S05.E25: Summer Daze, Summertime Sadness

[JerseyGirl]

I think she would take Adam back in a heartbeat, the only thing that would stop her is Daddy - so we'll never know when or how they hooked up because she would never admit to that again.  Now that he's single, let's see whose arms Adam lands in now.

[ghoulina]

I would like to say that Chelsea wouldn't hook up with Adumb again, but I can't say it with a certainty. But I AM fairly certain she would never actually take him back, in a relationship kind of way. When she had that breakdown (was it last season?), crying to her dad about how it sucks that she didn't give Aubree a good dad, that was a woman right there thinking of her daughter more than herself. I think Chelsea has finally reached that stage. Previously she kept taking Adumb back under the guise of creating a "family" for Aubree, but I think she really did it for herself, and her insecurity issues. Now I think she has really seen how badly that back and forth is effecting her daughter, and she's more focused on what will make Aubree happy in the long run, not herself. 

[Turquoise]

It annoys me that Leah gets to ask Corey for more money when she says she took more time off her own job because she's "stressed". Its not Corey's fault she popped out a third kid,and it bugs me that she's not working full time herself, but is sitting with Jeremy whining about money. Do they count Jeremy's salary when figuring out child support, since Leah isn't really working? Or should we assume the MTV money factors in?

In the state I lived in, no you could not count the stepparent's income. But the MTV money should absolutely be factored in.

[Lexie]

I think she would take Adam back in a heartbeat, the only thing that would stop her is Daddy - so we'll never know when or how they hooked up because she would never admit to that again.  Now that he's single, let's see whose arms Adam lands in now.

 

I don't think Randy prevents Chelsea from being with Adam.  She  moved Adam into her father's rental house that he was letting her live in after he told her not to.    I think the only reason they are not together is that Adam doesn't want her and is only interested in a friends with benefits relationship.

 

Of all the people on this show, Javi seems to be the least intelligent as far as actually being smart and knowing things. I think that is why Kail picked him, because she can control him. Javi actually seemed to think they can just deny Jo visitation on Father's Day, or cut short his 6 weeks visitation because they don't like it. No court in the United States is going to deny Jo access to his son on Father's Day just because Javi and Kail want him sitting on the beach with them. Jo should be careful, because I think Kail and Javi will eventually scheme to take Isaac very far away and severely limit visitation.

 

I agree.  I wish somebody would call Javi out and make him articulate why he thinks Jo is such a piece of shit father, and why he thinks he does more for Isaac and is more important.   Dr. Drew sure as hell won't, so I guess it will never happen but it would be interesting.    What exactly do they think Jo is doing wrong.   He fought for time with Isaac, he pays his child support, he sees Isaac when it's his time, he has a room in his house for Isaac.  Jo is no deadbeat father.   I can see Kail playing this exact game with Javi and Lincoln if they ever split up, but I really don't see that happening since Javi is so dumb and willing to hang in there even though Kail smacks him around when she's in hulk smash mode.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Jo is the only father from birth that was fully committed to parenting. He was the guy holding his son in the middle of the night on 16&P. Even Cory took some time to warm up.

[Lexie]

I don't think Cory took time to warm up.   He was the one at home with the twins at night when they were newborns and Leah was out with her ex and other friends.   Jace's father is useless and so is Adam, but I think that Leah and Kail lucked out in the babydaddy department all things considered.

[FozzyBear]

Jo is the only father from birth that was fully committed to parenting. He was the guy holding his son in the middle of the night on 16&P. Even Cory took some time to warm up.

Huh. While I do think Jo is a good father, I would reverse Jo and Corey in that situation. From what I remember Corey was all in from the pregnancy and very present with the twins from day 1. I remember Jo as being the one that took a few minutes to come around. I was under the impression that in the first few months Kali and Jo's parents did most of the hands on stuff and that Jo's Dad actually had a few talks with him about being a father no matter what. That could just have been my impression and to give Jo credit, he was younger than Corey. Still I remember really disliking Jo at first and thinking we had another spoiled mama's boy on out hands like S1 Ryan.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Rewatch Kail's 16&P. Eddie talks to Jo about dealing with Kail, but never Issac. I do think my comparison to Corey was unfair and he's a great father too. I think I ding Corey for living somewhere lese when they were infants, not his fault.

