Spoilers and Discussion

[camussie]

I think for the most part they did.  It was just badly written, with the exception of perhaps Mike's story with his parents which was actually well done (to be fair what the leads got was badly written as well).  For example Artie had an episode focused on him in season 1 and 5.  I knew how he felt about Tina breaking up with him.  I knew how felt about Brittany cheating on him.  I got some insight into what he felt about taking on NY.  I just never expected more for him because he was a supporting character.  same with Mike, Puck, Tina, and Mercedes.  Now i just want some nod to what their futures are.  

Edited December 19, 2014 by camussie

[RealityCowgirl]

Mike, Artie, Tina, etc were all supporting players so I didn't expect them to delve deeper into how Artie felt than they did. Really all I ever expect for supporting players on a show is a few focused episodes over the course of several seasons, a cursory look at their feelings on big life changes, and something at the end that tells me in general terms what their future is. That is why I want to know what Artie's and Tina's future while I also believe it shouldn't be a big focus.

This goes down to what I always say, Glee was never a true ensemble show even if some wanted it to be. It always had leads and supporting players. Characters like Artie, Tina, Mike, Puck, Mercedes were always supporting and to that end I feel like they got the right amount of focus even as I thought some of the plot/character development in that focus was terrible (as it was for the leads). .

What strikes me as I read that is that these supporting characters seem to be (along with Quinn) poised to be the true success stories. They made the most of high school, got a boost from participation in glee club (confidence, family, etc.) and are on their own long-term trajectories toward happy and successful lives. Just as most of us who had, if not literal glee club experiences,similarly positive high school/high school arts journeys.

I was thinking about that today, as I saw Harry's "Glee selfie" on Instagram. Mark and his Air Force uniform stuck out and I thought, "Wow. Never would have predicted five years ago that Puck wouldn't be a 'Lima loser' in the end." (Yes, I know Finn's death played a big role in his turnaround. I'd also argue for the transformative power of glee in his life.)

And that is why I'm sad they didn't get the stories they could have had.

Edited December 19, 2014 by RealityCowgirl

[spiritof76]

 

Wow. This show can't get anything right. So the last time the whole cast will be together will be the shitty noob propping two parter?

This is just awful. Having the whole cast (as in the originals) together in the last episode to close out the show, was literally the only expectation I had. I wasn't expecting  it to be good, or for the story to make sense or for the characterizations not to be all over the place. Nope. I know better then that by now. But the one thing, the only thing I expected (and wanted) was for the cast bake together to close out the show. Not in the 4 to last or whatever number it is show. I men what is the point of that?

 

And speaking of crappy spoilers, I know a lot has been said on this already, but I just have to add my two cents. I am beyond annoyed at this possible Sam/Rachel pairing. As has been discussed the idea that everyone has to end up someone they knew/dated in high school is ridiculous. Add to that the apparent need for RIB to have everyone paired up at the end for a "happy ending" because I guess to be single for a time is a fate worst than death? Oh but wait! Guess, who is probably going to end up, not paired off at the end (if things go as it looks like) Mercedes Jones! The sassy, independent, strong black woman, who doesn't need a man. She so doesn't need a man that she is probably going to be totally cool with Rachel (her friend) moving on with Sam (the one guy she has really really cared for). I bet they have her giving them her blessing and sing a love song dedicated to them. That burns me up. I don't agree that the only path to happiness is through a relationship the way RIB seem to. But in their world it is how they designate women as being happy and desired. And apparently Mercedes isn't worthy of that. Unless they bring some rando guy in at the last minute. Which would still kind of tick me off, because if this plays like we think everyone else will have been paired with a cast member and someone whose relationship we have seen and had some investment in. Anyway if this show is supposed to be about the underdog and giving young people hope or whatever nonsense they've been peddling I think implying that the one African-American female in the cast is the only one not worthy of love and being chased and desired, then that's a crappy message. It's no better than telling some girls they are only going to be happy if they have a man.

 

I won't even get into the whole Rachel being Mercedes friend and going after her ex. Because that part actually does not shock me.

