Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Jean]

I'm going to laugh if that's a portal from Arendelle to land with no magic. Poor Rumple.

I'm guessing either Snow Queen in a flashback or Anna making her way to Storybrooke in the present.

[kili]

I'm guessing either Snow Queen in a flashback

Good guess. Canadagraph reports

 

#OnceUponATime star Elizabeth Mitchell shooting a scene for ep 408 in a 1980s setting in a big city right now #OUAT

 

Hmm....1980s...if Emma was 17 in 2001, she would have been born in 1984 (spooky!) and could be a baby/young child at the time this is set. I hope we get some crazy hair and some serious shoulder pads on the Snow Queen.

Edited October 2, 2014 by kili

[pezgirl7]

Crazy thought... What if the Snow Queen is Elsa's real mother, which would explain her powers, and blonde hair. Then Emma and Elsa would have another thing to bond over: being given up by their birth mothers!

Edited October 2, 2014 by pezgirl7

[InsertWordHere]

Emma was born in 1983. I wonder if the Snow Queen had something to do with Emma's awful childhood.

[KingOfHearts]

 

I wonder if the Snow Queen had something to do with Emma's awful childhood.

If she did, best Big Bad ever. Sounds far more interesting than Zelena.

[retrograde]

Photo of Elizabeth Mitchell on set in an even more elaborate gown than the last.

Edited October 2, 2014 by retrograde

[Souris]

Crazy thought... What if the Snow Queen is Elsa's real mother, which would explain her powers, and blonde hair. Then Emma and Elsa would have another thing to bond over: being given up by their birth mothers!

If this weren't Frozen, maybe. But Disney would never allow that change to the Elsa/Anna relationship.

[kili]

Photo of Elizabeth Mitchell on set in an even more elaborate gown than the last.

 

Is she getting married? Let me guess, Eva stepped on her train ruining the wedding.

 

There are a LOT of white dresses this season (Belle's wedding dress, Anna's wedding dress, random wedding dress in store, Snow Queen's many white dresses). Elizabeth looks fabulous.

[Jean]

I called it, foster mom. Although I probably shouldn't be patting myself on the back for thinking like A&E. Somebody take away my drugs! Or she was looking for another person with magic? I'm just surprised the episode isn't called Cleveland.

If she did, best Big Bad ever. Sounds far more interesting than Zelena.

Hey now, we don't know that she's bad. Maybe baby Emma was like Damien. She's the one from Eva's bloodline.

Also, they're really determined to make Rumple a stupid bastard aren't they? And maybe Charming should've looked up his bestie who saved him from rocker hair and warlord Bo Peep before ripping out his heart.

[kili]

You know #OnceUponATime is doing a flashback scene when you see a TRON poster in the background

 

Henry had a TRON lunch kit. TRON came out in the summer of 1982 - that's before Emma was born. Although, maybe it was a poster for the video game.

 

I wonder if we are ever going to visit the TRON world.

 

BTW I did not know that Adam & Eddie wrote the latest TRON movie.

 

And maybe Charming should've looked up his bestie who saved him from rocker hair and warlord Bo Peep before ripping out his heart.

 

LOL.

Edited October 2, 2014 by kili

[RadioGirl27]

Emma was born in 1983. I wonder if the Snow Queen had something to do with Emma's awful childhood.

I hope not, mainly because it would be a way to take away Regina's and Rumple's responsibility in Emma's crappy life. It would be Adam and Eddy saying "see, it wasn't Regina's fault, it was the Snow Queen".

[FurryFury]

They kinda already did, by never bringing up Regina and Rumple's agency in ruining the lives of the Charmings and even making the latter try to socialize with/protect the former.

Edited October 2, 2014 by FurryFury

[kili]

Daily Mail has some bigger versions of those BTS photos.

 

I wonder if the Snow Queen pops into 80s world and then realizes her outfit doesn't fit in, so she quickly changes it (she goes from having the high collar to having a robe). In the robe picture, she has a white scroll in her hand.

 

Perhaps she's not in our world (assuming it is our world) because of Emma, but because that is also when the curse created Storybrooke.

