Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Shanna Marie]

If he has that snow globe then I'm assuming this is when he gets his memories back right?

That could explain them going from what looks like an intense confrontation to walking down the street holding hands.

 

There was a tease a little while ago, mentioning a conversation in the writers' room in which someone said something about "CHARACTER goes full on hero here" (or along those lines. I wonder if that's connected to the idea that it takes a hero to draw Excalibur. That had me also wondering about the speculation about Emma's reaction when Hook told her "that's not who I am" and walked away -- is she thinking he can turn out to be the hero she needs, and is this good or bad?

 

But then it's this show, so it will be Regina.

 

On the other hand, Arthur's drawn it before, so he'd be the obvious choice, unless something has happened since then that makes him not qualified.

[retrograde]

Regina will likely save the day against this season's real Big Bad, but if Hook can bring Emma back to the light, is it possible they are ultimately setting things up for a TLK to rid her of the curse? Surely she has softened some of they are holding hands down the street?

[HoodlumSheep]

* Edited because I accidentally posted in the wrong thread!

[Souris]

There was a tease a little while ago, mentioning a conversation in the writers' room in which someone said something about "CHARACTER goes full on hero here" (or along those lines. I wonder if that's connected to the idea that it takes a hero to draw Excalibur. That had me also wondering about the speculation about Emma's reaction when Hook told her "that's not who I am" and walked away -- is she thinking he can turn out to be the hero she needs, and is this good or bad?

 

But then it's this show, so it will be Regina.

 

I actually think that writers room tease was referring to Charming in this next ep. Josh mentioned we'd be seeing Charming at his most heroic, and this ep seems to be the one that's about.

 

Or, it could be Regina. As always.

Edited October 5, 2015 by Souris

[YaddaYadda]

Surely she has softened some of they are holding hands down the street?

 

I think there are greater forces at play. 

 

With Dopey being trapped inside a tree, I'm thinking that Nimue is also part of whatever went down with Emma, considering that she's technically the one that trapped Merlin in the tree.

 

I thought that was a major clue.

 

ETA - Either Nimue is behind this or it's her curse Emma used.

Edited October 5, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[kili]

I actually think that writers room tease was referring to Charming in this next ep. Josh mentioned we'd be seeing Charming at his most heroic, and this ep seems to be the one that's about.

 

Maybe it was about the scene in this latest episode where Charming leaps to the defense of a mass-murderer and slays one of her traumatized victims. He seemed pretty proud of his actions and the tone of the piece seemed to frame it as heroic.

 

Perhaps Charming will kill one of Regina's victims next episode as well and Arthur gives him a medal. It will have to be big to beat this episode where he heroically taught a mass-murderer to dance and helped to save her life twice.

 

Whoever cast the curse is the person who put Merlin in a tree (given Dopey is now a tree). Frankly, all evidence seems to point to Merlin being an out of control idiot, so he probably belongs in a tree. Ther person who did it deserves to be feted at Grannies, but they will probably end up dead by the end of the half-season.

Edited October 5, 2015 by kili

[YaddaYadda]

Speculation based on "original" mythology since some stuff says tree, other stuff says cave.

[Rumsy4]

Like Eion Bailey’s August, who also was in the mix as Season 4 came to a close, Lily (played by Agnes Bruckner) is theoretically “hanging out there somewhere [in Storybrooke],” series co-creator Adam Horowitz tells me. “We have a plan to pick up her story, though it’s not going to be right away. It may be the second half [of Season 5].”

 

Not particularly surprised, but it looks like Lily is going the way of Will Scarlett. I guess they decided to drop her story when planning for Season 5.

 

With Dopey being trapped inside a tree, I'm thinking that Nimue is also part of whatever went down with Emma, considering that she's technically the one that trapped Merlin in the tree.

 

Very much looks like it. I don't think Nimue is in Storybrooke in the present day, though. So, I'm thinking she and Merlin both die in Camelot. 

Edited October 5, 2015 by Rumsy4

[Mari]

Not particularly surprised, but it looks like Lily is going the way of Will Scarlett. I guess they decided to drop her story when planning for Season 5.

