Beth: You're going to miss me when I'm gone...

[diebartdie]

I am writing this in defense of Beth Greene, silly young woman who just wants to drink and sing and flirt. There is nothing wrong with any of that...well except the getting drunk part, that's pretty dumb in the zombie apocalypse anyway moving on. Look, Beth is only what, 18? Of course an 18 year old girl is going to freek out when her boyfriend and aunt (?) get munched by zombies, her emotions would be all over the place, even more than pretty much anyone else in CDB. I have a niece who is 18 and even without zombies wreaking havoc in the world, she loses her sh!t over the simplest things and then will turn around and be so awesome and level headed, it's crazy!

 

Beth loves singing and such a sad world as the one she finds herself in needs people who can sing or juggle or paint, creative people are always in short supply but they are truly the glue that keeps this sweet old word rolling so I dont see any reason to mock her for trying her best. I love that she sings and makes music in the face of such brutality and horror, for that alone she is very worth having around.

 

Beth had a sheltered life growing up with Herschel as a father with his bible belt understanding so now that he's gone (may the goddess whisper his name upon the wind) she's tasting what had been forbidden, alcohol and flirting with the dangerous biker guy. Being sheltered did not serve her well in that sorrowful world and that is part of why she tried to kill herself. I do not believe she did that for attention, I think she really wanted out of that shitty reality. I felt sorry for her then and I feel sorry for her now that she is seperated from her tribe.

 

Beth is a youngster, not fully formed so potentially she could be Carol v2.0 but with a better singing voice but I see her maturing more along the lines of Gabrielle, able to dish out violence but more inclined to find another way. I think she is a beautiful character with the kinds of reactions any normal 18 year old girl would have. Take it easy on the girl, she's still growing up, learning how to do this and learning how to just BE.

[SoSueMe]

Okay, you've made me feel like a big ole meanie. In my defense though, I think she's a lovely little actress but not for this show. She doesn't ring true. There is no sisterly chemistry with Maggie or romantic chemistry with Daryl (puleese). Every time she sings I feel like she is trying to launch a singing career for when she is written off the show. I see her being very happy and well cast on the Hallmark channel.

[kikismom]

 

 

Beth loves singing and such a sad world as the one she finds herself in needs people who can sing or juggle or paint, creative people are always in short supply but they are truly the glue that keeps this sweet old word rolling

 

 

 

"Do you have a camp? Could you take us in? We've been having a real hard time out here! I promise we'll pull our own weight! We can help you...my boyfriend makes dolphins and seagulls out of driftwood and I can make balloon animals!"

 

 

 

Beth is a youngster, not fully formed so potentially she could be Carol v2.0 but with a better singing voice

That's like saying Milton could have been Daryl v2.0 but with nicer handwriting. What's your point?

 

The only possible use for Beth is if they start an Olympic ski-jump team for the Zombie Apocalypse; she's got the stance down like a champ.

Edited October 15, 2014 by kikismom

[LilySilver]

The idea of Beth's character is interesting to me. At an age when a girl would be trying to define her place in the world, she is trying to define her place in the ZA world.  Of course, all the survivors are trying to figure out what it means to be alive, who they have and will become as a result of the horrors they have seen and done.  But she is trying to become who she is to begin with amidst all that.

 

It's natural that she would look to the strong man, the provider, the still-waters-run-deep guy who seems to be emotionally about her age. I'm still not sure if it was a brotherly thing or something else between them, but either way I think her feelings would be realistic.

 

As to whether she's a great actor...meh. Her character hasn't had much to do beyond that embarrassing singing thing.  She is a sweet, sheltered girl who believed the best about life and held onto hope longer than others did. She drug Daryl kicking and pouting out of his self-destructive despair.    I liked the scenes they shared and the personal things we learned about both of them, awkward as it may have been.

 

I hope she comes back to us stronger and more interesting, and then we'll see what the actor really can or can't do. I just can't judge her on what's been written for her so far, and I have to say that to me she's no worse an actor than some others who seem to be fan favorites.

Edited October 15, 2014 by LilySilver

[GreyBunny]

Come on, she's not that bad.

 

Yes she is.

[nodorothyparker]

Curiously, one of my biggest issues with Beth is one that is of the show's own making in casting.

 

They cast a now 30-year-old woman to play a teenager.  So the actress is automatically too old to credibly pair with boys in the character's own age and maturity range.  Yet she's playing a VERY sheltered and naive 17- or 18-year-old, which makes it really unpalatable to seriously contemplate her with any of our show's 40-something year-old leading actors who very much look like 40-something-year-old men, despite what Norman Reedus and his seriously scraggly hair might think.  Throw in that these men were supposed to be friends and peers of her father and the inappropriateness level just skyrockets.  As much as I hate trying to define a female character by her relationships to men, that's about all we have to go on beyond the fact that she's Maggie's sister and can take care of a baby and sing.

