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Rhondinella

By Rhondinella
in Downton Abbey [V]

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Constantinople
Constantinople

There is nothin' like a dame, Nothin' in the world, There is nothin' you can name That is anything like a dame! Penelope Wilton is now a Dame (of the British Empire).

AZChristian
AZChristian

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/kate-middleton/11466442/Kate-Middleton-visits-the-set-of-Downton-Abbey-in-pictures.html?frame=3229348   Fun pictures of Kate with the cast!

ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

Susan - that was hilarious.

 

I particularly love how Julian Fellowes is still griping three years later that Dan Stevens fulfilled his contractual obligations and told him at the start of season three that he wasn't signing on for season four. *Three years later* JF is still trying to play for sympathy.

 

Personally tho, I admit I would have loved the mystery of "why the hell were Matthew and Sybil out driving together???" :)

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SusanSunflower

SusanSunflower

(edited)

Yes, it is hilarious and also more than a little desperate ... gotta wonder exactly where in the storyline or even if Sybil would have had the baby in that case ... (I don't believe him but he loves the attention ... and damn will he miss it when its over) ... 

I remember the very first media blitz and, iirc,  Elizabeth McGovern got into trouble for saying something less than gushing ... and it became all.too.apparent they had all been told where they stood with Sir Julian ... which at that point really was something not worth jeopardizing -- parts of a lifetime or at least a chance to revitalize careers for the over-30 crowd ... No matter how good the money ... the boredom each must be extreme at this point.  I really expected Dockery to get some juicy scenery chewing scenes as a thank you for time served... She and Carson get rewarded by becoming loathsome in their final season ... jeez. 

Since then there have been ZERO complaints voiced publicly, even by Stevens (whose IMDB suggest a flurry of new projects in the works) ... Zero complaints except occasionally mention of taking a whole long day in costume and make-up filming and re-filming a 10 minute dinner scene ... 

My guess has been that the actors in many scenes are so "flat" is because they have to match re-takes for continuity ... a missing "hand on chin" in one version -- catastrophe, a missing smile or gleam in the eye ditto. Must be a laff-riot ... and the at-ease selfies don't prove anything, since I'd guess Fellowes and the production company is eager for all the Such a Happy Family of Actors publicity they can get ...  they likely have right of approval wrt release of same. 

Edited by SusanSunflower
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onthebrink03

onthebrink03

(edited)

Downton Abbey's Creator Wanted to Kill Off Two Characters in Matthew's Car Crash

http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2015/11/downton-abbey-matthew-death-car-crash

My God, Fellows is more of an idiot that I thought.  He didn't want Matthews death to dominate the Christmas special so he killed him at the very end?  Like that made any difference at all?  Like the final shot of Matthew lying there with cold dead eyes was not the dominate thing his loyal audience came away with?  Like it was a good idea to include such a scene on Christmas night?   Was Fellows born a moron or has he worked for it all his life?  Inquiring minds want to know.

 

Dan Stevens didn't spring his desire to not renew his contract and leave the show at the last minute.  He informed the show of his intentions at the beginning of his last contracted season.  Doesn't matter if Fellows had scripts written and casting done.  He shouldn't have assumed anything.  And to keep blaming Dan Stevens for the mess Fellows made of not only the Christmas special but the storylines going forward, is simply ridiculous.  Fellows is supposedly a writer.  Then write you imbecile.  Surely you have more than one idea rolling around in that head and if real life circumstances change, you can also change direction.  Dan Stevens owed his audience and the shows producers some quality work for the time he was contracted.  He gave them that.  People leave shows all.the.time.  To keep insinuating that Dan Stevens created this almost insurmountable problem is preposterous.  

 

And the Christmas special did not have to end with Matthew's death (shown so gruesomely so you knew he was really, really dead).  You could have had screeching brakes, sounds of a crash, people running  and left it a cliffhanger.  Still not the most cheerful of ways to end a Christmas night offering but it would have been far less grisly and the opening of the next season could confirm Matthew's death.  We could then see the funeral and the grieving of all concerned.  There were others besides Mary who suffered a loss.  Isobel lost her only son, Tom lost a close and valued friend, Lord Grantham lost a loved SIL and the immediate heir to Downton Abbey etc.  These were all things that would have made for some compelling viewing.  We got very, very little of that!  But of course most of the truly compelling stuff has always been off screen so at least Fellows is consistent if nothing else!

