing that goes on... but no, I don't want them to get together, either. I don't really care about Liv's love life, tbh. I do really like Lowell and wouldn't mind if they became forever zombie baby loves together, but it doesn't drive me to watch. I watch to see her eat the brains and do right by the victims. Although I don't really care about the MOW (mystery of the week), so there's that. 

 

I want more monster mythology. And yeah, a little blush and hair dye Liv? Little bit? Wouldn't hurt.

[Anela]

I've found it funny how realistic it was. I mean, on TV, romance tends to be hugely overstated, even with temporary couples, but it's rarely like that in real life. A lot or people, especially in their 20s, are in it for sex and fun without giving it much thought. I guess I'm just tired of this forced 'epicness' everywhere in many shows I watch.

I like it, as well. I think I'm just too old for the Vampire Diaries now, but they go over the top with this sort of thing, as do other shows. I smiled as soon as Lowell asked her if she had a boyfriend - it reminded me of when I was fifteen and working in my mother's office. They had just employed a seventeen-year-old guy - he seemed so grown up at the time ;) - and later in the day, one guy remarked that you could certainly tell that two teenagers were in the office. They may not have that much in common, but I think they're a good match. 

 

It didn't occur to me until this episode, that the actress who plays Liv, is wearing a wig. It never occurred to me with the woman from The Blacklist, either, until I saw posts about it online. I don't always pick up on things like that, but other things will bug me that everyone else is fine with. 

 

I can't remember if it was this episode, when the police chief added hot sauce into his drink? I'd been thinking, before he went into his office, that he was probably a zombie. When he told the detective to get back to doing the cases he was given, rather than following up on missing teenagers. 

 

I've forgotten what else I was going to say... I didn't even notice Irene from Two Guys and a Girl, but I was only listening part of the time, with my headphones. I wasn't feeling well, so concentration was only there for a short time.

Edited May 11, 2015 by Anela

[Julia]

I don't care about Ravi being Liv's boss at all because... well I just don't recognize that false 'authority' thing that goes on...

It's not so much the authority as the fact that it's a situation where the boss holds a disproportionate amount of professional power over the subordinate, so it has the potential for coercion and subsequent lawsuits even if the subordinate partner appears to consent. Which is one reason why in most companies, and all government jobs, it's a firing offense.

It's also a bad idea for the two people involved, because it adds relationship dynamics to. a work relationship that should be completely about work performance. That's not good for a relationship, unless you're dating a unicorn, but it's also an unwise professional choice. It opens the employer up for lawsuits if a subordinate thinks the failure of their relationship is behind their not being promoted or if their coworkers think the subordinate's after hours activity are responsible for the promotions they did get. Which is another reason most employers have a zero tolerance policy.

Anecdata: there's a woman who until recently worked for my company who they headhunted from Europe to run a program because she was such a star. Every time she was promoted, someone reminded everyone of that one time she hooked up with her boss at the christmas party, and it was strongly implied that she earned her job on her back. Which made her the lucky one, because the receptionist he hooked up with at an office party was fired for cause. Presumably, when women get more positions of real power and the culture changes, that will be an equal opportunity risk, but right now, it rests on the subordinate woman.

It's really not an imaginary concern, and JMO, it's a place decent bosses don't go.

Edited May 11, 2015 by Julia

[Minneapple]

I guess I'm just tired of this forced 'epicness' everywhere in many shows I watch.

It's made Arrow borderline unwatchable and ruined a formerly great character in Felicity. I swear I don't remember the last episode Felicity didn't cry. I just hate this concept that Everything Is Doomed If These Two People Don't Get Together.

It's a reason to cheer for a romance like Liv/Lowell, which is natural, nice and not a huge angst-fest. Romance shouldn't be a huge angst-fest! But teevee writers love it that way, so that makes me think Lowell is not long for this world.

