S08.E01: Have a Little Faith

[gunderda]

Several reasons other than Bill wanting to avoid the family.

1. By having Zoey and Will baptised with the biological child, they're making a statement about family, that Zoey and Will are members of the greater family.

2.It was probably fun for the family of the bio child to have the event filmed and put on tv and they may have held off on the ceremony so their child could participate.

3. It's obvious that TLC wanted to film a family event and this this way there was more family there than could easily be accomadated at the house.

 

 

 

And isn't their entire family kinda spread out over the US? It's probably not real easy for everyone to get together, so instead of having family members pick and choose which baptism they can go to, they all probably just figured it was easier to do it at the same time. 

[demarti]

I am fascinated by the juxtaposition of all the heartache and all of the blessings Bill and Jen have endured.  They have so, so much to be thankful for yet have also been faced with difficult challenges and let downs since the day they were born. The grace they display when dealing with life's ups and downs amazes me every time I watch this show.

Now, having said that, I wish they would stop constantly asking the kids for kisses all the time! Jeez, we know they love you already!  I also think
Will does what ever he wants and doesn't really listen to either one of them. He is spoiled. Adorable but spoiled.

Edited December 4, 2014 by demarti

[joanofarch4]

I didn't say BILL wanted to avoid the family...  ;)

[joanofarch4]

As I say, I'm not a child development expert, but I am able to cut-and-paste, and what I read suggests to me that Zoey is also lagging:

 

At age three he should have around 1000 words (give or take) and will be a more sophisticated talker. She'll be able to carry on a sustained conversation and adjust her tone, speech patterns, and vocabulary to fit the person she's talking to. For instance, she'll often use simpler words with a peer ("I need go potty") but more complex constructions with you ("I need to go to the bathroom"). She'll also understand simple rules of grammar and use plurals and pronouns correctly.  By now, other adults, including strangers, should be able to understand almost everything your child says, which means you won't have to do as much translating."

Edited December 4, 2014 by joanofarch4

[Absolom]

I found the priest interesting and perhaps he enjoys baptisms thoroughly or maybe he put some extra energy into it for TV.  I don't find it odd to have delayed the baptism to a time when many could participate.  My boss's husband wanted all of their children baptized in his old home parish and they were all over six months old by the time the baptism and the travel could be arranged.  One that was similar to the Kleins was coordinated with his brother's child and boss's child was closer to a year old by the time of the sacrament. 

 

I believe those speech standards are probably for "normal, average" children and not for children brought up in an orphanage that was also a bilingual environment or for a child who was at least somewhat hearing impaired.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Absolom

[BizBuzz]

Shoot, I didn't realize I was developmentally delayed, I am 52 and I still say "I need to go potty".

 

::giggle::

 

Please let's stick to the topic of the episode here in the episode thread.  This is not an official note, just a suggestion.  Thanks!

[Foghorn Leghorn]

 

Will does what ever he wants and doesn't really listen to either one of them. He is spoiled. Adorable but spoiled.

 

I had to laugh and cringe at the same time in this episode seeing Will become bratty.  First Will opens the show with swiping water bottles off the couch and we hear them hit the floor and he has "the look."  LOL  Cute but bratty.

 

Then later on Bill is sleeping and Jen pours her coffee while we watch Will throw alphabet letters onto the couch repeatedly while Jen is shrieking to Will "are you throwing?  We don't throw!  Do you want a time out?!??"   Will's face is delightfully non chalant and he answers yeah to each bullet he receives.  Jen seems oblivious to his mocking yet replies to his affirmative for a time out "now I know you are mocking me!"......so?  She doesn't give him a time out nor make him pick up the letters he threw so I was wondering if the fact he was mocking her all along made that demonstration ok in her books.   

[Lillybee]

Bill did say that they had the baptisms all at the same time so that they family would only have to travel once.

[joanofarch4]

I'm sure his condition makes his back more susceptible to injury - Jen mentioned that they both have  characteristic spinal issues - but I wonder if it was really the gym equipment and not constantly lifting that "Tiny Ton," Will...  We heard him grunt with the effort each and every time, and we know Jen can't lift him...  Assuming they're caring for both kids on their own, that would involve a lot of heavy lifting...  I, too, have had sciatica, and I don't know how he stood it all that time!  Thankfully, my ruptured disc reabsorbed naturally.  And it's not "magical thinking"; nine times out of ten, it does, given time and refraining from any aggravating activities, but it seems he soldiered on.

