S04.E13: Darkness On The Edge Of Town

[Guest]

27 minutes into it: Where the hell is David? Did something happen to him before the break and I just don't remember?

Edited March 2, 2015 by Trichromatic

[Shanna Marie]

The curse guarded by Chernabog could just have been the key core part of the curse. Then Rumple customized it for his purposes, adding the True Love and Emma stuff to break it and maybe even specifying where it would take them. Then Regina took that and added her own touches to it, like specifying which people to drag in from other realms and fine-tuning the personalities that would be given to people. She may have destroyed that particular version of the curse but may still have the original core curse, or at least the version she got from Rumple.

 

As for the author/happy ending stuff, your head will explode if you think about it too much. Regina cast the first curse to get her happy ending and remove everyone else's (but she totally deserves her own happy ending now -- well, the one she wants now. That will change as soon as she gets it). Then it was later revealed that her reason for needing the Dark Curse was that she couldn't harm Snow while in that realm. She had to go elsewhere to be able to get her revenge. But now they're saying she had to go to another world in order to get a happy ending as a villain because villains don't get happy endings in fairy tale land. And yet she, Rumple, and the Queens of Darkness are now trying to find the author because they don't have happy endings in this world. Haven't they ever heard that happiness is a journey, not a destination? If you're focused on finding happiness as some kind of goal in and of itself, you miss all the things along the way that might have made you happy.

 

Then we have the outlier, Hook, who of all the former(?) villains actually seems to feel bad about the things he's done and yet who seems fairly content with his current situation as possibly better than he could have hoped for. He's angry at himself and blaming himself even for things that were out of his control, but he's not complaining about his lot in life. I don't necessarily want full-time brooding Hook, but the fact that he is feeling bad about what he did rather than about what he does or doesn't have is what separates him from Regina.

[Curio]

Then we have the outlier, Hook, who of all the former(?) villains actually seems to feel bad about the things he's done and yet who seems fairly content with his current situation as possibly better than he could have hoped for. He's angry at himself and blaming himself even for things that were out of his control, but he's not complaining about his lot in life. I don't necessarily want full-time brooding Hook, but the fact that he is feeling bad about what he did rather than about what he does or doesn't have is what separates him from Regina.

 

This has been bugging me ever since Regina first mentioned the whole "villains don't get happy endings" line in 4.01. My knee-jerk reaction was, "Wait, then how do you explain Hook?" He seems pretty content at the moment. His girlfriend is the freaking savior. Is everyone just assuming his relationship with Emma is going to fall apart because he's a villain and he'll eventually lose his happy ending along with Regina? If that's the case, shouldn't Emma be more concerned about this relationship eventually failing?

 

I think it's awfully convenient the writers have purposely separated Hook and Regina throughout all of Season 4 so far. Have they even spoken more than 60 seconds of dialogue with each other this year? If they had, I'm pretty sure Hook would have called bullshit on her plan months ago and we wouldn't have any direction for 4B because Hook contradicts her entire Author theory.

[RadioGirl27]

 This has been bugging me ever since Regina first mentioned the whole "villains don't get happy endings" line in 4.01. My knee-jerk reaction was, "Wait, then how do you explain Hook?" 

I'm pretty sure the writers have totally forgoten that Hook was a villain when they first introduced him, and that's why he is not included in this "villains don't get happy endings".

[YaddaYadda]

I don't think Hook and Regina have had a single conversation since 301 when she was saying that what Greg Mendell told her about villains never getting their happy ending.  His reply was he hoped not because it meant they wasted their lives.  And before that, they had a similar conversation right before she sent him on his way for that visit with Maleficent.  It was another conversation about revenge and being a villain.

 

So Hook and Regina have had these conversations.  They are a blip on the radar, but they exist.  

[KingOfHearts]

 

I'm pretty sure the writers have totally forgoten that Hook was a villain when they first introduced him, and that's why he is not included in this "villains don't get happy endings".

Or Regina's theory is just a boatload of crap.

[RadioGirl27]

Or Regina's theory is just a boatload of crap.

Well, that too ;-) Edited March 2, 2015 by RadioGirl27

[woolmintons]

Aaaand for my first post ever I wrote an essay. Oh well.

