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Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

regularlyleaded

By regularlyleaded
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“Lady Tremaine doesn’t like Cinderella very much and she’s got an agenda," Horowitz says. "But there is something broiling beneath that’s personal and painful that is driving all of this."

It didn't take them long to confirm that Lady Tremaine will have a sob story.  And Drizella seems like a Regina with her oh-so-demanding mother. 

It looks like Rumple will get segregated as usual, this time with Alice in Wonderland.  Given the description of the character, I really don't see why it had to be Alice and not someone they hadn't written an entire series about already.

Adult Henry sounds like a total loser.

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When everyone realized Rumple and Regina weren't coming back, they had a big celebration and put on a cloaking spell so they can never be found or contacted ever again.

Curio
Curio

At least someone is freaking out over Emma's darkness. Keep giving a shit, Hook! You're pretty much the only one who does...

Serena
Serena

HER GRANDMA IS EMMA! Are they being serious with this?

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Her cursed Hyperion Heights counterpart, meanwhile, is named Jacinda. "We see a single mother who is struggling to keep her family together, keep her life together and keep her head up against many obstacles. So she's finding herself once again being Cinderella to the world where she feels like she is constantly cleaning up her mess, but yet she can never get ahead."

So Lucy is living with her mother?  When did Lucy's own memories "awaken"?  

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Cinderella's step-sister is "deliciously evil," says Kitsis.   "She takes a lot of abuse from her mom," Kitsis says, "but I wonder how long that will last." Horowitz adds: "There's a lot going on inside of Drizella, and she earned the evil moniker."

Eddy "wonders".  Basically, that means he wants us to wonder.  Except we don't care.  We'll be the judge if she's "deliciously" evil or just another despicable self-centered entitled villain.  They probably thought The Black Fairy was deliciously evil too.

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Another new iteration of a familiar face, Alice from Wonderland fame "is a character in the vein of Rumplestiltskin in that you don’t really quite know what she’s up to, where she’s going or where she’s been," Kitsis says 

So wildcard that the Writers can do anything with the character and decide later why the hell she's even on the show.

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 In Seattle, Tiana's counterpart Sabine will play a vital role. "Her relationship with Cinderella is like Snow and Red's," Kitsis says. "They're roommates, they're good friends."

They're like Snow and Red, eh?  Are they implying the show even cared about that friendship beyond Season 1?   If we add up Snow and Red's conversations from Season 2 onwards, would they last 10 minutes?

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"Lucy, right now, has to bear the burden of the truest believer because her father no longer does," Kitsis says. "It is up to her to get people to remain hopeful. You’ll see a lot of Henry in her, and I think you’ll see a lot of her grandma, Snow, in her."

If that means they're going to write her like Henry post-Season 1, then no thanks.

Edited by Camera One
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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

(edited)

I wonder if the fact that they keep putting New!Cinders in dresses that make her boobs pop out awkwardly has any significance. I bet she was a "brat" in her childhood just like Snow. That's the worst of all evils, you know...

Edited by Rumsy4
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cappoe

cappoe

1 hour ago, Rumsy4 said:

I wonder if the fact that they keep putting New!Cinders in dresses that make her boobs pop out awkwardly has any significance. I bet she was a "brat" in her childhood just like Snow. That's the worst of all evils, you know...

Unfortunately doing that still doesn't hide the fact that next to Henry this woman looks like she could be his mother over his lover.

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Serena

Serena

51 minutes ago, cappoe said:

Unfortunately doing that still doesn't hide the fact that next to Henry this woman looks like she could be his mother over his lover.

Yeah, they look mismatched in age. Henry looks 20, she looks like she's pushing 40. Now, I would be all for it if it turned out she's supposed to be older in the story, but I'm guessing not. 

It's also really awkward regarding her clothing because the way they're pushing her breasts looks SO purposeful. Like sometimes a woman's breasts are on the bigger side so when wearing a low cut dress, they're obviously gonna be noticeable. But this actress has small-ish breasts and they're pushing them SO HARD, you can see how much they want you to notice them. It's skeevy.

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CCTC

CCTC

13 minutes ago, Serena said:

It's skeevy.

I remember reading an interview with Elizabeth Mitchell when she was playing the Snow Queen.  There was a question about the costume and she relayed something the designer said about cleavage.  She just laughed - but I remember thinking it was a little creepy at times.   Not that she needed to be wearing turtle necks, but when an actress is giving a good performance (I thought Mitchell did a good job) you don't want people completely distracted by the costume.

Dania is an attractive woman, but she is almost 40.  If they try to make her look younger and have her dress and act like an ingenue she is going to look older than she is (think of young Regina in love with Daniel).  They were lucky that Dallas and Goodwin clicked (and also looked good in both Enchanted Forest and Storybook attire).  I am not sure lightening is going to strike twice.

