S07.E07: A Practical Guide for Time-Travellers

[Athena]

Quote

Jamie prepares to face British forces in battle. Roger and Brianna question Buck MacKenzie's intentions in the 20th century. William fights in the First Battle of Saratoga.

Reminder: The is the book talk thread. This may include spoilers for ALL the books. If you wish to remain unspoiled for any of the books, please leave now and head to the No Book Talk episode thread.

[McKavity]

I skimmed over the Buck/Roger/Jem/Rob/Bree parts in the books because I didn’t find them interesting, and I am still finding them uninteresting 🤷🏽‍♀️

[Quickbeam]

OMG Sophie cannot do sex scenes amongst other things. Poor Richard.

[nodorothyparker]

8 hours ago, McKavity said:

I skimmed over the Buck/Roger/Jem/Rob/Bree parts in the books because I didn’t find them interesting, and I am still finding them uninteresting 🤷🏽‍♀️

I've skimmed a fair bit of it too because it just. drags. on. so. long. They're doing a good job of condensing the '80s story down to its high points and moving along at a good pace. I actually enjoyed all the back and forth with Buck, who gets ridiculously short shrift in the books considering he's the one and only person we know for certain who actually went forward beyond his own time instead of back. In the books there's precious little sense of what he makes at all of the future.

I fast forwarded through most of the sex scene. i haven't found her as bad as some, but she's just not good here and those scenes only highlight the painful lack of chemistry that the show got right with everyone else but is sorely lacking between Roger and Bree.

[andidante]

5 hours ago, McKavity said:

I skimmed over the Buck/Roger/Jem/Rob/Bree parts in the books because I didn’t find them interesting, and I am still finding them uninteresting 🤷🏽‍♀️

I do too! Give me Jaime and Claire all day long!

[GHScorpiosRule]

I swear I dinna remember Buck a’tall in the 20th century! Or that asshat Rob going back with Jem to the 18th century. I just remember the kidnapping. Sort of.

[nodorothyparker]

That's probably because book Rob doesn't take Jem back to the 18th century. He does take him, yes, but it's a misdirect that gets Roger and Buck moving back through the stones so they can have their accidental side quest to the 1730s. There's a point in the last book where Roger and Bree realize that while Rob couldn't actually travel he almost certainly told another asshat who's been running around the 18th century for the last three books causing problems for both the Frasers and the Greys and that's how he knows about them.

Buck's presence in the 20th century as the only time traveler we've seen who moved forward past his own time seriously barely rates more than a "well, huh" in the books. I loved what they did with it in this episode in that coming from a culture that had stories about fairies and changlings and people disappearing for 200 years he accepted it pretty readily but still managed to have quite a bit of wonder at the world his descendants inhabited. The accents were a bit thick in that scene to try to make out, but were they were watching Buck Rogers, the astronaut who travels 500 years into the future? Unlike the Walking Dead universe that insisted on pretending that zombie movies and lore were never a thing to give characters any point of reference for what they were dealing with, I love that this series acknowledges the rich history of time travel in fiction and pop culture and the characters keep trying to line up their own experiences to that.

Other than that, I'm mostly just hoping we get to come out of this cliffhanger not having to watch finger removal surgery. I could really do without that.

[Ziggy]

29 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

while Rob couldn't actually travel he almost certainly told another asshat who's been running around the 18th century for the last three books causing problems for both the Frasers and the Grays and that's how he knows about them.

This plot point completely went over my head until I read something in Bees. 
 

Had we already met this individual before this season?

[nodorothyparker]

 

12 minutes ago, Ziggy said:

Had we already met this individual before this season?

I don't believe so. His first book appearance in is Echo and he's introduced as part of William's story. 

[Ziggy]

After the mid-season finale, I plan to reread Echo.

[ruby24]

They seem to be speeding up this storyline quite a bit, which is good I guess if they plan to get through it all. I mean, from this point on Roger is wandering through time periods on his own and doesn't even reunite with Bree and the kids until the very end of Book 8. Maybe they're gonna just really power through all of that.

