S04.E06: Dirty Business

[paulvdb]

Quote

Vernon Correctional Services provides compassionate rehabilitation to those in our care to prepare them for successful community reentry. At Vernon, it’s not about custody. It’s about family.

Premiere date: July 4, 2024

[AnimeMania]

Dan Mousseau as Webweaver

[bettername2come]

I was so happy to see Black Noir without a mask. And according to IMDB it's the same actor it's always been. But then he said, "a black ninja" and it clicked. He's the Black Gentleman Ninja from Psych: The Movie! Which I would probably know if I hung out on these forums more.

God, Hughie's having a rough week. 

I did not call Jeffrey Dean Morgan being a hallucination.

ETA: I just got the Zendaya joke.

Edited July 4 by bettername2come

[baldryanr]

I'd love to see outtakes from the milk scene - I cannot believe Antony Starr didn't burst out laughing the first time it happened.

[Racj82]

There are way too many bulletproof supes in the Boys.

[Affogato]

“Laddio! Get help, Boy!”

[AntFTW]

This episode was WILD!

The milk scene is funny as fuck! It was so unexpected and stupidly funny.

Didnt expect Joe Kessler to be fake.

Billy should report his techniques to the medical establishment. He’s able to amputate someone’s leg and control the bleeding without any medical equipment. The man’s a genius!

4 hours ago, bettername2come said:

ETA: I just got the Zendaya joke.

I didn’t get it until I read this 😂

Edited July 4 by AntFTW

[Racj82]

2 hours ago, AntFTW said:

Didnt expect Joe Kessler to be fake.

I felt offended with the reveal and let's look back at all the past moments because it was so telegraphed. Joe is never there when any of the team is and Butcher is the only one who actually responds to him. We also already knew he was hallucinating.

I did smile when A Train had his hero moment. Its really wild that in a show about a world of super powered beings, there is very little actual saving or heroics happening. They are just actors/celebrities for the most part. The Boys, themselves, are barely saving actual people. Their overall goal is to do that but in the day to day, its mostly just bloodshed and gaining intel.

[Affogato]

I had to stop the show a few times when Hughie was being violated. Nothing else on the Boys has bothered me, but that was terrible.  Quaid did a great job of acting throughout, and his looking for the ‘safeword’ (“Tarantula”), and it turns out to be “Zendaya”. Peter Parker, in some parallel universe, certainly has a libel suit in hand. Tim Drake was helpful, though.

I remember a lot of people didn’t realize Bruce Willis was a ghost in “The Sixth Sense” but I realized it fairly early, and for similar reasons to the Kessler reveal. Butcher is really fighting himself, and he is in bad shape. He was vomiting blood, I think, and I doubt he survives this. A real redemption arc seems unlikely, although maybe an almost redeeming act of some sort.

Sage’s story about her grandmother was sad and also revealing. Homelander’s reaction to her brain injury shook his faith in her, though. A Train really needs some approval. Is Noir the same actor because Noir is a clone of Noir? 

A lot happened in this episode. Firecracker is such a …well, good lord. And the web guy’s extra buthole  

Hughie’s dad’s last wishes were great, and isn’t that a health violation?

Edited July 4 by Affogato

[Glade]

This felt really stale--the show has already done the 'grossout supe sex party' skit before.  And Hughie being sexually assaulted for half of the episode in a 'comedic' way was disgusting and completely gratuitous.  Also, it didn't make much sense.  Tek-night should have immediately clocked the switchup with his 'super-sight' when Hughie pulled down his pants; there is no confusing his butt with Web-Weaver's; this could have ended before he was tied up, assaulted and had 'cum' smeared over his face.  We better get psychological realism with Hughie processing this traumatic assault in the coming weeks, not just pretending it's nothing. 

Edited July 4 by Glade

[Castiels Cat]

JDM being the hallo devil to Becca's hallo angel was obvious for a while. I wish they hadn't been so heavy handed with the reveal which wasn't really necessary. 

Sameer won't cook it up because he loves his wife and child more than he fears for his life and realistically he cannot cook it up up with one leg under those conditions. Butcher is literally out of his mind.  Of course this show had a junkie cook up a lethal nerve agent wearing a paper mask Anything is possible. Nonetheless I think the virus is a red herring.

Neumann thinks Homelander and Sage are cuckoo.  She will defect on the sly.

 

 

[RobertDeSneero]

Just confirms my belief that Homelander isn't part of Sage's endgame.

Loved how the people around Tek Knight wanted to screw him.