 

This book plot is all sorts of stupid. What’s supposed to be the end result? I keep seeing people saying, “Oh, Regina will learn that you are responsible for your own happy ending. Life is a series of choices and your choices and decisions have consequences.” Like, how is that an exciting storyline? An adult needs to have this explained to them by multiple people? It’s been four seasons and Regina needs it spelled out that you can’t blame others for your bad choices? That’s not exciting to me, that’s just sad.

 

I think they were giving us a sort of anti-parallel between Hook and Regina:
Hook's spent the last six weeks looking at this board, being reminded of all of the terrible things he did under Rumple's control, and he's expressing guilt and regret and remorse, not only for what happened to the Apprentice and the fairies, but for what led him to be under Rumple's control in the first place. He’s working with and comforting his former victim, and when the fairies are actually released, neither he nor Belle receives any credit (that instead went to the woman who merely twirled around the wavy knife). He’s also blaming himself for what happened, even when others are telling him it’s not his fault.

 

On the other hand, we have Regina, who has spent the last six (+) weeks pouring over this book filled with all the terrible things she’s done – rape, murder, attempted murder, torture, cursing thousands – and there’s no evidence she feels any guilt for any of these things. In all of 4A it was, “This book is wrong about me! Lots of bad things happened to Regina in here!” And according to 3x09, she doesn’t feel regret or remorse because she feels everything she did is justified by her eventually having Henry in her life (Even though she murdered and raped and cursed while in Storybrooke after she already HAD her son, and those actions aren’t in any book). She’s looking at this book and instead of thinking, hey, my own choices, my own actions, my own bad decisions have resulted in the life I have now, she’s placing the blame on an inanimate object and this omniscient “author.”

 

She is also working with her former victim, but that victim is comforting HER, coddling HER, putting in a hell of a lot of effort to be HER friend while getting very little in return. Friendship is a two-way street. This "friendship" is especially confusing since we just had an AMAZING friendship on the show between Emma and Elsa, and now we get...this. And I don’t feel like there’s been any real moment where Regina has showed that she felt that most of the things she's done were actually wrong. There’s a difference between admitting you did bad things and admitting you did bad things and that you were wrong to do them. "I cursed an entire kingdom" vs. "I cursed an entire kingdom and cursing people is bad." This whole thing is driving me nuts and I have no idea if the writers actually think they’ve redeemed Regina or if they’re toeing some line and are setting up the ultimate backslide.

 

Ursula's EF costume is terrible, but I love her in the LWM. I’m not really feeling Maleficent either, but maybe that will change. I love Cruella. Love, love, love her. She actually showed some self-awareness with the author nonsense, “better than blaming bad judgment and gin,” so maybe there’s some hope for her. Can you tell I dislike characters that show no self-awareness?

 

Ginny was looking adorable (and terrifying in that last scene). I’m glad they seemed to have stopped with the awful maternity clothes they gave her in 4A. I think I could have blinked and missed Charming. I’m 50% frustrated that the Mary Margaret mayor storyline went nowhere and 50% happy that she is back to teaching and that Henry is actually going to school. I read a meta that said birds in Storybrooke décor usually represent Mary Margaret, so it’s pretty disturbing to me that Regina would fireball that painting.

 

The Captain Swan casual intimacy, happiness, and Emma reciprocating the emotional support almost made up for the book crap and Woegina. ALMOST.

Edited March 7, 2015 by woolmintons

[Shanna Marie]

Or Regina's theory is just a boatload of crap.

We know that. If only they did. I'm just dying for someone to ask Regina what's so horribly unhappy about her life. The only problem with it at the moment is that she doesn't have the one particular boyfriend she wanted. We should all be so lucky. It seems like she's missing out on life by devoting herself to this quest for the Author and sighing over Robin. This is not a "villain" outcome, especially in comparison to Belle, whose husband was lying to her and scheming and who is now secretly back in town and still using her to carry out his schemes. Or there's Marian, stuck in a strange world with a husband she knows doesn't want her. And these are heroes. Regina's life is better than theirs. How is this an unhappy villain ending? They made a big deal out of showing that a True Love's Kiss isn't necessarily a romantic thing, that it can be a parent and child, so why are they apparently defining a happy ending as having a romantic partner, as though you've had an unhappy "villain" ending if you don't have a boyfriend/girlfriend or spouse?