I don't mind Roger and Brianna in the present day so much- they seem to fit better there than they do in the past, as they did in the books as well, imo. I'm actually bummed they wound up back with Claire and Jamie intending to stay there for good- are they insane? Why would they want to raise their kids there? What if something happens to one of them again, medically? This stuff is all so obvious and it's just never brought up, which is bizarre. I can't understand why anyone would want to live forever in a place where you'll never have indoor plumbing or electricity and you're likely to die from a violent act. Claire does it for Jamie. But Roger and Brianna? To go back there again? Makes no sense. Their kids will never have opportunities they would have in their own time. 

Hiding from those idiots trying to take their gold is NOT a reason. It never made sense as a reason to get them back there.

I dread the sex scenes with the two of them because Bree is just so bad and I feel sorry for Richard Rankin. Sigh. At least they played a good song during it.

I'm glad they did at least a little bit of Buck being in awe of the future. I hated that he was completely non-fazed by anything in the book. Come on, the dude came from the 1700s to the 1980s! That really would be like stepping on another planet as far as he's concerned. When you travel to the past we do have some learned context for what we're going to see, what we're not going to have, etc. but the future would be just nuts. I couldn't understand why he was so nonplussed by shit like cars, for example. I mean, really?

[GHScorpiosRule]

I think it was a bad idea for me to rewatch the first two seasons while watching this season.  I should have waited until the mid-season finale at least. 

[Noneofyourbusiness]

7 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

The accents were a bit thick in that scene to try to make out, but were they were watching Buck Rogers, the astronaut who travels 500 years into the future?

They were watching Blake's 7. Jemmy told Buck the main character was named Blake (and I recognize the show). But Mandy mentioned Buck and Roger's names while doing his beard, in an allusion to Buck Rogers. Jemmy's description of (Roj) Blake as "an astronaut 500 years in the future" would have been more accurate for Buck Rogers, since Blake is a starship captain, not an astronaut, and at least 700 years in the future.

And of course, Buck and Roger would be chrononauts, not astronauts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blake's_7

6 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

 

I don't believe so. His first book appearance in is Echo and he's introduced as part of William's story. 

Hmm, maybe the show will combine Rob with him? It seems Jemmy did go through the stones if Mandy sensed it.

[Jodithgrace]

Here’s something that I’m confused about. I’m rereading the books at the moment but haven’t gotten this far, yet. Do the stones “charge” one gem per customer or do they consume all of the gems you have? What I mean is, can you bring extra gems through with you, to ensure your ability to return? Does Roger even have any gems with him when he goes after Jem? I know that gem’s function seems to be steering the person to where they want to go. Is that why Roger gets lost? I’ve totally forgotten this part from the books. 

[Ziggy]

23 minutes ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Hmm, maybe the show will combine Rob with him? It seems Jemmy did go through the stones if Mandy sensed it.

The character has already been introduced this season. I just wasn’t sure if it was something I had missed in previous books.

I'm really looking forward to my reread of Echo. Now that I know who to look for, I’m hoping I’ll follow the story better.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

6 minutes ago, Ziggy said:

The character has already been introduced this season. I just wasn’t sure if it was something I had missed in previous books.

Can you please tell us in spoiler text who this person is?

[unlfan03]

23 minutes ago, Ziggy said:

The character has already been introduced this season. I just wasn’t sure if it was something I had missed in previous books.

I'm really looking forward to my reread of Echo. Now that I know who to look for, I’m hoping I’ll follow the story better.

I feel like the reveal will not hit as hard since they decided not to do the fixing of the high place then 

Spoiler

Lt. Richardson or as he was in the 80's Michael Callahan 

doesn't show up. It will be like the Buck reveal, a bit of a wet squib that book readers will get but the rest of the show watchers won't understand. Though I think that the Buck reveal could have been better as they knew that Graham wasn't available. I'm also sorry they left out 

Spoiler

Captain Randall-Isaacs

so far, by maybe next season. 

Edited July 30, 2023 by unlfan03

[GHScorpiosRule]

Ye ken it’s no’ a good thing or that something bad will happen tae Jamie when he leaves a scene in slow motion!

And dammit! Robert the Bruce Angus MacFayden DESERVES tae be in the opening credits! No’ in the closing as if he’s someone unimportant!!!