[jaytee1812]

I think for the most part they did.  It was just badly written, with the exception of perhaps Mike's story with his parents which was actually well done (to be fair what the leads got was badly written as well).  

I thought Mike's story was really badly written and was saved by how awesome Harry Shum, Jenna Ushkowitz, Tamlyn Tomita and Keong Sim were. There is absolutely no character development there for Mike at all. On another thread I made a dig about Mike doing exactly what Daddy says, but that's what he does. He's not studying dance, Dad says it's okay, now he is. I'd love to have seen Mike stand up and say I'm doing this with or without you. Also would've like to see him get into college without his girlfriend's help.

What strikes me as I read that is that these supporting characters seem to be (along with Quinn) poised to be the true success stories. They made the most of high school, got a boost from participation in glee club (confidence, family, etc.) and are on their own trajectories toward happy and successful lives. Just as most of us who had, if not literal glee club experiences,similarly positive high school/high school arts journeys.

I don't think it was intended but I think it's how it's turned out. Also Puck and Quinn appear to be the healthiest relationship. How did THAT happen?!

Anyway if this show is supposed to be about the underdog and giving young people hope or whatever nonsense they've been peddling I think implying that the one African-American female in the cast is the only one not worthy of love and being chased and desired, then that's a crappy message. It's no better than telling some girls they are only going to be happy if they have a man.

Or that they need to give up love so the special (white) snowflake can be happy

[SNeaker]

We can't actually know if Quinn and Puck are healthy or not given that they literally haven't shared one scene or word of dialogue since they became " boyfriend and girlfriend." (Seriously, Quinn, how old are you?) And judging by the spoilers, they don't have much of anything coming up. Easy to seem healthy when the writers ignore you. (Not that I mind since I detest them together.)

I'm so not interested in this show anymore and had no plans to watch (and couldn't if I were tempted -- SNeak don't watch TV on the Sabbath), but I'm a sucker for finales of all shows I once watched and would have checked out a big reunion finale. So of course they can't even have that. LOL, thanks, Glee.

Edited December 19, 2014 by SNeaker

[jaytee1812]

We can't actually know if Quinn and Puck are healthy or not given that they literally haven't shared one scene or word of dialogue since they became " boyfriend and girlfriend." (Seriously, Quinn, how old are you?) And judging by the spoilers, they don't have much of anything coming up. Easy to seem healthy when the writers ignore you. (Not that I mind since I detest them together.).

Surely boyfriend/girlfriend are still acceptable at 19?! Puck and Quinn are the healthiest relationship by virtue of the fact the writers haven't destroyed them.

[spiritof76]

 

We can't actually know if Quinn and Puck are healthy or not given that they literally haven't shared one scene or word of dialogue since they became " boyfriend and girlfriend."

Well you already know I think they grow up to be Frank and April from  "Revolutionary Road".  Now that those two have thrown their lot in with each other, there is no way out!

[SeanC]

Naya just posted its her last day on the Glee set, so no big ending that some were expecting with everyone there. They set her off as the housewife to a dumb witted racist moron. Sucky ending for a great character.

She and Brittany are off pursuing their careers, from the spoilers we've been given.

 

I'm a bit surprised that they aren't going for a big cast reunion in the finale, but a number of shows have used the technique of gradually phasing castmembers out over the final season, and in a way they're going to get more attention in 6.08 than they would in 6.13.

[tom87]

One unconfirmed rumor has Santana off to do her own tour.

 

Who knows maybe they filmed something for the final like a flash forward  for the future for Santana and Brittany.

 

I would think episode 12 and 13 are at least outlined  to know if they are doing  a peek into the future.

Edited December 20, 2014 by tom87

[ComfySweater]

Surely boyfriend/girlfriend are still acceptable at 19?! Puck and Quinn are the healthiest relationship by virtue of the fact the writers haven't destroyed them.

Puck and Quinn who started off as a drunken hookup that ended in teen pregnancy can't actually be the most functional Glee relationship ... ... shit, it actually is. That says basically everything. 

