S07.E01: A Life Well Lost

[Athena]

Quote

Jamie races toward Wilmington to rescue Claire from the gallows, only to discover that the American Revolution has reached North Carolina.

Reminder: This is the No Book Talk topic. No discussion of the books is allowed including saying "in the books..." Posts may be removed without warning.

[cardigirl]

Happy to say that I thought the episode really delivered!  Jamie, at the end, was fierce. Let's goooo!  New season!

 

(edited to add)  I can't believe I'm the only one who's watched and commented so far!!! Maybe you all are working on lengthy well-written reviews and thoughts?   Where is the Outlander community?!?  C'mon!  I want to hear your thoughts about that final scene.  *chills* 

Edited June 16, 2023 by cardigirl

[steph369]

2 hours ago, cardigirl said:

Happy to say that I thought the episode really delivered!  Jamie, at the end, was fierce. Let's goooo!  New season!

 

(edited to add)  I can't believe I'm the only one who's watched and commented so far!!! Maybe you all are working on lengthy well-written reviews and thoughts?   Where is the Outlander community?!?  C'mon!  I want to hear your thoughts about that final scene.  *chills* 

We were catching some zzz’s, cardigirl!

That was quite an opening scene. Craa-a-ack! And Claire's gone. I thought "That's a short season!" 😆 I was surprised Claire was released by the end of the episode. They usually drag it on for half the season. I guess they have so much packed into this season, they have to speed things up. Hope it doesn’t end up being too rushed. 

The “nailbiting” ending 🙄, will Jamie kill Brown or won’t he. Of course he won’t. He’s too honorable. Wish he would, it would be more realistic and impactful. 

[cardigirl]

23 minutes ago, steph369 said:

We were catching some zzz’s, cardigirl!

 

The “nailbiting” ending 🙄, will Jamie kill Brown or won’t he. Of course he won’t. He’s too honorable. Wish he would, it would be more realistic and impactful. 

I need to catch some zzzs too!  Jamie has killed before and not just in battle. There was one redcoat who he strangled after his family was threatened. Season 5? I think. Then he found Adso the kitten to take home to Claire. 

[DoctorAtomic]

"Let's go get my wife." That's a line you put in to imply it's going bonkers.  

Say what you want about the show, and I've certainly (fairly) criticized it, but I really got excited for the theme again. 

I completely didn't think the courts would be shut down due to the Revolution. I was expecting high courtroom drama.

I was really surprised that 'Ringo' said there were *five* travelers. I hope that pays off later. I would have helped him escape. Bree was being intractable; justifiably, but also kind of hypocritical. She was placed out of time and put in circumstances she couldn't control either. Roger wasn't wrong in saying he did what he had to do to keep on keeping on, and, unfortunately, that was doing nothing while people suffered; they would have regardless. Roger being there wouldn't have changed anything. Ringo goes back to help Native Americans; even in the 'present' 1970s, Bree and Roger know enough to know about Native Americans. Did Bree forget that Roger being in the wrong place at the wrong time got him swinging from a tree by his neck? 

Well, we all were in agreement that Malva wasn't Mr. Christie's biological daughter. We (fairly) complained about him and his self-righteousness last season, but that last monologue knocked it out of the park into the next time zone. I get why Claire would have difficulty thinking he did it, but I have no doubt he did. I thought so last season. I still think Allan was the father. 

I am glad they wrapped up Malva in this episode. I didn't want it to be dragged out. 

"Make your peace with the Lord if you must. Mr Brown."

Bookending the BAMF.

Great shot of Jamie in half shadow. I don't think Jamie would straight up murder Mr. Brown, but Jamie is smart enough to play that Mr. Brown's band of incels is played out given the political landscape. The governor of the colony is in a 'floating prison', and clearly understands that he is at a disadvantage, since the show clearly pointed out that Fort Johnston was lost.

I've said before that I do give credit to the show for showing the Revolution from the south. You don't see that in tv, and it looks like the show is ramping that up.

So this is shaping up nicely for my Friday late evening summer entertainment. Last season was my Sundays, but I like kicking off the weekend instead.

Edited June 17, 2023 by DoctorAtomic

[Glade]

I knew the opening scene wasn't really happening, but it did remind me of Dark Shadows, where the time traveler Victoria Winters was tried as a witch and sentenced to hanging, but the second before she died she teleported back to the present, replaced by her 1795 doppelganger.  So it was interesting to imagine for a moment that happening in the context of this show.  Would be fun if Roger made another reference to DS someday... otherwise this was a good episode, I liked Claire's interactions with the women in prison and then on the ship with the major and his wife.  It is an interesting detail that the courts are shut down; though if Claire already knew they would be last season, she certainly didn't show it. 