[YaddaYadda]

Hook's spent the last six weeks looking at this board, being reminded of all of the terrible things he did under Rumple's control, and he's expressing guilt and regret and remorse, not only for what happened to the Apprentice and the fairies, but for what led him to be under Rumple's control in the first place. He’s working with and comforting his former victim, and when the fairies are actually released, neither he nor Belle receives any credit (that instead went to the woman who merely twirled around the wavy knife)

 

Not only did Belle and Hook get zero credit for doing what they did, but given how horrible being inside the hat seemed because Shady!Blue seemed very shaken up, I was expecting her to have some kind of a reaction to Hook standing right there since he's the one who put her in the hat in the first place.

 

Got to love Blue though, spitting out that thank you to Regina seemed to just take a lot out of her.  Don't ever change Blue!

 

Or Regina's theory is just a boatload of crap.

As it should be.  I mean finding some person to write her her stupid Happy Ending.  Technically, her happy ending has already been written in the book.  Didn't the book end with the curse taking everyone to the Land without Magic, where she lived in 28 year groundhog day where Snow White was sort of scared of her and Archie greeted her every morning while he walked Pongo until she became bored with her life.  Regina just doesn't know how to be happy with what she has.  It's always more, more, more with her.

[RadioGirl27]

Not only did Belle and Hook get zero credit for doing what they did, but given how horrible being inside the hat seemed because Shady!Blue seemed very shaken up, I was expecting her to have some kind of a reaction to Hook standing right there since he's the one who put her in the hat in the first place.

Yeah, this have been bothering me so much. The lack of reaction of the fairies to Hook being there is baffling. And Emma giving all the credit to Regina when Belle and Hook have done all the work is just ridiculous, and another example of the writers have with her.

[Curio]

And Emma giving all the credit to Regina when Belle and Hook have done all the work is just ridiculous, and another example of the writers have with her.

 

They did the same thing last season when they came back from Neverland. They made a point to give Regina special credit and then totally ignored Hook, Rumple, Neal, and Tink's contributions.

[Bluerang1]

I liked how Chernabog stayed on the car after Regina left, it supported Rumple's theory about Emma's heart. I knew something was up when Chernabog didn't immediately fly after Regina.

[ParadoxLost]

Did we get a definitive answer on Chernabog?  Was it hatted? Did Rumpel's spell summon him? Or does the hat go to Bald Mountain?

[Camera One]

The black stuff came out of the Hat which everyone convenient turned their backs on, so it *looks* like the Chernabog came out of the Hat.  But who knows, it could have been created by that spell translation that Rumple sent to Belle.

 

When Blue came out of the hat, she or one of the fairies said, "Trapped in the Hat with that..." and I don't think she finished the sentence.  Was she talking about that Chernabog?  Or something else?  She seemed really traumatized.  Blue was also sitting alone at the diner by herself during that "celebration".

[YaddaYadda]

Rumple had Belle release Chernabog on purpose. Got to love how he's still using her.

[KingOfHearts]

 

Rumple had Belle release Chernabog on purpose. Got to love how he's still using her.

Got to love that she's still as gullible as Dora the Explorer.

[Souris]

I finally tried to watch the ep tonight and it was just painful. I intended to watch the scenes with Rumple and the Queens of Darkness -- because, hey, no Regina! -- but I simply could not take them nattering on about their "happy endings" one more time. And then I became Chandler:

 

 

So I had to start fast-forwarding them as well as Regina. I hate the Author storyline so, so, so much. It's soul-suckingly stupid.

 

The QoD seemed so inept and uninspired. What was with them just standing there when Rumple revealed he was double-crossing them and leaving them with the Chernabog? "Oh, ho hum, we'll just stand here and watch you leave and not even try to use our magic." I felt like I was watching community theater where the actors were overly concerned with hitting their marks and totally wooden as a result. "OK, you move there, then I'll cross here and stop. Then I shall say my line. And you will react." I don't know who directed this ep, but they were not good.

 

About the only plus was the Hook/Belle scene. Except for the eyelash spiders trying to eat her face.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Souris

[KingOfHearts]

 

I finally tried to watch the ep tonight and it was just painful.