Well, we deserve some good news.

[YaddaYadda]

Very much looks like it. I don't think Nimue is in Storybrooke in the present day, though. So, I'm thinking she and Arthur both die in Camelot. 

Okay, come back! You can't post this then leave without an explanation. How is Arthur dead in Camelot if he's alive in Storybrooke? And who do you think shapeshifted into him?

[Rumsy4]

Oops!! I meant Merlin. :-p Edited my original post.

[YaddaYadda]

Oops!! I meant Merlin. :-p Edited my original post.

 

Yeah, I think he's dead too, probably due to his own stupidity.

 

My friend pointed out that the sword is the hat this season which I didn't even realize until she mentioned it. And because idiot's prophecies are the end result of something and no one knows how to get to that end result, that's probably the reason he keeps making stuff that turns into a weapon against civilization basically.

 

The hat cuts the Dark One loose from the control of the dagger, and a whole Excalibur in the hands of the Dark one snuffs out the light, which is basically the hat on steroids.

 

But instead of having someone destroy Excalibur, he goes to see a 6 year old and warns her not to pull the sword 24 years from the day he saw her. 

 

Merlin is such a bumbling fool.

[Souris]

Not particularly surprised, but it looks like Lily is going the way of Will Scarlett. I guess they decided to drop her story when planning for Season 5.

 

Very much looks like it. I don't think Nimue is in Storybrooke in the present day, though. So, I'm thinking she and Merlin both die in Camelot. 

 

I generally hate when they drop storylines, but I'm perfectly fine with them dropping Lily's.

 

I don't think Nimue is even in Camelot. As far as we know, she filmed only with Merlin in biblical-looking clothes. So I think that was a flashback to the time of the origin of the Dark One. If she was the original Dark One, as is a popular spoiler theory, then she would have died at the hands of the next Dark One.

 

I do think it looks like Merlin doesn't make it out of Camelot, since he hasn't been spotted filming in SB. Does Emma kill him? Does he go back into the tree? Something else?

[kili]

Yeah, I think he's dead too, probably due to his own stupidity

Now I have that commercial "Dumb Ways to Die" going through my head. I'm going to go with "Poke a Stick at a Grizzly Bear" since one of the upcoming titles is "Bear King".  But one can never rule out "Create a really dangerous magical object and lose control of it" because that is just the way he rolls.

[Mathius]

People are jumping to conclusions by saying Lily's story is being written off. Not to say that it absolutely won't be, mind you, but we still ought to wait until 5B to be sure. It's all dependent on whether they end up having room for it or if "there are only so many stories and we can't sacrifice Regina's for this one".

On a side note, wouldn't Lily have made a MUCH more fitting "substitute Savior" in this arc than Regina, all things considered? She just recently came to town and is still dealing with experiencing magic stuff complete with "WTF" reactions, she would have been a natural fit.

[mjgchick]

I will cackle hard if they ignore Lily completely after Emma like the good person she is wanted to help her find her father.

[tri4335]

Lily served her purpose as a stand in for young Regina that Scott "Nimrod" could imagine kissing or being kissed by young Emma. There really is no more story to tell!

[KAOS Agent]

I think they had some kind of plan with the darkness shifting plot and were going to use that in resolving Emma's Dark One arc with the bonus of dragons, but then got caught looking at the new shiny thing over there and now Lily's superfluous and won't be seen again. This would be especially true if Agnes is cast in some other role. That would be ideal for the showrunners because they can just shake their heads sadly and say we'd love to have her back, but she's busy.

[LizaD]

Speaking of cut scenes whatever happened to the one with Emma in the black feathery dress? I thought that was her coolest outfit. I don't remember what the scene even was but would've loved to see that dress in motion.

Elliot Knight did a round of interviews, all linked on his twitter. Nothing spoilery except that they're going to dive "deep" into the existence of magic with Merlin and he didn't meet Robert until they shared scenes a few days ago.

I think Nimue died as the first DO and she's only there to give Merlin a backstory plus the DO mythology stuff. I just don't think it makes any sense for Merlin to be trapped sometime during Emma's childhood and adulthood, especially when the dude is supposed to be the Big Cheese of magic.