Edited December 20, 2014 by ComfySweater

[Sara2009]

There's no way I'm drawing the conclusion that Quinn and Puck are healthy. I've been given zero reason to believe that they are. Based on their history, I'd say they're one of the most toxic couples on the show.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Sara2009

[Atony]

Just saw where Gina Gershon will play Blaine's mom.  Kind of explains why Blaine's side of the family seems okay with the teen marriage.  If the actors' ages are anywhere close to the characters' ages, Mrs. Anderson was 15 when she had Blaine's brother (assuming Blaine & his brother have the same mom, of course).

 

For what it is worth Matt Bomer was definitely playing younger than his actual age.  His character and Blaine's character were meant to be probably 8-10 years apart.  Not 20 or they never would have grown up together.

[tab19]

I wonder what the final scene will be?  Given that it won't be some big reunion scene (since at least Naya and Heather obviously believe they're done) - I wonder if, as someone said has happened on other shows, they gradually say goodbye to all the characters over the remaining episodes.  That is, each gets a moment to say goodbye and we see where they are headed.  

 

And then the final scene is Rachel (as current Glee Club director) leaving McKinley/Lima (for Broadway, one hopes).  She turns over the club to Mr. Schue, and the final image is a shot through the door at Mr. Schue leading Glee Club.

Edited December 20, 2014 by tab19

[shantown]

I wonder what the final scene will be? 

I want most of the characters to gradually say goodbye, but the final scene should be Rachel, Mercedes, Kurt, Tina, and Artie - the Original 5.

[Sara2009]

I want most of the characters to gradually say goodbye, but the final scene should be Rachel, Mercedes, Kurt, Tina, and Artie - the Original 5.

I really want Will to be there too, but otherwise I'm good with this suggestion.

[dizzyizzy01]

I think Quinn's the most fabulous character to ever come out of Glee. Helps she was played by the best actress on the show.

 

 

Diana Agron is the definition of mediocrity.  She's very pretty though.  Quinn's character was also all over the map.  I never understood where they were going with her character.

[camussie]

Will should definitely be a part of the final scene.  I still hope they use Cory rendition of "This is not the end" as the fade-out song.  Even before he passed I thought it would have been a great song to end the show on and now it would be a wonderful way to include an actor/character who was one of the reasons for Glee's break-out success.  

 

Diana Agron is the definition of mediocrity.  She's very pretty though.  Quinn's character was also all over the map.  I never understood where they were going with her character.

 

 

I think she is a serviceable actress and singer. As for Quinn I felt like them trying to keep her as a main supporting character didn't work for her or the show.  

Edited December 22, 2014 by camussie

[dizzyizzy01]

I think she is a serviceable actress and singer as for Quinn I felt like them trying to keep her as a main supporting character didn't work for her or the show.

 

 

Oh she's certainly serviceable, but I do find it pretty laughable to say she's the best actress on the show, which of course is a subjective opinion.

[camussie]

Here is the first sneak peek on ET

 

Sneak peek
 

My thoughts: 

• Lea looks great.  
• "Suddenly Seymour" is painfully bad in that short clip we have.  Not a good fit for either one of their voices and they seem to be singing different renditions.  
• The set up as Rachel is the savior of the Glee club I feel is the exact wrong direction to go because it seems like we will pivot pretty quickly from Rachel is in Ohio due to her own hubris to Rachel is the savior of ND.  For me to be invested in Rachel's future I have to see that she is learning from her own mistakes versus simply glossing over them.  A better direction would be if Rachel decides to help the Glee club because, not only does she think she can, but she also wants to make sure that these kids get to experience the joy of simply performing, a joy that she once had and would like to experience again.  If it is all focused on Rachel coming in and saying I will save the Glee club because I am a star that tells me she hasn't learned a dang thing.

Edited December 22, 2014 by camussie

[Sara2009]

At least Lea can belt, though.

Darren has a pleasant voice, but Broadway songs aren't in his wheelhouse.

[CoyoteBlue]

 Suddenly Seymour is terrible (stop the constant background runs!) and feels completely irrelevant to whatever in the hell is going on with those two. Unless this is just more of the "Blaine is everything to everyone always." BS and just holy crap, can this be over so I don't need to watch this anymore to see Chris Colfer?