Edited by onthebrink03
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ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

Yes, it is hilarious and also more than a little desperate ... gotta wonder exactly where in the storyline or even if Sybil would have had the baby in that case ... (I don't believe him but he loves the attention ... and damn will he miss it when its over) ...

 

Sybil would have been having an affair post baby with Matthew and they crashed the car while kissing! :D

 

Seriously, I don't believe him either because in the same freaking article he's going on about how he got the news from Dan after the first five episodes where Sybil dies had been written... but JF does like to dreg it up and have the vapors over it, now doesn't he?

 

Since then there have been ZERO complaints voiced publicly, even by Stevens (whose IMDB suggest a flurry of new projects in the works)

 

Stevens has never appeared to be an idiot. I think he thought he was being cute and sarcastic with some of his remarks and got caught in a wild storm of rage and since then he's had nothing but nice things to say. Although you can pretty much tell he's tired of the why did you leave question - lately he's been answering it rather amusing with "why don't you look at the body of work I've done since?". He's also got no reason to badmouth Downton, his career is taking off - the Disney movie looks like a huge win for him - and if he *did* badmouth Downton... My sense of JF and GN is that they would run to presses to rehash yet again the betrayal and how Dan hurt them... whereas right now when JF pisses and moans three years later... it just makes JF look like a petty little dictator who got mad that some of the actors slipped their leashes...

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TheGreenKnight

TheGreenKnight

I personally liked the ending to season 3, but we don't see it on Christmas in the US, so that might make a difference. One of the few things I liked about series 4 was the opening shot of the Abbey looking similar to a cursed castle out of a fairy tale. It was probably the only series I actually enjoyed Mary's scenes (pre-suitors), too.

 

I could have seen Sibyl and Matthew dying together in the same episode, both riding to the hospital to see the newborn, but I'm fine with the way things turned out. Both characters received their due, Matthew's just happened to carry over into 4. It just comes across like a OTT grudge Fellowes is holding onto while Stevens has completely left DA behind.

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DianeDobbler

DianeDobbler

I'm actually okay with Matthew going off in the Xmas special. If I want to enjoy it, I have the entire episode and then just don't watch the end. Much better than only getting partway through and then the whole thing goes to hell. I liked it, all things considered.

 

Stevens appears to have told Fellowes he was leaving in good time ... but still not enough? Before S3, but after things had been cast?  I don't know; I think Fellowes had blinders on. Sybil/Matthew dying in the same crash - horrid idea. I also imagine really difficult for the cast to pull off - both Mary and Tom having to react - unless with both it was an ending shot of the Sybil/Matthew crash and we picked up months later. I do remember very few of the cast members covering themselves in glory while Sybil lay dying - everybody had to hover about the bed, Stevens gripping a post, while it went on forever and ever. Very enervating.

 

I think Elizabeth McGovern was a bit put out that she was one of the last actresses offered Cora. Cora being an American woman living in the U.K., and McGovern being the same, and the right age, she thought she should have been one of the obvious first actresses called. When I read that, I wanted to say, yeah but you suck, Elizabeth. I'd have called Gillian Anderson first too! And probably a slate of others before contacting your reps. At the end of the day she was good casting, not least because she looks like the mother of those particular girls, particularly Mary's mother. Blue eyes not withstanding. Height, dark hair, and extreme thinness and attenuated limbs.

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ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

I could have seen Sibyl and Matthew dying together in the same episode, both riding to the hospital to see the newborn, but I'm fine with the way things turned out.

 

Yeah but I think Susan has called it with "JF just loves attention". Since the protest has been for years that he had four or five episodes already written at the start of filming season three so he couldn't change a thing, this new story of how he wanted Sybil in the car with Matthew really feels made up. I mean really, the show is ending and he's married Mary to Henry Talbot and all JF wants to do is talk about Dan Stevens and Jessica Brown Findley leaving? I'd be a lil pissed if I was the current cast.