[ghoulina]

It's hard to remember the early years, but I thought Corey and Leah DID live together, but she cheated when the twins were fairly young, and he moved out of the trailer they were living in. I think he stayed with his dad? Until they got back together? Corey has never been the type to wear his heart on his sleeve, but I remember him always being very present and supportive. I think Jo was more of the slow to warm up guy, but he definitely made up for it. He's a great dad now, and I don't think there's anything unforgivable preserved on film - such as Adumb with his, "Tell me where and when to sign away that mistake".

[poopchute]

So, maybe I'm an idiot but I don't understand.  Kail definitely couldn't take Isaac on the trip?  So why even ask?  Just to be a dumb asshole?

[BitterApple]

So, maybe I'm an idiot but I don't understand.  Kail definitely couldn't take Isaac on the trip?  So why even ask?  Just to be a dumb asshole?

Well, Kail is know for bending rules and doing what she wants regardless of what she's told or the limits set before her. Given her personality I'm totally not surprised she was trying to take Isaac on the trip even though Scentsy forbid non-nursing children to be included. I will admit I don't see how the trip is such a "reward" for top consultants if they're not allowed to bring their family along. Unless there's something I'm missing, it seems like kind of a crappy policy.

Edited September 16, 2014 by BitterApple

[DangerousMinds]

Well, Kail is know for bending rules and doing what she wants regardless of what she's told or the limits set before her. Given her personality I'm totally not surprised she was trying to take Isaac on the trip even though Scentsy forbid non-nursing children to be included. I will admit I don't see how the trip is such a "reward" for top consultants if they're not allowed to bring their family along. Unless there's something I'm missing, it seems like kind of a crappy policy.

Or the whole "storyline" was producer-driven BS.

[GreatKazu]

I will admit I don't see how the trip is such a "reward" for top consultants if they're not allowed to bring their family along. Unless there's something I'm missing, it seems like kind of a crappy policy.

Well, I can see the company having to draw the line with children because imagine if a Scentsy representative has a uterus like that Duggar woman. The company is paying for the hotel, airfare and food. They don't want to have to dole out money for a family with say, six kids. Reading the rules, they were not even allowing a guest to join unless the Scentsy rep had sold enough product to qualify.

 

I am reminded of someone I knew who used to be a rep for some company she worked for. She won a trip somewhere with other company employees who had earned this trip. Spouses were allowed to go - if one was married - but the employee had to pay for them and of course, no kids allowed. I don't think it is uncommon for this to be the case.

 

I am just scratching my head at the possibility that Kail really thought she could take Isaac. Why would the producers want to have this faux storyline and then have Kail continue with this lie via her twitter responses?

[crazychicken]

If my memory isn't faulty I think when Leah cheated the first time and Corey moved out he continued to pay all the bills for the trailer as he didn't want Leah to have to worry about money as she had enough on her plate with the twins and school. That for me was a stand out moment for Corey as I could not imagine too many guys reacting like that after being cheated on. I think he was also asking to take the girls to his dads house to have time with them but Leah was refusing and only allowing the girls to go if she was present.

[NikSac]

I think he was also asking to take the girls to his dads house to have time with them but Leah was refusing and only allowing the girls to go if she was present.

 

It kind of blows me away how many good Dads get sucked in by this.  Maybe the laws are different there, but where I live (California) the Mom can't just "refuse" to let the kid(s) go or make the visitation on only her terms. Sadly the times I've seen this actually "work" for the Mom are in cases where the kids have a good Dad who loves the kids but doesn't want to cause a bunch of drama. I have never heard of a court saying "oh whatever their Mom says goes" when it comes to custody. Usually it's been more like push came to shove and it's more like Kail's situation where she puts her foot down and demands XYZ and the court says "Nope, sorry, he gets to see the kid(s) too." 

 

I think Corey's been incredibly accommodating when it comes to Leah, her whims, her living situation, and the girls' needs. It's water under the bridge now but I feel like he probably would've gotten more visitation and it would've cost him less (per month) if he'd gone through the courts and pushed the issue to begin with. I'm not saying he should have, but I wonder if it would have been a wake up call for Leah that she doesn't just get to dictate what happens.

[crazychicken]

I think Corey's been incredibly accommodating when it comes to Leah, her whims, her living situation, and the girls' needs. It's water under the bridge now but I feel like he probably would've gotten more visitation and it would've cost him less (per month) if he'd gone through the courts and pushed the issue to begin with. I'm not saying he should have, but I wonder if it would have been a wake up call for Leah that she doesn't just get to dictate what happens.