Maybe I should be more concerned about how the show is mirroring reality, but mostly I find it funny.

[Affogato]

11 hours ago, Castiels Cat said:

JDM being the hallo devil to Becca's hallo angel was obvious for a while. I wish they hadn't been so heavy handed with the reveal which wasn't really necessary. 

Sameer won't cook it up because he loves his wife and child more than he fears for his life and realistically he cannot cook it up up with one leg under those conditions. Butcher is literally out of his mind.  Of course this show had a junkie cook up a lethal nerve agent wearing a paper mask Anything is possible. Nonetheless I think the virus is a red herring.

Neumann thinks Homelander and Sage are cuckoo.  She will defect on the sly.

 

 

I really liked the scene where Neumann’s head explodes to avoid the mansplaining. Neumann was thrown by Sage’s nihilism, for sure. I wonder who was recording her speech to the billionaires (no regulation, you are the real superheroes). Sage, I’d bet, before her temporary setback, but it could have been Tek-Knight. Or one of the billionaires. 

The reveal of Kesseler being a hallucination was not, maybe, necessary for the viewers, but it was necessary for Butcher. Butcher didn’t realize he was an hallucination, and now he has to deal with being responsible for what he does and with the realization that he is totally alone.

17 hours ago, Glade said:

This felt really stale--the show has already done the 'grossout supe sex party' skit before.  And Hughie being sexually assaulted for half of the episode in a 'comedic' way was disgusting and completely gratuitous.  Also, it didn't make much sense.  Tek-night should have immediately clocked the switchup with his 'super-sight' when Hughie pulled down his pants; there is no confusing his butt with Web-Weaver's; this could have ended before he was tied up, assaulted and had 'cum' smeared over his face.  We better get psychological realism with Hughie processing this traumatic assault in the coming weeks, not just pretending it's nothing. 

In the comics 

Spoiler

• Tek-Knight doesn’t have superpowers, except for being ‘super’ rich, giving him access to tech and the leisure to learn how to use it, like Bruce Wayne

So the superpowers he shows in this episode seem odd, and may be an affectation. Hughie’s heartbeat could have been something he could have guessed. Even so, he was auditioning Web-Weaver and probably didn’t know about the great, gaping extra butthole. Ashley could have known, with access to the Vought databases.

Mostly the herogasm episode, people were having debauched but consensual sex, some for fun and some for power. This was different.

Firecracker’s milk production comes with a case of cardiomyopathy, I suppose this will be a plot point. 

A lot of things showed up in this episode and I think it really is a turning point for the show. 

[iMonrey]

17 hours ago, Glade said:

This felt really stale--the show has already done the 'grossout supe sex party' skit before.  And Hughie being sexually assaulted for half of the episode in a 'comedic' way was disgusting and completely gratuitous. 

That's sort of where I landed too. I think the show has run the gamut of gross-out shock value, and now it just feels obligatory. 

I also feel like we've been going in circles since the start of Season 3 and we haven't broken out of that rut. Even coming all the way back to Homelander nursing on someone. It's like the show is afraid to move forward. 

9 hours ago, RobertDeSneero said:

Maybe I should be more concerned about how the show is mirroring reality, but mostly I find it funny.

It's a little too on the nose if you ask me. Like Firecracker talking about Jewish space lasers. 

[Castiels Cat]

3 hours ago, Affogato said:

I really liked the scene where Neumann’s head explodes to avoid the mansplaining. Neumann was thrown by Sage’s nihilism, for sure. I wonder who was recording her speech to the billionaires (no regulation, you are the real superheroes). Sage, I’d bet, before her temporary setback, but it could have been Tek-Knight. Or one of the billionaires. 

The reveal of Kesseler being a hallucination was not, maybe, necessary for the viewers, but it was necessary for Butcher. Butcher didn’t realize he was an hallucination, and now he has to deal with being responsible for what he does and with the realization that he is totally alone.

In the comics 

  Hide contents

• Tek-Knight doesn’t have superpowers, except for being ‘super’ rich, giving him access to tech and the leisure to learn how to use it, like Bruce Wayne

So the superpowers he shows in this episode seem odd, and may be an affectation. Hughie’s heartbeat could have been something he could have guessed. Even so, he was auditioning Web-Weaver and probably didn’t know about the great, gaping extra butthole. Ashley could have known, with access to the Vought databases.

Mostly the herogasm episode, people were having debauched but consensual sex, some for fun and some for power. This was different.