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(edited)
29 minutes ago, CCTC said:

They were lucky that Dallas and Goodwin clicked (and also looked good in both Enchanted Forest and Storybook attire).  I am not sure lightening is going to strike twice.

They were super lucky in that every original cast member clicked right from the first episode: Emma, Snow, Charming, Henry (he was great as the precocious kid in S1), Regina, Rumple.  This season, they have just as many newbies.  The question of whether lightning can strike twice, six times over, is a very legitimate concern.  From the Season 6 finale and the sneak peek, I'm lukewarm on both Lucy and Adult Henry.

So maybe Alice in Wonderland is the one who gave Lady Tremaine the Curse, so Alice can use it to come back to the World Without Magic?  

Edited by Camera One
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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

(edited)

Cinders definitely looks very mismatched with Henry. In fact, Lana looks younger than her in that picture with Cinderella, Adult Henry, and Regina; Cinderella just looks tired. The boob-emphasis makes it even more awkward. 

I actually thought the promo poster with Cinders riding the bike was pretty good considering their usual standard. The writers seem to be pushing Cinderella as a mixup of Snow and Emma. Oh sorry--Emma doesn't exist anymore. Will she hit Henry on the head with a rock, and ride off to the ball on his bike?

Edited by Rumsy4
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Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

The thing with the boobage in Cinderella's dress is that it's not at all flattering cleavage in a sexy way. It just looks like the dress was made for someone else, and they're shoving her into it. It looks like bad tailoring rather than design for sex appeal.

And what do you bet she's wearing very modern platform stilettos under that dress?

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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

The awkward costuming could have something to do with the fact that Eduardo Castro is no longer the main costume designer for the Show (a part of the cost-cutting measures, perhaps). Although apparently he's still a consultant. Eduardo was hit or miss with the modern day stuff, but he usually did a good job on the EF costumes (though he tended to get a little too outre with the EQ's outfits at times). 

2 hours ago, CCTC said:

I remember reading an interview with Elizabeth Mitchell when she was playing the Snow Queen.  There was a question about the costume and she relayed something the designer said about cleavage.  She just laughed - but I remember thinking it was a little creepy at times.  

I too remember her saying she felt awkward and exposed until she started acting, and then she would get into the role and forget everything else.

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Serena

Serena

12 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

Cinders definitely looks very mismatched with Henry. In fact, Lana looks younger than her in that picture with Cinderella, Adult Henry, and Regina; Cinderella just looks tired. The boob-emphasis makes it even more awkward. 

It's gonna be so awkward when Henry has more chemistry with Regina than Cinders, just you wait.

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Noneofyourbusiness

Noneofyourbusiness

On 9/14/2017 at 10:16 PM, Camera One said:

The Black Fairy with her "sad" mother-looking-out-for-her-son backstory.   

Ah yes. The one that didn't give her any motivation to want to "snuff out the light".

On 9/15/2017 at 0:27 PM, Serena said:

HER GRANDMA IS EMMA! Are they being serious with this?

Saying "great-grandma" is just too hard.

That reminds me, this show is such a tangled (no pun) and long-rambling family drama that we've seen Lucy's great-great-grandparents on it (Queen Eva, King Leopold, the miller, King Xavier, Malcom/Peter Pan, Fiona/the Black Fairy).

On 9/16/2017 at 1:26 PM, Serena said:

Yeah, they look mismatched in age. Henry looks 20, she looks like she's pushing 40. Now, I would be all for it if it turned out she's supposed to be older in the story, but I'm guessing not.

Andrew J. West is 33 and Dania Ramirez is 37.

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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

I do think it's great that they've cast an older actress for the past, but the match between her and adult Henry (who really does look like he's in his 20s) is not looking good as of now.

11 hours ago, Serena said:

It's gonna be so awkward when Henry has more chemistry with Regina than Cinders, just you wait.

That's what I'm thinking too. OUAT's obsession with keeping all their charatcers the same age is not a good one. I think Emma, Hook, Regina, and Rumple should've been aged up. 

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(edited)

It's consistent with their strategy of telling the same stories over and over again.  There will no doubt be "callbacks" to the Pilot in the season premiere.  Adult Henry will take Lucy back to Lady Tremaine's house, where Lucy and her mother live.  There, Henry meets the cold Lady Tremaine and feels bad for Lucy and falls a bit for Lucy's harried mother.  After a hard day of Uber driving, Henry will relax in a bar where he meets Roni, who he is able to open up to about his failure of a book (which has caused him to put up WALLS and withdraw from society), and she encourages him to look out for Lucy.  Henry realizes Lucy has left her copy of Henry's zero selling book in the back seat.  The next morning, Henry decides to accept the call for a Uber driver to take Lucy to school and Jacinda and Tiana to work.  The hand in the clock in Lucy's room starts to move.