Maybe there's 2 Merlins walking around? 1 good and 1 evil to explain the existence of good and evil magic. The one trapped in the tree and the one they freed is the evil one cause the dude is walking around in a black robe. The good one was the one with young Emma and is currently hanging out in NYC. Nimue plus good Merlin trapped the evil one way back in the day. They also stripped his evil magic and Nimue took it on ala Emma.

I mean as of ep.7 we see Merlin and white dress Emma with her dagger. How did shit hit the fan so quickly after that given Merlin's power? And why is he letting her have the dagger and do magic with it when it just makes her darker?

[regularlyleaded]

I have a completely insane theory about Emma and Dark Emma based on that BTS spoiler pic of Jen dressed as Light Emma filming with a stand in dressed as Dark Swan. What if whatever happened in Camelot didn't necessarily turn Emma evil but split her into two entities? And now just like the Dark One's dagger and Excalibur, there's now a Dark Emma and "Light Emma", and the Emma that's in Storybrooke now is the Dark Emma half, and that's why she doesn't seem to have all her memories intact (since it appears that she didn't know she had Excalibur in the basement of her house). Meanwhile, Light Emma is trapped somewhere else and somehow The Dark One Dagger and Dark Emma are tied together as are Light Emma and Excalibur. 

 

It's an insane theory I know, but it's Calvinball!

 

(ETA: Ha! I just read your post LizaD. It seems we're on the same wavelength with the split characters. You're going with split Merlin, I'm spitballing there's a split Emma. ;)

Edited October 6, 2015 by regularlyleaded

[YaddaYadda]

If she was the original Dark One, as is a popular spoiler theory, then she would have died at the hands of the next Dark One.

 

Not if they managed to find a way to take the darkness out of her. She could still be alive if she's the Lady of the Lake, We have no clue what's been filmed in studios either.

 

Because of my weirdly obsessive nature, I zoomed in on the actress' dress and it has roses on it. Probably irrelevant, but considering all the roses we've seen in BTS...

 

since it appears that she didn't know she had Excalibur in the basement of her house

 

I thought I was seeing things when that happened. Like she didn't even remember she brought it with her until the darkness reminded her. I was actually wondering how the scene was directed.

Edited October 6, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[Curio]

I will cackle hard if they ignore Lily completely after Emma like the good person she is wanted to help her find her father.

 

Wasn't there spoiler out there that where Adam or Eddy said they'd get to Lily's plot after episode 5? Or was that just their vague answer where they'e like, "Well, she doesn't show up in the first 5 episodes, that's for sure."

 

I'm not going to sugarcoat anything—I despised the Lily and Maleficent plots. I thought "Lily" was one of the worst episodes in the entire series. I wish I could forget everything that happened with that stupid road trip Emma and Regina went on and the completely nonsensical morality behind Lily having all of Emma's darkness, even though Emma has been shown to tap into her darkness throughout the entire show. But I'll be so pissed if they don't tie up Lily's dad storyline. Because if they don't tie that up, then that means I wasted my life watching all of those scenes she was in in Season 4 and they were literally all for nothing.

Edited October 6, 2015 by Curio

[Free]

On a side note, wouldn't Lily have made a MUCH more fitting "substitute Savior" in this arc than Regina, all things considered? She just recently came to town and is still dealing with experiencing magic stuff complete with "WTF" reactions, she would have been a natural fit.

 

But then Poor Regina wouldn't get to play the Savior like they seemed to be going for to begin with.

Edited October 6, 2015 by Free

[LizaD]

Regurlarlyleaded, maybe they'll both be split and we get 4 for the price of 2. Add in some shapeshifting stuff and things could get really fun.

I was basing my spec off of Jacob and Man in Black and we all know how much they love their Lost references. Jacob sounds a lot like Merlin and I think the premiere scene was a callback of 2 scenes combined in Lost. Jacob appears to young Kate while she is stealing something and appears to Jack, giving him the Apollo candy bar. So of course our super creative master storytellers had Merlin popping up while young Emma is stealing an Apollo bar.