 

I think that is why Leah is so riled up now, Corey has always seemed to give in to keep the peace as he does not want to fight in front of the girls. He is finally taking a stand and not letting Leah dictate so much and she is now getting vindictive. Heck he went along with a truck broke up their marriage and even in later episodes he does not correct it when Leah throws it at him. Corey is a better person than me I would have said 'no your cheating arse broke us up both times'.

[FozzyBear]

Leah seems to be suffering from a case of "everybody thinks he's so great, but they don't really know!" and just wants everybody to see the Corey that drives her crazy. Which may or may not exist. I'm going with not, but you never know. I have known couples where one just comes across better for a variety of reasons and has a tendency to get all the sympathy and support from friends and co-workers, but then you find out what was going on behing closed doors and oh boy! Is that different! But then I've also meet couples where one party thinks everybody picks on them and blames everything on them, but they're just being a selfish, dramatic mess (I'm trying not to use gender pronouns because I really think both cases are just as likely to be male or female). My guess is that Leah thinks she's the former, but she's really the latter.

[kathybgd]

I already unloaded my anger last week about Jannelle and dear little Jace. I just want to say how society is changing so much! Every where I go (pharmacy waiting for refills, grocery store lines, driving in my car, looking over at the next driver in freeway stopped traffic, taking my dad to V.A clinics sitting in waiting rooms etc), peoples heads are down texting, playing games, whatever. What are we becoming? Nobody smiles or small talks anymore because of this and the danger on highways is escalating! That stripper bugged the hell out of me going to that softball game of Aubree's! You could so tell she was just there for that idiot balled father to show her off (why, I do not know), but how sad, how very sad dude! It's your little girl that worships you! Get your conceited head (why , I do not know), out of your ass! Leave the 'screw of the week' home or sitting in her car texting!

I would like to also add that baby Lincoln. is the CUTEST baby on t.v.!

Edited September 17, 2014 by kathybgd

[wrestlesflamingos]

Lincoln is honestly the cutest baby. He's like a tiny little man.

[Chicken Wing]

I know, right? There are babies who look like babies, and there are babies who look like cute mini versions of people. Lincoln is a literal mini-me of Javi. And when he laughs? Be still, my ovaries.

[wrestlesflamingos]

It would be fun if Kail got Lincoln a tiny uniform and drew a wispy moustache on him to complete the picture of mini-Javi.

[configdotsys]

Wow. Interesting that Isaac would not have been able to make the trip anyway, per the rules. No surprise that Kail-- when there's no drama to be had-- manufactures some of her own just to be a bitch. Had Isaac been able to go, I could easily see Kail showing Isaac the pictures and saying, "See Linky at the beeeeeachie!!! He had so much fun! Too bad you couldn't be there but your Dad wouldn't let you go."

 

Does anyone have any idea how many episodes are left? I thought this current season was abbreviated but they just keep going.

Edited September 17, 2014 by configdotsys

[Chicken Wing]

At the end of each episode, with each "next time on Teen Mom 2," I get both excited and annoyed that it didn't say "season finale." I am simultaneously happy that it's not over yet and exasperated that this shit won't go away.

[zenme]

At the end of each episode, with each "next time on Teen Mom 2," I get both excited and annoyed that it didn't say "season finale." I am simultaneously happy that it's not over yet and exasperated that this shit won't go away.

 

Yeah, and I just read http://radaronline.com/exclusives/2014/09/teen-mom-2-season-6/

[Chicken Wing]

Lord, save me.

[wrestlesflamingos]

It means supervision for Kaiser, so right on. Janelle can't just lose him at a party or leave him with boyfriend of the week's sister.

[DangerousMinds]

Unfortunately,, MTV's cameras are only there some of the time, so Jenelle and Nathan will have plenty of free time to lose that infant.

[MZ30958]

So much win on this thread.  Thinking back to what a great guy and father Corey has been since the beginning, reminded me of when Leah wanted to get back with Corey, and she invited him over to the trailer, and fixed him dinner.  While they are talking about getting back together, Corey is hesitating and Leah keeps shoving a cake at Corey.  He is trying to talk and has to stop and say, "Leah!  I don't want any cornbread right now!".  lol, it was his CAKE!!!!! with no icing.  It really did look like cornbread.