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Glade

Glade

Killing both Matthew and Sybil in the same end of season car crash is an extremely lazy and spiteful idea.  And Fellowes whines that he had already written the first five episodes--so?  Make some changes.  Sybil's final storyline sucked anyway.   Apparently at some point JF realized he had reached the limits of his writing abilities, got scared, and retreated into his comfort zone of lazy, boring, obtuse shortcuts, repetitions, time-jumps, abrupt endings and habit of leaving every exciting, meaningful scene to happen off-screen. And I think we all know that even if Gillian Anderson had said yes, there's no way in hell she'd have stuck around past season three either.

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SusanSunflower

SusanSunflower

odd -- that New York or was it Boston ? project isn't showing up on Fellowes' IMDB http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0271501/

 

Fellowes reminds me of Dominick Dunne -- except that Dunne, having labored in the Hollywood fields for years and years, never having enormous success -- had the good grace -- when he hit the motherlode late in life -- to be appropriately modest and grateful to have his later years suddenly and unexpectedly in the lap of luxury. Fellowes seems to have believed all those who gushed about his genius and then found himself either preoccupied with other projects and/or somehow paralyzed in the "sit down and storyboard" department. It was indulgent to let this show "waste" so much air time on stories (even seasons) that didn't go anywhere. oh well, what's done is done ... and he can laugh all the way to the bank (but that doesn't seem to be his personality) 

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ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

Dunne also had the tragedy of his daughter which often made his tv shows about the rich and powerful murdering people oddly poignant.

 

I have noticed that talk of the prequel/completely separate show set in the 1890s or whatever, in NY or Boston, have pretty much died. Methinks someone doesn't like the American way of filming. A lot of the "this is my work, you shall not alter it" stuff just isn't going to play in the States.

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SusanSunflower

SusanSunflower

(edited)

Gilded Age is back "in development" and he's written (it's shooting now) a 3-part miniseries of Trollope's Dr. Thorne ... yawn.  I love Trollope ... he's done a lot of adaptations I've never seen  except he did "Vanity Fair" which managed, as I recall, to lose a lot of the raised-eyebrow humor as it turned Becky into a less-complicated, more likeable, vaguely proto-feminist character ...when in fact she was a wonderfully wicked selfish social climber (in the mold of Scarlet O'Hara but much much more outrageous) ...  In the pretty to look at -- but that's not really how the story goes -- mold of Knightley's P&P 

Edited by SusanSunflower
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Andorra

Andorra

(edited)

I would have liked Sybil and Matthew dying simultanously, because it would have given Tom and Sybil at least a little bit opportunity to be together as parents. They got sidelined from the start, with one scene after the next for them cut so that only the repetitive garage scenes remained. We didn't see their wedding and then Sybil died without even talking to Tom after the Baby was born. She just sat there silent and smiling. If she had lived, we would have seen them a little bit together and it would have been nice for the fans of that couple, who didn't really get anything else.

 

Sybil's death scene was so much better written than Matthew's death though, so in retrospect I can appreciate it, that Sybil got a reall gritty death scene and that Allen especially had opportunity to shine in it. 

 

Aside from that I liked how Matthew died on Christmas eve. It was so shocking and I actually had to laugh, because the Mary/Matthew fans were in agony weeks before and in total denial. They said it was impossible that they would kill Matthew and when the Sybil/Tom fans pointed out "Look what happened to us! It IS possible and Dan Stevens was one of the actors that Ausiello mentioned who had not signed their contracts", they said "no way!" and that he was so much more important than Sybil and that he was the core of the show etc. 

 

And then they did it and I sat there and thought: "Oh my god, those Matthew/Mary fans are going to kill Julian Fellows!"

Edited by Andorra
Brn2bwild

Brn2bwild

Dunne also had the tragedy of his daughter which often made his tv shows about the rich and powerful murdering people oddly poignant.

 

I have noticed that talk of the prequel/completely separate show set in the 1890s or whatever, in NY or Boston, have pretty much died. Methinks someone doesn't like the American way of filming. A lot of the "this is my work, you shall not alter it" stuff just isn't going to play in the States.

 

I don't know that "when Robert met Cora" is terribly compelling television.  It might have been if their relationship were more complicated.

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ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

I don't know that "when Robert met Cora" is terribly compelling television.  It might have been if their relationship were more complicated.

 

Ah but there is the rub. Robert and Cora did not have a love match at all. Remember, there's at least one episode where its mentioned that they didn't actually fall in love until they were married for a year. There's also some suggestion and outright statement at times that Robert has an American wife because he was offered an ass ton of money to marry her... and her family was looking to legitimize themselves  and shake off the Jewish ancestry.