[FurryFury]

Epic romance isn't a bad trope, but it requires a certain quality of writing and actor chemistry that's hard to reach. And it also really suffers from a show not having an end date. As much as I loved Logan and Veronica on Veronica Mars, they were hard to watch in season 3 because of all this break up/make up stuff. And most couples that become central on TV are destined for this.

 

Right now, I'm just happy that the show doesn't put much focus on romance in the "epic" vein - it's just another storyline going on, and far from the most interesting one. I, however, really hope we won't get more of the stuff I've described above with Major, because it does seem like it can be a possibility down the line, and I definitely believe this couple is not the material for a huge romance.

Edited May 11, 2015 by FurryFury

[cynic]

I agree, FurryFury. I loved Logan and Veronica for a while, but there was only so much you could do with them before it got ridiculous. That romance would have been much more effective in a limited format. (Of course, that pretty much could be said about the show itself. The first season was amazing, but it couldn't sustain the quality.) I am glad though, that the powers that be recognized that Logan and Veronica were a more compelling story than the original OTP, Duncan and Veronica. Duncan's character was a bit of a misfire and that was hugely compounded by the charisma vacuum of the actor. Like Major, the actor was conventionally square-jaw handsome, but there's nothing there otherwise. It's hard to be invested in a love story when one of the parties is a total blank.

[FurryFury]

There was also a big problem with Duncan never really getting his own POV, which made it almost impossible to understand him and his motivations. He was a huge puzzle for me. Major, at least, is understandable, if boring. He's definitely not a Duncan - but he's a Piz, which still doesn't make him a great character. For those who haven't watched, Piz was a classic friendly nice love interest in season 3, but he was so boring and uninspiring people hated him. Major isn't quite as bad, again, he at least has some plot relevance, but with Piz, at least it was obvious he was simply a temporary love interest.

[AudienceofOne]

I used to have a friend that every man on Earth was attracted to the minute she met them. She rarely felt the same way so, while blunt, I totally got what Liv was trying to say to Ravi. And it had nothing to do with Ravi "not being good enough". It was a "she didn't feel the same way". And she clearly didn't so Liv was spot on. The number of times I had to go through the farce of "sounding them [my friend] out" on whether they were single and/or interested in this random man they barely remembered meeting... well, it was kinder that way but sometimes a good old kick would have been more satisfying. She's not interested, dude. Deal with it.

 

The point was not that radio woman was wrong; it's that she thought that being right was more important than being kind.

 

I got a little confused in this because I thought that Liv found out that Blaine was the "Candyman" an episode or two ago from the photo? So I was surprised she hasn't tried to do anything about it. Did I miss something?

[dubbel zout]

She's not interested, dude. Deal with it.

Didn't she say yes to a date at the end of the episode?

[Julia]

Didn't she say yes to a date at the end of the episode?

She did, although she asked Liv if she'd be OK with it, and Liv was happily over her radio shrink brain enough to say she was.

I think if she hadn't been into it, she would have just told him it was awkward because of Liv and left it at that.

[AudienceofOne]

She said yes to a date but didn't remember him and certainly hadn't had a "moment" with him. She did it from a "what the hell" perspective.

[Julia]

She said yes to a date but didn't remember him and certainly hadn't had a "moment" with him. She did it from a "what the hell" perspective.

I don't think what was onscreen supports that interpretation, but mileage varies. At any rate, if she didn't know who he was, then she didn't feel any way about him one way or the other, so Shrink!Liv was still wrong.

[Eneya]

Agreed.  I’m sick of hearing posters bitch about how Major bores them.  It seems to be mainly women who are whining about his character.  I guess their definition of boring must be a guy who is a handsome, muscular, clean cut, compassionate, romantic, educated, and employed.  I’m sure most would agree that Major has the aforementioned traits, yet posters still call him boring.  You’d think any respectable woman would want a man with Major’s characteristics.  Hell, he landed your girl Liv didn’t he?  The only reason they split up was because she died—not because he bored her. 