The Man in Black aka Smoke Monster is just like our Black Goo Monster aka DO.

[Serena]

Well, my spec based on the latest spoilers is that Dark Swan doesn't exactly remember all that happened in Camelot. It was kind of weird how she was like "That seems to be the question of the day" and "I wish I could tell you" to Hook when questioned about what happened. Why wouldn't she tell him? She doesn't seem pissed at him, so if she wants to be like "Ditch those losers who were so mean to me, and come hang out at my house" why wouldn't she simply tell him the horrible thing they supposedly did? Which goes with the spec that she's actually trying to do something else - her goal isn't to "punish" them or whatever, but something else, probably to do with Merlin.

[Souris]

Thanks to various cast/crew photos, we know the following characters filmed on location today: Hook, the Wicked Witch, Robin, Arthur & Merlin. Very odd group! Of course, they may not have all filmed together; there could have been different filming groups. The only costumes we know are the WW outfit & Arthur's usual getup, so it's a mystery whether it's Camelot or SB, or a combination thereof. 

[KingOfHearts]

 

It was only a matter of time before Zelena figures out how to take off the anti-magic cuff/gets someone to do it for her and go full on Wicked Witch again.

I guess that poses the question of why she didn't go back to being green in Camelot. She did when she went back in time and killed Marian. Do we know if she's green in the Wicked Witch costume?

Edited October 6, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[PixiePaws1]

I have a completely insane theory about Emma and Dark Emma based on that BTS spoiler pic of Jen dressed as Light Emma filming with a stand in dressed as Dark Swan. What if whatever happened in Camelot didn't necessarily turn Emma evil but split her into two entities? And now just like the Dark One's dagger and Excalibur, there's now a Dark Emma and "Light Emma", and the Emma that's in Storybrooke now is the Dark Emma half, and that's why she doesn't seem to have all her memories intact (since it appears that she didn't know she had Excalibur in the basement of her house). Meanwhile, Light Emma is trapped somewhere else and somehow The Dark One Dagger and Dark Emma are tied together as are Light Emma and Excalibur. 

 

It's an insane theory I know, but it's Calvinball!

 

(ETA: Ha! I just read your post LizaD. It seems we're on the same wavelength with the split characters. You're going with split Merlin, I'm spitballing there's a split Emma. ;)

I have had so many variations on the same theory of  an Emma split into Dark and Light but run into roadblocks:

1 - Originally I thought the sword was remade in Camelot and a) trying to use it or b) getting stabbed with it or c) the remaking of it, split Emma . . .

but the sword & the stone (so did she break the Round Table to get it since the stone it was sitting in the middle of it in Camelot?) is still in pieces since Emma has both in Storybrooke, so, I thought ok:

2 - maybe they tried something else with the dagger - it was mentioned a while back that the dagger’s rules had changed - and stabbing her didn’t kill her but split out Light from Dark….

But that didn’t seem likely, so I thought ok:

3 - the sword was remade and with options a, b or c from my first thought above, but it was then embedded as a whole back in the stone and Dark Emma is waving around a fake so no-one knows she doesn’t actually have it.

Any of the above leaves Light Emma trapped in Camelot (or my first thought was she trapped behind that locked door in the new house  but that was debunked) and when I saw Killian carrying the glass globe I thought it was the crystal ball Neal used to see Emma across realms and he’s seen Light Emma back in Camelot and cottoned on to the game.

But the problem with a split is that Dark Emma would have to be wholly evil (and if  the writers follow the usual split good/evil halves trope) and :

A) so far, she doesn’t seem particularly evil (although I might change my mind about that if she tries to do to Killian what I think she is planning based on the 5x03 promo) and A+E have said her actions as Dark Swan still have integrity so not sure how they can claim this AND call her a villain .. . (??)

And

B) Imp Rumple is telling her she still has to pay a price to get rid of the Light so seems to me she is still carrying some Light (unless I misunderstood).