Firecracker’s milk production comes with a case of cardiomyopathy, I suppose this will be a plot point. 

A lot of things showed up in this episode and I think it really is a turning point for the show. 

Good point about Butcher needing to realize this. I would love for Joe to have explained to Butcher that he was a supe 

[Castiels Cat]

13 hours ago, RobertDeSneero said:

Just confirms my belief that Homelander isn't part of Sage's endgame.

Loved how the people around Tek Knight wanted to screw him.

Maybe I should be more concerned about how the show is mirroring reality, but mostly I find it funny.

 

I thought Tek Knight died in Gen V. I need to rewatch that I guess or did Vought resurrect him.

[RobertDeSneero]

7 hours ago, Castiels Cat said:

I thought Tek Knight died in Gen V. I need to rewatch that I guess or did Vought resurrect him.

My guess is that you're confusing him with

Spoiler

Social Media Jeff

 

[Castiels Cat]

57 minutes ago, RobertDeSneero said:

My guess is that you're confusing him with

  Hide contents

Social Media Jeff

 

Not at all. I remember his tree escape going south. I guess it was embarrassing but not deadly  

[AntFTW]

What’s Firecracker’s power? 🤔

16 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I also feel like we've been going in circles since the start of Season 3 and we haven't broken out of that rut. Even coming all the way back to Homelander nursing on someone. It's like the show is afraid to move forward.

As much as I liked season 3, I feel like they ran out of ideas in season 3. I just got the feeling that they didn’t really know what to do with these characters anymore, and now they’re winging it.

[Castiels Cat]

8 hours ago, Castiels Cat said:

Not at all. I remember his tree escapade going south. I guess it was embarrassing but not deadly  

Edited autocorrect.

Edited July 6 by Castiels Cat

[Blue Plastic]

I didn't like all the disgusting sexual violation in this episode.

How did Firecracker find out about Homelander's mommy/breast milk fixation?

The thing I really liked this show for, its social commentary, is really going a little too on-the-nose now. They're just basically copying exactly what is unfortunately going on in the US political system at the moment. It's not a commentary at this point.

[shrewd.buddha]

On 7/5/2024 at 11:23 AM, iMonrey said:

I think the show has run the gamut of gross-out shock value, and now it just feels obligatory. 

It feels a bit lazy at this point.  Apparently season four is the season of butt stuff.. 

Butcher has been "dying" for six episodes - yet we know he isn't going anywhere.
Once the show reached the point where Homelander and the Vought know exactly who and where The Boys are and could remove them any time they wish - but never will - you just have to decide to sit back and watch things go 'round and 'round.

 

Edited July 8 by shrewd.buddha

[Affogato]

On 7/6/2024 at 11:34 PM, Blue Plastic said:

How did Firecracker find out about Homelander's mommy/breast milk fixation?

 

That is a good question. Of course, she has negligible powers (except social media)and is well motivated to keep her current position. I suppose anyone, even stillwell, would document any weakness of Homelander. So, journalistic skills? 

[Charlemagne]

On 7/6/2024 at 10:34 PM, Blue Plastic said:

How did Firecracker find out about Homelander's mommy/breast milk fixation?

She's now part of The Seven.

I think the easy answer is that she found out through old-fashioned office gossip.

[Affogato]

9 minutes ago, Charlemagne said:

She's now part of The Seven.

I think the easy answer is that she found out through old-fashioned office gossip.

Yes, journalistic skills. But I doubt it is general knowledge. Ashley maybe is a little perv and would know. 

[Charlemagne]

2 minutes ago, Affogato said:

Yes, journalistic skills. But I doubt it is general knowledge. Ashley maybe is a little perv and would know. 

I would imagine it follows the Servant Rules of British Aristocracy shows... some of the grunt employees see and hear everything and gossip with one another. They don't ever do anything about what they see and hear but I can't imagine that there is any way that the milk thing remained a secret at Vaught Tower.

[tennisgurl]

How is it that, in all that craziness, Firecracker splashing breast milk into Homelanders mouth might be one of the most shocking moments of the season. 

Tek Knight as an obviously evil Batman, complete with an Alfred, sidekicks, a Batcave/sex dungeon, being apparently a super detective, was pretty fun, even if it was another "weird sex is weird and bad" sequence which we've seen plenty of times on this show before. 

A Train's smile when the kid saw him doing something actually heroic might be a real turning point for him, unlike many of The Seven he's not really sadistic or malicious, mostly he's very selfish and weak. 

Poor Hughie is having a seriously rough week. 

