Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion

[Starry]

11 hours ago, shantown said:

I think the audience is putting too much stock in the line "we're gonna need more diapers." (more than the writers are, at least). Aside from "This house is bitchin'" being somewhat of a recurring joke, how much of Barry's speed force gibberish has actually played out? I mean, we're still waiting on learning anything more about that speed force language he was writing in! When Nora was also writing in that I thought FOR SURE we'd get more about it and nope. 

I agree. They've got an easy way out here because they can explain it away with a simple "that line was said by Barry in a different future/aborted timeline".

[SimoneS]

19 hours ago, Trini said:

Well, I guess it can go either way; but I'm assuming that since Helbing (who is just terrible at doing teases) spoke about Iris' pregnancy, it's more likely happening than not happening soon. He said that the end of the finale would set the timetable, and since the only thing that happened was the Crisis date getting moved up sooner, I'm assuming that the pregnancy is moved up sooner.

So you think that Wallace is more willing to work with babies. After all, the show likely has two to three more years to go. I think the show shouldn't be reluctant to let Barry and Iris have children. The babies don't have to appear in every episode. Look at Jenna we never see her. The twins can appear two or three times a season tops.

I did think that Iris would be pregnant either at the end of this past season or next year, but I at the time didn't realize that they were moving up the Crisis. We'll just have to see now. 

[Trini]

47 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

So you think that Wallace is more willing to work with babies.

No, I just think they needed something to up the stakes for the crossover, and show that the timeline has changed. (Plus the Tornado Twins have to come in at some point, anyway.)

53 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

I think the show shouldn't be reluctant to let Barry and Iris have children. The babies don't have to appear in every episode. Look at Jenna we never see her. The twins can appear two or three times a season tops.

The fact that the kids would be sidelined is exactly why I DON'T want Iris to get pregnant. Why bother bringing in their children if we never see them, or they not a significant part of the show? I'd rather they not do babies at all, if they're not going to do it well. (And I don't think they'll do it well.)

[SimoneS]

9 hours ago, Trini said:

The fact that the kids would be sidelined is exactly why I DON'T want Iris to get pregnant. Why bother bringing in their children if we never see them, or they not a significant part of the show? I'd rather they not do babies at all, if they're not going to do it well. (And I don't think they'll do it well.)

The two shows that I thought used their babies the best were Friends and Charmed. Emma on Friends didn't always appear on screen, but she was the focus of some of the funniest episodes. Wyatt on Charmed had more a constant presence because he was the focus of evil which either wanted to abduct or turn him evil and he had powers to protect himself. I think that The Flash can find a balance where the twins only appear in a few episodes each season, but yet still have a significant role in Barry and Iris' lives. 

[SimoneS]

I have been thinking about how they can end the show now that their series finale story had been appropriated for this upcoming crossover. They could tweak the comic book story where Iris "dies." After finding out that she has been reborn in the 30th century, Barry leaves to join her there. They are happy and conceive the Tornado Twins, only for the anti-Monitor to show up and kidnap Barry. They could end it on that cliffhanger or have Barry return to be with Iris and the twins.

[BeautifulFlower]

1 hour ago, SimoneS said:

I have been thinking about how they can end the show now that their series finale story had been appropriated for this upcoming crossover. They could tweak the comic book story where Iris "dies." After finding out that she has been reborn in the 30th century, Barry leaves to join her there. They are happy and conceive the Tornado Twins, only for the anti-Monitor to show up and kidnap Barry. They could end it on that cliffhanger or have Barry return to be with Iris and the twins.

It'll be terrible to end the show on a cliffhanger.

[Featherhat]

I don't think they'll end it on a cliff hanger, I doubt they were going to leave it on the headline without resolving it one way or another when COIE was going to be the Flash finale so they won't now.

The last time they made the story all about Iris "dying" I got very annoyed with her lack of agency so I'd be wary of that happening again.

I don't think they'll end it on a cliff hanger, I doubt they were going to leave it on the headline without resolving it one way or another when COIE was going to be the Flash finale so they won't now.