I love how mixed the reception has been for this episode. Some people liked it, others thought it was just mediocre, and others thought it was absolutely dreadful.

 

 

I do believe this is the only thing that every single faction of the ONCE fandom is almost unanimously in agreement. So "Congrats" to the writing team for writing something so downright dumb that it unites everyone.

A. No one understands it, B. it removes free-will, C. it's more woe for Regina (which is bad for both her haters and lovers), D. it's overly vague, E. no one cares about it, F. it's boring, G. there's no facts behind it, and H. it's ridiculously contrived. It just has the audience had a total loss. In a show where there's crazy random magic who-haw going around, it's a confusing plot that's trying to reach out to an already confused audience. It just makes no sense unless you oversimplify it, but when you do that it makes no one responsible for their own actions.

Edited March 3, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[FabulousTater]

This book plot is all sorts of stupid.

I do believe this is the only thing that every single faction of the ONCE fandom is almost unanimously in agreement. So "Congrats" to the writing team for writing something so downright dumb that it unites everyone.

[Grammaeryn]

My theory for the Snowing evil trio deal is that the trio offered to stop the curse in exchange for the kingdom. Snow and Charming said no obviously but that would A) piss all the townsfolk off and B) push the whole What If abandonment buttons Emma has.

[ParadoxLost]

I love how mixed the reception has been for this episode. Some people liked it, others thought it was just mediocre, and others thought it was absolutely dreadful.

 

I think the episode was mixed.  The character stuff with Hook/Belle. Emma/Hook, and the villains dealing with random stuff like ordering fast food was all fun.  I'm trying to get on board with Regina's redemption because I'm tired of fighting it so even Regina/Emma wasn't to bad.

 

The problem is that they take the good stuff and then drop in stupid stuff because they are too lazy to earn their plot points.  It was intolerably irritating that Emma/Regina let Cruella and Ursala into town because it made no sense.  It doesn't stand up to any scrutiny at all even with Regina's villains deserve a happy ending shtick.  It was unacceptable that Rumpel made a speech about no one knowing he was back in the middle of the street with cars driving in the background.  I'm not a fan of Ursala and Cruella letting Rumpel into the town when he's betrayed them in every fairyback. 

 

 

And really show, I caved on Regina so why must you have her throw fireballs at pictures symbolic of Snow.

[Camera One]

And really show, I caved on Regina so why must you have her throw fireballs at pictures symbolic of Snow.

 

I can imagine the entire Writers' Room laughing non-stop about that one for 10 minutes.

[Souris]

It was intolerably irritating that Emma/Regina let Cruella and Ursala into town because it made no sense.  

 

 

Oh, how could I forget to mention THAT bit of stupidity? Yet another example of the writers needing something to happen, so they make the characters behave in the most incredibly stupid manner to allow it to happen instead of coming up with a way that doesn't make the characters basically mobile ferns.

 

The book plot doesn't stand up to even the most cursory logical examination. I would say it's the dumbest plot the show has ever come up with. And that includes the Home Office.

[Camera One]

Oh, how could I forget to mention THAT bit of stupidity? Yet another example of the writers needing something to happen, so they make the characters behave in the most incredibly stupid manner to allow it to happen instead of coming up with a way that doesn't make the characters basically mobile ferns.

 

It fits with the pattern of making the protagonists all contenders for the Biggest Idiot Award.  Did Regina think of binding Ursula and Cruella's magic until they proved themselves?  Maybe finding out how the hell Ursula got her hands on Rumple's cell phone first, before inviting them into town?  The fact that they had the "heroes" allow Ursula and Cruella to keep the Scroll shows how little thought they put into this.  And then they have Snow and Charming stupidly go right up to the villains and threatening them?  Way to show your hand.  Basically, everyone in Storybrooke is about to get played.  Hey, what else is new.  This has got to be as enjoyable as the Evil Midwife aka Wicked Witch Wearing Giant Ass Emerald Con.  And as others have said, that the Stupid Awards includes nominations for Ursula and Cruella.  How stupid do they have to be, to fall for Rumple's tricks over and over again.  He left them in a cavern to freak'in die.  Yes, let's let him crash on my couch eating my Ramen noodles.  I'm sorry, but your villain card has been revoked just for that.  

