Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Souris]

Here's a set video of the Elsa/Anna reunion. (Scroll down the page.)

 

It looks to me like Elsa & Emma somehow use Anna's snowflake necklace to call Anna & Kristoff forth. JMo seems to be holding a necklace in a lot of the scene.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Souris

[RadioGirl27]

It's incredible that the video is still up, because it's very spoilery. I suppose we will see tonight how Anna and Kristoff ended up in the chest and where it was all this time. That's the only thing I'm interested right now.

 

The girls in tumblr are so sweet (well, that's not exactly the word I was thinking while reading their posts, but I'm an educated lady). They still think tonights episode is going to be great and it's going to have a "beautiful" development for Hook and Emma. But, hey, maybe I'm wrong and they are right (but I doubt it).

[daxx]

I am keeping my expectations low for Hook and Emma tonight.  I plan on having a bit of rum to make it through the other expected scenes tonight.

[sharky]

RadioGirl -- I think the phrase you're looking for is "Bless their hearts." It's a southern phrase that essentially means, "Oh, you poor naive soul." I don't know though. I am hoping for some good Captain Swan in this one based on the writers involved -- they've done some awesome Hook/Captain Swan episodes. Plus, it's two hours long. We have to get at least a little something with them after last week.

 

But I also have hope for them because OQ sounds like it's going to be hot mess tonight so I need something to look forward to.

Edited November 16, 2014 by sharky

[Rumsy4]

I am cautiously optimistic about tonight's episode (leaving out the OQ bits). I've given up on expecting any logic or continuity to the plots, so at least  won't be disappointed there! haha

[YaddaYadda]

JMo did tweet about the show which she has sort of abstained from doing here and there.  I realize that show goes down a lot better when there are no expectations.  But hey, if the show takes a bad turn, my Habs are playing Detroit, so there's always that!

[KAOS Agent]

See as much as Outlaw Queen makes me want to hurl, the hot mess that is their relationship has got to provide some entertainment. I mean, the crypt sex alone while the wife is on ice is just so messed up that I want to know just how far this show will go with the insanity. I'm ready to embrace the madness. Alcohol helps.

Edited November 17, 2014 by KAOS Agent

[Rumsy4]

Alcohol would leave me with an unacceptable hangover for Monday morning (my alcohol tolerance is really low), but I have Strawberry Cream-cheese pie! heh 

[KingOfHearts]

 

I am cautiously optimistic about tonight's episode (leaving out the OQ bits). I've given up on expecting any logic or continuity to the plots, so at least  won't be disappointed there! haha

 

I have a feeling this episode is either going to make or break 4A. It's the beginning of the climax, and it has the responsibility of kicking things up another level. The story has slowed down quite a bit, so hopefully two hours will be enough to wake it up.

 

About Emma losing her magic, part of me wants it to happen because lasting consequences are so rare on this show. A lot of people will disagree with me on this, mostly Emma fans, but I'd like her to get a new angle as opposed to clinging to the "Savior" title. It could help the Charming family if they're forced to learn more about her as a person rather than depend on her magic all the time. Anything to take away the writers' crutch.

Edited November 17, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[ParadoxLost]

See as much as Outlaw Queen makes me want to hurl, the hot mess that is their relationship has got to provide some entertainment. I mean, the crypt sex alone while the wife is on ice is just so messed up that I want to know just how far this show will go with the insanity. I'm ready to embrace the madness. Alcohol helps.

 

So this is happening? Good job show, stealing stuff from General Hospital is the hallmark of good storytelling. 

 

 

About Emma losing her magic, part of me wants it to happen because lasting consequences are so rare on this show. A lot of people will disagree with me on this, mostly Emma fans, but I'd like her to get a new angle as opposed to clinging to the "Savior" title. It could help the Charming family if they're forced to learn more about her as a person rather than depend on her magic all the time. Anything to take away the writers' crutch.

 

The "savior" is basically a moot point because its always Regina's magic that saves the day lately.  It doesn't really matter if Emma has her magic or not.

Edited November 17, 2014 by ParadoxLost

[sharky]

JMo did tweet about the show which she has sort of abstained from doing here and there.  I realize that show goes down a lot better when there are no expectations.  But hey, if the show takes a bad turn, my Habs are playing Detroit, so there's always that!

Your Habs are playing my Wings tonight? I think I know what can easily distract me from the OQ nonsense. Go Wings! [and PS -- I just started working on a Captain Swan hockey AU fanfic. You're welcome. ;)]

 

Currently on my first glass of wine with more in the fridge so I have that going for me.

Edited November 17, 2014 by sharky

[Emma]

Sipping my first (of many I'm sure) Bloody Mary. And we're off.