I am annoyed with myself for not guessing that JDM was in Billy's head earlier, its pretty obvious in retrospect. 

Hughie's mom being all "what the ever loving fuck" about what Hughie's friends are up to was hilarious. And she hasn't even met Billy yet!

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

A Train's smile when the kid saw him doing something actually heroic might be a real turning point for him, unlike many of The Seven he's not really sadistic or malicious, mostly he's very selfish and weak. 

I agree, of the Seven he's probably one of the "nicer" ones (grading on a HUGE curve here). I do think he could be redeemed and that moment, as you said, might be his turning point. He felt what it's like to be an actual hero in that moment. Hopefully he liked it and wants more. I think he could be a big help to the Boys and they need it. Their plot armour will only get them so far (well, to the end of the shows run, but still, it's wearing thin). 

[rmontro]

I thought Noir was Batman, now Tek Knight is too?  I thought seeing the slimy parody version of Spider-Man was pretty funny.

But yeah, this show has definitely gone downhill, after peaking last season.

[madmax]

I think watching this episode and the last while drinking heavily was not a good idea.

While there were many gross-outs, and the reveal of JDM/Kessler being a hallucination that 90% of viewers already knew, I almost teared up at Kimiko's note to the police officer at the jail.  She had nowhere else to go.  So heartbreaking right on the heels of Hugh's death.  This show isn't supposed to make me feel.

[iMonrey]

On 7/8/2024 at 4:00 PM, Mabinogia said:

I agree, of the Seven he's probably one of the "nicer" ones (grading on a HUGE curve here). I do think he could be redeemed and that moment, as you said, might be his turning point.

I guess we're supposed to forget he murdered Popclaw then. I have a hard time getting on board with the redemption of murderers.

[Mabinogia]

19 hours ago, madmax said:

I almost teared up at Kimiko's note to the police officer at the jail.  She had nowhere else to go.  So heartbreaking right on the heels of Hugh's death.  This show isn't supposed to make me feel.

That got me too. Just hit me hard. Poor Kimiko. While I can accept that Frenchie probably should go to prison for what he's done (which can really be said for every single character on this show) seeing Kimiko looking so lost and alone broke my heart. I love Kimiko and don't like seeing her so heartbroken. 

[Castiels Cat]

On 7/8/2024 at 5:00 PM, Mabinogia said:

I agree, of the Seven he's probably one of the "nicer" ones (grading on a HUGE curve here). I do think he could be redeemed and that moment, as you said, might be his turning point. He felt what it's like to be an actual hero in that moment. Hopefully he liked it and wants more. I think he could be a big help to the Boys and they need it. Their plot armour will only get them so far (well, to the end of the shows run, but still, it's wearing thin). 

His "decent human being/heroic moment" basically outed him and he did not seem to care. That was big. He cannot lie his way out of saving Mother's Milk. He is burnt and he's smart enough to know it. I think A-train is joining the team. He essentially already has on the down-low taking more and more risks as the season progressed. He does not want to see Project Sage succeed. The violence disgusts him. This is really not what he signed up for; even that horribly racist movie Training A-Train was too much. He is out in every way save the public testimonial

 

Noir better be gone before the next episode airs or he is dead. Deep will sell him out. 

Will we see a sudden  temperament change in Noir: quiet and constamtly masked. Neumann has to make a move and this is the easiest way to introduce SB in a new and improved Noir outfit.

 

 

On 7/9/2024 at 12:40 PM, rmontro said:

I thought Noir was Batman, now Tek Knight is too?  I thought seeing the slimy parody version of Spider-Man was pretty funny.

But yeah, this show has definitely gone downhill, after peaking last season.

Noir is more of a Green Arrow maybe.

[Castiels Cat]

8 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I guess we're supposed to forget he murdered Popclaw then. I have a hard time getting on board with the redemption of murderers.

Not that it matters however his murder of Popclaw was a Shakespeare reference wasn't it and ergo a silly writers conceit. He lost it when he realized she was unfaithful or am I misremembering. It's a weak Othello reference. I don't even think it propelled the story along much. Hughie already couldn't hate him more.

Gratuitous Shakespeare is just bad.

 

[AnimeMania]

Black Noir might be a Black Panther riff.

[rmontro]

16 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Black Noir might be a Black Panther riff.

Maybe, the "Noir" seems more suited to Batman than Panther though.  I don't see Green Arrow there at all.  No reason they can't have two Batman takeoffs, I guess.  Although I don't know who the Chuckie Cheese stuff would fit with...