So then I came back to this which might be partially right:

4 - Emma is not split but someone else has the dagger or is controlling her in some way  because she said she embraced the Darkness so imp Rumple should be gone UNLESS whoever is really puling the strings is pretending to manifest as imp Rumple and is actually gas lighting HER.  Because I agree she seemed surprised the sword was chilling in her basement and she certainly seemed genuinely confused about what to tell Killian about the events of Camelot.

The expression on Guinevere’s face when she placed her hand, oh so carefully, on Arthur’s arm in that little scene in The Price just smacked to me of someone mind controlling someone else. I think Guinevere is long dead and replaced by someone like ‘Madam Mim’ or ‘Morgana’ (Mim was a known shape changer and in some legends Morgana disguised herself as Guinny to conceive Mordred by Arthur) or Guinny has just gone bad (‘cos  . .plot device). So it’s whoever is disguised as Guinny or Guinny herself that is in control of everything and the true big bad. I don’t think it’s Merlin.

Well - now that I have finished raving like a madwoman . ..feel free to pick this to pieces.

[FierceAfroChick]

Loving the split theories!  So Light Emma may be somewhere under some sort of enchantment and TLK will actually work on her rather than Dark Emma?

Edited October 6, 2015 by FierceAfroChick

[PixiePaws1]

So Light Emma may be somewhere under some sort of enchantment and TLK will actually work on her rather than Dark Emma?

Never thought of that! Good theory. My take on the failed TLKs is #1 failed because Emma didn't want to rid of the power at that point and #2 because Emma isn't ready to let the darkness go until they have a way to get rid of it permanently (which could still be the case even if she is being controlled)

[RadioGirl27]

The expression on Guinevere’s face when she

but the swordplaced her hand, oh so carefully, on Arthur’s arm in that little scene in The Price just smacked to me of someone mind controlling someone else. I think Guinevere is long dead and replaced by someone like ‘Madam Mim’ or ‘Morgana’ (Mim was a known shape changer and in some legends Morgana disguised herself as Guinny to conceive Mordred by Arthur) or Guinny has just gone bad (‘cos . .plot device). So it’s whoever is disguised as Guinny or Guinny herself that is in control of everything and the true big bad. I don’t think it’s Merlin.

Well - now that I have finished raving like a madwoman . ..feel free to pick this to pieces.

Watching the episode I had the same idea, that Guinevere is also Morgana. I was thinking more along the lines of them combining both characters in one, but an impersonator is also a possibility.

[kili]

Wouldn't Lancelot be the obvious fake instead of Gwen? Lancelot was shown in the Enchanted Forest marrying Snow and Charming. He was frozen in the Cora Dome. He became a leader of Town Cora Dome and he was supposedly killed by Cora. 

 

While  he might not have been actually killed by Cora, why is their no recognition of the woman who got him off King George's crew? Why is there no recognition of the Evil Queen (except from poor, unfortunate Percival)?  How did he explain his 30 year absence? 

 

So, I cannot decide whether Lancelot is fake or the show has really terrible continuity.

[RadioGirl27]

But Lancelot is not in Camelot right now. He was in the first scene when Arthur got the sword (and we don't know when that happened) but he has not appeared again.

Edited October 6, 2015 by RadioGirl27

[Curio]

Man, I really hope this split Emma theory is true, because there's so much potential for awesomeness there. There's always a chance JMO just happened to run into her stunt double who was filming a different scene on set and decided to take a photo with her, but I like the idea of a Dark Emma and Light Emma acting in the same scene way better.

 

Loving the split theories!  So Light Emma may be somewhere under some sort of enchantment and TLK will actually work on her rather than Dark Emma?

 

If Emma splits into two somehow in Camelot, I'm thinking that the Light Emma somehow gets sucked into that red gem in the handle of Excalibur. So when Rumple is tells Emma in the basement, "You can make that weapon whole again and use it to snuff out the light...forever," maybe the "light" that he's referring to is Light Emma who happens to be stuck in the sword. So when Dark Emma tries to take the sword, the red gem lights up (aka Light Emma) and blasts her back because that's all Light Emma can do to protect herself. But once the sword is combined with the dagger, Light Emma will cease to exist and there will only be Dark Emma.