[SistaLadybug]

I thought Zoey was only two.  I could've sworn I heard Jen say Zoey was two during the episode.  Well, wait ... I think she's celebrated her third birthday recently but she may still have been two at the time of filming.  Either way, I think there is a spectrum of "normal" (I hate that word).  I think Zoey communicates quite well, in both verbal and non-verbal ways.  Her facial expressions and those big old eyes speak volumes.

 

I speak rapidly and a lot.  Just a flood of words.  Somehow, my daughter was able to learn to speak well and properly.  She talks like her mom - quickly - but in contrast, she doesn't speak as much (she's an introvert, unlike me).  My ex-husband, idiot that he was, was sure that, because she's a southpaw, I'd never be able to teach her to write, being right-handed myself.  She has lovely penmanship and honestly, she taught herself.  I didn't even have to do it. 

 

That's all to say that: Children are amazingly flexible and resilient.  They learn what they need to know, sometimes because of their parents and sometimes in spite of them.  From what I can see, both Will and Zoey are flourishing.  They may have challenges, but who among us doesn't?  Despite the difficulties they may experience because of their short stature or speech delays or any number of other things, they have been blessed in this world - with a loving and stable family, both immediate and extended; with financial means; with access to the best of healthcare.  We all have the things that lift us up and the things that weigh us down - in the balance, I think these kids are doing just fine.

Edited December 5, 2014 by SistaLadybug

[SunnyBeBe]

I love the family, especially the kids. Each week, I feel lucky to be able to watch this family.

 

 I have a niece with special needs who is speech delayed. She's been in speech therapy for years. . She's 4 now. Progress was slow, but we saw a huge improvement this year.  She's about 2 years behind.  Will and Zoey's speech is concerning. i'm trying to be positive, but man,....it's concerning.  I'm sure Bill and Jen are very aware of it, but they are putting on a good face.  You do the best you can and move forward. That's all you can do.  I feel for them.

[ZoloftBlob]

Zoey turned three in septemeber or october of this year so some of the filming was done before she turned three and some after.

[Jellybeans]

The timeline is a bit off (as seen with Jen's hair) so it is hard to tell what when happened. Bill has fully recovered from his surgery per Twitter, and on this episode I noticed his weight changed several times.

[eributterfly]

I am confused Bill is saying that his back,problem is a reminder of being a little person but, didn't the injury come about from him lifting something that was probably to heavy for him?

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I am confused Bill is saying that his back,problem is a reminder of being a little person but, didn't the injury come about from him lifting something that was probably to heavy for him?

 

He said he used a kettlebell incorrectly and felt something snap/crackle or pop in his back and of course he already had compressed spinal discs because he is a little person.  Kettlebells require much more control than regular dumbbells because of the momentum and swinging motion that occurs.  Bill is not an agile person and has had both of his hips replaced further reducing his mobility.  Attempting to control a kettlebell should have been contraindicated and I hope he wasn't paying a personal trainer who should have known better.  I am a certified personal trainer.  

 

I am sure he is reminded of his many surgeries because he is a little person however this one was a direct result of inappropriate weight training. 

Edited December 6, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[BitterApple]

 Bill is not an agile person and has had both of his hips replaced further reducing his mobility.  Attempting to control a kettlebell should have been contraindicated and I hope he wasn't paying a personal trainer who should have known better.  I am a certified personal trainer.  

I was going to say, if he isn't working out with a professional, he probably should be.

 

Regarding Will, I'm happy to see the improvement in his speech, but to me he is extremely immature for his age. Throwing blocks and sucking his thumb is something a two year-old does, not a four year-old. I don't think it's necessarily due to any fault of Bill or Jen's, he just seems pretty far behind developmentally.

[EmmeRose]

I knew little Will (then known as Josiah, I believe) was in very bad shape when rescued by the New Day Foster Home.  Considering that the poor little one was being starved to death, it is easy to see why he is delayed.  However, I think his speech is improving tremendously.  I give Jen and Bill credit for loving him and being patient with him and giving him toys and trips, etc.  I wonder if New Day ever discovered who Will's birth parents are.  They should be put in prison!