[InsertWordHere]

So Hook won't be affected by the shattered sight spell and this will out him as a "villain," right?

[YaddaYadda]

Maybe he's not affected by it because he doesn't have his heart which is a really bright red.  I was expecting something more battered than that.

[Leather Jacket]

i'm afraid that everyone will just assume Hook is being off because he has the shattered sight and then we're heading into 4B without them realizing he's missing a heart

[Serena]

Did they say that only good people are affected by the shattered sight spell, though? If they did I missed it. Because I thought everyone would be affected.

[InsertWordHere]

I don't think they said. I just assume heartless people won't be affected.

[Serena]

I mean, it could go either way. It seems you can do everything and nothing without a heart (you can't feel! but you can have TLK!). Either the writers will use as an excuse to have Hook not be affected because they don't want to have him be mean to Emma, or they will say it does affect him anyway because they think Hook being mean to Emma is "delicious drama" or whatever. It could be entertaining either way. I guess a straight man going "are you all very stoned?" when people start sniping at each other could be needed.

[YaddaYadda]

Even if he's mean to her, it's all part of the curse, so it's not like they can scream at him for that.  I'd like to see David and Mary Margaret go at it in a very passive-aggressive way, you know.  Like a real couple that's not all sunshine and freakin' unicorns.

[Artsda]

Promo for next episode.

 

[HoodlumSheep]

I'm wondering about the whole shattered sight/heartless situation too. Also, I'm hoping Belle finds Emma's phone and listens to the messages. I wonder if this'll be how she finds out.

[sharky]

Someone just reassure me that Robert said something like the shit is going to hit the fan for Gold in a few more episodes. I just can't take thus CS angst longer than that. I mean seriously! Why can't they just be happy? Why does OQ get to have graveyard sex before Hook and Emma have some coffee? You stupid loveable show.

[Mari]

I'm wondering about the whole shattered sight/heartless situation too. Also, I'm hoping Belle finds Emma's phone and listens to the messages. I wonder if this'll be how she finds out.

But would she believe it?

 

So far, Belle's more likely to believe that Hook is manipulating or lying to Emma than to believe Rumple would dupe her.

[pezgirl7]

Rumple took Emma's phone, so I'm sure he'll erase Hook's message. I suppose he could destroy the phone, and then if Emma gets a replacement, the old messages could be on it. But that would just be careless on Rumple's part.

I hope Rumple gets his comeuppance. Tying Hook up and tormenting him about Milah was so cruel. Rumple isn't anywhere close to being redeemed.

[Serena]

Yes, Robert totally said shit hits the fan in 9 and 10 for Rumple. So I'm guessing that's when they are made aware of the heart situation and (I'm hoping) Emma absolutely loses her shit at Rumple.

[YaddaYadda]

If they're made aware of the heart situation, I hope they keep it on the D-L because Rumple will not hesitate to do away with Hook especially if he is backed into a corner.  Honestly, I know a lot of people are hoping that Emma finds out, but I think Belle will just be the biggest part.  If she was around and hears the message, then she knows Hook is not trying to con Emma because he knows about the hat and he has no way of knowing about it unless he's seen it.

 

I think the whole Belle wants to be a hero thing...Hook has wronged her in the past, so as a character who wants to be a hero, she would come full circle on that one by basically working with the heroes and not protecting her asshole husband anymore.

 

And really, she might finally become aware that Rumple really did crush Milah's heart in front of Hook.

Edited November 17, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[KingOfHearts]

 

Rumple took Emma's phone, so I'm sure he'll erase Hook's message. I suppose he could destroy the phone, and then if Emma gets a replacement, the old messages could be on it. But that would just be careless on Rumple's part.

 

This is Once Upon a Time though... Rumple hasn't been passed the idiot ball yet this season. I could see something like that happening on this show.

[Jean]

 

Robert totally said shit hits the fan in 9 and 10 for Rumple

I'm pretty sure what Robert said was he ups the evil a couple of notches in ep. 9 and 10.

 

Next episode is when Elsa/Anna reunite, you'd think they would have advertised that instead of the focus on the mirror spell, even if it is too spoilery.

[InsertWordHere]

I noticed that too. Methinks Snow gets locked up for her own safety, or more likely, the safety of others.

[Bluerang1]

Ohh excited to see Anna (and Kristoff, I orginaly thought that she was the only one in the chest), in Storybrooke. Regarding the promo not showing any of this, I think they might save it until next week and air it during whatever is keeping Once away from us.

[pezgirl7]

My theory is that Arendelle defreezes, melting all the ice, which causes a major flood. Anna and Kristoff climb into the chest so they don't drown, but then I have no idea how they end up in our world.