 

I mean, there were some dramatic possibilities there, although I do personally feel prequels are rarely a good idea - no matter how intriguing Caprica was... we all know who ends up nuked to death 50 years later.

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Dejana

Dejana

(edited)
I think Elizabeth McGovern was a bit put out that she was one of the last actresses offered Cora. Cora being an American woman living in the U.K., and McGovern being the same, and the right age, she thought she should have been one of the obvious first actresses called. When I read that, I wanted to say, yeah but you suck, Elizabeth. I'd have called Gillian Anderson first too! And probably a slate of others before contacting your reps. At the end of the day she was good casting, not least because she looks like the mother of those particular girls, particularly Mary's mother. Blue eyes not withstanding. Height, dark hair, and extreme thinness and attenuated limbs.

 

I imagine that if they'd cast Gillian Anderson as Cora, they'd have gone in a different direction in casting the Crawley sisters, save Laura Carmichael. A totally different show, but when The Brady Bunch was first being developed, TPTB hadn't settled on actors to play the parents, so the producers also cast three brown-haired girls and three blond boys, in case they chose a brunette Carol and fair-haired Mike.

 

I borrowed Lady Catherine, the Earl and the Real Downton Abbey from the library last week and in the photos and the cover portrait, Lady Catherine reminds me a bit of Laura Carmichael physically, yet Catherine was regarded as a lively beauty in her day. Laura can look so different than Edith in real life; I can't put my finger on exactly how they play down her looks on the show. it would have been interesting if they hadn't, and in an alternate universe where Gillian Anderson was Cora, Laura was cast as the lookalike daughter, with another fair-haired actress as Sybil and Edith stuck out like a sore thumb by being a brunette.

 

I do agree that Gillian would've bailed after three seasons or not agreed to that many to begin with, leaving the Earl of Grantham a widower. Mary could've turned her catty venom on potential stepmothers, rather than Edith.

Edited by Dejana
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HighQueenEB

HighQueenEB

I do agree that Gillian would've bailed after three seasons or not agreed to that many to begin with, leaving the Earl of Grantham a widower. Mary could've turned her catty venom on potential stepmothers, rather than Edith.

 

Now that would have been far more interesting, I suspect, than the dreck we got with Mary's endless parade of suitors.

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Andorra

Andorra

(edited)

Very funny interview this morning on Swedish radio with Allen Leech. I actually laughed tears about some of his answers.

http://sverigesradio.se/sida/avsnitt/638543?programid=2024

 

It's a lengthy interview and it is in English. It starts at 1h38 and lasts (with some interruptions of songs and what I assume are Swedish News) until 2h27. Check it out, it is really very entertaining. 

Edited by Andorra
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DianeDobbler

DianeDobbler

Very funny interview - a bit weird when one of the interviewers honestly seemed diverted by his having been in the series "Rome", and became oddly persistent about what it was like working with "the horses" at Highclere. "Lady, they're show biz horses! The guy brings them in, they do an hour in hair and make-up and then they do their scene!" and everybody telling that interviewer she'd gone off the rails a bit. Always enjoy Allen Leech's personality in general, and here it was fun listening to him snark on Lady Canarvon a bit, as well as on the character of Mary.

SusanSunflower

SusanSunflower

I could buy William as a virgin -- unless Matthew decided to give the boy an education. The battlefield mortality rate were appalling and brothels were -- I gather -- plentiful ... 

But I really wondered about Matthew and Lavinia .. and Matthew and paralysis ... particularly as the hoary matter of Mary's presumed virginity kept being dragged about ... Fellowes seems to have intentionally over-censored the realities of the day .... for pbs or for his own sense of propriety ... protecting the home team?? 

ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

Yeah, I admit, while I didn't find it odd that Matthew didn't find a nice girl until two years later, I did wonder why they weren't "We're engaged, the wedding is while I am on leave and lets get some heirs made! People are dying like flies! Lets not wait!". I mean, I will grant you, my family is pretty trashy but Grandma met Granpa in the Tube during the Blitz, and they were married twenty four hours later. By the time the war ended, she had *three* kids to bring to the states.

 

Of course my musing precludes the fact that Mary and Matthew both were doing a little "I can't marry my fiance until he/she marries her!" dance the entire time but the practical matter of the heir only reared it's head after Matthew's junk was rendered useless.