I think Leah's anger is definitely due to Corey standing up for himself and what is best.  She's not getting her way, so the fury is unleashed.  She reprimanded him, calling him "Corey Tyler!" as though he is a child.  Can't stand her.

[GuiltyPleasureTV]

Former foster parent here. As terribly sad as it is, the system is really set up to deal with physical abuse rather than emotional/mental. And it's not even very good at that. But Jace appears to be getting enough food to eat, has a roof over his head and as far as we know not being hit. Frankly, I don't know that foster care would be better for him than what he's getting now. The system tends to move kids back and forth from their biological families and between different foster care homes. You couldn't design a system better to destroy a child's ability to form healthy attachments to other people if you tried. There's a reason I'm a former foster parent, only lasted a year. At least as it is now, Jace has a limited number of caregivers.  

 

Now if Jace could be straight-up adopted by a family who would prioritize his needs, that might be the best scenario. Not that I can see that happening. Barb is too attached and Janelle doesn't care enough about him.

Yeah it sucks that some kids are mistreated as badly as Jace and I feel very bad for him. But as someone who has worked in the court system with foster kids and CPS involvement, I don't have much faith in that system. The foster homes are often worse and even if kids are successfully placed and adopted into relatively well-adjusted families, they can still have issues for life that stem from their birth parents abandoning them. My dad was raised by a mom as crazy as Jenelle and by today's standards he would be taken away from her but he always says he's glad he wasn't. He would rather be with his birth mom than somewhere else. (Who knows what he would have said if he was actually adopted. I DO have two adopted siblings that are related to me on my dad's side of the family-- everyone in his family is pretty much unfit to parent-- and my now teenaged adopted sister has attachment disorder that they say is related to her being taken away from her mother by CPS at age 2. She was in foster care and then went to live with my parents, who are definitely not the world's greatest parents or anything close (they have tons of issues) but they are all about image and status and so the state deemed them more suitable to raise my sister (and also her younger bio brother) than her bio parents simply because her bio parents were caught with pot and couldn't pass pee tests. Sure, if I liked pot I would give it up to keep my kids but I feel like when people have kids young and they have mental health or addiction issues they aren't suddenly going to become upstanding citizens of the year and I'm not so sure that means their kids should be taken away or that the kids will necessarily be better off.

(ANIMALNURSE-- I'm not trying to say anything bad about you as a foster parent. I know there are some very good foster parents doing their best within a broken system!)

I'm also not a proponent of the government coming in and deciding how every family should live and what is dysfunctional and what is not. It's a very subjective standard and I've read comments about Catelynn being a bad mom because she sends Nova to stay with her mom because she has PPD and needs a break; Leah is a bad mom for feeding her kids junk food etc. (I am not arguing that either of these moms is a good mom but I don't think these particular reasons are reasons to take their kids away and I have no idea what CPS would use to determine dysfunctional versus functional. ) 

What I think is sad is that MTV ran PSAs about not mistreating dogs, and made Jenelle apologize, etc., but they do NOTHING to address her and Barb's horrible neglect and mistreatment of Jace. I'm an animal lover, I currently have 1 adopted dog that was previously abused and in the past I have had others that have lived with me until they passed away from old age. I took care of them and loved them and I do not think Jenelle's treatment of the dogs was right. But I honestly think she treats Jace worse, and so does Barb sometimes, and in my book an innocent human child is at least as or if not much more important than a dog. MTV should be running these ads about parenting and making these people attending parenting/guardianship classes rather than filming their mistreatment of their kids. But then again I am a culprit in this since I watch the show and MTV films it for entertainment purposes.

Edited April 7, 2016 by GuiltyPleasureTV

[GuiltyPleasureTV]

I don't think Chelsea talks bad about Adam to Aubree. I know the things she says are filmed and Aubree will see them one day but I think Chelsea wants her to have a good relationship with her dad.