I think I much prefer the recast Buck I stead of Graham. 

And since I knew ahead of time, I just closed my eyes as I listened to Phil Collins, though they should have muted that GODAWFUL “moaning” of Sophia’s.

Bree and Roger continue to show how STOOPID they continue to be. ‘It’s a wonder that Jamie and Claire are hee parents. And as much as I carp about Gabaldon’s writing, I’m here for JAMIE AND CLAIRE. I don’t give any bluedilly foocks about anyone else.

But Man oh Man! Claire looks BADASS holding that sword in next week’s mid-season finale! Jamie BETTER not be in a coma or wotever in it. I’ve noticed it’s all new writers this season thus far. 

And now I’m off to continue my rewatch of season three.

[iMonrey]

Why is there a General Fraser? Is he related to Jamie? If not why use the same name? Are they running out of names?

[Noneofyourbusiness]

19 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Why is there a General Fraser? Is he related to Jamie? If not why use the same name? Are they running out of names?

Jamie explained this to Claire two episodes ago in "Singapore". This is Simon Fraser, a second cousin with the same name as Jamie's grandfather. That's why Jamie was concerned the redcoats would come up the hill, because a highlander was leading them. And like Jamie's grandfather, this Simon Fraser is a real person who really did lead the charge to take Ticonderoga.

[SassAndSnacks]

It has taken me awhile to comment because my corneas are still burnt from the Bree/Rog sex scene that no one asked for and no one needed to see.  And the soundtrack...so cringe.  That song is an absolute timeless jam, but it belongs to Miami Vice and not one of the most uncomfortable and unnecessarily long love scenes I've ever seen.  The moaning had me dry-heaving.  

1980's Sophie doesn't bother me as much as 1770's Sophie but....blech.  This isn't her best.

But Buck...dah-yum.  That was a feast for me, and I didn't even know I was hungry.  He saved this episode for me.  I felt like he was a bit of an ass in the book, but I was loving this guy.  

Was not expecting Show to pull the trigger on the Jemmy kidnapping plot just yet because we haven't met Mike Callahan, so I was surprised they went there so quickly.  I don't feel like Show gave us time to process these new characters and set up the connection between Jem and Mandy or the reasons why Bree and Rog were comfortable letting Jem stay with Bobby.  The timeline was longer in the book, so I wasn't like "WTF, you barely know these people and you're letting your kid stay with them?" when I read it like I was when I saw it.  Roger finding Jem's scarf at the stones was a nice callback to Claire's shawl.  

Charles continues to actually make me give AF about William.  He was great.  

Buuuuttttt...... Sorry, Show.  This will always be Jamie and Claire's story, and the 5 minutes I saw of them wasn't enough.  But I loved that they kept the line about the font size, bringing back Jamie's printer career.  And Jamie in buckskins, yes please!

On 7/28/2023 at 6:56 PM, nodorothyparker said:

those scenes only highlight the painful lack of chemistry that the show got right with everyone else but is sorely lacking between Roger and Bree.

I was thinking this!  They got everyone else SO right (ok, maybe not Lizzie but it worked out fine), but this casting continues to be such a bad miss.  

On 7/28/2023 at 1:24 PM, McKavity said:

I skimmed over the Buck/Roger/Jem/Rob/Bree parts in the books because I didn’t find them interesting, and I am still finding them uninteresting

YAAASSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!  I completely ignore Bree and just look at the scenery - the Loch, the fab decor of the Lallybroch redux, even the caravan.  

16 hours ago, unlfan03 said:

I feel like the reveal will not hit as hard

100% Agree.  Without Mike Callahan, the Richardson plot doesn't go as far as it could/should. 

12 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Ye ken it’s no’ a good thing or that something bad will happen tae Jamie when he leaves a scene in slow motion!

Ooooh, good point.  But I still love the slow-mo shots of him.  

12 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I’m here for JAMIE AND CLAIRE. I don’t give any bluedilly foocks about anyone else.

Maybe if I only watch the Jamie and Claire parts, I'd really like this episode?  It would save a lot of time anyway.  I was disappointed with this one.  I stayed up late to watch it and felt like it was a bit of a waste.  But I think the Phil Collins sex is marring my overall impression of it.  