[Iguessnot]

I'm going to blame the actresses because her presence just bugs and she's not capable of any acting depth to overcome that perception. A lot a people were upset because they want to consider Beth a child in relation to Daryl. Except for my annoyance that the writers wanted to push the view that young and blonde are only things that matter to all men, the age of this physically grown woman didn't interest me. I think that scene with Axel in the prison is still valid now "I didn't mean no offense. I've been locked up a long while and, well, there weren't many women. You follow me? I mean, Maggie, she's with Glenn and you're a lesbian. I was just talking with her." As soon as he finds out that Carol isn't a lesbian, Beth is a distant memory.

 

For me, even after a couple of episodes featuring Beth, she's still not compelling. The only man for her is that Robot Chicken nerd kid.

Edited October 15, 2014 by Iguessnot

[HalcyonDays]

Think we can come up with a better title for Beth? (cause she's really not that bad...). Just you know, sometimes unsuited for zombie-world.

 

How about Beth: Sweet voice, sweet sister.

 

 

I'm open to your suggestions!

[SoSueMe]

Oh geez, I just googled. She's 29 in RL???? That just makes it so much worse for me. There goes any slack I was cutting.

[LilySilver]

How about "Beth: You're going to miss me when I'm gone....?"

[RedheadZombie]

I now strongly dislike Beth.  It has nothing to do with the fact that she's been mostly weak and sheltered - it makes perfect sense that Hershel and Maggie babied her.  When they reached the prison, it was very practical to give Beth primary care of Judith.  I'm fine with all of that.  I don't enjoy the singing, but I can tolerate that.  What I cannot and will not tolerate, is for Beth to be the break out heroine of the show.  First of all, the actress is perfectly lovely, but I saw her on TTD - she is just like Beth.  The actress herself is vanilla bland, with incredibly low energy.  She is capable of portraying sweet little mousey Beth who lives on the periphery, and rocks Judith to sleep. 

 

But the show made the incredibly ill-advised plan to make her a star, and test out Daryl and Beth as a soap opera super couple.  For me it began with the opening of the episode where Beth is narrating her diary.  A southern accent means (to the actress) you cut all the g's off of your words.  "From then on in, we were runnin', and hidin', and campin'".   Then suddenly Beth is pro-active and bossing around an almost catatonically passive Daryl.  She drags his ass around seeking to get drunk - something I never in a million years believe Beth would do since Hershel was a recovering alcoholic.  It was like spitting on his grave.  She then takes the time to break into song accompanied by the piano.  It was horrible.  It was laughable.  Throw in Daryl allowing Beth to almost be killed before showing any sign of interest, whipping it out and peeing right in front of her, and bitching about poor baby Daryl not having ponies ...... I wanted them both to be killed - stat.  Then to be increasingly disrespectful to Hershel (a man Daryl greatly respected), Daryl grabs Beth and roughs her up and scares her.  It was an utter miss for me, of both characters.

 

Some actors have the ability to elevate the acting of those they have scenes with.  I would describe AL, MMB, LJ, and SW, as that type of actor.  To my surprise, Norman does not have this ability.   EK (in my opinion) was not elevated by NR.  NR's acting was actually hindered by EK's inability to emote.  It's a damned shame, and I will truly have a fit, if Beth turns out to be the lone Greene survivor.

 

I do think Beth and Daryl are very lacking in chemistry.  It's difficult to interpret what we were to make of those Beth/Daryl scenes, because of EK's weak acting.  It came off as Daryl mooning over Beth, and developing temporary insanity - how else to explain answering the door to a horde of loud, hissing zombies?  He was in lurve.  Beth, to me, definitely came off as disinterested (at least romantically), and was Pollyanna-ing her way through The Walking Dead Musical.

[diebartdie]

What's your point?

 

Well my point is only that I don't think the CHARACTER of Beth Greene is all that bad. The actress is ok, not great, we're probably not going to see her win any awards ever but still, the character makes sense to me and she doesn't bother me at all. I wont be sad when she does die though.

Edited October 15, 2014 by diebartdie

[LilySilver]

I didn't think he was in lurve. I thought he was surprised and relieved to have found some degree of hope again. He was destroyed by the loss of the prison and his beloved friends, his place in the world for the first time in his life. She gave it back to him (or a glimmer that he could go on, at least).  I have NO idea what was intended beyond that for exactly the reasons you expressed. 