That's a recast of Wendigo Donner, right (edit: I guess not, I just didn't recognize him)?  It has been like seven years since they filmed season 5, so it makes sense.  It is really sad to think that he would wind up conscripted to fight in the army of his colonizers.  I wish Bree and Roger would help him get home.  

I had to replay the scene where Tom Brown enters the bedroom twice, because I could have sworn that there was a knife protruding from his stomach in the first shot (foreshadowing for his ultimate fate?) but no I guess that was his cane.  I do buy that Christie would murder his daughter/niece, but I also still feel like the theory that his son did it works.  It does feel anti-climactic but I'm glad all of that is wrapped up now; the preview for next week looks so much more exciting.  The Christies really bogged down the show last season, I'm glad to see the backs of them. 

Edited June 17, 2023 by Glade

[Lola82]

What did Jamie mean when he told Brown that he tormented Young Ian? I can’t remember any interaction between the two.

It seems like it happens several times every season, but I never get tired of seeing Jamie and Claire dramatically reunite.

So happy to have the show back!

[Hanahope]

I also thought Bree was being a bit judgmental.  i understand her situation, but Roger was right, if Wendigo had tried anything, he would have been killed.  self preservation is a strong instinct and hard to overcome for someone that is not your kin.  

I certainly would not blame Jamie at all for dealing with Brown any way possible that gets him out of the way.  Jamie will have enough problems trying to stay on the "right side of history."

I'm glad the Malva story is resolved, and i could believe Christie killed her, but not sure then why he would allow Claire to be put on trial for it.  self preservation again, i guess, though he has a better defense, one that other men could accept.  he'd get a fair trial a heck of a lot more than Claire would have gotten.  I'm glad she got released so easily (I suspect there's more to it in the books, but i haven't read that far).

[ferjy]

14 hours ago, Glade said:

I liked Claire's interactions with the women in prison and then on the ship with the major and his wife.

I did too. My favourite parts are always with Claire, and these scenes were some of the best. I thought it was a good episode. Though I can still do without Bree. I’ve even warmed to Roger (still not crazy about the character, but do like Richard Rankin). But I never liked Brianna as a character and like Sophie Skelton even less. 

I was surprised (can’t go as far as to say impressed 😄 ) by Sam’s acting right at the end. I’ve never thought he’s a very good actor but he did look fierce at the end. He actually had a different expression on his face for once! Not the usual filling his pants look that he uses for every situation. 

Though I wasn’t very fond of the Christies storyline, I’m sorry to see Mark Lewis Jones go, great actor. Now it looks like Richard Brown’s days are limited. Another good actor, Chris Larkin (Maggie Smith’s son, Toby Stephenson’s brother, for those that didn’t know). 

Just a glimpse of Ian, but I’m sure we’ll see more of him. So happy to have the show back and I already can’t wait for next week!

 

[ferjy]

39 minutes ago, Hanahope said:

and i could believe Christie killed her, but not sure then why he would allow Claire to be put on trial for it. 

I didn’t think he did. It seemed to me he was lying about it. Whether because he wanted to save Claire or to protect someone else (his son maybe?) or possibly both, kill two birds with one stone. 

[nara]

Great episode. Finally, I have some must watch TV again. 

I liked that they resolved the Claire prison issue. I don’t think Christie killed his daughter. I think it will be revealed to be Allan later. I also noticed he avoided the question of the baby’s father (also Allan IMO). 

Laughed when they embraced and the guard said “That is not permitted.” It reminded me of “No touching!” from Arrested Development.

New characters that I hope we will see again are Sadie for comic relief and Governor and his wife.

I really enjoyed the debate between Bree and Roger. When do you stand up for others and when do you protect yourself? I honestly don’t know what I would do if put in that difficult situation. I completely got each of their positions on the topic, which is what made it compelling. Even from the beginning, Bree plunged fearlessly and recklessly into the past to save her parents.    Not sure Roger would have done that, even for reverend Wakefield. 

[BitterApple]

I thought this was a great opener. Sometimes season premieres can be a bit clunky, as the cast tries to regain their chemistry, but I didn't sense any of that here. 