The last time they made the story all about Iris "dying" I got very annoyed with her lack of agency so I'd be wary of that happening again.

[SimoneS]

4 hours ago, BeautifulFlower said:

It'll be terrible to end the show on a cliffhanger.

True. A cliffhanger would be terrible. 

[Trini]

I don't know how they will resolve this upcoming Crisis in 2019, but I think they could do a another 'Crisis' story to close the show. (There have been several in the comics, right?)

I don't think there'll be a big cliffhanger in the series finale, but I can also see them leaving some things openended. But I do like the idea of time travel in the finale, since the pilot had time travel too.

Edited May 30, 2019 by Trini

[SimoneS]

Yes, there are several crises in the comics. They will probably create a series finale for The Flash that involves a crossover that gives the other DCTV shows remaining on The CW a major role.

I have always been concerned that the intention was to use The Flash crisis to end on a cliffhanger which is why I am glad that they moved it up to give Arrow a major role.  I think this reduces the likelihood of them using a cliffhanger with Barry disappearing in the series finale.

[ursula]

4 hours ago, SimoneS said:

I have always been concerned that the intention was to use The Flash crisis to end on a cliffhanger which is why I am glad that they moved it up to give Arrow a major role.  I think this reduces the likelihood of them using a cliffhanger with Barry disappearing in the series finale.

Well speaking for myself, that sounds kind of cool. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[Trini]

From TVLine; not-so-surprising casting info:

Quote

THE FLASH

Season 6 will introduce a new male Big Bad, and rumor has it producers are eyeing diverse actors for the part.

https://tvline.com/gallery/fall-preview-new-characters-this-is-us-the-flash/#!1/the-girl-with-the-red-lightning/

Eh- the only thing that's "news" is that the villain might not be white this year.

So maybe it will be Godspeed/August Heart for Season 6? (I haven't been able to find a definitive answer about the character's ethnicity, but he has been depicted as brown-skinned in the comics.)

If that is what they are planning, I hope that even if August is in the first part of the season, they don't introduce Godspeed until mid-season.

[SimoneS]

A new Big Bad. What a surprise, that never happens. At least an actor of color will be getting the job. Hopefully, he can act, especially after the hell that was Chris Klein last season.

[Trini]

I think they do good with the casting the majority of the time (considering their budget and filming in Vancouver); the writing is where they let the actors down half the time. Come through, Wallace!

[SimoneS]

I don't know what happened with the casting last season. Supergirl got Sam Witwer and Jon Cryer, while The Flash got Chris Klein. I just don't get it. Someone must have had it bad for Chris Klein. However, if his casting convinced Todd Helbing that he was burnt out and wanted to other things, it is all good.

[Trini]

Not anything new, but more conformation that Sue Dearbon will be introduced in Season 6, from this interview(video) with Hartley.

[SimoneS]

There have been "leaks" about season six on YT. A previously reliable uber fan claims that leading up to the crisis that the show will focus on Barry and Reverse Flash's lives before the timeline was changed and Barry finds out that his mother also dies in that timeline. Barry will be chased by demons or lead the demons into the Speedforce. Barry will disappear when he is trapped in the Speedforce. The rest of the season is about Barry trying to get out of the Speedforce and what happens to the city when he isn't there to protect it. I doubt that they will have Barry trapped in Speedforce for the rest of the whole season, but we'll see. Basically, this is a version of Flash Rebirth which was to be expected. 

Another thing I noticed, it seems like a lot of people are convinced that Cisco is no longer part of Team Flash. I can't help wondering if Carlos will be recurring next season which is why they didn't announce his permanent exit.

[Trini]

2 hours ago, SimoneS said:

There have been "leaks" about season six on YT. ...

Sounds fake to me.

3 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Another thing I noticed, it seems like a lot of people are convinced that Cisco is no longer part of Team Flash. I can't help wondering if Carlos will be recurring next season which is why they didn't announce his permanent exit.

People really want this rumor to be true for some reason.