 

So, also as above, the character of Beth is workable to me.  Again, the actor's abilities...?  Who knows. If they give her something more to work with and she still falls flat, I'll know it was her limited skill.  But up until now I think the writing for the character has been variously boring, silly, and implausible so it's hard for me to say if that's the problem.  Anyway, I don't hate her with the fire of a thousand suns as some do.  I'm just...meh.  But I feel that way about Maggie too.  Neither of them does a thing for me.

Edited October 15, 2014 by LilySilver

[nodorothyparker]

Some actors have the ability to elevate the acting of those they have scenes with.  I would describe AL, MMB, LJ, and SW, as that type of actor.  To my surprise, Norman does not have this ability.   EK (in my opinion) was not elevated by NR.  NR's acting was actually hindered by EK's inability to emote.  It's a damned shame, and I will truly have a fit, if Beth turns out to be the lone Greene survivor.

 

This was my take on it too and I never knew what I was supposed to be getting from those two episodes either.  They felt awkward and embarrassing.  Norman is one of those actors who appears to be only be as good as the actor he's playing off of, which is why he shines in scenes with Andy Lincoln and Melissa McBride, arguably the two strongest actors still in the cast.  Emily Kinney seems to have about two settings as an actor, low energy/generically sweet and the more rarely seen shouty girl.  Scenes she's in where she's more than background always feel very flat.

Edited October 15, 2014 by nodorothyparker

[ghoulina]

My take on Beth is that I am fine with the character itself. I like the idea of a wide range of ages on this show, so a sheltered teenager could be cool. The problem, IMO, is the actress and the writers. Emily Kinney is a beautiful young woman and I, for one, enjoy her singing. She is a passable actress and would do alright on a show that doesn't require a lot of depth. But I just find her to really lack confidence and commitment. She has had some super emotional scenes, but they always feel awkward to me. Like she's really holding back. 

 

I also think the writers have a hard time writing for youth. I've had the same issue with Carl - some of the lines they've given him just don't feel natural, so they don't always have the best stuff to work with. This becomes an even bigger problem when you have a woman who hasn't been a teenager for a decade playing one. 

 

And I agree that there isn't any chemistry with her and Daryl. I don't even just mean in a romantic way, because I didn't see them going there anyway. But their scenes, for the most part, were just flat. So I don't really want to see some big reunion with them. 

[HalcyonDays]

How about "Beth: You're going to miss me when I'm gone....?"

 

I like this one actually. Because one can read it straight, or very tongue in cheek....

[ghoulina]

I like it as well, I think it's perfect for Beth.

[RedheadZombie]

Here's a subtitle idea for Beth -  "I know you look at me and see another dead girl".  That's a quote from Beth in season 4, episode 12.

[Emily Thrace]

Personally I think there is a lot of chemistry between Daryl and Beth. Its part of drew me in to the show in the first episode I watched(30 days). Chemistry is very subjective, enough people (including Greg Nicotero) agree with me that I know I'm not alone on that one.In fact I think TPTB were surprised by how much chemistry the actors had and that's part of why Still and Alone seemed off.(That and Still is an episode about class writen written by someone privledged). I think Scott Gimple wanted a mentor/mentee relatinship but realized that it might not come off that way once shooting started and wound up doing rewrites, So we got a script that was going for ambigous and wound up just muddled.

 

I do think the character is somewhat hindered by the writing some of the lines are bad or just unrealistic. And it seriously pisses me ff that they they cut the scene from Still that actually explained why Beth wanted a drink. Cuz we seriously needed all those shots of Daryl kiling Zombies with a golf club but a characters motivation is disposable. Show, this is why you do not win all the awards.

 

I like the potential of Beth, she could easily be someone who is different from the other. Not a whirling, snarling badass, but someone who sweet and quiet but should not be messed with. They've screwed up six different ways with Tyrese's character it would nice to have a less agressive person survive and even thrive in the new world. I think Beth could be great example of someone who survives by their wits not their strength.  A point I think the show misses sometimes.It annoys me how often a show that supposedly is geared to fanboys often treat inteligence as a liability or weakness. (See Milton or Eugene).

 

 

 

It's natural that she would look to the strong man, the provider, the still-waters-run-deep guy who seems to be emotionally about her age. I'm still not sure if it was a brotherly thing or something else between them, but either way I think her feelings would be realistic.

 

Someone pointed out over on Livejournal that Daryl is one of the only available men around for Beth. I mean in thier current situation its basically Daryl, Eugene or Tyreese Who would you want to date? That's not to say that Beth would jump on Daryl because he's her only option.  I just think of all the issues with this relationship the age argument is probably the weakest. In the ZA "appropriate" goes out the window and this would be no exception. For one this is entirely a social construct a hundred years ago no one would have batted an eye at Daryl dating Beth and social norms are the last thing anyone cares about in the ZA.  For another good things and good people are so rare I can't really see anyone seriously objecting to two people becoming happier.  