What you say around a child and about a child's father, to anyone in their presence, that child internalizes and can take as something bad about themselves, as  they are 1/2 of each parent. It is never good to talk badly about a child's parent in front of or around them. I think Chelsea is a good mother EXCEPT for this one really bad thing and I think she should know better. She needs parenting classes/counseling to help her not take out her anger on Adam around Aubree. I also think it's wrong of her to tell Aubree that Adam is coming when-- as far as I heard on the show-- he himself never said he was coming. He just asked for time and place. I think she does that kind of stuff so that later she can say "oh look he didn't come, wah wah wah"-- at Aubree's expense. Aubree is innocent and needs to be spared unnecessary pain or fighting. If I was in Chelsea's shoes I would never mention whether or not Adam might be coming. Sure Aubree can ask and will start asking more as she gets older but at this age I would say "I'm not sure, honey, we'll see who all shows up to cheer you on, and I'll be there with bells on" and as she gets older I would let her text or call him and ask. But I wouldn't waste time texting and calling him and making a big deal out of it in front of Aubree. To me that is completely unnecessary drama that will only hurt Aubree.

[GuiltyPleasureTV]

 

It annoys me that Leah gets to ask Corey for more money when she says she took more time off her own job because she's "stressed". Its not Corey's fault she popped out a third kid,and it bugs me that she's not working full time herself, but is sitting with Jeremy whining about money. Do they count Jeremy's salary when figuring out child support, since Leah isn't really working? Or should we assume the MTV money factors in?

In my state the step parent's income is NOT counted, as the step parent did not biologically create the kid and only the parents who made the kid are legally/financially responsible for the kid. BUT both parents' income is counted in the calculation, as is the amount of time each parent has custody of the kid. If one parent suddenly stops/decreases their job then that former income can be imputed into the calculation. There have to be really substantial reasons for a parent to just stop working at a job and get out of paying child support or get more child support from the other parent based on that. If it's for the good of the kid-- for example maybe if the parent was in school to get a better career or if the child has disabilities and the parent must stay home and take care of them (which could be Leah's case but not really since she's lazy and doped up and too stressed out to either work OR take her kid to PT), etc. Sometimes in a bad economy with mass layoffs the court will understand and slightly adjust the child support. But usually if the parent just quits working because they don't feel like it or they're too stressed, they can't ask for child support to be adjusted. (I doubt Leah's tanning job made much money and I don't know if it even figured into child support because I don't know if she had that job at the time. I think they like to make these girls work realistic teen mom type jobs because Leah's real money comes from MTV. I'm not sure if MTV money is calculated into child support or not but it should be. Also I have no idea why she's selling Mary Kay except maybe to establish a job she can do from home after MTV stops filming. But it seems like she's bad at it and I also don't think multi level marketing companies like Mary Kay make much money for the person silly enough to sign up to be a pawn in their pyramid scheme. When they do make money from it they have to report it on their taxes (Often it's a loss! Like in Leah's case-- if I even believe she spent that money on MK stuff. I don't--- I think the MK excuse was a cover up for spending money on drugs and who knows what else). So then that income would count towards child support calculations and I'm assuming that MTV money would too as it's reported on taxes.

[GuiltyPleasureTV]

I already unloaded my anger last week about Jannelle and dear little Jace. I just want to say how society is changing so much! Every where I go (pharmacy waiting for refills, grocery store lines, driving in my car, looking over at the next driver in freeway stopped traffic, taking my dad to V.A clinics sitting in waiting rooms etc), peoples heads are down texting, playing games, whatever. What are we becoming? Nobody smiles or small talks anymore because of this and the danger on highways is escalating! That stripper bugged the hell out of me going to that softball game of Aubree's! You could so tell she was just there for that idiot balled father to show her off (why, I do not know), but how sad, how very sad dude! It's your little girl that worships you! Get your conceited head (why , I do not know), out of your ass! Leave the 'screw of the week' home or sitting in her car texting!

I would like to also add that baby Lincoln. is the CUTEST baby on t.v.!

Eh. I'm not a social person and I dislike small talk/ talking to strangers etc. I used to always have my head in a book when I was out and about or when my parents forced me to attend events etc. Now I still usually have my head in my Kindle... or sometimes my phone or iPad. I really don't think it's much different. Not everyone wants to live in a place where everyone knows everyone and is expected to talk to everyone when they see each other at the local five and ten. I prefer bigger cities and strangers who mind their own business as I do the same. ;) When I was a kid I had coloring books and doll and toys and I think kids are still like that today and they also have more modern technology electronics to keep them entertained, and that doesn't really bother me. Sure I try to make family time TV/technology free and I would encourage my kid to talk to his family members some at events but even among adults there are people (like me) who are more reserved and like to keep to ourselves and do introverted type things. My husband has a huge family with big get-togethers and I love them all and get along with them all but there are times when I want to just do some work on my laptop or text my sister who lives in another state about the baby she just had, etc. I would never expect my kid to just be social all the time if he sometimes wanted his own time too. Likewise some of my husband's cousins and their kids are extremely friendly and social whereas others sit on the couch and post selfies to Instagram. I get along with the more outgoing ones more since they are better at talking about stuff and I know them better, but I like the others just as much and I have certainly had nice conversations with them when both of us have been in the mood.