 

[Haleth]

Ok, when did Jaime and Claire become the least interesting part of the show?  I was more interested in the 20th c, well, except for the sex. I was riveted by the scenes with Buck. He certainly adapted well to the marvels around him to the point he could pass for a modern guy.  Loved Rik Rankin's growing impatience/jitters with Rob sitting at the table while Buck was in the pantry.  I also enjoyed the William scenes  And of course the brief (don't blink) glimpse of Ian.  My world has gone topsy turvy. 

Callahan?  Richardson?  I guess I don’t remember the book.  I don't recall where Jem ends up but I sort of remember Roger and Buck bouncing around and meeting one person in particular.

Some observations added in the light of day.  (Sorry I can't include the OP's names.)

Quote

 Angus MacFayden DESERVES tae be in the opening credits! 

I so agree.  He was a highlight of the episode.

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That song is an absolute timeless jam,

Does anyone not drum the steering wheel when you hear that riff on the car radio?

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But I think the Phil Collins sex is marring my overall impression of it.

I was thankfully distracted by the yellow floral sheets.  I remember that exact pattern.  

 

Edited July 31, 2023 by Haleth

[Cdh20]

On 7/30/2023 at 7:09 PM, Haleth said:

Ok, when did Jaime and Claire become the least interesting part of the show?  I was more interested in the 20th c, well, except for the sex. I was riveted by the scenes with Buck. He certainly adapted well to the marvels around him to the point he could pass for a modern guy.  Loved Rik Rankin's growing impatience/jitters with Rob sitting at the table while Buck was in the pantry.  I also enjoyed the William scenes  And of course the brief (don't blink) glimpse of Ian.  My world has gone topsy turvy. 

 

I was thankfully distracted by the yellow floral sheets.  I remember that exact pattern.  

 

I watched with my bff & she so wants those sheets! 
 

I distinctly remember that in this book the 1980’s were more interesting than the 1770’s. 
 

I ♥️ William! 
 

 

[NaughtyKitty]

16 hours ago, Cdh20 said:

I watched with my bff & she so wants those sheets! 
 

I distinctly remember that in this book the 1980’s were more interesting than the 1770’s. 
 

I ♥️ William! 
 

 

I want those teal and gold sheets so bad!  If anyone finds them, please DM me. My guess is that they were really vintage ones though.

[Cdh20]

I just rewatched with my hubby, who has not read the books, and he said this episode was the best one of the season so far…time travel, kidnapping, war, cliffhangers! 

[Scarlett45]

On 7/29/2023 at 2:41 PM, ruby24 said:

I'm glad they did at least a little bit of Buck being in awe of the future. I hated that he was completely non-fazed by anything in the book. Come on, the dude came from the 1700s to the 1980s! That really would be like stepping on another planet as far as he's concerned. When you travel to the past we do have some learned context for what we're going to see, what we're not going to have, etc. but the future would be just nuts. I couldn't understand why he was so nonplussed by shit like cars, for example. I mean, really?

Yes I told my Mom that. He called a car a “loud carriage” which makes sense. But I could see him still being terrified of how fast they were. 

On 7/30/2023 at 12:49 PM, SassAndSnacks said:

The timeline was longer in the book, so I wasn't like "WTF, you barely know these people and you're letting your kid stay with them?" when I read it like I was when I saw it.  Roger finding Jem's scarf at the stones was a nice callback to Claire's shawl. 

It was. It would’ve made more sense if Rob was just taking them to the movies- Bobby is a child in Jem’s class and that seems like a “socially appropriate” thing to do. Having a slumber party and not confirming with Bobby’s mom wouldn’t fly even in the 80s. 

[Linderhill]

16 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Having a slumber party and not confirming with Bobby’s mom wouldn’t fly even in the 80s. 

It wouldn't have flown in the '70's either.  My mom's first question would be asking permission of the other mother.  

[GHScorpiosRule]

That's the problem with what Roberts and company have decided to do with this season-condense buiks 6-8 so while some unnecessary stuff is fortunately cut out, important stuff is also cut out.