I always thought Allan impregnated and killed Malva. I can't see Tom taking the fall otherwise. Regardless, I'm fine with whatever conclusion the show came up with. I was never big on the Christies and didn't want to see that plot dragged out. 

I understand Brianna's feelings but Roger was right with regards to Wendigo. There was nothing he could've done to stop the attack without getting himself killed. Like all of you said, survival instinct usually overrides the desire to be a hero. Very interesting though, that there are more travelers out there. That's an exciting prospect. 

The Brown guy definitely isn't dead. 

Looking forward to the return of Lord John and Willie next week! 

[Ziggy]

12 hours ago, Lola82 said:

What did Jamie mean when he told Brown that he tormented Young Ian? I can’t remember any interaction between the two.

I was wondering the same thing.  Hopefully someone can remind me.

[Scarlett45]

On 6/16/2023 at 9:18 AM, steph369 said:

The “nailbiting” ending 🙄, will Jamie kill Brown or won’t he. Of course he won’t. He’s too honorable. Wish he would, it would be more realistic and impactful. 

Jaime is honorable but this would be an honorable killing. This douchebag set up his wife to hang for murder- he’s got to DIE! 

 

22 hours ago, Ziggy said:

I was wondering the same thing.  Hopefully someone can remind me.

I think Brown tormented Young Ian’s Cherokee friend, “Young Ian (and), the Cherokee you tormented.”

[DoctorAtomic]

31 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Jaime is honorable but this would be an honorable killing. This douchebag set up his wife to hang for murder- he’s got to DIE! 

tbh, with the courts basically shut down, and, you know, a full scale war going on, who's going to bother if Jaime does kill him? Aren't they in Wilmington right now? It's not like they're back on the ridge and Brown has allies from his vigilante group. Who would know really?

Brown dragged Claire to Wilmington to be prosecuted for murder. A high ranking crown officer took her to help with his wife's labor. That's legal; she didn't pull a jailbreak. Somehow, Brown dies. No one there knows him enough to follow up. I'm sure his genteel personality wasn't making any friends that anyone who might know him peripherally there would care either. 

[Ziggy]

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think Brown tormented Young Ian’s Cherokee friend, “Young Ian (and), the Cherokee you tormented.”

Do you remember when that was? I have no recollection.

[Scarlett45]

8 hours ago, Ziggy said:

Do you remember when that was? I have no recollection.

Before Claire’s abduction and rape in season 5. 

[greekmom]

I am a casual watcher.  But honestly, I was scratching my head at this episode.

Christie was in love with Claire? When?  

Wendigo Donner - so 5 came over and so far we've seen 2 i think.  Wonder were the other 3 are.  I find it interesting how people who come to change the past (Montauk Five, Gellis) get into a heck alot of trouble but Claire , Brie, Roger and the small French dude who just observe the past and not try to change it just live in the past.  I dunno.  I think Roger was right, he should try to help Wendigo get back to his own time but it does seem impossible.  I would love it if they met a traveller who was from their future (say 90s/00's) instead of the 60s/70s.

Guess there is no way to keep the Frasers out of the American revolution.  They couldn't just declare themselves Switzerland? 

[GHScorpiosRule]

2 hours ago, greekmom said:

Christie was in love with Claire? When?  

Probably from the moment she healed his hand. It was clear, if you watched him, the way he looked at Claire last season, that he had feelings for her. And then at the end, when he volunteered to go when that asshat, Brown had her dragged away for "trial" in the season finale last season.

[DoctorAtomic]

5 hours ago, greekmom said:

Christie was in love with Claire? When?

Christie seems to have a host of issues. He probably thinks love is complaining about everything left and right. I suppose this was in the book, so maybe it was more foreshadowing. Would we be missing something if it was cut from the show? I don't think so. I don't recall it coming up in the discussions here. 

Christie being wracked with guilt because he killed Malva, and Claire is being dragged around by a bunch of vigilantes because of him seems consistent with his characterization from last season. They can just leave it at that. 

5 hours ago, greekmom said:

I find it interesting how people who come to change the past (Montauk Five, Gellis) get into a heck alot of trouble but Claire , Brie, Roger and the small French dude who just observe the past and not try to change it just live in the past. 

Claire and Jaime did try to change the past in seasons 1 and 2, to no avail. This time around, they aren't really trying to change much because we all want the rebels to win. Gellis is Roger's ancestor too, so she kind of changed some things. 

I wouldn't say Claire doesn't get into trouble though. The entire series is Claire mouthing off and being dragged all over the place. 