Edited March 3, 2015 by Camera One

[Donny Ketchum]

Rumple had Belle release Chernabog on purpose. Got to love how he's still using her.

 

Got to love that she's still as gullible as Dora the Explorer.

To be fair to Belle (since someone has to be), she had no way of knowing it was Rumpel.  If she did, I don't think she'd have taken the info at face value.

[KAOS Agent]

I didn't have a problem with Ursula and Cruella using Rumpel to get to Storybrooke. They were even prepared with the gun and all and I liked them telling him he was nothing. The issue came in when they let him into town before he told them his actual plan. It's clear that Rumpel is using them, but he was right that he's crazy powerful now and he has a special in as the professor. Having him work behind the scenes helps them, but that whole conversation needed to occur before they let him into town, not after. And it sure as hell shouldn't have taken place in the middle of Main Street.

[Camera One]

They took a huge leap of faith that Storybrooke actually existed, by going all the way out there with Rumple with zero proof.  The gun was when they showed they had some smarts, though they could have strung him along a little by first gauging what they could have gotten in Storybrooke without Rumple, before deciding to let him in and trust him with the whole Author stuff.  

Edited March 3, 2015 by Camera One

[KingOfHearts]

It was intolerably irritating that Emma/Regina let Cruella and Ursala into town because it made no sense.

This could have easily been fixed if one of the characters had a positive past with Ursula and Cruella. There was just no reason for them to trust them at all from what was given. Their information about the beast wasn't that vital either. A red flag should have been the fact they met with Rumple. How did they not expect they were working for him?!

I almost wish a mystic spoon or an alien vampire bunny would have just let them in instead. Heck, even an inside guy like Mr. Smee would have been more satisfying and less stupid. The scroll was just too convenient and eliminated any tension about leaving Storybrooke.

Edited March 3, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[jhlipton]

I was meh.

 

Rumple got back way too quick and way too easy (even though we knew he would) -- way to make the ":banishment" totally pointless.  The "villains" spent more time striking poses and tossing quips than they did getting as personality.  "Gin and bad decisions" echos the "desperation and gin" line they stole from Carson McCullers who "claimed she existed almost exclusively on gin, cigarettes, and desperation for weeks at a time".

 

When the Chernabog,was deciding who was most evil, and the Villains were helping each other, I was hoping it would get a "Nurrh?" face: "They're not supposed to do that!"

 

QoD: Why shoul we believe you.

Rumple: Because this time I'm not lying, reaaly and for true!"

QoD: Well, alrighty, then.

 

Did production get a discount on 1980's computers -- Rumple's "You've got mail" (WHAT??!!) and Belle's Apple ][ in the library.

 

Henry continues to be the Kristina Van Tassel of OUaT.

 

Some amusing quips, but all-in-all, fairly disappointing.

[Rumsy4]

It's nice to know that Henry is focused on getting his mom a HE instead of on his HW (homework). That kid gets creepier by the season. Henry being 'Henry' was cute in Season 1, but it's long past its expiration date.

[Whodunnit]

"...Something truly despicable. Not just being snippy or sneezing on somebody's dog."

Kingofhearts, I just know that snippy comment would end up being made to the villain's father's nephew's former roommate, who would then do something horrible completely changing the villain's life and we all know that the person responsible and with the world's blackest heart is not the one who actually commits the crime but rather the individual who snubbed the crime doer and sent them on a killing spree that would make Elizabeth Bathory proud; Regina, Adam and Eddie told us so.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Whodunnit

[Whodunnit]

Say, whatever happened to the mouse (A.k.a. Mickey the geriatric apprentice)?

How nice that Chernbog found the time to accessorize. Nice bling demon! Edit: spelling.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Whodunnit

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On a shallow note, can makeup just scale the eff back on the fake eye lashes?  Belle's eye lashes were very distracting for one and she looked like she might take flight they were so long.  Fake eye lashes are like fake boobs, the bigger they are the faker they look.