[Barb23]

My theory on the editing is that there isn't a whole lot of episode-worthy material here. It seems almost like a random compilation of snapshots taken whenever they could capture a smile from Will or a quizzical look from Zoey or, of course, a publicity gig like going to Washington to lobby for legislation (not exactly "kids doing normal things" in my book). With multiples who will not be named, you could pretty much just set up a camera and leave the room and we'd have an hour of cute comments and interactions (who can forget "Hannah's underwears" or "I can't see sheep"?). Here, there's sure not a lot of dialogue, even with Zoey who - at age three - should be talking, and not just in monosyllabic responses to Jen's interrogation. So I think they link together whatever useable footage they glean from who knows how many hours and hours of taping to elicit the desired response from the viewers. Or at least that's what it looks like.

"Hannah's underwears" is one of my all time favorite lines. I still laugh when I think about it.

Regarding Jen's fast talking. I'm a fast talker as is my son. I also talk loudly on the phone, even tho I don't have a hearing problem. I try to slow it down & talk more quietly. I am a nervous type person & maybe that has something to do with it.

[mtnrunner]

I knew little Will (then known as Josiah, I believe) was in very bad shape when rescued by the New Day Foster Home.  Considering that the poor little one was being starved to death, it is easy to see why he is delayed.  However, I think his speech is improving tremendously.  I give Jen and Bill credit for loving him and being patient with him and giving him toys and trips, etc.  I wonder if New Day ever discovered who Will's birth parents are.  They should be put in prison!

 

Will was starving to death because the original orphanage he was in didn't feed him nor take care of any of his basic needs.  The orphanage probably got him when he was only a few days old.  This alone would explain his delay but when you add adjusting to a whole new language the barriers will add up.  Jen and Bill will make sure Will has any kind of help, therapy, etc he needs so he'll be fine in time.  

 

Honestly watching the season premier I think Zoey is behind as well.  My guess is we aren't hearing about her medical issues because Bill and Jen want to keep that to themselves as they are keeping things about Will to themselves.  She definitely has acondroplasia but I'm guessing other issues as well that are sensitive.  

 

The one thing I realized watching this episode is how they will "create" drama.  Given Bill's symptoms and how long it's been going on I bet they already knew the prognosis and he'd failed conservative measures so they knew surgery was needed.  So going to New York was to see the specialist they wanted to do the surgery not to receive a diagnosis.  Bill's dwarfism I'm sure complicates things but I was kind-of rolling my eyes at a lot of it because it's a road I've been on.  There is no way he went that long with those symptoms without already knowing what was going on.  It's been two years for me since my injury and conservative measures are helping so I'm staying on the course.  I feel bad for Bill cause a) that is a hard surgery b) I'm sure he did have to delay it due to all that was happening in their lives. 

[Absolom]

I blame TLC.  They want to hype the drama and yes in the real world Bill wouldn't fly to NY to get a diagnosis nor would he have gone two years without trying various treatment options.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I blame TLC.  They want to hype the drama and yes in the real world Bill wouldn't fly to NY to get a diagnosis nor would he have gone two years without trying various treatment options.

 

No question the network is after ratings any which way it can.  We have certainly seen our share of hyped promos only to find they are very misleading when it comes to showtime!  

 

I am sure Bill was treated at TCH for his pain and of course had MRI's there.  Having had herniated discs myself in my low back and more recently my neck I can tell you the treatment options are pain management (meds), avoidance of movement and/or massage/chiropractic/physiotherapies.  

 

I guess they didn't have a specialist in Texas who had experience with little people issues either.  Speak Now for Kids is a good thing but it also applies to them or they would not have had to leave Texas to get 'er done!  "Speak Now for Specialists!"  

Edited December 7, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[Jellybeans]

Most little people use a select group of doctors for their special care needs such as surgeries.

[NausetGirl]

I am fascinated by the juxtaposition of all the heartache and all of the blessings Bill and Jen have endured.  They have so, so much to be thankful for yet have also been faced with difficult challenges and let downs since the day they were born. The grace they display when dealing with life's ups and downs amazes me every time I watch this show.

Now, having said that, I wish they would stop constantly asking the kids for kisses all the time! Jeez, we know they love you already!  I also think

Will does what ever he wants and doesn't really listen to either one of them. He is spoiled. Adorable but spoiled.