[YaddaYadda]

The only costumes we know are the WW outfit & Arthur's usual getup, so it's a mystery whether it's Camelot or SB, or a combination thereof.

 

Leaf Lady has such a sweet life! When I was 7, I wanted to be Grace Kelly (don't ask). Now, I wanna be the Leaf Lady. #lifegoals

 

About Emma's split personality, much as I couldn't see it before, I can see it now. And yes, there was something way off with her before she went into the basement. 

 

What I wanna see now is her scene with her parents. There's a huge difference in the way she behaves and talks to Hook and Henry vs the way she talks to Regina. How is she going to behave with them?

 

The 5x03 promo with her in her first date dress and looking very much like Emma, I don't think she's trying to manipulate him. I really think she needs him to trust her for whatever.

 

That globe in Hook's hand, that is also in Merlin's tower, it looks like it contains a scroll.

Edited October 6, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[Mari]

I'm thinking that the Light Emma somehow gets sucked into that red gem in the handle of Excalibur. So when Rumple is tells Emma in the basement, "You can make that weapon whole again and use it to snuff out the light...forever," maybe the "light" that he's referring to is Light Emma who happens to be stuck in the sword. So when Dark Emma tries to take the sword, the red gem lights up (aka Light Emma) and blasts her back because that's all Light Emma can do to protect herself. But once the sword is combined with the dagger, Light Emma will cease to exist and there will only be Dark Emma.

I really hope this theory is true, because if they are talking about light as a synonym for all goodness, that's an amazingly stupid goal. Even in the world's most evil situations and regimes, there have been glimmers of goodness.

I don't care how powerful Merlin, Emma, the Dark One goop, and assorted villains have gotten, stamping out good is not something they are capable of. If that's the actual goal? How dumb do they assume the viewers are?

[KingOfHearts]

Watching the episode I had the same idea, that Guinevere is also Morgana. I was thinking more along the lines of them combining both characters in one, but an impersonator is also a possibility.

As if she didn't have enough similarities with Marian already!

[Serena]

About the promo, Emma is wearing her date dress but with the 405 ponytail. I never liked date ponytail (it was too high) so I'm glad they chose a cuter one. But I'm wondering if it's also a callback to the scene in 405 where they have a heart-to-heart?

[snarkastic]

That globe in Hook's hand, that is also in Merlin's tower, it looks like it contains a scroll.

 

Dark Curse Version 3.6? (I don't actually know what we're up to here)

 

Or the prophecy about the Savior/Dark One?

[YaddaYadda]

Or the prophecy about the Savior/Dark One?

 

 

I think it's whatever is going to help Emma out in the end. The last scroll we saw contained in a globe like that was the pre-Dark Curse, but I think it's some kind of prophecy that likely has to do with Excalibur since it seems to be key to whatever in the world is going on.

 

ETA - I noticed upon my last re-watch of the episode (no worried, watched it only twice) that the tunnel leads deeper under the house and that it's fenced with bars, like a jail cell basically. At first, I thought it might lead to the mines, but really, what if Emma has Merlin imprisoned in her basement?

Edited October 6, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[Rumsy4]

ETA - I noticed upon my last re-watch of the episode (no worried, watched it only twice) that the tunnel leads deeper under the house and that it's fenced with bars, like a jail cell basically. At first, I thought it might lead to the mines, but really, what if Emma has Merlin imprisoned in her basement?

 

Hah! I noticed those bars too. For a minute I wondered if Emma had transported the EF cell to Storybrooke, but the bars were too ornate for that. Ooh-- it's an excellent theory that Emma has Merlin stashed in her basement! Or she has Nimue imprisoned there (because I still think Merlin is a goner and Nimue is the Big Bad). 

[Serena]

I don't like this new trend where they don't publish press release and still on Monday anymore.

[sharky]

Dark Curse Version 3.6? (I don't actually know what we're up to here)

 

Or the prophecy about the Savior/Dark One?

This may be a little too Harry Potter for the show to get away with it.