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Kktjones

Kktjones

1 hour ago, Camera One said:

It's consistent with their strategy of telling the same stories over and over again.  There will no doubt be "callbacks" to the Pilot in the season premiere.  Adult Henry will take Lucy back to Lady Tremaine's house, where Lucy and her mother live.  There, Henry meets the cold Lady Tremaine and feels bad for Lucy and falls a bit for Lucy's harried mother.  After a hard day of Uber driving, Henry will relax in a bar where he meets Roni, who he is able to open up to about his failure of a book (which has caused him to put up WALLS and withdraw from society), and she encourages him to look out for Lucy.  Henry realizes Lucy has left her copy of Henry's zero selling book in the back seat.  The next morning, Henry decides to accept the call for a Uber driver to take Lucy to school and Jacinda and Tiana to work.  The hand in the clock in Lucy's room starts to move.

I think we need to bookmark this post so we can revisit it after the premiere and count up how many details you were able to accurately predict :).

I wonder about Lucy and how much she knows. She knows Henry is her father and in the finale was saying something about his family needing help, but I wonder who she's talking about. That is, does she know Roni is Henry's mother and Rogers is his step-father? Does she know all about Storybrook and will she be trying to get them to remember Emma, Snow, etc. or will she just know the people that were in the EF2 before the curse. Ok, that just surpassed the amount that I actually care about Lucy, so I'll stop now. 

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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

1 hour ago, Kktjones said:

Ok, that just surpassed the amount that I actually care about Lucy, so I'll stop now. 

Lolol. Same. We just can't help speculating on this board, even after we've stopped caring. 

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MadyGirl1987

MadyGirl1987

5 hours ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Saying "great-grandma" is just too hard.

That reminds me, this show is such a tangled (no pun) and long-rambling family drama that we've seen Lucy's great-great-grandparents on it (Queen Eva, King Leopold, the miller, King Xavier, Malcom/Peter Pan, Fiona/the Black Fairy).

Wow... I never thought of that... I guess with all wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff going on(people frozen in time/immortal/in Neverland not aging) you lose track of how many generations are shown.

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jhlipton

jhlipton

5 hours ago, MadyGirl1987 said:

Wow... I never thought of that... I guess with all wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff going on(people frozen in time/immortal/in Neverland not aging) you lose track of how many generations are shown.

I started to put together a family tree, but realized quickly how little I care.

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Noneofyourbusiness

Noneofyourbusiness

15 hours ago, MadyGirl1987 said:

Wow... I never thought of that... I guess with all wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff going on(people frozen in time/immortal/in Neverland not aging) you lose track of how many generations are shown.

 

10 hours ago, jhlipton said:

I started to put together a family tree, but realized quickly how little I care.

It's been done: http://onceuponatime.wikia.com/wiki/Lucy#Family

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Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

11 hours ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

It's been done: http://onceuponatime.wikia.com/wiki/Lucy#Family

That one's missing some of the complexity, like the marriage between Regina and Leo that makes Regina Henry's step-great-grandmother in addition to being his adoptive mother, which makes her both Lucy's grandmother and step-great-great grandmother or the connection between Hook and Milah that makes Hook both Henry's step-grandfather and his stepfather, so he's both Lucy's step-grandfather and step-great-grandfather.

I once tried to draw a family tree, just for fun, before Lucy came into the mix, and it just looked like a bowl of spaghetti.

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Camera One

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(edited)

No one is raving over the new stills from the new season?  Why does Adult Henry's hair look so weird in the Enchanted Forest.  It's much better in current-day.  Alice in Wonderland is going to be kooky.  I wonder if she's going to be as important and intriguing as The Oracle.  Lady Tremaine looks unnaturally tanned or maybe it was just bad lighting.

Edited by Camera One
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Anakerie

Anakerie

I want some Lion King characters, damn it. They don't have to actually be lions. But I want Scar running around. Of course, they'd probably give him a tragic backstory too that totally explains why he murdered his brother and tried to murder a child...when they were cubs Mufasa stole his Slinky.  Why can't Regin-and-tonica serve him drinks while he recites his sad tale?

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KingOfHearts

KingOfHearts

(edited)

Took a peak at some of the promo pictures. Alice looks like a creepy stray cat wandering the streets. It's distracting that Drizella looks so much like she could be Regina's daughter. I do like how drastically different Lady Tremaine appears in her HH persona. 

Why does the castle in Alternate Forest look exactly like the one in the Enchanted Forest?