[SimoneS]

2 hours ago, Trini said:

Sounds fake to me.

The guy has been pretty reliable with spoiler info in the past. He does seem to know someone close to the show so we'll see.

2 hours ago, Trini said:

People really want this rumor to be true for some reason.

I actually don't think that most people want this rumor to be true. With a few exceptions, Carlos/Cisco is popular on most of the online fan sites/forums that I lurk on. I think it was the way Cisco's story ended last season that convinced people that he won't be back. There hasn't been an announcement that Carlos is leaving, but I think "something" is going on with Cisco. 

Edited June 20, 2019 by SimoneS

[Featherhat]

Hmm, they've paralleled Flash and Arrow before (wedding, future daughters in different ways etc) and having both leads absent from their teams and loved ones could fit that pattern in the lead up to the crossover.

Not that they should or shouldn't just it might make it a bit more likely because otherwise it sounds a convoluted choice for a half season.

Edited June 20, 2019 by Featherhat

[BeautifulFlower]

39 minutes ago, Trini said:

People really want this rumor to be true for some reason.

I can't really blame them. The way Cisco was written for the back half of the season, anybody would think he was getting written off. Especially with his scene with Caitlin in the finale. It came off as goodbye.

I still don't see the purpose of getting rid of Vibe. It can't be a budget issue as they barely used him during the season anyway and there's still other metas on the team. If Carlos wanted to appear in less episodes, I don't see how Cisco not having powers will help with that.

Something went down behind the scenes because this whole thing makes zero sense. Maybe Carlos will be announced as recurring or maybe they plan to kill Cisco is Crisis.

[SimoneS]

Correcting the leak I posted above; Barry will be gone for a few episodes not the rest of the season. I have my doubts that this also.

[Trini]

Sounds like the cast will be back in Vancouver next week:

For pre-production, I assume. I don't think filming starts until July.

[SimoneS]

Good news is that Carlos is back for the premiere.

[Kate45]

On 6/20/2019 at 9:53 AM, SimoneS said:

There have been "leaks" about season six on YT. A previously reliable uber fan claims that leading up to the crisis that the show will focus on Barry and Reverse Flash's lives before the timeline was changed and Barry finds out that his mother also dies in that timeline. Barry will be chased by demons or lead the demons into the Speedforce. Barry will disappear when he is trapped in the Speedforce. The rest of the season is about Barry trying to get out of the Speedforce and what happens to the city when he isn't there to protect it. I doubt that they will have Barry trapped in Speedforce for the rest of the whole season, but we'll see. Basically, this is a version of Flash Rebirth which was to be expected. 

Another thing I noticed, it seems like a lot of people are convinced that Cisco is no longer part of Team Flash. I can't help wondering if Carlos will be recurring next season which is why they didn't announce his permanent exit.

Don’t forget that a ton of “leaks” happened for season 5 and all of them were false. Any leaks before the episodes have been filmed should always be taken with a HUGE grain of salt. Not enough people have the information to be able to “leak” it. Besides, I can pretty much guarantee that Grant won’t be out for multiple episodes this season. I just don’t think Berlanti would give Eric Wallace the job if that was a part of his plan!

 The only time that leaks were spot on when the Supergirl ones were posted, but that was after the episodes had been filmed and the show didn’t stop airing until the end of June. In other words, many people had seen the information including some low level people who weren’t invested in keeping the information quiet. 

[BeautifulFlower]

2 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Good news is that Carlos is back for the premiere.

Well it was to be expected since nothing came out about him leaving. However, I still stand by that SOMETHING happened bts. The way he was written in the back half was in a goodbye way. Especially the finale. 

[Kate45]

8 minutes ago, BeautifulFlower said:

Well it was to be expected since nothing came out about him leaving. However, I still stand by that SOMETHING happened bts. The way he was written in the back half was in a goodbye way. Especially the finale. 

I agree. Personally, I think he got rid of his powers because of COIE, but the storyline practically didn’t happen. The show gave no reason for why Cisco couldn’t be Vibe anymore in a practical sense. 

