LilySilver

Agreed. All I could think was that it would have been so much more complex to have the candle flicker into flame just as Brienne learned of Stannis' presence, thus requiring her to choose and revealing so much about her character, priorities, and motivations. Just as it would have been so much more complex, imo, to have Thorne suspicious or even aware of the mutiny at hand, but not directly involved--showing perhaps some conflict in his face while he ultimately chose not to intervene. I wanted him to be more complicated than he was so that we could fully appreciate how serious and alarming John Snow's decisions would have been to men of the night's watch. Which would allow the viewers to more fully appreciate both John's courage, his likely naivete, and his ultimate prescience. Hum. The walk was well done but WAY too long. And the haircutting scene---did we really have time to waste in this eppy?! I would have preferred a minor nod to Sansa's strength as well, if Theon's final lines had been hers, or if she had grabbed his hand and led him to the parapet. Would have made a world of difference to me. I did find myself feeling unexpectedly proud of Theon, though in general I find him irredeemable and deserving of his fate. I do appreciate the complexity his character is given in competing loyalties, daddy issues, etc. I had to restart HBOgo mid episode and it just happened to restart seconds before Myranda's "fall". I wouldn't have chosen to view it twice, but have to admit I enjoyed it just as much the second time. WHY would Sansa drop that corkscrew?! (ETA, "Auger", correct. jfc. ctfd. "Item that might be used as a weapon and is marginally better than nothing" was my point. I know the difference between an auger and a corkscrew, and know that it makes absolutely no difference in this context. Breathe, berry.) Ugh. Not that it would likely make an effective weapon, but better than nothing. For that matter, why not pick up an arrow or two whilst hustling by barrels full of them? I just want her to be a little smarter, tougher. ETA: *IF* Stannis is alive, it's because Brienne wants to punish his accomplice in Renly's murder and will carry him to the wall where his king's blood might be of use...Maybe. Not sure I care anymore whether Jon Snow is dead, DEAD dead, or if L + R = J. Did we get the ridiculous prison scene with Bronn just so he'd know about the antidote and save Myrcella? God, when Ellaria kissed her full on the lips I was running for a wet wipe to hand through the screen. But no one in Dorne though anything of it?! Really lame.

Maybe she (like me) was just trying to forget Andrea and her story line altogether... ? I don't know. Benefit of the doubt?

You see this endcap at a home decor superstore and can't stop giggling. Wistfully, you wish your pretend friends from TWoP/Previously TV forums could be there to share the moment. You pay no mind to the other shoppers giving you the side eye as you laugh out loud and snap a pic.

This makes total sense. Although I would add that to me Emily Kinney comes across as younger than she is, as well, so that may have been part of it, and certainly part of why I felt worse for her than I might have someone else. She talks and acts like she is maybe 19, and not in a bad way, but she does seem emotionally young to me. I still think it's weird the way they interacted and wonder if they left on awkward terms....Most people (strangers) would have patted her on the shoulder or something, at the very least. Hardwick was beside himself, lol, and I would have loved to know what he was thinking. I guess what it comes down to is that Kirkman presents himself as enjoying the power he holds over the show, the characters, the audience. It's triggering for me, due to the whole "Lost" debacle where the writers were just too too clever for us all...ugh. Really, I don't need big payoff from a show once I'm invested, but I do want it to make sense and give me something to think about.