 

I think more than Daryl makes Beth feel safe and in their world that's a powerful draw.I also think Daryl was probably the first person to treat her as someone who has a real opinion and that she should be listened to and she learned she has value that way. I also think Beth is very curious about Daryl and wants to understand him more. She's good at reading people and the fact that she has trouble reading him intrigue's her

[kj4ever]

I don't get the Beth hate either.  While she's not my favorite character in the world I think she serves her purpose and the actress that plays her does the best with what she's given.  I think a lot of the problem with people hating Beth is the want Daryl with middle-aged Carol and don't like the idea of him with the young pretty blonde.  Not EVERYONE mind you, but I think that's where a lot of the Internet grumbling about her comes from.

 

Personally they seemed more like brother and sister to me, but everyone has their point of view.  Dudes in their 50's marry 18 year olds, and I think Beth is around 18.  Before Daryl started growing out the hair he looked way younger than his years.  I don't see the age difference being that scandalous as I think Daryl is supposed to be perceived as younger than he is.

 

I'm actually really interested in the Beth character since those episodes.  Maggie was the fuck up of the family, and usually there will be at least one sibling in the family who responds by trying to never let their parents down.  I think Beth was that person and it will be interesting to see how she reacts without having that parental figure around.

 

What did the deleted scene say about why Beth wanted a drink?  I didn't see that one.

[ghoulina]

I think a lot of the problem with people hating Beth is the want Daryl with middle-aged Carol and don't like the idea of him with the young pretty blonde.  Not EVERYONE mind you, but I think that's where a lot of the Internet grumbling about her comes from.

 

Yea, that might be where a lot of the Daryl fangirls are coming from. Or Carol fans. But a lot of the posters here have likely not been huge fans of Beth since well before she and Daryl were thrown together season 4. 

 

Personally, if Daryl is going to be with anyone (and I actually detest the idea of everyone coupling up on this show, that would annoy me to no end) I'd prefer Carol, just because I think they have can really relate to each other and have one of the best bonds we've seen on this show. And I like that whatever is going on between them hasn't been all goo-goo eyed, like Glenn and Maggie. I fear if you paired Daryl up with Beth, it would go the goo-goo route. But I'm not super worried about it, because I'm really not certain that was/is the direction they're going with those two characters. 

 

I do think Beth was good for Daryl; he was practically catatonic after the fall of the prison. I like that she tries to stay hopeful and keep going. Their time together was very cathartic for both of them, but I don't think that means they have to start bumping uglies now. I still see more of a brother-sister thing, but we'll see.....

[JackONeill]

A lot's been said already, but I did want to cast my vote: I like Beth.  (Yes, maybe the actor isn't the strongest; then again, I don't see a single Laurence Olivier in the whole cast.  No offense meant.)

 

Like someone said above and I hope I'm not misconstruing, but I like what the character represents.  Someone young (not as young as Carl) who knew family and saw it all ripped to hell and back.  She's not a fighter (like Rick and Daryl) or street savvy (like Glenn and some of the others).  But she's learned to survive, but not in the superwoman-Carol way.  I hope to see her make it to the end.

[diebartdie]

I don't see why anyone would really choose the monogamous route in the za anyway?

[bosawks]

I am not a Beth fan I think she's a putz, can you picture her trying to fight along with the rest of them exiting the train car, but the things that Daryl did that annoyed me in their little storyline excursion last season I lay strictly at the feet of Daryl.

 

I can point right to the episode that crystallized for me the idea that the character wasn't needed.  The episode Alone and comparing my interest level between her with that of Sasha and Maggie.  That Sasha/Bob/Maggie mini-arc was among my favorite things this show has ever done, the Daryl/Beth thing not so much.  Now it was helpful if I was watching on DVR and had some time constraints since I could just fast forward through all her scenes.

 

I find every other female character more compelling, even Rosita and Tara, and it will annoy me when one of them is sacrificed for Beth.  Unfair as it may be I'm almost proactively annoyed with her character because of this.

 

Hopefully they will write her better and Emily will act her better and I can change my mind but this Perils of Pauline crap is just, well, crap.

[GodsBeloved]

The only problem I have with Beth is the actress LOL

[Watcher0363]

Well I am one of those who thought Beth and Daryl had sex at the funeral home. Nothing wrong with that. Beth has been on the back burner for quite awhile. It is time she gets more screen time. I must admit over this last off season the actresses on this show have all glamored upped and become very physically fit. Beth (Emily Kinney) really looks like Hollywood glamor of the 40's and 50's.