[Serena]

A link to some videos from Sunday's ep just appeared on the ABC MediaNet page. Of course I can't see them, but as soon as people with ABC press access grabs and uploads them, we should have the rest of the sneak peeks.

[NotBothered]

Perhaps she's not in our world (assuming it is our world) because of Emma, but because that is also when the curse created Storybrooke.

Interesting.  Was tipped off some way? 

 

It seems odd that she would have been after Emma, since we haven't seen or heard anything about her.  If she was after her magic, you would think that she would have made a larger effort to stay in touch or tried to foster it in some way.  The other option that I can think of is that she was threatened by Emma's magic (maybe a rumor reached her about someone powerful who was intended to break the curse) and purposely tried to get Emma to supress it.

 

I do think that she's going to have some relationship to young Emma, especially with the overlap between the promised young Emma flashbacks and the Snow Queen centrics.

[YaddaYadda]

Why would she be after Emma's magic though?  If anything, she might've tried to adopt her, make Emma her daughter.  If the Snow Queen lived outside of Storybrooke, then doesn't that mean she also aged?  I get that the scenes from yesterday were likely flashbacks, but I think it would be fun if they have the Snow Queen (older than Emma) in the foster system with her and that's the reason Emma's magic goes all wonky.

 

I get the feeling this whole thing is going to be wonky as hell. 

[sharky]

Well, you can tell it's the '80s by that dress. Frankly, I think she probably would've fit in perfectly with the "Dynasty" New York types so maybe it's another NYC trip. I do have to wonder about her connection to Emma though. We've seen from other outdoor shots that Elizabeth Mitchell is in Storybrooke with her ice cream shop so if she's from Emma's past, wouldn't Emma recognize her? If she's trying to go under the radar but was still a part of Emma's life, she's got to be from really early in Emma's life. Or perhaps Emma finally making the connection between EM and her early years is what throws her magic off in the first place.

[RadioGirl27]

I get the feeling this whole thing is going to be wonky as hell.

Yeah. Every new bts photo and any new spoiler make more and more wary about this half season. I can't come up with a threory that makes sense.

[YaddaYadda]

Or perhaps Emma finally making the connection between EM and her early years is what throws her magic off in the first place.

 

This is sort of what I've been wondering myself.  I don't know if you remember what was filmed maybe 3-4 weeks ago, Emma crashing her bug and getting out of the car and asking "why are you doing this to me" or something to that effect.  I remember posting if it's not the Snow Queen who managed to mess with Emma's powers.  It makes no sense that she's suddenly out of control like that.

[patchwork]

Because they have to carbon copy the Frozen casts' costumes as best they can it looks like all of Wardrobe's creativity is going into the Snow Queen's outfits. I prefer the first one we saw but I love all the detail in this new outfit.

 

There's a lot of potential in Snow Queen being Emma's step mother, the show is never going to hold Regina and Gold accountable for the suck that was Emma's life so I hope that's where this is going. Who knows it may even lead up to a MM/Emma moment. 

[myril]

This is sort of what I've been wondering myself.  I don't know if you remember what was filmed maybe 3-4 weeks ago, Emma crashing her bug and getting out of the car and asking "why are you doing this to me" or something to that effect.  I remember posting if it's not the Snow Queen who managed to mess with Emma's powers.  It makes no sense that she's suddenly out of control like that.

 

Has Emma so far ever been really in control of her powers? Would say maybe they are more lucky, that Emma's powers mostly seemed to have been rather limited so far and haven't fully unfold yet. Possible that spending more time in a magical surrounding might make Emma's power become stronger. If Emma and Elsa bond over that, they could learn together, how to control their powers. And maybe it's Elsa, who plays a practical joke on Emma with some ice, it gets out of hand and leads to crashing the bug? Guess not, but one can dream.

 

If they make the Snow Queen have some role in Emma's childhood I might throw a vodka party for days, but not with happy thoughts.

[YaddaYadda]

Has Emma so far ever been really in control of her powers?