No, it's not his problem at all, but there is a basic human way to handle it, especially if it's someone you have worked with and who you wrote out of the show. I was uncomfortable that she was so upset to begin with, but Kirkman's reaction seemed like a 13-year-old boy's, not a successful author/screenwriter/showrunner's. It just irked me. It was so much more awkward for Hardwick to cross over to her to give her a hug than it would have been for Kirkman to just put his arm around her. Clearly the relationship (and the social skills) wasn't there. Anyone else sitting next to her, I thought, would have helped her pull it together rather than just sitting there with a weird look on his face. As for Emily, yes, I wish she had not been so emotional but I got the feeling that some of her upset WAS from sitting next to him. Why was she still so upset this far down the line? It does sound like she was abruptly informed of her character's immediately impending death. Is that how they always do it? Maybe she's just still mad about the way it was handled, I don't know. Sometimes I cry when I'm mad. Mostly I scream obscenities, but sometimes, you know, a little teary. Lauren Cohan was crying on TD when Herschel died, so it's not a first. I don't mind killing off characters either. I mean it hurts! But it's part of the show, as with GOT. And I have really liked some of the episodes Kirkman's responsible for. What I said was that I don't like him (as in he just bugs), and I don't trust him to do right by the characters/storyline long term. In his interviews he often seems to be saying that any character development is simply a manipulation to get to the payoff of feeling shocked or saddened by the character's death. Of course it isn't; of course it can't be. He has to get that as a writer. Yet it's what he heavily implies time and again. Okay, his characters, his show. But I think it's a poor way to treat an audience and a poor way to keep a show interesting, unless you think your audience is just in it for the shock and gore (which surely some are--just that I ain't). Add to that the apparent insistence that the show follow the comics, which I think needs to handled with an eye toward what the show *is* rather than what it's based on, and I don't feel very hopeful that the quality of the show will remain high. Or watchable, which is really the low bar I'm using. If the characters and their struggles aren't the driving force of the show, but rather just tools (looking at you, Major Moobs) and cogs in an endless stream of pointless plotlines--if characters are not written consistently and continue to be used as a means to an end, then it's just not interesting to me. Not that there can never be inconsistencies. Writing is hard! But the impression I get from Kirkman's interviews (and it may just be a miscommunication, but it's pretty consistent in the way he presents it) is that he sees himself as a puppet master, and he decides which strings to pull not based on choreography (characterization and crafted conflict driving the plot), but by which will give him the biggest immediate shock/pain payoff from the audience. 'Specially in a MSF, ya'll! I don't like it.

Exactly why I felt so awful for Emily Kinney having to sit next to him in the midst of her little emotional breakdown... "Smug" is definitely the right word, I and I don't trust him to do right by characters for whom it seems I have greater affection and respect than he does---and they are his own creations. I think it's weird how he giggles about how "everybody dies," and doesn't seem aware that it's those characters that keep an awful lot of us coming back in spite of the gore, instead of vice-versa. Not that I can't handle it if characters die--any of the characters, really, if it's done properly (properly for Rick would of course involve my weeping body draped gracefully over his as he confessed with his dying breath that he had always secretly loved me too...and I'd need creative input as to the lighting and music)--Kirkman just seems so callous to the human element of the story, and so jazzed and impressed with himself over the gore and hopelessness. There's nothing wrong with a zombie story that's just about horror and gore, but it's not something I would ever watch. No one who knows me can believe I watch TWD as it is--for me it's all about the humanity, survival, and relationships. Kirkman doesn't seem to get that at all. As he sat there on TD with Emily in a puddle of tears next to him, with that smug expression, I swear I wanted to jab a teensy pair of scissors into his...upper arm? Ha. Take that, ye basterd. As Nurse Gigi said, when they can't take the time and care to do justice to the the characters and opt for the quickest contrivance available just to get the quick payoff/shock value, I feel cheated. There has to be enough to bring me back in spite of the gore and the bleak outlook. Don't be lazy, writers. I can forgive a lot, but it's been a pretty steady pattern of sacrificing the integrity of what we know of the characters.

I was just coming here to say that. It distracted me to the point that Beth's death probably impacted me less than it would have otherwise. I'm trying to think of a production reason that it would have been so important to shoot the scene in the hallway, and to make the exchange in that manner, and with the entire "away team" right there together with no one left back if things went wrong? Not hardly. Not Rick Grimes. Yes, thanks Kikismom. I would think we'd be seeing other RV camps dotting the landscape here and there--it wasn't a bad idea. Or fortifications of suburban neighborhoods....I guess there aren't that many people left? I think I remember reading that the showrunners were assuming that 1 in 5,000 survived, initially. Anyway, they make it seem like everyone left is either helpless ninnies (Woodburyites, wards, FPP, and fruit hippies) or eeeeeevil. Or cartoony like our new folks (who are also ninnies if you ask me--except the lovely Miss Rosita.) It seemed like the group with Martinez was a little dumb, too, but within the range of normal until the Governor returned. Did all the good, solid, smart, badasses left in Georgia just happen to end up with Rick?