Yet... I really don't care about any of these new characters, or adult Henry for that matter. I'd rather have versions we've already seen on the show any day of the week.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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Souris

Souris

Bex returning for multiple eps.

So they didn't want her before but now they do. Gee, it's almost like they realized there was no buzz on the newbies, fans needed a reason to tune in or the new stories aren't working as well as they'd hoped. Shocking.

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KingOfHearts

KingOfHearts

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Bex returning for multiple eps.

Praise the Lord.

Quote

So they didn't want her before but now they do. Gee, it's almost like they realized there was no buzz on the newbies, fans needed a reason to tune in or the new stories aren't working as well as they'd hoped. Shocking.

These writers enjoy dumping characters only to bring them back, don't they? 

Edited by KingOfHearts
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Camera One

Camera One

6 hours ago, Souris said:

Bex returning for multiple eps.

Frankly, I was surprised she wasn't brought back to start with.  This makes it official... only the ex-villains are back for multiple episodes.

It does seem like they're running out of ideas.  Bringing tidings of gloom and doom in Storybrooke, maybe?  Plus now they can fill a few episodes with "What happened to her since last time?"  

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KingOfHearts

KingOfHearts

(edited)
1 hour ago, TheGreenKnight said:

The Rebecca Mader news is the only thing I've heard about the new season that's made me excited. Well, her and Tiana, I guess.

Can Zelena be Mama Odie? Well... if she gets her magic back, that is.

It'll be interesting to see teenage Pistachio.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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Free

Free

3 hours ago, Camera One said:

Frankly, I was surprised she wasn't brought back to start with.  This makes it official... only the ex-villains are back for multiple episodes.

It does seem like they're running out of ideas.  Bringing tidings of gloom and doom in Storybrooke, maybe?  Plus now they can fill a few episodes with "What happened to her since last time?"  

They've been running on empty for a while.

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Colette

Colette

On 19/9/2017 at 4:45 AM, Shanna Marie said:

That one's missing some of the complexity, like the marriage between Regina and Leo that makes Regina Henry's step-great-grandmother in addition to being his adoptive mother, which makes her both Lucy's grandmother and step-great-great grandmother or the connection between Hook and Milah that makes Hook both Henry's step-grandfather and his stepfather, so he's both Lucy's step-grandfather and step-great-grandfather.

I once tried to draw a family tree, just for fun, before Lucy came into the mix, and it just looked like a bowl of spaghetti.

Snow is both Henry's grandmother and his step-sister and Emma is both his biological mother and his niece.

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Camera One

Camera One

After the Zelena announcement, a bunch of people tweeted Adam asking why Emma isn't back but Zelena is, etc.  He replied to them but it's all deleted now.  

I wonder if Zelena will have an alternate identity in Hyperion Heights.  Surprise!  She was there all along. 

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Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

Or maybe Zelena has a history with one of the new characters, and we'll be seeing her mostly in flashbacks. You know, she was almost as jealous of Lady Tremaine as she was of Regina, or something like that.

We'll build to the season finale in which Lady Tremaine is planning on attacking Storybrooke and must be stopped. After all, even in this new configuration, all villains will still have taking over a small town in Maine as their primary life goal.

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Free

Free

12 hours ago, PixiePaws1 said:

..and the tragedy is they didn't have to be...!! 

Exactly, they squandered the premise and pretty much burned through most of their characters early on.

10 hours ago, Camera One said:

After the Zelena announcement, a bunch of people tweeted Adam asking why Emma isn't back but Zelena is, etc.  He replied to them but it's all deleted now.  

I wonder if Zelena will have an alternate identity in Hyperion Heights.  Surprise!  She was there all along. 

It seems kinda obvious Jen herself doesn't want to come back at this point.

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ParadoxLost

ParadoxLost

On ‎9‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 8:02 PM, Camera One said:

Frankly, I was surprised she wasn't brought back to start with.  This makes it official... only the ex-villains are back for multiple episodes.

It does seem like they're running out of ideas.  Bringing tidings of gloom and doom in Storybrooke, maybe?  Plus now they can fill a few episodes with "What happened to her since last time?"  

I'll be surprised if Zelena is in Hyperion Heights.

I think this falls into the category of they realized that they don't have an excuse to flashback to Regina's past without Snow.  So Mader is there for a protracted flashback to what happened in Storybrooke between s6 and S7.

Also another attempt to have the season 1-6 audience to not bail.  I wonder if this was the plan all along and they wanted some "good news" to announce near the premiere.

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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

2 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

I wonder if this was the plan all along

Nope. No way. They probably ran out of ideas for the new charatcers and decided to bring back some old ones for inspiration.

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