[heyerchick]

I hope Lea's version of Let It Go has a bit more oomph than the clips are showing, because that is just so generic.

[dizzyizzy01]

For me to be invested in Rachel's future I have to see that she is learning from her own mistakes versus simply glossing over them.

 

 

There is no point to being invested in any character's future.  The writers' aren't so I think you'll be disappointed no matter what!

[caracas1914]

The only suspense for me left is whether the Season Premiere is going to dip to 1.0 or less ratings from the get go.

[camussie]

I wouldn't expect them to be over 1.0 in demos.  They didn't even hit that on "Opening night" and they were at 0.6 in the finale.  as far as total viewers that was around 1.6 in the finale so it could possibly slip below 1 in the first night but I think it won't until 2 or 3 in.

[fakeempress]

The Let it Go staging will probably improve the rendition. It's a good cover but personally I'm tired to hear Lea belt. I know it's coming, it's so predictable with the power numbers, and especially in this case it sounds maudlin against the reality of what causes Rachel's retreat to Lima.

As for what can be heard from SS, it doesn't sound good at all. Even Lea's belting sounds too much. Darren of course isn't a good match for her in the belting Broadway numbers, and sounds really overpowered there. I agree with Sara2009, I can't get giving him all these Broadway numbers which require a solid and good quality range throughout. I've said before that for me his voice has an interesting tone but loses quality in the higher register where (I don't know the technical terms so in layman words) he loses the sonority and has to compensate by shouting.

[CoyoteBlue]

The Let it Go staging will probably improve the rendition. 

I doubt it. From what little we got, it's her park'n'barking, making her usual repertoire of weird faces and gestures. Seriously, you could make a drinking game out of the repetitive mugging she does as she yet again belts the crap out of everything.

[Hana Chan]

The sneak peak was... disappointing. At least as much as this show is capable of disappointing me at this stage. Was nice to see Will, but I'd like to see more about how he really feels coaching the team that had been ND's biggest rival and is such a powerhouse that it's likely to overwhelm ND 3.0. His investment in ND was so deep and personal that this, for me, can be the most powerful storyline of the season.

 

As far as the Rachel/Blaine show... pass... I've little desire to see Rachel moping because she self-destructed her own career and even less to see Blaine feeling sorry for himself because Kurt momentarily came to his senses and dumped his ass. Suddenly Seymour was embarrassingly bad, with Lea's belting and Darren shouting because he can't hit the notes otherwise and it ends up being a yelling contest. 

 

No Kurt... No Santana... no me gusta.

Edited December 22, 2014 by Hana Chan

[caracas1914]

Well maybe the premiere  will best the .6 ratings the season 5  finale mustered.

 

It could happen.

[fakeempress]

Somehow missed from the preview the part where Darren says he's singing some or all of it live. It must be in his contract to get one live number at the piano per season, otherwise I have no rational explanation.

[Glorfindel]

Nothing I've seen today impresses me.

 

'Let it Go' is bland and an almost 1:1 copy of Idina Menzel's version, while 'Suddenly Seymour' is just horrible with Darren's screeching and Lea doing absolutely nothing with the song but powerbelt on full blast.

Plus this sneak peek was basically almost completely focused on Blainchel: not something I personally would tune in for, as they are (besides Becky) the characters I dislike the most on Glee.

 

And really, were Lea, Darren and Matt, along with Chord and Amber, the only ones of the cast available to do promo videos? What's up with Chris not being in any video yet (the only one of the cast who got a PCA nomination this year, so you'd think they would want to use his popularity to the max), and if I remember correctly Kevin is also still a regular on the show.

Edited December 22, 2014 by Glorfindel

[Hana Chan]

I'd actually love to see a real conflict between Rachel and Kurt that isn't quickly resolved with Rachel learning a lesson (for all of three seconds) and Kurt having the moral high ground. I'd love to see Kurt be a little selfish and career focused and seeing the positives of being director (or co-director) on his CV and not immediately bow and scrape to Rachel because she's so special and in such a bad place and she needs her favorite gay cheerleader to prop her up for the umpteenth time.