 

Control is perhaps the wrong word to use in her case.  It's more her being able to use them when she needs.  Magic is innate to her, but it never seems to be an easy endeavour.  The difference so far between Emma and Elsa is that they've shown Elsa losing control the moment her emotions start running high.  I've never seen Frozen, but from 4x01, the main difference between the two is that Emma is actually able to supress her emotions, Elsa, not so much.  They're polar opposites when it comes to the way they feel.

[KingOfHearts]

 

They're polar opposites when it comes to the way they feel.

Polar? Sounds like an ice pun.

 

Emma doesn't know how to use her magic effectively, nor does she know many spells. When she went against the snow monster, there were a million other ways magic could have solved the situation. She knows the basics, but now she needs to know how to control it better so she's able to use it more often.

 

I like the idea of Emma having a connection to something magical from her earlier years... a lot.

Edited October 2, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Rumsy4]

The Snow Queen storyline is starting to look very intetesting. She has overtones of Narnia's White Witch with all the portal-hopping. The White Witch hitches a ride with two kids from her dying realm to our World, where her magic does not work, and then to Narnia. In another book, she basically has the Frozen Heart plot with Edmund Pevensie.

Maybe EM's Snow Queen was able to hitch a ride to our World when the Dark Curse was cast, and she came over through the Door. She needed Emma for some reason. But in the LWM, her powers did not work, and she was setting off Emma's latent magic unintentionally.

So she somehow managed to find Storybrooke and sneak in, and decided to wait until the savior found Storybrooke. She could have killed someone and taken over their Cursed Identity. That would explain why she has an ice-cream shop.

As to why she did nothing until now--who knows. I doubt she came over with the second Curse--none of them had jobs or identities assigned to them. The Merry Men landed in the woods, and Zelena pretended to be looking for a job.

[KingOfHearts]

 

 

She needed Emma for some reason. But in the LWM, her powers did not work, and she was setting off Emma's latent magic unintentionally.

So she somehow managed to find Storybrooke and sneak in, and decided to wait until the savior found Storybrooke. She could have killed someone and taken over their Cursed Identity. That would explain why she has an ice-cream shop.

I'm thinking she knew Emma was the savior, so she kept her under her wings. She probably mistreated her, so Emma ran away. I'm thinking the ice cream shop might have arrived in Curse 2. Since the Snow Queen is mostly likely from Arendelle/EF, she might have gotten swept up with everyone else. That's my guess.

 

New Sneak Peek: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/video-once-a-time-mary-737401

 

Grumpy: "He's a doctor, not an electrician!"

Edited October 2, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[RadioGirl27]

I'm thinking she knew Emma was the savior, so she kept her under her wings. She probably mistreated her, so Emma ran away.

Then she is just as stupid as the rest of "big bads" this show has had. If you need Emma for something (break the curse, not break the curse, give you her magic, etc.), you adopt her, treat her well, raise her as your daugther and prepare her for whatever you need her to do.

Anyway, are we having to consecutive Snow Queen flashbacks? Because episode 7 is about her and it seems episode 8 is about her too. I take anything over another pointless Regina vs. Snow, but this is a bit too much.

New Sneak Peek: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/video-once-a-time-mary-737401

 

Grumpy: "He's a doctor, not an electrician!"

I can't describe that sneak peek without being rude, so I would keep my mouth shut.

[YaddaYadda]

I would have loved the scene even more if Regina and her evilness weren't mentioned because seriously, why?  She's evil because of them?  Thanks, show!

[Joenigma]

 

I would have loved the scene even more if Regina and her evilness weren't mentioned because seriously, why?  She's evil because of them?  Thanks, show!

Yep, if only that line wasn't there in her rant, it would have been a fun scene.

[KingOfHearts]

 

Then she is just as stupid as the rest of "big bads" this show has had. If you need Emma for something (break the curse, not break the curse, give you her magic, etc.), you adopt her, treat her well, raise her as your daugther and prepare her for whatever you need her to do.

It may have been that Emma rubbed her the wrong way, or the Snow Queen was just cruel. I'm picturing a Cinderella/Stepmother type situation.

 

 

Yep, if only that line wasn't there in her rant, it would have been a fun scene.