 

As for the bars, I wonder if that's just a doorway that leads to the Storybrooke mines/tunnels. Maybe I'm head canoning with this, but we've seen the mines plenty of times on the show, then there's that doorway that leads farther back into Regina's vault, and of course Maleficent's cave under the library. I wonder if they're somehow all connected underground. Of course, this could also lead to the possibility that with Emma's underground lair, she now has access to Regina's vault potentially.

[YaddaYadda]

This may be a little too Harry Potter for the show to get away with it.

 

Everything is always going to be too Harry Potter or too Arthurian. I mean where did she get her ideas for Dumbledore, the boy who lived from, and the sword of Gryffindor from? If A&E can keep taking (stealing) ideas from Lost because they're so enamored with it and can't close the door on that, then I can see them "borrowing" from Harry Potter. 

 

Maybe I'm head canoning with this, but we've seen the mines plenty of times on the show, then there's that doorway that leads farther back into Regina's vault, and of course Maleficent's cave under the library.

 

I think Adam posted a BTS of the mines last week, if I'm not mistaken.

[kili]

Is Rumple really Rumple? I know he is portrayed as being in Emma's head, but maybe it is Nimue or somebody like that and they just aren't visible to everybody else.

 

Frankly, if I was Emma, I would have told Rumple to stay that Blast-ended-skrewt/pig thing so that she wouldn't have to listen to him grind her down. The skrewt was scary, but at least she doesn't speak skrewt.

 

If Rumple is some other entity pretending to be in her head, it would explain why Emma might be pretending to be evil when she's really not. This other entity is also the one who likely cast the new curse.

Edited October 6, 2015 by kili

[LizaD]

I think the only problem with the split Emma is that DS isn't completely dark. You saw shades of real Emma with Henry, Hook and when she's alone. I don't even think she's dark with Woegina either but that's another story.

 

 

Dark Swan doesn't exactly remember all that happened in Camelot. It was kind of weird how she was like "That seems to be the question of the day" and "I wish I could tell you" to Hook when questioned about what happened.

I think that's just really clunky writing to draw out the "mystery." Remember all those cryptic conversations Ingrid and Rump had that went absolutely nowhere and meant absolutely nothing? Their writing gets super clunky when they try to do 2 things: draw out some mystery and then when they finally do want to reveal something, the exposition is really bad too.

 

I think we already got the answer of her "goal" which is to join Excalibur and the dagger. I don't think the mystery is there anymore. The twist they'll drop is what happens when it is whole. JM had pictures of her with Excalibur for ep. 8 right? I think that's when its pulled out and that's also when we saw Snowing and Woegina at her house too so most obvious conclusion is that Woegina pulls out Excalibur.

[Serena]

I think we already got the answer of her "goal" which is to join Excalibur and the dagger. I don't think the mystery is there anymore. The twist they'll drop is what happens when it is whole. JM had pictures of her with Excalibur for ep. 8 right? I think that's when its pulled out and that's also when we saw Snowing and Woegina at her house too so most obvious conclusion is that Woegina pulls out Excalibur.

But she only got that goal at the end of 502. What did she want to do before? Just chill in her new house and watch the town run around trying to defend themselves against some new monster every week?

 

Why is Dark Swan trying to get Killian to trust her? I mean, I know he's fine and all, but since she now has this "join the dagger with Excalibur" sword, you'd think she wouldn't have time to play head games with him, complete with dressing up. Is he key to the Light Snuffing like he was key to the Dagger Cleaving? Except I doubt Dark Swan would go along with it if the price was his life.

[KingOfHearts]

 

But she only got that goal at the end of 502. What did she want to do before? Just chill in her new house and watch the town run around trying to defend themselves against some new monster every week?

There has to be some reasoning behind the memory wipe as well. The Excalibur + Dagger seemed like totally new information to her. That goal seems vague and missing important parts. "Snuff out the light" has to have a deeper meaning.

[mjgchick]

Maybe Emma going dark while having Excalibur and the Dagger is the only way to defeat the DO curse permanently?

[RadioGirl27]

It seems that Mulan, Red, Merida, Arthur and Zelena are shooting together, or at least at the same place. It's a weird group, that for sure.

Edited October 6, 2015 by RadioGirl27