[Affogato]

1 hour ago, rmontro said:

Maybe, the "Noir" seems more suited to Batman than Panther though.  I don't see Green Arrow there at all.  No reason they can't have two Batman takeoffs, I guess.  Although I don't know who the Chuckie Cheese stuff would fit with...

Since panthers are black variants of leopards and jaguars ‘black panther’ is sort of ‘black black’ so it does fit.  

[Castiels Cat]

4 hours ago, rmontro said:

Maybe, the "Noir" seems more suited to Batman than Panther though.  I don't see Green Arrow there at all.  No reason they can't have two Batman takeoffs, I guess.  Although I don't know who the Chuckie Cheese stuff would fit with...

Oliver Queen was trained by a guy with basic ninja skills wasn't he. Granted zi just watched Arrowverse.

[Dobian]

I heard a lot of people bailed on the show after this episode so I was curious to see why.  Okay, it's a total gross-out that never stops. Not enough to keep me from coming back for the last two episodes, but it's getting ridiculous.  Firecracker's the one who should be called Mother's Milk, btw. The reveal at the end with Butcher was great, though.

Edited July 20 by Dobian

[roamyn]

I actually found the Hughie scenes more disturbing than the earlier Splinter scenes.   After the laugh fest that was ep 5 (the flying sheep still tickles me), this was outright horrifying & cringe inducing - both the assault and the -on-the-nose commentary on the state of US leadership.  Tho Kripke has said most of it is coincidence in hind sight,he took a guess on the way things seem to be headed.

While I felt for Kimiko at that last scene, I can't help but remember her outright glee at killing all those security guards last season who were just doing their jobs.

And I still hate Starlight and couldn't help but feel a twinge of compassion for Firecracker still.  Bullied all her life, she's just wanting revenge.  Of course she's going abt it the wrong way, but she doesn't strike me as very intelligent.   Like a wounded animal snapping back in the most baseless way.  If she weren't a Supe with a horrible agenda, we'd be rooting for her.

While A-Train seems to be on the redemption ac, Deep is getting deeper into the dark side.  And Ashley has just destroyed an good she did by helping Maeve last season.

Edited August 21 by roamyn

[Affogato]

On 7/11/2024 at 6:57 PM, Castiels Cat said:

Oliver Queen was trained by a guy with basic ninja skills wasn't he. Granted zi just watched Arrowverse.

Deep is drawn into his cult by a costumed archer. 
 

i think oliver queen learned his survival skills when shipwrecked, but I think his rich father had made him learn how to use a bow and arrow as a teen. Comics, anyway. During his time on the island he was imprisioned for a while by ninja types. Not sure if he learned anything directly from them. He was forced to. I suppose, become a man. 

Edited August 21 by Affogato

[Affogato]

5 hours ago, roamyn said:

 

And I still hate Starlight and couldn't help but feel a twinge of compassion for Firecracker still.  Bullied all her life, she's just wanting revenge.  Of course she's going abt it the wrong way, but she doesn't strike me as very intelligent.   Like a wounded animal snapping back in the most baseless way.  If she weren't a Supe with a horrible agenda, we'd be rooting for her.

Starlight and firecracker were both abused as children. Starlight found out what the 7 were like and left and opposes them. Firecracker has the same opportunity and chooses revenge, and to be an abuser herself. ‘Rooting for her’ seems  strongly worded. I also have sympathy for the abuse homelander endured, and the deep. 

[roamyn]

3 hours ago, Affogato said:

Rooting for her’ seems  strongly worded.

I said.... If she weren't a Supe with a horrible agenda, 

And IMO Starlight WAS NOT abused as a child.  She had everything handed to her on a plate. No, she didn't like being used as a doll by her mother, but others go thru the same thing w/their stage parents and don't bully the lesser relentlessly, then make half-assed, shifty apologies.

Edited August 21 by roamyn

[Affogato]

40 minutes ago, roamyn said:

 

I said.... If she weren't a Supe with a horrible agenda, 

And IMO Starlight WAS NOT abused as a child.  She had everything handed to her on a plate. No, she didn't like being used as a doll by her mother, but others go thru the same thing w/their stage parents and don't bully the lesser relentlessly, then make half-assed, shifty apologies.

You are forgetting her being forced on stage to perform in horrible pain. Even if that was true, the rest of it was abuse. Her needs were secondary to her mothers at all times. She was devalued and controlled. I also bet a lot of them do things they regret later, too, to try to placate their abuser.