I know that line was supposed to be funny, but they seriously should have chose someone else besides Regina to mention. Snow's Stockholm Syndrome is still intact, I see. 

Edited October 2, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[YaddaYadda]

I know that line was supposed to be funny, but they seriously should have chose someone else besides Regina to mention.

 

It's everyone's fault that Regina is evil except her own.  She had no control over her action, everyone else did.  They pushed her into it.  I'd be entirely fine if they decided to blame Cora and Rumple for Regina's decent into Crazy Town, but let's leave the peasants out of it.

[Joenigma]

 

I know that line was supposed to be funny, but they seriously should have chose someone else besides Regina to mention.

If you take that line out, it makes Snow sound less insulting and as a viewer more sympathetic.

 

I've never seen Frozen, but from 4x01, the main difference between the two is that Emma is actually able to supress her emotions, Elsa, not so much.  They're polar opposites when it comes to the way they feel.

 

Emma and Elsa are basically two sides of the same coin.

[Rumsy4]

That line from the Sneak Peek made me raging mad. Well, at least it is mutual--even the dwarfs blame Snow and Charmings for the "killings". Literally the door is more to blame than Regina. She is not evil--just misunderstood.

[Artsda]

"Stop saying letters!" LOL

[Jean]

 

I'm thinking she knew Emma was the savior, so she kept her under her wings.

But that was just a trumped up title Rumple gave Emma for his curse. He didn't even know she had magic. My guess is she needs Elsa and Emma's magic for something. Since they already broke the resurrecting the dead and time travel rule, then it's make someone fall in love (with her). That someone is probably hot sugar daddy Rumple.

 

I also don't think she's been hiding out in Storybrooke all during the curse because Emma and co. are already investigating the ice cream shop in Ep. 3.  Something's got to tip them off and we all know it's not brain power.  She meets the Snow Queen in all her glory in Ep. 4. If they knew each other in the past Emma probably forgot or repressed it or it was erased.

 

 

Anyway, are we having to consecutive Snow Queen flashbacks? Because episode 7 is about her and it seems episode 8 is about her too.

They have to wrap up the Frozen arc by 4x09 and the last 2 set up 4B? Georgina is only set for 9 episodes and she's been in every single one so far.

[KingOfHearts]

That line from the Sneak Peek made me raging mad. Well, at least it is mutual--even the dwarfs blame Snow and Charmings for the "killings". Literally the door is more to blame than Regina. She is not evil--just misunderstood.

 

 

That line was so off the wall. And we're just coming off of Regina's Book of Woe comment. There really was no reason to put that line in there, except to fuel the victimization movement.

 

But that was just a trumped up title Rumple gave Emma for his curse. He didn't even know she had magic

 

I'm talking First Curse. She wanted to keep the Savior under her watchful eye until she could break the curse, sort of like August. As for why, she might have needed her for leverage or she counted on her having magic, so she planned to use her. That's my theory. 

 

 

If they knew each other in the past Emma probably forgot or repressed it or it was erased.

Emma might have remembered her, just not as the Snow Queen.

Edited October 2, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[SilverShadow]

I'm willing to cut Mary Margaret some slack. Between the sleep deprivation and the physical stuff new moms are allowed an extra allotment of crazy.

[Crimson Belle]

What is the line? I'm not where I can watch today.

[kili]

Grumpy: "He's a doctor, not an electrician!"

 

Nice Star Trek reference.

 

I too would appreciate a recap of the scene.

 

Well, at least it is mutual--even the dwarfs blame Snow and Charmings for the "killings".

 

They have done that already. In the scene where Ariel first comes to town, the dwarves are chatting about how peaceful things are (and safe for Miatas) when Snow and Charming aren't there. Only Grumpy objects. No mention of the fact that Regina and Rumple are generally all the cause of the mayhem and they are also not there.

 

This show.

Edited October 2, 2014 by kili

[ShadowFacts]

What is the line? I'm not where I can watch today.