[Joanh23]

Yes I'm guessing Snow and co are locked up for their own safety, although if the shattered glass spell turns everyone against each other, then locking them into cells  may not be the best solution!   Emma and Snow both look like they're crying in that scene so I'm hoping we'll be getting something good with them.

[shipperx]

I mean, it could go either way. It seems you can do everything and nothing without a heart (you can't feel! but you can have TLK!). Either the writers will use as an excuse to have Hook not be affected because they don't want to have him be mean to Emma, or they will say it does affect him anyway because they think Hook being mean to Emma is "delicious drama" or whatever. It could be entertaining either way. I guess a straight man going "are you all very stoned?" when people start sniping at each other could be needed.

My impression Re: heartless is that it depends on who has your heart. If someone has your heart they can hijack you because they can control you. If you don't have your heart but it's in safe keeping ala when Will hid his away but Cora did not possess it or when Regina hid hers, then you aren't controlled but are distanced from emotion. It's my fanwank anyway. The problem for hook is that Rumps has it and intends to use it and now Hook doesn't have the free will to resist Rumps commands.

Edited November 17, 2014 by shipperx

[Joanh23]

I would think that Rumple wouldn't want Emma to suspect anything is wrong with Hook just yet so he'd be telling Hook to act normal around Emma - if/when the Snow Queen is sucked into the hat and Rumple has all the power he needs he'll be feeling pretty invincible and so he won't care if Emma know's by then or not.

 

I can see 4x11 ending in Rumple casting his spell to break the hold of the dagger - Emma and Belle will arrive and try to persuade him not to crush Hooks heart.  I'd love it to end with Rumple deciding to go ahead and complete the spell anyway, but there's no way they'll kill Hook so somehow Emma saves Hook, but Rumple and Belle end 4x11 split up.

[YaddaYadda]

Didn't Regina do some spell to protect her heart from Zelena or something last season?  I'm sure they can come up with someone when he tries to crush his heart and it doesn't work.  Then they can just go "Acio Hook's heart."

 

I know wrong show.

Edited November 17, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[Mari]

I can see 4x11 ending in Rumple casting his spell to break the hold of the dagger - Emma and Belle will arrive and try to persuade him not to crush Hooks heart. I'd love it to end with Rumple deciding to go ahead and complete the spell anyway, but there's no way they'll kill Hook so somehow Emma saves Hook, but Rumple and Belle end 4x11 split up.

That makes sense, but--and I'm not just being antiBelle here--what do they do with Belle if she actually separates from Rumple for a significant amount of time? They've not really developed any other relationships for her at all, and the theme of the season is apparently "Don't give up on the people you love."

[YaddaYadda]

She can be Baby Do-Over's official sitter while she waits to have Baby Baelfire Do-Over?  Or Rumple accidentally hurts her, kills her, can only bring her back with TLK but won't do it because he'll lose his powers and he'll always chose those over everyone.

[shipperx]

If they're going to do a real major death (as opposed to a fake out one). It would need to be Belle or Rumps. Either Rumps is just full on villain and thus eventually gets taken out or he's thrown for six by losing Belle. In which case she doesn't serve much purpose on the show -- unless she carries a baby Bael-over for Rumps to obsess over -- so they should mine the angst by killing her. Then Rumps would go hard core villain. (Which he more or less is right now).

Edited November 17, 2014 by shipperx

[scenicbyway]

I haven't had a chance to see the episode yet (husband's birthday was yesterday and he's not a Once fan) obviously, taking Hook's heart is going to backfire in some way for Rumple.  I can't help but wonder if Hook will actually end up Frozen, perhaps he take a hit from DQ for Emma, but of course he doesn't die because Rumple's removed his heart (just like Marian).  I also wonder if they'd go the route of splitting Emma's heart to save Hook, in case Rumple really does use it for the spell.  I really think we'd have to have a TLK between Hook and Emma before that could happen, but they do tend to mirror Charming and Snow quite a bit.

 

As for the shattered site spell.  Why didn't DQ just ribbon Elsa and Emma from the beginning to channel their magic?   She's had the mirror ready for a few episodes and she seemed to be trying to get Emma to lose control.  If control was what was needed, why not focus on that?

[Joanh23]

Belle is my least favorite character as it is, so if Belle doesn't dump Rumple's ass when she finds out the truth then whatever bit of sympathy I have for her will be gone!

[sharky]

Belle is my least favorite character as it is, so if Belle doesn't dump Rumple's ass when she finds out the truth then whatever bit of sympathy I have for her will be gone!

She could get interested if she breaks bad and goes villainous for Gold. I wouldn't mind seeing that.

Didn't Regina do some spell to protect her heart from Zelena or something last season? I'm sure they can come up with someone when he tries to crush his heart and it doesn't work. Then they can just go "Acio Hook's heart."