I was so distracted during that Hook/Belle scene because I could see her eyelashes even in the long shots. In the close up shots, I was like HOLY HELL, why is Belle wearing drag queen lashes (and I mean no disrespect to drag queens - performers wear those huge thick long fake lashes so that people in the back row of the theater can still see them). It's really unnecessary for people who are being filmed in high definition for tv (in fact on tonight's episode of RuPaul's Drag Race, on of the contestants was told by the judges in reference to her makeup, "This isn't the theater. This is tv."). In profile, Belle's lashes looked like they were about an inch long, which is just ridiculous. I actually had to rewind the entire scene and rewatch because the first time around, I couldn't pay attention to anything but those crazy fake lashes.

[YaddaYadda]

To be fair to Belle (since someone has to be), she had no way of knowing it was Rumpel.  If she did, I don't think she'd have taken the info at face value.

No, I don't fault Belle in the least. I mean hey, I'm chatting wiht you guys and I don't know if you're some evil author writing my happy ending right now, so no Belle is not to blame. But Rumple is. How does he think she will feel when she finds out that he used her? Or are we starting the next conversation with a lie? Actually, several lies in this case.

[kili]

No, I don't fault Belle in the least. I mean hey, I'm chatting wiht you guys and I don't know if you're some evil author writing my happy ending right now, so no Belle is not to blame.

 

I do blame Belle a little. Somebody at least should sign her up for an internet safety course. Right now, she's probably  penpals with some creepy guy she thinks is a fellow female book-lover (and she has told him her real name, where she lives and where she hides the key to her backdoor - good thing he can't find Storybrooke) and has already sent some foreign Prince her bank-account number. 

 

She knows magic is dangerous. Maybe don't try the spell without taking a few moments to get a second opinion or to find out how the translation was done. Or to do some google searching on your Oxford professor (Rumple may be magical, but the guy is not a tech wizard in the real world). On the internet, you can be whoever you want to be.

 

Actually, I'm stunned that Emma didn't ask a few questions.

[YaddaYadda]

Or to do some google searching on your Oxford professor

 

Google?  What is that you're talking about?  It's all about AOL!

 

Actually, I'm stunned that Emma didn't ask a few questions.

Emma doesn't seem to ask much questions these days about anything really and she turned around and gave Regina the credit for releasing the fairies and then Regina turned around and wasn't happy with Belle when Chernabog was flying overhead.  This show really is fucked up.

 

I hope Belle has enough sense to stay away from him and not take him back.  Even at a distance, he is still using her and lying to her.

[KingOfHearts]

 

Rumple got back way too quick and way too easy (even though we knew he would) -- way to make the ":banishment" totally pointless.

This didn't bother me as much because the repercussions were still there. He's not Mr. Gold any more - he's Rumplestiltskin and he's out for revenge. Now if Rumpbelle got back together in this episode, I'd be flipping tables. He still has to lay low, and Team Hero still has the dagger, so he's not out of the water yet. I do think those six weeks in the real world affected his character quite a bit just from the few scenes we saw of him out there. He's returned to his Rumple roots in that he's a man who's been to the bottom and never wants to go there again.

 

Besides, I'll take Big Bad Rumple any day of the week. ;)

[YaddaYadda]

He's returned to his Rumple roots in that he's a man who's been to the bottom and never wants to go there again.

 

It's interesting that you say that because he did ask Cruella if she was tired of being ordinary which is exactly what he was during those 6 weeks, ordinary, powerless, walking with his cane (I thought the scene of him crossing the town line and throwing his cane was all kinds of awesome).  And then Cruella mentioned how she never wanted to go back where she started.

 

They gave her the lines that Rumple should have spoken, but really didn't, but we know the character.  In many ways, that does make Rumple and Cruella very similar.

 

One thing though, I hope they don't keep going with the short jokes.  Twice was enough imo.

[kili]

Did Regina think of binding Ursula and Cruella's magic until they proved themselves?

They should have at least searched the trunk of the car to make sure Rumple wasn't in the back.

Their story is that they want to be redeemed, but they just finished robbing Rumple of his cellphone. It's a little suspicious.

Edited March 3, 2015 by kili

[YaddaYadda]

Well our heroes aren't exactly known for their high IQs and on a good day, they share a brain, so nothing really unexpected.  You know what could have helped?  If Snowing had said something about why they were so against having those two cross the town line.