 

And both could have a valid view of why they are more suited for being director. Rachel is the one who had the most professional achievements in comparison to Kurt's more modest achievements, but she's also guilty of extreme hubris and her inability to listen to and absorb the advice that conflicts with what she wants cost her all of her achievements. Kurt might not have achieved goals as lofty as Rachel has (yet), but he's also not a college drop-out and still has a positive reputation in the theater community (insofar at least that he's still got the acceptance that Rachel discarded) and has a long history of being a strong team player. I'd love to see them go hammer and tongs with one another and come to a grudging agreement to share leadership but not happily.

[Anna Yolei]

I hope Lea's version of Let It Go has a bit more oomph than the clips are showing, because that is just so generic.

Honestly, most of the covers since beginning of season four have been generic as all getup. TIIC don't even bother to create new arrangements anymore.

[Glorfindel]

New promo: The final season. (no actual spoilers in them)

 

-ETA-

Reposting in the media ('Let's try to market this')  thread, as I think it belongs there more.

Edited December 24, 2014 by Glorfindel

[fakeempress]

Episode summaries:

 

6x01 - "Loser Like Me"

Following the epic failure of the very first episode of her semi-autobiographical live TV series, a humiliated – and now unemployed – Rachel flees Hollywood and returns home to Lima, Ohio looking for moral support and a reboot. Unfortunately, things at home aren’t any better, as she quickly discovers her two dads are in the midst of getting a divorce and their family home is being sold. Misery loves company, and Rachel reconnects with Blaine, who, following his breakup with Kurt and being cut from NYADA, has also returned home to Lima to lick his wounds, and has taken a position as the coach of the all-male Dalton Academy Glee Club, the Warblers. Also back home is Sam, who has given up his modeling career for the lower stress position as McKinley’s assistant football coach, and proud poppa Will has taken a job coaching McKinley’s bitter rivals, Vocal Adrenaline.

In the interim, Sue, McKinley’s new principal, has remade the school in her own image, disbanding the Glee Club and ridding the school of every last remnant of New Directions – and all arts classes and clubs in general – and turning it into a sports powerhouse. Meanwhile, in New York, Kurt tries to move on with his post-Blaine life but finds himself second-guessing his decision and getting a rude awakening. Back at McKinley, following an attitude intervention by her friends, Rachel sets her sights on a new goal… reinstating the arts and reviving the Glee Club at McKinley… but it comes with a catch, and a whole new set of challenges.

SPECIAL GUESTS
Figgins - IQBAL THEBA
Dave Karofsky - MAX ADLER

PRODUCTION CREDITS
Written by RYAN MURPHY, BRAD FALCHUK & IAN BRENNAN
Directed by BRADLEY BUECKER

6x02 - "Homecoming"
As Homecoming approaches at McKinley, Rachel finds she is up against several obstacles, some old and some new, as she tries to reconstitute the school’s Glee Club, but she remains unfazed and dedicated to her task at hand. While Kurt has stepped up to assist her in the monumental task, the two soon find themselves in an all-too-familiar power struggle. Following a moment of inspiration, Rachel resorts to calling on the alumni of New Directions in a bid to make Glee Club cool again, and Puck, Quinn, Santana, Mercedes, Brittany, Artie and Tina arrive to act as recruiters and mentors. While it looks like Rachel’s immediate problems may be solved, the returning alums discover much has changed at McKinley in their absence.

At Dalton Academy, Blaine is shocked with the news that a new student – a girl named Jane – has been admitted to the formerly all-male school and wants to be a Warbler, which results in chaos among the current members of the show choir and ends with Jane getting a chance to earn her way into the exclusive club. Meanwhile, Kurt finds himself in an unusual situation when he approaches a gay – and uniquely empowered – member of McKinley’s football team in a bid to recruit him for the Glee Club, Sue continues her pursuit to crush the new iteration of New Directions, and three rival show choir coaches find keeping their “friendly competition” friendly to be a bit harder than anticipated.