Also, according to the very reliable Vancouver paps as well as some production people from the show on Twitter the show doesn’t start filming until July 2nd. Maybe something has changed? Plus, it’s the same director from the finale doing the premiere. There may not be a time jump this year, once again. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, Trini said:

Sounds like the cast will be back in Vancouver next week:

For pre-production, I assume. I don't think filming starts until July.

All I get from this picture is Grant/Barry looks like a baby he looks so young!😄

[Trini]

7 hours ago, Kate45 said:

 Plus, it’s the same director from the finale doing the premiere.

Where is this info from?

 

Quote

There may not be a time jump this year, once again. 

Possible, but I think there could still be the usual time jump. The same director doesn't necessarily mean the premiere directly follows the finale. Plus, Season 5 ended in a way that didn't need to pick up exactly where it left off. (It's the only time the show has ended without a major cliffhanger, or in the middle of a scene.)

[BeautifulFlower]

From Matt's Inside Line Scoop

Quote

Have you heard anything about The Flash’s Caitlin Snow having a romantic interest in Season 6? —Clarice
A romantic partner? I cannot say for sure. But it looks like both Caitlin and Cisco will be making the acquaintance of a fellow scientist, since the CW series — in addition to casting this new baddie —  is busy filling the role of a socially awkward, African-American genius in math and science (who specifically is a bit obsessed with aliens and their tech).

We don't need another scientist on this show. Whether they are recurring or not.

[Trini]

(Jinx!)

From Matt's Inside Line:

Quote

... But it looks like both Caitlin and Cisco will be making the acquaintance of a fellow scientist, since the CW series — in addition to casting this new baddie —  is busy filling the role of a socially awkward, African-American genius in math and science (who specifically is a bit obsessed with aliens and their tech).

Is this going to be a character for STAR Labs? The CCPD? Another lab/company? Guest star or a regular character?

[BeautifulFlower]

Dude, it's quite sad that question for Season 6 about Caitlin was about her having a love interest.

Moving on. I'm happy that we will see a black person in STEM. I want her to be a woman, because there's barely any Black woman in STEM represented on Tv. Plus, we really don't need another male character

[Trini]

Another thing :

Does this mean that aliens are going to be in some of the plots next season? Or (fingers crossed) more crossovers with Supergirl??

Also, they always write Cisco/Caitlin/Barry/a random Wells to be able to do whatever "science" the plot needs (or they'll steal something from somewhere). So what is this new scientist going to add?

I'm glad for more minorities on screen, but I hope this character is a guest or recurring, because they can barely develop the minority characters they have already.

Crazy speculation: If this new character is a woman, what if it's Ralph's love interest, Sue?

---

19 minutes ago, BeautifulFlower said:

Dude, it's quite sad that question for Season 6 about Caitlin was about her having a love interest.

It's a fair question; she hasn't had a love interest for two whole seasons now, unlike every other character. (Not really counting Ralph, since he's new; but even he is supposed to be getting one soon.)

[SimoneS]

There are already too many people on Team Flash so I can't help wondering if this new African American genius scientist is going to eventually be Cisco's replacement. I agree that it would have been nice if they chose to cast an African American woman, but I will take this. 

[Trini]

The way Matt phrased his answer doesn't specify a gender -- although I'm sure he knows if it's a man or woman they are looking for. hmmmm....

---

BTW, Victoria Park (Kamilla) retweeted the The Flash account's announcement of the Season 6 premiere, so that could be a positive sign that she will make some appearances next season.

[adora721]

Why does Berlanti et al think that everyone in STEM is "socially awkward"? And why not make friends with Iris? Why does it have to be Cisco and Caitlin? Seriously? Like Iris won't be able to be friends with someone in STEM for what reasons? Once again, the classist, elitist writing of this show rears its ugly head. 

[SimoneS]

4 hours ago, Trini said:

It's a fair question; she hasn't had a love interest for two whole seasons now, unlike every other character. 

And this is a very good thing.