 

I guess Hook won't be wearing the stupid hat this half season since it seems to now have passed on to others.

Edited March 3, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[Dani-Ellie]

I wonder how much of this is because once again we know so much more than the characters do. This is a constant problem, where we're privy to all the villains' machinations but the good guys aren't. We know the villains are lying but the good guys do not, so the good guys look like dumb-dumbs for taking people at their word.

[KingOfHearts]

 

We know the villains are lying but the good guys do not, so the good guys look like dumb-dumbs for taking people at their word.

Well, after Midwife Zelena, freeing Regina from execution and trying to blackmail Rumple, I tend to lean on they're just dumb. But I see your point.

[dr pepper]

When Rumple stole the gauntlet, said it was from Camelot, then got the challenge, i was excited. I thought, ah, he's going to have to face Morgan Le Fae. But nope, it was a trio of other characters, including a dog slaughtering society lady not from a fairy tale but somehow promoted to witch. That was a disappointment. Then i thought, oh yeah, Disney. There's no Morgan in Disney's version of Camelot. And then i remembered Madam Mim, the magical bag lady. Thank goodness, the writers didn't go that direction. And i see now, that dog skinning is apparently Cruella's secondary power; she started as a witch and became a society lady only after being exiled to Earth. I wonder if she'll get a backstory.

Oh and the creature from Fantasia was a bit of a disappointment close up. I'd always thought of it as a balrog, but the cgi looked more like a gargoyle.

[Mitch]

Loved this episode now that we have those boringFrozen Princesses off the show. The episode hti the right notes of moving the bad plot, character moments and wink, wink camp. I know they will screw it up by giving each Queen a backstory where they miss there Mommy but right now I am loving these over the top broads being Wicked cause its Fun! After the first half of the season we need it to be a little  more lighthearted and fun and the writers hit the right notes of the characters being self aware and flippant but still aware that people can be hurt. Though yes, I was sorry they got to Storybrooke, I could have watched them driving around in that cool ass car for days...(You know they left without tipping at the diner down the highway from town..)  Plus there was the added fun of watching misogynistic Rump get knocked to his ass by Street Ursala and then had a gun pulled on him by Trashy Reality TV Cruella. I love them both so don't kill them off..leave them in town so we can have a counterpoint to the boring Charmings at town meetings..."Should we let the latest vilaln in town and believe their story?"  Ursala ..."Are you people CRAAAZZZY! Remember you let US in?" ...Cruella, "Darling one thing I agree with Woegina is that both of those two are indeed idiots! Let's hit happy hour and roll Grumpy in the alley for some beer money!"

 

Hilarious that the writers do not even care about Prince Dullard. He is gone for most of the episode and then its like "Yea, what Snow said!" I hope their secret is a good one those two are as boring as Snow's Blue Bird Picture which Regina delightfully burned up.

 

About the happy endings. I believe that Regina feels that he can write her a happy ending as everytime she tries to do something heroic...like save the town and send everyone home safe, etc, bad things keep happeing to her...(yea, yea, no lecture on her slaughtering a vlllage..I am giving it through Regina's view point.) I dont think the point is that the characters dont think that he writes their entire life story to become villains etc, but that he nudges them in that direction and keeps them there.  Rump a dump felt he could do it on his own....but now he beleives differently. ..also the "happy ending," he was taliking about was reuniting with his son but also keeping his magic in a world were no one else does. His son and world domination is that a-holes happy ending. But I gotta say, I love him being an a-hole and being called on it, especially by those two bad broads!

[Writing Wrongs]

So is Storybrooke now the safe haven for all the stranded villains out in our world? This show is...not what it used to be. 

[RadioGirl27]

Well our heroes aren't exactly known for their high IQs and on a good day, they share a brain, so nothing really unexpected.  You know what could have helped?  If Snowing had said something about why they were so against having those two cross the town line.

Really, it's amazing how stupid Emma and Regina were there. Not only they let Ursulla and Cruella in, they let them keep the scroll. That's up there with Hook blackmailing Rumple as the most stupid thing one of the "heroes" have ever done.

[Curio]

So is Storybrooke now the safe haven for all the stranded villains out in our world? This show is...not what it used to be.