I know wrong show.

Regina didn't take her heart to a witch fight, giving it to Robin instead. You may thinking of when she put Henrys heart back in and cast a spell to protect it after that stupid child gave it to Pan.

But if they somehow get Hook's heart back, they're going to need a protection spell now that we know Gold wants it.

Edited November 17, 2014 by sharky

[retrograde]

Rumple surely has an interest in either keeping Hook from being affected by the mirror thing or keeping away from him if either of them are. I imagine both will immediately try to kill the other if affected, and whether it's Hook or Rumple who is affected, that's gonna result in Hook getting real dead real fast. Runple seems to want him alive for now, so he should keep them both clear of the spell.

[kili]

Does the spell have to destroy the heart to work? Zelena's spell was successfully cast and appears to have had absolutely no lasting harm on Snowflake or Regina's heart which were actually used in the casting (at least Charming's courage and Rumple's brains were just totems).

 

I imagine Hook's heart requries some crushing though for this one to work. Rumple looked too happy about it when the Snow Queen revealed the secret. I bet the Sorcerer really thought he had things covered when he put all those conditions on his hat. I wonder how many Dark Ones got to the point of being able to use the hat and there was anybody left who knew them before. Of course, the hat is being pretty generous with the "knew him before" definition since Killian had one short conversation with Rumple before he became the Dark One.

[Emma]

http://www.spoilertv.com/2014/11/once-upon-time-episode-408-smash-mirror_17.html?m=1

At work so I can't watch. Deleted scene with Elsa and Snow.

[Writing Wrongs]

They should've kept this scene in and took OQ crypt scene out.

[YaddaYadda]

Am I the only one who doesn't think Hook's heart will get crushed?  It almost seems like one of those things where they pulled his heart out to show him that should stop considering himself a villain and think so very little of himself.  And that goes for everyone who doubts him (Snowing, I'm sort of side eying you on this even if you made some progress).  I'm just assuming everyone thinks he has a dark heart and they just need to see for themselves.

[Rumsy4]

Please not the heart!splitting thing again! I thought it was ridiculously contrived with Snowing. It would make even less sense with Hook and Emma. They're not there yet (and hopefully never will be). I think we won't see much of Hook with the main group for the next two episodes. He was only seen filming with Rumple at one point, right? Let's hope at least Emma notices that it's odd for him to stay away so long. 

 

In the promo, Grumpy is running with everyone by the Town Line. That a huge sign that THINGS ARE GOING DOWN. lol So the slowest spell ever will take all of next episode to reach all Storybrooke, right? Shattered Sight isn't until 4.10.

Edited November 17, 2014 by Rumsy4

[kili]

Am I the only one who doesn't think Hook's heart will get crushed?

 

I don't think it is getting crushed either. I also don't buy the theory that Hook and Emma will share a heart. They aren't that far along in their relationship that it would ever work. Charming and Snow were in a much different place.

 

I think that Hook is going to sacrifice himself to save the town. Maybe he tosses himself in front of the hat. Maybe he gets frozen. Maybe he gets shredded in a wood-chipper (I think Rumple would enjoy something old-school like that to Hook - there was some serious malice on display there). But, he's going to get killed. But...and this is where Hook gets his delicious payback at Rumple...him not having a heart somehow saves him. Some kind of Harry Potter-like technicality means that his heart tethers him to life. So, ultimately, he dies, but he's not permanently dead. Rumple will not be pleased that he saved Hook's life.

 

I was convinced he was going to be frozen like Hans Solo, but then the Snow Queen froze Anna and Kristoff. We know they aren't dead (they show up in Storybrooke) and nobody removed their hearts, so being turned into a block of ice does not kill you.  Which, is weird, because it means that Regina didn't need to remove Marian's either. IDK Maybe Elsa's act of True Love (allowing herself to be urned) protected the entire kingdom and that is why they didn't die when frozen, but Marian and Hook needed to have their hearts out to survive.

[YaddaYadda]

That's probably why Anna and Kristoff look so wet when they come out of the chest, because they thawed inside it.

 

Count me in as someone who doesn't want the whole heart splitting thing, because it's contrived and I hated it when they did it for Snowing because it's a total cop-out and CS are not really there.  They keep emphasising that Emma has savior magic which is different than the other magic, so I'm guessing it will come into play there.  In the preview, we do see Hook at the town line as well, but he's more in the back.   

 

Didn't Carlyle say that Rumple does even worst things in 409 and 410?  Because wow!  Trying to hat the savior for her powers and taking someone's heart was not vile enough!  But keep on trucking Rumple, I do love you best when you're an unapologetic asshole.

[Artsda]

Interview with Colin.

 

'Once Upon a Time': Is Hook going to die?