33 minutes ago, Trini said:

The way Matt phrased his answer doesn't specify a gender -- although I'm sure he knows if it's a man or woman they are looking for. hmmmm....

---

BTW, Victoria Park (Kamilla) retweeted the The Flash account's announcement of the Season 6 premiere, so that could be a positive sign that she will make some appearances next season.

I didn't notice that Matt didn't mention the person's gender. Would they cast an African American woman as Sue? 

I would like to see more of Kamilla, especially if she is working at the newspaper with Iris, but I am skeptical about what her presence means.

18 minutes ago, adora721 said:

Why does Berlanti et al think that everyone in STEM is "socially awkward"? And why not make friends with Iris? Why does it have to be Cisco and Caitlin? Seriously? Like Iris won't be able to be friends with someone in STEM for what reasons? Once again, the classist, elitist writing of this show rears its ugly head. 

I think the "social awkward" STEM person is a tv trope cemented by the Big Bang Theory. I don't think that Iris will ever have a friend. All her intimate scenes will always be with Barry and Joe. 

[Maverick]

1 hour ago, Trini said:

BTW, Victoria Park (Kamilla) retweeted the The Flash account's announcement of the Season 6 premiere, so that could be a positive sign that she will make some appearances next season.

 Unfortunately this isn't a positive for me as I couldn't stand Kamilla. 

[adora721]

47 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

I would like to see more of Kamilla, especially if she is working at the newspaper with Iris, but I am skeptical about what her presence means.

1 hour ago, adora721 said:

The actress portraying "Kamilla" is so wooden and lacks energy; she and Cisco have zero chemistry IMO. I prefer to see less of her unless her acting improves. I can't imagine she'll make a great friend for Iris especially compared to Linda Park, who had great chemistry with Iris.

[adora721]

50 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

All her intimate scenes will always be with Barry and Joe. 

I understand that Iris has the most intimate scenes with Joe and Barry, but for Iris to have no real women friends is awful and unrealistic for such a caring and charismatic woman as Iris. Iris had to go to the gutter to ask Caitlin Frost, who tried to help murder her, to be her MoH. That was insane!  I hope they make Sue Iris' genuine friend.

But if all they are doing with this new STEM character is repeating the stereotype of the supportive Black friend who has no life of her /his own so he/she can support Caitlin, I'm not here for it.

[SimoneS]

6 hours ago, adora721 said:

I understand that Iris has the most intimate scenes with Joe and Barry, but for Iris to have no real women friends is awful and unrealistic for such a caring and charismatic woman as Iris. Iris had to go to the gutter to ask Caitlin Frost, who tried to help murder her, to be her MoH. That was insane!  I hope they make Sue Iris' genuine friend.

But if all they are doing with this new STEM character is repeating the stereotype of the supportive Black friend who has no life of her /his own so he/she can support Caitlin, I'm not here for it.

I would like Sue and Iris to be friends. Sue is likely to get much more screen time than Kamilla.

I don't mind the African American STEM character becoming Caitlin's bestie because that would ensure that she continues to have no friendship or alone scenes with Barry.

Edited June 27, 2019 by SimoneS

[Trini]

3 hours ago, SimoneS said:

... Would they cast an African American woman as Sue? 

Now that I've thought about it more, I think it's unlikely. It would be too similar to Barry & Iris.

[Featherhat]

It's not uncommon for characters who would logically have a lot of friends to have none,  hence Caitlin was Iris's MOH. And STEM characters are "most easily" fitted in with existing ones. It would be really great for her to make a new friend though, whether this new character, Sue or both. It doesn't seem Linda Park is coming back any time soon.

I'd like to say they cast Sue as African American but I agree with @Trini it's probably too similar to Barry and Iris.

I can see why people are asking about a LI for Caitlin, it's been a while and she's had parent and KF plots albeit of highly questionable quality.

[Starry]

Provided that they tackle the issue of dating when KF is also inhabiting Caitlin's body, I wouldn't mind Caitlin getting a new love interest. My problem is that she already has a story with her mother turning into an ice meta. A family plot and a love interest plot is two plots too many for a character I want to see less of.