 

Completely agree. These are two individuals who are truly believable when they say "We know how lucky we are to have all that we have.." Because they have been through the ringer and come out the other side.  I think both Bill and Jen are extraordinary in this regard.

 

Also agree that Will has pretty much gotten a pass for a LOT since his adoption. IMO, because he is lagging developmentally right now - which is completely understandable given his situation - both Bill and Jen probably view him "in a younger light" - as a younger child than he really is. If they saw him regularly in a group of other 4½-year olds - most of whom would at least be potty-trained and speaking better - they might realize how much he needs to make up. And would probably amp things up a little for him. Right now, next to only Zoey - who's half his age let's note - maybe things don't appear all that badly to them.  If I was in their situation, I'd want to think the same thing.  And they're not really bad. He IS making some progress and I think they're being extremely attentive to every aspect of his development. But in a few months, he'll have been in the US for two years and personally I would have thought he'd be further along than he currently is.

 

I do think they could help a lot in the area of his willfulness, which I don't think can be attributed to any developmental issue. That's a character trait that is just "all Will." One many of us have as well - LOL. But he needs to learn - and is fully capable of learning  - that Bill and Jen are the parents and the bosses - and that he needs to mind them. The pouting and refusals to obey need to be dealt with in a firmer way, in most instances. A 30-second timeout while one or both parents hover nearby, continue talking to him etc is not punishment. When he's naughty or belligerent and doesn't mind, he needs consequences serious enough to make an impression on him, to change his behavior. Make a toy disappear for a few days, perhaps. Or timeout in a corner chair, with no talking. And obviously it needs to be different than what they might do with Zoey - he's about twice her age. 

[NausetGirl]

I don't think Will's delays are Bill and Jen's fault either. If you go to New Day's website (the foster home in China who rescued Will) there is a summary about him. He was being starved to death and left to die. In addition to his orthopedic issues he had several other medical problems. New Day saved his life. Considering all this, it's not surprising that he is delayed. My only issue with Bill and Jen is that in light of these problems, maybe they should give Will a break, and keep him out of the public eye. I think he would be better served if they just let him have a normal life, like other kids.

 

Yes, there are a lot of reasons for Will's current problems and lags. And they all stem from the extremely rocky start in life that this poor lil guy got. When he arrived at New Day, he was approximately 3 months old and weighed, IIRC, just 6 pounds! Looking at that fact alone, he's just fortunate to be alive. New Day very definitely saved his life.

[NausetGirl]

Zoey turned three in septemeber or october of this year so some of the filming was done before she turned three and some after.

 

Yes, IIRC I think Zoey turned two In India, just before her adoption in October 2013.

[NausetGirl]

I noticed that during the Christening, Will's shirt tail was out. They had him dressed the same way on Easter. I wonder why they don't tuck his shirt in. It looks funny to have the shirt tail out with a vest on.

 

If Will is still wearing a diaper or training pants, I wonder if the "shirt tail out" look makes that fact less obvious. Not being critical, just wondering. I would not be surprised if potty-training was something New Day set aside for Bill & Jen. After all Will turned three right around the time of his adoption, which I understand from my friends with kids is the earliest you usually start with boys. I imagine training is somewhat easier in a familiar setting too.  Maybe the idea was - let's let Will become accustomed to us, to his new home & new bathroom in Houston etc, before we launch into something big like potty-training...

[ZoloftBlob]

Psst - potty training is one of the *forbidden* topics!

 

(waits for the ground to tremble and storms to rage, perhaps in the pool, which is also *forbidden*)

[NausetGirl]

Psst - potty training is one of the *forbidden* topics!

 

(waits for the ground to tremble and storms to rage, perhaps in the pool, which is also *forbidden*)

 

Oh dear, so sorry. I guess I can understand that. After some of the topics and innuendo I've seen, regarding the Duggars in particular, potty training does seem a little tame but I do understand the reasoning behind it.  Sorry - many apologies.

Edited December 9, 2014 by NausetGirl

[4leafclover]

I raised two boys and neither could keep a shirt tucked in.  Like Jen and Bill, we gave up trying and just let it go.  No biggie in the big scheme of their lives today.

[LazyToaster]

I always figured the shirttail out was a dress-like-daddy thing since that seems to be Bill's preferred style.