Based on posts I have read, it seems that if a man is to be considered “non-boring”, he has to be a narcissist, a liar, a criminal, a drug dealer, a kidnapper, or a murderer.  These are all evil traits, yet female posters lust for miscreants like Blaine, Carson McCombs (Ryan Hansen aka Dick Casablancas), and Lowell (we’re learning he isn’t the sweet guy he’s pretending to be).   

These days some women have a sick taste in men.  But hey! Good fiction is based on reality.  Rob Thomas nailed this phenomenon in Veronica Mars and has done it again in Izombie.

Dude... this is television... perfection IS boring. He is so stereotypical, it is like nails on a chalk board.

But thanks for equating fiction with reality and hive-minding women. :) I feel so educated about the female condition after having a dude explain it to me. God forbid someone enjoying a complex character which happens to be male, this must be because women are vile.

[editorgrrl]

[Peyton] said yes to a date but didn't remember [Ravi] and certainly hadn't had a "moment" with him. She did it from a "what the hell" perspective.

 

I don't think what was onscreen supports that interpretation, but mileage varies. At any rate, if she didn't know who he was, then she didn't feel any way about him one way or the other, so Shrink!Liv was still wrong.

 

Liv: It's Ravi.

Peyton: Who?

Liv: [whispering] My boss, from the morgue.

Peyton: [whispering] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. British guy.

 

Peyton: Hey, Liv? Um, your boss just, uh—

Liv: You should say yes.

Peyton: Is that weird for you?

Liv: Do it.

Peyton: [to Ravi on the phone] Um, yes. That, that sounds great.

 

Peyton knew who Ravi was—she just didn't recognize the name. And she could've turned down the date if she wasn't interested. If she wanted to let him down gently, she could've just said it would be too awkward because of Liv. She had an easy out—but said yes.

[jhlipton]

Good ole' "mansplaining".  Makes me so proud to be male!  

 

Of course to make this vile point, the MRA has to ignore that a goodly number of women on this forum find Ravi attractive, and he's about as nice as they come (but, fortunately not "nice").  I know it's off-topic, but MRAs are so disgusting... ugh.

 

I don't mind the case of the week -- it provides a place for Liv to use her zombinality and visions.  

[Eneya]

Side-track but... I don't find Major attractive, I prefer Ravi... Clive works better for me too. And I STILL prefer tv characters not to be balanced human beings.

I do wonder... why guys who enjoy movies with femme-fatales are never blamed or accused the same way women are who like (the example here) fantasy scenarios?  :)

P.S. Sorry if my previous comment was too much on the snarky side, I read the forum after spending an unpleasant amount of time reading hate for the new Mad Max movie by "real men and women" and got ticked. :) Either it is "just a piece of pop-culture" or it is important... does not work both ways whenever which is more convenient. Also, Major does not get negative treatment in the show whatsoever nor it is excused... a bunch of people stated they find him boring. The amount of hate reserved for female characters is a lot more brutal (death, rape threats, long rants and insults and etc.) AND equating the actor with their character is a regular. So... ugh.

Edited May 14, 2015 by Eneya

[Julia]

I don't really Get whoever they're writing manic pixie dream girl (and her increasingly popular cousin, waifish doe-eyed manic pixie combat haxxor sue) for but I don't think it's a moral issue.

I think it's fun that the boy-candy on this show is kind of a smorgasbord :)

Edited May 14, 2015 by Julia

[jhlipton]

P.S. Sorry if my previous comment was too much on the snarky side, I read the forum after spending an unpleasant amount of time reading hate for the new Mad Max movie by "real men and women" and got ticked. :)

Consider yourself lucky. Someone posted a positive comment about "Men Go Their Own Way' -- I found it was a webslime. Those who contribute are not "men" in any sense of the word I'm familiar with, but are offal and cow-poo.

For what it's worth, I think Major was played a bit too low-key, but that may have been to make his freak-out all the more startling.