Snow is in a basement facility trying to get the town's power back on, Granny and Grumpy and Sleepy? are suggesting Gepetto or Dr. Whale as possible helpers, Snow gets frustrated and has a funny outburst about how she's operating on 8 hours sleep, breastfeeding, and says she is not magic.  The objectionable line is that she says she gets why Regina is evil -- "it was you, you - you survived without electricity forever, go out and get yourself a flashlight!", paraphrasing.

[Rumsy4]

That scene in Ariel was the one I meant.

In the Sneak Peek, Snow freaks out (that part is funny), and yells at them saying maybe Regina was not evil but they were. ETA: Oops, she says she gets why Regina became evil. Yeah Snow--blame it on the peasants. :-p

Edited October 2, 2014 by Rumsy4

[ShadowFacts]

To clarify she says 8 hours sleep in the last week, sorry.

[maryle]

I'm already more interested in the snow queen than all the Frozen stuff together but the last picture with that  Dynastie dress and the real possibility that it somehow connect to Emma trauma is unexpected open the door to so many new stories for Emma .

 

She could be the Foster mother or posing as a social worker to Watch over her growing power.  Maybe it is because of her that Emma as so many walls and problems to open up. That will be a surprising  twist.

She coud already have frozen Emma heart as a child so she will be a lone woman when she need her.

[Crimson Belle]

Thanks for the summary.

[RadioGirl27]

That line is just so infuriating that invalidates a very funny scene.

Anyway, back to the Snow Queen. In this photography from last night she has a scroll in her hand.

 

 

She coud already have frozen Emma heart as a child so she will be a lone woman when she need her.

I actually thought about this before. Maybe Emma is the one with the Frozen heart and she has had it like that since she was a kid. I don't think I like it, but it's a possibility.

[kili]

Thanks for the recap!

 

Granny and Grumpy and Sleepy?

 

Happy was listed in the press release (Michael Coleman as Happy). Could it be him?

 

What is the timeline since Snow gave birth? She gave birth, they defeated Zelena, Rumple killed Zeleena opening the portal and meanwhile the party started. During the party, Elsa arrives and the next day she decides to freeze the town. 36  hours? Snow couldn't have been sleeping well before Snowflake was born.

 

In other news, any chance Robin was one of Bo Peep's henchmen? She can't be a warlord without a few of them and he keeps alluding to some "bad behaviour" in his past.  There has to be some pay-off for that, doesn't there? If he's refering to stealing from Prince John to give to the peasents that were being over-taxed and likening that to killing villages full of peasents, he is a moron.

Edited October 2, 2014 by kili

[FurryFury]

If Robin was a henchman of Bo Peep, of all things, he'll look even more ridiculous than he already does. If it's possible, of course. He's already a joke of a character

[KingOfHearts]

 

Happy was listed in the press release (Michael Coleman as Happy). Could it be him?

Yes, it's Happy.

[Shanna Marie]

If Robin was a henchman of Bo Peep, of all things, he'll look even more ridiculous than he already does.

You know, I kind of want this to be true, just so I can be even more catty about him without even feeling the least bit bad about it. Just thinking "Bo Peep's henchman" makes me grin.

 

And I'm holding off buying the final accessories for my lady pirate Halloween costume until I see what warlord Bo Beep looks like, because that right there has awesome potential all over it. I'm currently really regretting the fact that I donated that late 80s Gunny Sax dress to charity years ago because it would have been the perfect foundation for an Evil Bo Peep outfit. See, you should never get rid of your old clothes, even when they're out of style and bring back bad memories because you wore them to your horrible college boyfriend's horrible brother's horrible wedding that somehow made your boyfriend's mother decide she hated you enough to spend the rest of the summer persuading him to break up with you (I think I committed the horrible crime of actually being civil to the boyfriend's father's current wife). Ahem, anyway, I'm in love with the very concept of warlord Bo Peep.

[FurryFury]

I'm a bit upset I can't appreciate the true hilarity of Bo Peep as a warlord, it's just not the same when you never heard about her before. Still, at least I'll have Charming's flashback hair. I think it already was compared to the hair of your classic, run-of-the-mill heavy metal band - because that was the first thing that popped up in my mind after seeing it.

[Serena]

Michael Coleman is still on the show? LOL, I know some people who won't be happy about that.