It's that question of balance--it wasn't the pace or lack of action at the farm that got to me (there was actually a lot of action; I binge-watched that season so I never felt as claustrophobic about it as some did), but the fact that it veered toward soap-opera, that the the speechifying was out of balance with actual, more natural, character development. But as I've said before, one of the top five most moving scenes to me was at the farm, with Rick yelling, "Brother, don't do this!" to Shane. I did think that the Shane/Rick relationship managed some nuance which was given in small expressions, a twitch of Shane's eye, Rick's anger at Lori, Shane's confusion and rage at being the one to sacrifice his humanity to save Carl....Gee, now that I think of that part of the season, I guess I did like the season at the farm. But not the speechifying. God, not that. And that was what more than half of this midseason episode seemed to consist of to me--mostly Dawn speechifying, then the other rapey cop speechifying, and even Tyreese speechifying. I think even new Bob speechified as he lay dying iirc. But I get that it's difficult to write nuanced behavior and conversations and be sure you're communicating what you want to as writer. Me neither, but continuing to take precious episodes to worldbuild with characters I don't care about isn't going to work for me. I guess my question about the series of Big Bads is simply why don't we also meet groups more like CDB along the way? It seems like some of them would be getting it (closer to) right. Maybe we're just unlucky in who we run into.... I know it would muck things up narratively, but couldn't we bump into a nice group of folks who would let CDB stay in their isolation cell for the night and then usher them safely along their way? Or something? Or evidence that such people had existed? In fact that was a complaint I had when the whole Woodbury thing went down--I would have thought that someone would have at least tried to put things back together. I guess Morales did, but then along came "Brian." Anyway, I understand the complications in trying to set up a functioning society now. Do we have to keep reviewing it? I hope not but I don't see an alternative. I liked Beth just fine too. I liked what she represented to the group, and to Daryl in particular. I liked that in that particular case, she did save him. I think she had value. But I wasn't particularly attached to her, and I have never really cared much for Maggie either, so it was only in the loss I felt for the other characters that her death particularly got to me. Oh, and having to watch Emily cry on TD was also excruciating. Sitting next to Kirkman of all people (why didn't they set her in the middle so that somebody could put an arm around her without Chris having to awkwardly cross the set to do it?!) She does seem younger than she is. I really share your feeling about things getting too dark. I had to work myself up to start watching again when the season started. Part of the reason I love Rick is that he is relatable--I like to think that he is acting and feeling much as I would do in his place, in general--certainly there are certain decisions where we diverge. (And I like to think I'd pay a little more attention to hygiene.) If he gets too dark or brutal, he will lose a lot of his appeal for me. I love Michonne but don't think she would carry the show for me (she doesn't seem conflicted at all; very peaceful with who she is and what must be done vs. what cannot be done), Carl grates on my nerves, Daryl...well he might could be interesting enough to keep me watching if he were a bit fleshed out, Tyreese needs to get off my screen now, I like Sasha as a stalwart soldier, FPP could keep my attention for an episode or two with his shirt possibly off (can I say that? So sexist.), Glenn and Maggie are boring, Tara is silly, I love Rosita, and Abraham is stupid. I still miss Merle. So I'm kind of relying on Rick here to retain his humanity, which is what makes the show watchable for me. If he isn't a little broken by losing Beth like that, he won't be the Rick I think I know. He will be too dark. I think the farm and the prison, though, did serve a sort of a touchstone for the whole "family". They had, for a moment, peace and relative safety. They had a home, they know it's possible, and I think they will want to find it again at some point. It's been shown to be nearly impossible to maintain, but maybe they could have a little bit better emergency meetup plan the next time, and just prepare for the next big Baddie to show up.

So I guess the big bads we keep having to endure are to function as character foils---"Here's where the Governor went wrong...Here's where Terminus cracked....Here's Dawn's overreaction/weakness...." as opposed to the fine tuning Rick, and the group along with him, have had to do. Yet all of those "bad" folks were able to sustain reasonable safe, stable existences more effectively than our group has done. I assume I'm supposed to come to the conclusion that being good is hard, and the only way to be "safe" in this world is to be evil... I just hope the show isn't always about the next Big Bad, though I suspect it will be. And they can't be on the road forever, so I'm interested to see if/where they make a new "home." How many times can the show explore the question of "how far is too far?" and "can you come back?" I really am interested to see where they take it, but I don't like nor trust Kirkman, and I do still have that "Lost" PTSD thing happening, so I'm wary as well and not getting my hopes up, especially after the past few episodes which have been uneven at best, imo. Who am I kidding? Rick shaves and Daryl gets a bath, I get a good solid 5 minutes of Michonne in an episode, and all is forgiven.