 

Storybrooke is basically villain rehab now.

 

I believe that Regina feels that he can write her a happy ending as everytime she tries to do something heroic...like save the town and send everyone home safe, etc, bad things keep happeing to her.

You could say that about a lot of characters, though. Emma does the heroic thing and saves Marian from being killed by Regina, but her heroic action gets stomped on and thrown back at her as a bad decision by Regina. The Charming Clan try to do the heroic thing and stop Zelena from doing a diabolical scheme and Snow gets her baby stolen away from her. Hook does the heroic thing and trades his Jolly Roger to save Emma, but he comes back to find that she's in love with another man and he nearly drowns to death. Marian does the heroic thing and gives Regina her blessing to go after Robin and she immediately becomes sick again and has to live life in the real world with a man who she knows doesn't truly love her. Belle does the heroic thing and forces her husband across the town line, and now she has to live with the guilt of knowing she had been fooled for so long and doesn't even get credit for helping the fairies out of the hat. Rumple tries to do the heroic thing and sacrifices himself for Neal and Belle and he gets brought back as Zelena's prisoner. 

 

I re-watched the episode and the fact that Emma just now remembers Ingrid's scroll is really annoying and totally controlled by the writers needing to fill in a plot point. Why didn't Emma think of that weeks ago as a way for Regina to get back to Robin? Couldn't Regina and Robin have a long distance relationship where they go and visit each other every other weekend or something? Real world couples do that all the time. They could take turns where one weekend Robin comes to the town line and crosses over into Storybrooke for a couple days, and then Regina can go visit him for a week in the real world. It's not like these people have any real 9-5 jobs holding them back, either. Regina could just up and visit him on a random Wednesday and they could go see a movie and Storybrooke wouldn't know the difference. Regina's the freaking mayor now anyways, she can make whatever rules she wants about her job. I kind of hope Regina and Emma's stupidity to allow Cruella and Ursula into Storybrooke and letting them keep the scroll backfires and the scroll gets destroyed or something.

 

Also, it made no sense to let Cruella and Ursula in after they filled them in on the Chernabog information. Even without their "help," Emma should have come to the conclusion on her own that the Chernabog is obviously a magical being, so they could just lure it to the town line and force it over. Why did they need the information about the dark heart to do that? I ended up fast forwarding all that Regina/Emma car stuff because it was just so stupid.

[kingshearte]

I liked Snow's threat at the end. More of bandit Snow please. Mary Margaret needs to take a hike.

So much this.

 

I quite liked it! I think there was a bit too much of screentime for the queens of darkness though. I can't believe they're trusting Rumpel after what he did to them. And Ursula should do more than use her tentacles, that was a bit of a letdown.

I know, right? You need Cruella's Dr. Doolittle abilities, Malificent's fire manipulation, and Ursula's... Go-Go-Gadget arms? Lame.

 

How did Cruella get away with "Cruella Fineberg" in the Land Without Magic? Did they not see the hair, the clothes, and the car? I wonder if they just thought she was a crazy woman who thought she was Cruella DeVil.

I just about choked when she said "Cruella DeVil? No one calls me that here." I was all "Really? Have you looked in a mirror lately? If your name were Mary Sunshine, I'm pretty sure people would still call you Cruella DeVil." That said, she was definitely my favourite of the three of them. Scenery-chewy, to be sure, but entertaining about it.

 

I don't actually remember Bell's specific words when kicking him out, but didn't they include some variation on "don't come back"? In which case, how can he do so at all? And I know she said something about never hurting any of them (possibly anyone at all?) ever again, so how will they get around that when he inevitably does hurt someone?

 

I thought this episode did a theoretically good job of dropping hints about possible stories and secrets (Snowing's secrets, whatever Blue's hiding, I feel like there was something else, but I don't remember), but sadly, I have no faith whatsoever that the payoff will be particularly satisfying.

 

And did anyone else notice whether Socha was still in the credits? The complete and utter pointlessness of his character last half season can't have been his whole thing, can it?

[YaddaYadda]

Michael Socha is still in the credits but he is also under contract, so his name has to appear in the credits.  They should've put him as recurring.  It would have made so much more sense than tying a whole year's salary up.