I think this new addition is a man. When they don't specify a character's gender or race, they always end up being male/white. And I wouldn't want it to be Sue not because I don't want Sue to be African-American, but because I don't want her to be a science genius. She isn't in the comics and I would like the show to keep it that way and to put her in Iris' orbit. I also expect Sue to be immediately linked to Ralph given the tease in the finale.

This new character could be Cisco's replacement or he could be introduced just to die in Crisis. Aliens are not a staple in the Flash universe. That part about him being obsessed with aliens seems oddly specific and a possible Crisis tease. I do like that this new science genius is black because black people in STEM are underrepresented and the one time they did make a black character, Wally, be in a STEM field, they made sure to point out he felt inferior to the white and non-black scientists.

[SimoneS]

I have seen speculation that the new African American scientist is Silas Stone who worked at STAR Labs with his wife, Elinore Stone in the comics. Their son is Cyborg. The Stones did research on alien tech and the Parademons which could be related to the alien tech in the spoiler about the character. His role could be part of the build up to the Crisis. That leak did mention Barry and demons.

Edited June 27, 2019 by SimoneS

[Trini]

12 hours ago, Featherhat said:

It's not uncommon for characters who would logically have a lot of friends to have none,  hence Caitlin was Iris's MOH.

It's a TV thing (however, this show is especially bad at this); you generally don't see too many people outside the main group, even though in reality a person is not always with the same 6 people all the time.

11 hours ago, Starry said:

And I wouldn't want it to be Sue not because I don't want Sue to be African-American, but because I don't want her to be a science genius. She isn't in the comics and I would like the show to keep it that way and to put her in Iris' orbit. I also expect Sue to be immediately linked to Ralph given the tease in the finale.

Sue being a scientist would be a big twist on the character.

I'm also hoping they connect Sue to Iris as well as Ralph. She can contribute to the CC Citizen!

11 hours ago, Starry said:

Aliens are not a staple in the Flash universe. That part about him being obsessed with aliens seems oddly specific and a possible Crisis tease.

This was my take too. I'm not familiar with the comic story, so I don't know which comic character it could be.
 

9 hours ago, SimoneS said:

I have seen speculation that the new African American scientist is Silas Stone who worked at STAR Labs with his wife, Elinore Stone in the comics. Their son is Cyborg. The Stones did research on alien tech and the Parademons which could be related to the alien tech in the spoiler about the character. His role could be part of the build up to the Crisis.

This would be interesting! But I doubt it's Silas Stone since DC is already using him on Titans, and I don't think "socially awkward" fits his profile.

[BeautifulFlower]

Grant filmed them at the table read for 6x01 and 6x02.

Someone took a screenshot and managed to make out that 6x02's title is A Flash of the Lightning

Also looking closely, we can see that Sam Chalsen is one of the writers for 6x02.

DP osted on Instagram as well. We can't see 6x01 title, but the writers are Eric Wallace and Kelly Wheeler.

Apparently Lamonica Garrett is at the table read

[Velocity23]

Just now, BeautifulFlower said:

Grant filmed them at the table read for 6x01 and 6x02.

Someone took a screenshot and managed to make out that 6x02's title is A Flash of the Lightning

Also looking closely, we can see that Sam Chalsen is one of the writers for 6x02.

DP osted on Instagram as well. We can't see 6x01 title, but the writers are Eric Wallace and Kelly Wheeler.

Apparently Lamonica Garrett is at the table read

It seems he is skyping from the writers offices to the cast and showrunner in Vancouver.

[BeautifulFlower]

3 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

It seems he is skyping from the writers offices to the cast and showrunner in Vancouver.

I wonder if he's going to be ending scene to tease off the Crisis.

[Trini]

Wallace and Wheeler for the premiere - I like them, but Wheeler is new-ish. Did she get a promotion?

Can any one make out who Chalsen's partner for 6.02 is?

Well, if the Flash pun is in the second episode, maybe the premiere title will reference the Crisis?

Edited June 28, 2019 by Trini