Agree with all of this. The thing about Bob's leg bothered me on the night of the big BBQ--seemed like all of them (were there, like, 5 or 6 termites there?) had a big hunk of meat. Does a human calf really have that much meat on it? I thought at the time... And now we see the leg and you can't even tell it's been eaten off of...Annoying. Usually I am just grossed out by how dirty they all are, but in this episode, the Rick Grimes' determination and focus were hot enough to overcome the (imagined) stench as well as my revulsion at that beard. Hot, hot, hot. I loved the kiss on the forehead, reclaiming Beth into the group. Darryl's reaction along with Rick's gutted me, but honestly the greasy hair and the filthy face are getting close to making Darryl's facial expressions impossible to read. The image of Darryl holding Beth's small, dead body had me sobbing, though. SO, the nail through Gabriel's foot was just so that he'd be slowed down enough not to be able to outrun the herd of walkers, thus leading them back to the church? Hum. So I guess he won't be dying of tetanus after all.... I wondered if Morgan had gone to the prison to find Rick (didn't Rick leave him directions?), then came upon Terminus and followed the marks from there? Kirkman's comments on TD made me worried--I was nothing but happy to see Morgan again until Kirkman suggested maybe he could be dangerous to our group. As for the talk vs. action--for me it's not that I don't like talk or character development, as I love both when well done. But as mentioned above, action can provide great character development when done well (as EVERY SECOND with Rick was in this episode) whereas endless jabber about the latest big-bad storyline has me in tears. Not in a good way. I just didn't care about the caricatures at the hospital. I do love the shot of the clean hospital hallway, with all of the wards choosing to stay put rather than go with filthy (hawt) Rick and filthy (just filthy) Darryl and their rag-tag, dangerous looking band. In fact that's the one thing I've enjoyed about this season, is being forced to look at my beloved peeps through the eyes of strangers. Gabriel is absolutely terrified of all of them (or was, until he realized that they had done what they had to do in reaction to what this world has become). Looking at them from his perspective, they do seem to be monsters. And in the hospital hallway, the stark difference in existences is on display. Do you want to claw and scratch and have blood all over you like those people? Or do you want to be clean and "safe" and put up with some bullying....and beatings....oh and maybe an occasional rape? For those not enduring the actual rape, the choice was probably an easy one. "I ain't going ANYWHERE with those people!" ETA: count me in for the "just can't" with Tyreese. He is going to get someone killed. Again. And this time it might be someone I care more about than Bob. The big blue eyes though. I might have to rewatch just the Rick scenes. Alone. By myself.

I was neutral on Beth, knew her time was probably up, but didn't want her to die. But what got me about it was Daryl's face and Rick's face. God, they just watched sweet little Beth, who they were so happy to have just gotten back, get shot in the head. Just like that. Right in front of them. Brutal. Rick's face killed me. And yes, Rick was especially hot in this episode. I think Morgan is still some time behind our group--the grass had grown up around the bbq pit, I thought. Yes! Who was it who called that the map would show up and Morgan would follow them? I love it!

oh, Thorin Oakenshield, yes! I'll follow you every time!! Wait. Sorry, distracted by the commercial breaks which are so far superior to this interminably slow storyline. I guess this is all so that we will find the final segment super intense and action-packed by comparison....great strategy showrunners! I feel like I'm getting screwed; don't I have some laundry to do?! Did love the "They're close," though. Heee. So deadpan Rick. Sexay, even through that silly fuzzy beard.

Ohh, here we go with Tyrese's moment of self awareness! Yay!! The most interesting thing to happen so far!! Talk talk talk. Action, pls.

Halfway into the midseason finale and I'm bored to tears and vaguely annoyed. Super!

As the walkers were pouring out of that building next to the firetruck, politely single file, was I the only one shouting at my TV, "SHUT THE FUCKING DOOR!!"? Morons.