[tennisgurl]

5 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I wouldn't say Claire doesn't get into trouble though. The entire series is Claire mouthing off and being dragged all over the place. 

No kidding, hopefully this mess has helped her realize that she needs to read a room and pick her battles. Like Roger said, you cant always be the hero, you have to know when to fight and when you have to back off and live to fight another day. 

Really happy to see the show back again and this was a very solid season premiere. I'm surprised that Claire is out of jail so quickly, I was expecting this to go on for at least a few episodes, but I'm really glad that we're moving on. There is so much exciting stuff happening with the revolution and the new time traveler, Claire going through another trial doesn't sound anywhere near as fun. I really liked Claire's scenes with the governors wife on the boat and the women in the prison, that's really Claire at her best.

I'm fine with the Creepy Christies all being gone, this is a good way to end the story. I always thought that Mr. Christie killed Malva so I buy that it was him, although I wouldn't be surprised if it was actually his son and he's protecting him. I hope not though, I'm fine leaving this whole plot like this.

I knew that Claire wasn't actually going to die, but that beginning was still quite the *gasp!* moment. Just like the ending, hot damn did Jamie look like he was about to strike that scumbag down with the wrath of god.

Roger quoting "float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" as part of his preaching was funny, and of course it alerts him to the other time traveler. If I was them, I would go around doing modern quotes all of the time to see if anyone reacted to find other time travelers, there are apparently tons of them running around!

Edited June 20, 2023 by tennisgurl

[taanja]

Late to the game. I live in the Northwoods/Tundra -- summer is short and sweet and MUST be enjoyed because it is gone in the blink of an eye!

I knew that was some kind of dream sequence because NO WAY will this show kill off Claire. Ummm!!! Without her the show doesn't exist!

Anyway. No way I buy that Tom killed Malva. But god his story explains a lot. The child of his brother. He already saw his wife as some sort of witch and of course transposed those feelings onto baby/child Malva. Is it any wonder that poor girl was as messed up as she was! But Tom never came across as a murderer to me. 

Ok. So how many time travelers are there anyway? And I'm going to need a better explanation how the stones work because why exactly can't Jaime go forward into the future? Why can only certain people go through the stones? Are they all somehow related to one another? 

[Scarlett45]

11 hours ago, taanja said:

Ok. So how many time travelers are there anyway? And I'm going to need a better explanation how the stones work because why exactly can't Jaime go forward into the future? Why can only certain people go through the stones? Are they all somehow related to one another? 

The ability to time travel is genetic, but not all time travelers are related. Think of it like a rare dominant trait, if one of your parents is a traveler you’re likely to be one. We know it’s not recessive as Bre can time travel due to only 1 time traveling parent. 

[Noneofyourbusiness]

12 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

We know it’s not recessive as Bre can time travel due to only 1 time traveling parent. 

And Geillis and Dougal's son presumably inherited it from one time travelling parent, Geillis, and then generations of MacKenzies in Roger's paternal line inherited it until you get to Roger. Then Jemmy seems to have extra abilities because he inherited it on both sides.

Edited June 27, 2023 by Noneofyourbusiness

[DoctorAtomic]

I thought it was both because Gellis and Claire didn't inherit the trait. 

[Noneofyourbusiness]

Just now, DoctorAtomic said:

I thought it was both because Gellis and Claire didn't inherit the trait. 

Presumably they did. Most of their ancestors weren't in a position to use it.

[Scarlett45]

16 minutes ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Presumably they did. Most of their ancestors weren't in a position to use it.

Yeah. It also be a spontaneous mutation as well, which they did pass on to their offspring. But it is genetic. 

[DoctorAtomic]

Other than Gellis-Roger, I don't recall the show getting into how Claire has the ability. Maybe it was the guy from the first season. 

[Cdh20]

4 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

Other than Gellis-Roger, I don't recall the show getting into how Claire has the ability. Maybe it was the guy from the first season. 

We do not know much about Claire’s family, but obviously at least one of her parents was a time traveller, but we do not know if they knew it or not? 

[DoctorAtomic]

I didn't know if it was mentioned in the show. I don't rewatch. I thought I could have missed something. 

I do recall in the first season, there was a song at the party about a traveller and the stones. Claire made the connection that she could in fact travel forward (or, back to 1947). I thought it would be neat if the person they were singing about was an ancestor. 

It also could be something like being lefthanded. You don't have to have either parent be lefthanded. Sometimes it just happens.