[PunkyMouse]

I hate both the character and the actress. Beth on the periphery as Judith's babysitter was fine. But absent of that role Beth is a sheltered little annoyance who can't seem to believably adapt to the current reality. In this horrible, ugly world nobody gets to be young the way they used to. I cannot get past the fact that she was so desperate to "play" grown up that she abandoned Judith. It was up to Tyrese and the Crazy Kids to save her.

EK is just not a good actress. Her accent is worse than Lauren Cohan's and that's saying a lot. Her moony-eyed portrayal of Beth is grating, and the show comes to a grinding halt whenever she is the focus of any scene. I just dread the inevitable, seeing which compelling characters are sacrificed on the altar of Beth.

[mightysparrow]

I don't like Beth because she was nothing but lawn furniture for 4 seasons and then suddenly she's an 'important' character.  Based on what?  Also, Emily Kinney is a dreadful actress and I resent any time I have to spend watching her in waaaaaaaaaay over her head.

 

I'm not one of the people who want to see Daryl with 'middle-aged' Carol.  I don't care for Carol either.  And I think that it's ironic that Beth fans claim that anyone who dislikes the character is some past-it crone who want the stud for themselves.  Does that mean that Beth fans are airhead, teenyboppers who don't have a clue?  I can't speak for anyone else, but my dislike of Beth has nothing to do with Daryl.  Beth is a crappy enough character on her own, she doesn't need help.

[Constantinople]

I don't really like or dislike Beth, but I can't take the character seriously given how often her own sister forgets about Beth's existence.

[SoSueMe]

I don't like Beth because she was nothing but lawn furniture for 4 seasons and then suddenly she's an 'important' character.  Based on what?  Also, Emily Kinney is a dreadful actress and I resent any time I have to spend watching her in waaaaaaaaaay over her head.

 

I'm not one of the people who want to see Daryl with 'middle-aged' Carol.  I don't care for Carol either.  And I think that it's ironic that Beth fans claim that anyone who dislikes the character is some past-it crone who want the stud for themselves.  Does that mean that Beth fans are airhead, teenyboppers who don't have a clue?  I can't speak for anyone else, but my dislike of Beth has nothing to do with Daryl.  Beth is a crappy enough character on her own, she doesn't need help.

Just for the heck of it I checked out NR's and MMB's bios. MMB is only 4 years older than NR. Regardless of his recently dyed hair, (it wasn't always jet black was it?) he is way closer in age to Carol than to Beth.

 

Even if there was no Carol I would find the Beth character annoying, unconvincing and badly acted.

[shang yiet]

A lot's been said already, but I did want to cast my vote: I like Beth.  (Yes, maybe the actor isn't the strongest; then again, I don't see a single Laurence Olivier in the whole cast.  No offense meant.)

Same here. Nothing wrong with Beth as far as I'm concerned. I'm actually quite interested to see where the writers take her. That's a lot of room for more.

 

I like that she's not a badass and now has to learn to make it without her dad and big sister around. She's a realistic character and there are and should be plenty of Beths around in a ZA world. Not everyone is a badass weapon-wielding samurai. I find Beth much more realistic than Michonne or Rosita for example.

 

As for the Carol or Beth debate, i vote neither. I don't see anything sexual between either women with Daryl, more sisterly vibes. I'm not interested in shipping so the real age of the actress does not bother me.

 

It's time for Beth to come out of the background now that her dad is gone.

[kikismom]

My dislike has nothing to do with the hookup potentials of anybody. If there was no Carol, if there was no Daryl, I would still be tired of this shit. Look at the metamorphosis that Rick and other characters have experienced, and she is seriously going on with the lady bug art and the Dear Diary crap...if she was in pre-ZA society she would be a person who's development froze in Marcia Brady ---Beth never levels up no matter what happens around her.

 

 

How about "Beth: You're going to miss me when I'm gone....?"

How about the old country-western song title:

"How Can I Miss You If You Won't Go Away?"

Edited October 15, 2014 by kikismom

[LilySilver]

My dislike has nothing to do with the hookup potentials of anybody. If there was no Carol, if there was no Daryl, I would still be tired of this shit. Look at the metamorphosis that Rick and other characters have experienced, and she is seriously going on with the lady bug art and the Dear Diary crap...if she was in pre-ZA society she would be a person who's development froze in Marcia Brady ---Beth never levels up no matter what happens around her.

 

 

How about the old country-western song titile:

"How Can I Miss You If You Won't Go Away?"

Beth has never leveled up no matter what has happened, until now. I thought that was the development that they were shooting for with the Beth/Daryl-centric episodes.  She acknowledges that she has been focused on, and fighting to, maintain her rosy view of the world, her hope that they could just have futures and happiness and maintain it all.  Since I hoped (even knowing that obviously in a t.v. show they couldn't do it) they could stay safe and settled and form a real community at the prison too, I get that. 