SPECIAL GUESTS
Tina Cohen-Chang - JENNA USHKOWITZ
Noah ‘Puck’ Puckerman - MARK SALLING
L. Quinn Fabray - DIANNA AGRON
Santana Lopez - NAYA RIVERA
Brittany S. Pierce - HEATHER MORRIS
Kitty Wilde - BECCA TOBIN
Becky Jackson - LAUREN POTTER
Dave Karofsky - MAX ADLER

PRODUCTION CREDITS
Written by RYAN MURPHY
Directed by BRADLEY BUECKER

Edited December 24, 2014 by fakeempress

[shantown]

 

Rachel resorts to calling on the alumni of New Directions in a bid to make Glee Club cool again, and Puck, Quinn, Santana, Mercedes, Brittany, Artie and Tina arrive to act as recruiters and mentors.

Didn't they already do a storyline where half of these people already came back as mentors? This is awful.

[jaytee1812]

Also two college students, an airforce pilot, three college dropouts and a pervy film student, who would let this lot near their kids?!!

[SeanC]

Didn't they already do a storyline where half of these people already came back as mentors? This is awful.

I was amused to see that described as "a moment of inspiration" on Rachel's part, since bringing back graduated characters to teach the newbies lessons is pretty much the default for how New Directions has worked.

[caracas1914]

It's a rehash of the phenomenally successful Season Four with incredibly enough, even more irrelevant and disposable Noobs to populate the choir room.

Navy man Puck in dayglow clothes recruiting high school kids in the school cafeteria for Glee says it all.

[Hana Chan]

The whole point of New Directions was that it wasn't "cool". It was the place where the kids who didn't fit in elsewhere found a place. Like the girl who was so socially inept that she was friendless despite her talent, or the boy in the glass closet, or the girl who had to invent a stutter as part of her disguise. They were joined by a head cheerleader who lost her social standing when she got knocked up, a closeted lesbian who slept with every boy in the school, a girl with the relative IQ of a parsnip and assorted jocks who had their own quirks. And king of the losers was their choir leader who kept inappropriately trying to relive his glory days through his choir.

 

ND only became remotely "cool" after they won a National title, a feat that they were unable to repeat once their biggest stars graduated. Trying to portray ND as anything other than a refuge for the kids who didn't fit in anywhere else is a continuation of the betrayal of what this show originally stood for.

[SeanC]

Trying to portray ND as anything other than a refuge for the kids who didn't fit in anywhere else is a continuation of the betrayal of what this show originally stood for.

On the contrary, I think few things better signify the problems with this show than the show's obstinate clinging to the idea of ND and its members as uncool well past the point where their various accomplishments, individual and collective, would have changed that situation.  Indeed, that problem started to manifest itself as early as episode 3, though it took a while before it really started to grind down on them.

[Anna Yolei]

Did anyone else watch Charmed back in the day? Ya noticed how the whole "saving innocents" thing got sidelined in later seasons to the point that when Haley Couco (sic?)'s character was introduced in the last season that she and the half-sister Rose would get scorned for doing so?

Glee has become like that with ND being the cool kids. I don't think it was impossible to address their new rise in social status and still keep the things that made the show what it was, and I don't count the season four primere's lip service to that. Rachel and Kurt were in a prime position to become social butterflies in a school which celebrated talent, but instead we get man problems. Yippee.

[caracas1914]

Glee has become like that with ND being the cool kids. I don't think it was impossible to address their new rise in social status and still keep the things that made the show what it was, and I don't count the season four primere's lip service to that. Rachel and Kurt were in a prime position to become social butterflies in a school which celebrated talent, but instead we get man problems. Yippee.

 

 

I always thought that also that the decision to stick to  the competition format repeating it in Season 2 hindered  them.  In hindsight, having them lose early at Sectionals in Season 2 and eschewing that format while they had other adventures/SL's in school, then having them do somewhat better in Season 3 (reaching Nationals)  and perhaps winning it all (Nationals) in Season 4 might have worked better.