[mbutterfly]

I think it is the imitate Daddy thing plus their shared body types. Just my guess, of course. 

[Micks Picks]

Speaking of the water used at the Baptism, it reminded me of an uncle who got baptized a few years ago when he was, like, 92.  I was flabbergasted he hadn't been baptized before given the piety of his mother.  But I digress.  He could no longer drive and really wanted to be baptized in the Catholic church but couldn't find drivers to get him to services very often.  There was a paucity of Catholics in his area.  So he got baptized in the baptist church, and someone sent me pictures.  GOOD LORD THEY DUNKED HIM.  I thought at his age they might relax the full immersion standard  but they didn't.  Oh well, at least he got it done in time.

[gunderda]

Bill likely put off stuff with his back for valid (to him) reasons.  they went through TWO adoptions... getting them both settled in... then Jenn had cancer.... still trying to get kids settled in.... he likely felt his back was not a priority or told himself it wasn't as bad as he knew it was.  That's not uncommon for people to do.

[Absolom]

Bill likely put off stuff with his back for valid (to him) reasons.  they went through TWO adoptions... getting them both settled in... then Jenn had cancer.... still trying to get kids settled in.... he likely felt his back was not a priority or told himself it wasn't as bad as he knew it was.  That's not uncommon for people to do.

I believe that.  What I didn't believe was that he hadn't had it checked out at all in the two years since the injury and that to get it checked he had to go to New York.  He knew he was looking at surgery and had said as much in an earlier episode. 

[EmmeRose]

I really feel that Will's shirt not being tucked in has to do with his distended stomach, which is a characteristic of achondroplasia!  If the shirt was tucked, his stomach would be very noticeable, and I think they want to avoid that!

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I really feel that Will's shirt not being tucked in has to do with his distended stomach, which is a characteristic of achondroplasia!  If the shirt was tucked, his stomach would be very noticeable, and I think they want to avoid that!

 

This plus I don't think pull ups/diapers are conducive to having shirt tails tucked in, there is no room and it would also get soiled.

[mbutterfly]

This plus I don't think pull ups/diapers are conducive to having shirt tails tucked in, there is no room and it would also get soiled.

Well, most slender diaper wearers often wear tucked in clothing. That may be a factor, but I really think it is his body shape, much like Bill's. 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Well, most slender diaper wearers often wear tucked in clothing. That may be a factor, but I really think it is his body shape, much like Bill's. 

 

Well we know Will is not slender and he does have a belly similar to Bill's almost like it was inherited!  Bill tucks his shirt in when wearing a suit yet Will doesn't so them dressing alike ends there.  Will probably has to wear a larger shirt and they may have already learned the tail is fair game for soiling inside his "unnerwears!"     

Edited December 29, 2014 by Foghorn Leghorn

[Honey]

Who knows?  Maybe they had already retucked his shirt 5 times that day, and finally just gave up.

[mbutterfly]

I've wondered whether Jen hasn't wanted to tuck in Bill's a few hundred times before she gave up. 

[RedheadZombie]

Will and Zoey are absolutely precious. That priest sure did drench those kids, though. He wasn't very gentle about it. LOL

 

That priest did not impress me.  Not only did he practically drown one of the kids, he didn't realize that Bill or Jen wouldn't be able to hold the kids up that high, like a power lifter.  Then his stupid smearing of oil all over the parents' faces - yuck!  If you're the only priest in the world doing this buddy (which he bragged about), there's probably a reason.

[NausetGirl]

That priest did not impress me.  Not only did he practically drown one of the kids, he didn't realize that Bill or Jen wouldn't be able to hold the kids up that high, like a power lifter.  Then his stupid smearing of oil all over the parents' faces - yuck!  If you're the only priest in the world doing this buddy (which he bragged about), there's probably a reason.

 

I was quite honestly appalled when I saw this deacon perform the baptisms. He dumped much more water than was necessary on each of the kids, soaking their clothes to some extent, messing up hair that had been carefully-fixed etc. I've been to jillions of Catholic christenings and never seen more than a few drops of water sprinkled on the babies. Same deal with the oil - way too much was used, and that doesn't just dry up after a while like water. Must have been icky for both adults and children until they could clean up. Personally I think this deacon has a few issues of his own...

Edited December 31, 2014 by NausetGirl