Speaking of "taking the shot", I'm glad Major didn't reload the gun and shoot the Candyman in the head. Major doesn't know which genre of show he's in -- he thinks he's in a crime procedural, and shooting someone when they're down is very BAD on that genre show.

[Ubiquitous]

I could be mistaken but it looked like the rat went into zombie rage mode before it bit Ravi. That's probably how the rat bit thru the chain.

I thought it bit him further up the edge of the glove b/c Ravi wasn't paying attention to how he was holding Dr Oppenheimer.

[theatremouse]

Liv: It's Ravi.

Peyton: Who?

Liv: [whispering] My boss, from the morgue.

Peyton: [whispering] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. British guy.

You forgot the bit where she didn't recall him just from being reminded "boss from the morgue". I'm pretty sure that still didn't help and Liv showed Peyton a photo of him on her phone? And then she was "yeah yeah British guy".

So I think the text of P's entire phone call scene leaves a lot of room for interpretation. Did he make an actual impression and P just hadn't retained his name and that he were Liv's boss, but otherwise, Peyton was still certainly interested? IE he made an impression but not the one most obvious to the audience and/or Liv? Or does her need to be reminded of who he was with several different clues, ultimately resulting in him registering only as "British guy" mean it was more of a "what the hell, why not" acceptance of the date.

I think it's very hard to tell from the scene, possibly intentionally. We can't really deduce without more from Peyton whether he'd stuck in her mind as cute/attractive/charming/interesting/some-other-positive-attributes British guy all along, and she just didn't recall his name or the rest of the details about him; or if he she only vaguely remembered him, but having no particular objections to him, were willing to accept a reasonable sounding invitation, so long as her roommate who is his employee didn't mind/didn't see it as a potential conflict or problem for her worklife. Maybe for Peyton, a pleasant enough seeming guy, who is vouched for as not alarm-bell-sounding by her roommate and good friend is reason enough to go on a single date?

I don't know because I was never a person who really went on "dates" but Peyton has been established as someone who dates lots of people, so maybe for her it's really not that big a deal to agree to a single date with a guy. As in she didn't have any special reasons to say no, so she said yes, vs they had a moment and he were memorable and she were interested in him from said moment forward. I also think there's also a decent amount of wiggle room in between "meh, why not" and "interested in him from the moment they met". So she could be somewhere in between too.

I got a little confused in this because I thought that Liv found out that Blaine was the "Candyman" an episode or two ago from the photo? So I was surprised she hasn't tried to do anything about it. Did I miss something?

This might not be what happened to you, but here's my experience/memory, in case it helps:

Jerome was on whatever episode, mentioned the Candyman to both Major and in front of Liv (possibly Clive too, can't recall). He's established as creepy guy at skate park with whom some kids go off never to be seen again. Unclear whether in that moment Jerome knew who was the Candyman or just knew of him. Candyman is assumed to be drug dealer.

Later on, scene in the skate park, Blaine leads Jerome off to find Eddie his doom. We (the royal "we") get a lightbulb-ish moment: Blaine=candyman.

However, upon further review, if one assumes Jerome had some vague idea of what the Candyman looked like, Blaine can't be him because then Jerome wouldn't have approached him, let alone gone with him regardless of claims of having seen his friend at a house party.

Later-er, Major decided/determined through his own shenanigans that Dupont must be the Candyman, and moves forward from there with all future references to the Candyman meaning Dupont.

So I think Liv knows the Candyman is clearly connected to Blaine, but probably is not himself Blaine.

[Sakura12]

I think if Peyton had a "moment" with Ravi like he claimed they did she would've remembered him, like he remembers her. I do think Liv was right in saying that plenty of guys think they had a "moment" with her, when Peyton didn't feel the same. Not saying she's can't be attracted to Ravi, he is a good looking Doctor with an accent. But there was no special moment between them. Ravi has to start from the beginning if he wants to date her. 

Edited May 25, 2015 by Sakura12