 

So to me it seemed the writers understood who Beth had been in terms of the series and in viewers' eyes, and they were ready to develop her beyond that.   Any question of what was going on with her and Daryl, exactly, was by far secondary.  She just saw her dad get decapitated. They just lost everyone they loved and every bit of safety they'd had, which they had worked hard to build.  Her delusions had been destroyed very literally.

 

 Honestly, it would seem odd to me if they were thinking about sex at all. They were thinking about survival, both physically and emotionally, and weak little Beth was the one who saved Daryl in that sense.  I'm not a huge fan of the character, and I don't ship ANYONE in the ZA (gross), but that's interesting enough to me.

 

ETA: Okay, I ship Rick and Michonne a little.

Edited October 15, 2014 by LilySilver

[NurseGiGi]

I'm not a shipper, either, and really have no interest in anyone's sweet baboo crap.  The worst thing that ever happened to Glen's character was having him hook up with Maggie.  Now he's just an extension of Maggie instead of the cool guy he was in season one.  I'm getting off topic, though.  I just don't like Beth.  I don't like the actress and don't like the way she's been written and I gag a little each time she sings.  Maybe something will happen this season that changes my mind but I don't think that's likely.

[kikismom]

I tried to subvert a shipper thread; my plan was to have Beth based on the lazy girl who slept with one guy or another on Utopia, and all the other characters in TWD would be inhabited by the contestants on Utopia. But I discovered shippers don't have a sense of humor. At all.

[LilySilver]

Right. That shit ain't funny.  We're talking about love. True love.

[JackONeill]

For the record: although I'm a pepper, I'm not a shipper.  (It will take people of a certain age to get the "pepper" comment.  Of course, the way I used it NO ONE may get it.)

Seriously, I don't watch this show to see who's in LUUUUVVVVVV.

 

And I still like Beth.

And I still wonder why no one's gotten poison ivy in all the wrong places.

[NurseGiGi]

*raises hand*  Yep, I got the pepper comment.

 

And I've been wondering about the poison ivy, too.  Actually, it's really been gnawing at me wondering where they were going to do their business at the prison.

Edited October 15, 2014 by NurseGiGi

[bosawks]

Speaking of the song stylings of our "beloved" chanteuse do we have a music thread yet?

[LilySilver]

Thanks a lot for the earworm JackONeill!! That one's going to be with me for a few days.

If anyone was to be thinking of love, true love, during the ZA, I guess it would be the young folk.  Still, even they should be hardened by now (and not in the sexy way).  I just can't imagine thinking about sex for several levels of reasons, but maybe biology would take over and overcome my objections, which are:

 

1)  Peee-yeeewwhh.  You stink.  Your breath stinks, your hair stinks, your crusty body stinks, and your beard stinks (because if it was gonna happen, it'd be with Rick, of course. Mmmhmm.)

 

2)  I like you. I care about you.  Sometimes I go a little crazy thinking about how hard it will be to watch a walker chomp on you and have to shoot you in the head myself.  If I tap that, I won't be able to tap that when I need to to keep you from turning, KWIM?  So we're good? Okay. Good. Get off me, Dirty.

 

3)  Pregnancy in the ZA.  Only women too stupid to live would go there.  Lori.

 

4)  If we break up, it's going to be beyond awkward and I'm going to have to find another group. Pain in the ass and I'll have to pack all my stuff. And thangs.

 

5) No privacy.  Are you a screamer?  Obvious issues there.

 

There are more reasons not to get entangled - it seems to me that the "grown-ups" would see the downsides and avoid those sorts of complications....Bob and Sasha, watcha doin'?!

 

Do we know if Beth was getting busy with the boyfriend she refused to get too attached to? From that episode (was it "30 days") we see that even Beth has enough sense to know getting too attached to someone is not smart. 

 

Anyway, I just never got the sense that she was going there with Daryl. She needed to process, in some way, where she'd been, what they'd seen and endured. Daryl was with her and had his own issues, and it got personal and interesting (though AWKWARD) on a level we hadn't seen before.  What would this show be if they'd moved closer....and closer....and ended up writhing on the floor next to the puddle of pee?!  It would just be incongruous with the characters of Beth  & Daryl to say nothing of the tone of the show.