With Adam's girlfriend on her phone during the game... what else was she supposed to do? Chat it up all friendly with Chelsea and Chelsea's family, when they were (understandably) talking badly/making fun of her and Adam? Yeah she could have watched the game and cheered more for Aubree but she has no obligation to Aubree... she barely just met her. I think she was just uncomfortable and felt awkward. I am not good in social situations let alone awkward situations like that and I would most definitely be on my phone if not in the car! It was clear Adam brought her along to either hurt Chelsea, show her off, and/or drive him to and from the game so he didn't get (understandably) yelled at by Chelsea and everyone in America for not attending the game again. It was wrong and selfish for Adam to bring and probably dumb for her to agree (unless she wanted to be on TV and then thought differently about it... because she certainly didn't look comfortable to be there), but I wouldn't expect her to be social at a time and place like that. And while I found her tattoos (or excessive tattoos like that at all) gross and didn't think she was the most beautiful girl on the planet, I don't think she's ugly or old and dried up looking like everyone else seems to. I thought she looked just fine. I don't care if she's a stripper or porn star... Adam seems/looks worse in that department and until recently Chelsea jumped his bones every chance she got so my skeevy feelings are reserved for Adam and in that situation Chelsea.

(I completely agree that ADAM should have paid most or all of his attention to Aubree during the game-- as should have Chelsea-- but Adam has always been very selfish and all about Adam so it doesn't surprise me that he didn't. Also Chelsea has her head too far up Adam's butt and trying to figure out and complain about what's going on with Adam to pay more attention to Aubree's game. She still seems like a 16 year old high school girl when it comes to how she deals with Adam.)

[GuiltyPleasureTV]

Re: Kail and her Father's Day request.

 

Mother's Day is very important to me. I don't consider it a hallmark holiday. I don't buy or receive store-bought mother's day cards or do anything commercial. For me it is a day to celebrate being a mother. I had two pregnancy losses before I had my son-- one was a late term stillbirth-- and every Mother's Day I am grateful for my son and also I reflect on the children I lost who are not here with me. On all that I've been through to become a mother. On the time that I wondered if I would even get to be a mother (I'm in my mid-30's and plan to have more). I am married but if I wasn't there is no way in heck I would give up my son on Mother's day. Obviously it is a very important day to Jo too, because he said it was and said that he specifically arranged to always have Isaac on Father's Day in the custody agreement.

I also agree with those who said that this in not about what is best for "one day" for a 4 year old. This was about what was best for Kail and what SHE wanted to do. Yes, the best interest of the child is always most important but with things like this and with co-parenting one does have to weigh what would make the other parent happy/sad (especially when kids are so young they don't know the difference yet) and clearly it would make Jo sad to not be with Issac on father's day. It's not just one day, it is FATHER'S day. Just like if I was supposed to have my son over Christmas and I had plans with my family and some of them had kids there yet my ex wanted to take my son that day that I was supposed to have him and claim that it is just one day and why can't I rearrange it. No way. Yeah, maybe if my son was getting to do his lifelong dream on that day or something (even then, I would want to be there too, with my son on the day that is so important to him) but not just because my ex felt like planning something on that day and then guilt-tripping me about how our son will feel if he doesn't get to be a part of it. Kail could do that ALL the time with those same lame excuses. And it wasn't even an every-other-parent holiday but Father's day; it is customary in most parenting plans that each parent has the kid(s) on the parents' birthday and Mother/Father's Day, and the rest of the holidays are alternated every other year. So this is a big deal and not something that Kail can just change on a whim.

 

Sure it was okay of her to ask but she clearly expected the answer to be no and I know she would have said no to Isaac not being with her on mother's day. (Heck, she complains that she has to let Isaac see Jo on normal days he's supposed to go there-- how it's not fair to HER family/herself-- so you know she wouldn't want him to go on Mother's Day-- HER day!) But I can't believe people are giving Jo flack for nicely saying no (he even considered it but I understand why he said no. Any parent that valued Father's Day at all would definitely want their child with them on that day.