Roseanna

Roseanna

Andorra, I interpreted "My eyes have been opened" to mean that Mary's character whose qualities (commanding, spending money freely) etc) were made clear during the honeymoon. However, Matthew said it playfully.

During their marriage Mary and Matthew never seemed very passionate (cf. Sybil and Tom's kiss after the separation). Of course that could be due their English upbringing - or JF's style.

skyways

skyways

(edited)
During their marriage Mary and Matthew never seemed very passionate (cf. Sybil and Tom's kiss after the separation). Of course that could be due their English upbringing

 

 

It's funny I thought they were very passionate. Which is really odd for me to say because when I watched it when it first aired I didn't think so. But on re-watching, they were. Most of their scenes were bedroom scenes in each other's arms, or teasing and smooching.. It's Tom and Sybil that didn't get much between them after that first scene what with their arguing about morning coats and Sybil's pregnancy.

Edited by skyways
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caligirl50

caligirl50

I didn't know where to post this so I hope here is okay.

In the states, A Salute to Downton Abbey aired Sunday on PBS.  Hugh Bonneville hosted and they showed exclusive clips from Season 6.  This was also a fundraising opportunity for PBS.  

It didn't reveal a lot but enough to make everyone's mouth water - less than a month away!

I haven't been on this board since early September (except once recently) as I wanted to be surprised when it aired here.

I don't know if iTV did this as I think it was made for PBS.  Hugh not only hosts but also co-wrote it.  Sadly, I don't have a link but will look for it if anyone asks to see. Those of you not stateside can just giggle at all of this since you are in know about all.

 

Lady Mary.  Wow.  That was a surprise, even with the little they gave away.  I think I know a few things as I stumbled onto a youtube site by accident that showed something I would have rather been surprised about but anyway her storyline is not what I expected.  AT ALL.

 

One last thing: Julian Fellowes seems to love Edith being unhappy and is quite unapologetic when discussing her character.  I wonder why but whatever. It is what it is.

Andorra

Andorra

And the two of them had just been talking about him in an interview last week! That's awful.

 

I thought Allen was subdued when he was asked about setting up Michelle and her fiancé, but I thought it was only because he was reluctant to talk about Michelle's private life. To know now that they were smiling and pretending all week in the US, knowing what was going to happen soon is heartbreaking. How brave and professional of them to do their work despite the circumstances!

They probably didn't know that it would happen so soon, Michelle left the US promo tour sooner than the others and flew home on thursday. 

DianeDobbler

DianeDobbler

Probably not, although he was in hospice. I assumed Allen and Michelle were good friends (along with Laura Carmichael) from being the same generation that stuck with the show so long, but if he introduced her to his good friend who became her significant other, that's even more of bond. She has always struck me as a lovely woman.

Darling Lily

Darling Lily

I watched Allen and Michelle on WWHL, and thought that Allen seemed a little subdued.  Michelle was pretty effervecent though.  I was so sorry to hear about her Fiance.  What a tragedy for all of them, seems like Downton come to life...you get used to those types of things happening back in the day, but today when someone so young dies so quickly from disease, it's a punch in the gut.

 

So very sorry for them.

ZoloftBlob

ZoloftBlob

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/6823078/Dame-Maggie-Smith-killed-off-Downton-Abbey.html#_ga=1.164684668.2145667322.1451241253

 

I sorta love that the body isn't even cold and GN is already insisting it's all Dame Maggie Smith's fault.

 

And....

 

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/tv/6645432/Elizabeth-McGovern-Im-so-happy-the-tedium-of-Downton-Abbey-is-over.html

 

Someone is no longer shy about how they feel

DianeDobbler

DianeDobbler

I always get the feeling that Elizabeth McGovern thinks the tedium of Cora is the fault of the writers and not her own. But you can't have great stuff handed to you on a platter all the time. All of the other actors were given deadly stuff to do - thinking Allen Leech in particular. Some of Maggie Smith's supposed "witticisms" were dire - just churned out by some "Duchess bon mot" generator that was often set on "falls flat", but she delivered with energy and intent. Penelope Wilton as well. Hugh Bonneville.

 

I can see a Downton movie where Robert is a widower. That could prompt some fun shenanigans.

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