Edited October 15, 2014 by LilySilver

[Ocean Chick]

I like the idea of a character like Beth - young woman coming of age during the ZA.  I just have some of the same problems with Beth/EK, that some of you others have pointed out.  I know they cast EK, who's nearly 30 now, as a teenager, and that her lack of acting skills weren't a problem back in Season 2, as she was just intended to be a red shirt taking up space in the background until it was time for her to die.  But show runners got changed and story lines got changed and I think Beth got overlooked for a bit.  And suddenly there they were, with Beth still alive and taking up space and needing something to do.  And Gimple was faced with critics talking about the poor use of women on the show.  So he has to build up the few he's got.  So Carol gets storylines and arcs, and because MMB is a fine actress, that's all good.  But EK?  Not so much.  She's limited as to what she can do.  She'd be fine in a CW show - she's very beautiful and young looking.  But when you have a cast full of people like AL, SW, MMB and DG, it really shows her limits.

 

I didn't see any sparks/chemistry between EK and NR, for what it's worth.  And that's good, as the thought of a 40+ man and an 18 year old girl is squicky.  It's Jerry Springer/Maury Povich types of squick.  If Daryl hunts for Beth, it'll be the same as when he was hunting for Sophia.  For Beth's sake.  And a bit of his own, as Beth was lost on HIS watch.  But I'm not seeing any type of "epic romance" forming.  This is TWD, not a Disney or Hallmark movie.

[mightysparrow]

I like the idea of a character like Beth - young woman coming of age during the ZA.  I just have some of the same problems with Beth/EK, that some of you others have pointed out.  I know they cast EK, who's nearly 30 now, as a teenager, and that her lack of acting skills weren't a problem back in Season 2, as she was just intended to be a red shirt taking up space in the background until it was time for her to die.  But show runners got changed and story lines got changed and I think Beth got overlooked for a bit.  And suddenly there they were, with Beth still alive and taking up space and needing something to do.  And Gimple was faced with critics talking about the poor use of women on the show.  So he has to build up the few he's got.  So Carol gets storylines and arcs, and because MMB is a fine actress, that's all good.  But EK?  Not so much.  She's limited as to what she can do.  She'd be fine in a CW show - she's very beautiful and young looking.  But when you have a cast full of people like AL, SW, MMB and DG, it really shows her limits.

 

I didn't see any sparks/chemistry between EK and NR, for what it's worth.  And that's good, as the thought of a 40+ man and an 18 year old girl is squicky.  It's Jerry Springer/Maury Povich types of squick.  If Daryl hunts for Beth, it'll be the same as when he was hunting for Sophia.  For Beth's sake.  And a bit of his own, as Beth was lost on HIS watch.  But I'm not seeing any type of "epic romance" forming.  This is TWD, not a Disney or Hallmark movie.

 

Great comment!!!

[Watcher0363]

A soliloquy of self affirmation (Or how Beth survived the ZA)

 

I am the Beth, do not hate the Beth.

Do not hate the young Beth.

Do not hate the beautiful Beth.

Do not hate the blonde Beth.

 

I am the Beth, maker of sweet songs.

I sing among the throngs.

I would let Daryl win at beer pong.

I would let Daryl remove my thong.

 

I am the Beth, I rather like being the Beth.

A young, beautiful, blonde,

who can wear a thong,

while singing a song.

I rather like being the Beth. I am the Beth.

[ghoulina]

cannot get past the fact that she was so desperate to "play" grown up that she abandoned Judith. It was up to Tyrese and the Crazy Kids to save her.

 

I didn't think Beth abandoned Judith? In fact, I thought that was why she got off the bus in the first place, to go find her? They weren't together when shit went down and everyone decided to leave. Or do you mean the fact that she came outside during the stand-off and left Judith inside? That I don't have a problem with. Beth can at least shoot a gun, and they probably needed all hands on deck. Lizzie and Mika were old enough to watch an infant for a little while. So they were the ones that had the baby, not Beth. Beth never had her in that scenario, but she did try to go and find her, and that's how she got separated from the bus and wound up with Daryl. 

 

 

edited: because who the fuck is Ben?

Edited October 15, 2014 by ghoulina

[diebartdie]

Meh, I dont like the new title of this thread.

[kikismom]

 

1)  Peee-yeeewwhh.  You stink.  Your breath stinks, your hair stinks, your crusty body stinks, and your beard stinks (because if it was gonna happen, it'd be with Rick,

http://content.clearchannel.com/cc-common/mlib/15197/02/15197_1393279748.jpg

 

 

 

4)  If we break up, it's going to be beyond awkward and I'm going to have to find another group. Pain in the ass and I'll have to pack all my stuff. And thangs.

 

 

If I break up with someone, they will be the one who has to find another group and pack their stuff. And thangs. And that will be awkward...for that someone. It won't be awkward for me at all.

 

 

 I just can't imagine thinking about sex for several levels of reasons, but maybe biology would take over and overcome my objections

It isn't even a ZA now and there have been at least 5 men on this show that can be as dirty as they wanna be and I would like to drink their bathwater.