 

Instead we got Glee winning  state football championships, Nationals  and home coming queen by the time they graduated in Season 3.

Edited December 27, 2014 by caracas1914

[Casual Viewing]

I get the feeling that aside from deciding on their Finchel endgame RIB had no idea on timelines or storyboard, not even a bare outline of how the series would progress, which is why the later competitions and Rachel's Broadway success all fell flat. They left themselves with no where to go but downhill.

Bad continuity, bad character development, no storyboard, and fan pandering resulted in the total mess this show became. Season 6 seems to be where they literally stomp it to death.

[SevenStars]

I get the feeling that aside from deciding on their Finchel endgame RIB had no idea on timelines or storyboard, not even a bare outline of how the series would progress, which is why the later competitions and Rachel's Broadway success all fell flat. They left themselves with no where to go but downhill.

Bad continuity, bad character development, no storyboard, and fan pandering resulted in the total mess this show became. Season 6 seems to be where they literally stomp it to death.

 

I agree. I think the only thing the writers knew for sure is that Klaine and Flinchel were going to be end-game, that's it. Everything else they write it as they go. Pick songs and try to make the story-lines fit within the songs and when that doesn't work, they just say f-it and just keep going. 

[camussie]

I think they had a rough idea of at least through 512/513 as before Cory passed I think they had already decided that the 100 was going to be the Will send-off episode and therefore also the graduation episode.  That is why I think the newbies 1.0 all got 13 episode contracts a month before Cory died.  Fox could have built that one inflection point in, in case ratings dictated going down to 1 narrative.

 

I think they had also probably decided that Rachel's FG debut was going to be in the last half of season 5, if not that last episode.  The problem is they had no plan for anything beyond that even though they were given a 2 season extension.  Basically it seems they had no real plan of what to do after with their female lead after Rachel had her Broadway debut which is why they should have never pulled the trigger on that story line as early last third on season 4.   As for their original male lead, Finn, they had already relegated him to riding the white board status by the second half of season 4.  

Edited December 28, 2014 by camussie

[tom87]

Didn't they have to have Rachel succeed early so she could give it all up for love and return "home" to Finn? 

[tom87]

You win the correct anon award this week, because I have confirmed with my sources that this is accurate.

"Must Have Been Love" by Roxette

"All Out Of Love" by Air Supply

These are songs that ND sing in episode 5.

http://missbeizy.tumblr.com/post/106372264310/i-found-out-the-new-directions-songs-for-episode

This blog has had some spoilers before but take with grain of salt.  They don't have direct knowledge but seem to have sources to check if something is true or not.

 

Episode 4 and 5 seem to be the Invitational  in episode 4 VA has two songs so if ND have 2 in episode 5 I guess would make sense.  Wasting songs on people we don't care about though.

Edited December 28, 2014 by tom87

[camussie]

Didn't they have to have Rachel succeed early so she could give it all up for love and return "home" to Finn?

 

 

I think this was part of it but really what were they going to do during season 6 if Finn had lived?  A protracted version of her Hollywood adventures (but set in New York) where instead of her pilot failing it got picked up and then on her hiatus she makes a successful movie.  Because Rachel having wild success after wild success in various entertainment mediums would have gotten old real quick.  That is why it was a mistake to pull the trigger on Funny Girl so early and the reason they made that mistake is because of RM's stupid "I'm Home" ending which it seems was his plan so he could end the show at the place that he considered the heart of it - the choir room.  Finn and Rachel's individual stories and their story as a couple seemed to all be in service to that concept.  Finn's especially since it seems Rachel was at least going to get to experience a lot of success away from Lima while Finn was relegated to riding the whiteboard by the second half of season 4.  

Edited December 29, 2014 by camussie

[jaytee1812]

If they wanted the choir room to be the heart of it why didn't they delay Rachel's success? I remember when she choked her NYADA audition there was speculation it was so she would be in Lima for season 4. What they're doing now might have worked then. Could you imagine Tina, Blaine or Artie if Rachel tried to tell then what to do? Much more comedy potential than Finn taking over.