Edited October 15, 2014 by kikismom

[kelnic86]

I'll join in on the "I like Beth" train. I like badass females like Michonne and Carol just as much as anybody else, but I also like the sweet innocence that Beth brings to the show. I think it offers a nice balance to a show that's become filled with so many characters that have hardened over the years. I think it takes a lot of strength to remain hopeful in this world. I admired her for how after being separated from everyone and seeing her father get beheaded right in front of her eyes, she didn't sit around feeling depressed. She found a reason to keep living and keep believing. I don't see her as weak (mentally) because of that. To me, she came off incredibly strong-willed. Sure, she's not the strongest physically of the bunch, but I don't hate her because of that. I also don't have a problem with Emily Kinney, however limited her acting skills may or may not be.

 

I also like her dynamic with Daryl. I don't ship anyone on TWD. But I do think they have a sweet chemistry. I like how she allowed him to have hope and brought out a softer side of Daryl that we never got to see before. I liked how he was toughening her up by showing her how to track, use his crossbow, kill a few walkers by herself. For two people who are such polar opposites, I liked how they balanced each other out. I thought they complimented each other nicely. But that's just my opinion on the matter. I know mileage varies and all.

 

Anyway, I'm interested to see how her character develops even further in season 5. Now, that she's alone and without Daryl, I'd like to see how she's going to adapt to this new place that she's in. I think (I hope) we'll get to see more of that strong side of Beth that I saw last season. 

Edited October 15, 2014 by kelnic86

[kikismom]

 I think it takes a lot of strength to remain hopeful in this world. I admired her for how after being separated from everyone and seeing her father get beheaded right in front of her eyes, she didn't sit around feeling depressed. She found a reason to keep living and keep believing. I don't see her as weak (mentally) because of that.

I respect your opinion and how strongly you feel about it. I don't know if any of us can be definitively right or wrong about some of these characters. (Except Gareth, anyone who sticks up for him is nuts.)

 

I would argue though that it would take a lot more strength for those other people to remain hopeful. It's a lot easier for Beth to be optimistic when she never left the prison. She hardly even went outside. When you don't have to be in the Big Spot getting snarling walkers falling like hailstones, when you don't have to be in a little car covered in walkers with a few hundred more coming fast and have to open the door and fight through it...She walks the corridors singing to a baby. She walks to the garden with a baby...not to work but to watch other people work. Etc etc.

Of all the human beings left alive in just America during the ZA, from what we've seen, nobody anywhere has had it as easy as Beth Greene. Including the Woodberries.

So many other characters hardened over the years?...because they had to see ugly things and do ugly things that Beth never has to...Bob was more upset about Zach than she was. She went into shock from seeing walkers get shot at the barn; nobody else had the chance to lay on a bed while other people took care of killing walkers and burning walkers. 

Now she didn't even have to be at Terminus. Yes she got kidnapped but it appears not to be by child-raping marauders or cannibalistic thugs everyone else gets grabbed by, but by

some people who gave her scrubs to wear and have her do hospital work. It could be worse Beth, it could have been a lot worse.

 

She finally has to kill a walker because Daryl sets it up for her and helps her, and she plays it like a carnival midway game: haha I got one! Pretty soon I can do bad all by myself. It's like it wasn't a rotting corpse that rips people apart till they die in terror---more like she won at Whack-A-Mole.

 

She hasn't developed strength IMO---she's developed attitude. I think that is more dangerous than helpful.

Guess we'll have to agree to disagree!

Edited October 16, 2014 by Dougal
Tagged what I think is a spoiler – correct me if I missed something. :)

[ghoulina]

I do think Beth is mentally strong, in her own way. She has come a long way. She started out being suicidal after seeing her mother and other friends and family mowed down as walkers. She totally lost it. Then just a few days later her home was destroyed and a close family friend gobbled up whilst holding Beth's hand. And she WAS on the road with all of them for those 6 months after they lost the farm and before finding the prison. 

 

I won't argue that Beth has been more sheltered than a lot of them, but she has not been entirely sheltered. She's seen some shit herself, and while she is never going to have the physical prowess of Michonne, or even her sister, I think she does have a tough, "keep going" attitude. When Glenn was sick and so many in the prison had their lives hanging by a thread, Maggie was devastated and Beth kept her going. 

 

If season 2 Beth had seen her father beheaded, been separated from her sister and everyone else but monosyllabic Daryl, she probably would have tried to off herself all over again. But here she is, trudging on, determined to find the others, and forcing Daryl to get out of his funk. She does seem, to me, to have a great deal of mental fortitude. 

[kikismom]

Dougal! It was in the Season 5 promo!!!